Slashdot Mirror

← Back to Stories (view on slashdot.org)

Fujitsu Spins Off Its PC and Mobile Divisions (engadget.com)

Posted by Soulskill on from the decision-could-affect-tens-of-people dept.

An anonymous reader writes: Back in February, Sony unloaded the part of its business that built PCs. Now, a year later, competitor Fujitsu is doing the same. The company announced it would be spinning off its PC and mobile business, effective 1 February 2016. Your first reaction was probably, "Fujitsu had a PC and mobile business?" You're not alone, and this is likely why the split is happening. In their press release, they say, "With the ongoing commoditization of ubiquitous products, mainly of PCs and smart phones, it has become increasingly difficult to achieve differentiation, and competition with emerging global vendors has intensified." More simply: they couldn't make a competitive product. Hopefully, this is the start of a trend; the race to zero in the Windows laptop market is finally killing off some of the participants.

100 comments

  1. Expect lower quality hardware. by sethstorm · · Score: 3, Insightful

    As Lenovo bludgeoned ThinkPads and HP's moves eviscerated entire product lines, Fujitsu's spin-off will also reflect a lower quality product over time.

    --
    Twitter supports and protects racists - by smearing their critics with the "Hate Speech" label.
    1. Re:Expect lower quality hardware. by PolygamousRanchKid+ · · Score: 1, Interesting

      As Lenovo bludgeoned ThinkPads and HP's moves eviscerated entire product lines, Fujitsu's spin-off will also reflect a lower quality product over time.

      You know, I've a lot of comments about Lenovo SchtinkPads having bad quality, but it doesn't match my experience at all. I have a W520. It is big, black, ugly and bulky, and no thief would consider trying to steal it, because it is not shiny and silver, like an Apple. But that is fine with me. I pimped it up to 32GB main memory, and two 512GB SSDs. If the thieves knew what all is in it, they would steal it just to cannibalize the components.

      The thing seems to be indestructible. I do a lot of traveling on trains in Europe, and the SchtinkPad inadvertently gets banged up a bit here and there. No problem. It always boots up like a charm. My girlfriend has some kind of MacBook, and I have the feeling that if she sneezes on it, it will be offline for a week.

      --
      Schroedinger's Brexit: The UK is both in and out of the EU at the same time!
    2. Re:Expect lower quality hardware. by TWX · · Score: 1

      We bought new the X301 and more recently the Thinkpad Yoga 12, and I have a Yoga 12 assigned to me from work. Both are very sturdy machines. The Helix series are proving to be pieces of junk as you look at 'em funny and they break, and the Yoga 11e series is too small to be terribly useful, but coworkers are agog over the X1 Carbon series.

      I fondly remember the Fujitsu Lifebook series. My wife was often issued one for work travel and it was stout, light weight, and had a long battery life for the era. We had strongly considered one when we ended up with the X301 instead, which was a lot like one of the used IBM-era Thinkpads that I had gotten used years before and still worked well.

      --
      Do not look into laser with remaining eye.
    3. Re:Expect lower quality hardware. by Grishnakh · · Score: 5, Insightful

      If the thieves knew what all is in it, they would steal it just to cannibalize the components.

      No, they wouldn't. Thieves don't care about components, and don't want to spend time trying to sell technical items on Ebay. They want something they can hock quickly, which means something that has a high resale value at consumer places, and that means Apples.

      This is merely the nature of niche-market stuff versus mass-market shiny consumer crap. There's lots of very expensive industrial equipment, for instance, which easily costs 6 or 7 figures, but isn't in much danger of being stolen because thieves wouldn't know what to do with it. Lots of engineering workplaces have oscilloscopes and other test equipment costing high-5 figures or more; how often does that stuff get stolen? Never; they're in much more danger of their $2k Apple laptops getting stolen.

    4. Re:Expect lower quality hardware. by fluffernutter · · Score: 1

      I have a T430 as my personal laptop. My laptop bag opened and it dropped on a hard tile floor once (I watched it bounce a few times on the floor with horror). There was not even a crack or a chip, laptop still works fine.

      --
      Laws are rules for the court, but merely a bottom bar to hit for life. Think beyond laws in your actions always.
    5. Re:Expect lower quality hardware. by KGIII · · Score: 3, Interesting

      Don't tell macs4all or canadianmacfan this but one of my gifts for my daughter was a new MBP. I know... I know... I did my best to bring them up right but I failed as a parent and she has an iPod, iPad, and several other Apple devices like a desktop, a couple of laptops, and I think she's even got a damned router made by them. Buggered if I know the name but the girl's a fan and yes, yes she has been exposed to Linux. (Her brother uses Debian - sometimes Arch.)

      Anyway, she's not the most gentle creature with her hardware. She works in a pediatric trauma unit and things get jostled around when you're in a hurry. I should probably OTP this next part 'cause I'm never going to live it down but, well, I don't recall her ever actually having anything break - hardware wise. She's... Hmm... 28 now (I'm pretty sure) and has probably been using Apple products for 15 years?

      I've bought a lot of iStuff over the years and she generally wants one of them refreshed every holiday - like it was a new iPad for her birthday. She's not asked for an iPod in a while?

      Ah - she says I'm an ass - she's 27. She also says, "They're great Dad, you should get one." I did once. She absconded with it on a visit. My two kids are getting my girlfriend drunk. 'Tis the first time they've met. But, I digress...

      So, as much as I like to poke the rather crazy and overly defensive iFans... The hardware seems to hold up pretty well. I know that it holds up very well at a small community's elementary school. Oh - the screens break on iPods but I'm now told they still work even if they are, "Mashed to shit." The kid swears like a sailor. So, while it's anecdotal, there's quite a bit of data in that anecdote. From what I observe, the hardware holds up just fine.

      Well, I don't usually drink but I'm gonna go have a rum and coke with the kids. Any posts beyond this point and it wasn't me - it was someone using my UID while I was away from the computer. (That's my lie, I'll tell it any way I want.) Merry festivities and goodnight to all unless I shamble back in. I imagine two drinks will serve quite nicely.

      --
      "So long and thanks for all the fish."
    6. Re:Expect lower quality hardware. by teaDrunk · · Score: 1

      Rum and Coke. Yessssssssss. Happy Holidays, dear friends.

    7. Re:Expect lower quality hardware. by KGIII · · Score: 1

      Same! They passed out. I stopped at two but I kind of made 'em strong. It wasn't even good Rum. My daughter has bad taste. Well, cheap taste. It's just the Captain's - spiced of course. Meh, she's a good kid. She hasn't built me any grandchildren yet. That is unfortunate. I want to spoil them rotten. I am going to buy them drum kits, guitars, dirt bikes, guns, cars that go too fast, and a gimp suit. For their first birthdays. Not really, of course. Though my son might find some humor in it.

      --
      "So long and thanks for all the fish."
    8. Re:Expect lower quality hardware. by hairyfeet · · Score: 3, Interesting

      Can we PLEASE stop posting yet another "PC is dying" story when its absolute horseshit? Gather round childrens, and let an old greybeard explain a few things that many seem to not know, especially retards that work in the press...

      This is the most important fact that you need to know regarding PCs and sales mmkay? From 1993 to 2007 there was a bubble, no different than the dotbomb or the "houses will always go up" real estate bubble, this was NOT THE NORMAL STATE and was caused by two factors, 1.- Rapid advances in die shrinking technology, and 2.- A focus on single core computing. Now before 1993? You saw what we have now, slow and steady turnover with moderate and acceptable growth. Problem is, just as we saw too many bad companies (remember petfood online? Or CueCat?) that based their entire business model on "on the Internet" being enough to make them rich so too did you see many during the PC bubble base their whole business around infinite growth, like the bubble would never burst.

      "So what about PCs in 2015, oh wise old one? And what about mobile?" I hear you ask. Its very simple young childrens, once the PC went to multicore they performance bubble burst and they went from "barely good enough for a year or two" to "insanely overpowered and good for a decade" which frankly was the default state before 1993. Before then programs didn't need a new PC every other year just to run and now? Can you name something mainstream that won't run just fine on a first gen C2Q or Phenom I X4? Hell the majority of people who aren't gaming are quite happy with a 10 year old C2D or Athlon X2 and even the gamers get along just fine on the second gen C2Q and Phenom II X4s and X6s, and those are 7 year old chips. PCs have simply gone back to being appliances that you replace when they die just like they were before the bubble when I was supporting 8 year old IBMs and Commodores locally.

      Finally as for mobile? I'm gonna really piss off the fanboys but here goes mobile is in their own bubble which is about to burst so its not even gonna get half the run that PCs did in their bubble, why? Because ARM doesn't scale, it blows its power budget once you get beyond a certain speed, which is why we are now up to quads and octocores being the norm instead of climbing MHz like in the PC world. Also battery tech has been stagnant for more than a decade so adding more cores and more speed? Just gives you a device with a 15 minute battery life. I'm already starting to see this, talking to the brothers that own the phone shop down the road they are seeing more and more older phones being brought in for repair because people see no reason to upgrade as they are happy with their iPhone 4 or Galaxy II. They are also seeing a big uptick in the $100-$150 phones because nowadays that gets you a quad core with 8MP camera and a decently sized touchscreen and that is what Joe Average cares about so more and more are seeing now reason to buy $600+ phones. This goes double for tablets, which even Apple is having trouble getting folks to buy the latest iPad because people are happy with the previous model. This is also ignoring the rotting elephant in the room which is many tablets are ending up in sock drawers because the users find mobile software lacking compared to their laptops. I swear I must get dozens trying to sell me tablets really cheap each year because they just can't find a use for the things which isn't better served by their laptops, I had the same problem which is why I gave my 10 inch quad tablet to a nephew.

      So no worries childrens, PCs aren't going anywhere, its simply going back to normal where you have 2 or 3 really big companies selling the boxes and parts and everybody just replaces when they die. Even the mom & pop shops that have any sense won't be going anywhere, I'm staying swamped with HTPCs, Home networking, and home theater setups and I'm predicting with all the cord cutting and everything being online that is gonna be a really big growth market for PCs in the coming years.

      Now if you'll excuse me I have new games that are calling, Happy Holidays!

      --
      ACs don't waste your time replying, your posts are never seen by me.
    9. Re:Expect lower quality hardware. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I do like it when slashdotters post drunk

    10. Re:Expect lower quality hardware. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      mobile is in their own bubble which is about to burst

      many people will soon come to realize that desktops and real laptops are infinitely more useful and productive at home than shitty little tablets and phones and other touch screen crap... where most people use a 'computer' and the 'internet' the most.

      you can't type for shit on a screen. you can't mouse around an application (not an app, a real computer application) with a stupid fucking touch screen. neither the keyboard or the mouse, nor the screen size for that matter, of a desktop be duplicated on a 5 inch phone...

    11. Re:Expect lower quality hardware. by John.Banister · · Score: 1

      I have to agree with you that the attractiveness of an item to a thief relates to the reliability of the market for what has been stolen. However, keep in mind that thieves will happily target 6 figure industrial equipment if they can easily pull 4 figures worth of copper out of it, because there's a reliable market for that copper.

    12. Re:Expect lower quality hardware. by unixisc · · Score: 1

      I agree w/ you about PCs, but not so much about tablets. I've seen iPads in places I wouldn't expect - restaurants for order taking, airport terminals (particularly the one at Minneapolis) and other such places. Not to mention that they are a lot easier to handle and have an easier interface. Something I don't exactly see the Surfaces replacing.

      Also, I don't think the tablet bubble is anywhere near close to bursting. If in the 90s, people kept buying PCs b'cos the software was quickly overwhelming the hardware, in this case, the driving factor will be battery life. People won't get new tablets b'cos of more cores or anything, they'll get new tablets to get longer battery life. Also among the Millenials, a lot of them are more used to doing things not even on tablets, but on phones. I do think tablets are a convergence point b/w the 2.

    13. Re:Expect lower quality hardware. by hairyfeet · · Score: 1

      Did I say that NONE of them would find a use? Nope just that consumers find them to be toys which is the truth. There will always be a niche for that form factor, hell no differently than the netbooks that you can still buy today (they just don't call 'em netbooks) but Joe and Jane Average simply find mobile software lacking compared to that laptop they already have.

      And we already have evidence the tablet bubble is bursting, you have sites like Tiger offering BOGO free sales trying to move the things and even Apple, whose fanboys can usually be counted on to buy the latest iShiny no matter what, has seen sales drop like a stone of the new iPad. Battery tech is stagnant so we aren't seeing better battery life if anything we are seeing the opposite as OEMs try to jam more and more cores into the things to try to make up for the fact that ARM doesn't scale. Many of the first gen tablets could get 8 hours plus because they were only a single core ARM at sub 1GHz, now you are lucky to get 3 hours on that new Samsung octocore.

      And again you are ignoring the rotting elephant which is that tablet software sucks and is almost completely based around time wasting and media consumption. Just look at the top 10 Android and iOS apps, its nearly all just time killers. Well the thing with time wasters is people get bored with just being passive consumers, this is why TV watching has dropped, and on their laptop they can play time wasters AND do real work AND have access to better featured full desktop programs... it really doesn't take long before the tablet looks like a stupid cousin of the laptop they already have.

      But there will always be niches, medical, warehouse inventory, anything where you have to walk around inputting data all day is a good fit for the tablet, that simply isn't the kind of thing Joe and Jane do all day. Again just look at the netbook, once upon a time they were as common as dirt and now you have only a few models being made for road warriors that need ultraportables, the same will hold true for tablets, just you watch.

      --
      ACs don't waste your time replying, your posts are never seen by me.
    14. Re:Expect lower quality hardware. by LienRag · · Score: 1

      IBM T430 or Lenovo T430?
      Or are they bith as sturdy?

    15. Re:Expect lower quality hardware. by fluffernutter · · Score: 1

      Lenovo T430. Fortunately, with the thinkpads Lenovo kept the durable design that IBM started. I can't say the same for Lenovo's consumer line.

      --
      Laws are rules for the court, but merely a bottom bar to hit for life. Think beyond laws in your actions always.
  2. This will be the year of Atari ST! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

    Finally with the long awaited death of the PC market it is time for Atari to rise form the ashes and make a new ST. Long live TOS! Love live GEM! ...too late? Atari is already dead back in the 90s? Doh! At least there's still linux!

  3. Fujitsu products by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

    I guess it depends on where you live if you've heard of Fujitsu computers and phones. I see both their computers and phones everywhere here in Japan. I remember they had some good corporate stuff in the US about a decade ago. Their tablet PCs sold fairly well before the iPad age. It's true that their consumer products are not too desirable judging by how many people I see with them, but I thought there were doing well in corporate.

    Maybe NEC will be next as it's also a company nobody in the west really knows is still making computers and is also not doing well in the consumer market but looks fine in corporate. It feels like all the big names in Japanese computers are quitting. Anybody remember when Canon made computers and Pentax made printers?

    Now that I think about it, I notice less and less people I know have a home PC and are fine just with either their phone or tablet. Laptops and tablets greatly outnumber desktops in Japanese stores – and that's if the store even carries desktops anymore. When they do, it seems like there are more non-Japanese brands than ever. The home computer scene has changed quite a bit over the last decade in Japan.

    1. Re:Fujitsu products by fuzzyfuzzyfungus · · Score: 1

      They used to have a bit of a niche in ultraportables, back when particularly light weight was hard to come by in laptops; but that just isn't a terribly special feature anymore.

    2. Re:Fujitsu products by unixisc · · Score: 2

      Not just Japan. When I used to work in Spansion - the Flash Memory joint venture of AMD and Fujitsu - the laptops we had from our employer were Fujitsu LifeBooks w/ Athlons inside them. They were a neat product from both our parent companies. Included in the lineup was a bright red 'Ferrari' model, which was awesome to look at. But if you went to, say, Microcenter, there was really little reason to prefer a Fujitsu to a Toshiba or a Dell. I doubt that a spun off company making generic parts will be any more successful

    3. Re:Fujitsu products by Sooner+Boomer · · Score: 1

      I have a Fujitsu laptop. It's 8 years old, and I've had to put it aside temporarily because the switch that turns the backlight on when the lid opens has failed. I will "re-purpose" it as a desktop unit with an external monitor soon. It's been a great computer. Laptops are generally consumable products with a limited lifespan, but, except for normal wear and tear, this has been a great unit. It's a lot better than this Dell POS I'm using now (serious quality issues...).

      --
      Chaos maximizes locally around me.
  4. What the literal F? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

    Hopefully, this is the start of a trend; the race to zero in the Windows laptop market is finally killing off some of the participants.

    I can see why such a sociopathic comment was posted anonymously.

    1. Re: What the literal F? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Exactly. It should be posted anon since it is wrong. We've already hit bottom with Dell. There is no way to make a lower quality laptop.

    2. Re: What the literal F? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      That's the truth. Fourteen out of the last batch of twenty Latitude laptops we bought didn't work out of the box.

    3. Re: What the literal F? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I think it's been two full years since we bought a Dell laptop that worked out of the box and made it a full month without a major problem.

    4. Re: What the literal F? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      70% out of the box failure rate isn't too bad for Dell.

    5. Re: What the literal F? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      And I bet nearly half of those laptops are still broken considering how hard it is to get Dell to honor their warranties.

    6. Re: What the literal F? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I think it's been nearly three years since we've had a Dell laptop make it an entire year. Dell is already at the bottom.

    7. Re: What the literal F? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      The Dell I bought for my nieces didn't work out of the box today. It really ruined their Christmas. I bought a guaranteed next business day service plan, but they're not going to be able to fix it until the middle of February. They said NBD guarantees a response, not a repair.

    8. Re: What the literal F? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      From what I've seen from Dell, I have trouble believing that 30% worked.

    9. Re: What the literal F? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      This. My god, this. It takes Dell weeks to dispatch on-site repairs even when you pay a lot for a 4 hour response.

    10. Re: What the literal F? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Dell ruined Christmas for a huge number of people today.

    11. Re: What the literal F? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      That's why you by extras and have good backups if you buy Dell.

    12. Re: What the literal F? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Exactly. I bought my daughter her first computer today, and it wouldn't even POST. Dell made my daughter cry today.

    13. Re: What the literal F? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I wish Dell would start testing before shipping like they used to do.

    14. Re: What the literal F? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      For servers, we have about a 70% out of the box failure rate. I agree with you that that is too low of a failure rate for Dell laptops. They're even worse.

    15. Re: What the literal F? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You're doing better than we are with Dell. I just inboxed an entire pallet of Latitudes that didn't work. That ruined my entire week.

    16. Re: What the literal F? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      No you made her cry. You bought her a Dell.

    17. Re: What the literal F? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Even with a service plan, expect Dell to take months to fix all of them.

    18. Re: What the literal F? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I wish Dell would start testing before shipping like they did in the late 90s.

    19. Re: What the literal F? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Dell defines the bottom.

    20. Re: What the literal F? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Dell ruins lives. Working with them is the worst part of my life.

    21. Re: What the literal F? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      They make me want to die. Want to die.

    22. Re: What the literal F? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I call BS on the claim that that many worked.

    23. Re: What the literal F? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Yes. Dell is laughing because they already beat everyone else there.

    24. Re: What the literal F? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I've been happier with the out of box failures as compared to classic Dell which for many years was to fail at just about the time you got everything setup.

    25. Re: What the literal F? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Months? Try never.

    26. Re: What the literal F? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I hate how the idiot C-level guys that so often make the bad decision to buy from Dell are never held accountable.

    27. Re: What the literal F? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I got fired from my last job because we had more Dell laptops that were broken than worked. Dell is just crooked.

    28. Re: What the literal F? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      They always blame the low level guys for Dell's constant failures.

    29. Re: What the literal F? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      That's because they are CONservatives and they want to rip us off so we have no money and have to die. To die! (Filling in for the usual guy, just getting my drink.)

    30. Re: What the literal F? by nnull · · Score: 1

      What else can you buy? Currently Dell has one of the best spec lightweight notebook with linux support. All the other ones are pretty much junk except Apple's Macbook pro. The choices are starting to be very disappointing and I have no desire to move to some android tablet for my work, considering that linux support for these devices are abysmal at best. Luckily for PC's, I can still build whatever I want.

    31. Re: What the literal F? by unencode200x · · Score: 1

      We have about 3,000 of them and have maybe 10 fail a year with a try hardware issue, If that. Now sales people breaking them is a a different issue ...

      --

      Chance favors the prepared mind.
      Perfect is the enemy of good.
    32. Re: What the literal F? by unixisc · · Score: 1

      I've seen all the above comments, but I got an Inspiron last year through Costco, and have not had problems w/ the Computer. Only thing that once happened - due to a lightning strike, the power supply fried, and neither Costco Concierge nor Dell would help w/ that. So I bought myself a universal power supply, and have kept using this ever since.

      That said, this is the laptop that I deleted Windows 8 from, and installed PC-BSD. It runs great. I have another laptop where I run Windows 10, and haven't noticed much differences. As usual, trackpad of both are lousy, but in case of the Dell, since PC-BSD doesn't recognize it and I've been forced to get a mouse, that issue solves itself. Oh, neither of the laptops are touch.

  5. Hopefully by Noah+Haders · · Score: 4, Insightful

    >Hopefully, this is the start of a trend; the race to zero in the Windows laptop market is finally killing off some of the participants

    I agree, pcs are more and more commoditized and it is harder to make a profit, but why is this something to hope for?

    1. Re:Hopefully by AmiMoJo · · Score: 1

      Indeed, it seems like a loss. Fujitsu make some good PCs in Japan. Nothing spectacular, but reasonably priced and reliable.

      Hopefully the new company continues to produce good workhorse machines and give other manufacturers some competition in the mid range.

      --
      const int one = 65536; (Silvermoon, Texture.cs)
      SJW, n: "Someone I don't like, and by the way I'm a fuckwit" - AC
    2. Re:Hopefully by Kjella · · Score: 2

      I agree, pcs are more and more commoditized and it is harder to make a profit, but why is this something to hope for?

      Maybe a fan of the Apple/MS Surface/Lumia model? That the OEMs aren't really adding any value and you could just cut the middle man. Because from what I understand that's mainly what they do these days, they take hardware from AMD/nVidia/Intel + various others for screen, touchpad etc., software mainly from Microsoft and outsource the assembly to Foxconn-style assemblers and the support to call centers somewhere. It would probably be pretty bad for Linux users, not sure it'd be all that bad for Windows users. The Surface line seems to be getting pretty good reviews and sell well...

      --
      Live today, because you never know what tomorrow brings
    3. Re:Hopefully by KGIII · · Score: 1

      Linux users will be okay, I imagine. The Girl Child got her MBP and my son uses Debian mostly so he got one of these:
      http://www.titancomputers.com/...

      I don't know exactly what he specced it out to be but it wasn't *too* bad. I think it came to a little under, or just over, 3k with shipping. I just let him pick it out and that way he gets what he wants. He has it with him (I had it shipped to him and he got it early). He's got Debian on it now and I'm probably going to order two more of them. One for me and one for the girlfriend. I poked at it earlier and it's pretty damned speedy and surprisingly cool. I'd have expected more heat from it but it's not bad, not bad at all.

      I guess he had to do a little tweaking as there were some screen tearing issues but the open source driver fixed it. I guess he was getting some screen tearing with the Nvidia drivers.

      Anyhow, it's never really been "good" for Linux users though it's better now. I suspect they'll (we'll) be just fine.

      --
      "So long and thanks for all the fish."
    4. Re:Hopefully by nnull · · Score: 1

      I don't think so. Android tablets with locked hardware is gaining ground and linux support for these devices is pretty abysmal to none. The one market where linux could shine is being shunned by the open source community on a grand scale. I would love to have linux on some of these devices, but there are none to be found.

    5. Re:Hopefully by KGIII · · Score: 1

      True but we like to make staunch claims that Android is Linux. "Linux after it has been taken into a lab and given a vivisection by Google." is the usual nomenclature. But it's Linux nonetheless. I'm counting it. I am, however, seeing more and more people root them. I've even seen a few with Ubuntu on 'em. You can even buy a Ubuntu phone, it might even work in your country now. There should be some decent tablets. I hear tell that it's possible to get Linux onto a Surface Pro.

      Nah, I think it'll be okay. I really do. They've installed Linux on a toaster by now. Someone's gotta have a cryptic wiki page somewhere to get you started with Toaster Linux. There will be some distro that is maintained by three guys and a beagle and they'll maintain Toaster Linux. Send 'em a few bucks for pizza and they're happy and they might even answer a question and then you too can have Toaster Linux. Hell, someone's got to have a 3/4 finished Linux for your Television Remote and if you want to learn a little Python you can fix the GUI for 'em.

      I really do, I think it will be just fine for Linux - if not better than ever. I have not looked but I know you can buy touch screens, an Arduino, and a 3D printer and make the damned thing yourself if you really want. There's almost certainly directions on the internet. I'm pretty sure there's an Ubuntu tablet coming out at some point - if not out already.

      It's never going to be the Year of Linux on the Desktop. I'm not even sure if that's even a goal anyone considers realistic any more. It's just not something many people want to do. I do. I like it just fine. It's fun. I learn stuff. I break stuff. I poke stuff. I have a good time. I really think the Linux users will be good to go. My son has used it for most of his life, actually. I like Windows just fine but I wasn't learning anything new with it so, well... I changed and I'm learning more as I go. I've always had it installed on a partition but now it's all that there is. It might be confirmation bias but I'm seeing lots of other people who have done the same thing over the years.

      So, I'd say the community is pretty healthy. It's even healthy with SystemD. Some folks decided to move away and others just adapted or rolled their own or whatnot. That's all good. The more choices there are, the better it is for me. I might want to run Linux on my toaster. (Which is more likely to happen than I am to use a tablet on a regular basis.)

      --
      "So long and thanks for all the fish."
    6. Re:Hopefully by tlhIngan · · Score: 4, Interesting

      Maybe a fan of the Apple/MS Surface/Lumia model? That the OEMs aren't really adding any value and you could just cut the middle man. Because from what I understand that's mainly what they do these days, they take hardware from AMD/nVidia/Intel + various others for screen, touchpad etc., software mainly from Microsoft and outsource the assembly to Foxconn-style assemblers and the support to call centers somewhere. It would probably be pretty bad for Linux users, not sure it'd be all that bad for Windows users. The Surface line seems to be getting pretty good reviews and sell well...

      But the OEMs are what make PCs, well, PCs.

      They are the ones that created (for better or worse) the immense diversity in PCs.

      For an example, look at Apple. Everytime Apple releases a new Mac, people complain - too expensive, or a PC is cheaper, or they don't have X, or they don't sell a $250 laptop, etc. etc. etc.

      Well, that's what OEMs are for - Apple simply picks and chooses the markets they want to sell to. Other OEMs find their own markets. And these days, the results are clear computing wise - we've got more diversity in computing now than ever before - I mean, Windows can be had on a PC costing $100 (tablet or "desktop" compute stick). This is unheard of.

      Yes, for a time the market got stuck - and we were stuck with shitty $500 laptops with 1366x768 screens and nothing to fulfill the high end market. Except Apple who was making a killing selling $1000+ laptops that no OEM wanted to touch and offering high-res screens and GPUs and all t hat. Then Intel formed the Ultrabook market to entice OEMs to produce MacBook Air competitors. Which dragged OEMs into the premium market as well.

      OEMs added value by creating computers that fit their target demographic. Sure sometimes people optimize too well and you hit a local minima (like desktops and laptops being almost all budget and crap), but a push away and now you have OEMs producing higher margin higher end PCs and competing against Apple.

      Heck, remember the netbook craze that completely died away because of tablets? It's sorta making a comeback because you can get really cheap computing devices. And heck, my $100 Windows tablet runs the latest Windows and runs software written for a time when it couldn't be imagined that a computer for $100 was possible. Heck, most of the technologies that power the tablet weren't even thought of.

    7. Re:Hopefully by drinkypoo · · Score: 1

      Indeed, it seems like a loss. Fujitsu make some good PCs in Japan. Nothing spectacular, but reasonably priced and reliable.

      They made by far the most powerful Wacom-equipped laptops which came at a reasonable price and didn't spontaneously explode. I thought that was pretty spectacular. Once the machines hit refurb you could get a whole laptop with an i7 in it for less money than a Wacom Cintiq

      --
      "You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"
    8. Re:Hopefully by Hognoxious · · Score: 1

      One for me and one for the girlfriend. I poked at it earlier

      How romantic!

      --
      Confucius say, "Find worm in apple - bad. Find half a worm - worse."
    9. Re:Hopefully by KGIII · · Score: 1

      Heh. She passed out and I stayed up and watched Wonders of the Universe until I fell asleep and then, like an hour ago, she woke me up. She's ill and it is mildly amusing. My kids got her drunk last night. I even had two Rum and Cokes. Alright, I had two glasses of rum and a splash of coke and an ice cube. I should tell her that sex is a cure for hangovers. I just made her some food and coffee so she'll have to cope with that. I'm tired. And grumpy. Technically, my neighbor and his wife are here and she's usually the person that cleans my house (I hate calling her a housekeeper) so I'll clean the damned thing myself, after my coffee and cigar.

      My son brought me up some Montecristo, San Martin, and some other kind that I've forgotten the name. Sipan maybe? At least that will keep me busy for a while. G'mornin' or some such. Yes, yes this is entirely off-topic.

      --
      "So long and thanks for all the fish."
    10. Re:Hopefully by dbIII · · Score: 1

      Heck, remember the netbook craze that completely died away because of tablets?

      It went MS Windows only overnight remember - after that trade show where the head of ASUS was singing the praises of his netbooks in the morning and APOLOGISING for them in the afternoon after lunch with some MS folk. Big coincidence there because MS never threatens OEMs do they?
      The MS netbooks didn't sustain the craze and it fizzled out. Whether the linux ones could have kept up the sales is a matter of speculation, but up to that point they had been doing well.

    11. Re:Hopefully by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Well if you work with computers you need a powerful desktop PC with a big screen (plus pen tablet, second monitor etc.) if not then a phone or tablet is enough. I think there's no real market for portable computers anymore. If you want a notebook experience then buy a bluetooth keyboard/mouse for your phone or tablet. Done.
      I never liked notebooks anyway lol...

    12. Re:Hopefully by dbIII · · Score: 1

      People travel.
      While for some insane reason laptops/notebooks became a status symbol meaning a lot of them just sat on office desks, there's still a few people that need something with a little bit of grunt and a keyboard. For the rest who are travelling tablets plus keyboard do the job. IMHO the surface is effectively a laptop and blurs the lines.

    13. Re:Hopefully by unixisc · · Score: 1

      But the OEMs are what make PCs, well, PCs.

      They are the ones that created (for better or worse) the immense diversity in PCs.

      For an example, look at Apple. Everytime Apple releases a new Mac, people complain - too expensive, or a PC is cheaper, or they don't have X, or they don't sell a $250 laptop, etc. etc. etc.

      Well, that's what OEMs are for - Apple simply picks and chooses the markets they want to sell to. Other OEMs find their own markets. And these days, the results are clear computing wise - we've got more diversity in computing now than ever before - I mean, Windows can be had on a PC costing $100 (tablet or "desktop" compute stick). This is unheard of.

      Yes, for a time the market got stuck - and we were stuck with shitty $500 laptops with 1366x768 screens and nothing to fulfill the high end market. Except Apple who was making a killing selling $1000+ laptops that no OEM wanted to touch and offering high-res screens and GPUs and all t hat. Then Intel formed the Ultrabook market to entice OEMs to produce MacBook Air competitors. Which dragged OEMs into the premium market as well.

      OEMs added value by creating computers that fit their target demographic. Sure sometimes people optimize too well and you hit a local minima (like desktops and laptops being almost all budget and crap), but a push away and now you have OEMs producing higher margin higher end PCs and competing against Apple.

      Heck, remember the netbook craze that completely died away because of tablets? It's sorta making a comeback because you can get really cheap computing devices. And heck, my $100 Windows tablet runs the latest Windows and runs software written for a time when it couldn't be imagined that a computer for $100 was possible. Heck, most of the technologies that power the tablet weren't even thought of.

      Diverse PCs are history. I remember in the 90s, when there were some hundreds of PC companies - not just our current lot, but companies like Gateway, Compaq, Micron, Midwest Micro, Zeos, Tagram and a whole lot more. Granted, they weren't very inexpensive as the lot today, but the computers they made were reliable. Apple was in a very different market - mostly targeted at publishing, education and kids.

      How things have changed!!! Today, Apple makes the best workstation out there in the market, as well as high quality laptops. While the PCs we get are no different from the ones made by the likes of Asustek or Gigabyte. In fact, why have the Dells or HPs any more? Just have the Asusteks, Gigabytes and Lenovos selling computers - they won't be much worse than what we now have. Dell, HP and IBM are now just IT outsourcing companies.

    14. Re:Hopefully by unixisc · · Score: 1

      If you wanna count Android, why not also count all the guns that have Linux running in them to improve pinpointing targets? As is well known, gun sales peaked recently, so there are a lot more Linux installations out there - w/o people even asking!

      I wonder whether systemd alone could have everything a gun needs in its AI?

    15. Re:Hopefully by KGIII · · Score: 1

      SystemD improves boot times meaning that your firearm will be ready faster!

      I also don't know how many firearms are using this. I do own a bunch but not one of them has any software on it. (One does have a small hand-held computer that goes with it.) Err... I think that's running QNX, actually.

      --
      "So long and thanks for all the fish."
  6. Hurr durr by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

    "Fujitsu had a PC and mobile business?"

    You'd only say that if you were an American who'd never traveled abroad.

  7. Basic research is lacking by Burz · · Score: 2

    Endpoint (i.e. PC) security is abysmal and could be taken in several new directions if there was more research done on open hardware, adding security context to UIs and such. Heck, we don't even have PCs and mobiles that represent keys, certs and signatures as first-class objects.... An MS Excel spreadsheet on a Linux desktop is more likely to be properly represented and handled than is a PGP key (on any OS).

    Why not sell people on devices that have on/off switches on all mics and webcams? On wireless transceivers?

    There's lots of room for differentiation in this field.

  8. There is a World market for 5 PC's by rmdingler · · Score: 1

    So to be fair, the Thomas Watson prediction was only a few decades off?

    --
    Happiness in intelligent people is the rarest thing I know.

    Ernest Hemingway

    1. Re:There is a World market for 5 PC's by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      To be fair, is there a world market for more than 5 cloud providers? Watson's prediction had context and you're ignoring it.

    2. Re:There is a World market for 5 PC's by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      are you blind? name more than 5 big producers ........ rofl . i wish i was stupid so i could ignore the rest of the wordl like everyone ... ya wordl with an l at the end fuckitall

  9. Japan is behind the US on this by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

    I will give credit to IBM, they are able to sell off businesses, before they get extensively commoditized. Desktop PCs in early 90s. Laptops in early 00s. x86 servers. Chip foundaries ~2014. The HP buyout of Compaq seemed to me the time other companies should exit the wintel desktop PC, around 2000. It then became engineers in North America took chips, parts, and software, designed a PC around that, have the actual manufacturing done in China, tech support in the Phillippines. Dell seemed the last holdout, in actually assembling PCs in America in the mid 2000s. I guess you don't need many companies designing PCs in the world.

    1. Re:Japan is behind the US on this by dbIII · · Score: 1

      Dell seemed the last holdout, in actually assembling PCs in America in the mid 2000s

      Only because ASUS stopped making stuff for Dell in Taiwan and went their own way in 2005, so Dell had to do it itself for a while.
      www.quora.com/What-is-the-story-of-asus-and-dell

  10. Re:PCs are for LUDDITES! by tepples · · Score: 0

    Let me know when Microsoft Visual App Studio becomes a Metro-s*xual UWP app. Until then, you'll still need to use Luddite programs to app apps for app devices.

    Programs!

  11. Contract manufacturers like Foxconn by retroworks · · Score: 1

    Contract manufacturers make most commodity appliances like PCs. The added value of Sony or Fujitsu that is necessary to negotiate with the contract manufacturers becomes a distraction at a certain point, and the "brand" is better off focusing on its core assets.

    --
    Gently reply
    1. Re:Contract manufacturers like Foxconn by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Fujitsu was still making a lot of laptops in their own factories in Japan.

    2. Re:Contract manufacturers like Foxconn by unixisc · · Score: 1

      Does Foxconnn make either PCs or laptops? When I worked in the industry, they made things like iPhones, iPads and maybe other peripheral devices. Desktops were largely made by the likes of Asus and Gigabyte, while laptops were done by the likes of Compal, Quanta and Arima.

    3. Re:Contract manufacturers like Foxconn by retroworks · · Score: 1

      Well, Wistron and Lenovo and Compal and Quanta, sure. More people know Foxconn, which makes more of the displays.

      --
      Gently reply
    4. Re: Contract manufacturers like Foxconn by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Fujitsu manufactures desktops and servers, including the PCB, in its own plant in Germany.

    5. Re:Contract manufacturers like Foxconn by intrico · · Score: 1

      Yes, they do make PC's and laptops. There's been quite a bit of press about the consolidation of computing/peripheral electronics manufacturing over the past several years, and Foxconn is often involved.

  12. Best business class laptop I've used by n0creativity · · Score: 5, Interesting

    At my last job, the guy who purchased our user level tech was pretty set on Fujitsu laptops. They were significantly more expensive than the alternatives, but every model I used in my 10 years there was feature rich, excellent in build quality, and incredibly reliable. The ultabooks, while not as thin or lightweight as others, still managed to pack 3 or 4 USB ports, a docking station port, a special port for the included external wired NIC, and a full size keyboard. I was pretty disappointed when they decided to switch to the Surface Pro and it's single freaking USB port. As a Sys Admin and fill in network admin (our primary network guy got his undies in a bunch a quit one day), I can't even begin to describe how obnoxious it is to only have 1 USB on your laptop. Need to run to the network closet and diagnose a switch issue? Better bring your surface docking station, power cord, and a small table to setup on... turns out Serial to USB adapters don't play well with a USB hub that's also running a mouse and USB NIC. I actually ended up setting up a RasPi in each switch closet and just left it unplugged until I needed to use it. Fujitsu made great business grade laptops. I can't speak to their mobile devices, but this is a significant loss. I was actually contemplating going with them for the next round of laptop refreshes at my new gig... guess that's not happening. BOOOO! HISSSS!

    1. Re:Best business class laptop I've used by ruir · · Score: 1

      You also have nowadays bluetooth serial adapters.

    2. Re:Best business class laptop I've used by edis · · Score: 1

      I have still managed to fish out "Made in Germany" of theirs, when needed laptop for clients, while at extremely competitive prices and usually two Windows versions included for complete piece of mind. With many laptops there have been some kind of problem, but did not occurred on theirs, except power jack ruined by some child at somebody's home. Often, choosing laptop from new look at the market, I happened to end with Fujitsu (Siemens) again.

      At this state of things they will be missed for sure.

      --
      Servant of karma
  13. Marketing is the differentiator by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    The vast majority of people don't care about security (but I do think that's slowly changing). Since PC's are now a commodity product you either compete on price (very low margins with high volumes) or the perception as a luxury product. Both require a lot of marketing and if your core business is not PC's there's really no appeal in doing either.

    1. Re:Marketing is the differentiator by Burz · · Score: 1

      Well, maybe the un-Sony-fication of the PC industry will be a good thing. More experimental vendors like Purism are emerging, and they aren't catering to impulsive consumerism.

  14. Hey man they made great laptops by 0xdeaddead · · Score: 1

    In Japan. BUT between them, and NEC they were my favorite

  15. "the race to zero in the Windows laptop" by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    The original poster writes this like it is a good thing, a benefit. Only stupid people would think that. The "race to zero", a misnomer in it's own right, will only leave a monopoly of one player. When there is one player, quality will start to suffer and prices start to rise.

  16. Toshiba looks to do the same by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Toshiba apparently is looking for ways to jettison its PC business too. I have to say after buying one of their notebooks that its probably for the best. The race to the bottom seems destine for PC makers as they try and compete as well as cheapen products to make a profit. I also bought a Dell and frankly Dell going private has done nothing but negatively affect Dell in my opinion in PC's. Dell has always had a abysmal customer service record and if my experience in any norm they still have a huge issue. Product quality is also not improving in my opinion at all. I finally ended up back with a Mac simple out of frustration with PC notebook quality and service.

    1. Re:Toshiba looks to do the same by unixisc · · Score: 1

      I had Toshiba laptops from work in the past. They were always pretty mediocre - never found them much to write home about. As for Dell's customer service, I had a Dell early in 2000, and their service at the time was great. It seems like after they went private, they have no worries about how they look in NASDAQ, and so they just do anything. Their real business is that of Dell Enterprise Services, not their PCs or laptops

  17. We lost Hitachi Global Storage Tech by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    and now Fujitsu.. The real high-quality drive manufacturers are going away, and we're left with the cheap stuff built by Seagate and Western Digital..

    1. Re:We lost Hitachi Global Storage Tech by __aaclcg7560 · · Score: 1

      I loved Fujitsu hard drives back in the day (late 1990's) when the first 1GB+ hard drives became affordable. IIRC, I had a 1GB and 3GB model. I avoided WD hard drives like the plague for 20 years, but recently started using them since the Seagate hard drives kept dying one day after the warranty expires.

    2. Re:We lost Hitachi Global Storage Tech by ruir · · Score: 1

      They used to be high quality. Now they are still expensive and mostly shit, at best as good as the others.

  18. I'm sitting on the fence by Hognoxious · · Score: 1

    Thieves don't care about components, and don't want to spend time trying to sell technical items on Ebay.

    Thankfully the criminal classes have not read Adam Smith*, and so a separate profession that specialises in that hasn't ever emerged.

    As for thieves breaking into offices just to taff the RAM, I must have totally imagined that.

    * to do: banker joke here

    --
    Confucius say, "Find worm in apple - bad. Find half a worm - worse."
    1. Re:I'm sitting on the fence by Grishnakh · · Score: 2

      Maybe you're thinking of chop-shops and the like. Yes, they do exist for cars. And yes, computer components used to be the target of theft. I remember when $1000 486 CPUs in PCs used to be easily removed because they started using ZIF sockets, and a lot of name-brand PCs (Gateway, etc.) had easily-opened cases, so pretty quickly universities and other places where PCs were publicly accessible started having big problems with these chips mysteriously disappearing, because apparently no one ever thought that someone might just pop the top up, lift a level, and swipe a $1000 part that fits in your hand. Of course they started locking cases after that.

      These days, however, computers are dirt cheap. You can spend a bunch on some high-end rig, but not many people do, usually only gamers. Laptop theft used to be a big problem too; again, not any more since you can get laptops for dirt cheap. Apple owners might still need to be careful (since their laptops are both very easily distinguished and very overpriced), but for everyone else it just isn't a big factor any more. Laptops and computers just aren't valuable enough any more to support a big black market in stolen goods. You're much more likely to have your phone stolen.

      When was the last time you heard about thieves breaking into offices to "taff" RAM? (I'm guessing that's some silly Britishism for "steal".) Probably back when RAM was really expensive, like 10+ years ago. I could totally see that back in the days of RAMBUS memory with the P4; that stuff was ridiculously expensive. These days, why would anyone go to the effort of swiping $20 worth of RAM?

  19. oops... by LienRag · · Score: 1

    "both"