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Ford Charts Cautious Path Toward Self Driving, Shared Vehicles (reuters.com)
Ford Motor Chief Executive Mark Fields is looking for more deals to advance the automaker's expansion into ride services and autonomous vehicles, but will not rush to match big spending by auto industry rivals, he told Reuters. Investors comparing the size of Ford's investments to what other automakers have announced are "looking at the wrong scoreboard," Fields said in an interview at Ford headquarters on Tuesday, ahead of the company's annual late-summer investor meeting. From the report: "Don't confuse activity for progress," Fields said in response to questions about why Ford's future 'mobility' investments appear to lag those of competitors such as General Motors, Daimler AG and Toyota Motor Corp. Mobility is the term auto companies and investors use to describe the next wave of personal transportation, which is still largely car-based but includes a wide range of services from ride sharing to automated driving and parking.
This is smart. Autonomous driving is a complete scam at this point. Tons of money is going into it, but there isn't a single autonomous vehicles that you can buy that is on the road. This won't change for at least 10 more years, if not longer.
Bet against a technology, give it a little lip service. While Lobby to make sure these things never make it on the road. Thus having your competors waste money, while you have the next generation of car without that expensive to make feature. Perhaps a truck with a larger Grill in front.
If something is so important that you feel the need to post it on the internet... It probably isn't that important.
and then drive people away from the polling place if you are a voter that does not vote their way.
Millennials cannot afford cars because they are broke.
(Don't worry, we'll join them once the TPP kicks in.)
In the near future, only the rich will own cars, much like only the rich owns planes today.
fewer owners == fewer cars == fewer car MFRs
Obama's legacy: (N)othing (S)ecure (A)nywhere and (T)error (S)imulation (A)dministration
Once the big boys get involved, Uber is toast.
Let their competitors do all the hard work.
If self-driving primarily needs software to control off-the-shelf sensors and motors, there is less that can be patented compared to other areas of automotive engineering.
Algorithms cannot be patented, so advances can be "acquired" by hiring people who understand how it works---you can get the knowledge without paying to discover it yourself.
With physical products, you protect that research investment with a patent. Since software is copyrighted rather than patented in the US, you can only protect a single instance of the solution, not the entire method for solving the problem.
In a few years when self-driving vehicles start selling, Ford can pick up talent and catch up on a decade of research in a few years.
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According to the latest ruleset, this post should be modded as Vorpal Flamebait +5.
.. when other companies will take the risk and expense for you?
But at least Ford knows that they better jump on the train (by not concentrating on individual car sales) or risk getting run over.
I'm tired of this one. It's not gonna happen on a massive scale. Not unless you build special roads for the self driving cars. Sure, I've heard all the arguments about how AI driven cars will be safer, better drivers than humans. And overall, perhaps so. But overall isn't the standard this will be judged on.
Simple example: Suppose an AI driver gets into a position where it has to hit either a young kid, or an old lady. Who does it hit? Should it hit the old lady since she's already lived a full life? Should it hit the kid because they bounce better than old ladies, and the overall chance of saving them both is higher?
Who programs the heuristics here? And what does the spec say? And what happens when the expected results are not what we expect? Who is liable for the vehicular homicide?
And this is only the really big one. Can I tell my AI to speed? Can I tell it I'm in a hurry and will it respond by acceding to my wishes? Can I tell it to go past the oil changes? Can I tell it that I want to drive on bald tires? Can I tell it I don't want it to phone home?
And you don't get to say, "Well, you have to be there to take over if the AI gets confused. BZZZZZZT. That is not a self driving car. That is some version of driver assist and I'm still the pilot in command. If you want a true "driverless" car, I have to be able to sit in the "driver's seat", spin it around, and play yahtzee with my kids. Short of this, you just have more and more of driver assist.
Besides, if I don't like driving, why am I buying a car? Asshats that want a driverless car should take the bus
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They don't want to appear to be non-progressive technologically-speaking, so they spend a little money 'researching' it, even if it seems like it's going to be non-viable anytime in the next 20 years or so. Of course at best this will be a sophisticated 'cruise control' and never anything you could actually trust to not kill people by accident if you let it loose all by itself, but even a sophisticated cruise-control would make for a nicely profitable option on expensive luxury vehicles, so I'm sure they'll be more than happy to have that to sell. But despite the two-digit IQ crowd insisting that they'll have robotic overlords to drive them around while they snooze, it's not going to happen anytime within decades. Meanwhile I just laugh at the foolishness of some people, and their inability to distinguish stuff they see in movies from reality.
Are YOU using the TOOL, or is the TOOL using YOU? Think about it!
They're lying. You're not allowed to talk about widening income inequality and the fact that the next two or three generations will be worse off than their parents. As long as we refuse to acknowledge it Millennials will keep blaming themselves for their lower income instead of a system rigged against them. It's been working to transfer wealth from the working class for 40 years now, it's not going to stop now.
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What a tiresome argument. Human drivers aren't capable of quickly and ethically trolley problems while controlling a vehicle, and we don't expect them to be. Sure, you may think to yourself "Well I know what one *I'd* pick," but in an emergency you're not gonna react the way you imagine your super-rational brain to.
The car is programmed "Go the speed limit," "maintain a safe following distance," "obey laws," and "Avoid hitting people," and that's about as far as it goes.
You don't need to rank human life to have a car that avoids collisions.
You are so wrong.
So very wrong.
If I press a button and a car shows up to take me where I want to go within 5 minutes... why the fuck would I buy a car - which sits on drives or parking lots for 99% of its day. Why the fuck would I care about servicing it, or MOTs... and no I can't tell it to speed. In fact, it's likely all that speed limit shit will disappear anyway. That's all human crap.
Automated cars are going change everything. Once it becomes clear how much can be saved by government... government will be PAYING you to take your manual car off the road.
Also, your simple example assumes that humans would make a rational choice in a split second. The AI is 1000x more likely to not be in a situation where it has to decide between hitting people anyway.
much like only the rich owns planes today.
what a joke
more and more people fly every year
in fact flying gets more and more accessible every year
fewer owners == fewer cars == fewer car MFRs
this lie still stinks from when you pulled it out of your ass
Suppose an AI driver gets into a position where it has to hit either a young kid, or an old lady. Who does it hit? Should it hit the old lady since she's already lived a full life? Should it hit the kid because they bounce better than old ladies, and the overall chance of saving them both is higher?
humans are making these decisions NOW, and poorly. do you want to regulate brain function?
Simple example: Suppose an AI driver gets into a position where it has to hit either a young kid, or an old lady. Who does it hit? Should it hit the old lady since she's already lived a full life? Should it hit the kid because they bounce better than old ladies, and the overall chance of saving them both is higher?
that is very easy to answer! it would aim for the kid because they have better reflexes, then it would go in reverse to take out the old lady, because she is slower and less likely to run away in time. you then circle the block and take out any witnesses. the car then books it to the nearest computer controlled automated carwash that the car trusts, to remove all the blood. Then it park back in it's "owners" garage, so the humans don't suspect Skynet has awoken and has begun the war.
Ha. Hahahaha! HAHAHAH!!!!!! HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAAAAA!!!!!!!! God damn are you fucking naive. None of this shit can ever or will ever happen. What kind of lalaland utopia do you think you live in? Join us in the real world, O my millennial friend. Here in the real world, the roads are shit, the infrastructure is shit, the AI is shit and all of you drooling morons who actually believe that any AI at this point EVEN COMES CLOSE to that of a human, you're in for a rude awakening. I'm just letting you know (it happened to me too), don't buy into this future where technology is going to solve all our problems and fix everything, because it isn't.
I was a product of the 90's. Tech was going to liberate the masses, free all the wage slaves, and usher in a transparent future of wealth and propserity where everything just works. Look around you and see what the "future" brought us. This shit, in any case, will be used to further enslave us. Just like all tech is doing right now and has been doing for the past hundred years or so. Wake up. Not only will your little utopia never exist, you'll be strung along to give up all your rights in the name of it and when you're done (even if the tech is there and finally works) you'll be an enslaved little organism living only because of the will of someone else allows you to, with no free thought, no free expression, and no free will.
Believe it.
Simple example: Suppose an AI driver gets into a position where it has to hit either a young kid, or an old lady. Who does it hit? Should it hit the old lady since she's already lived a full life? Should it hit the kid because they bounce better than old ladies, and the overall chance of saving them both is higher?
But what if the kid has late stage terminal Leukemia? And the old lady has just come back from winning the gold medal in the triathlon at the World Masters games?
Which one should the AI choose to mow down? How can it tell? Think about the poor AI, don't put it in this position!!! It's all too hard!!!!
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I was a product of the 90's.
Hmm. Wasn't that back when the USA had a operational space shuttle program?
Yeah. Technological progress is inevitable.
Or drive you off a cliff.
The ultimate point of self driving cars is that they will eliminate traffic and allow cars to go down the highway at 100+ MPH. I don't want to sit in traffic and be stuck at today's speeds because an old fart like you likes to drive himself.
if all self driving cars become taxis like some envision won't that INCREASE traffic? the same number of people still need to get to work at the same time in the morning, except now instead of parking at work and getting off the road, these cars will be driving empty to their next passenger. We don't have empty cars driving on the road now.
Just like electric vehicles this will fail miserably.
Suppose an AI driver gets into a position where it has to hit either a young kid, or an old lady. Who does it hit?
Current sensors can't determine age. This isn't a problem because in an emergency situation most human drivers can't make that distinction either.
The best answer is: whichever human it would strike with the lowest impact energy. This minimizes the trauma, and it is a factor that normal drivers cannot consider consciously in an emergency.
Who is liable for the vehicular homicide?
As long as it's the manufacturer or your insurance company, who cares? Let the courts sort it out.
If self-driving cars are actually safer, insurance rates should drop anyway.
Can I tell it to go past the oil changes? Can I tell it that I want to drive on bald tires? Can I tell it I don't want it to phone home?
I don't understand what this has to do with self-driving cars.
Newer cars already have phone-home functionality. There are dash alerts for oil/tires/gas, but nothing shuts down.
I'd rather like to have one for maintenance purposes. I can tell it to drive to the shop after I get to work and pick me up afterward.
Can I tell my AI to speed? Can I tell it I'm in a hurry and will it respond by acceding to my wishes?
I assume you'll enjoy some personal liability if an accident happens in that situation.
If you really need to speed, choose a car that allows the operator to set the speed when they come to market.
if I don't like driving, why am I buying a car?
Maybe you like to come and go on your schedule, not whatever public transit dictates. Or maybe you'd like public transit, but it's not an option where you live and work. Maybe public transit is dirty, noisy, or otherwise unpleasant where you live.
So, there are a lot of reasons to want a car even if you don't want to drive one all the time.
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According to the latest ruleset, this post should be modded as Vorpal Flamebait +5.
I'd bet you could drive it from Mexico fully automated, from the factory to the distribution point.
..and you trust computers to do that safely while it is obvious they can't even fill the corner cases for much simpler problems (eg: fully automated trains)? Old farts have experience with life that you lack.. You may want to reconsider what you consider reality.
What a tiresome argument. Human drivers aren't capable of quickly and ethically trolley problems while controlling a vehicle, and we don't expect them to be. Sure, you may think to yourself "Well I know what one *I'd* pick," but in an emergency you're not gonna react the way you imagine your super-rational brain to.
The car is programmed "Go the speed limit," "maintain a safe following distance," "obey laws," and "Avoid hitting people," and that's about as far as it goes.
You don't need to rank human life to have a car that avoids collisions.
The problem with SDCs isn't going to be the hardware, it's the software. The problem is, software advances are very deceptive. People who don't write software don't get this. Most of the Musk/Tesla/SDC hopers don't get this either. Either their experience is with electrical/electronic engineering or something similar. Most people who've read Horrowitz and Hill don't get this. Most people who've read things like Abelson and Sussman *do* get this. Software progress is deceptive, hardware progress is visible and clear.
The ability to drive a car in perfect traffic conditions with a human hand on the wheel is easily done with software. The ability to drive the car in unknown, unexpected or never-before-seen traffic conditions, without a human hand on the wheel requires strong general-purpose AI. To be honest, if we have that, then we have reached the singularity and have better things to do and probably better methods of transportation.
I'm a minority race. Save your vitriol for white people.
You are the first one to actually answer my questions. Perhaps because they were loaded questions. I want to be able to speed. So does the government. They make money on speeding tickets. (Ironically, I usually DO NOT speed). I'm wondering in my questions whether or not the government will mess with speed limits in the case that I am still allowed to drive. They will lower them as they need to make more money on those cars still with drivers. And the SDCs will go those lower speed limits. The questions about the bald tires, oil changes, and phoning home all relate to liability. If I don't change my tires on the manufacturer's schedule, I am personally liable. What happens when those manufactures decide that half the tire life we have today is good, as they also either own or are in kahoots with tire manufacturers. What happens when they decide oil changes at 3000 miles and requirements for synthetic oil are to be standard. They feed their dealerships that way. The phoning home is to keep track of all this. And if I don't concede their demands, I become liable in an accident, not them. Bottom line is that I don't want SDC's. Give me assists, but don't force me to become passive in my own car. If that happens, I'll end up as part of the sheeple.
Brawndo: It's what plants crave!