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Of 8 Tech Companies, Only Twitter Says It Would Refuse To Help Build Muslim Registry For Trump (theintercept.com)

On the campaign trail last year, President-elect Donald Trump said he would consider requiring Muslim-Americans to register with a government database. While he has back-stepped on a number of campaign promises after being elected president, Trump and his transition team have recently resurfaced the idea to create a national Muslim registry. In response, The Intercept contacted nine of the "most prominent" technology companies in the United States "to ask if they would sell their services to help create a national Muslim registry." Twitter was the only company that responded with "No." The Intercept reports: Even on a purely hypothetical basis, such a project would provide American technology companies an easy line to draw in the sand -- pushing back against any effort to track individuals purely (or essentially) on the basis of their religious beliefs doesn't take much in the way of courage or conviction, even by the thin standards of corporate America. We'd also be remiss in assuming no company would ever tie itself to such a nakedly evil undertaking: IBM famously helped Nazi Germany computerize the Holocaust. (IBM has downplayed its logistical role in the Holocaust, claiming in a 2001 statement that "most [relevant] documents were destroyed or lost during the war.") With all this in mind, we contacted nine different American firms in the business of technology, broadly defined, with the following question: "Would [name of company], if solicited by the Trump administration, sell any goods, services, information, or consulting of any kind to help facilitate the creation of a national Muslim registry, a project which has been floated tentatively by the president-elect's transition team?" After two weeks of calls and emails, only three companies provided an answer, and only one said it would not participate in such a project. A complete tally is below.

Facebook: No answer. Twitter: "No," and a link to this blog post, which states as company policy a prohibition against the use, by outside developers, of "Twitter data for surveillance purposes. Period." Microsoft: "We're not going to talk about hypotheticals at this point," and a link to a company blog post that states that "we're committed to promoting not just diversity among all the men and women who work here, but [...] inclusive culture" and that "it will remain important for those in government and the tech sector to continue to work together to strike a balance that protects privacy and public safety in what remains a dangerous time." Google: No answer. Apple: No answer. IBM: No answer. Booz Allen Hamilton: Declined to comment. SRA International: No answer.

28 of 588 comments (clear)

  1. Bad Headline by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Informative

    They were also the only one to give *any* answer.

    1. Re:Bad Headline by jellomizer · · Score: 4, Insightful

      I need to agree. The news loves to take "no comment" as an admission of guilt.
      Trump is very anti-journalism I can see things going two ways.
      1. Expansion of fake news and more emotional profit driven journalism.
      2. A renewed effort into making journalism a trusted source to get information free of trying to push a political bias.

      I would love to see #2 but I get the feeling we are just going to get more crap stories trying to get an emotional response vs forcing us to look at what is really said and in context.

      --
      If something is so important that you feel the need to post it on the internet... It probably isn't that important.
    2. Re: Bad Headline by Chaos+Incarnate · · Score: 5, Insightful

      The requirements are right there in the question: would you support creating a database to track people of a given religion? There's no tweak to the requirements that could make that a palatable task.

      --
      Benford's Corollary to Clarke's Law: "Any technology distinguishable from magic is insufficiently advanced."
    3. Re: Bad Headline by Bartles · · Score: 4, Insightful

      He's not anti journalism. He's anti shit-journalism, which this story clearly is.

    4. Re: Bad Headline by ShanghaiBill · · Score: 4, Insightful

      So a random email from a journalist landed in some PR drone's inbox. There were likely hundreds of other emails to deal with, and he or she spent 10 seconds writing a quick response while finishing a cup of stale coffee. You make it sound like this was an official statement of policy from Microsoft's Board of Directors, with BG himself consulted to help craft the appropriate response.

      This is just amateur ambush journalism being use to provoke outrage from idiots.

    5. Re:Bad Headline by flopsquad · · Score: 5, Insightful

      They were also the only one to give *any* answer.

      This, exactly. Look, Trump's Muslim tracking plan (and most everything else about Trump) is batshit crazy and not-even-trying-to-hide-it evil.

      BUT the fact that most huge companies don't wring their hands over responding to every question posed to them by random strangers is... common sense and completely unsurprising?

      I could just as easily send a flurry of questionnaires to the mail room of every Forbes 50 company asking whether they support genocide and puppy punting. Get one of them to write back "No, we think that's awful" and all of a sudden "Only 1 of 50 Top Companies is Opposed to Genocide and Puppy Punting."

      It's not even "gotcha" journalism--no one was gotten. MS said $formResponseToDiversityQuestion, and Twitter said "No." Everyone else didn't feel obligated to give these folks an answer.

      --
      Nothing posted to /. has ever been legal advice, including this.
    6. Re: Bad Headline by Wuhao · · Score: 5, Insightful

      This isn't shit journalism because it puts Trump in a bad light. It's shit journalism because it asks a loaded question, and attempts to make a story out of the landslide-majority of polled companies that didn't take the bait. It fits into a broader narrative in which Trump represents the second coming of Hitler, and everyone who does not unconditionally reject him is a neo-nazi.

      For decades, we were warned about the dangers of increasing media consolidation. And since the rise of online journalism, we've been warned that this new model does not support the kind of journalistic integrity we came to expect in our news. A decade ago, Fox News showed us that facts and integrity are not necessary to win viewers. Now the major outlets are controlled by a handful of entities, and they do not practice journalism as we once understood it. Those entities are in turn controlled by the ultra-wealthy. The ultra-wealthy have political agendas based on their wishes and needs. Because they live very different lives from everyone else, their agendas are unlikely to match the wishes and needs of the broader population. So the institution we relied upon to inform us in our democratic decision making is now in the business of pushing agendas that are unlikely to match the wishes and needs of the broader population.

      That's scary.

    7. Re:Bad Headline by Pieroxy · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Trump's Muslim tracking plan

      You can bitch all you want on this piece of garbage-journalism, they still got into your head making you believe there is such a plan. This is classic persuasion. Make people think about what should be their reaction *if* something would happen. You start thinking about your reaction and before you know it you've taken the something for granted.

    8. Re: Bad Headline by drew_kime · · Score: 4, Interesting

      You make it sound like this was an official statement of policy from Microsoft's Board of Directors, with BG himself consulted to help craft the appropriate response.

      It was an official response to a media inquiry. Nobody at Microsoft PR would do that without making sure it was the company's position.

      Why are you so determined to give them cover for this?

      --
      Nope, no sig
    9. Re:Bad Headline by flopsquad · · Score: 4, Informative
      Hell, I don't even have to go outside of my own post history to find the rebuttal.

      GS: "Are you unequivocally now ruling out a database on all Muslims?" Trump: "No, not at all"

      That was the final word on Trump's proposal to create a database to track all Muslims, which he had tried to backtrack to just "refugees". I'm not sure if it came before or after his idea that mosques need to be placed under surveillance.

      I can update that statement with some better dates. The instances I can find of Trump talking about tracking Muslims ("Ooops! What I said about Muslims wasn't about Muslims, but refugees, mainly Muslim ones, or not, except wink wink it's about Muslims!") occurred in (at least) November 2015. The instances I can find of Trump talking about surveilling mosques occurred in (at least) November 2015 and June 2016. The instances I can find of Trump saying he wanted to ban all Muslims from entering the country occurred in (at least) December 2015.

      I'd put in all the extra work to meticulously link all this stuff, where Donny is saying it, on video, but I assume you haven't been living under a rock for the last 18 months, and thus already know about it and have somehow rationalized it all away. Maybe the Lamestream Media had an evil Trump stunt double who was saying all that crazy bullshit on video? Or it was secretly Hillary in orangeface and a bad wig?

      Of course, we've all taken Trump too literally, which I learned just this week from the Lewmeister. Maybe trashing minorities of every stripe and giving the middle finger to women (which he bragged about doing in a grossly literal way) was just pleasant banter and he doesn't remember saying it. Or maybe he remembers saying it, but he didn't mean it because that's just how us Americans all talk around the dinner table and in the bar and in the locker room, "You know, Norm, there oughta be a way to track all those damn terr'ist moslems. Maybe like a number or something they have to wear all the time so we can know who the bad guys are."

      --
      Nothing posted to /. has ever been legal advice, including this.
    10. Re: Bad Headline by Dread_ed · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Nice post. It seem that modern journalism, instead of informing the public, is selling our biases back to us in a mad rush to produce page clicks. The result is an echo chamber effect on a national scale that balkanizes the electorate into self-selecting political entities, blind to the overall facts and hopelessly spun in the direction of their original predilections. See also the rise of Facebook as an adjunct to the news media, where users control what news they see by blocking uncomfortable or non-congruent sources.

      Not only does this create division, but the inherent bias that draws in the targeted groups serves as a mental barrier to entry for non-aligned groups. As long as there is a safe harbor for intellectually and politically similar ideas from one news source, and other sources violate the entrenched norms and standards with biased reporting designed for another group, mobility from one ideological clade to another is limited. Plainly stated, when news outlets produce content which is canted towards a politically limited audience the underlying facts are presented in a way that prevents consumption by individuals with non-aligned ideals. This produces extremely polarized individuals, not only blind to any other interpretations of the issues, but also belligerent to representatives and outlets that contradict their viewpoints.

      --
      When the only tool you have is a claw hammer every problem starts to look like the back of someone's skull.
  2. Those who something, something by Oxygen99 · · Score: 4, Insightful

    I think I speak for anyone who's read a history book when I say this is an absolutely awful idea. I know Twitter gets a lot of stick but well done them. If you're in favour of this then you're a fascist or you're an idiot. There's literally no middle ground. This is how it starts.

    --
    I had a dream, bright and carefree, but now there's doubt and gravity
    1. Re: Those who something, something by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Whether that out-group is Muslims or traditional Americans is up for debate.

      Would be hard to debate it without knowing what a traditional American is. For example, does being a Muslim rule you out from also being a traditional American? Does being an atheist? Does race or ethnicity come into it? Or are there just particular traditiona you have to observe? And is it every one on the list of traditions or just 7 out of 10 or so?

    2. Re: Those who something, something by guruevi · · Score: 4, Interesting

      Bush and Clinton tried to build one before, part of it eventually was used to become what we now know as the no-fly list. Obama had the chance to get rid of it and didn't. But I guess it's okay if the establishment does it.

      --
      Custom electronics and digital signage for your business: www.evcircuits.com
    3. Re: Those who something, something by ShanghaiBill · · Score: 4, Interesting

      Does being a Muslim rule you out from also being a traditional American?

      The first muslims arrived in Jamestown VA in the year 1619, aboard a Portuguese slave ship. That was a year before the Mayflower landed at Plymouth Rock.

    4. Re: Those who something, something by rmdingler · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Based on how I understand the teachings of Islam, being muslim excludes you from being anything else. It is their job, their purpose, to spread Islam and the Sharia law to every corner of the globe. Do you want America to remain the culture it is today? Islam - and by extension (an unknown sized subset of) muslims - does not.

      In every way, your statement is equally correct with Christianity and Christian substituted for Islam and Muslim.

      --
      Happiness in intelligent people is the rarest thing I know.

      Ernest Hemingway

    5. Re:Those who something, something by BlueStrat · · Score: 3, Interesting

      I think I speak for anyone who's read a history book when I say this is an absolutely awful idea. I know Twitter gets a lot of stick but well done them. If you're in favour of this then you're a fascist or you're an idiot. There's literally no middle ground. This is how it starts.

      This story is based on an NPR interview with Muzaffar Chishti who directs the Migration Policy Institute's office at NYU School of Law. So, we're talking about a Muslim professor at an extremely Left-wing university being interviewed by a Left-wing government-funded "news" service. Naturally there will be a balanced, fair, and unbiased tone regarding PE Trump in any reporting.

      They noted that Trump has made a number of statements, many contradictory, regarding the influx of immigrants, refugees, and temporary-visa visitors from nations known for harboring and exporting radical Islamic terrorists.

      Currently there are only minimal and mostly ineffective systems for vetting/screening these people and enforcing deportation of those who violate the conditions of their visas and/or overstay the temporary-visa limits. This IS a problem that needs to be addressed.

      They were not discussing, as many here attempt to imply, that Trump wants to 'register' every Muslim, including US citizens who have lived here their whole lives. They are talking about recent/current immigrants and visa applicants from regions that many radical Islamic terrorists call home. I'd call it common sense to keep better tabs on visitors/new immigrants from such regions, particularly as (like with Somalia) there are often no criminal or other databases from those regions with which to vet them against, or to even verify where they were born.

      If you think it's a good idea to just throw open the doors and let anyone into the US from those regions, can we place them all into your neighborhood/city? You may want to visit Londonistan and look around a bit before you answer.

      Strat

      --
      Progressivism (aka US 'Liberalism'): Ideas so good they need a police/surveillance-state to enforce.
    6. Re: Those who something, something by haruchai · · Score: 4, Insightful

      " It is their job, their purpose, to spread Islam and the Sharia law to every corner of the globe"
      that certainly sounds ominous. But then one should take a look at the history of the spread of Christianity.
      And the actions of America through its foreign policy & military. Or the actions of the colonial nations, Britain, France, Spain, Portugal, etc.

      --
      Pain is merely failure leaving the body
    7. Re: Those who something, something by angel'o'sphere · · Score: 4, Interesting

      Based on how I understand the teachings of Islam
      Then you should learn about islam.

      It is their job, their purpose, to spread 1) Islam and the 2)Sharia law to every corner of the globe.
      No it is not.

      1) it is their Puprose to spread islam to the unbelievers. Which are heathens and/or Pagans. Which excludes by definition Jews and Christians and other religions that believe in the same god as Muslims do.

      2) wrong on all accounts. Traditional islam has nothing to do with late middle ages Sharia Law. Sharia law is spread/held up by idiots that are still stuck in the middle ages. Hint: Christian law was not very different to Sharia law in the middle ages.

      Islam - and by extension (an unknown sized subset of) muslims - does not.
      That is an idiotic claim. Muslims that emigrated from muslim countries are usually those that don't want to live under Sharia but want to live in a free society. A free society where they can celebrate and interpret Islam as they see fit and not as the Imam sees fit. As it was e.g. during the high times of Islam, when that "world view" was the most advanced of the planet, when science, medicine, art and philosophy where at their prime.

      But you likely never have heard about those times.

      --
      Cost free eBook I read (by iBook/Kobo/Amazon/ObookO/Gutenberg etc.): "The Green Odyssey" by Philip Jose Farmer.
    8. Re: Those who something, something by 0100010001010011 · · Score: 4, Interesting

      It is their job, their purpose, to spread Islam and the Sharia law to every corner of the globe.

      Exactly, as the Quran says:

      “And he said to them, “Go into all the world and proclaim the gospel to the whole creation. Whoever believes and is baptized will be saved, but whoever does not believe will be condemned.'” - Mark 16:15-16

      “And this gospel of the kingdom will be preached in all the world as a witness to all the nations, and then the end will come.” - Matthew 24:14 NKJV

      And what about those that are sinners?

      Now therefore, kill every male among the little ones, and kill every woman who has known man intimately. But all the girls who have not known man intimately, spare for yourselves - Numbers 31:17-18

      And let us not forget how the Quran deals with unruly children:

      If a man have a stubborn and rebellious son, which will not obey the voice of his father, or the voice of his mother, and that, when they have chastened him, will not hearken unto them: Then shall his father and his mother lay hold on him, and bring him out unto the elders of his city, and unto the gate of his place; And they shall say unto the elders of his city, This our son is stubborn and rebellious, he will not obey our voice; he is a glutton, and a drunkard. And all the men of his city shall stone him with stones, that he die. Deuteronomy 21:18-21

      And what if someone mentions other faiths?

      If your very own brother, or your son or daughter, or the wife you love, or your closest friend secretly entices you, saying, “Let us go and worship other gods” (gods that neither you nor your ancestors have known, 7 gods of the peoples around you, whether near or far, from one end of the land to the other), 8 do not yield to them or listen to them. Show them no pity. Do not spare them or shield them. 9 You must certainly put them to death. Your hand must be the first in putting them to death, and then the hands of all the people. 10 Stone them to death, because they tried to turn you away from the Lord your God, who brought you out of Egypt, out of the land of slavery. 11 Then all Israel will hear and be afraid, and no one among you will do such an evil thing again. - Deuteronomy 13

      At least I swear that was the Quran, I always get my fairy tales mixed up.

    9. Re:Those who something, something by BlueStrat · · Score: 3, Informative

      PS. When exactly did you realise you were a fascist?

      When exactly did you realize you have no intelligent or cognizant refutation and so chose to fall back on juvenile name-calling? Way to keep it classy, AmiMoJo!

      And we do keep tabs on domestic gang members in places like Chicago and L.A. where gang violence is a problem. Police keep extensive records including photographic records of gang member's tatoos. Can we not demand at least this much scrutiny of people from regions known for terrorism asking to enter the US and who have no background data to speak of with which to vet them against?

      Seeing as how one of the Federal Government's main duties is to secure national borders and screen those entering and all that, it seems like asking them to do that in a competent and effective way would be the farthest thing from 'controversial'.

      Strat

      --
      Progressivism (aka US 'Liberalism'): Ideas so good they need a police/surveillance-state to enforce.
    10. Re:Those who something, something by BlueStrat · · Score: 4, Insightful

      What does this have to do with immigration? Border controls are one thing, but you said "keep better tabs on", as in watch them once they are inside the country. That requires extensive surveillance. And not just immigrants, visitors too.

      You don't even seem to understand the implication of what you are saying.

      Apparently you've never traveled internationally much. Almost every other nation on the planet keeps far closer watch over people entering/visiting/immigrating to their countries and while they are there than does the US. The US has one of the most open and liberal immigration/visa systems of any nation and keeps far fewer tabs on them once here than almost any other nation.

      You talk like implementing sane foreign visitation/immigration policies are equivalent to going full-'Big-Brother'. It's hyperventilating like yours that prevents rational debate. Of course, derailing rational debate may be the goal.

      Strat

      --
      Progressivism (aka US 'Liberalism'): Ideas so good they need a police/surveillance-state to enforce.
  3. Re:Bullshit article by gtall · · Score: 4, Insightful

    More to the point, the lawyers of 7 out of 8 companies advised their clients to STFU and hope the issue goes away.

  4. Re:No More Muslims by PopeRatzo · · Score: 5, Funny

    We're fighting back. Fuck you SJWs and leftards, we're gonna build the wall and camps.

    Last time you guys tried that, SJWs and leftards kicked your ass all the way back to the bunker, Adolf.

    --
    You are welcome on my lawn.
  5. Alternative headline. by jgullstr · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Out of 8 tech companies, not one says it would help build Muslim registry for Trump.

  6. Trump on extreme vetting by unixisc · · Score: 4, Informative

    No, he never did. His original proposal was a blanket ban on all Muslim immigration, which is not unconstitutional. That then ultimately morphed into extreme vetting, where nobody who hates the country would be allowed in. (It's another thing that we can't throw out the Jeremiah Wrights, Louis Farrakhans, Keith Ellisons and Bill Ayres' out of the country: that would be unconstitutional, b'cos unfortunately, they are already citizens.)

    And I don't see how any of these 'tech' companies can make any such lists. It's not difficult to open fake identities on Facebook, Twitter, Instagram and all other social media sites. I have only one Facebook account, which is not under my actual name, and has no actual personal information. Such a thing would have to be done by the DHS, but again, since religion is not one of the questions that anyone gets asked, it would have to be introduced.

    I do think there is a way of achieving something close. Current immigration application forms ask people whether they are, or have ever been members of the Nazi party, blah blah blah. Change that to questions like whether they support Shariah law and spreading it to non-Muslim countries like the US, whether they support honor killings, et al. It's true that nobody who does will honestly answer it, but here's the rub: if any immigrant does say no to the above questions and then go on to do anything to the contrary, it would be grounds for instant deportation. The beauty of it is that it doesn't even ask if one is Muslim, so if someone is a foreign Noam Chomsky trying to get in, and after getting in, publishes stuff in support of Hamas or al Qaeda, that will be instant grounds for deportation. Once we have SCOTUS filled w/ originalists, instead of hacks like Ruth Bader Ginsburg.

    1. Re:Trump on extreme vetting by lgw · · Score: 5, Interesting

      And I don't see how any of these 'tech' companies can make any such lists.

      Oh, you're wrong there. Google and Facebook both know every Muslim who's been online in the US (to some imperfect but high degree of precision and accuracy). They already have the "Muslim registry", not to mention, Christian, Jewish, atheist, etc registry. It's their core business.

      I spent an hour once chatting with one of Google's professional racists. His job was racial discrimination*: analyze every "signal" from your browsing habits, search history, gmail, etc to determine your race. No different for religion, income, etc. They were quite good at it. Of course, Google has no intent for this more nefarious than targeted advertisement. But the database exists, and it's a US company.

      *discrimination - n. The ability or power to see or make fine distinctions; discernment.

      --
      Socialism: a lie told by totalitarians and believed by fools.
  7. Re:False dichotomy by alexo · · Score: 3, Interesting

    In the last election, while not the only choices, were the major choices.

    And that's the problem right there.

    Your problem is not Trump or Clinton. It's a system that culminated in a choice between two candidates which a large portion of your countrymen believe are both unsuitable for the job.

    Address the cause, not the symptoms.