Deja Vu: Microsoft's 2015 Surface Book Ad and Apple's 2014 'Your Verse' iPad Ad

theodp writes: With its sweeping vistas and narration by the late Robin Williams, Apple's 2014 'Your Verse' ad dramatically showcased the many ways iPads might help people create, from making movies to calibrating wind turbines. So it's interesting that Microsoft's first ad for its new Surface Book (YouTube) bears a striking resemblance to the earlier Apple ad (YouTubeDoubler comparison). Which is probably only fair, since Apple's soon-to-be-released iPad Pro bears more than a passing resemblance to the Microsoft Surface. Hey, good artists copy, great artists steal, right? By the way, between the release of Microsoft's Surface Pro 4, Apple's iPad Pro, and Google's Pixel C, is the keyboard+touch interface poised to be a four-decade "overnight success"?

Comments

Computing in the 21st century is...

[Assoluto]

...all marketing, no substance. The one exception is Linux, which is all substance and no marketing. Of course, that itself is is something of a problem.

Re:Computing in the 21st century is...

[Anonymous Coward]

Zzzzz... tired old post is tired.

editorialize much?

[Anonymous Coward]

obnoxious summary links to youtubedoubler with the two commercials that have a slight resemblance in that they are both advertising tablets.

Re:editorialize much?

[v1]

really all they have in common is they both switch frequently between life shots (most of which not incorporatin the product), with deadpan narration.

Re:editorialize much?

[HairyNevus]

Seriously, this is done all the time, especially by energy/oil corporations. Exxon has one similar right now: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WrH19H-J4pU. What's the point? That both Apple and Microsoft used tired advertising techniques? Oh! But M$FT used them last, when they were more tired!

Re:editorialize much?

[r-diddly]

No, I noticed it. Was watching TV (yes I admit it), saw the ad, and was about to say 'WTF I'm so sick of these Apple ads trying to convince everyone they're a fucking special unique snowflake' and then boom I see the Windows logo.

Re:editorialize much?

[GrpA]

Just because something is done all the time, it doesn't mean it's a bad strategy - in fact, it usually points to a very good strategy.

Surface has gouged out an entire market from under Apple's feet. People who use tablets with active stylus tend to love them ( and they use their fingers too, but sometimes, you just want a pen... ) - And Apple's contempt for pen-based input as a marketing strategy ( eg, Macbook Air will never feature touch/pen ) allowed Microsoft to just walk in and take the place without any resistance.

It may have taken, even needed, apple to make tablets cool enough for the market to seriously consider them, but they don't know how to innovate and now Microsoft is using the same ads that are so effective in the demographic that usually buys Apple to sell them Surface.

I suspect the OP has identified this.

Reminds me of the old Apple vs PC ads. Except it looks like PC went on a diet, got ripped and is stealing chicks from Apple... Not only is he good looking now, he's funny too. And he can run real-world programs, not just apps. So he might as wear the turtleneck sweater and too eh?

GrpA

Re:editorialize much?

[v1]

It may have taken, even needed, apple to make tablets cool enough for the market to seriously consider them, but they don't know how to innovate and now Microsoft is using the same ads that are so effective in the demographic that usually buys Apple to sell them Surface.

Apple has always known how to innovate, the problem is it gets more difficult over a product's lifespan to find good, exciting new innovations. You start to "run out of steam". The best thing to do at that point is to come up with a whole new product and throw your innovation into that instead. The best time to do that is of course when the rest of the world has geared up and is copying your current product in its present form, with all the innovations already worked out. Can't blame them, skip the creativity, R&D, and risk, and go right to market with a safe, proven idea. But at that point it's a saturated market, and that cancels out a lot of the gains of your shortcuts. (that's been microsoft's strategy for decades now, it's low yield, but [i]is[/i] profitable if done right)

It's just time for Apple to move on. Their new target of course is the Apple Watch. I don't expect we'll see a lot of advances in the iPad department anymore, it's time for the copycats to take over milking it for what little is left there. I must admit it was pretty entertaining seeing all the smartmwatches just crawl out of the woodwork so quickly, the copycats are really stepping up their game. I'm sure we'll see an MS Watch sometime in the next few years, they don't move nearly as fast as the others. (they tend to wait for something to clearly be a success before copying it, rather than watching the rumor mills in an attempt to get a product to market in time to compete with what someone else thinks will be a hit - obviously risky)

Re:editorialize much?

[Dutch Gun]

You probably got fooled because Microsoft created an advertisement that wasn't laughably bad. Of course you'd initially assume it was from Apple.

This is more their style.

Re:editorialize much?

[macs4all]

It may have taken, even needed, apple to make tablets cool enough for the market to seriously consider them, but they don't know how to innovate

You do realize, of course, that the above sentence-fragment is completely self-contradictory, right?

If Tablets existed before the iPad (which of course they did), and they were ALL non-starters UNTIL the iPad (which of course they were), then certainly Apple did some sort of innovation that suddenly transformed the entire idea of Tablets from "uncool" to "cool" (which of course they did).

Is not that the very essence of "innovation"?

Re:editorialize much?

[macs4all]

I'm sure we'll see an MS Watch sometime in the next few years

And dollars to donuts its great claim to fame will be that it runs Office365, Watch Edition.

Re:editorialize much?

[v1]

It will also come in several different (subscription based) versions, offering a variety of features like Alarm, Daylight Savings, and chronograph, none of which will come with the starter version. If you don't keep your subsription up, it will start displaying "this time isn't genuine", and force you to watch an ad before it tells you what time it is.

Re:editorialize much?

[nobodie]

No, what Apple has always done is very good marketing, which is what they did with the iPad. The innovation had already come with the iPod and the music store innovation. An old, tired idea at the point where it became the "App Store." And really, they run repos for applications and charge you to buy them. That is innovation? No that is stealing the idea from linux and other unix derivatives and charging people for it. Charging people is not an innovation.

Re:editorialize much?

[macs4all]

No, what Apple has always done is very good marketing, which is what they did with the iPad. The innovation had already come with the iPod and the music store innovation. An old, tired idea at the point where it became the "App Store." And really, they run repos for applications and charge you to buy them. That is innovation? No that is stealing the idea from linux and other unix derivatives and charging people for it. Charging people is not an innovation.

You're so full if shit I can't believe you even believe your own bullshit.

You realize, of course, that you switched in the middle of your rant from the iPad to Linux (which actually IS the OS that stole from Unix, instead of BEING a Unix, like OS X) to the App Store, right?

Re:editorialize much?

[nobodie]

the OS X kernal was/is called Mach, which was a derivative of BSD. Linux, while considered by most to be a Unix variant, has taken the Unix base and built and built and built on it so that it now has evolved in many different directions. Yes, correct. This is good. Apple has also evolved OS X. Also good. But neither are adequate to meet the high standards you and I set for "innovation." My comment had to do with the "App Store" and the fact that it is just a repo with a price for the downloads. It is considered by many in the Apple world as the "innovation" that is making Apple rich. I dispute the use of the word innovation in this context. Both of the OSs are evolutions of Unix, but called the App Store an innovation is wrong.

Sorry, but I can't bring myself to rise to your level of vitriol, I have a life and things to do today.

Archie Bunker would not be so kind

[Anonymous Coward]

Now would he. It's all Chinese pinko commie crap any wayz youz lookz at it.

Exactly Identical

[im_thatoneguy]

I mean, they're both TV spots showing people using the product in a variety of settings, what a rip off. They even both have a narration!

Re:Exactly Identical

[Anonymous Coward]

Exactly identical and unexpectedly surprising.

Re:Exactly Identical

[Anonymous Coward]

This is Slashdot! We don't give a fuck about what you're doing with the technology you own. If you don't get your sense of pride from who makes your technology then you're a fucking loser, loser.

Surface Pro vs iPad Pro

[Anonymous Coward]

I'm not going to watch the stupid ads because fuck you, I block ads, but hey, since we're discussing tablets, might as well make some observations about the two.

First off I'd say that the Surface Pro 4 SHOULD kick the iPad Pro's ass for one simple reason: it's an actual computer, running an actual desktop OS. I have a Surface Pro 3 and the thing is GREAT as a tiny computer. It runs a real desktop OS so I end up using it as a little netbook. I can run real applications on it, which is really all I want to do with it. I only very rarely use it as a tablet but when I do that feature is really nice. The iPad Pro doesn't run a real OS and you won't be able to install real desktop apps on it. Sure, it will look a lot like a Surface with its keyboard and its pen, but it simply can't hold a candle to being able to run real desktop apps from anywhere with no restrictions on who publishes them.

On the other hand, Windows 10.

I made the mistake of "upgrading" my Surface Pro 3 to Windows 10. The new Windows 10 "tablet" mode manages to be EVEN WORSE than tablet apps were in Windows 8. They managed to make the pen interface even worse - before using the pen as handwriting basically worked. You'd almost never use the feature (as using the onscreen keyboard or the REAL keyboard was always better), but it was there, and it was nice. Windows 10 ruins it and makes it worthless.

Windows 10 is so bad that it means that the iPad Pro could manage to be better than the Surface Pro 4, and there's no way that should be possible.

Re:Surface Pro vs iPad Pro

[bondsbw]

So you love how Windows 10 can run real applications, is a true desktop OS, and you even consider its tablet mode "really nice". You never use handwriting, but because you think that's not as good, your conclusion is that Windows 10 "is so bad".

What?

Re:Surface Pro vs iPad Pro

[Lumpy]

The tablet mode is abysmal. windows 10 normal mode is great, and luckily the recent updates fixed a lot of battery drain issues that caused the surface to stay on in your backpack and cook it's self.

Re:Surface Pro vs iPad Pro

[Anonymous Coward]

The tablet mode is abysmal.

In what way? The launcher reconfigures to make it more finger-friendly and from there it is about whether the application you want to run is more geared toward a tablet or laptop use-case.

Re:Surface Pro vs iPad Pro

[Anonymous Coward]

For some strange reason using desktop apps in tablet mode is harder than using them in desktop mode. I was under the impression "tablet mode" was for making using "classic" apps easier when using it as a tablet, but it flat-out isn't.

Let me explain. When the hardware keyboard is attached and the Surface defaults to Desktop Mode, you can bring up the software (touch) keyboard and the handwriting keyboard. Whatever - don't know why you'd want to do that when you can just use the keyboard, but it doesn't hurt.

When you remove the keyboard, the OS switches to "tablet mode" and YOU LOSE THE ABILITY TO BRING UP THE SOFTWARE KEYBOARD. The button to do it just vanishes and you have to rely on the app explicitly telling it to do so to activate it. I assumed I was just being stupid so I actually went to a Microsoft Store and tried the new Surface Pro 4 demo units and they do the same thing! In desktop mode, bringing up the tablet keyboard is a prominent button. In tablet mode, it's gone and there's no way to bring it back.

This makes Tablet Mode useless for the majority of apps. It means Desktop Mode is more useful when using the tablet as a tablet making you wonder why Tablet Mode even exists!

Re:Surface Pro vs iPad Pro

[holostarr]

So basically you just didn't bother to do a simple Google search. Follow the steps below to enable keyboard in table mode:

1. Switch to tablet mode

2. Right click on the task bar

3. In the pop-up menu select "Show touch keyboard button"

4. Enjoy touch keyboard in tablet mode

View post on imgur.com

Re:Surface Pro vs iPad Pro

[Anonymous Coward]

So basically in the same place as in windows 7 and 8. Still you'd think that if Microsoft were going to automatically toggle this button's appearance, they'd hide it when you plug in a real keyboard and show it when you remove the keyboard.

Re:Surface Pro vs iPad Pro

[wasteofspace77]

Thank you. I did not know about this. Makes tablet mode usable with Firefox.

Re:Surface Pro vs iPad Pro

[holostarr]

So if you are unhappy with Windows 10, downgrade back to Windows 8! Here are the steps to downgrade:

1. Go to "All Settings"

2. Click on "Update & Security"

3. Click on "Recovery"

4. Under "Go back to Windows 8.1" section, click "Get started"

5. Stop COMPLAINING!!

Re:Surface Pro vs iPad Pro

[swb]

Will they finally allow pairing a BT mouse with the iPad Pro?

I like my iPad 3 for infotainment consumption. I use a keyboard case and have always wished for the ability to pair a mouse, even if I could only use it with an RDP app. It's the one thing that might drive me to an ultrabook-type laptop, although I think I'd miss the simplicity of IOS for the things I use it for.

Re:Surface Pro vs iPad Pro

[Anonymous Coward]

Yeah, uh, there is no "go back to Windows 8.1" section. That's gone. I think it was only available for a month and, silly me, I kind of assumed Microsoft would FIX the bugs in Windows 10, instead of doing things to actively make it worse like adding ads to the Start menu, so I didn't revert fast enough.

Re:Surface Pro vs iPad Pro

[Anonymous Coward]

No no no, you are on the wrong website. This used to be news for nerds, things changed and it is now news for computer-illiterates who want to dick measure about how the company who makes the personal computing device that they chose came up with an idea before the company who makes the computing device that somebody else chose and discuss the patent lawsuit about said idea.

Nobody here wants to do anything, they want to complain that what they want wasnt given to them by default. The days of this being a forum for geeks and hackers is LONG gone!

Re:Surface Pro vs iPad Pro

[gl4ss]

well they just made the mistake of !'ing the default value. you know, the same kind of mistake they did with checking the update to windows 10 optional update to be checked on by default. what a 'mistake'

Re:Surface Pro vs iPad Pro

[macs4all]

First off I'd say that the Surface Pro 4 SHOULD kick the iPad Pro's ass for one simple reason: it's an actual computer, running an actual desktop OS

Right. Because the marketplace spoke SO loudly that that's EXACTLY what they wanted for the PREVIOUS DECADE that Windows-Based Tablets existed (but sold nearly ZERO units across several brands and form-factors) BEFORE the iPad waltzed in and INSTANTLY ATE THEIR LUNCH.

Face it, other than the Slashdot crowd, the MAJORITY of people do NOT want everything to be a full-featured computer. They already HAVE abundant choices for that. They want something that handles what they do MOST OFTEN (browse, email, look at vids). That's where a tablet fits in.

Remember Jobs' comments at the debut of the iPad? That's the genius of the iPad.

Slashdot is full of nothing but a bunch of computer luddites. The general public has moved on. Why not Slashdotters?

Re:Surface Pro vs iPad Pro

[macs4all]

So basically in the same place as in windows 7 and 8. Still you'd think that if Microsoft were going to automatically toggle this button's appearance, they'd hide it when you plug in a real keyboard and show it when you remove the keyboard.

Sounds like the Tablet Experience team and the Desktop Experience team can't tell True from False.

Re:Surface Pro vs iPad Pro

[nobodie]

Well, hmmm, not to make too big a point about this cause I am not the "ordinary" user.... well does anybody remember the WeTab? It was a 12"tablet from a German company (Titoo? I think) who made a tablet that could run Win 7, or Linux (I put Fedora on mine) or any number of other OSs. I bought a bluetooth keyboard and a simple little stand for it and had a pretty decent little desktop for a small investment. Fedora had touch pretty quick (had to bash around a bit the first time I did it, then it was standard after a year or so). So, while I am very impressed by the surface, it wasn't news to me.

What it was was a nice piece of well put together kit. I don't suggest them to my students, because of the price, but students who do have them can work just as well or better than the ones toting macbooks. Even the Chinese ones with macbooks running winXP (yes, that is a real thing). So I have to say that the Surface is as good as a Macbook. Yes, I just damned it with faint praise, but for most people that sounded like a big up, so take it as you will.

As a Tech Enthusiast

[tuppe666]

So its come to this, we compare marketing of two similar products aimed at the same potential customers, and Apple fanatics call copy to a montage of real world and exciting examples of their(not your) product being used.

Ironically all I thought was poor value devices to both. I miss Bill buying shoes.

Re:As a Tech Enthusiast

[macs4all]

Ironically all I thought was poor value devices to both. I miss Bill buying shoes.

And I suppose you miss the Vista OS that went along with that campaign.

The OS that sucked so hard that MS stopped advertising the name "Microsoft" along with Vista, and just started calling it "Windows" (not Microsoft Windows)?

Re: As a Tech Enthusiast

[terjeber]

Saying that the Surface Pro and the iPad Pro are similar is like saying an Audi S8 and a 1969 Beetle are similar.

But will the ipad Pro suck like the surface?

[Lumpy]

Having had to reinstall the OS yet again last night because Wifi goes out and will not come back because of a serious bug microsoft will not fix. They chose to use the super crappy "Marvell" chipset for their wireless in the surface 1,2,3 and it is highly common for it to wig out on you and you lose the drivers for the wifi and you have to uninstall the device and drivers, reinstall the old drivers and then reboot, or many times tell the surface to do a OS reinstall to get it back to working again.

So if the Ipad Pro does not do that, It's better. I wish Samsung would make a surface pro type of tablet so I can get away from the shit-quality that microsoft hardware has become.

Re:But will the ipad Pro suck like the surface?

[Anonymous Coward]

Most people who have had that issue (to your extent - OS reinstall) have gotten replacements under warranty. You're in a (vocal, admittedly) minority who have had problems that bad with the wifi. It's worth noting that the leading contender - the intel chip - has a similar number of people with awful connectivity problems. Heck, the Sony I had was an exceptionally poor performer with that Intel board compared to the $300, 4 year old Acer I used to have.

You should dump it for Apple hardware. Of course, you'll have to choose between a pen and a real OS. But if you have a problem you can drive to you local Apple Store and have them replace it. With that Surface, you'd have to go all the way to a Microsoft store to get that kind of service.

Re:But will the ipad Pro suck like the surface?

[wasteofspace77]

Sounds like a hardware problem. Have you tried getting it fixed?

Why would you even bother reinstalling the OS multiple times to fix the WiFi connection? Life is too short.

Re:But will the ipad Pro suck like the surface?

[Lumpy]

Yeah Microsoft will NOT cover it under warranty as a reinstall fixes it so it's not a hardware problem (what I have been told)

Honestly the next one is NOT going to be a Microsoft surface... I am hoping one of the other PC makers will have one that is made from premium parts and not crap like Microsoft uses.

Re:But will the ipad Pro suck like the surface?

[Lumpy]

Yes, microsoft refuses to "fix" anything as a reinstall brings it back to normal so they blame user error or whatever software I install. and it's a common problem the forums are full of the complaints about it and it spans all three versions of the pro.

Re:But will the ipad Pro suck like the surface?

[thegarbz]

Sounds like an isolated case to me.

Posted by a happy Surface Pro 3 user who's WiFi has never drop out. Except that one time but it turns out the power actually went out and I didn't notice.

Re:But will the ipad Pro suck like the surface?

[Anonymous Coward]

Isolated as in tons of threads about it all over the internet in all the forums?

$3199 for a tablet? Seriously?

[JustAnotherOldGuy]

Microsoft's 1TB Surface Book will cost you $3199 (plus tax), which seems a bit steep to me.

Yes, it comes with a 1TB solid state drive, but honestly, who is going to fork over ~$3,500 for a tablet? Sure, I can see a few niche applications that might require this kind of storage, but damn...$3500?

You could buy several 128GB WiFi + Cellular iPads and still have enough left over for lunch, assuming you didn't need a full terabyte of HDD space.

Or you could buy an HP EliteOne 800 G1 (Core i7, 1TB, 3.2 GHz, 8 GB RAM) for about $1,400 per unit...

I'm just not seeing why the huge price difference for the Surface would be worth it.

Re:$3199 for a tablet? Seriously?

[ranton]

Or you could buy an HP EliteOne 800 G1 (Core i7, 1TB, 3.2 GHz, 8 GB RAM) for about $1,400 per unit...

You do realize that is a desktop machine, not a laptop or tablet, right? The processor in that machine uses four times the power of the processor in the Surface Book. You might as well compare an iPod to the Surface Book.

Microsoft's 1TB Surface Book will cost you $3199 (plus tax) ... who is going to fork over ~$3,500 for a tablet?

The same people whose desktop has 2 30"+ 4k monitors, who drive a Tesla, and who live in a $600k+ house. No one who is budget conscious would buy it, but no one like that would buy the $10,000 Apple watch either. Yet these products still exist because some people out there don't care what they cost.

And if you really had a need for a 1TB hard drive on a mobile device, and a spinning disk would be too slow, its not like you are spending that much more when ammortized over the life of the device. Even if you only use it for two years, that is $60 per month more than a more reasonable $2k device. Its hard to even buy a dinner for two at Outback Steakhouse for that amount of money. Its also less than many peoples' monthly Starbucks habit.

Re:$3199 for a tablet? Seriously?

[Anonymous Coward]

Yes, it comes with a 1TB solid state drive, but honestly, who is going to fork over ~$3,500 for a tablet?

It's the Surface Book, it can run without the keyboard but as far as hardware and price goes it is in the same league as the Macbook Pro except the latter doesnt have the ability to operate without the keyboard because it lacks stylus and touch input. Is this important to you? If not then maybe go the Macbook, if so then go for the Surface or maybe you don't want to spend that much on a computing device so go with something else, your choice, choose what's best for you.

Re:$3199 for a tablet? Seriously?

[Anonymous Coward]

You could buy several 128GB WiFi + Cellular iPads and still have enough left over for lunch, assuming you didn't need a full terabyte of HDD space.

So how come people are buying MBPs instead of several iPads then? It just doesnt make sense does it? Oh of course, because they arent the same thing. I thought this was a tech site where people here knew and understood the differences between different kinds of devices yet there are people like you who dont have the slightest clue about the differences between an iPad and an x86 laptop. You see a computing device that can operate without a keyboard and assume it must be just like an iPad, I think this is the wrong website for you.

Or you could buy an HP EliteOne 800 G1 (Core i7, 1TB, 3.2 GHz, 8 GB RAM) for about $1,400 per unit...

Or you could go to Starbucks and get yourself a blueberry muffin for about $3.50, that's a lot cheaper than a $1400 computer!

I'm just not seeing why the huge price difference for the Surface would be worth it.

That is abundantly clear. You obviously dont know enough about this if your alternative suggestions are a desktop system and half a dozen iPads.

Re:$3199 for a tablet? Seriously?

[Overzeetop]

The same people whose desktop has 2 30"+ 4k monitors, who drive a Tesla, and who live in a $600k+ house. No one who is budget conscious would buy it, but no one like that would buy the $10,000 Apple watch either. Yet these products still exist because some people out there don't care what they cost.

There are actually quite a few people who don't drive Teslas or have $600k+ houses that work with multiple monitors. While there is a large market for budget conscious people, there is also a large market for professionals need a relatively fast machine but spend a lot of time on the road (or, at least, not chained to a desk) and don't want to carry a heavy laptop around.

I have three monitors - 2x20 and and a 30. I'll likely be upgrading to 2x42 with my SP4 so I can have two, full-sized architectural prints open at the same time in my office (plus email/calendar/takslist on the native screen), but be able to take the tablet with me to job sites where I can look up all the same information and jot down site notes directly on the plans in my PDf viewer. I'm decidedly not in the Tesla-driving set, but I know what will save me time and money and aggravation - and $3k (okay $2200, I cheaped out and got the i5/512GB) is worth a couple days of consulting income to make my office run smoother and reduce duplicated effort (typing up field notes or scanning and labeling field note sheets individually).

Re:$3199 for a tablet? Seriously?

[Anonymous Coward]

Microsoft doesn't make tablets. They make laptops with a detachable keyboard. Apple does make laptops and does make tablets. Apples laptop is a laptop with a laptop OS, a keyboard and a touch pad. Apples iPad is a tablet with a tablet OS and applications that have to be controlled by the touch interface.

In my opinion you can't compare Windows hybrid with Apples 'pure' solutions.

My idea is that a tablet should be a tablet and nothing else. And a laptop should be a laptop and nothing else.

I still not get Microsoft's idea on a tablet. Most programs you need are Desktop version only. So you end up using your 'tablet' as a laptop. So why go through all the extra costs in development to make a laptop that can remove the keyboard, instead of just build a cheaper and nice to use tablet? Why do they build such an expensive netbook with a bad keyboard?

What do they mean that productivity equals typing letters in word, typing sums in Excel and having meetings with boring Powerpoint slides? There are so many people in business that don't need that 'office productivity' but who could use computing power to make their job easier. Well Microsofts view is give them a Lablet with Office, that will make them productive!!!!

Re:$3199 for a tablet? Seriously?

[Anonymous Coward]

Well I run a lot of 3D modeling and design applications as well as the gaming environments those assets are used in. I liked my Alienware system but the more I have been travelling the more I notice how cumbersome it is to travel with. The alternative is something light and powerful with a discreet GPU, there are a few options but the key ones are the MacBook Pro and Surface Book. I can put Windows on the MBP to run the applications I need so that's no problem but the advantage of the Surface is it has stylus input, I dont use it that with my wacom digitizer but I would probably use it more if it was always available. For web browsing and reading (particularly while travelling) I prefer a tablet to a laptop so this would also mean I dont have to carry 2 devices.

It certainly isnt for everyone and is nowhere near as universally applicable as the iPad but not everything has to be all things to all people.

Re:$3199 for a tablet? Seriously?

[ranton]

I still not get Microsoft's idea on a tablet. Most programs you need are Desktop version only. So you end up using your 'tablet' as a laptop. So why go through all the extra costs in development to make a laptop that can remove the keyboard, instead of just build a cheaper and nice to use tablet? Why do they build such an expensive netbook with a bad keyboard?

1) Some users don't want to carry around two devices. A Macbook Pro + iPad Air 2 weigh 6.6 pounds. A Surface Book weighs 3.34 pounds, essentially half the weight. With only one device you also don't always have to carry a case that can hold both. You can just carry the device alone.

2) Some users (like me) have gotten so used to touch screens that exclusively using a track pad on their laptop is a horrible experience. Although I concede I may be a minority with this gripe, I simply hate a laptop experience without a touch screen now.

3) It is far cheaper to have one device than two. A laptop of the same quality as the Surface Pro would only cost a few hundred less, if that, and a high quality tablet costs twice that difference. Buying one device likely saves around $500.

4) As far as tablets go, the Surface Book may be the best one yet. It has a large screen but is very light without the keyboard (about the same as the original iPad). It has a great stylus. It isn't as good for casual gaming as an iPad, but it can potentially play PC / XBox quality games. There are clearly pros and cons for every electronic device, but the Surface Book (and Surface Pro 4) have a lot in the pros category.

There clearly are budget laptops and tablets that make the Surface products seem expensive. But they don't hold a candle to the Surface, or the Apple products that are its true competitors.

Re:$3199 for a tablet? Seriously?

[SomeoneFromBelgium]

[..] who is going to fork over ~$3,500 for a tablet?[..]assuming you didn't need a full terabyte of HDD space[..]

Umm, the one that really DOES need 1TB and desktop power in such a compact, light form factor???
If you're a designer/artist/... that is constantly on the move (in a factory, on a work site, at clients...) and this device allows you have all your stuff with you and you can do your work on the spot instead of aftherwards in the office this thing will pay itself back in no time...
But it's not intended for your avarage mobile user who only needs internet and some storage for mail, photo's and moderate video stuff.

Re:$3199 for a tablet? Seriously?

[macs4all]

Microsoft's 1TB Surface Book will cost you $3199 (plus tax), which seems a bit steep to me.

And people whine about Apple gouging for "commodity PC hardware"?

My God, the most expensive MacBook Pro will only set you back $2499. The equivalent Surface Book costs $200 more, but it still has the same integrated Intel GPU as the MBP.

And of course the MBP has an OS that both respects your privacy and knows that its a Desktop OS.

But I guess if you are trapped into the MS ecosystem (which you could also run on an MBP, if you wanted), then the 1TB Surface Book may be what you want... When it finally ships in January, 2016.

By the way, it seems like spec for spec, the MBPs and Surface Books are priced pretty closely; so maybe, just maybe, Apple hasn't been "gouging" all this time, and it really does cost a little more to up the build and component quality, eh?

Re:$3199 for a tablet? Seriously?

[JustAnotherOldGuy]

I agree with most if not all of what you said.

For me, I think that unless I needed some tablet-only feature I'd probably just buy a nice laptop for ~$2000 and call it good. You can get a pretty nice laptop for $2K although I don't see very many with pressure-sensitive screens (a few are available, though).

Re:$3199 for a tablet? Seriously?

[macs4all]

I agree with most if not all of what you said.

For me, I think that unless I needed some tablet-only feature I'd probably just buy a nice laptop for ~$2000 and call it good. You can get a pretty nice laptop for $2K although I don't see very many with pressure-sensitive screens (a few are available, though).

Well, the MacBook Pros have Pressure-Sensitive, Multitouch Trackpads about the size of an iPhone screen. Does that count?

Re:$3199 for a tablet? Seriously?

[Anonymous Coward]

My God, the most expensive MacBook Pro will only set you back $2499. The equivalent Surface Book costs $200 more, but it still has the same integrated Intel GPU as the MBP.

Of course it costs more, it has an active digitizer and touchscreen so the price is about right relative to the MBP.

so maybe, just maybe, Apple hasn't been "gouging" all this time

Or more likely Microsoft is following Apple's playbook.

Re:$3199 for a tablet? Seriously?

[macs4all]

My God, the most expensive MacBook Pro will only set you back $2499. The equivalent Surface Book costs $200 more, but it still has the same integrated Intel GPU as the MBP.

Of course it costs more, it has an active digitizer and touchscreen so the price is about right relative to the MBP.

so maybe, just maybe, Apple hasn't been "gouging" all this time

Or more likely Microsoft is following Apple's playbook.

The MBP has an active, force-sensitive, multitouch trackpad. Pretty much as much cost as adding that to a display these days.

No. I think that my original statement about cost to do things "right" is correct. And I have several industrial control product designs under my belt to prove it.

Re:$3199 for a tablet? Seriously?

[Anonymous Coward]

The MBP has an active, force-sensitive, multitouch trackpad. Pretty much as much cost as adding that to a display these days.

No the trackpad is not "active" (see tap sensing vs pressure sensing), the Surface Book has an active digitizer. It has a multitouch trackpad as well but adding force sensitivity to the trackpad (Apple's method is just putting a pressure sensor in each corner of the trackpad) is a LOT cheaper than an active digitizer setup on the screen that can can detect both pressure sensitivity and the angle of the stylus.

I have seen your posts, you get pretty defensive about Apple so let me just clarify that I'm just pointing out the difference here. I am not saying one is better than the other or that one is a better choice just that they are different the additions to the Surface do indeed make it more expensive.

Re:$3199 for a tablet? Seriously?

[Jack Griffin]

but honestly, who is going to fork over ~$3,500 for a tablet?

Rich people.
The same people that buy $5000 handbags and $15000 watches. If you're making $50k/week, and you need to buy a tablet, are you seriously going to get the $500 model that all the regular folk have?

That depends on what the definition of "is" is

[gavron]

As in "it IS identical" but in this case "is" doesn't mean "it is" it means "is nothing like it and I did not have sex with that woh-man."

E

Microsoft's ad is less annoying

[OldSport]

Both showcase serious delusions of grandeur in cloyingly overdramatic fashion, but at least Microsoft only subjects the viewer to 30 seconds or so. That Apple ad made me want to start firebombing.

Similar ads?

[Anonymous Coward]

Oh my goodness... two ads that resemble each other!!?? That's never happened before! This is outrageous!!

But seriously... I avoid both MS and Apple products, but this article has got to be the stupidest thing I've ever read.

Grasping at straws

[Anonymous Coward]

To say Microsoft copied the Apple ad is a very big stretch. I guess the things they have in common is that they're two tech giants advertising a tablet-like device in a variety of life and product shots.

As a pen computer user from way back, I'm sad

[WillAdams]

The iPad Pro disappoints me for not having access to arbitrary / legacy / opensource apps (I need to be able to run things which aren't on Apple's App store: Macromedia FreeHand, FontForge, various CNC apps).

The Microsoft Surface 4 and Book don't suit my needs 'cause the hover distance w/ N-Trig is low, and it has jitter problems w/ slow strokes (which don't affect most people or typical usage).

Both of them disappoint me for not having a truly daylight viewable display --- I really want a vendor to build daylight view booths into their stores and then show off a unit which has a transflective display --- I despair of ever replacing my Fujitsu Stylistic ST4121.

But I seem to be the only person who cares --- most recent article I can find on daylight viewable comparisons is from years ago: http://gizmodo.com/5888618/dis...

Huh?

[Anonymous Coward]

You could say the same thing about every car/truck commercial. How is this news?