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Trump Targets the Abuse of H-1B Visas

An anonymous reader writes: As part of Trump's comprehensive immigration overhaul, his plan not only addresses immigrants who enter or stay in the country illegally, but also the H-1B visa program and its well-documented abuses. Parts of the proposal include requirements to offer positions to U.S. STEM graduates and effectively requiring a minimum wage for hiring out of the country that would make it prohibitive to do so.

69 of 492 comments (clear)

  1. Amazing by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Interesting

    I might actually vote for him because of this policy. Never thought I would say that.

    1. Re:Amazing by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Of course you might. There's nothing like America for single-issue voting.

      "Well, yeah, he's a complete idiot, and he'll plunge our country into a new depression, and half the population will starve to death, and the other half will eat them to stay alive, but there might be a few more jobs for American tech workers at the end of it!"

    2. Re:Amazing by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Funny

      Overreact much?

    3. Re:Amazing by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Insightful
      Trump is going to be good for one thing: getting the Republicans to have a real debate on immigration. This is probably a good thing for them in the long run, and they've been trying to have it both ways for a while, being the party of free trade but ignoring trade in labor, but it'll get ugly for a while and there's a small risk that it could get ugly for a long while (like if the jerk is elected).

      I understand Trump's platform includes changes to the 14th amendment so that you're not a citizen when you're born on US soil anymore. Quite a big deal.

    4. Re:Amazing by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Funny

      It's called hyperbole, and everyone does it.

    5. Re:Amazing by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Funny

      The also seem to have ensured illiteracy.

    6. Re: Amazing by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Interesting

      WTF are you talking about?

      The H1-b visa is government meddling in the free market because of lobbying by tech firms who wanted to increase the supply of workers to reduce wages.

      Here's another way wages have been reduced, increased working hours for the same pay - actually lower because of inflation.

      2001 C++ programmer made 80k around here working 40 hours a week- maybe a couple weeks a year of 60+ hours.

      Now it is 65k a year and 60 hour weeks are the norm.

      Don't like it? Well, you are unqualified and lack the skills to work here.

      You kids haven't seen how this profession has deteriorated in the 20 years. And much of that is because business bribed Congress to import indentured servants from third world countries with inferior educations.

    7. Re: Amazing by Chrisq · · Score: 3, Informative

      The H1-b visa is government meddling in the free market because of lobbying by tech firms who wanted to increase the supply of workers to reduce wages.

      No free market of labour would mean that anyone who could get a job offer in the USA could come in. Not many people would want this!

    8. Re: Amazing by taxman_10m · · Score: 2

      I'd be inclined to see whether his various business ventures have exhibited this sort of hiring policy; or whether he's a "Buy American!" sort of guy when looking for votes; and a buy Mexican sort of guy when looking for labor...

      Why does it matter? Don't hate the player, hate the game. It doesn't bother me if Trump as a businessman engaged in standard business practices. He's now saying the game sucks and needs to be changed. Good for him. Booo to people who think supposed hypocrisy is the greatest sin imaginable and should prevent us from fixing errors.

    9. Re:Amazing by gbjbaanb · · Score: 2

      and yet TFS didn't even give us a link to his policy!

      Here's a "news" article that gives a link and a summary piece about it.

    10. Re: Amazing by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Funny

      Actually, Soylent is lead and cadmium.

    11. Re: Amazing by parkinglot777 · · Score: 2

      2001 C++ programmer made 80k around here working 40 hours a week- maybe a couple weeks a year of 60+ hours.

      Now it is 65k a year and 60 hour weeks are the norm.

      That's the entry level of H1B. Also, number of hour a week is fixed to 40-hour a week for a full-time job (if less than that, it is invalid for the work permit); thus, number of hours per week has nothing to do with it.

      So you meant an entry level of a programmer should get 80k a year???

    12. Re: Amazing by beelsebob · · Score: 4, Informative

      What on earth makes you think an H1B worker "isn't free to leave for a higher paying job"?

      As someone in the US on an H1B, I can assure you, changing jobs is trivially easy (once you live in the bay area, and have something like "Google", "Uber" or "Apple" on your CV, everyone wants you). The process of changing jobs on an H1B involves exactly what it would do for a US citizen - go and interview, get the job, move. The only gotcha is that the other company must be willing to sponsor taking over the H1B (which is a tiny cost compared to the wage they'll be paying you).

    13. Re: Amazing by thaylin · · Score: 2

      So then it does not "involve exactly what it would for a US citizen". As a US citizen, I do not have to make sure someone will sponsor me.

      --
      When you cant win, ad hominem.
    14. Re:Amazing by Holi · · Score: 2

      It's not the Democrats running around yelling like Chicken Little.

      --
      Sorry, teleporters just kill you and then make a copy. A perfect, soul-less copy.
    15. Re:Amazing by Jason+Levine · · Score: 2

      During his announcement speech, he knocked the HealthCare.gov website by saying that he has websites built for $3. Now, you can claim that HealthCare.gov cost too much or that it was too buggy and you'd have fair points. You can claim that the government shouldn't be running a "HealthCare.gov" and you'd have a fair political point. (One that many would disagree with, but still a fair opinion.) However, claiming that HealthCare.gov could be built for $3 is totally false. As a web developer, I know how much I charge for website work and something of that scale would cost nowhere near $3. About the only way I can POSSIBLY see Trump building a HealthCare.gov sized website for $3 is if he exported the work to people in India/China/etc that don't care about being paid $0.01 for 8 hours of work.

      So either Trump had no clue about web development costs and was just running off his mouth (admittedly very likely) or he knows how much he pays for web development and has some seriously flawed hiring practices.

      --
      My sci-fi novel, Ghost Thief, is now available from Amazon.com.
    16. Re:Amazing by ProfBooty · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Trump has a political brilliance, a strategic brilliance, a thoroughness in showmanship unlike anything anybody else running has, a personal image perfect for maximizing his control over public opinion through the rhetorical strategy of hyperbole, and the money to do this his own way, right, without needing to be phony to satisfy some donor or other.

      Doesn't mean he will be a great president, but his use of hyperbole sticks in many average voters minds as it move the goal posts in his direction, even if the numbers he uses are actual incorrect. It is a great rhetorical device.

      --
      Bring back the old version of slashdot.
    17. Re: Amazing by beelsebob · · Score: 2

      Thankfully, this is a trivial task, and does not in any way justify the idea that you are "[not] free to leave for a higher paying job"

    18. Re:Amazing by Crashmarik · · Score: 5, Informative

      Why do you think a businessman would be for a free market? Businessmen prefer regulation in their favor over free markets any day.

      This "businessman" has driven his various companies bankrupt on at least 3 occasions, and fancies himself a self-starter when he inherited all his money from his actually successful father. No wonder he's a Republican.

      That's BS. Sure he inherited money but there's not many people that achieve a 10,000 % ROI.
      I don't even like the guy and don't believe a word he is saying but I can't stand people that make shit up

    19. Re:Amazing by Nyder · · Score: 4, Interesting

      Of course you might. There's nothing like America for single-issue voting.

      "Well, yeah, he's a complete idiot, and he'll plunge our country into a new depression, and half the population will starve to death, and the other half will eat them to stay alive, but there might be a few more jobs for American tech workers at the end of it!"

      Actually Trump wouldn't hurt the country that much. Most laws he will try to pass probably will get vetoed by Congress or the Senate (forget who vetoes who) and when they try to pass laws, he's veto them because that is the sort of asshole he is.

      And unlike how Obama lets congress do whatever, we'd have high comedy when Trump talks smack about them all the time.

      --
      Be seeing you...
    20. Re: Amazing by mjtaylor24601 · · Score: 3, Insightful

      No, that is not free market labor. Free market labor is anyone who can get a job offer in an area they are allowed to be in can take the job.

      <devilsadvocate>So your definition of a free market is one where the government (who explicitly decides who is allowed to be in the country) gets to decide who can and can't participate in trade?</devilsadvocate>

      Don't get me wrong, I think labor is a classic example of where a regulated market is better for everyone overall. But it's still a pretty regulated market.

      --
      I wish I were as sure of anything as some people are of everything
    21. Re:Amazing by Barsteward · · Score: 2

      "Trump is going to be good for one thing: getting the Republicans to have a real debate on immigration." - people like this do not create a real debate, they just create division and give the racist and xenophobes a platform to voice their distasteful opinions. You cannot have a real debate with these types of people.

      --
      "The hands that help are better far than lips that pray." - Robert Ingersoll (1833-1899)
    22. Re:Amazing by MightyMartian · · Score: 4, Insightful

      And that's the real issue. Trump makes a lot of claims and promises that would require Congress to cooperate, and looking at how Trump scores on the whole "get along with other people" index, it suggests that his Presidency, rather than being some great revolutionary change, would be four very long years of him shouting crude abuses at Congressional leadership.

      --
      The world's burning. Moped Jesus spotted on I50. Details at 11.
    23. Re:Amazing by msauve · · Score: 2, Interesting

      "scientific models"

      That's an oxymoron. "Scientific" implies testable hypothesis. But, as soon as one of these models deviates from reality, they change the model instead of the hypothesis.

      --
      "National Security is the chief cause of national insecurity." - Celine's First Law
    24. Re:Amazing by GargamelSpaceman · · Score: 3, Insightful

      He says all the time he need flexibility to do deals.

      This amounts to 'trust me' which where politicians are concerned, doesn't generally work out well. This is the worst thing about Trump IMO.

      For instance, he was pro-choice a few years ago, and now he's pro-life because he wants the GOP nomination. Once he supported single payer healthcare, now he doesn't because he wants the GOP nomination. From my point of view I wish he'd never changed his positions. This says to me, these issues aren't very important to him. Or maybe they are and he's just making a deal.

      Also, the birther thing, he de-emphasizes now seems to paint him as an idiot, but it may have appealed to more people than it put off. Was it ever important to him, or just a way of getting attention. Also, consider that appearing dumb enough to do stupid things might help him in negotiations by giving him flexibility. If you appear too rational, it can be a weakness because it allows others to predict your moves. Computers still don't dominate poker.

      The wall seems dumb at first. And getting Mexico to pay for it, just stupid, but I don't think he really wants a wall. He wants to use it to browbeat others. The pressure he will apply to get the wall built is an anti-nafta agenda with impounding of remittances, which if Trump has any brains ( which he probably does but hides well ) is what he really wants. I don't think he really wants to get the wall easily.

      Making E-verify mandatory and penalties for violations by employers certain and severe will do more to deter illegal immigration than any wall ever could, which Trump says he wants to do.

      His bluster about his willingness to send troops to the Middle East could easily be a bargaining chip he intends to cash in for a better deal. Would more military adventures in the Middle East be a bad idea? Yes. But then he may not actually want them.

      The list goes on. but while you could imagine a rational Trump that is bluffing, you don't ever know that for sure. People like to see themselves in others when it's not really there. The thing he's saying to the American Public is 'Trust me.'.

      And is your favorite Trump position core, to his agenda or something to be cashed in? Or maybe everything actually might be cashed in in some possible deal but the whole agenda is genuine.

      That might be what Trump is trying to do by running. The right and left are moving further apart and alienating more and more people opening the way for a populist centrist candidate to take both right and left positions to synthesize a new deal.

      As for the H1B thing, he'll get the internet on his side with that one. Too bad it keeps an upper level 'maximum wage' , just raising it ( which will be undone by inflation eventually ) rather than just eliminating H1B.

      Still, it's something.

      The two populist candidates are Bernie Sanders and Trump.

      Bernie Sanders won't have the money to beat Trump.

      If Hillary gets the nomination, how many populist Bernie Sanders supporters will go to Hillary and how many will become Trump supporters when he shifts to the left in the general election ( which he will ).

      Will Armerica stand for another non-populist president given how alienated they feel by the bought and paid for right and left?

      And like it or not, America is becoming more National Socialist. America is not racist or anti-semetic, but they want some moderate socialism and realize that socialism isn't feasible without border control ( the nationalism ) or else you get a race to the bottom as people flood in from everywhere. You can't heat the great outdoors.

      And being nationalist and socialist doesn't make you a hater and certainly doesn't make you Hitler. -- Hitler was a bad guy.

      Being moderately socialist doesn't make you a commie, it just means you're not a Rothbardian Libertarian Ayn Rand worshipper. It makes you normal.

      Being nationalist, doesn't make you racist if you define nation geographically and include all c

      --
      ...
    25. Re:Amazing by MightyMartian · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Someone who managed to get Russia, China, France and Britain to sit down and negotiate with Iran, even while Russia and the West are embroiled in a mini Cold War.

      That's the kinds of things historians will take notice of, not some asshole who talks about female journalists having blood come out of their "you know where".

      --
      The world's burning. Moped Jesus spotted on I50. Details at 11.
    26. Re:Amazing by fey000 · · Score: 4, Funny

      And unlike how Obama lets congress do whatever, we'd have high comedy when Trump talks smack about them all the time.

      This is true. No other president would be half as fun as Trump.

      There may be a few nukes and world wars along the way, but the White House would be funnier than American Dad. Hell, I'm off to buy a year's supply of popcorn now.

    27. Re: Amazing by Rogue974 · · Score: 5, Interesting

      I am glad that your experience on the H1-B Visa program has been a trivial task for you. That is not always the case though.

      At a previous company, we had an H1-B visa employee that we hired from another company and despite the fact he was sponsored by the other company and we were willing to sponsor him, he almost got deported because of the process of handing off from 1 company to another did not go smoothly.

      He worked for us for 3 years, and then went to another job and again, almost ended up deported. It was a nightmare on both ends.

      I also know a few H1-B visa employees at my current place of employee who have had similiar fears.

      Citizen loses a job or goes to another job, nothing happens. H1-B Visa person always has the possibility of being kicked out of the country if HR screws up the sponsorship.

      I am not part of the IT tech industry, but chemical manufacturing and the people I know have been electrical or chemical engineers and not working for Google or other big names like those you mention. So while ti can be smooth, you are 1 HR screw up away from losing your status and being deported.

      I am glad you have worked for companies who have it down well enough that their HR has worked for you, but that is by no means the norm for smaller companies.

    28. Re:Amazing by MightyMartian · · Score: 2, Insightful

      All theories are essentially models.

      Nothing like being lectured to by someone who is completely ignorant of how science works.

      --
      The world's burning. Moped Jesus spotted on I50. Details at 11.
    29. Re:Amazing by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Actually a close look at his record shows he's *not* very good at real estate. In NYC, he's long been known as a clown whose inheritance has saved him from his stupidity more than once.

      The Republicans are running two blowhards who fail as businesspeople running on their records. Carly Fiorina is the other. You'd think the one doesn't have multiple bankruptcies directly tied to extremely bad management and that the other wasn't fired for practically running a legendary company straight into the ground.

    30. Re:Amazing by Crashmarik · · Score: 3, Interesting

      So is it settled science that we can base policy on, or is it still not giving accurate prediction over the time period in question ?

    31. Re: Amazing by Crashmarik · · Score: 4, Informative

      Yeah because that doesn't happen anyway
      http://www.mercurynews.com/sci...

      But hey never let a good crisis go to waste, when you can lie to move your agenda.

    32. Re: Amazing by ceoyoyo · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Sure it does. Business licenses are regulation. They can, and are, also abused sometimes. Joe Mayor's brother's kid gets that contractor license instead of Joe Blow. Import restrictions on things, including labour, are called "protectionism," which is the opposite of "free trade."

      Americans are weird. You're so afraid of (OMG) socialism that you just redefine whatever regulation you find desirable as "free market."

    33. Re:Amazing by MightyMartian · · Score: 2

      A theory does not have to be complete to have utility, and the insurance industry accepted AGW years ago.

      --
      The world's burning. Moped Jesus spotted on I50. Details at 11.
    34. Re:Amazing by N!k0N · · Score: 2

      Most laws he will try to pass probably will get vetoed by Congress or the Senate (forget who vetoes who) and when they try to pass laws, he's veto them because that is the sort of asshole he is.

      "Congress" is made up of the Senate (2 reps per state), and the House of Representatives (Reps dependent on state population).

      Pres gets to suggest new laws to congress. Congress can choose to vote or drop it on the floor.
      If a bill passes congress, the pres can veto. If the bill is vetoed, Congress can overrule with 2/3 majority in both houses.
      If a bill is passed into law, Supreme Court finally has the power to review and deem it unconstitutional.

    35. Re:Amazing by JackieBrown · · Score: 2, Insightful

      And that's the real issue. Trump makes a lot of claims and promises that would require Congress to cooperate, and looking at how Trump scores on the whole "get along with other people" index, it suggests that his Presidency, rather than being some great revolutionary change, would be four very long years of him shouting crude abuses at Congressional leadership.

      So more of the same? I guess he can switch to executive orders like our current president.

    36. Re:Amazing by geekopus · · Score: 3, Insightful

      A thread complaining about how broken American politics is includes a nugget like "[I] forget who vetoes who". Wow.

      We should bring back these:
      https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tyeJ55o3El0

    37. Re:Amazing by ArmoredDragon · · Score: 2

      Personally I won't vote for him because of his comments about Snowden.

    38. Re: Amazing by Lord+Kano · · Score: 2

      If you think that your experience is identical to everyone else's, you are the one who is deluded.

      Your experience is atypical. Outside of the Bay area, Silicon Valley and Manhattan, tech salaries are substantially lower.

      In my market, $70-90k is the range for most experienced IT personnel. Employers here heavily recruit H1B workers and pay them in the $75k range. It's cheaper because H1B contractors don't get paid the same kind of benefits, retirement, et cetera.

      LK

      --
      "Hi. This is my friend, Jack Shit, and you don't know him." - Lord Kano
    39. Re: Amazing by Beetle+B. · · Score: 2

      The process of changing jobs on an H1B involves exactly what it would do for a US citizen - go and interview, get the job, move.

      Except you need the government to get involved. Your paperwork needs to be approved, and there is an annual quota.

      Also, if you're Indian or Chinese, you have a long waiting list for the green card (friends in my company - some who joined as early as 2008, still don't have a priority date - for those who know what that means). Changing jobs can require redoing the labor certification which may put you in the back of the queue. For most H-1s, it's not a big deal. For Indians and Chinese who've been waiting for 5 years, adding an extra 5 years is not a real option.

      --
      Beetle B.
    40. Re:Amazing by Yoda222 · · Score: 4, Insightful

      We don't have an unified theory in physics yet. Should we stop to send electronics in space until we get something which can handle both quantum mechanic and gravity?

    41. Re:Amazing by Dragonslicer · · Score: 2

      He is trying to get things changed so that "buying American" is something doable again.

      How? By making enough of the population so hopelessly poor that they'll work for $0.50/hour?

    42. Re: Amazing by m00sh · · Score: 2

      I am glad that your experience on the H1-B Visa program has been a trivial task for you. That is not always the case though.

      At a previous company, we had an H1-B visa employee that we hired from another company and despite the fact he was sponsored by the other company and we were willing to sponsor him, he almost got deported because of the process of handing off from 1 company to another did not go smoothly.

      He worked for us for 3 years, and then went to another job and again, almost ended up deported. It was a nightmare on both ends.

      I also know a few H1-B visa employees at my current place of employee who have had similiar fears.

      Citizen loses a job or goes to another job, nothing happens. H1-B Visa person always has the possibility of being kicked out of the country if HR screws up the sponsorship.

      I am not part of the IT tech industry, but chemical manufacturing and the people I know have been electrical or chemical engineers and not working for Google or other big names like those you mention. So while ti can be smooth, you are 1 HR screw up away from losing your status and being deported.

      I am glad you have worked for companies who have it down well enough that their HR has worked for you, but that is by no means the norm for smaller companies.

      You're sensationalizing things. Saying almost got deported is like saying you almost died in a car crash due to a reckless driver cutting you off this morning.

      Plus, deportation is involuntary removal. Without a job and a means to make money, who would sit around and wait for to be deported? They would voluntarily go back.

      Plus, there is a grace period to look for a job (6 months without incurring a penalty). Additionally, you can always come back when you find a new job.

      Plus, it's not HRs to screw up. You have immigration lawyers do most of the paperwork. There is nothing an HR can do to screw anything up. The process is identical to hiring anyone else on the HR end. The lawyers might screw up but they can always make up with additional paperwork.

    43. Re:Amazing by xfizik · · Score: 3, Interesting

      That "someone" didn't get Russia, China, France and Britain to sit down and negotiate with Iran. Those countries never had as big as problem with nuclear Iran as the U.S. did/does. It was mostly the other way around - the U.S. threatening Iran and the others with leaving the talks and keeping the sanctions every other day.

    44. Re:Amazing by Anonymous+Cow+Ward · · Score: 2

      Likewise - the people I know who voted for Ron Paul did so because he fit their ideology as a whole better than the other two candidates, not because of any one issue. I'd be surprised if people who were single-issue voters chose Ron Paul.

      --
      Examine even your most deeply held beliefs. Nobody is always right.
    45. Re:Amazing by Coren22 · · Score: 2

      4 bankruptcies out of 100's of companies, 10 billion + in assets, yeah, he's a real failure there.

      --
      APK likes to ask for responses to the same things over and over. Maybe he just likes the responses?
    46. Re:Amazing by jp10558 · · Score: 3, Insightful

      If you believe Snowden at all, he and plenty of others tried through channels, and nothing happened for years. Are you also for people just sitting on 0days when companies decide to wait 14 years to patch?

      It sounded like responsible disclosure to me.

      And really, did he reveal anything we all didn't strongly suspect anyway? Not that made the news. Sure it pissed off a lot of people, but there wouldn't have been anything to tell if
      a) the govt was playing by the rules
      or
      b) actually responded to internal concerns in any real way vs covering it all up.

      Then again, maybe he's the best Russian agent in decades for discrediting the US. In either case, it seems like he did everyone some good in calling the NSA out - though whether it really makes any difference is hard to tell.

      --
      Opera, Proxomitron-Grypen,GPG 0x0A1C6EE3
  2. Trump by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Informative

    I'm starting to like this Trump guy.

  3. I like a Trump by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Funny

    I usually have a good, long trump when I'm on the can

  4. Awaiting Instructions From The Mother Ship by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Funny

    I sense a great disturbance in the Force, as though millions of independent-minded correct-thinking Slashdotters crying out in confusion about what opinion they're supposed to have about Donald Trump...

    1. Re:Awaiting Instructions From The Mother Ship by AC-x · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Even a stopped clock gives the right time twice a day.

    2. Re:Awaiting Instructions From The Mother Ship by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Insightful

      In that reasoning, a stopped clock is more often right than a clock that's running slightly slower or slightly faster than it should...

  5. Re:Standing up for American workers by SirDrinksAlot · · Score: 2

    Warren Buffett for tax reform because he doesn't think he or any other billionaire pays enough is also a mind f*k

  6. End the H1b program by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful

    It was there to fill a claimed temporary shortage, but it had the inevitable result of driving down wages and thus reducing people training to enter the field. It should have been killed a long time ago, there are other visa categories that can be matched for skilled labour.

    The H1b has some benefits for US employers, particularly it locks the employee in, they can't switch to a better job, Zuckerberg loves them, his slave army, but it gives H1Bs an advantage even for the same pay grade.

    Plus at the end, they leave, fully trained, and ready to work at your offshore division for a wage lower than the US and above the local wage, thus exporting the job and the skills.

  7. Scott Adams said it best... by Karmashock · · Score: 5, Insightful

    http://blog.dilbert.com/post/1...

    ""
    Like many of you, I have been entertained by the unstoppable clown car that is Donald Trump. On the surface, and several layers deep as well, Trump appears to be a narcissistic blow-hard with inadequate credentials to lead a country.

    The only problem with my analysis is that there is an eerie consistency to his success so far. Is there a method to it? Is there some sort of system at work under the hood?

    Probably yes. Allow me to describe some of the hypnosis and persuasion methods Mr. Trump has employed on you. (Most of you know I am a trained hypnotist and this topic is a hobby of mine.)
    ""

    Trump is a complicated subject... because its insane... but the situation is so nutty that he starts to make sense... which tells you how insane the situation is...

    Americans are furious. Both sides of the political spectrum.

    Republicans are pissed.
    Democrats are pissed.

    No one trusts anyone.
    Both side's politicians are full of shit.

    There is a general consensus that the elites are fucking over the people at large.

    The republicans tried to purge their own party with the "tea party" and similar things. Democrats only see this form their perspective but they don't realize that a fair amount of the animus was directed at the establishment republicans which is why the establishment doesn't like the tea party.

    The democrats tried to purge their own party with stuff like code pink, occupy wall street, and now black lives matter.

    And all of this is failing. The Establishment of both parties is very good at stonewalling this stuff. Black Lives Matter shows up to a Bernie speech and basically takes it over. They try the same thing at a Hillary speech and they don't even get in the front door. Think about that.

    And that's basically what has been going on. So what is Donald Trump?

    In my view, he's a purgative. A drug you take to induce vomiting. You accidentally eat poison... it has to get out. So you take a purgative... and you vomit.

    The American electorate has been dry heaving for decades. We're that cat that just can't seem to get up that golf ball sized fur ball. And we just stand there back arched... dry heaving trying to get it out.

    Do I like Donald? He's a weird guy. But I think BOTH parties should have someone like him running. Because Hillary is business as usual, Bernie is weak, and I've not seen anyone else out of them that is ready to challenge the establishment.

    To paraphrase Augustus, "things that can't go on forever - don't."... The status quo is not acceptable. The corruption, the incompetence, the deceit... it has to stop.

    We tried just voting them out. That failed.
    We tried splinter political factions. That failed.
    We tried lobbying and bribery to make them stop. That failed.

    So... we're open to the "unstoppable clown car" that is Donald Trump.

    If this fails as well... it just means the madness will be escalated another notch. This is not stopping.

    Something that I think the establishment is starting to wake up to is that people are f'ing furious. And while some may giggle at the fury, it is unwise to not appreciate that people behave increasingly unpredictably as the fury builds. The sort of rage that is building is the kind where you rip off your OWN arm and beat someone to death with it. The establishment can't handle that.

    I assume Donald is going to lose here... but whomever does win... whomever is in charge... they're going to have to change the way things are done. Because the whole "you need to pass the law to see what is in it" thing along with powerful people blatantly violating federal law and getting away with it... The big powerful companies fucking up and then getting bailed out by everyone that didn't fuck up.

    This is starting to get dangerous.

    --
    I've decided to stop wasting my time responding to AC trolls/sockpuppets... so if you want a response from me... login.
  8. Presidential elections are like Microsoft Windows by Anon-Admin · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Presidential elections are like software versions. They promise great new features, they promise to fix existing bugs.

    Once you buy it on the promises, the fix or feature is slotted for the next version or update.

    Most of the time you will forget it was promised or by they time they get to version 3, it will be a problem for the new development team.

    Remember, the president is like a CEO/Sales person. He can not really fix any of the issues, he can only suggest that it be fixed and push others to fix it.

  9. Clinically insane by ThatsNotPudding · · Score: 2

    The problem with the clinically insane is once in a while, they make a cogent point.

    They're still bug-fuck crazy, though.

  10. But but he's bad with women! by MikeRT · · Score: 5, Interesting

    It's amazing that we live in a society where people constantly complain that bad boys clean up with women and we have a bad boy worth billions, saying what's on the minds of 10s of millions while the "respectable candidates" dither and call for "civility" and people think he's going to lose hard with women.

    My prediction: if it's Sanders or O'Malley, he'll clean their clock with the female vote. Even Hillary will be shocked to find a lot of women defecting because Trump will be the first alpha maleish candidate we've had since at least Kennedy.

    People will vote for him because his response to things like China will not be civil, but "fuck you and fuck the horse you rode in on." Trump is a candidate that Putin will respect; most of the candidates from either party, not so much.

    1. Re:But but he's bad with women! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Informative

      "Trump will be the first alpha maleish candidate we've had since at least Kennedy"

      Did you forget Reagan?

  11. Blind squirrel finding an acorn by sjbe · · Score: 4, Insightful

    I'd be inclined to see whether his various business ventures have exhibited this sort of hiring policy; or whether he's a "Buy American!" sort of guy when looking for votes; and a buy Mexican sort of guy when looking for labor...

    Trump CLEARLY would never say anything that wasn't true or self serving... [/sarcasm]

    Seriously, anyone thinking of actually voting for this guy is an idiot. Trump may be good for a laugh but he is not presidential material. We need someone who will actually try to understand issues before spewing whatever dumb idea jumps first into his mouth. Someone who has more nuance to their rhetoric than calling people "losers" or "rapists". There should be some dignity to the office and dignity is something Trump completely lacks. He might have said something that appeals on this one issue but that hardly makes him the guy you should vote for.

    1. Re:Blind squirrel finding an acorn by konohitowa · · Score: 5, Funny

      We need someone who will actually try to understand issues before spewing whatever dumb idea jumps first into his mouth.

      Crap. Well, that completely ruins any hope for Biden.

  12. Re:well hot damn by Chris+Johnson · · Score: 4, Interesting

    Oh, he's intelligent all right.

    He'll lose, but could literally move to Texas, secede, and become King. He could open hotels in every red state and increase his wealth by an order of magnitude: and you think Sarah Palin was a media darling after the McCain/Palin campaign?

    Donald Trump doesn't have to win the Presidency to get an insanely huge return on THIS investment. Those aren't voters he's courting. They're obsessive lifelong customers bordering on worshippers, in a cult of personality that suits him just fine. This will make the Apple cult of Jobs look smalltime.

    In the Fox debate, Trump was literally on the central throne, the position of power, all the lesser pols lined up to the sides helplessly. He is loving this and will continue to love it and have the most hyoooogely awesome time ever.

    If I could have as much fun as Trump is having, telling the truth, I'd count it a life well spent.

  13. Re:well hot damn by Nidi62 · · Score: 3, Interesting

    One way to look at it is that Trump is already one of the richest people in the world -- he doesn't need to use the office to become rich, which is generally what happens when someone elected to office isn't yet rich.

    There are very few rich people who stop trying to become even richer. You can always have more money. Populist policies, setting up a cult of personality, a penchant for making money: Trump wants to be an American Putin.

    --
    The only thing necessary for evil to triumph is for it to be pitted against a slightly greater evil
  14. Trump taking a position at all on H1Bs by swb · · Score: 2

    ...is kind of interesting. Have we had any candidate outsdie of the far left who's done anything besides outright supporting the H1B program as big business likes it, quietly going along with it or ignoring it? It sure seems like the most common reactions among both parties are to either vigorously support H1B programs because they want support from big business or dot-com, pretend it isn't an issue or stake out some kind of multiculturist pro-immigration position claiming we need the world's best and brightest. The latter is at least a position that sounds rational but seldom includes changes to the program to eliminate abuses and usually just ends up being an entity that didn't get the visas they wanted for the people they wanted.

    To me that Trump is critical of this in at least a somewhat thoughtful way shows an interesting policy position. Either it shows Trump is more intelligent than he seems or at least is far savvier in staking out positions than might be expected from his bellicose pronouncements.

    It's too easy to say he's just pandering to natvist sentiments because I don't think the H1B visa program has the kind of visibility among the kinds of people who hate immigration because immigrants are brown and talk funny.

  15. Also in The Register by Sara+Chan · · Score: 5, Interesting
    There is another (I believe better) article about this in The Register: “Donald Trump dumps on Facebook's Mark Zuckerberg”. Some quotes from Trump, extracted from the article, are below.

    We graduate two times more Americans with STEM degrees each year than find STEM jobs, yet as much as two-thirds of entry-level hiring for IT jobs is accomplished through the H-1B program. More than half of H-1B visas are issued for the program's lowest allowable wage level, and more than eighty percent for its bottom two. Raising the prevailing wage paid to H-1Bs will force companies to give these coveted entry-level jobs to the existing domestic pool of unemployed native and immigrant workers in the U.S., instead of flying in cheaper workers from overseas. This will improve the number of black, Hispanic and female workers in Silicon Valley who have been passed over in favor of the H-1B program.

    Mark Zuckerberg’s personal Senator, Marco Rubio, has a bill to triple H-1Bs that would decimate women and minorities.

  16. Trump can't be any worse than by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Bush or Obama

  17. Re:Standing up for American workers by ranton · · Score: 4, Interesting

    Now when he starts screaming about capital gains being taxed higher, then I'll start listening to him.

    This is precisely what he has been screaming about. Here is the first article you will find if you google for "warren buffett capital gains tax":
    A Minimum Tax for the Wealthy. It was written by Warren Buffett in 2012. When he talks the decades when our capital gains taxes were almost double what they are now, he says "Never did anyone mention taxes as a reason to forgo an investment opportunity that I offered.

    He does want excessive incomes derived from capital gains to be taxed higher, so are you listening now?

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    -- All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing. -- Edmund Burke
  18. Re:Solve the actual underlying problem by tompaulco · · Score: 2

    Not the symptom or its manifestation.

    The fundamental problem is that few US citizens are motivated to attain high levels of education, and to earn their wages / wealth by contributing to society, rather than living off subsidies doled out by the guvment.

    What are you kidding? Or is this Bill Gates? This is a lie. 65.9 percent of high school graduates enroll in college for the next semester. That is almost 2/3, which is a pretty astonishingly high number. And that number is down from previous years.
    The REAL problem is that there are millions of unemployed college educated workers out there who can't get a job because companies have hired H1b at lower wages to do the job instead.

    --
    If you are not allowed to question your government then the government has answered your question.
  19. Re:Presidential elections are like Microsoft Windo by mu51c10rd · · Score: 3, Informative

    Remember, the president is like a CEO/Sales person. He can not really fix any of the issues, he can only suggest that it be fixed and push others to fix it.

    Well said...seems every election year, people forget that most of the issues the candidates claim they will fix, actually require Congress to fix them. The President relies upon 535 House members and 100 Senators to actually do any of their promises...hence, most don't happen.