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Can Living In Total Darkness For 5 Days "Reset" the Visual System?

the_newsbeagle writes: That's what one neuroscientist is aiming to find out. He wants to put patients with a type of amblyopia, the vision problem commonly called lazy eye, into the dark for 5 days. His hypothesis: When they emerge, their brains' visual cortices will be temporarily "plastic" and changeable, and may begin to process the visual signals from their bad eyes correctly. Before he could do this study, though, he had to do a test run to figure out logistics. So he himself lived in a pitch black room for 5 days. One finding: Eating ravioli in the dark is hard.

155 comments

  1. This is called Kaya Kalpa in yoga by Visarga · · Score: 5, Interesting

    It's supposed that if you can do it for 10 days, your visual cortex will start processing other input and add its extra processing power to your meditations. Here's a link to a presentation: http://hridaya-yoga.com/how-to...

    1. Re:This is called Kaya Kalpa in yoga by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Funny

      That seems like a really bad idea for people who still need their visual cortex for vision. If you want to jack up the wiring in your brain, just abuse dangerous drugs. It'll save you a lot of time.

    2. Re:This is called Kaya Kalpa in yoga by viniciuscb · · Score: 3, Informative

      Tenzin Wangyal Rinpoche, a guru of the Bon (shamanic) buddhist tradition describes in his book "Wonders of Natural Mind" his experiences in a traditional tibetan "dark retreat" of 49 days (among other things).

      By his account he said that after some days he started to experience mind-created visions and that he lost the notion of time. He said that the 49 days seemed to be, in the end, like twelve days. He also said that he had some training before the retreat, because people that does it without some instruction can be overwhelmed by the visions, which at some point seem to be very real.

    3. Re:This is called Kaya Kalpa in yoga by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Life is a fraud too, which, coincidentally is also documented in the Vedas.

    4. Re:This is called Kaya Kalpa in yoga by umafuckit · · Score: 3, Interesting

      That seems like a really bad idea for people who still need their visual cortex for vision. If you want to jack up the wiring in your brain, just abuse dangerous drugs. It'll save you a lot of time.

      I don't know what you mean by "jack up the wiring" but mushrooms will probably get you there and they're not dangerous.

    5. Re:This is called Kaya Kalpa in yoga by swillden · · Score: 2

      Makes sense, actually. If your idle visual cortex starts doing other things (whether useful or not), it stands to reason that the result would be interpreted as a visual hallucination.

      --
      Note to ACs: I usually delete AC replies without reading them. If you want to talk to me, log in.
    6. Re: This is called Kaya Kalpa in yoga by karlandtanya · · Score: 4, Interesting

      It took about 5 minutes for me, but had to be *total* dakness. So dark I couldn't tell if my eyes were open or shut. This was in a lab where we were doin nuclear emission spectroscopy (just gas discharge tubes). Any outside light would pollute the results, so the lab was really dark until we turned on the juice.
      During that period I could see as clearly as i'm seeing this screen flowing sheets of glowing pastel paint sliding down a wall that wasn't there.
      Not true hallucinations of course--by definition if you know it's not real it's not a hallucination. Phosphenes I think they were called.

      Anyhow, very beautiful and unusual. I don't think my lab partners saw anything--at least they didn't say they did. Or they were afraid people would think they were nuts.

      Later i blacked out my dorm room & reproduced the effect. And learned it's really hard to produce absolute darkness. Tinfoil is *full* of tiny holes! And black paint is not as opaque as it seems.

      --
      "Reality is that which, when you stop believing in it, doesn't go away." - Philip K. Dick
    7. Re:This is called Kaya Kalpa in yoga by Boronx · · Score: 1
    8. Re: This is called Kaya Kalpa in yoga by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Just a friendly correction- your 'by definition' statement isn't accurate, as it is completely possible to experience hallucinations that the senses register as identical to real world phenomenon, and still retain categorical understanding and clarity that differentiates between reality and the hallucination. An example of this would be the conscious observance of formication delusion (registered on the surface of the skin) with the simultaneous experience of actually physically feeling the manifestation, yet still knowing what you are feeling is not actually taking place. Another easier example is the fact that you can experience auditory hallucinations that you cognitively know are not actual voices, yet you are aware that you are hearing them the exact same as you hear any real voice, resonating and processing as external auditory stimuli experientially identical to real sonic stimuli.

    9. Re: This is called Kaya Kalpa in yoga by tehcyder · · Score: 3, Funny

      Tinfoil is *full* of tiny holes!

      I wondered why the Lizard Overlords' thought waves were still getting through.

      --
      To have a right to do a thing is not at all the same as to be right in doing it
    10. Re:This is called Kaya Kalpa in yoga by dingleberrie · · Score: 4, Funny

      I don't know what you mean by "jack up the wiring" but mushrooms will probably get you there and they're not dangerous.

      And they grow in the dark!
      I'm sensing an opportunity for synergy here.

    11. Re:This is called Kaya Kalpa in yoga by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Reusing processing power that originally evolved to solve graphical problems to now solve other problems? Sounds very much like the human equivalent to CUDA :).

    12. Re:This is called Kaya Kalpa in yoga by RockDoctor · · Score: 2

      mushrooms will probably get you there and they're not dangerous.

      Some mushrooms are not dangerous (and are hallucinogenic). Others are dangerous (and hallucinogenic). And still others are dangerous (and are not hallucinogenic).

      Generalising, it is not safe to rely upon generalisations about the safety of mushrooms.

      --
      Birds are not dinosaur descendants;birds are dinosaurs, for all useful meanings of "birds", "are" and "dinosaurs"
    13. Re:This is called Kaya Kalpa in yoga by RockDoctor · · Score: 3, Interesting

      By his account he said that after some days he started to experience mind-created visions and that he lost the notion of time. He said that the 49 days seemed to be, in the end, like twelve days.

      That is pretty standard for isolation. If you're out of the normal day-night cycle, most people tend to drift round to a longer-than-24 hours circadian rhythm. A forend of mine did a number of experiments on this in various cave systems in Yorkshire in the 1960s, where he'd have light from lanterns he controlled, and food / water dumps would be left in the cave at irregular intervals (to remove circadian prompting). His body clock went up to something in excess of 30 hours.

      Of course, since he had lanterns (OK, miner's light) to turn on, he wasn't experimenting on "resetting" his visual cortex, but on removing the circadian prompt. But relevant.

      Anyone who has been a caver and has been waiting for several hours for the rest of the party to come back (or catch up), will have turned the lamp off to save the battery. (Of course, the wise troglodyte carries spare lights. but you still keep your system-level redundancy.) And the colours come and the patterns happen. and you hear the water getting louder and you wonder about whether it's raining up top. Some people freak. Most people turn the light back onto the low power setting.

      --
      Birds are not dinosaur descendants;birds are dinosaurs, for all useful meanings of "birds", "are" and "dinosaurs"
    14. Re:This is called Kaya Kalpa in yoga by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You meditation whack jobs are no better than psychic surgeons, no better than "healing crystals," no better than any other scam a common grifter or snake-oil salesman would have had at their disposal. Just another "cure-all" that's existed for centuries and still hasn't solved all the problems it's claimed to address, what a fucking coincidence.

      And the captcha word? "Frauds."

      There's a lot of what you describe going on out there.

      But at the same time, social scientists have documented some real benefits from meditation in studies. It's no longer considered a fraud. Many of the claims regarding it, certainly, especially by those selling something or posing as religious leaders. But there is some truth hiding behind the obfuscations, nonsense, and marketing. It's not magic, and it's not as spectacular as the more extreme proponents would have us believe, but that's actually what a realistic person would expect.

      You should be able to get references to the studies from the usual sources, or even by wandering over to your local college library and browsing the psychology section.

    15. Re: This is called Kaya Kalpa in yoga by ChristopherPatrickTa · · Score: 1

      It took about 5 minutes for me, but had to be *total* dakness. So dark I couldn't tell if my eyes were open or shut. This was in a lab where we were doin nuclear emission spectroscopy (just gas discharge tubes). Any outside light would pollute the results, so the lab was really dark until we turned on the juice. During that period I could see as clearly as i'm seeing this screen flowing sheets of glowing pastel paint sliding down a wall that wasn't there. Not true hallucinations of course--by definition if you know it's not real it's not a hallucination. Phosphenes I think they were called.

      Anyhow, very beautiful and unusual. I don't think my lab partners saw anything--at least they didn't say they did. Or they were afraid people would think they were nuts.

      Later i blacked out my dorm room & reproduced the effect. And learned it's really hard to produce absolute darkness. Tinfoil is *full* of tiny holes! And black paint is not as opaque as it seems.

      5 minutes is not long enough to fully adapt the human visual system see: http://www.visualexpert.com/im... 5-8 minutes your cones (the photoreceptors concentrated in the central visual field that are used to encode color) and 20+ minutes for the rod (what we use to see in low light situation) to full adapt. Phosphenes are normal and can be produced by placing slight pressure on the eye. Also interesting dark adaptation can be done independently in each eye. Black out one eye for 8 minutes or so (easier to do than a whole room) then open both your eyes. It is a fun and a little disorienting experience if done correctly.

  2. Not that hard by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

    One finding: Eating ravioli in the dark is hard.

    He should try being blind.

    1. Re:Not that hard by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      And you measure how close he is to that by measuring the hair on his palms... It's scientific!

    2. Re:Not that hard by Translation+Error · · Score: 1

      He is.

      --
      When someone says, "Any fool can see ..." they're usually exactly right.
  3. not even a lil LED ? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Wow, if you can't even have the slightest, dimmest little LED and you were in complete darkness, can you imagine eating, shitting, peeing? And what can you do? listen to music? Make phone calls from an old landline phone or maybe a cell phone with a disconnected screen and using SIRI to dial calls... Even being able to do those things, I think I'd go out of my mind.

    1. Re: not even a lil LED ? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Funny

      Yes that is why blind people are crazy.

    2. Re: not even a lil LED ? by BarbaraHudson · · Score: 1

      I've done that for a month or so a cou

      --
      "Transparent" is a shit show that trades on every stereotype going. A man in drag is NOT a transsexual.
    3. Re:not even a lil LED ? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Funny

      ... And what can you do? ...

      Edit Slashdot stories.

    4. Re: not even a lil LED ? by BarbaraHudson · · Score: 1, Interesting

      I've had to do it for weeks at a time when my eyes become extremely photosensitive, and my family thinks I'm crazy, so maybe you're right. But if he thinks eating ravioli in the dark, he should try baking biscuits from scratch without a timer. They were good, but it was kind of messy.

      --
      "Transparent" is a shit show that trades on every stereotype going. A man in drag is NOT a transsexual.
    5. Re:not even a lil LED ? by phantomfive · · Score: 1

      Myself, I would get a braille computer.

      --
      "First they came for the slanderers and i said nothing."
    6. Re:not even a lil LED ? by narcc · · Score: 1

      Braille displays are ridiculously expensive. Most blind computer users just use a screen reader. NVDA is a popular free alternative to the overpriced Window-Eyes and JAWS, well-worth your time if you're interested.

    7. Re:not even a lil LED ? by phantomfive · · Score: 1

      Most blind computer users just use a screen reader.

      Do they? How are you so sure? The small sample size of blind people I know uses a screen reader (you can get them for ~$3000)

      --
      "First they came for the slanderers and i said nothing."
    8. Re:not even a lil LED ? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      They've had half a century to get the price down...

      https://www.youtube.com/watch?...

    9. Re:not even a lil LED ? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      iOS has a bunch of features to make it blind-accessible. With a bit of practice you can accomplish quite a bit.

  4. Wait for the results. by Seor+Jojoba · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Why is it a story that someone has a hypothesis? Do the tests, publish your findings.

    1. Re:Wait for the results. by alvinrod · · Score: 2

      From reading the article it sounds like some got a hold of his recruitment email and decided it sounded interesting enough to write up an article, which might even help him recruit more individuals for the actual study.

      At least it's more interesting than most of the crap that gets posted online today such as top ten lists of celebrities who have pets that look like other celebrities or whatever Bennet Haselton is doing.

    2. Re:Wait for the results. by hey! · · Score: 2

      Well he *is* going to test the hypothesis. But he has to test the *procedure* as well on a smaller scale before he uses it on his research subjects.

      People underestimate how much of science is like this. Advancing science isn't just a matter of creating more theoretical knowledge; a lot of the time it's about advancing know-how.

      --
      Post may contain irony: discontinue use if experiencing mood swings, nausea or elevated blood pressure.
    3. Re:Wait for the results. by pj2541 · · Score: 1

      The new paradigm in science is 1: Publish your thesis. 2: Never do the tests at all. 3: Deny any wrongdoing. 4: Profit (achieve tenure, et cetera.)

    4. Re:Wait for the results. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Not to mention the concern about not having light for 5 days may be hard. Just consult the blind, they do it their whole lives.

      Oh no, something may be hard, run!

    5. Re:Wait for the results. by ChristopherPatrickTa · · Score: 1

      Full disclosure: I am familiar with the researchers and had an opportunity to participate in this project. The work is ongoing. This research is woefully underfunded at present and based on solid research done in animal models. One could also ask, "Why write stories about humans going to Mars? They've not designed/built any of the hypothesized vechiles." The answer is, in the current scientific climate, this kind of story is not a non-story, but the difficulty in attracting funding in this area even for very promising project.

  5. Where are his grad students? by xxxJonBoyxxx · · Score: 5, Funny

    >> Eating ravioli in the dark is hard.

    Isn't this what grad students were invented for?

    1. Re:Where are his grad students? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      But how would the grad students be able to find him in the dark to feed him the ravioli?

  6. Testing by Firethorn · · Score: 5, Interesting

    I think that it's that he's willing to use himself as a test subject before inflicting it on others, fairly rare today.

    Not that I suggest a heart surgeon do a transplant on himself or that a doctor inject himself with insulin if he's not diabetic...

    But living in complete darkness for ~5 days can have unexpected developments/difficulties, it's probably best to NOT inflict that on kids until you know what to look for.

    --
    I don't read AC A human right
    1. Re:Testing by doconnor · · Score: 5, Informative

      Barry Marshall, who discovered ulcers where caused by a bacterial infection, tested it by drink a petri dish of the bacteria and got gastritis and then cured himself with antibiotics.

      Got the Nobel prize.

    2. Re:Testing by Electricity+Likes+Me · · Score: 4, Informative

      There's a long history of doctors and scientists in medicine testing their ideas on themselves.

    3. Re:Testing by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      There's a long history of doctors and scientists in medicine testing their ideas on themselves.

      Yes, although it is the fastest way to get a qualitative result it is usually frowned upon... best wait until you have some meaningful result tested in a controlled way before you go talking to the press about how you were running human experiments on yourself.

    4. Re:Testing by h33t+l4x0r · · Score: 1

      Nowadays he'd get complaints for using antibiotics irresponsibly. You're going to create super-ulcers, Barry!

    5. Re: Testing by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Just like Dr HErman ROIN

    6. Re:Testing by losfromla · · Score: 1

      I think what you meant to say was that he had it verified by his strictest opposition, he already knew it would work as he had done other tests. What he did was submit to the acid test under conditions that were indisputable.

      --
      Only I can judge you.
    7. Re:Testing by azcoyote · · Score: 1

      Eh, I'd live in the dark for 5 days if I were still bringing in paychecks during that time.

      --
      Incipiamus, fratres, servire Domino Deo, quia hucusque vix vel parum in nullo profecimus.
    8. Re:Testing by RockDoctor · · Score: 1

      I think that it's that he's willing to use himself as a test subject before inflicting it on others, fairly rare today.

      While that is fairly uncommon today, that's not the case here. Isolation experiments have been carried out in various forms for a long period of time. Some have used volunteers (e.g. the ones I describe above), some have involved literal torture, but the field is definitely not short of prior experimentation. The precise question which this researcher wants to answer may not have been addressed, but the broad limits of reasonable volunteer safety are reasonably established.

      --
      Birds are not dinosaur descendants;birds are dinosaurs, for all useful meanings of "birds", "are" and "dinosaurs"
  7. Solitary confinement by dmaul99 · · Score: 1, Flamebait

    Why not just go to any maximum security prison and pull any of the number of guys they have locked up in "the hole" and check it out? They're in there far longer than 5 days. Heck at gitmo not only are they in pitch black for 24/7 for weeks but they get deafening rock music blared at them the whole time too.

    1. Re:Solitary confinement by jimbolauski · · Score: 1

      There is light in "the hole".

      --
      Knowledge = Power
      P= W/t
      t=Money
      Money = Work/Knowledge so the less you know the more you make
  8. Not a good idea by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Funny

    It is pitch black. You are likely to be eaten by a grue.

    1. Re:Not a good idea by KatchooNJ · · Score: 0

      Ah... and me without points to give out today. :-) That one brought a smile to my face.

      --
      "Never give up, for that is just the time and place when the tide will change." -Harriet Beecher Stowe ^_^
    2. Re: Not a good idea by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      Not if you pay someone to do a surgical shine-job on your eyeballs.

  9. Overkill by nospam007 · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Why not just glue them a mask on their face?
    Way cheaper.

    1. Re:Overkill by TWX · · Score: 1

      Probably because the incentive to cheat would be too great.

      --
      Do not look into laser with remaining eye.
    2. Re:Overkill by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Not if it's locked and the doctor has the key

    3. Re:Overkill by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      They make black-out contacts, but they aren't perfect. Don't google unless you can imagine what they are for ...

    4. Re:Overkill by losfromla · · Score: 1

      I like this suggestion, a whole mask covering the face and head with no light leaks and only holes for the mouth and nose, now where can I find one of those...?

      --
      Only I can judge you.
    5. Re:Overkill by Solandri · · Score: 1

      Most people probably haven't experienced total darkness. I experienced it while working late at a campsite (astronomy camp). I had to walk from the lab to my cabin on a moonless night with thick fog, no lights. You literally cannot see your hand in front of your face. You can't even tell if your eyes are open or closed. It was one of those epiphany moments where you're experiencing something completely new for the first time in your life. I remember thinking, wow, so this is what it's like to be blind. I had to find my way back to the cabin entirely by feel and my memory of the path.

      Anyway, a mask or bag over your head isn't going to cut it. Even the photographic dark rooms I've been in always had a faint glimmer of light leaking in somewhere - a point of reference that told me which way I was facing. Fortunately the walk back to my cabin was downhill with grass on the edges of the path so I could tell I was sort of going in the right way. I don't think I would've made it if it had been completely flat and all grass.

    6. Re:Overkill by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I went caving one time. Yes, pitch pitch black is a new kindof blackness.

    7. Re:Overkill by tehcyder · · Score: 1

      They make black-out contacts, but they aren't perfect. Don't google unless you can imagine what they are for ...

      Can you give us a clue?

      --
      To have a right to do a thing is not at all the same as to be right in doing it
    8. Re:Overkill by Talderas · · Score: 1

      Try your friendly adult toy store.

      --
      "Lack of speed can be overcome. In the worst case by patience." --Znork
    9. Re:Overkill by Cederic · · Score: 1

      Halloween costumes, according to Google. Maybe I should've searched for something other than 'black-out contacts'.

    10. Re:Overkill by dingleberrie · · Score: 1

      If you can sell an HD virtual reality system that simulates being in the dark you may be able to make a tidy profit.

    11. Re:Overkill by RockDoctor · · Score: 1

      Most people probably haven't experienced total darkness. I experienced it while working late at a campsite (astronomy camp).

      Speaking as a person who has been a student on astronomy camps, a photographer back in the days when you loaded your own film into the cassettes in the dark, and a caver : you didn't experience total darkness then.

      For a start, it would have taken your eyes 20 minutes to a half hour to achieve dull "dark adaptation" to reach full sensitivity to light.

      --
      Birds are not dinosaur descendants;birds are dinosaurs, for all useful meanings of "birds", "are" and "dinosaurs"
  10. Eating pasta in the dark, for science? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I'm a fucking Rhodes scholar then.

  11. Blindfold Anyone? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

    Why not use a blindfold for 5 days?

    Are these people stupid or just trying to make everything more difficult than it seems?

    1. Re:Blindfold Anyone? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      TFA states that their hypothesis called for as close to "no photons" as possible. They brought in photo-sensitive paper to ensure at the end of the test their was no light whatsoever present in the room. Previous experiments with lab rats showed increased plasticity in the visual cortex after being immersed in complete darkness for a period of several days. A simple blindfold wouldn't be able to meet those conditions.

    2. Re:Blindfold Anyone? by Etcetera · · Score: 4, Interesting

      Why not use a blindfold for 5 days?

      Are these people stupid or just trying to make everything more difficult than it seems?

      A) Some light is likely to get in, and they would need to be in a mostly-dark room regardless to account for slip-ups. Even then, they wanted to get 100% darkness, not 99.5% darkness (by timeslice)
      B) Ever worn a sleep mask or eye pillow? Your eye does different things when it's covered or has pressure on it (and a lot of pressure would need to be applied here, most likely). Having your eye "free" to look around (but having no source of light in the room) is likely to be physiologically different than wearing a dark blindfold.

    3. Re:Blindfold Anyone? by Coren22 · · Score: 1

      How do you check the photosensitive paper?

      --
      APK likes to ask for responses to the same things over and over. Maybe he just likes the responses?
    4. Re:Blindfold Anyone? by narcc · · Score: 1

      Do a quick search for the term "photograph". That should explain it all.

    5. Re:Blindfold Anyone? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      A simple blindfold wouldn't be able to meet those conditions.

      A more complex blindfold surely would do. With 3d-printers everywhere, it should be relatively easy to create one that fits precisely to the shape of the head.

    6. Re:Blindfold Anyone? by omnichad · · Score: 1

      Put it in fixing solution before turning on the lights. If it comes out white, there was no light. This is with photographic film negative. Not sure if there is any real difference.

    7. Re:Blindfold Anyone? by Firethorn · · Score: 1

      It's effectively like a simple Polaroid photo sheet. If it comes out black, not exposed to light. If it comes out white, exposed.

      --
      I don't read AC A human right
    8. Re:Blindfold Anyone? by slew · · Score: 5, Interesting

      FWIW The most common treatment today for lazy eye (Amblyopia) is to simply patch (i.e., think pirate patch) your good eye and hope your brain will stop relying on your good eye and start learning how to see again through eye that the brain was ignoring (suppressing). So it is basically a type of blindfold for one eye.

      For children with lazy eye, the patch is generally worn for a few hours a day for 6 months to a year. The older you are, the less well patching works (presumably because your brain is less plastic in these regards).

      However, new research suggests that there might be a way to retrain your brain (without resorting to trying to "reboot" your brain) by a form of vision therapy that attempts to reinvigorate the part of your brain that uses both eyes to see, by forcing it to exercise.

      One researcher has been experimenting with having people play a special version of tetris where each eye gets part of the information and the brain has to integrate both views to successfully play the game. Initially each eye would get a version that would be easy to fuse (depending on the problem that caused the lazy eye, such as out-of-alignment/direction), as the treatment progressed, the versions would progress toward the normal viewing. Seems like they got reasonably good initial results which were better than patching

      Maybe not every problem needs to be solved by rebooting the system.

    9. Re:Blindfold Anyone? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Yea, I've gotten so use to self-correcting my own double-vision. That it's second nature. I still have troubles, but it's manageable. Patching, and surgery never really did much for me.

    10. Re:Blindfold Anyone? by MrKaos · · Score: 1

      For children with lazy eye, the patch is generally worn for a few hours a day for 6 months to a year. The older you are, the less well patching works (presumably because your brain is less plastic in these regards).

      I had lazy eye when I was a child and the treatment was eye exercises using different cards with shapes, focal exercises (a string with focus markers on them held out from the face) and a pen that you move around and maintain focus on. I got some awesome headaches doing it however I didn't need glasses for 40 odd years.

      Recently it has made a re-appearance and I was dismayed to find that I was just prescribed glasses, which help, but even for the few weeks I've had them I've noticed that it just makes the good eye less capable of seeing and the lazy eye even worse, so I stopped wearing them because they seemed to be making the condition worse.

      I'm doing the exercises again and working through the headaches and regularly cover the good eye to force the lazy eye to focus, it seems better however I have to make a conscious effort to focus and another to not let my eyes go *out* of focus.

      It is annoying and I hope this research will help. Thanks for the link to the tetris game treatment, which will be the next thing to try.

      --
      My ism, it's full of beliefs.
    11. Re:Blindfold Anyone? by houghi · · Score: 1

      I would also assume that you start with &00% blackness, because if it fails, you know that darness is not a solution. If a mask fails, you have to still test the 100% darkness to see if that was the reason.

      And even if the mask is 100% effective, it is also much easier that it will fail as a 100% mask. e.g. when you eat, you need to open the part at your mouth. When you sleep, it can not be removed and ths sleep light affected or it moves a bit unknown to anybody and THAT lets the test fail.

      Way to hard to use a mask. Much easier to have a black room.

      --
      Don't fight for your country, if your country does not fight for you.
    12. Re:Blindfold Anyone? by codeButcher · · Score: 1

      A relative's son was also diagnosed with "lazy eye" and got the eye patch and exercises. However, he also was a bit lazy doing those. The solution was to provide him with an air rifle fitted with a collimator sight (requires both eyes looking at the same spot to aim) - of course together with strict safety/responsibility training. Seems to have done the trick. As a side effect, the pre-teen lad has gradually been introduced to "real" fire arms, and is now one of the best shots at his dad's shooting club even in competition with adults. Seems that the self-esteem from a "real" accomplishment is valuable: he is on the quiet side but happy and confident, not cocky or moody, seems not having any need to prove anything.

      --
      Free, as in your money being freed from the confines of your account.
    13. Re:Blindfold Anyone? by SuiteSisterMary · · Score: 1

      Take photosensitive paper off of wall.
      Place into light-proof envelope.
      Open small hatch in wall, which leads to drop box.
      Place envelope into drop box.
      Close hatch.
      Alert the people outside the experimental room that they can now open their hatch, and retrieve the envelope.
      They then take the envelope to a photographic darkroom and proceed as normal.

      --
      Vintage computer games and RPG books available. Email me if you're interested.
    14. Re:Blindfold Anyone? by RockDoctor · · Score: 1
      You're assuming that your "light-proof envelope" is a light-proof envelope, and that your darkroom is completely dark. The envelope is hard to check, but I've never been in a darkroom that was completely dark (though I've never been in a commercial darkroom ; only ones built by amateurs). After an hour or two, you can see the light seeping around the door frames, the key hole cover, etc. A dark room doesn't need to be completely dark, just dark enough to not significantly affect your film or papers. Of course, you keep your materials in black heavy-duty polythene bags inside heavy cardboard boxes, themselves normally in a closed cupboard. And even that won't keep the cosmic rays out - which will eventually fog your film (or paper).

      I'd expect that commercial dark rooms do exactly as caves do : lots of right angle turns between daylight and the victim, and thick walls of stone. Close-fitting doors and black paint in the angles help, but you still need several sets of right angles to get to the point that you need your full half-hour or so of dark adaptation to be able to see the leaks.

      --
      Birds are not dinosaur descendants;birds are dinosaurs, for all useful meanings of "birds", "are" and "dinosaurs"
    15. Re:Blindfold Anyone? by SuiteSisterMary · · Score: 1

      They've somehow managed to do this processing for decades, so I'm sure they have some method.

      --
      Vintage computer games and RPG books available. Email me if you're interested.
    16. Re:Blindfold Anyone? by RockDoctor · · Score: 1
      Oh they have. I was first loading film into cassettes in the mid-70s and was still using the same darkroom in the mid-90s. The human eye is considerably more sensitive than still photographic film of those eras, so a darkroom that was perfectly good for working with 400 or even 800 ASA film (27-30 DIN) could have sufficient light leaks that you'd be able to tell where the door was, and frequently where the door lock's striker plate was because that would have a brighter leak around it.

      You wouldn't leave your film (exposed or unexposed) laying on the work bench for hours on end, but you could perfectly safely spend a couple of minutes "walking" a roll of exposed film into a developing spiral before putting the film into the developing tank (an effectively opaque cylinder itself) and starting on the next film. My father and I put such techniques into play routinely doing the B/W photography for family weddings etc, and had got our "shot to print" time down to under 2 hours by team work, and it really pissed off the professional photographers that we'd be at the reception giving away lots of enprints and modest numbers of 8x10s when they would be a week away from delivering anything to the people who'd just paid them a week's wages. I had other friends since who did newsroom photography for newspapers in the 70s to 90s, and they really pushed the boat out - chemicals in 30% methanol ; flaming the films to dry them quicker ; skipping the enprint or proof sheet stage to choose the print negatives directly ...

      Ah, lost skills.

      --
      Birds are not dinosaur descendants;birds are dinosaurs, for all useful meanings of "birds", "are" and "dinosaurs"
  12. Works better w/multiple "friendly" test subjects by Nonesuch · · Score: 1
    Doesn't sound like a fun process to go through by yourself, could be interesting, in a large enough space, with other participants.

    Otherwise, lots of books on tape. And whatever sort of setup they use when teaching braille, might as well come out with a new skill.

  13. Number 2 by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Funny

    How can you tell if you are done wiping?

    1. Re:Number 2 by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Funny

      Taste each wad of paper before dropping it into the toilet. Duh!!!

    2. Re:Number 2 by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      I'm guessing sort of like scratch and sniff. Wipe till it the paper smells clean.

    3. Re: Number 2 by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Informative

      Fold paper in half; if it sticks together, keeping wiping.

    4. Re: Number 2 by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Funny

      Fold paper in half; if it sticks together, keeping wiping.

      +1. This one knows his shit.

    5. Re:Number 2 by TWX · · Score: 1

      Equip the water closet with a bidet.

      --
      Do not look into laser with remaining eye.
    6. Re:Number 2 by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      How can you tell if you are done wiping?

      Maybe he has one of Japanese washing/spraying toilets.

    7. Re: Number 2 by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Another option would be to use a bidet.

    8. Re:Number 2 by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Wash with water and soap

    9. Re: Number 2 by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Bidet

    10. Re:Number 2 by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      That's not what a bidet is for and it wouldn't be practical for this situation. The solution is a Japanese toilet.

    11. Re:Number 2 by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Use the flashlight app on your phone.

  14. Ravioli tastes better by Overzeetop · · Score: 5, Funny

    Yes, but eating the grad students in the dark is really no easier, and the ravioli tends to taste better.

    --
    Is it just my observation, or are there way too many stupid people in the world?
    1. Re:Ravioli tastes better by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Funny

      I've eaten a grad student in the dark. It wasn't that hard. I knew anatomy and she appreciated the effort.

    2. Re:Ravioli tastes better by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Funny

      It wasn't that hard.

      You're doing it wrong.

    3. Re:Ravioli tastes better by TJ_Phazerhacki · · Score: 1

      Wish this could be +6.

      --
      Physics is nothing like religion. If it was, we'd have an easier time trying to raise money!
  15. Scotonauts by Noah+Haders · · Score: 1, Funny

    Sounds like scrotonauts lol

  16. Hypothesis: Patch the good eye by scsirob · · Score: 1

    If this works at all, then it would be interesting to apply a patch/mask to the good eye when coming out of the dark and wear that patch a few more days. Although I have no proof whatsoever, my hypothesis would be that this would train the brain to 'trust' the image from the amblyopical eye. After another week, release the 'good' eye and see if this balances out vision.

    --
    To Terminate, or not to Terminate, that's the question - SCSIROB
    1. Re: Hypothesis: Patch the good eye by BarbaraHudson · · Score: 1

      Decades ago one of my sisters had a lazy eye. She had to wear an eye patch on the good eye for a while, that's all. Simple solution that doesn't interfere much with their daily lives.

      --
      "Transparent" is a shit show that trades on every stereotype going. A man in drag is NOT a transsexual.
    2. Re: Hypothesis: Patch the good eye by Firethorn · · Score: 1

      Decades ago one of my sisters had a lazy eye. She had to wear an eye patch on the good eye for a while, that's all. Simple solution that doesn't interfere much with their daily lives.

      Fixes a decent percentage of the population, sure, but what about those for which the eyepatch fails?

      --
      I don't read AC A human right
    3. Re: Hypothesis: Patch the good eye by drinkypoo · · Score: 3, Funny

      Fixes a decent percentage of the population, sure, but what about those for which the eyepatch fails?

      Get an eyepatch with a better elastic. There's no excuse for an eyepatch to fail.

      --
      "You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"
    4. Re: Hypothesis: Patch the good eye by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Fixes a decent percentage of the population, sure, but what about those for which the eyepatch fails?

      When I was younger I also had to wear an eyepatch. My specialist even attempted corrective surgery on the muscles that control my eye. Nothing ever really helped completely. It's manageable, I can 're-align' my sight on my own after years of self-correcting. But, it's not a permanent solution.

    5. Re: Hypothesis: Patch the good eye by MadKeithV · · Score: 1

      I think you should apply the patch to a test server first, though, just to be sure.

    6. Re: Hypothesis: Patch the good eye by gstoddart · · Score: 1

      I blame it on all those low-cost H1B pirates, they're undermining the integrity of the eye-patch industry.

      --
      Lost at C:>. Found at C.
    7. Re: Hypothesis: Patch the good eye by volmtech · · Score: 1

      Four decades ago my infant daughter was diagnosed with lazy eye so we put a patch on her good eye. She constantly tried to pull it off so after a few days I took it off of her. A few years latter it was determined she had optic nerve damage from a birth defect and had no sight in that eye. We were blinding her with that patch.

  17. Isn't that what he tried? by grimJester · · Score: 1

    No text

  18. Nope. by BronsCon · · Score: 0

    Apparently, nobody can do that.

    --
    APK quotes people (including myself) without context and should not be trusted. Just thought you should know.
  19. Answer: by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    .oN

  20. Re:Using the potty. by DigiShaman · · Score: 0

    Easy, you wipe until you think it's dry, then smell. If oder, keep wiping. If no oder, you're clean. Haven't you ever smelled your own shit? Don't lie!

    --
    Life is not for the lazy.
  21. Go talk to miners by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    who have been trapped without light awaiting rescue.

  22. Re:Using the potty. by grub · · Score: 1

    What if he touched poo-poo to his nose? Gross. (btw sorry about the misplaced commas and such in my post, talking about poo-poo while in the dark gets me excited.)

    --
    Trolling is a art,
  23. Re:Using the potty. by no1nose · · Score: 1

    It's like I'm wiping a marker... https://www.youtube.com/watch?...

  24. Ravioli hypothesis... by pr100 · · Score: 1

    Clearly we need a well funded study, followed by publication in a prestigious journal to substantiate finding about the difficulty of eating ravioli in the dark...

    1. Re:Ravioli hypothesis... by pr0fessor · · Score: 2

      ravioli, marinara, blender, and drink it from a glass. should work for steak, potatoes, and gravy too.

    2. Re:Ravioli hypothesis... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      > ravioli, marinara, blender, and drink it from a glass

      Operating a blender in the dark, doesn't sound like a recipe I want to follow.

  25. film by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Each day the two men tacked up a large piece of photosensitive film used in radiology. Days later, after they’d left the room, Backus developed those five sheets of film and was gratified to find them pure black, indicating zero exposure to light.

    Shouldn't this film, not being exposed to light, be white (transparent) instead? Or is this some kind of special film?

    Also, why didn't they just (properly) cover their eyes? That would have made it much easier for someone else to help them with their blind activities.

  26. He had to by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    They didn't believe him otherwise, his theory of gastritis being caused by bacteria was laughed away.

  27. epicure by PopeRatzo · · Score: 1

    One finding: Eating ravioli in the dark is hard.

    Not so hard if you're naked and in the bathtub, which is how I like to eat my ravioli.

    That way, I don't get sugo stains on my clothes.

    --
    You are welcome on my lawn.
  28. Re:Works better w/multiple "friendly" test subject by dpidcoe · · Score: 1

    Also morse code and touch typing.

  29. DeepDream by Pseudonymus+Bosch · · Score: 1

    This reminds me of DeepDream, Google's neural network that looks at images and tries to see things that are not there.

    --
    __
    Men with no respect for life must never be allowed to control the ultimate instruments of death.
    GW Bu
  30. Just use the Brock string + read "Fixing my gaze" by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

    The cheapest and most efficient solution is doing the "Brock string" exercise on a daily basis. Read all about it on Wikipedia and Youtube.

    The concept is that you simply need to retrain your brain to use the correct neurons and reinforce these correct pathways by doing the exercise.

    The scientific base for this is brilliantly described and perfectly explained in the book "Fixing my gaze", by a neuroscientist: http://www.fixingmygaze.com/

  31. Re:Using the potty. by dublin · · Score: 1

    Because, obviously, blind people have learned just to hold it and never poop. Really, sometimes the asininity of the questions and assertions on /. is mind-boggling...

    --
    "The future's good and the present is nothing to sneeze at." - Roblimo's last ./ post
  32. At best: Not always. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Personal anecdote, have given myself bad burns to the eyes via UV radiation from a cutting torch. Subsequently had to have my eyes covered for 2 weeks to let naturally heal, then a month with sunglasses.

    I'm left eye dominant and that didn't change as well as the lazy eye.

  33. Experiments in cats... by cosmicaug · · Score: 1

    Yeah, there are some papers showing this return of plasticity in the visual cortex of cats after light deprivation (or, to make it sound more evil, maybe it was kittens?).

    1. Re:Experiments in cats... by thogard · · Score: 1

      Do cats see IR like rats and snakes can? If so, how do you make it dark when they are glowing in the IR range.

    2. Re:Experiments in cats... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      even for animals with IR vision, there has to be some degree of ambient light... technically there has to be some sort of illumination for even the most advanced IR cameras need IR illuminators. IR vision doesn't mean eyes glow, that's a reflective substance called tapetum lucidum that helps them amplify ambient light. Human retinas respond to high IR frequencies, even ones that we can't see. https://irilluminators.wordpress.com/

    3. Re:Experiments in cats... by RockDoctor · · Score: 1

      It was kittens. They'd have their eyes stitched up before the age at which they'd normally open. Several different excuses given.

      --
      Birds are not dinosaur descendants;birds are dinosaurs, for all useful meanings of "birds", "are" and "dinosaurs"
  34. AH, I doubt it by argStyopa · · Score: 1

    I have this, and while they don't know the cause, it seems that there's an issue with the fine-motor balance in the musculature around the eye. Could be genetic, could be damage.

    Why would sitting in the dark recondition those muscles? It's not a brain-processing issue (which, who knows, maybe is reset by isolation and lack of input - seems bs to me), it's a muscle issue. After my 47 years of imbalanced muscle behavior, I find it rather hard to believe that sitting in the dark's going to reset that.

    --
    -Styopa
    1. Re:AH, I doubt it by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      It won't affect muscle tone, but with 5 days of sensory starvation the first image received might shift the area of the retina which is currently trained as the centre of vision, but which was misaligned through muscle tone changes that caused the lazy eye.

    2. Re:AH, I doubt it by RockDoctor · · Score: 1

      Why would sitting in the dark recondition those muscles?

      Those muscles are under nervous control. It may be subconscious or unconscious control, but it's control nonetheless.

      the theory is about re-setting the control system, not the muscles.

      --
      Birds are not dinosaur descendants;birds are dinosaurs, for all useful meanings of "birds", "are" and "dinosaurs"
  35. Windows by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I though it is called Windows. It needs rebooting all the time.

    1. Re: Windows by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      ????????

  36. A first-tier IT help desk person thought of this by kazekirifx · · Score: 1

    So, basically like power cycling the eye, right? Gotta remove the battery from the mother board and let it sit for a while for the RAM to clear, I guess. This should fix most minor eye issues I would assume. Similar processes should also work for the ears, nose, etc.

  37. I can see my limbs in the dark. by Maxo-Texas · · Score: 1

    I think I'm processing the proprioception data visually but I'm not sure. It's an odd effect.

    --
    She was like chocolate when she drank... semi-sweet at first and then increasingly bitter.
  38. Pure black, indicating zero exposure to light by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

    "Each day the two men tacked up a large piece of photosensitive film used in radiology. Days later, after they’d left the room, Backus developed those five sheets of film and was gratified to find them pure black, indicating zero exposure to light."

    Most "photosensitive film" is unaffected by darkness - when developed it remains clear. Either they inadvertently exposed it to light, were living in a (dangerously) high radiation environment or Eliza Strickland who is "an associate editor for the science and technology magazine IEEE Spectrum," grew up in the digital age and believes that such bygone technologies as "photosensitive film" are not worth knowing about. It was the "pure black" that got me - it gives a real impression of veracity...

  39. Re:Using the potty. by tehcyder · · Score: 1

    talking about poo-poo while in the dark gets me excited

    Rule 34, although it won't really work on video.

    --
    To have a right to do a thing is not at all the same as to be right in doing it
  40. Radiohead will never be the same if this works... by cloud.pt · · Score: 1

    If this works, and Thom Yorke gets cured, all them RH hipsters are gonna miss that semi-closed stare he gives out on concerts. Bummer.

  41. Dumb experiments by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Back around circa 1900, there was a lot of experiments with electricity and a treatment to all sorts of ailments. It caused perm damage to a lot of people. There are also currently "extreme cold therapy" where they expose your body to -200 deg temps. and now this total darkness.

    Listen folks, the human body has a normal range of tolerance for a reason, and anything exceeding that range is the stuff of frankenstein. Don't do it.

  42. Re:A first-tier IT help desk person thought of thi by Talderas · · Score: 1

    Compared to smell or sound, sight is easily controlled. You simply need to control photons in the room. Since the human body doesn't generate photons you only need to control for external sources. With both smell and sound the human body is capable of generating these stimuli on its own.

    --
    "Lack of speed can be overcome. In the worst case by patience." --Znork
  43. You need more than professional help... apk by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    You need a MIRACLE to get the best of what I post & myself http://slashdot.org/comments.p...

    APK

    P.S.=> ... And you KNOW it - hence your weak illogical off topic failing ad hominem attacks directed my way, vs. proving points I post validly & technically wrong... apk

  44. Re:Using the potty. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    AIDS INFESTED HOMO DETECTED! Warning! Warning! AIDS in gay homo rectum detected! Warning! Warning! AIDS prevents ability to detect (bad) humor! Warning! Warning! AIDS AIDS AIDS!

  45. Sensory Deprivation and REST by frank249 · · Score: 1

    Many associate Sensory deprivation with torture but short-term sessions have been described as relaxing and conducive to meditation. Sessions of up to 24 hrs for therapeutic purposes are referred to as Restricted Environmental Stimulation Therapy (REST) There is a substantial amount of research in treating addictive behaviors with REST is reviewed with smoking, overeating, alcohol consumption, and drug misuse. There are two types: Flotation REST and Chamber RESTIn chamber REST, subjects lie on a bed in a completely dark and sound reducing (on average, 80 dB) room for up to 24 hours. Their movement is restricted by the experimental instructions, but not by any mechanical restraints. Food, drink and toilet facilities are provided in the room and are at the discretion of the tester. Subjects are allowed to leave the room before the 24 hours are complete; however, fewer than 10% actually do. With regard to the article, I would be concerned as some studies have had participant experience hallucination after 48 hrs.

    --

    Today's vices may be tomorrow's virtues.

  46. Re:Using the potty. by RockDoctor · · Score: 1

    What if he touched poo-poo to his nose? Gross

    [Shrug] you've never had to wipe your parent's shit off their bum?

    Don't worry, you too are eligible for this joy. Because you may have no children whose shit you'll have to wipe up, but you sure as hell have had parents, and there's a good chance that you are going to live long enough to see them in their incontinence.

    Paying some one less rich than you to wipe up your parent's shit is simply transferring your problem to someone else.

    --
    Birds are not dinosaur descendants;birds are dinosaurs, for all useful meanings of "birds", "are" and "dinosaurs"
  47. LSD & Psilocybin by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Serotonergic psychedlic drugs can also reset some filters in your brain.

    http://www.iflscience.com/brai...
    http://www.livescience.com/485...

    I used to be unable to see video tearing when VSYNC was disabled on a computer.
    Then I took LSD and watched a film. I suddenly could see it clearly.
    This improvement was persistent.

    Sunsets and clouds also gained tremendous detail, permanently.

  48. Ravioli in the dark by eric_harris_76 · · Score: 1

    Not if they're toasted ravioli. (Sprinkling grated cheese on them could be a challenge, though.)

    --
    There's no time like the present. Well, the past used to be.