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Phil Schiller Says the MacBook Pro Doesn't Need an SD Card Slot (theverge.com)

Apple's new MacBook Pro models have upset many people for many different reasons. Some are unhappy with the inability to get more than 16GB of RAM, some are upset with the high-price, some are unhappy about the missing physical Escape and function keys, and many are unhappy because Apple didn't put an SD card slot in the MacBook Pro. But Apple has an explanation. From a report on The Verge: Speaking to The Independent (paywalled), Apple exec Phil Schiller said the company had dropped the SD card slot as it was "cumbersome" and because wireless transfer technology for cameras is "proving very useful" as an alternative. Schiller said, "Because of a couple of things. One, it's a bit of a cumbersome slot. You've got this thing sticking halfway out. Then there are very fine and fast USB card readers, and then you can use CompactFlash as well as SD. So we could never really resolve this -- we picked SD because more consumer cameras have SD but you can only pick one. So, that was a bit of a trade-off. And then more and more cameras are starting to build wireless transfer into the camera. That's proving very useful. So we think there's a path forward where you can use a physical adaptor if you want, or do wireless transfer."

32 of 675 comments (clear)

  1. Phill Schill by geek · · Score: 5, Funny

    Just take the er off his last name and you've pretty much summed the prick up perfectly.

    1. Re:Phill Schill by Joce640k · · Score: 5, Funny

      Then there are very fine and fast USB card readers,

      Um, wouldn't you need a USB connector for that?

      --
      No sig today...
    2. Re: Phill Schill by LDAPMAN · · Score: 4, Informative

      A simple google would show you there are plenty of them.

    3. Re: Phill Schill by ColdWetDog · · Score: 4, Interesting

      On MY 7 year old MBP, I don't use the SD slot (well, it doesn't have one), but it's currently plugged into the Ethernet port. And is so on a daily basis.

      It's also hooked up to a MagSafe connector which has gone MIA in the new incarnation of the MBP, I use the USB - A ports with dozens of peripherals during the week without a dongle.

      As has been aptly mentioned in a number of venues, these new machines are Mac Book Airs, not Mac Book Pros.

      --
      Faster! Faster! Faster would be better!
    4. Re: Phill Schill by subk · · Score: 5, Insightful

      True, *you* probably don't need a professional grade laptop.. But photographers use the SD card every day. IT professionals use the escape key and ethernet jack every day. If you don't use either of them, you're probably not using your MacBook in a professional capacity. Writing emails and surfing Facespace doesn't count.. Apple really should be calling these "MacBook Air" or "MacBook Lite" because they are missing all the things that made them "Pro".

      --
      Now, if you'll excuse me, I have backups to corrupt.
    5. Re: Phill Schill by jittles · · Score: 5, Informative

      On my 7 year old macbook pro, I think I used the SD card slot maybe 2 or 3 times total. Same goes for the ethernet jack. If your'e going to use it so infrequently, doesn't seem like a disaster to expect an adapter.

      Perhaps, but his arguments are asinine regardless. Card half sticking out? Hmmm i seem to have several cameras where the SD Card slot is spring loaded and has absolutely nothing sticking out of it. Wireless is satisfactory? Sure - lets just sit there for hours while I transfer 30GB of pictures from my last vacation. Sounds like a great time for everyone.

    6. Re:Phill Schill by butchersong · · Score: 5, Insightful

      The macbook pro ships with a headphone jack and no port to plug the lighting headphones they force you to buy for the iphone. So you need an adapter for an sd card slot, an adapter for your headphones either for your phone or laptop, an adapter to plug your current usb devices into the macbook pro... One thing I've always admired was how polished the macbook line hardware is but the dongles are starting to add up.

    7. Re: Phill Schill by Grishnakh · · Score: 5, Insightful

      This guy is an obvious s(c)hill. I haven't seen many SDcard slots on laptop computers that stick out when there's no card in it. On my Dells, they usually have a little plastic insert to keep dirt out, the slot is spring-loaded, and that plastic insert sits completely flush. Only if you have an actual SDcard in there does something stick out, but that's not a problem because normally you don't leave the cards in there very long, only for when you need to transfer stuff, then you put them back in the camera or whatever.

      And yeah, expecting people to just use wireless transfer is indeed idiotic, especially given the gargantuan image sizes that modern mega-megapixel cameras create.

      Now, using a USB card reader could be a workaround. I have one of those lying around in case I ever need to read a CF card again (not likely), or my SD slot were to fail, or if I needed to read a Sony MemoryStick (not likely at all). But wait! There's no USB-A slot on this shitty new MacBook! So I'd have to go buy some kind of hub or adapter, or buy an all-new USB-C card reader.

      This new MacBook is just a giant failure in every way. It'll be interesting to see how the sales for it fare; will the Apple faithful buy it anyway and delude themselves into thinking it's wonderful even though it's a big step down? I wouldn't be surprised.

    8. Re: Phill Schill by torqer · · Score: 5, Funny

      I think it's more aptly called the Mac Book Err

    9. Re: Phill Schill by scubamage · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Ah yes, a card sticking half way out for a few seconds. Way worse than a dongle sticking out several inches.

    10. Re: Phill Schill by Roger+W+Moore · · Score: 4, Interesting

      It'll be interesting to see how the sales for it fare; will the Apple faithful buy it anyway and delude themselves into thinking it's wonderful even though it's a big step down?

      If it were just this then I'd say no but as an Apple user for the past decade this was the last straw. I've been waiting over a year now for a new Mac Pro with nothing and when I was thinking of switching to the Mac Mini to get by they took out two of the cores so it is now a desktop with less power than even their low end laptops. With this latest change they are killing off the laptops as well: no ports, crap GPU, old CPU and insane pricing. I'm now going to move back to PCs with Linux+Windows. Windows has a new Linux subsystem which will hopefully make it bearable and the new hardware from Microsoft, Surface book and Surface studio, looks far more like it came from Apple while the new Macbooks with their fondle bar are far more reminiscent of the old-style MS 'innovations': a stupid gimmick with no real use.

    11. Re: Phill Schill by cfalcon · · Score: 4, Insightful

      You still need a goddamned adapter. Buy a USB-A drive, it works on every machine. Buy a USB-C drive, it works on.. like this one Apple thing?

      Yes, eventually that will change. But at the end of the day, we are entering a world of dongles, because the U in USB is gone. It's just "dumb stupid computer plug that doesn't work".

    12. Re: Phill Schill by Bing+Tsher+E · · Score: 5, Funny

      Like Jobs himself, Apple products will get thinner and thinner until they die.

    13. Re:Phill Schill by cfalcon · · Score: 4, Informative

      If you buy an SD to USB-A adapter (aka, an SD card reader), then you can plug it into every computer, and your car. This is the normal state of things.
      If you buy an SD to USB-C adapter, then you can plug it into anything with a USB-C slot, which is very few things at this time.

      If you buy the first one, you'll need an adapter to use it on your Very Few Things.

      If you buy the second one, you'll need an adapter to use it on your Very Many Things.

      So, which is the correct call? For most people, the first option.

  2. Why not remove the screen too by kuzb · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Apple's idea of value is hilariously distorted. Let's charge more than everyone else and deliver less.

    --
    BeauHD. Worst editor since kdawson.
  3. They want to sell over priced Accessories by Joe_Dragon · · Score: 5, Informative
  4. Complainers gonna complain by Archangel+Michael · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Here is a thought to all you people complaining about Apple's decision making on their products ... DON'T BUY IT.

    The only way to get Apple to listen, is to vote with your dollars. If you buy their products, you prove them right.

    --
    Agent K: A *person* is smart. People are dumb, stupid, panicky animals, and you know it.
    1. Re:Complainers gonna complain by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Insightful

      It's not so polar. What if you have used macs for 5-10 years, bought lots of software or just personal investment, and if they don't voice their opinions, apple won't change (if they do). You're what's wrong w/ america. "If you don't like it, move!"

  5. Fuck You, that's why. by geekmux · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Let's be honest. The last few changes from the Apple design team have afforded little or no explanation behind them, and they certainly were not done based on consumer input.

    Provide all the weak-ass explanations you want Phil. We know the real answer is Fuck You, that's why.

    The disgusting nature behind this behavior from vendors is the Fuck You mentality is becoming rather addictive.

    Consumers, if you want design change that even hints towards what you may want or need, vote with your wallet, because all other channels have been effectively silenced.

    1. Re:Fuck You, that's why. by dgatwood · · Score: 5, Informative

      Actually, the better answer is that they weren't willing to update the SD card reader to something modern. Newer UHS-II SD card readers are much faster than the ancient UHS-I reader that they included, and somebody probably calculated that upgrading to UHS-II would require replacing their USB-2 hub with a USB-3 hub in addition to upgrading the SD card reader, and they decided that it wasn't worth it.

      As someone who uses the SD card slot on a regular basis, I disagree with them, and this is definitely making me question Apple's commitment to photography professionals, particularly given what they did to Aperture.

      --

      Check out my sci-fi/humor trilogy at PatriotsBooks.

  6. Isn't this more up to the customers to decide? by QuietLagoon · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Or, more likely, Apple just couldn't figure out how to get a SD reader into the stylishly small housing for the MacbookPro. Style over function - welcome to Apple's world.

  7. Bag of Dongles by Bugler412 · · Score: 4, Informative

    In the near future, any Apple user will be easily identified by the bag of expensive dongles he/she would have to carry to maintain functionality. Wireless?! Gimme a break, anyone that shoots photos in volume with a DSLR (I routinely get over 1000 shots from a single live music venue shoot, low/variable light and moving subjects makes for a huge number of throwaway shots ) knows that wireless, even relatively current 802.11ac (which nearly no cameras have) can't keep up with a high volume shooting situation for even just still JPGs, let alone RAW files or video. The physically connected card has nearly an order of magnitude advantage in throughput. They are basically ceding the professional market to Linux/Windows machines.

  8. Dear Apple.... by Lumpy · · Score: 5, Insightful

    I'm a guy that is full in the Apple ecosystem and I make money programming for apple devices. But the latest macbook pros are NOT pro.

    Wireless from the camera? Is this guy that much of a dipshit? Go ahead and see how fast you can transfer these 36 Megapixel RAW images from my D810 camera. Yes I use the XDHC slot and I dont want to wait a week for these to transfer over wifi. slapping the card in the macbook was super fast and worked great.

    Macbook pros are not for pros anymore. It sounds like they really want to eliminate any professional use of their products by removing features that pro photographers use heavily.

    It is pretty sad when the last version of the product is significantly better than the latest version.

    --
    Do not look at laser with remaining good eye.
    1. Re:Dear Apple.... by wickerprints · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Schiller's subtext is this: "We believe the vast, vast majority of people taking photos are doing so with their iPhones. We want to encourage that behavior and make any other camera obsolete."

      Apple doesn't want to make it easier for people like you or me who use professional-grade imaging equipment. They arrogantly believe that the only thing that people need to take good photos is the iPhone 7+ with their fake bokeh.

      And before the Apple fans accuse me of being a troll, let me state for the record that I have exclusively owned Apple hardware since at least 2004. The only phones I've bought since 2007 were iPhones; I owned the original iPhone. I've watched as Android went from a joke to a serious competitor, to beating iOS hands-down in features, yet I've remained loyal. But these statements coming out from Cupertino are unacceptable to me. I count myself among their most loyal consumers, but I will not be purchasing this Macbook Pro, despite having more than enough money to spend on the highest-end model and all their ridiculous dongles they expect me to buy with it. For me, this was never about money. This is about not taking a huge step backward in function. Yes, I am voting with my wallet.

      I sincerely hope that Apple's management listens, because the direction of their "innovation" is antithetical to everything that Steve stood for. Steve believed in the importance of design, but design as a means to an end, which was to facilitate rather than hinder the user experience. Jony Ive's design philosophy is to make devices as pretty and thin as possible, screw function. Without Steve to put a reality check on that, this Macbook "Pro" is the all-too-predictable result.

    2. Re:Dear Apple.... by Solandri · · Score: 4, Informative
      The whole point of using memory cards on a camera is so that when one card is full, you can quickly swap it out for a new one and continue shooting. If you've got two cards, you plug the second one into your laptop, start copying photos to the laptop, and go back to shooting. The copy will finish long before your second card is full, so when it does become full you can just reverse the process, format the first card, and go back to shooting. If this weren't the case, there's no need to use memory cards. You could just build 32GB or 64GB or whatever straight into the camera.

      The only workarounds Apple leaves are:
      • you must carry enough memory cards to hold all the photos you'd shoot in a day, then waste time transferring them in bulk instead of transferring them while you continue shooting,
      • or you must always carry an external card reader with your laptop everywhere you take your camera,
      • or you need a second camera that you can use while you leave the first one next to the laptop transferring its photos wirelessly.

      As for the card sticking halfway out, that's only true for lame laptop vendors who tried to save a few cents for a spring-loaded eject mechanism. Those leave the card sticking halfway so you can pull it out with your fingers (and to save a negligible amount of space inside the chassis). The better laptops have SD readers where the card goes fully inside when inserted. The only reasonable rationale I can think of for eliminating the SD card slot is to make your device waterproof. I suspect what's really going on is that Apple gave the SD Association an ultimatum while negotiating licensing fees, and when the didn't blink Apple had to remove the card slot to save face.

  9. Re:We know better than you by Grishnakh · · Score: 5, Insightful

    That's because that's what makes a laptop a professional model: a bunch of parts that you may or may not ever use.

    Any real business laptop these days has an HDMI or DisplayPort output, and probably even a VGA output, because conference room monitors use those connectors. You can't go to some customer site, where you don't know exactly what their conference room has (and they probably don't either, off the tops of their heads), and then bitch at them for not having some brand-new USB-c connection or not having an adapter for your laptop.

    Real business laptops have Ethernet jacks, because many businesses (and governments especially) require them for security purposes. How exactly do you think you'd ever use a MacBook with no Ethernet on a secure government network? You wouldn't; those networks are NOT wireless.

    A "professional" laptop is not going to require you to carry around a bunch of adapters for all the circumstances you might find yourself in and not anticipate beforehand. This is why *real* pro laptops have all these ports, even if it does make them slightly bigger and heavier. For cheap-ass consumer-grade computers, leaving out stuff that's not used as much may be just fine, but that doesn't work for serious business and professional users.

  10. Re:We know better than you by vux984 · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Where is the use case that they are lugging around a DSLR, lenses, lights, tripods, and a laptop but are really put out by the SD reader?

    Its not about the 'lugging it around'; its not even about the cost; it's about the sheer blind arrogance and idiocy of making a tool less useful. The 'pro' series stuff is supposed to be a TOOL for PROFESSIONALS.

    Tools are supposed to be functional. When they are less functional for absolutely no good reason, people who use them get pissed.

    Nobody thought that macbook pro was too big, nobody wanted it thinner. Nobody wanted them to remove the sd card.

    Meanwhile apple comes out with this nonsense...

    "and because wireless transfer technology for cameras is "proving very useful" as an alternative"

    You know how a photographer works? They fill a card, pull it out, and put in the next one and keep going. They don't sit around for 2 hours doing an 8 or 16GB wireless transfer.

    " Then there are very fine and fast USB card readers,"

    And it used to be built in.

    "and then you can use CompactFlash as well as SD"

    Great idea Apple. Add a CF slot. That would be an actual feature.

    "we picked SD because more consumer cameras have SD but you can only pick one"

    Bullshit. You can pick more than one. You've got all that space from taking the DVD out, and the expresscard slot out, and the SSD is a fraction of the size of the old hard drive... so room isn't a problem. Add the 2nd most popular slot, and watch people actually get excited about the new laptop instead.

    Better still make it a modular part, so if it breaks, it's easy to replace. That would be how you design a professional tool.

    Oh... you took all that space and made it thinner instead... nobody wanted it thinner.

    Imagine you used a heavy duty pickup truck for work.

    Then the next years model is announced its new truck, basically a Porsche 911 with a trailer hitch.. And the maker told you, well... this is better because people need to carry different cargo... and this way you can buy exactly the trailer you need!! Oh and with the availability of courier services (aka 'wireless transfer') a lot of people don't even need a truck bed at all... they just make a phone call and the cargo shows up at the destination!!

    And just look at this new 'truck' its smaller, and lighter, and handles great. Look how sleek it is. (Well.. until you actually hook up a trailer (aka usb dongle) to it and then its unwieldy as shit... but we didn't REALLY want you to use a trailer with it... did we mention you can get a courier to move stuff for you!!)

    Oh, and it's virtually un-serviceable except at specialized dealers; so keep it in the city and maybe the highway -- don't take this truck onto farm roads and mountain roads. Its just not built for that. If you need something from a farm or mountain road... it has this great built in phone you can use to call real professional with actual tools to do it for you!

    That's about apple's recent approach to dealing with 'professionals' who need 'tools'.

  11. Then we don't need a Macbook Pro by grumpy-cowboy · · Score: 4, Informative

    Any other REAL "pro" laptop will do the job. You know laptops with USB, HDMI, .. ports, SD card, more than 16GB RAM, a full keyboard, ...

    --
    Will $CURRENT_YEAR be the year of the Linux Desktop?
  12. Re:Another Macverstisement! by Grishnakh · · Score: 5, Funny

    Don't worry, "macs4all" will be here filling the comment section with rebuttals to everyone's anti-Apple comments and telling us how Apple can do no wrong.

  13. Re:We know better than you by thsths · · Score: 5, Insightful

    That is nearly accurate, except that *every* professional would appreciate a USB port and a Gigabit Ethernet port. They may not always use them, but they are just essential for a lot of different jobs. On the SD card I half agree: I like it, I use it a lot, but it is getting less common.

    Of course the elephant in the room is that both USB port and SD port can be used for (cheap) storage extensions. And Apple absolutely wants to prevent that. So I think that is the real reason: form and money over function.

  14. Wireless is a hassle by nitehawk214 · · Score: 4, Informative

    I have one of those wireless capable cameras. Nearly worthless feature.

    First, you have to connect your laptop/phone to the camera's wireless AP, not the other way around. Goodbye internet while transferring files, and having to fuck around with the wireless settings. Want to transfer files to desktop? Nope.

    Second, on the cameras I have experience with (Olympus and Sony), you have to use the manufacturers app to transfer files. Want to simply access the files as a disk? Nope. Want to transfer RAW files? Nope.

    The only thing the wireless feature is useful is as a remote shutter trigger and viewing the LCD screen when the phone is on a tripod.

    --
    I'm a good cook. I'm a fantastic eater. - Steven Brust
  15. Re:We know better than you by Dixie_Flatline · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Make it a modular part? That's a great idea. Like, maybe they could make it detachable, and then it would be easy to swap. They could use a standard interconnect for it, maybe with a standards based cable that's really fast, so you don't have to worry about bandwidth.

    Modular is good, that way people that don't need it don't have to have their laptop burdened with a useless port.

    Not all people that buy Mac Pros are photography professionals. We have a Nikon D3s at home--a pro level camera--and it uses compact flash, so we've NEVER used the SD card slot. My point-and-shoot camera uses a mini-SD card, so I still can't use that SD card slot. Just give me a USB port and an adaptor so I can put WHATEVER thing I want there.

    Not all professionals are the same, and not even all professionals of the same type have the same needs. More ports, yes, but more multi-use ports.