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Teachers 'Unwittingly' Spying On School Children With Surveillance Software (thestack.com)

An anonymous reader writes: A thousand schools across the UK are monitoring children's classroom activities through surveillance software, according to a new report released by privacy advocate group Big Brother Watch. The paper claims that schools have spent an estimated 2.5 million pound ($3.1 million USD) on monitoring solutions to keep an eye on pupils. The technology, known as 'Classroom Management Software', tracks computer usage, including pupil internet activity, browser history, and even keyboard strokes. The report found that 70% of secondary schools (PDF) in Britain have installed monitoring systems, across more than 800,000 school-owned devices and near to 1,500 privately-owned devices.

76 comments

  1. well... by MitchDev · · Score: 5, Interesting

    If these are school-owned computers, on school property, then I don;thave much of a problem with this... privately owned devices and/or devicesa the students take home, not as much so

    1. Re:well... by telchine · · Score: 4, Interesting

      If these are school-owned computers, on school property, then I don;thave much of a problem with this... privately owned devices and/or devicesa the students take home, not as much so

      Interesting point. If they were adults then I'd agree. However kids aren't really able to ascertain the implications of this spying, so I'm unsure. Also, they don't have much choice about the matter. I can choose whether or not to work for an employer that acts like Big Brother, kids don't really have much of a choice about which school they go to.

    2. Re:well... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Insightful

      if you use a public toilet it's not YOUR toilet, you don't OWN that toilet, i guess it's ok to install a camera in their and watch you take a shit... oh not cool?

    3. Re:well... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Yeahhh... still not sure how this is "unwitting", but I am particularly unsure how you view this as a more substantial violation of privacy than simply going to public school in the first place.

    4. Re:well... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Department stores commonly put security cameras in the dressing rooms, where they watch you undress to try on their clothes...to make sure you aren't stealing said clothing.

      Why shouldn't there be cameras in public restrooms to make sure you aren't vandalizing them, or using illegal drugs in them?

    5. Re:well... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Oh.. are they defecating on the computers, too?

    6. Re:well... by pr0fessor · · Score: 0

      I have my users locked down tight... if you want to set up a profile for Ashley Madison do it at home where your spouse can help you because you won't be getting to it or anything else here and any traffic logged at the firewall is for trouble shooting. We already know your not browsing adult content unless it's a couple years worth of playboy and penthouse hidden in the back of a file cabinet and one of the secretaries found it while you where on vacation and now your fired.

    7. Re:well... by Mashiki · · Score: 3, Informative

      Despite what the article says, I'm going to go with the "this is not unwittingly." Those teachers and organizations know or should know exactly what they're doing.Seems like some kids are able to. The court case for anyone who wants to read it. Keep in mind that the UK is the same country that tried to create life-long student records for "extremism." And there was also most recently the trojan horse scandal, and on top of that a school recently turned around and said that "If you don't go to the mosque, they'll be marked down as a racist for their entire school career." FYI: School is in the same region as the trojan horse scandal. The UK has a lot of problems.

      --
      Om, nomnomnom...
    8. Re:well... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      My state recently passed a bill that requires we filter the network access on all take-home devices. When they're taken home. Naturally there was no funding for software, and to hell with the time sink it caused.

      Anyway, I wouldn't be surprised to learn someday this ticks up to monitoring capabilities. Because terrorists. Or whatever. I don't care anymore.

    9. Re:well... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Education in the UK is publicly funded, and as such schools are responsible to the public and not their own financial interests.

      But even if they were, I would argue that the school abuses widespread ignorance of computing technology to implement policies that no reasonable person would agree to, were they done in more overt manner. Furthermore, if this tracking policy is not clearly communicated to every person using those devices, then this might as well be fraudulent behavior as a reasonable person would not assume they are being tracked in such an environment, let alone a young child.

    10. Re:well... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      There are no cameras in changing rooms, the cameras are outside of the rooms to make sure you dont walk away wearing the clothing. Its also why they count how many items you take in with you and put the tag on your door listing the number of items you should bring back out with you. The tag is so there is video evidence hey this schmuck took three items in and came out with one.

    11. Re:well... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0, Insightful

      Maybe if you didn't lock those computers down so tightly you could pull up a grammar guide and discover the difference between your and you're. I desperately hope you aren't an actual professor, as my thesis from my masters wouldn't have been accepted with that sort of rudimentary mistake.

    12. Re:well... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      So I guess, in your school district, the Madisons send their daughter to a private school?

      Back to topic: UK school spying really doesn't matter - like Arthur Dent, the little mushminds 'will be [are being] programmed not to notice' (the spying).

    13. Re:well... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      In what country? Because in the US they aren't allowed to as it's a violation of privacy. Same with the bathrooms. Having worked in service through college, I can promise you that they get vandalized regularly, but it's illegal to put cameras in to catch said vandalism. As for changing rooms, you aren't allowed to put cameras in them, however you are allowed to disallow them from bringing bags in with them and limiting the number of items they can bring with them. Which is what they actually do.

    14. Re:well... by Dunbal · · Score: 1

      In their what?

      --
      Seven puppies were harmed during the making of this post.
    15. Re:well... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      The software logs keystrokes which means it exposes passwords.

      If the student ever logs into say their gmail account, for something school related they hand over the ability to reset all accounts managed by that email address to the school administration who monitors the system.

    16. Re:well... by Hognoxious · · Score: 1

      According to the telly earlier, some schools are implementing BYOD which does blur the issue a little. Unless they remove it at 3:30 and reinstall it at 9:00 the next day.

      But really, if the schools didn't do this and one of the pupils was caught with jihadist donkey porn there'd be a shitstorm of complaints, and it'd be 90% the same people.

      --
      Confucius say, "Find worm in apple - bad. Find half a worm - worse."
    17. Re:well... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      For some people analogies are just too hard to comprehend.

    18. Re:well... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Bravo pedant, now youed butter beggar off cos you're skills ad nought to the's conversating.

    19. Re:well... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      Are you comparing an offhanded internet comment to a thesis paper? Really? And why throw out the comment about you having a masters, should I be impressed. I apologize but I am not.

    20. Re:well... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Interesting point. If they were adults then I'd agree. However kids aren't really able to ascertain the implications of this spying, so I'm unsure.

      Bad news Skippy. If you look at the tracking done by sites "adults" like to use you'd see that adults have no clue about this stuff let alone its implications. Child or "adult" it doesn't matter.

      Well off to post selfies on Facebook and like some stuff!. Man, giving facebook access to everything on my phone makes life so much easier.

    21. Re: well... by fermion · · Score: 1
      Kids need to learn that if it is not your machine, not your network, there is no expectation of privacy. They need to know that when they are using wifi at McDonalds or Starbucks every they do is logged. If a school owns a computer, and they take it home that compuer shouldbe kept in a common area and not in private area where the kid might have naked time. Like any computer owned by an employer, nothing should be done in it that is not work related.

      Kids are given computer so they can learn skills and etiquette so when they grow up they can be successful for a lifetime. Teaching them now so they don't get fired for making p0rn on thier work laptop is a good thing.

      --
      "She's a scientist and a lesbian. She's not going to let it slide." Orphan Black
    22. Re:well... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Yes, teachers know exactly what they're doing, but it's what they've always been doing. The one thing teachers and parents agree on is that children have no right to privacy.

    23. Re:well... by MitchDev · · Score: 1

      Exactly.

        "Why didn't you have monitoring and blocking in place to prevent kids from going to inappropriate sites!!!!!!!

  2. Unwittingly? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2

    How is it unwitting if they spend $3.1 millions on it?

    It's like saying I got unwittingly stoned after ingesting these drugs...

    1. Re:Unwittingly? by alvinrod · · Score: 1

      Getting stoned out of your wits isn't the same as getting unwittingly stoned even if the outcome is much the same.

    2. Re:Unwittingly? by telchine · · Score: 1

      How is it unwitting if they spend $3.1 millions on it?

      I was wondering this. The TFA says that it's the teachers that are the unwitting parties. It's the schools that are buying the spy software, and the teachers are having to use it. I guess unwilling would be a better term, but you get the gist.

  3. Good by The-Ixian · · Score: 0

    You need to keep a tight leash on those little rug rats.

    How are you going to guide a student if you don't know what they are up to all the time?

    That's the trade off... you are young with few responsibilities but you are monitored closely. Once you are older, you are not monitored so closely and have more freedom but with that comes responsibilities...

    --
    My eyes reflect the stars and a smile lights up my face.
    1. Re: Good by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      apparently you haven't worked for my employer.

    2. Re:Good by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Besides, how else are you supposed to get them used to big brother? Make it seem normal at a young age! /sarcasm

    3. Re:Good by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Once you are 'older' the goddamned government should keep it's nose out of your damn business, PERIOD! NO MORE MASS SURVEILLANCE!

    4. Re:Good by Woldscum · · Score: 0

      How else are they going to track the affect of the state indoctrination and propaganda?

  4. Not news to me by chexican · · Score: 1

    I'm being watched by one of these as I type this!

    1. Re:Not news to me by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Your drugs will arrive in 1 hour.

    2. Re:Not news to me by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      So today you learned they don't even realize they're watching you.

  5. "monitoring children's classroom activities" by perry64 · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Isn't "monitoring children's classroom activities" pretty much number one on a teacher's list of responsibilities?

    1. Re:"monitoring children's classroom activities" by Oswald+McWeany · · Score: 1

      Exactly. I think a right to privacy is paramount; however, kids need to be watched. Just like they haven't gained many rights and privileges afforded to adults, they also haven't yet earned to right to privacy.

      Protectors of children, be it parent, or teacher need to be monitoring the children whilst under their care.

      --
      "That's the way to do it" - Punch
    2. Re:"monitoring children's classroom activities" by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Informative

      A few years ago there was a scandal about school-provided laptops that the kids took home. The school got caught red-handed using the cameras to spy on the kids even when they weren't using the laptops, in their own bedrooms.

      The school insisted that they never did this, despite the fact that they got caught because they accused a student of using illegal drugs (in his own bedroom), based on video-camera evidence from one of these laptops.

    3. Re:"monitoring children's classroom activities" by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      Exactly. I think a right to privacy is paramount; however, kids need to be watched.

      So, in your view, a right to privacy isn't really paramount, more like para-paramount.

    4. Re:"monitoring children's classroom activities" by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      And that's exactly how this software functions - it allows a teacher to watch thumbnails of a classroom's worth of pupils at a time; in many cases the software allows capturing screenshots, polling/testing, allowing or blocking specified activities, and even enables distance learning for telecommuting/virtual classrooms. Generally the software isn't collecting metrics although that is possible to some degree, but most teachers or lab admins don't have the time or energy to follow up on what those numbers in a constructive way.

      There really isn't anything generally nefarious going on here - especially not in the context of devices in school, although there have been high profile cases where such software has been used to "spy" on kids outside of school, including an infamous one in a Philadelphia suburb a few years back. That's not to say that this couldn't be more nefarious than happens to be at the moment, but generally no one wants to see this stuff misused in a way that might actually hurt kids.

    5. Re:"monitoring children's classroom activities" by Pseudonymous+Powers · · Score: 1

      Exactly. I think a right to privacy is paramount; however, kids need to be watched.

      So, in your view, a right to privacy isn't really paramount, more like para-paramount.

      Or, come to think of it, parent-paramount.

    6. Re:"monitoring children's classroom activities" by Alain+Williams · · Score: 2

      Yes, but that does not go so far as monitoring their blood pressure, how full their bladder is, ... ie there are limits. So if a teacher (reasonably) says that they can have 5 minutes free time and send email, ... the keystroke logger will capture the kids' mail account passwords. Then who knows what will happen to it. The school will doubtless say that they will not scrape passwords, but: * can you trust everyone who can access the logs; * what happens when the next data breach comes along and these logs get sent to china/... ?

      I don't think the schools are aware of a potential liability. If they don't want it then don't collect it.

    7. Re:"monitoring children's classroom activities" by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      In the original sense of focusing students, preventing distractions, inspiring, mitigating bullying, and evaluating learning disabilities and/or abilities then yes.
      In the "we have automatically turned on your webcam, microphone, and keylogging, (just because we technically can), and now consider this a fine example of remote-monitoring"... well this is not in the same ballpark.

    8. Re:"monitoring children's classroom activities" by GuB-42 · · Score: 1

      This is a different matter.
      When a kid is at home, his is under his parents or guardian responsibility. By spying on the kids at home, the school violated the privacy of whoever is taking care of the kid.

    9. Re:"monitoring children's classroom activities" by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Silly me, I always thought it was, y'know, to teach...

    10. Re:"monitoring children's classroom activities" by SuricouRaven · · Score: 1

      I work at a school. We block all email services except for the one we control, and the one we control has filters on it that prevent any student from emailing another student.

      We have this in place because a lot of bullying was taking place over email, and the school could have faced legal action because of it.

  6. And this is a surprise? Why? by QuietLagoon · · Score: 2, Insightful
    In the rush to make schools "computer-friendly," school administrations have given away the privacy of the children in a wholesale manner.

    .
    Did anyone at all stop to think at the reasons why software and computer companies are so eager to get their software and hardware in the classrooms and in the backpacks of our children? It certainly does not appear to be to help the children, though that is the reason they hide behind.

    At a minimum, every school and every parent should ask their technology vendors what information is being harvested from the children, and with whom is it shared?

    It appears that these companies are building databases on our children for unspecified use and with our passive cooperation.

  7. In other words by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Windows 10 is installed on the students computers

    1. Re:In other words by beastofburdon · · Score: 1

      There is no hope then.

  8. Re:And this is a surprise? Why? by dmiller1984 · · Score: 2

    My school has used software like this in the past and the program we used didn't keep a log of anything. It was just to see in real-time what was happening on each student's computer. You could freeze the machines if you needed to get the attention of the class or broadcast the teacher's computer to the kids' machines. Software like this is almost essential for managing a computer class, but I would be wary if there was software that actually collected data, but that hasn't been the case in my experience.

  9. Sigh. by ledow · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Sigh.

    I work in schools, in the UK.

    It is THE LAW that we must ensure that the children's devices do not expose them and are managed and under school control. Hence we install monitoring software.

    We are required, by child protection laws, by e-safety regulations, by basic child management, and by parental demand, to watch what they are doing and intercept what we can.

    And, from experience, even when we do, kids will load up porn sites (Filters? We have multiple layers. Kids are good at getting round them) and try to print them out before the IT guys can stop it, kids will watch movie trailers not suitable for their age, kids will try to get on their home email or some third-party message service so they can chat across the classrooms (exposing themselves to the possibility of strangers contacting them, which is the first stage of grooming).

    Bitch about it all you want, the law says we have to protect them in this way and any school that doesn't will fail inspection, be outed by parents and be on the news by lunchtime when a child just walks past their management, filters or settings.

    And in the days of BYOD and 1:1 devices, that means we also install settings, management profiles and enforce proxy/filter settings on device that they might well take home. Generally, parents will DEMAND that. Or else they are just being given a computer that - at home - lets their little darlings walk past their NetNanny or equivalent.

    And it's parents demanding the devices in the first place. Certainly not the school IT departments!

    Before you leap on the privacy shite, consider the background. Schools have ZERO choice in this. Failing to implement such measures means they will be taken to court. Not providing devices or BYOD means they are made to feel like the dinosaurs of education and parents run away from them. In some cases, such devices are basically DEMANDED.

    Feel like that leaves you between a rock and a hard place? Welcome to my life.

    I've worked in UK schools all my life as the IT guy. State, private, primary, secondary and above. We have no choice. Even data protection means we need to secure, manage and lock down the children's machines so that their data doesn't leak to third-parties (like browser extensions and shite like other front-page stories at the moment) - because THAT'S breaking the law as well, unless they have an EU-compatible Data Protection policy.

    Before you assume evil on behalf on the schools, imagine the alternative - schools without tech competing with schools with tech, or schools with no e-Safety of child protection on their machines.

    We teach our pupils to treat the school iPad like an exercise book. Use it for work. Configure it for your work. Don't play games on it. Don't doodle on it. Only use it in lessons when your teacher asks you to. Take it home and do your homework on it if you like/need to. But spying on the kids via it? No. Because it should be used for school work only. Worried about the school IT guy looking at what your child searches for? You have bigger problems, such as what they are doing to your child in school, with access to their school email, web history, etc. And if you're that worried, turn the device off when at home.

    But don't come out guns blazing thinking that child privacy is the biggest issue at play here. It's not. It's important - ESPECIALLY important. But the other things that it dictates (i.e. others not seeing that information that the school already can get a myriad of ways) are infinitely more important.

    1. Re:Sigh. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I second this. People see "monitoring" and immediately go crazy, when in fact parents at home often install similar monitoring software for their children. It's our duty to protect these children and to ensure they are not exposed to material that is potentially harmful to them, and by law we have to prove that we are doing so.

    2. Re:Sigh. by jittles · · Score: 4, Insightful

      I can agree with most of those sentiments but, a keyboard logger? That just seems a bit extreme. Does your IT group log all keystrokes the students type?

    3. Re:Sigh. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Informative

      I also work in IT in a UK school.

      You're exactly right. Our kids have an iPad each through the school but it is made abundantly clear to them and their parents (who own the iTunes account, what with their 13+ age restriction) that we, the school, owns the device. They can do what they want on it, though there are exceptions whilst they attend: We block facetime, iMessage and a couple of others during school hours (which is an absolute PITA - apple do not provide good enough controls for this stuff) and prevent the device from installing any apps rated 13+ via a profile, which cannot be removed by them, only us through the admin interface. All apps used in classrooms are vetted to ensure they're not 13+ before being used, and we avoid apps with ads in as much as possible. That said, we can't stop everything. There are plenty of proxy apps out there. Our web filter (installed on the tubes, not the devices) is used to block them as and when we spot them, because they use them to access porn sometimes, and facebook the rest of the time. Nothing wrong with facebook? This is a discussion about privacy, so we'd want to block facebook anyway, but they're there to work and learn, not browse their feed.

      We do allow email, however. The encrypt all the things is causing some issues that have yet to be properly addressed on an official country-wide scale (afaik.)

      We use classroom management software (this FOIR came to me, in fact) but it doesn't do any keylogging or any of that bullshit. I'm a privacy advocate, and respect students (and indeed the staff) privacy. The CMS software is used by the teacher to witness and close down that odd game embedded in the excel spreadsheet that Johnny has on a USB drive (we allow those, too) that he is playing instead of working on web design stuff, and to take over the kids screens to show them a presentation or video or whatever, or do group things like project one kids work to the TV in the room or get them to complete a survey or whatever.

      We also have biometrics. Thumbprints for registration and the canteen (cashless school). I'm a bit iffy about this but it was installed before my time. Depending on politics and so on I'm going to look at removing the registration side... but mainly due to the cost and the ability for students to forget to register, messing with attendance data slightly. Though, I will say this about the biometrics: their fingerprints are not able to be used to identify the individual. You'll get away with around 4,000 people or so before the system starts seeing little Alice as our good friend Johnny from web design. The prints don't take enough points of data, and though, yes they can identify a student easily in a school, you can't use the data in a court of law as it's simply not good or reliable enough.

    4. Re:Sigh. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Getting the kids used to have their computer use monitored and recorded so that they'll be more accepting of it when its done to them as adults by the government?

    5. Re:Sigh. by BlueStrat · · Score: 2

      You're exactly right. Our kids have an iPad each through the school but it is made abundantly clear to them and their parents (who own the iTunes account, what with their 13+ age restriction) that we, the school, owns the device.

      What happens if parents refused to sign up for any accounts on behalf of their son/daughter-student? And/or refuse to sign for responsibility for the school-provided device(s) nor provide their own device(s)? If the student himself refuses to sign for responsibility/an account, or even take possession of the device(s)?

      Strat

      --
      Progressivism (aka US 'Liberalism'): Ideas so good they need a police/surveillance-state to enforce.
    6. Re:Sigh. by Sparowl · · Score: 1

      While I don't necessarily agree with it, I can see why - to see how students are getting around the filters. If you can find out how they got around it, you can find a way to stop it.

    7. Re:Sigh. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      The UK is f'd and has it's priorities wrong. The school should not be providing devices to students that violate there privacy. They should not be directing students to its own sites/services, third party products, sites, or services that collect, sell, provide to others, or utilize outside of the scope of the use for which it was provided information to others.

      Now- should a child visit a site outside of what a school/teacher has directed and information is collected, etc I have no problem with that. Educate students about the collection of information and risks to providing information, don't control students. We should let the learn and grow.

      Prohibiting access to random site x is always censorship and that is unethical. The government should stay out of the morality business. Pornography is not immoral or unethical, but might be inappropriate to the same extent playing video games is inappropriate.

      Gross, disgusting, scary, etc pictures are not unethical and even if it's something we should be shying our kids away from if they are scared its going overboard to censor everything that might frighten them. 'protecting' them and shielding them from the world is only doing a disservice to them. Its turning our kids into adults that need babysitters and 'safe spaces'. Adults who are unable to hold down jobs.

      This absurd over 'protection' is giving them this idea that the government has some obligation to protect its people outside the scope of war and provide for them services/food/TV/internet/housing/etc when it should not given its inability to do so without the use of force, violence, and theft to take what others have earned to do so.

      People have a need to survive and the majority should be left to provide for themselves and seek there there own means of protection. The government to the extent it exists should not take nor give and do the absolute minimums (maintain major roads until some other means can solve this problem, protect property rights, etc). There is a place for charity- but it's not within the realms of government as such charity via government is not really charity- it's theft/violence/and coercion.

      The ends do not justify the means.

    8. Re:Sigh. by SuricouRaven · · Score: 2

      We don't log keys, but we do log every application launched and site visited. It's mostly for after-the-fact investigations. When someone leaves pornographic printouts scattered around the corridoors as a joke (this has happened) or takes a picture of another student from the school website, draws a crude penis pointing in their mouth and labels it 'fag' (this has also happened) then we need every bit of evidence we can get to try to work out who was responsible - and to prove who was responsible when they accused then claims that they went to the toilet without logging out and someone else must have used their account.

    9. Re:Sigh. by SuricouRaven · · Score: 1

      I can tell you exactly what happens in that situation: The student doesn't get to use the computers. At all.

      I've never actually seen it happen, but I have seen new students stuck in that situation for a week while their parents keep forgetting to sign and return the usage agreement form.

    10. Re:Sigh. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      OP here, should have signed in to comment :/

      Some parents refuse the use of a device altogether (though we've only had two of these) and unfortunately, these students go without. But it's understandable, all material is available in a non-digital format anyway. The rest, we either control the device and account (they pick it up from us every morning and drop it off after school) or if the parent wants a device but doesn't want an account (which hasn't been the case yet) they would have a device and we control the account. They wouldn't have the password in either of the two latter cases..

    11. Re:Sigh. by ledow · · Score: 1

      Yeah, that's my ultimate plan.

      That's why I blocked fingerprint payments in the canteen.
      That's why I blocked ID cards and access cards for the kids.
      That's why I blocked use of their photographs on their accounts.
      That's why I block anything that hints of 1984.

      But THE LAW says I need to protect them from people finding out that same information. And that means their SCHOOL device, used FOR SCHOOL, bought BY THE SCHOOL, needs to be managed by THE SCHOOL. Amazing that. It says NOTHING about what the parents do with the child at home.

      (P.S. I removed my daughter from a nursery because they demanded fingerprints to allow parents access to the building...)

      The beauty and art in the book 1984 was not that a draconian society was formed. It's that it was a natural evolution of what happens when someone imagines that level of technology.

      Take your conspiracy theories elsewhere, no government is that highly organised and no school is part of a secret plot to brainwash your children (at least, not without getting caught - we don't even have that Creationism junk in schools over here because it's illegal to teach that rubbish!).

    12. Re:Sigh. by ledow · · Score: 1

      Correct.

      And nobody ever protests to the point that it doesn't happen.

      My current school even get around the "having to edit photographs for those children whose parents didn't consent" stuff - the school agreements basically says that by sending them to the school, you agree we can use their photo for school purposes. We still can't IDENTIFY the child (child protection again), but we don't have to sit and blank out faces from a photo of an assembly with 500+ kids.

    13. Re:Sigh. by ledow · · Score: 1

      I don't use keyloggers, but a lot of the "monitoring" software has that feature. Does that count as "we bought keyloggers"? Apparently so.

      And I can think of uses for them. Until you work in a rough school (e.g. where 16-year-old kids will throw a PC through a third-floor window because "why am I sitting GCSE computing, I'm gonna be a mechanic anyway, my dad said so", and then start a fight INSIDE AN EXAM ROOM to get out of it etc.), you have no idea of the shit that flies around. Even things like working on shared documents with other pupils, typing in THE WORST kind of threats ("will rape u", etc. to girls), insults and bullying and then deleting it before the teacher sees it.

      The usual use of them is in fact to detect grooming keywords, where younger pupils are typing in their personal details in chatrooms that they find that aren't blocked, and so on. It's for discovery, not 24/7 monitoring. When the keylogger sees things like A/S/L? they will flag it for review.

      Personally, I refuse them, but I have software with that capability. And I now work in the nicest school you can imagine (private primary school) with kids who are disciplined for failing to hold open a door for a member of staff.

    14. Re:Sigh. by jittles · · Score: 1

      We don't log keys, but we do log every application launched and site visited. It's mostly for after-the-fact investigations. When someone leaves pornographic printouts scattered around the corridoors as a joke (this has happened) or takes a picture of another student from the school website, draws a crude penis pointing in their mouth and labels it 'fag' (this has also happened) then we need every bit of evidence we can get to try to work out who was responsible - and to prove who was responsible when they accused then claims that they went to the toilet without logging out and someone else must have used their account.

      Sounds like you're doing exactly what you should be doing at a school, then. I'd mod your reply up if I could.

    15. Re:Sigh. by wildstoo · · Score: 2

      I work in IT in a UK school too.

      We don't do BYOD here. All student devices are school-owned and monitored. We use a (fairly popular) combined firewall/email/web filter appliance that filters the web pretty aggressively, because we have to comply with both UK and Scottish legislation on child protection.

      Under the new "Prevent" legislation, we even have a duty to monitor students use of web and email for signs of extremism! We're still waiting for the appliance vendor to roll out an update that will allow us to do this. If they don't, there's a good chance we'll have to switch to another provider.

      We don't use any form of classroom management software. Teachers cannot see what the kids are doing on the computers. This is mostly because teachers are treated like royalty here, and we are not allowed to implement anything that might "increase their workload", even when classroom management is obviously central to their jobs!

      We (the IT department) can connect to students and teachers' devices at any time and view and interact with their sessions, though they are notified when we connect. This is rarely used for policy enforcement, it just saves us having to hike between buildings when Prof. Forgetful has, for example, accidentally hidden his unread messages.

      We have biometrics for the cashless canteen too. Same as yours, the fingerprint is stored as a hash, not an image, so the fingerprint records are only useful for this specific system. We previously allowed parents to opt out of this system, but recently it became part of the admissions process (we're an independent school). Now, if you want your kid in this school, you must consent to biometric registration. We only had a couple of parents ever opt out anyway.

      All of these measures are enforced by our management teams and almost universally welcomed by parents. Obviously, all of this creates more work for our under-resourced IT department, but as GP points out we have absolutely no choice in the matter. None.

  10. Working in the UK Education Sector by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Without controls and monitoring students will look up "anything" and share "anything". Monitoring the internet use of children like this shouldn't be that different from how their monitored online at home, the same way a parent monitors what films they can watch, what "magazines" they can buy (if any children still want magazines).

    This is just an extension of good parenting. Most of the internet isn't suitable for children and some of it can be dangerous. Until they're old enough to know the difference and make those decisions I fully support schools trying to manage their access.

    If this is just a UK thing, and schools world wide just let children have unfiltered access to the internet then I think I prefer knowing that my future children will have the same protection at school as they do at home. School should be teaching parents about this software, how to manage their home computers, encourage their use in family spaces. Instead the school teachers are attacked as spies and the government tries to force a blanket wide "porn" ban on the entire population which doesn't solve the problem.

  11. This is common place in the US as well by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I work for a school district in technology, and this is nothing new. Every site that a user goes to is logged, employee and student accounts are both tracked. There is even an SSL middle man so they can see whats behind encrypted pages. They are probably reading me type this out at this very moment....

  12. Re:And this is a surprise? Why? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Agreed and not only that but it accustoms children to the "normal state" being one of constant, ubiquitous surveillance. When children are exposed to something from when they are little, they adapt to it and it becomes their normal state of the world.

  13. What a world, what a world! by reboot246 · · Score: 1

    Is this really the kind of world you want to live in?

    Well, unless you do something pretty soon, this is the world you're going to have and it will be getting worse not better.

  14. Better option by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Teachers 'Unwittingly' Spying ...

    Because 'unwittingly' helping children view adult porn, ISIS propganda, cyber-bullying, or distribute kiddie porn (because schoolgirls are entitled to be forgotten) is a better option? It's obvious why this is being done and it's easier to have one IT department handle all the traffic than demand that parents outsmart their children.

  15. Not News by WindowsStar · · Score: 1

    So???

  16. Challenge by b783719 · · Score: 2

    School: You can't do what you want on school computers. we have surveillance software too.

    Kids: Challenge Accepted!

    inb4TheRiseOfTwelveYearsOldScriptKiddies

  17. curso NR 10 by Instituto+Santa+Cata · · Score: 1

    Curso NR 10 online curso NR 10 curso NR 10 online

  18. Re:And this is a surprise? Why? by beastofburdon · · Score: 1

    Software like this is almost essential for managing a computer class, but I would be wary if there was software that actually collected data, but that hasn't been the case in my experience.

    If I were you I would read through the EULA's of all that software before I made such claims.