Slashdot Mirror
Ask Slashdot: Recommendations For a Reliable Linux Laptop?
An anonymous reader writes: I will be looking for a new laptop soon and I'm mostly interested in high reliability and Linux friendliness. I have been using an MSI laptop (with Windows 7) for the last five years as my main workhorse and did not have a single, even minor problem with the hardware nor the OS. It turned out to be a slam-dunk, although I didn't do any particular research before buying it, so I was just lucky. I would like to be more careful this time around, so this is a hardware question: What laptop do you recommend for high reliability with Linux? I will also appreciate any advice on what to avoid and any unfortunate horror stories; I guess we can all learn from those.
Anti-recommendations are probably just as valuable, a lesson I learned when an HP laptop I bought (low-end, I admit) turned out to be notoriously fickle when it comes to Linux support. Since our anonymous submitter doesn't specify his budget, it would be good if you specify the price for any specific laptops you recommend.
Dell Precision and Latitude machines have mostly worked for me over the years. Thinkpads also.
I saw this link in another thread, but I haven't used it. Anyone care to comment?
linux mint runs really well on it! everything works out of the box except the wifi, but you can just use ethernet to download the driver for the wifi adapter in the mint driver manager app. plus the screen is beautiful
I've had pretty good luck with Intel chipsets, including Intel Graphics. I've been using a Dell e6430 for a couple of years with very good results. I had to put in one hack to reload the WIFI modules and restart WPA supplicant after resume or the wifi would get slow and weird on certain access points. Otherwise the thing just works; I dock it at work with dual monitors and it seamlessly switches over, something I couldn't say about my previous nVidia graphics dell.
There are a huge variety of laptops out there, each with their own good points and bad points.
What type are you looking for? 11.6" Netbook, 13", 15", or 17"? Low-end, mid-range or high-end processor? How important is battery life? How important is low-price? Any preference for SSD or large-capacity rotating drive? Etc.
There are too many parameters left un-addressed.
I bought a Samsung series 9 a couple of years ago and Ubuntu works perfectly on it.
Just buy a System76 laptop. Everything will work, including suspend.
I am myself considering a linux laptop, currently have a mac. The makerspace I am apart of, many people have MSIs. Have you tried running linux on your current laptop?
System76 has been selling Linux laptops for years now. I've never bought one, but they certainly have expertise in getting it to work.
The Dell M3800 (15") and M6800 (17") look well-built and officially support linux. I have no experience with either, but I researched them after I saw someone here on /. recommend the M3800 for linux, and I plan to buy a M6800. As a bonus, they're old enough models to also support Windows 7 (which is why I'm getting one).
I've been running Fedora on mine for a few months. I had some early problems with wireless, but on my most recent trip (a few kernel updates later) it was fine. The touchpad seems to be working better too. My only real gripe at this point is that the battery doesn't quite last all day like my 13" MBA can, but then the Zenbook's considerably cheaper than most in the under-three-pound category so I guess sacrifices had to be made somewhere.
Slashdot - News for Herds. Stuff that Splatters.
I have Dell Precision M3800 for my work and it has been fantastic. It comes pre-configured with Ubuntu and thus saves you a hundred dollars vis-a-vis the Windows LIcense cost. I am very happy with the machine and use it has a workstation replacement. I push it hard and it has been fine. I would suggest that if you use it as a development machine to purchase a stand to allow it to cool properly. The graphic device drivers are great and it is an actual working touch-screen which I honestly don't use (emacs users) but does make the Unity interface actually usable. Link is here; http://www.dell.com/us/busines... Lenovo's have been good in the past but Lenovo is reducing quality fast and thus I would not suggest such a machine. HP also would not be a good choice. (Thanks Fiorina!)
I still highly recommend the Thinkpad T-series line, now owned by Lenovo, for running Linux on a laptop. I've been running Linux on various generations of the T-series since when IBM introduced the line (T21 running Fedora Core 1-4, then Gentoo), and I've never had any significant or insurmountable problems. They use mostly Intel parts and Intel tends to be fairly open source friendly which leads to them being easy to support. My current laptop is a T430s running Gentoo, and my prior laptop was a T400 also running Gentoo. Sleep/hibernate both work as does all the other features (video camera, ultrabay, etc.). The build quality is quite solid too (I only replaced my T400 because I wanted more than 8GB of RAM).
I have less experience with the other Thinkpad lines, but I would imagine both the X-series & W-series would also work well. If you go with a different brand, I generally recommend going straight to the business line (i.e. Dell Latitues, etc.) of the laptops for better build quality.
Sadly, PS/2 was yet another victim of USB, which doesn't care what you plug into it, the electrical slut.
As others mentioned the question is terribly vague.
I'm running Linux Mint 17.2 on a Lenovo Y50, 16GB RAM, 1TB HD, NVidia 860M w/2GB. The latest Optimus support is very nice for switching between the Nvidia and native Intel graphics. Though targeted as a gaming laptop I'm using it for computer vision development with OpenCV.
The new Dell XPS 13 is the best machine I have ever used.
Mac Book Pro is like a kids toy in comparison.
What's up with the deluge of A.C. posts?
The Clevo 651se is rebadged by lots of companies. All the hardware has worked fine with the drivers that came with Fedora 21. The only slight pain was getting the Nvidia drivers but, in the end, I found some BumbleBee rpms that bundled the drivers.
Everything feels cheaper than the Apple laptops but it all works well enough. I've had it for 6 months and nothing's broken yet. The back of the screen is worryingly bendy plastic and the backlit keyboard is literally a light behind a normal keyboard so you won't be able to read the keycaps in the dark. Also all the keys are the same size so it is hard to find the arrow keys reliably.
All the special function keys worked out of the box (Volume up/down, aeroplane mode etc).
If the built in HD display is not enough you can plug in 2 4K external monitors, however if you choose to run all 3 screens you'll have scaling issues until your chosen distro moves over to Wayland(or Mir?). Fedora are hoping to change over next year.
Probably the best hardware in a laptop you can buy, and I'm running all kinds of Linux distros in VMs using Parallels. Completly 100% satisfied with this setup.
Just not worth it...
Had one for a couple of years up until last year.
- Fan control was a problem, would get hot, then run fans on max.
- Wifi drivers were a pain, and didn't always recover from suspend reliably (needed reboots).
- Dealing with poorly documented Ubuntu PPAs to get drivers and docs for configuration is a chore.
- There are enough differences between model years that what once worked now doesn't. User's writing 'works for me' without specify which MacBook pro vintage they use is not helpful.
Replaced with an ASUS G550JK(https://www.asus.com/Notebooks/G550JK/) last year. Has same or better specs than a MacBook pro of the time, for a little over half the price, and the IPS display is beautiful. Everything just worked (Ubuntu 14.04). I almost miss messing about with drivers to make them work (not!).
Look at the laptops from System76, I am using their old lowest end right netbook now and it has worked flawlessly for years. It was $250 with Ubuntu pre-installed. I have no connection with that company (or any other for that matter).
Loaded a 4 year old HP Mini 311 (Atom CPU/Nvidia graphics/3GB RAM) and everything worked. Everything. Had been using Win7 followed by a Win10 up(?)grade. Not happy with the performance but now the system is usable again.
I have the Thinkpad X1 Carbon. Mine was the first-gen model, and I still use it. I can't speak to following generations. Works great with Fedora Linux (GNOME desktop).
And before anyone asks: Yes, I completely wiped the hard drive and re-installed with Linux. It's a total "start from scratch" so I didn't inherit any spyware (that I know of).
That said, I'm thinking that my next Linux laptop will be a Purism Librem. I've read very good reviews, and I kind of want to support someone who built a Linux-only laptop.
Dear poster,
Please specify your original machine. I would love to know the details.
...it's called http://www.linux-on-laptops.com
I'm not sure how frequently it's updated these days, but for example it doesn't have my Lenovo Thinkpad X230, which works perfectly fine. Maybe I should submit a report there... but to be honest, most hardware is fairly well supported these days, and I wouldn't worry too much!
Had a macbook pro for six years, and loved the integration of software and hardware. But if you want to run Linux, the premium price you pay for sleek design and integration of hardware and software might not be worth it. Very limited upgrade options - memory soldered, hdd not replaceable, and battery I hear is also sealed.
I've had a T440s for a year now, no issues whatsoever running Debian. Everything works. Battery life is not an issue because you can hotswap without power off. I get between 12 and 18 hours with internal and external combined. Rugged machine (the lower edge is rounded so you don't end up with a callous palm) easily replaceable internals are also a big plus if you want a machine that can grow with you. T450s might have a better trackpad, but if you spend most of your time on the keyboard you'd be hard pressed to find a better one on a laptop.
I'm running Fedora 22 with the Mate DE on an Acer AOA150-1570. Granted, it's a tad slow, but that's to be expected given that it's powered by an Atom N270 with only 1G of RAM. It has a 120 GB HDD (later models had a 160 GB HDD) and the small, 3-cell battery. My only complaint is that the wifi radio seems to be a bit weak and won't always connect (this isn't a Linux problem, the same thing happens in Windows). Well worth the $50 or so they're going for on ebay. HTH
I currently run Ubuntu on an HP EliteBook and previously on an old slow Acer Aspire one and works very well on both. Easy to install, just boot with usb key and installs itself. Automatically installed the correct drivers for everything (actually, you can already test this with the usb boot key, since that will just boot you into Ubuntu). A lot of people don't like the Unity desktop, but I think it's fine. If you don't like the "bloated" Ubuntu distribution and Unity, you could give Xubuntu or Kubuntu a try.
Basically most common distributions come with a bootable USB key live version, so you could just try out Mint, Red Hat, etc... as well.
I would just go for any major laptop manufacturer, most Linux distributions are mature enough to work on them.
I recently had to quickly replace a dead laptop. I did some research and my hot tip is: look at what parts are used in laptops sold by companies that focus on 100% free software. For example, Think Penguin's offering:
https://www.thinkpenguin.com/c...
Buying from them is one option, but if you're going to buy elsewhere then you can still check the components these guys have gotten working with 100% free software drivers.
For me the big worry was graphics cards since I bought a netbook a few years ago with an Intel Poulsbo card and it basically can't run a graphical interface. Ironically, the current Think Penguin laptops use Intel HD graphics cards, so I picked the screen size I wanted and bought the cheapest laptop I could get with an Intel HD graphics card and the desired screen size. (I got a Lenovo G70. It's OK.)
Another site with info is: https://h-node.org/
C'mon dude, if you want people to comment you could at least say what the linked page is about.
I'm not doing homework just to see what I can help you with.
Dell Developer Editions (look under Business), because:
1. It already comes with Linux (Ubuntu 14.04 LTS) out of the box. (No worries about SecureBoot or UEFI, SSD TRIM, partitioning, etc)
2. They've presumably ironed out the bugs and kinks before putting it on sale. (Or they're going to get crappy reviews and lots of returns)
3. Their tech support will speak Linux, rather than balk at supporting anything that's not Windows.
4. You don't have to pay for a Window license you won't use (Yay, $50.)
5. The hardware should be competitively spec'ed and priced because they're selling thousands of the same box with Windows on it.
6. They may even support the accessory compatibility if they sell accessories (Displayport to VGA anyone?)
7. They're pretty (the XPS 13 anyway).
8. Dell should be rewarded for truly supporting Linux, even if it is Ubuntu and not whatever hardcore distro you prefer.
Over the last five years I've had school designed Acer laptop, 2 core 1.1 g Hz that loaded Fedora over and over without issue.
Then I got an HP laptop. I could never get the graphics to work with linux. I finally loaded virtualbox under windows and installed linux as a client.
Fed up with that situation, I bought a nice 4 core 1.5 g Hz Acer that load Fedora after I partitioned the drive using Windows built in utility. It loaded Federa 22 without issue and now using Google-Chrome-beta, I can watch videos from Amazon and Netflix without an issue. It's been a month since I booted Windows.
p.s. The best battery life I've had on the three is the latest Acer, an Aspire E 15 ( AMD Quad-Core E2-6110 ) and I think it was $349
It's awesome that the xps 13 ships with linux.
Mod me down, my New Earth Global Warmingist friends!
If you feel comfortable with istalling Linux yourself, get a Chromebook Pixel and slap Linux onto it. Amazing hardware, great design and perfect compatibility with Linux, since ChromeOS is also based on Linux.
You can very easily run ChromeOS and Linux at the same time, you can use ChromeOS for the basic stuff and even run Linux in a window inside ChromeOS or you can wipe the Pixel clean and go Linux-only (that requires some more fiddling though).
Check out the FSF's recommendations for hardware at https://www.gnu.org/links/companies.html. It's hard to see how these wouldn't work out with GNU/Linux. In particular Minifree Ltd (http://minifree.org/) has some laptops that might interest you. They're modified ThinkPads so the hardware is pretty reasonable.
Low end model. Admitted, I spent some money on making it scream. 256G SSD, 8 G RAM, Intel wireless card.
Running Fedora 22 XFCE as the GUI.
The only thing that doesn't work perfectly is the Webcam, which I didn't want anyway.
I was seriously surprised at how nice this thing is to use. Much nicer than any current Windows laptop for sure, you don't have to do battle with the UI for a start
I have a desktop for games, all I wanted was the digital equivalent of a notepad, a pack of cards and a paperback book for when I'm away from home. It's a lot better than that.
I got the "hiDPI" XPS 13 before they finished the linux version, but it works like a charm.
Two issues:
- It occassionaly hangs (flashing caps = kernel panic?). I blame the broadcom wifi chip.
- The hiDPI is gorgeous but sometimes annoying if applications assume that 10pt should be enough for anyone. My main gripe is actually that it is difficult to work with an external monitor. The hiDPI 13" requires something like 16 - 18 pt fonts to be usable, which is completely silly on a normal 27" HD screen. So, if I have both plugged in any setting is wrong, and as far as I know there is no way to automatically adjust zoom settings per screen that works even when you move a window from one screen to the other. I run ubuntu with the i3 tiling window manager so it's possible that default gnome/kde/unity came up with a fix, but I don't think so?
I have a Toshiba Poretege Z835 and work perfectly for mi
This is Off-topic, but I've had 3 MacBook pros over the years and all were awesome as Windows machines. Today all three of them are still in active use, not bad since the oldest one was purchased in 2008. Before then I had Dell, Toshiba, Compaq, Sony, and Gateway laptops, all of which had a critical failure by year 2. (With the exception of Dell they all had terrible displays, Toshiba by far being the worst.) I did have one Macbook whose logic board burnt out, but Apple fixed it and for some reason replaced the LCD while they were in there. Yes, that was under the AppleCare warranty.
Sorry, I have no Linux experience to share on these machines. Actually I was under the impression that Apple's silliness made it really difficult to get Linux on there. I'm currently miffed at them because they no longer support Windows 7 within Boot Camp, meaning I either have to upgrade to 10 or go with a different laptop brand next time I upgrade. I mention this because I don't really know what's keeping Apple from disallowing dual-booting into Linux.
"I like to lick butts!" by MobileTatsu-NJG (#32700246) (Score:5, Informative)
There's nothing "pro" about a laptop with no hardware buttons.
Two-in-one or classic laptop?
Which 2-in-1s work well with Linux? I've read horror stories about Wi-Fi and suspend not working on 10 inch 2-in-1s like the ASUS Transformer Book and the Acer Aspire Switch. Debian says screen backlight control on the Transformer Book T100TA is "Unsupported (No Driver)", suspend is "Error (Couldn't get it working)", and Wi-Fi is "Only works with a non-free driver".
Just buy a System76 laptop.
Agreed, so long as System76 makes a laptop in the size you want. Right now I see nothing smaller than 14 inches.
Ubuntu on a new Acer 573P. Touch screen, camera, speakers all working well. Fast, light, cool.
My quad i7 2011MBP works perfectly. what era of MBP were you using?
Do not look at laser with remaining good eye.
I can second this. My Dell XPS 13 "Developer Edition" that came preinstalled with Ubuntu is the best Linux laptop I have ever owned. I hate the crap Broadcom WiFi card in it, but it does work fine out of the box with Ubuntu and Linux Mint. I did have to replace the preinstalled Dell version of Ubuntu as it was horribly corrupted somehow (if you ran anything other than trivial programs, they would crash). I also own a System76 Linux laptop, but I think the Dell "Developer Edition" XPS 13 model and the M3800 model are better built machines. Check http://www.dell.com/ubuntu or http://www.system76.com/ as both options do ship with Ubuntu preinstalled.
I should add that I have heard that the new Asus Zenbook 505 laptops are very Linux friendly, but I have personally never used one and they ship only with Windows.
I'm curious, were your non Apple laptops a match in terms of $. I have a theory that if you spend the same amount on a Windows machine it would last just as long.
My Macbooks were all about $2,300 each, give or take a little. Most of the non-Apple laptops I had were between $1,000 and $1,500. One of the Toshibas I had was a little over $2,000 and the Dell I had was $2,200. The one non-Apple laptop I had that at least behaved well was a second-hand business-class Compaq from the late 90's, I don't know what it originally sold for.
"I like to lick butts!" by MobileTatsu-NJG (#32700246) (Score:5, Informative)
I find that if the chipset is made by the same guys that made the CPU (pretty hard to find anything else these days) and the WiFi is made by Atheros, you will probably be able to get it to work. I used to always say intel WiFi but I've had some problems where APs got upset at intel NICs for no reason I could discern. I also like either nVidia or Intel graphics, but not AMD. Sometimes it will work great, sometimes it will blargh. Of course, last I heard that nVidia Optimus stuff still didn't work right... all-intel is your best bet, if you can live with crippling graphics performance :)
"You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"
runs linux MINT 17.2 great from a $50 mSATA 60GB KingFast disk, sandy-bridge Dual Core/4-threads i5, IPS screens available, all spare parts seem to be cheaply available. runs 16GB ram. The X220 is a portable lightweight magnesium chassis road-warrior machine, typically 3 years old on eBay, discounted by a thousand dollars/euros from their price new - and still feels much better than any current 'supermarket' laptop. If you want to have fun, use the built in STEAM client in MINT and connect via udp packets to a STEAM gaming server in your LAN, have full screen high frame-rate gaming/cuda-experiments in your lap! it just works.
You could later add an eGPU via express card slot to an outboard GTX750 and have *real* local gaming, or cuda experimentation. It's more robust than my collection of MacBooks and has a great keyboard, but a poor trackpad, so everyone use the red nipple button instead. MINT has had zero problems driving the hardware, windows 7 (on the other 7mm SSD in the HDD slot) needed several gigabytes of downloads just to get stable, since loading MINT I haven't rebooted into windows for about a month.
Out-of-the-box, I have found Mageia5 to offer the broadest hardware support (particularly with laptops), especially for those annoying closed-sourced drivers that the purists dislike (that's understandable) and the average user just wants to work (I understand that as well).
https://www.mageia.org/en/downloads/
Avoid the Live Media version; they could not fit enough drivers on it to provide broad hardware compatibility. I have found "Network Installation" to be the best as you can access all of the "tainted" software during the install which includes a lot of the binary drivers and codecs.
If you tend to buy a new one every 2-3 years, System76 is a good option.
If you hang onto them for a long time, you might appreciate the better structural strength and build quality of the Thinkpads.
I had a couple of System76's and they were great but around the 3-3.5 years the components and case parts (eg palm rest, display hinges) began to fail. I do have big gorilla hands and slap my keyboard like a pimp slapping a ho, though, so it could just be me.
In any event, I went with a T440s last time around. Overall, very happy with this machine. I will probably get another Thinkpad in 3 years or so when upgrade time rolls around.
If you opt for a Thinkpad: If they still offer a choice between LG and AOU displays, go for the AOU. I've had both in mine.
pr0n - keeping monitor glass spotless since 1981.
When "new" entries are submitted against Ubuntu 11.10, and this month is 15.09, it makes me think the site is four years out of date.
System: Host: localhost Kernel: 4.1.7-pclos3 x86_64 (64 bit gcc: 4.9.2) Desktop: N/A dm: gdm Distro: PCLinuxOS Machine: System: Hewlett-Packard product: HP EliteBook 6930p v: F.20 Mobo: Hewlett-Packard model: 30DC v: KBC Version 87.2B Bios: Hewlett-Packard v: 68PCD Ver. F.20 date: 12/08/2011 Chassis: type: 10 CPU: Dual core Intel Core2 Duo T9550 (-MCP-) cache: 6144 KB flags: (lm nx sse sse2 sse3 sse4_1 ssse3 vmx) bmips: 10641 clock speeds: min/max: 800/2667 MHz 1: 2667 MHz 2: 2667 MHz Graphics: Card: Advanced Micro Devices [AMD/ATI] RV620/M82 [Mobility Radeon HD 3450/3470] Has a SSD, runs like a scolded cat, DM Trinity.
http://chimpbox.us
Acer, Asus, Dell, HP, Apple, Lenovo, Toshiba, Samsung, Sony, Foxcomm, Panasonic, Itronix, Sharp and you will be fine.
Every maker has issues. All of them. Some are purely design. Some are HW failures and some are driver related.
Only a specific model, for a specific version of Linux can be commented about.
For example, I have an Acer C720 chromebook - wiped chromeOS in the first 5 minutes and loaded Ubuntu. That was almost 2 yrs ago. Touchpad driver issues were the beginning and the lack of a delete key (common to all chromebooks). About 3 weeks ago, the 'n' key started getting picky. Last July, it was the '7' - a simple cleaning made it a little better, but the 'n' is just screwed.
Had an Asus before. Chicklet keyboards suck. 'nuff said.
Still have a Dell that I like. Good keyboard and it is about 5 yrs old. The wifi support was hard to get working - should have spent the $15 upgrade for a better wifi microPCI card (better linux support).
A friend picked up a new Dell XPS 13 about a month ago - WOW! That thing is sexy, but at $1600, it should be.
We had an installfest last week and saw a lot of new laptops. Avoid HP. They break the BIOS, badly. I'd say to avoid Apple HW too - there was always 5 special incantations to get those to work ... except for one MBP which we never got installed. That was with 3 Mac-lovers and linux 20+ yr experts helping.
Lenovo is known to HW lock addon cards, so you can only put in approved replacements. That means replacing a bad wifi card isn't $25 - it is $50 because only specific models are allowed to work. It is a BIOS thing, I hear.
So - the old rule of making a list of chips and verifying each has Linux support is the best advice. Buying anything less than 6 months old is asking for driver trouble.
I'm curious, were your non Apple laptops a match in terms of $. I have a theory that if you spend the same amount on a Windows machine it would last just as long.
That depends on the 'Windows Machine' you buy (Let's call them PCs since you can run more OS'es on them than just Windows ++shock/awe++). My experience with large laptop pools have taught me that the really cheap ones that ship with chargers the size of a lunch box, batteries that last a two to three hours and cases that are made of plastic tend to age fast while the MacBooks and other PC's with metal housings last longer although there are also some gracefully designed and light high quality laptops with polymer cases that are pretty rugged. Then there is the issue of CPU, RAM, SSD vs. HD and so on. Cheaper machines tend to ship with new CPUs but many other components that are obsolete and/or inadequate (as in too little RAM, HDs/SSDs that are to small and low quality batteries). If you want small form factor and high quality/new components you have to pay for it, regardless of whether you buy an Apple PC or a 'Windows PC'. If you don't care about form factor, don't mind squeaky plastic casings and component quality/newness matters less then you can pay less. Apple laptops are some of the best designed highest quality laptops you can get and if you go looking for PCs with the same build quality, lightness, small form factor, battery life/quality/cycle-count and components the price difference isn't really that massive. I use Apple PCs mainly because I hate the Windows UI, I don't have the patience to sort out the couple of dozen glitches (usually not serious, just annoying) that seem to come with ever major release of every Linux distro I have ever used and because I like the build quality, huge trackpads and small form factors of the MacBooks. If Apple HQ ever gets sucked into a gravitational singularity generated by all the Android users on Slashdot getting together in one place and hating Apple simultaneously, my close second choice would probably be a high end Lenvo Think Pad running Linux and Gnome 3 (I know, that last part is sacrilegious but I like the Gnome 3 UI even more than Aqua) but I do not expect it to be massively cheaper than the MacBook I am using now..
Yo Been running Linux on my desktop and Laptop for a few years now. Since everybody has their own quirks about laptops I will stick to things worth knowing. Generally if you buy the latest laptop from any company make sure it has all Intel parts especially Wi-Fi and bluetooth hardware, the drivers are easier find and mostly you don't need to look for them at all. If you you are going for non-Intel hardware get an older laptop at least a year old...so that someone has made some drivers for the hardware.
I'm surprised nobody has mentioned the Purism (https://puri.sm) laptops. 15" or 13" options, fully open source -- at least that's the goal -- and comes with a derivative of Trisquel, I believe. Ships in October-ish, depending on what you order and whether their schedule changes.
Best of all, buy a notebook or laptop already with Linux.
Before specs, look at weight. There are nice things with 2Kg (4 American pounds) and kids' toys weighing 1Kg (2 pounds). Try to find something lighter which still works as a computer.
Ask technicians what brands not to buy (they know what breaks hardware-wise).
It may happen you need to buy a Windows laptop to put Linux on it. That's bad on so many levels but *sigh*:
Test at store, see if it all works. Some distros have an accompanying hardware test (e.g. see boot screenshots of Mageia IIRC) for you to see what Linux can find.
Specifically test Wi-fi (including speed) (e.g. connecting to your smartphone). Many moden ones can share the 3G connection, effectively creating a small wi-fi oasis around them (btw, that depletes the battery some 3 to 4 times faster).
Regarding specs look for some benchmark (I use "Passmark CPU list") and see where a prospective laptop ranks on that list. Around 900 on that list is ok IMHO (that means circa 900 CPUs are faster than the one you searched).
More importantly, if you can, get at least 4GB. My machines all have 2GB (and they work like a charm) -- except for dealing with big files (big spreadsheets, for instance). This makes an important difference.
Some nice things to have are HDMI (to see Full HD on a TV), USB 3.0 (to transfer big files), higher resolution (1366x768 is not that much), Bluetooth etc.
Probably the earlier versions... Even with OSX the fan control and such were not good enough.
After the turn of the decade the quality has been excellent, so good that I would not feel comfortable suggesting anything other than a MBP, no matter the OS.
I've bought used high end Dells a generation or two behind for the past 15 years, ever since I've had a laptop. I've had an Inspiron 8000, 8200, 9400, and for the past 4+ years a Precision M6500, which is a beast -- i7-920XM,16 GB RAM (which can be expanded to 32 GB), 2x2.5" bays, optical bay, mSATA, 17" WUXGA screen w/Radeon HD7820, a pair of USB3 ports, and an eSATA port. The only things I've had to replace have been the keyboard twice (due to my sloppiness around it; it's no more fragile than any other), the battery, and some memory that developed errors (not likely due to the laptop). I've run various versions of openSUSE on it with no problems of any kind, and no blobs either. The tech's a bit dated -- first generation i7, SATA2 (3 Gb/sec), only 2 USB3 ports -- but with the mSATA it's plenty fast for the photo processing I do on it. If you need something more up to date, you can pay a bit more for a used M6600 or M6700, although you'll give up the WUXGA. No mechanical problems with the lids and that that I had with the 8000 and 8200 (the 9400 was disappointing, having a 64 bit processor but basically set up as a 32 bit system that couldn't exceed 3 GB of usable RAM).
There's no comparison between the low end and the high end Dell laptops. The high end ones are built solidly, easy to repair and upgrade, and just plain feel solid. Of course, this puppy isn't light, and the power brick itself is substantial. Battery life isn't great either. But if you want a solid system that will run Linux well and won't give you any trouble, this is worth considering. If you want a smaller system, the Precision M4x00 is a 15" screen but otherwise basically the same, I believe (it may not have the second drive bay).
I wouldn't touch anything ASUS or Toshiba. Their build quality is just crap.
I'm currently using both an Asue Eeee 1004HA, W/Debian 8.1/32b, Openbox, and a ThinkPad X201 Debian 8.1/64b, KDE 4.13 and both run without a single problem, even hibernate works.
I see no reason to purchase a high end brand new system anymore. When I chose the X201, I made a commitment to get one at least 2.5ghz, 64b, and starting with 4g memory. The X201 was only $150, used six months ago and has been the best laptop since my T23 which I might add lasted 13 years. was running Damned Small Linux/Openbox at the very end.
I've enjoyed my ZaReason Verix 547. http://http//zareason.com/shop/Verix-547.html Slightly more expensive, but they have great customer service and you can customize every aspect of the box, even removing stock components and getting a refund on them. I'm pleased with the result.
I have a MSI GT60. Worked flawlessly out of the box with every flavor of Linux except for Ubuntu. Surprisingly, Mint and LMDE run perfectly. Dual gfx Intel/nVidia work perfect with the open source drivers or the nVidia drivers. I suggest you visit Linlap for more info and have a look around. Here is the GT60.
http://www.linlap.com/msi_gt60...
I run Ubuntu on an alienware 17 r2. Only $1500 w/ 17" screen and nvidia 970m video card. No driver support for the wireless yet afaik but I just use a $10 dongle. Would want to bump memory and get a ssd tho (m.2 sata supported) If you want cheap with the ability to play video games (dual boot?) Its a good option. If you don't need graphics its less compelling but still slick. Ymmv
I have a ThinkPad W530. $1600, 16B, 1TB hard drive (mechanical). It runs Ubuntu without any issues at all.
Using Ubuntu 15.04 LTS:
Both the Toshiba s75 and Lenovo z710 have:
- Terrible keyboards: Fat flat chicklets that don't work well and resul in lots of typos. The lettering is coming off the Toshiba's keys and the backlight doesn't work with Ubuntu. On the Lenovo I was able to get the backlight to work but the keys were painted clear plastic and after a few months not just the letters, but the black paint surrounding them, chipped away letting the light shine through horribly.
- Terrible touchpads: Very sensitive and positioned perfectly (and identically) wrong, so my thumbs hit them all the time and trigger the mouse to jump around and randomly click things. I can disable them (but they re-enable after the laptop is closed and repoened). I can't find any way to reduce their sensitivity.
Battery life is half what the battery tools says it should be (about 1 3/4 hours, tool claims 4 and doesn't learn it correctly.)
Built-in radios were not supported by latest Ubuntu LTS when I got them, though an update fixed that after about a year.
Other than that they DO work. They're just a pain unless you carry a mouse and decent keyboard around with you.
Bantam Dominique roosters crow a four-note song. Once you've heard it as "Happy BIRTHday" you can't NOT hear it that way
I second that. On the other hand Linux runs out of the box and the hardware is cheap! Add good back up and you are golden if you live near a pawn shop.
Yeah, this. Only thing I don't like is you have to take an extra step and install a driver for the crappy broadcom wifi it has, but otherwise macbook pros, especially the retina versions, really rock and run linux like a champ.
Yup. Linux finally clicked 100 percent for me when my mentor told me that you just have to think of OSX as the shiniest slickest ditro of Linux. I run linux on my iMac from time to time, and haven't had a problem yet.
The shepherds did so well protecting the flock that the sheep no longer believed that wolves existed.
Normally I like Fedora/CentOS, but then I ran several distros on this HP Elitebook. I did not like Ubuntu at all, but Linux Mint is what I settled on because it runs like a beast and just has all the bells and whistles.
I have had no problems with this machine and have really pushed it many hours per day. Has gone from running 9 hours with multiple Virtual Machines, DB, WEB server and about 30 gvim windows open (plus unknown number of xterm doing ssh to machines, firefox and chrome running, and thunderbird) and shut ut down packed it up and put into a car from -20 though 100+ degrees and hauled for 50 minutes to start it all up again (a few less term ssh sessions) avert work day and use to at least 8 hours each week end day. It does get two 5 days of vacation, but it does travel to TX each year. The hardware is rock solid. I can not state on how the Unbuntu Linux is as that replaced with Gentoo the day that I got it. (Okay KDE was a present on the second day.
My Z580 has been rock-solid under Ubuntu 15.04, though I really don't use it as a laptop. But all the hardware worked without fussing around, and it's been 100% stable since I got rid of Windows 10. Windows 7 had been reliable on it, too, but I was having hardware problems with 10 (the sound drivers stopped working), so I switched.
My main system has been Ubuntu for years, but it was getting pretty old and slow and I didn't need to be able to run Windows database engines any more, so Microsquishy got the heave-ho.
Lenovo tends to use bog-standard hardware, so they have an excellent reputation for running with Linux.
I do not fail; I succeed at finding out what does not work.
Another option, if you want a true portable, is a Chromebook.
It is easy to add a full Linux desktop which runs in a chroot, using Crouton, a bit like a lightweight virtual machine, and flick between that and the ChromeOS desktop, if you like.
It means the vendor is looking after the tricky stuff like power management and wifi drivers, but you still can have a full Linux desktop of your choice.
And it helps that you can get a 4GB full-HD IPS with 9 hour battery for under $300. (Or the Pixel for a lot more.)
Your 'mentor' is a fucking tool.
Your 'mentor' is a fucking tool.
Explain. You're in at the deep end of the pool now, so it better be good.
The shepherds did so well protecting the flock that the sheep no longer believed that wolves existed.
Define "hardware button".
No, seriously, I have no idea what you mean by that. Because it would seem to me that all laptops nowadays lack hardware (ie, mechanical) buttons.
Why is this even an ask slashdot?
Don't we all know that certain Dell laptops (read: anything business, and many consumer grade) work fine running Linux.
OOTB intel graphics, bluetooth, wifi, ethernet, etc.
I have one laptop from Asus from their price/value segment (R301LA) and I can't say that everything runs out of the box: - wmi keys (i.e. brightness regulation) - touchpad (Elantech) doesn't work after suspend (it disappears from /sys/ so it's pretty damn undetectable)
- it doesn't always suspend after closing the lid
Sure, You can live with that (and with mouse attached), but when you buy a laptop from company that makes money on Linux (Android devices, Chromebooks) you expect better treatment.
There is no such thing as a reliable laptop. Ignore those Mac fans that say otherwise. What would they know? Mac fans buy new every time Apple says to anyway! There is no time for anything to go bad!
Just get a really nice desktop and an always on internet connection. Also, get unlimitted data on your phone, and a tether app. Get a decent tablet, an integrated keyboard/case for it and a bluetooth mouse. Note - Apple products do not count as decent tablets for your purposes. Apple is too controling to let you use a mouse!
You will want that mouse because what you are going to do is access that desktop by remote desktop or VNC. There ya go! A system that is reliable. Laptops are not!
Not only they're built as bricks but they have excellent Linux compatibility all across the board.
There are only two companies that *really* get Linux and free software. One is Mini Free which sells a line of older refurbished Lenovos, but with a free BIOS. Yes! The other is ThinkPenguin. ThinkPenguin goes out of the way to ensure there is a readily available selection of good hardware regardless of particular need. They got stuff almost nobody needs like firewire cards, dial-up modems, parallel cards, in addition to the more common items like printers, wifi cards, and computers.
ThinkPenguin was behind the ath9k-htc drivers/firmware source release too. Thanks to them and Adrian Chadd and Luis (forget his last name) we have properly supported wifi cards today. It almost didn't happen. Unfortunately the next generation of chipsets is turning into an even bigger issue.
The other thing to worry about with many other manufacturers including: HP, Dell, Sony, Apple, Toshibia, and Lenovo is they are utilizing digital restrictions and its hindering support for Linux. You can't replace your wifi chip if it doesn't work despite it being an otherwise *standards compliant slot*. They're using something called white listing in the BIOS.
Yeah, my T430s has been great with Linux and Qubes OS. Its also really tough, IMO. Thinkpads (not the consumer Ideapads) have remained near the very top in the Linux compatibility column.
OTOH, if you want something that is built to be SO compatible with Linux that all the hardware will run using open-source drivers, take a look at the Purism Librem. They have sexy 13" and 15" models.
Last but not least, you should know about Hardware Compatibility Lists (HCLs): All of the Linux ones I know about have become shrunken and worthless *except* for Ubuntu's which can recommend a wide variety of certified-compatible models. If it works with Ubuntu, there is a very high probability it will work with other decent distros.
Acer Extensa EX2508 Laptop, Intel Processor N2840 2.16GHz, 8GB RAM, 1TB HDD, 15.6" Screen, DVD DL, Intel HD, Webcam, Bluetooth, Windows 8.1. Swapped the HDD for an SSD as a laptop without one is not worth having. My only tweak to ubuntu was to set acpi=force, otherwise shutting down would sometimes need me to press the power button.
Well, by definition it isn't linux, since it runs a different kernel.
Besides, the main attraction to a linux distro is that it is configurable. Want it to act like Windows? Fine. Want it to act like a Mac? That's fine too. It's all configurable; unlike OSX, which is basically not configurable at all. (Try setting up a Mac with focus-follows-mouse and see what I mean).
As to the original question: Lenovo. Every one I've tried works fine. The *only* thing to watch out for (and this is true of any brand laptop) is the touchpads that have no physical buttons (a la recent macbooks). With Windows theyre' barely usable; with Linux you may as well give up and just buy a mouse. While it's nice to know that I can fix the driver for it to work right given a week or two.... I don't have the time.
On a laptop, I'd settle for OS X and buy Apple.
Desktop is different, but still...
Windows 2000 - from the guys who brought us edlin
I've always liked Thinkpad (Lenovo) laptops, they generally ship Linux-friendly hardware and are tough and durable, it's the company default where I work. If you were unfortunate enough to procure the second to last model the touchpad needs some work
Regardless of the make/model you use, be sure to implement hybrid suspend so you'll never lose your work should you run out of battery while suspended. I'm currently using a Lenovo x240 on Fedora 22 with great results, regardless of the spyware shipped on the lower-end models I'll still stick with them for the excellent durability and hardware support until something better comes along.
Have a squat over at the hobo house.
I hate the crap Broadcom WiFi card in it ...
Not sure why so many people make a big deal out of this. I had a crappy wifi card in an old dell. Bought a new one Intel Centrino one and it's been rock solid. Here:
http://www.amazon.com/Ultimate...
Intel Centrino Ultimate-N 6300 802.11 a/b/g/n 2.4Ghz and 5.0Ghz : $10.69
That's a half-height Mini PCE-E. You can get a bracket on there to extend it to full height for $4 (or just make your own).
(that's not the card I got, but it should do better than what I had picked up - mine lacks "a", but also has bluetooth)
i'm sure psychiatrists have a word for it. somebody more knowledgeable please help me. what is it called when somebody makes other people do the thing they feel guilty about, to feel less guilty themselves (because others are now doing it too)?
i've had Macbook Pros. that's not a computer, it's a fashionable legburner with built in pipe organ (as soon as you do anything even remotely resembling work). that thing just can't cool itself and stay quiet. i also tried running gnu/linux on it but the story was the same. it either throttles itself to a crawl or wheezes like an old asthmatic.
Thirded. XPS 13 developer edition here and not only is it just a lovely piece of hardware, it zipz along and ships with Ubuntu. I've also tried Debian, fedora, mint and elementary live USB sticks and everything just works.
The only bad point is the WiFi, which doesn't have great range for some reason.
Think it was £1100 or so.
One of the few non-mac laptops with simular resellability are the ThinkPads. A refurbished one will come way less than half the original price and still have all the quality. Get a high-end refurbished thinkpad, max ou the memory, replace the hdd with an ssd and you've got yourself a high-end linux laptop for a bargain-deal. I use a pimped out refurbished TP W510 as my main linux machine - it's the best I ever had.
We suffer more in our imagination than in reality. - Seneca
If you kill yourself, you're unholy obsession with Macs will trouble you no more.
*your, not you're.
Surprised no-one has suggested Novatech - though they may not be an option if not in the UK. The reviews are often pretty good, and they have no O/S models with good reports of Linux support - see http://www.novatech.co.uk/laptop/range/novatechnpron1589.html#reviews - for an i5 model.
I got my current Linux laptop from Novatech and it is still going strong 8 years on. Think my next one will come from Novatech too. Would consider the ebuyer Ubuntu machines but they aren't quite high end enough.
Posting as AC because I CBA to register, but I would highly recommend Thinkpads up to and including the x230/T430/W530 etc era. I can't speak to the newer ones as I'm still using a T410s and an X230 and expect to do so for another 3 years minimum, probably much longer. I have also had extensive use of X200, X201, X301, X220, L520, all with Windows and Linux, all without problems.
A further recommendation would be that every linux developer I personally know uses a Thinkpad (nearly all X220 or X230), and a locally based highly regarded company specializing in linux development, including kernel development, bespoke hardware and who produce their own linux distribution are standardized on Thinkpads.
Keyboards are a matter of personal choice, but they are usually widely praised. The older models are limited in screen resolution, but the X250 might meet your needs.
If you are on a budget, then second user Thinkpads can be a phenomenal buy - you can pick up 3rd gen i5/8GB/SSD X230s under 300ukp in perfect condition and they'll go for years. IME they generally run cool and are very reliable.
Another reason to like them is Lenovo hardware maintenance manuals, listing every part and process needed to rebuild the thing from scratch if you ever needed to fix it - a far cry from Apple's Glue-it-together appliance style of things. Oh, and removable batteries for the most part - even the "non-removable" ones are removable with a screwdriver.
It depends what works for you, but these are some reasons why thinkpads work for me and many other linux people.
> works like a charm
> occassionaly hangs
Pick one...
i recommend contacting http://thinkpenguin.com/ for several reasons. firstly, yes they install GNU/Linux by default (so they've done all the hard work, and the research, in advance. is that worth paying for? yes!) secondly, they actually go to the trouble of replacing the BIOS with Coreboot. is _that_ worth it, and worth paying for? yes!
and thirdly, they make sure that the hardware that they've selected is FSF-Hardware-Endorseable, which needs some explanation as to why this is important - and it's not *actually* to do with some sort of stupid or idealistic or neo-fascist or brain-washed or self-righteous or [insert suitable continuation of series of derogatory sentences towards the FSF, Dr Stallman in general and their goals, here, which may be in your mind as to why you feel that you should completely ignore anything and everything associated with the FSF, which we're about to show you are completely moot] reason.
no, the clear benefit from buying FSF-Endorsed hardware such as printers, WIFI and 3G dongles etc. is that they JUST WORK. peripherals these days usually have built-in firmware. because the firmware is pre-loaded in FSF-Endorseable products onto NAND Flash or EEPROM, they're pretty much guaranteed to be more expensive than the devices that require the proprietary firmware to be uploaded to the device, from the main OS, before the device can actually function.... BUT...
what that means in practice is that if you don't *have* that proprietary firmware, or if it happens not to be compatible with the OS, or if you lose it, or if the file system becomes corrupted, or if you perform an upgrade of the OS, and many many other reasons all of which amount to a great deal of hassle, you cannot use that device, period.
the most ridiculous instance of this is that ethernet is becoming less common, CD/DVD drives are becoming less common, creating USB-sticks to boot-install systems has always been a pain, EFI-boot (only) is becoming more common.... how the hell is anyone supposed to install an OS when the only network access is WIFI, and the WIFI requires bloody proprietary firmware that has a license that prevents and prohibits that firmware from being installed on the bloody installation media?? how stupidly ridiculous a situation can you possibly get into! and don't get me started about usb-ethernet devices, which, due to them being USB, are often *excluded* from selection as a "main internet connection" during the install process, because, by nature of them being removable, the OS can't guarantee that the device will be there on the next boot.
avoiding all this hassle is what you pay for when you buy pre-vetted products from http://thinkpenguin.com/ and other companies that are listed on the FSF's page http://www.fsf.org/resources/h... . you can also go to http://h-node.org/ and take a look there to see if what you want is listed.
so when you buy a product from http://thinkpenguin.com/ you know that it's "just going to work". if you genuinely want to replace the OS, you can... and it will be a very straightforward job, unlike, i can guarantee, absolutely every other recommendation at the time of writing of this comment with a category "5" score here on slashdot.
ironically, and not surprisingly, thinkpenguin get less support calls (hardware "just works"). their customers are happier.... and so are more loyal. is that worth paying a bit extra for? yeah i'd say so.
Lots of businesses use Lenovo laptops. I bought a refurbished Lenovo ThinkPad T420 from http://www.tier1online.com/ at the beginning of the year and am really liking it. Definitely worth a look. Am using Ubuntu 15.04 on it, no problems.
Got an multiple acers at home all work perfectly fine and at work we're on dell (been through 3 models) and they also work perfectly.
I paid about $450 I think way back when, ordered from NewEgg. It was a 'Last years model closeout" special...
The "D" key broke off a few years ago but if you wiggle your finger on the pad that's underneath there, it will type the letter for you.
I've run Gentoo, BSD, and currently Ubuntu on this machine. It's lived twice as long as I anticipated, and while even simple tasks like web-browsing are starting to become difficult... It ain't broke, so I won't replace it (until it does).
Frankly, when I replace it, I'll likely look at another Toshiba. While not fancy, nor slick, nor stylish, for what I paid, I got a heck of a bargain, and a fine computer that's run fine for everything I've ever asked it to do.
Different DPI on monitors is not a trivial problem.
It might get solved, but on a future version of Gnome, KDE or Cinnamon running on a future version of Wayland.
A shameless quote from Clem here :
http://blog.linuxmint.com/?p=2...
Edit by Clem: I’m not 100% sure, but I think that’s not possible with Xorg. The wayland developers talked about implementing this feature but although promising for the future, wayland is still too early to consider.
It is perhaps possible to hack up a partial solution by running a secondary X session or X server just for the second monitor. Would be fun if that works (although the two screens are now "islands" that only share the mouse pointer)
Make sure the wireless will work beforehand, and everything else will fall into place. In the past I had good luck with most Thinkpads but it's been a couple of years.
I have never had trouble installing Linux on any laptop I have owned.
But these days I just keep a VM of mint.
I have used both Dell and Clevo. Both have been fine for me. Personally, I prefer Clevo. They are OEM laptop manufactures, that people like System76 use. Although I know System76 do change the bio and other things. I have had three Dell machines, with Linux on it. They all have worked out of the box. I have heard.
I use a number of used and refurbed Thinkpads. They are usually cheap. Expandable to more memory, second hard disk, etc. Driver support is excellent.
The old ones (my newest is an i5 based T420) run fast and my T61 dual core with a replacement SSD drive instead of the 7200 rpm disk is still quite usable
and built like a tank. Teardown and maintenance videos on line. My $38.00 T61 was upgraded to 8gb of memory, a 240 SSD and it runs Linux and Windows
quite solidly. Not the lightest laptop -- but the keyboard on these old gems was excellent and the 1600x1280 video is still outstanding. The trick is finding the
correct thinkpad. The T8100 in the model I'm using is one of the better Core2 Duo performers out there.
The keyboard keys are mechanical.
well charms do hang on bracelets, so....
...
I buy locally, so I always test the machine with a live CD before I buy. I have ended up getting hp Pavilions for my last 3 laptops. I usually keep them until they fail, around 5 to 7 years. My current laptop in a HP dv 8000, I run a Mint host and a bunch of virtual machines in virtual box for various purposes. The only problems has been not being able to toggle off the touch pad when I type (wandering thumb), and not being able to get the Beats Audio bass speakers working (even in a Window virtual machine).
I also installed Mint 17 on a friends hp 15g. The only problem not being able to toggle the touch pad.
I'm also in the market for a new linux laptop, after seeing what Windows 10 has done to my security. However, I'd hold off for a couple of months. Dell and others are releasing versions of laptops with Intel's new Skylake architecture. I believe that it has enough improvements to warrant the wait.
No, no, no.
I run ubuntu on a Macbook Pro and it's only given me problems. Hard disk failure (i've seen a few of these, it's a problem with the HD cable, independently of the OS). The video output in particular is crap (I've seen macbooks fail during presentations several times, even when running MacOSX, including my own).
To get the video output to work on linux you need to boot with an extra kernel parameter, but then your virtual desktop has a fixed size larger than the laptop screen if the external output is not connected (so you can't have that on by default or your windows may open out of the screen area).
The laptop was purchased by my employer, but I'd rather pay myself (up to 1.5K) and buy somethind that it works reliably.
Avoid apple computers at all costs.
Despite popular belief, MINT is not all that stable on many systems. At least not Cinnamon.
Well, by definition it isn't linux, since it runs a different kernel.
And yet how odd. I open up a terminal, and viola, almost everything is the same.
Your kernel distinction is interesting and true enough. but in everyday use, it's a Unixy OS, and whether or not my mentor is a "fucking tool " as the AC so eloquently put it, once he noted that fact to me, I suddenly became a whole lot more capable in Linux, because I applied OSX knowledge to it.
As for his work, he uses a Macbook Pro for all his development work on emergency communication programs, a complete cross platform suite for Linux, OSX, and Windows. Not too bad for that AC's "fucking tool".
If you like, I can give you his contact info so you can tell him how wrong he is.
The shepherds did so well protecting the flock that the sheep no longer believed that wolves existed.
We've come far enough now that pretty much any non-budget laptop should be able to run Linux without the gamut of driver issues that existed in years past. I don't think there's much of a difference between the sets of reliable Windows laptops and reliable Linux laptops anymore. The keyword to look for is _reliable_, not Linux.
Yeah, this. Only thing I don't like is you have to take an extra step and install a driver for the crappy broadcom wifi it has, but otherwise macbook pros, especially the retina versions, really rock and run linux like a champ.
My MacBook Pro Retina does okay. They keyboard drives me nuts so I've always got another keyboard attached; and the wifi on it has some issues - like killing the VPN connection after several hours of use and not allowing me to maintain a connection thereafter unless I enable/disable the wifi (just figured that one out). But overall, it's okay. I'd still prefer something non-Apple though.
Truth is like the sun. You can shut it out for a time, but it ain't goin' away. - Elvis Presley (source: imdb.com)
HP zbook with nvidia quadro + linux mint work great. Docking station, networking, bluetooth etc.
just make sure u turn off the hybrid gpu crap in bios first!!
TLDR; A 'Pro' product isn't defined by some arbitrary nonsense like the number of buttons it has. It's defined by how well it does the job it is set out to do. Use the tool that matches your needs.
---
If you think the definition of "Pro" requires having a nasa-like control panel to manage the fiddly details of your equipment, then your not a professional... you're a child who only wants to impress his friends.
A professional-level device helps you get your work done with as minimal hassle as possible. A professional-level device is reliable, because the person using it is trying to get *real* work done, and doesn't want to waste time dicking around with inconsequential bullshit like whether the color of your window borders are exactly #FEFEB0, or if you can shut off the wifi using a physical toggle button.
It doesn't matter who makes the device, or . What matters is whether it does the job you need it to do, and that it does so reliably without getting in your way.
I switched to using Macs when I finally got fed up with Windows and it's utter inability to suspend/resume reliably (among other things). I had initially tried to switch to linux, multiple times, but I couldn't find a single distro that could handle suspending properly, not to mention there was no decent virtualization software to run non-linux applications on, and there were no decent alternatives on Linux that compared to stuff like Microsoft Office or Adobe products.
So I moved to using OSX and haven't looked back since. It's the perfect combination (for me) of all possible worlds. Major vendor support, good virtualization tools for when I am in a pinch and am forced to run something windows-based, but I still get all my unixy command-line goodness, etc. And everything for the most part works. I don't have this perpetual worry in the back of my head that I'm going to sit down in front of my computer one morning and my computer is completely fubared because of something I couldn't have anticipated (Like Microsoft botching yet another update).
Game support on Mac is more or less crap compared to Windows, but I'm not a big gamer so I don't really care that much.
The prefered and well working laptops for GNU/Linux are the traditional ThinkPads known as Xxxx, Txxx and Wxxx series, these execludes especially so-called ThinkPads and stuff like Yoga/Helix. The ThinkPad should only contain Intel hardware (CPU, GPU, Chipset, NIC, WiFi) and no descrete graphics from AMD/Nvidia.
Furthermore the "Developer Editions" from Dell are especially made for GNU/Linux.
Some old ThinkPad series are even certified by RedHat.
I had initially tried to switch to linux, multiple times, but I couldn't find a single distro that could handle suspending properly,
Works great for me on Linux Mint KDE on a Dell Latitude E6400. A big part of the suspend problem is probably with the hardware. You probably had a crappy laptop. Get a business-class computer with Intel hardware; that's the secret recipe for running Linux reliably and everything working well.
not to mention there was no decent virtualization software to run non-linux applications on
Ok, this is just dumb. VirtualBox and VMWare both run fine on Linux, among many other choices.
It has been my experience for a decade or so that everything works with Linux.
In our household, we have three laptops, all working fine with Linux.
One is Dell, and two are Toshibas. All are 6-7 years old.
None came with Linux pre-installed. All ran fine with Kubuntu LTS. Everything works, sound, WiFi.
What does not work are the multimedia buttons (a button may work, e.g. Mute, but the ones next to it would not, e.g. Play, Stop, ...etc.)
2bits.com, Inc: Drupal, WordPress, and LAMP performance tuning.
I got an HP Stream 13 at Microcenter for $200. It's not a top-of-the-line machine and the keyboard has some annoyances (especially if you're used to quality Thinkpad ones which nobody else even comes close to anymore). It is good enough to play fullscreen video without issues. Ubuntu/Mint seem to work fine (not 100% out-of-the-box but pretty close to it by Linux standards) including wi-fi, webcam, bluetooth, and all the other bells and whistles I'm aware of.
Car analogy: a VW Beetle and a Porsche 911 are pretty similar when it comes to driving; they are both automobiles and both have the same basic functionality. But referring to a 911 as a 'tarted up beetle' will generate some lively discussion.
Note that "almost everything is the same" is not "almost everything is similar". Both linux and OSX are indeed based on the same fundamentals as Unix; but neither is Unix, they just look and feel much the same. You can't take a program from one and run it on the other without some work and a recompile.
The previous generations of the XPS13 were really good. However, I cannot concur on this on the current generation of the XPS13 (model 9343) with the broadcom wifi. The Broadcom wifi card makes the machine basically useless when upgrading to a newer version of Ubuntu due to the proprietary wireless module that doesn't work very well. Both Ubuntu 15.10 and 15.04 wouldn't even see 5Ghz wifi networks, much less join them. The machine also frequently panics with the broadcom wifi.
Having said that, the machine is excellent otherwise. FWIW, I actually managed to convince Dell to send me an intel replacement for the broadcom wifi. The intel wifi is so, so, so much better. It basically turns the machine from having a terrible UX to having a great UX. The panics also disappeared.
Also, I would suggest ripping out the synaptics driver in favor of the libinput driver on Ubuntu 15.10. It provides a much nicer experience. I use the following in /etc/X11/xorg.conf.d/99-libinput.conf:
Section "InputClass"
Identifier "libinput"
Driver "libinput"
MatchDevicePath "/dev/input/event*"
MatchIsTouchpad "true"
Option "Tapping" "true"
Option "ClickMethod" "none"
Option "NaturalScrolling" "true"
EndSection
This makes the touch pad act a lot like a macbook touch pad, and it makes no-look use of the touch pad much easier. Also, the "DisableWhileTyping" option is on by default on my machine, but you should make sure that it on to get the best experience.
This system does need some love in the dynamic-plugging-in-of-monitors area, but everything else works really well now that I have the intel wifi card.
FWIW, the OS on my machine is upgraded directly from what Dell ships on the machine. Short of removing a few OEM related packages on the upgrade, there wasn't much problem.
Let's clarify real quick. Overall I agree with your point, but:
However, the windowing system is not highly customizable. I'd argue it's far better than Windows, and provides a better user experience for the majority of users than GNOME, KDE, etc... but no, you're not going to be editing the source and recompiling with new features.
Personally, I am happiest with Mac on my desk and Linux in my server room (or cloud). The MacBook Pro isn't that much more expensive. It's a great computer with a good (paid) warranty that gives me full support and compatibility with all the tools I need, and I'll never have to waste time fucking with drivers or the latest GNOME stupidity.
SWM seeks new sig for a brief fling
...but the distinction should be maintained.
Why? How "unixy" Linux or MacOS is is a really rather tired argument by now, isn't? Having cut my unix teeth on Solaris, AIX, and HP-UX, seems like I should be able to tell how "unixy" something is. I have MacOS because of my work, but I hate it. It doesn't really fee like unix to me at all, and I have a hard time understanding how "unixy" it really is since the kernel is a heavily modified mach clone. But whatever, just saying your reasoning on how "unixy" Mac is seems a bit strained to me, even with a big web page with small characters explaining how "unixy" it is.
Python: 'And then suddenly you have a language which says "we're all stuck with whatever the whiniest coder wants".'
You can't take current tools and retroactively apply them to a situation from over a decade ago.
Linux Mint didn't exist. Heck, Ubuntu itself was relatively new.
VMWare workstation didn't support linux until v6.
Virtualbox was very mediocre at best.
So yeah, if I try to make the switch now, I'll probably have much better success. But then? Not even remotely.
Acer C720 or C740 Chromebooks are really cheap and everything works when you replace Chrome OS with Linux. Buy one with 4 GB of main memory and then replace the SSD with a bigger one.
...but the distinction should be maintained.
Why? How "unixy" Linux or MacOS is is a really rather tired argument by now, isn't? Having cut my unix teeth on Solaris, AIX, and HP-UX, seems like I should be able to tell how "unixy" something is. I have MacOS because of my work, but I hate it. It doesn't really fee like unix to me at all, and I have a hard time understanding how "unixy" it really is since the kernel is a heavily modified mach clone. But whatever, just saying your reasoning on how "unixy" Mac is seems a bit strained to me, even with a big web page with small characters explaining how "unixy" it is.
The point of my post was more to correct the semantics in the discussion than to debate how unixy either OS is. Mac, Linux, *BSD, and Solaris are all sufficiently unixy for me. But I'm not a real neckbeard--I never used AIX or HP-UX.
By "the distinction should be maintained" I meant the distinction between OS and GUI. Why not? GUIs are interchangeable and optional. I do the vast majority of my work in terminal, my cross-platform text editor, and a browser. I care a lot more about how the OS handles path resolution, variables, ssh, port forwarding over ssh, symlinks, shell expansion, regex, etc. than crap like launchctl or X. Is there even a POSIX standard or anything similar regarding windowing systems?
I'd agree that Mac doesn't "feel" Unixy. But in my experience, it implements the standard reliably enough. I'm curious where it falls short for you (aside from personal dislike, which I totally get).
If you haven't read the standards, you might want to glance at IEEE Std 1003.1, 2013.
SWM seeks new sig for a brief fling
And the dang delete key vs backspace. MBP are really bad for development. But give them credit on graphics speed w/Linux.
I bought a system76 laptop when ubuntu 12 was released. I still use it as my main laptop with ubuntu 15 and haven't had a single issue. If you will be running primarily linux, go with a vendor that specialize in that.
Let's clarify real quick. Overall I agree with your point, but:
My full apologies here folks, This is slashdot, and I probably insulted some of the linux folks with my asinine comparison.
The shepherds did so well protecting the flock that the sheep no longer believed that wolves existed.
Linux works on mac's and intel and has for a long long time.
avoid ubuntu and fedora/redhat. they are the microsoft wannabes.
opensuse and debian are great.
distrowatch.com
Your best bets are Lenovo (I've got X220 and it's superb in Arch) and Dell.
Other brands might work, but those two are most likely to work properly, i.e. including suspend and all hardware buttons.
Chromebook's are basically guaranteed to work with Linux...seeing as ChromeOS is a Linux distro. You could wait for the new Dell Chromebook 13, which goes up to an i5 and 8GB of RAM or get a Chromebook Pixel. The Pixel is designed so you can dual boot, iirc. The Dell, no clue but if you wait a bit, John Lewis and the coreboot community will probably come out with a ROM for it if it's needed.
If you are interested in reliability of the results you produce, read on.
If you want trustworthy calculations or documents without occasional random mistakes in content, you need a machine with ECC. See http://www.intel.com/content/dam/www/public/us/en/documents/technology-briefs/workstation-ecc-memory-brief.pdf
Soon to be available:
Lenovo: http://www.anandtech.com/show/9503/lenovo-launches-new-p50-and-p70-mobile-workstations-with-first-mobile-xeon-chips
http://www.pcworld.com/article/2960799/laptop-computers/the-first-skylake-laptops-are-lenovos-thinkpad-p50-and-p70-graphics-workstations.html
They do not appear yet on Lenovo's shopping site.
HP: http://www8.hp.com/us/en/hp-search/search.html?nores=true&qt=zbook%20ecc
Results for “zbook ecc” (0) No results found in All HP.com. Please try again.
Nowadays, with very few exceptions, desktop PC's, laptops, notepads, phones and even low end servers all come with RAM that does not check for soft errors at runtime, and usually not even hard errors at power-on or reboot. No parity checking, no Error Correcting Coding (ECC). Most user-class processors, chipsets, motherboards, and BIOS's do not support it.
On these computers, if a random change happens to a bit of code, if you are fortunate, the program crashes. If a random change happens to bits of the kernel, if you are fortunate, the whole OS crashes. If it happens to your application data, well, it isn't what it used to be. Random alterations to a dirty disk buffer in memory will get written out to disk. If it happened to your data, it changed. If it happened to a directory or file system allocation bit map, some spot that is occupied will maybe appear to be free. If it happened to the table of which dirty disk blocks are where in memory, then data blocks on disk will end up with totally content, with the correct content written someplace else or not at all..
Why is it this way? The story goes back 25 years, when clone makers came out with IBM PC clones without parity memory. IBM's and some other company's PC's had parity memory. The good news was that it would catch soft errors. The bad news was that when BIOS caught a parity error interrupt, it cleared the screen, put a Parity Error message on the first line and halted the computer. Unsaved work? too bad. In the middle of a file write, directory or FAT file system update? too bad. Some manufacturers offered a BIOS option to disable that behavior. Enough customers preferred that option that more companies started using non-parity memory. After all, the parity memory bits add another 12.5% to memory cost. Why not be able to offer a lower price for what the customers want? Eventually, even "market driven" IBM started doing the same.
ECC watches for and corrects soft errors when they happen.
For some people, it may be adequate to use a generic laptop to VNC or RDP into a server class machine with ECC for important work.
This may stray from the typical, but I actually have a 9 year old Panasonic Toughbook CF-52, duo core. Last year I took the Linux plunge and loaded Linux Mint as a dual-boot with Windows XP Professional. Once I became familiar with Linux, I purchased a new Crucial SSD 256 gig, and am running Linux Mint 17.2 on it exclusively. Including going through the bios, from power on to fully loaded is about 25 seconds. I have had zero issues with this computer in 9 years, and it sits on a jotto desk in my truck very nearly every day, through the blazing heat of Atlanta summers. The machine has in excess of 25,000 hours of operating time since new.
Because of the reliability, I bough my wife and son each a refurbished Toughbook CF-52, for $695 each, and they are also running Linux Mint 17.2 (cinnamon as well) and absolutely have had zero issues. I only wish the computer had an hdmi port, but the wifi is strong and never drops, the speed is absolutely fine, and, unless you are doing heavy-duty video editing, they are perfect for us.
OK you mention that there is no real VR in Linux, that is BS. No the problem is that you are depending on oracle to deliver, that is not going to happen. Or even some other close source company that is ever going to work. But the software is done and working, to that in a minute. And as to hardware go with DELL, Asus or Lenovo, HP are just cheap and just break down. What you need to ask is before purchase what is the UEFI is support, and what OS do they sell it with. Granted HP dose sell Ubuntu laptops, but they are under powered and over priced. Hardware drivers are no longer the problem, nor is VR under Linux. What are your connectivity requirements, how many USB ports are you going to use at one time. Do you need HDMI or just VGA, are you going to use thunder bolt or USB 3.1. Now to the OS my recommendation is Robo Linux or at least the VR software. This software dose what they advertize, just copy your windows OS and run under Linux and use the VR. I still do not understand why all of Linux user say all software has to be free, that is not true. If you donate you are paying for it, you are sponsoring someones work. Hell they will pay for bloated and spy-ware with windows and OSX, but not with Linux. Someone is doing the work to make your life simpler, why not help the work to go on. It is $2.37 for a years support and $9.95 for the VR software to just import your current OS to Linux. The developer is not charging for the VR or Linux, but for his work to Import your current OS to Linux the just works and is protected under Linux. And if any thing goes wrong you can just restore it back to that same point. Plus your are paying for support with the OS for a year for just $2.37, plus any update that he makes in that year. I have distro hopped for the past 15 years, this is one of the most stable and fastest OS that I have used. I developed software so I work from Linux and I play on windows. Till the time that steam is fully out of beta, this has been my best option. I save time and multiple boots between OS. I have 5 PC'S and 2 Laptops and have fond the most time saver with this software. 4 PC'S have Windows 7 Ultimate now they all run under Linux and no more problems. And the laptops just run Linux, one of them is use Robo Linux and VR windows 7. Ho by the way the laptops are a Dell 5370 and a Asus K55N-RHA8N29. Hope this helps someone, and just download and try a live vercion. If your like it, just think of it as a donation to the developer for his work.
http://slashdot.org/comments.p...
But I will check out Robo Linux. I hadn't heard of that distro before.
I'm impressed you can still read the screen and type with all those cocks in your mouth.
http://pi-top.com
Admittedly, I haven't received mine yet, but it's due in the next couple of weeksâ¦
However, at its core is a raspberry pi 2, which by now has solid, stable versions of Linux including Ubuntu.
Plus: from a maker point of view, it's ideal. Totally hackable in both hardware and software.
Hey, I gotta afford that Macbook Pro somehow!
If you want to go cheap, grab a thinkpad T510 ($200 on ebay right now). It is the first of the series to use a full led backlit LCD. It is also lighter than it's older brother the T500 and T61. If you want to spend more money, then get the T520. Anything after that (T530, ect) I do not have experience with. The slim 'x' series laptops are good too as well as the carbon series. But I like the bigger screens on the T series.
Picked it up for $20.00. Gave it 4GB of RAM and installed debian 7 (wheezy) and purged pulseaudio. That was two years ago. I use mate and compiz-fusion for my desktop. Sure the built-in wi-fi is only g, the left speaker is borked, the lid hinge is a bit wonky and the battery may last for an hour tops but it is still very dependable and responsive, sleeps and wakes up with no problems.
Serenity now, insanity later.
I know there are a bit more expensive but they work great under linux. The only thing I would recommend is to install the wifi-card for yourself, and add a A/N Ath9k with tripple-streams.