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Inside Uber's Aggressive, Unrestrained Workplace Culture (cnbc.com)

Excerpts from Mike Isaac's report for the New York Times: Interviews with more than 30 current and former Uber employees, as well as reviews of internal emails, chat logs and tape-recorded meetings, paint a picture of an often unrestrained workplace culture. Among the most egregious accusations from employees, who either witnessed or were subject to incidents and who asked to remain anonymous because of confidentiality agreements and fear of retaliation: One Uber manager groped female co-workers' breasts at a company retreat in Las Vegas. A director shouted a homophobic slur at a subordinate during a heated confrontation in a meeting. Another manager threatened to beat an underperforming employee's head in with a baseball bat. Until this week, this culture was only whispered about in Silicon Valley. Then on Sunday, Susan Fowler, an engineer who left Uber in December, published a blog post about her time at the company. [...] One group appeared immune to internal scrutiny, the current and former employees said. Called the A-Team and composed of a small group of executives who were personally close to Mr. Kalanick, its members were shielded from much accountability over their actions. One member of the A-Team was Emil Michael, senior vice president for business, who was caught up in a public scandal over comments he made in 2014 about digging into the private lives of journalists who opposed the company. Mr. Kalanick defended Mr. Michael, saying he believed Mr. Michael could learn from his mistakes.

192 comments

  1. the enron of this generation by known_coward_69 · · Score: 5, Insightful

    loses money

    sex fueled culture

    no definitive product

    1. Re:the enron of this generation by Presto+Vivace · · Score: 2

      mod this up!

    2. Re:the enron of this generation by Narcocide · · Score: 3, Funny

      Also describes the entirety of social networking.

    3. Re:the enron of this generation by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      This must be what happens when they only hire people that pass with the "green" color on their test. Who knew that yellows and blues had valuable social and self-moderating skills.

    4. Re:the enron of this generation by TheGratefulNet · · Score: 1

      uhm, burma shave??

      --

      --
      "It is now safe to switch off your computer."
    5. Re:the enron of this generation by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      they need to go full enron by having employees take uber rides in circles around the building

    6. Re:the enron of this generation by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      loses money

      sex fueled culture

      no definitive product

      Don't forget: everyone in financial power in the existing industry fucking loves it.

  2. motivation by l3v1 · · Score: 1

    "Another manager threatened to beat an underperforming employee's head in with a baseball bat."

    Now, that's what must be a highly motivating work environment :/

    One must wonder how their hiring process works, i.e. letting such characters through the gates, since recent reports don't paint a pretty picture.

    --
    I am putting myself to the fullest possible use, which is all I can think that any conscious entity can ever hope to do.
    1. Re:motivation by Fire_Wraith · · Score: 4, Interesting

      It probably doesn't get highlighted in the hiring process. Most people don't brag about that in interviews - the misbehavior comes out later.

      In most companies, someone pulls a stunt like any of the ones listed here, and they're quickly smacked down, or fired outright (depending on the incident). Judging by the rumors and reports of incidents at Uber, that wasn't the case there. Instead, HR seems to have been told to ignore and protect "high performers" in a penny-wise/pound-foolish policy that leads to the sort of culture like you see described. What happens is that when people don't get punished for the first few things, they start to realize that the normal limits don't apply, and the bad sorts start pushing the envelope. Eventually you get a workplace culture where all sorts of stuff is tolerated, and you wind up with a toxic work environment.

    2. Re:motivation by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      From the tone around here these days, I'm sure they have no problem finding idiots that think common decency is beneath them.

    3. Re:motivation by Archangel+Michael · · Score: 4, Funny

      "The beatings will continue until morale improves!"

      --
      Agent K: A *person* is smart. People are dumb, stupid, panicky animals, and you know it.
    4. Re:motivation by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      "A director shouted a homophobic slur"

      Unbelievable. I would expect an individual of that caliber to speak more clearly.

    5. Re:motivation by Notabadguy · · Score: 1

      "Another manager threatened to beat an underperforming employee's head in with a baseball bat."

      Now, that's what must be a highly motivating work environment :/

      One must wonder how their hiring process works, i.e. letting such characters through the gates, since recent reports don't paint a pretty picture.

      That sounds like the sort of thing where someone is quoting Bon Qui Qui (Mad TV; https://www.youtube.com/watch?...) and says, "I will cut you!" or something, and the receiving end takes it as a threat.

      Granted: The first rule of public speaking (or just about any kind of presentation) is to Know Your Audience. KYA. Applies to everything. You shouldn't tell jokes to people who may not get them, or may take offense at them...unless you're a stand-up comic. KYA. But that sort of professionalism isn't taught at any MBA school, and we have an entire generation or two of managers who are missing fundamental characteristics of leadership.

    6. Re:motivation by MightyMartian · · Score: 3, Insightful

      A homosexual slur is likely to get a very strong reprimand. Threatening to beat someone up or grabbing someone's breasts is almost certainly going to see you escorted off the premises. Uber sounds like one fucking terrible place to work.

      --
      The world's burning. Moped Jesus spotted on I50. Details at 11.
    7. Re:motivation by quantaman · · Score: 4, Insightful

      "Another manager threatened to beat an underperforming employee's head in with a baseball bat."

      Now, that's what must be a highly motivating work environment :/

      One must wonder how their hiring process works, i.e. letting such characters through the gates, since recent reports don't paint a pretty picture.

      It's not the hiring process that's creating the problem, it's senior management. Management would have heard about the incident (or similar ones), and they had the ability to discipline both the manager to grabbed the baseball bat as well as his manager who didn't do anything about it. Instead they let the incident go, perhaps even laughing about it and treating it as an example of a passionate manager motivating his people.

      It's like corruption in Russia, they didn't get that way by hiring corrupt government officials, they got that way by demonstrating, at the very top, that corruption was tolerated. That same baseball bat manager might have been a perfectly decent manager in a different organization, or weeded out if he couldn't play along, but put in an organization that didn't restrain his tendencies he becomes a menace.

      --
      I stole this Sig
    8. Re:motivation by PopeRatzo · · Score: 3, Insightful

      What happens is that when people don't get punished for the first few things, they start to realize that the normal limits don't apply, and the bad sorts start pushing the envelope.

      You have just described our entire political and economic system. The "bad sorts" have pushed the envelope right to the top..

      --
      You are welcome on my lawn.
    9. Re:motivation by chispito · · Score: 1

      In most companies, someone pulls a stunt like any of the ones listed here, and they're quickly smacked down, or fired outright (depending on the incident).

      Unfortunately, I don't think it's the incident that determines the response, it's the pay grade of the offender.

      --
      The Daddy casts sleep on the Baby. The Baby resists!
    10. Re:motivation by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      What happens is that when people don't get punished for the first few things, they start to realize that the normal limits don't apply, and the bad sorts start pushing the envelope. Eventually you get a workplace culture where all sorts of stuff is tolerated, and you wind up with a toxic work environment.

      Seems to be playing out right now in the Executive branch.

    11. Re:motivation by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Pinning for the summer days of 2016 when you still had someone to point the finger at eh?

    12. Re:motivation by tanimislam · · Score: 0

      "Another manager threatened to beat an underperforming employee's head in with a baseball bat." Now, that's what must be a highly motivating work environment :/ One must wonder how their hiring process works, i.e. letting such characters through the gates, since recent reports don't paint a pretty picture.

      Here's a modest proposal: after something like that is reported, publicize it on youtube, and refer to the offender by his or her social security number or home address.

    13. Re:motivation by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      My uncle was once hit by a desk phone thrown by his manager in the office. He retired on the settlement at the age of 43. Has houses on three continents.

    14. Re:motivation by avandesande · · Score: 1

      Sorry but this is probably just the culture there. If I had an okay but 'broey' guy or gal in a interview I would probably pass and wait for a normal person.

      --
      love is just extroverted narcissism
    15. Re:motivation by jedidiah · · Score: 1

      We still have legacy polices in place that readily allow for that.

      --
      A Pirate and a Puritan look the same on a balance sheet.
    16. Re:motivation by jedidiah · · Score: 1

      > It's like corruption in Russia,

      That's funny because "Russian corruption" goes back way further than Putin.

      --
      A Pirate and a Puritan look the same on a balance sheet.
    17. Re:motivation by ScentCone · · Score: 1

      Let me guess: you think that everything that's wrong with the country happened in the last four weeks, and is Trump's fault. So, you'd be totally OK with everything that's been wrong for the last eight years being entirely Obama's fault, right? No? I see.

      --
      Don't disappoint your bird dog. Go to the range.
    18. Re:motivation by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      "Another manager threatened to beat an underperforming employee's head in with a baseball bat."

      Now, that's what must be a highly motivating work environment :/

      Isn't this normal? Big tech companies are full of high pressure. Everyone is on drugs or they're alcoholics. Burnout is high and people on the edge of cracking seems normal where I work.

    19. Re:motivation by meta-monkey · · Score: 1

      manager to grabbed the baseball bat

      It doesn't say he actually grabbed a baseball bat. Needs context. I wouldn't be shocked if this were an "aww, man, I'm gonna kill whoever didn't reload the printer, haha!" that when it's time to get someone fired/smeared is reported as "Bob threatened to murder employees who didn't complete tasks properly."

      --
      We don't have a state-run media we have a media-run state.
    20. Re:motivation by The+Snowman · · Score: 1

      Another manager threatened to beat an underperforming employee's head in with a baseball bat.

      Now, that's what must be a highly motivating work environment :/

      One must wonder how their hiring process works, i.e. letting such characters through the gates, since recent reports don't paint a pretty picture.

      Negan will hire anyone, but loves to bash in heads with a baseball bat. One could certainly call "perform well so you do not die" to be a highly-motivated work environment.

      --
      24 beers in a case, 24 hours in a day. Coincidence? I think not!
    21. Re:motivation by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Where in his response did he say anything about Putin?

    22. Re:motivation by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Ah, somebody's so terribly upset that they can't blame Obama for everything, even being out of toilet tissue any more, aren't they?

      It's ok sweetheart, your little temper tantrums are just what we expected.

    23. Re:motivation by ScentCone · · Score: 1

      Hey, look! Somebody with reading comprehension and cognitive problems attempting to spin something in a childish way, and feeling smug! Which is exactly how the Democrats managed their last several elections, resulting in the loss of over 1000 legislative seats, both houses of congress, the White House, and the Supreme Court. But please, carry on! That would be awesome. Thanks.

      --
      Don't disappoint your bird dog. Go to the range.
    24. Re:motivation by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      It doesn't say he actually grabbed a baseball bat. Needs context. I wouldn't be shocked if this were an "aww, man, I'm gonna kill whoever didn't reload the printer, haha!" that when it's time to get someone fired/smeared is reported as "Bob threatened to murder employees who didn't complete tasks properly."

      True story: I worked for a government entity; somebody fucked up and restored an entire volume instead of an account. It went physical almost immediately with half the team having to pull them apart.

    25. Re:motivation by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Oh wait, what's that sound? That's the sound of you desperately telling us how the realization that you actually have to deliver on your promises is causing you to pout like a toddler.

      Reminds me of a kookaburra.

    26. Re:motivation by ScentCone · · Score: 1

      Yeah, he'll never get around, for example, to orders reducing regulatory burdens. Oh, right! Already done. Or any movement at all to start to undo the financial stranglehold that Obamacare has put onto people forced to fear IRS enforcement if they don't go broke buying insurance they can't use ... oh, right! Already done, with more under way. I guess we could run down the long list, but you already know it and you're pretending you don't so you can engage in more lefty denialism. Carry on! It obviously is your coping mechanism.

      --
      Don't disappoint your bird dog. Go to the range.
    27. Re: motivation by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Ah, now you're doing the bleating of a Pyranese Mountain Goat.

      Still waving your little Trump flag? Wave it faster, then you can see the secret code.

    28. Re:motivation by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You mean orders exposing the public to greater risk from a lack of oversight by the proper agencies, aided by a misguided hiring freeze, a wild declaration of "Repeal Repeal Repeal" with no actual effective replacement in sight. You could run down the list, and you'd be exposed for your frauds and lies. The President you so richly endorse couldn't even handle his beloved yet ill-thought-out executive order without ducking responsibilities all along, blaming it on judges, his predecessor, and denying the burdens it caused.

      But don't worry, I'm sure he wasn't lying about his inauguration, his national security adviser, and that whole bit about promoting his daughter's clothing like was entirely appropriate. It's all the media's fault that the Mexicans won't pay for the wall.

  3. "Rape, murder, arson, and rape." by ZecretZquirrel · · Score: 1

    The four unwritten core values.

    1. Re:"Rape, murder, arson, and rape." by Captain+Splendid · · Score: 1

      You said 'rape' twice...

      --
      Linux, you magnificent bastard, I read the fucking manual!
    2. Re:"Rape, murder, arson, and rape." by R3d+M3rcury · · Score: 2
    3. Re:"Rape, murder, arson, and rape." by fahrbot-bot · · Score: 1

      You said 'rape' twice...

      Looking at another menu, I'd say there's not much rape in this item.

      --
      It must have been something you assimilated. . . .
  4. Re:I was raped there by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Poe's law style troll is not very funny.

  5. Not Employees? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    How does a company that doesn't have employees have a workplace culture at all?

    1. Re:Not Employees? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      your question is stupid and you should feel stupid

    2. Re:Not Employees? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0
  6. What about Google and Facebook? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I can't wait to read stories about the shenanigans going on at these companies.

  7. Uber, or the Mob? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    "Another manager threatened to beat an underperforming employee's head in with a baseball bat. "

    That's it, I'm sending them a resume and github link

  8. Goes both ways by Notabadguy · · Score: 5, Interesting

    And my ex-manager (woman) was at a poker game at my house, raving drunk and after losing a hand to me, threw a handful of ceramic poker chips in my face as hard as she could. Not that it surprised anyone because she occasionally comes to work drunk. Not that anyone will do anything about it because she's a she.

    And then there's the manager of our finance department (black woman) who doesn't feel unprofessional screaming at me on the phone and calling me names - while I'm on speaker phone with her - while people in other offices come to listen in amazement. She developed a billing workflow for our entire business unit, and after deploying it at the END OF THE QUARTER with no testing - which caused no end of headaches - I dug through to figure out the errors, drafted a corrective action plan to fix it and sent it to her - which culminated in this legendary phone conversation where she was screaming at me on the phone about how I was too stupid to figure out how to use the workflow...

    I documented all of this, got supporting statements from my colleagues, and went to HR - who basically said that she's untouchable because she's a minority and a woman. I work for GE; not exactly a small-time company. We have all the expected training, HR-enforced compliance...hell, when someone does something that grabs the attention of a regulatory body in a bad way, people get fired. The people involved get fired. The people who weren't involved but heard about it punitive career action for not proactively taking steps to report it up the chain of command. The people who weren't involved and didn't hear about it, but were in a position that they theoretically SHOULD have heard or known about it get formally reprimanded.

    But God help that there be a woman, or for double damage a minority woman...and rules go out the window.

    1. Re:Goes both ways by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      ...HR - who basically said that she's untouchable because she's a minority and a woman. I work for GE...

      That there is the reason why affirmative action gets the bad rap it does, and why productive and capable people from protected categories are burdened by being thrown into the same category as AA appointments.

    2. Re:Goes both ways by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0, Insightful

      So...is she an ex-manager because you moved on, or someone did something about that behavior? That said, your tone really stands out as misogynistic. Not saying you are, but it just comes across that way. Perhaps, it was the rant about affirmative action and focused on women and minorities, and just a wide set of generalizations without any hint of nuance.

      That said, I'd have taken the easy way out, if HR told me what you claim they told you, and sue. Especially, if she had been abusive to you. Jackpot!

    3. Re:Goes both ways by mdm-adph · · Score: 3, Funny

      Don't meet with your managers in your off-time, at your house, for anything, especially if they're women

      If someone screams at you on the phone hang up

      These are great suggestions

      --
      It is by my will alone my thoughts acquire motion; it is by the juice of the coffee bean that the thoughts acquire speed
    4. Re:Goes both ways by ISoldat53 · · Score: 1

      Sometimes it is expected that you socialize with co-workers in the off time. Failure to do so can result in you being branded "not a team player."

    5. Re:Goes both ways by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      >Don't meet with your managers in your off-time,
          Christmas parties, etc. Sometimes there is some 'get-together' (especially in a tight-knit & friendly office), and the unwanted person will show up.

      >If someone screams at you on the phone hang up
          Yes, but if that person can fire you on a whim- sometimes one will 'just listen' while the other person vent, (especially if there are others listening & it helps validate the myth of this person's tirades). Are you even married?

    6. Re: Goes both ways by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      And there we have it. The reason all this PC stuff is counterproductive to the very people it is supposed to help.

    7. Re:Goes both ways by MightyMartian · · Score: 4, Informative

      It's one thing to go to the corner pub, or to go to lunch once in a while. I honestly would never hang out with a manager at their house.

      --
      The world's burning. Moped Jesus spotted on I50. Details at 11.
    8. Re:Goes both ways by Notabadguy · · Score: 5, Interesting

      So...is she an ex-manager because you moved on, or someone did something about that behavior?

      I got the fuck out. I took a demotion and a pay raise and moved to another team....which was difficult because of the "You're my best project manager so I'm going to give you a shitty performance review so that you have to stay on my team and make me look good" problem.

      That said, I'd have taken the easy way out, if HR told me what you claim they told you, and sue. Especially, if she had been abusive to you. Jackpot!

      One doesn't really sue GE. Especially an individual...or at least me - with a fairly long military career behind me, where I've been called worse and hurt worse. I'm just pointing out that it goes both ways. Stories like mine don't make national media...unless I'm a woman. Then I can blog about it, sue my employer for sexual discrimination, and even when a court rules against me - still make national headlines.

      That said, your tone really stands out as misogynistic. Not saying you are, but it just comes across that way. Perhaps, it was the rant about affirmative action and focused on women and minorities,

      No - not a misogynist....this story is about men mistreating women in a corporate culture. Stories like this make national headlines. The reverse stories do not. Just like domestic violence - news only reports one side of it. http://www.huffingtonpost.com/...

      What's her name accuses men at Uber of sexually harassing and holding her down and it makes national news. I report women at GE assaulting and physically abusing me, and I'm a misogynist. See my point?

    9. Re:Goes both ways by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      >...stands out as misogynistic...

      AHHH HAA!! It does not come across that way. Those two example the poster give make perfect sense to those in a professional environment & held to some social/professional standards. Do you hear misogyny merely because you hear a gender being mentioned? It's important to the story. You're literally looking for fault, (which describes the posters double-standard exactly).

      TWO FACTS:
      - The article is about unrestrained workplace culture.
      - The poster calls two incidents where unrestrained professionals act beneath any office's standard, yet remain untouchable. While the other staff are held to the high-standard.

      WHY THAT'S RELEVENT:
      - Poster and all other professionals are bound by a code of ethics, behavior, manners- (call it what you will).
      - Those things are in place to keep everyone on the same page, and prevent exactly what the article & poster's two tales have shown can happen.
      - And when it does happen it's usually bad news for those that engage in Unrestrained Workplace Culture, but poster offers two cases where people can dish it out but and ride roughshod with their own brand of Workplace Culture yet the tools for the staff to protect themselves are on hold, thanks to PC culture.
      - Similar to your comment & notice of a gender buzzword, people protecting themselves by 'calling out' a true offender get themselves labeled as prejudiced, misogynistic, and boat-rockers who should just be quiet.
      - Although you wrote nicely, and allowed for the possibility of poster's non-misogyny, something tells me you are very distant from the professional world and that's why you focused on the one tiny glimmer of hope you had to school somebody...

    10. Re:Goes both ways by nine-times · · Score: 2

      I documented all of this, got supporting statements from my colleagues, and went to HR - who basically said that she's untouchable because she's a minority and a woman.

      I don't understand why you say, "Goes both ways". It seems like the same problem. Someone is abusive at work, but getting away with it due to poor management. This isn't "going both ways", it's "going the same way".

      Unless you're just trying to make some kind of "I hate 'political correctness' and affirmative action!" argument, in which case, that's kind of off-topic.

    11. Re:Goes both ways by Cyberpunk+Reality · · Score: 1, Insightful

      You did the same thing she did, and got an almost identical response. (Shitty HR! Who could have imagined!) She responded to that by eventually going public. You whined about it from passive-aggressive pseudonym on Slashdot.

      --
      Rule 35 of the internet: "If it can be hacked, it will be". - Charles Stross
    12. Re:Goes both ways by fahrbot-bot · · Score: 1

      Maybe they don't read /. and think you're a bad guy :-)

      --
      It must have been something you assimilated. . . .
    13. Re:Goes both ways by fahrbot-bot · · Score: 1

      If someone screams at you on the phone hang up

      Someone should pass that advise along to the Prime Minister of Australia. :-)

      --
      It must have been something you assimilated. . . .
    14. Re:Goes both ways by AmiMoJo · · Score: 0, Troll

      Ah, unsubstantiated anecdotes, those will do in place of actual data. No no, don't worry about naming the company or anything that might let someone verify or refute your claims, we will just take your word for it.

      FWIW the one time I've personally known anyone to get fired for being drunk it was a black guy. I don't read anything at all into that, it's just a meaningless data point. It does cancel out your anecdote though, so at least we are at neutral buoyancy again.

      --
      const int one = 65536; (Silvermoon, Texture.cs)
      SJW, n: "Someone I don't like, and by the way I'm a fuckwit" - AC
    15. Re:Goes both ways by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      My wife is Hispanic. Her co-worker is black. Her co-worker took over 300 hours of spontaneous "vacation" in 2016. The not so funny running joke is "I wonder if she'll be at work today?" She has never been written up for it. She only receives verbal reprimands which are not binding. She works "overtime" (working outside the normal working hours) to catch up on the work she failed to complete because she wasn't there and when she is there she spends the majority of her time texting. When my wife tries to take vacation she has earned they fight it because they know if she doesn't come in no work will get done at all. Even when she does take a day off they call her all day asking how to do something. She's accrued over 100 hours of sick leave as well but can't use that unless she's unable to get out of bed sick. There is definitely an unwritten "hands off" policy when it comes to certain minorities.

    16. Re: Goes both ways by Type44Q · · Score: 1

      And... way to go, accidentally admitting that you didn't actually read through any of what you claim to refute. He mentioned the fucking company, shithead: GE.

    17. Re:Goes both ways by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      I documented all of this, got supporting statements from my colleagues, and went to HR - who basically said that she's untouchable because she's a minority and a woman.

      Bullshit
      I can tell you want it to due to affirmative action, but I don't believe that they would tell you that, even if it was.

    18. Re: Goes both ways by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Perhaps in some organisations or perhaps your wife's perspective isn't fully informed and your's is even less so but you're making the mistake of thinking you can judge a situation you are woefully unprepared to judge on anyway.

    19. Re:Goes both ways by Ryanrule · · Score: 1

      Name names or fuck off.

    20. Re: Goes both ways by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      My mother has multiple similar stories about her days in ATnT

    21. Re:Goes both ways by jedidiah · · Score: 1

      No. It does go both ways. It's only acknowledged when the victim is acceptable. Otherwise it gets ignored. There's a particular narrative and anything that falls outside of that narrative will be ignored, belittled, or denied.

      This very article is the perfect example of this "narrative curation" in action.

      --
      A Pirate and a Puritan look the same on a balance sheet.
    22. Re:Goes both ways by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Have you tried just getting thicker skin? Maybe you don't belong in this industry.

    23. Re:Goes both ways by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      No, that's not even remotely close. She wrote a very public blog with specific accusations and while claiming she has evidence, she provided none. He relayed a story without expecting anything from it. I also fail to see why his screen name is considered "passive aggressive". Does his screen name hurt your feelgoods?

    24. Re:Goes both ways by thegarbz · · Score: 1

      That depends entirely on the manager and your relationship with them. Not everyone is a career oriented thunder**** and this goes for both managers and people.

    25. Re:Goes both ways by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Annual Review Score: 2/5 - Needs Improvement
      Summary: While MightyMartian is a highly skilled developer, he is not a team player and has trouble fitting in with the team.

      HR Recommendation: Enroll in PIP with 60 day review for termination.

    26. Re:Goes both ways by nine-times · · Score: 2

      Ok, so what's the "other way" that it goes? In the one case, you have "aggressive behavior by an employee goes unchecked because of poor management." What's the other way?

      Are you interpreting one of the examples to be "aggressive behavior by management goes unchecked because of poor employee behavior"? Because then it would make sense to say, "It goes both ways." But I feel like, in both cases, it's a problem of bad management.

    27. Re:Goes both ways by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      And he got called a misogynist for it. Imagine the screaming, doxxing, continuous abuse he would have experienced if he went public.

    28. Re:Goes both ways by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I documented all of this, got supporting statements from my colleagues...

      As soon as you even have to consider doing this, it is time to start looking for another job. Such workplaces are toxic.

    29. Re:Goes both ways by serviscope_minor · · Score: 1

      No - not a misogynist....this story is about men mistreating women in a corporate culture.

      It sounds from the summary that male and female employees are being mistreated, so why are you making this claim?

      --
      SJW n. One who posts facts.
    30. Re:Goes both ways by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      It sure is easy for an incompetent manager or person in HR to claim that they are not doing their job because of the color of someone's skin, and then get believed by gullible people. From the manager's POV there is no actual problem because your wife is a doormat who takes up the slack. When she stands up for herself and demands her vacation days, as legally entitled, her manager might decide that she needs a better co-worker and then will lift a finger.

    31. Re:Goes both ways by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Your tone really stands-out as nibbarized bat-shit phony. Female nibbars are known for their swinish behavior. Mebby somebody puts a bat to your slutish face.

    32. Re: Goes both ways by Notabadguy · · Score: 1

      It was a poker game - at my house - with most of our department - and it was our Christmas get-together.

    33. Re:Goes both ways by mjwx · · Score: 1

      No - not a misogynist....this story is about men mistreating women in a corporate culture.

      It sounds from the summary that male and female employees are being mistreated, so why are you making this claim?

      He's not, the AC did and that is really just a troll.

      Most people who read the GP's first post simply read it as his manager was abusive and probably borderline incompetent and sociopathic. Doesn't matter about the gender. Sadly these people are good at covering their arse, the OP got out peacefully with his dignity intact, which is a good end to the story.

      I've had similar treatments at a previous job. Bullied until I lashed back, then having that used to extend my probation. I was the highest performing member of the team. Best day of that job was handing in my notice to go work for a customer who was leaving that company. Then deleting all references that I ever worked there, a 9 month gap is nothing in a 15 year career.

      --
      Calling someone a "hater" only means you can not rationally rebut their argument.
    34. Re:Goes both ways by meta-monkey · · Score: 1

      No one called Fowler a man-hater because she didn't want to get propositioned by her manager.

      --
      We don't have a state-run media we have a media-run state.
    35. Re:Goes both ways by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      apparently you didn't read the slashdot comments

    36. Re:Goes both ways by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      It's never expected. People who think it's expected are insecure and assume that everyone else is judging them. I've worked 10+ years across 5 different industries and have never once had an issue with keeping my coworkers at a distance.

    37. Re:Goes both ways by michael_wojcik · · Score: 1

      Yes, your anecdote definitely proves the general case.

      I know, I know. Critical thinking is hard.

  9. Re:to any original stragglers out there by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

    The Register is decent if you can stomach the sarcasm, slashdot has clearly been taken over by the white supremacist legions.

  10. Shocking!!!! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    A director shouted a homophobic slur at a subordinate during a heated confrontation in a meeting. Another manager threatened to beat an underperforming employee's head in with a baseball bat.

    If people find this shocking God knows what they'd think if they went onto a school playing field. You'd be called a faggot ten times per day and physical threats are the norm.

    Of course, children have the common sense to brush off such language as banter with no real meaning. Sadly, many adults are lacking in common sense and appear to suffer a break down if called a nasty name.

    I'm honestly despairing for humanity when people can't brush off a simple insult. The snowflake generation really are utterly worthless. They can't get any work done because they're too busy being offended and outraged.

    1. Re:Shocking!!!! by MightyMartian · · Score: 1

      I wouldn't brush off someone threatening to beat my head in with a baseball bat. I'd be calling the cops.

      --
      The world's burning. Moped Jesus spotted on I50. Details at 11.
    2. Re:Shocking!!!! by TheGratefulNet · · Score: 4, Insightful

      tech is a small world; make waves and you may not be working in your field again.

      we have mostly killed unions and workers refuse to band together because... reasons. (shrug).

      and so, there is no one to speak for the regular worker. not really, not anymore.

      we need jobs to pay the bills. its pretty powerful to hold that over someone's head.

      this is the unwritten rule. complain and you find yourself out of work and unable to GET work (in some extremes). now, if you are a white male and older than that magic number, you will try even HARDER to avoid being fired or making 'trouble' for managers at work.

      until we get a proper balance of power, the worker will continue to be abused and have no real recourse. not in the US and CERTAINLY not in trump's US ;(

      --

      --
      "It is now safe to switch off your computer."
    3. Re:Shocking!!!! by Geoffrey.landis · · Score: 3, Insightful

      I wouldn't brush off someone threatening to beat my head in with a baseball bat. I'd be calling the cops.

      Good idea, but if you don't have it on tape, it's your word against his, and the result is he gets a mild warning "say, Jim, you should be more careful in how you phrase things, ha, ha, some people are taking it wrong," while you get tagged as "too sensitive" and "not a team worker" and are the one let go at the next downsizing.

      --
      http://www.geoffreylandis.com
    4. Re:Shocking!!!! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Of course, children have the common sense to brush off such language as banter with no real meaning.

      Children will also eat candy until their teeth rot out of their skull, and skip taking baths until they look like lepers, absent an external source of discipline to hold them accountable when they do these things.

      Are you really holding up children as your standard of desirable behavior? Because if so, you have some seriously low standards for appropriate behavior.

      They can't get any work done because they're too busy being offended and outraged.

      I don't quite get this argument. How much work does ANYBODY get done if they're actually worried about their safety, or feel they're constantly being attacked? Do YOU want to work in an office where "being verbally assaulted" is just part of the normal day? I sure don't. I bet you get more done on days where you're not assaulted, too. So why is it somehow a bad thing to expect that people will be *civil* and *polite* to one another in the workplace?

    5. Re:Shocking!!!! by labnet · · Score: 1

      It has always surprised me how little protection a US worker gets. Like your health care system; it sucks compared to the rest of the modern world (unless you are rich)

      There seems to be this culture in the US of : There is nothing stopping you from becoming rich and powerful; and if you don't work hard enough, then you don't deserve anything.

      Its like a society that got stuck at the selfish adolescent stage if independence, rather than moving to the mature state of interdependence. (ie like the EU, Canada, Australia, NZ), where society realises it need to provide basic health and employment protection services for those that aren't as smart, healthy or motivated as others.

      --
      46137
    6. Re:Shocking!!!! by Agiailotes · · Score: 0

      and workers refuse to band together because... reasons

      Because they were selected for employment based on their temperament

      I believe the kids these days call this kind of personality a 'cuck'

    7. Re:Shocking!!!! by Shotgun · · Score: 1

      Cultures differ. I find the European mindset of desiring the state to provide for their needs to be immature. Maturity, in my opinion, requires a realization that no one has a right to another person's labor....no matter how much they claim to "need" it.

      --
      Aah, change is good. -- Rafiki
      Yeah, but it ain't easy. -- Simba
    8. Re:Shocking!!!! by labnet · · Score: 1

      Cultures differ. I find the European mindset of desiring the state to provide for their needs to be immature. Maturity, in my opinion, requires a realization that no one has a right to another person's labor....no matter how much they claim to "need" it.

      I get that: and I look down on people at the outer suburban shopping centre who are mooching off my labour.
      But. we already have plenty of overproduction of the basics of life, with tons of automation coming that will displace lower skilled jobs. So were are heading for a more socialist society whether we like it or not, and the USA is behind the 8ball on this paradigm shift.

      --
      46137
    9. Re:Shocking!!!! by TheGratefulNet · · Score: 1

      your caring for fellow man is SO TOUCHING....

      current phrase that the kids, today use, to describe folks like you:

      "I GOT MINE, FUCK YOU."

      that's the phrase. as long as I get what I want, the hell with everyone else.

      selfish prick, you are. and everyone else like you who trumped the US to that orange doofus.

      --

      --
      "It is now safe to switch off your computer."
  11. Outrageous! by ScentCone · · Score: 0, Offtopic

    beat an underperforming employee's head in with a baseball bat

    Everyone knows that only liberal protesters at places like Berkeley and anti-Trump events are allowed to talk about and do that sort of thing.

    --
    Don't disappoint your bird dog. Go to the range.
    1. Re:Outrageous! by PopeRatzo · · Score: 1

      beat an underperforming employee's head in with a baseball bat

      That could be taken as a physical threat against the President.

      --
      You are welcome on my lawn.
    2. Re:Outrageous! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      And there it is! The daily "insert my displeasure that my candidate didn't win, even though it's not the topic of the discussion" from PopeRatzo! You never disappoint.

    3. Re:Outrageous! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Everyone knows that only liberal protesters at places like Berkeley and anti-Trump events are allowed to talk about and do that sort of thing.

      Like this guy.

      And this one.

      Total liberal protesters, who get away with everything!

  12. The nail in the coffin by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Between the bad Uber drivers assaulting passengers, non-bad Uber drivers getting screwed over, and now reports like this, I think we can all safely say that Uber is CANCEROUS as a company and as a 'service' and as such should be avoided. Bye-bye Uber, and nothing of value was lost.

  13. Re:Mostly, send the snowflakes to Venezuela by MightyMartian · · Score: 5, Insightful

    So you think managers threatening to kill someone or calling them a homosexual slur is just fine? If I was in charge, there would be a whole lot of people being marched out the door. I certainly would never tolerate anything like that (I'm management now). Manager or regular employee, if you cannot behave with a modicum of decency and manners, then you won't long have a job anywhere I manage.

    --
    The world's burning. Moped Jesus spotted on I50. Details at 11.
  14. Re:I was raped there by bobbied · · Score: 0

    Lady, why does it matter what HR said? Call the police, report them, sooner rather than later. If not for yourself, for the next person. Then get yourself some help dealing with this.

    You might consider a civil suit too if the HR folks really had that attitude about it... Junk like this is unacceptable.

    --
    "File to fit, pound to insert, paint to match" - Aircraft Maintenance 101
  15. Pretty common by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    This kind of behavior isn't all that uncommon. While I haven't been physically threatened or called homophobic slurs, I've seen all kinds of inappropriate aggressive behavior and unwarranted yelling from upper management. I've seen this behavior in small start ups and in large Fortune 500 companies. I've seen people go to HR in tears about how poorly they're being treated and of course nothing ever happens because HR is powerless/indifferent. Its like managers get all of their training from Alec Baldwin's character in Glengarry Glen Ross and can't function on any human level.

    1. Re:Pretty common by MightyMartian · · Score: 3, Insightful

      It's what happens when you let sociopaths into senior management. The advice I received many years ago about "toxic employees" is that while companies should throw them out as soon as possible, quite often, because they have some sort of narcissistic personality, they ingratiate themselves with their bosses, move up the corporate ladder, where they become nightmares to everyone else and create an incredibly toxic environment. And they can significantly harm a company in the process, driving out talent along the way. I cannot imagine why any company would tolerate this kind of behavior, or would allow such a workplace environment to persist. Apart from the risks of expensive lawsuits, such a workplace will have low morale, wallow in inefficiency, and ultimately gain a reputation as a shit place to work.

      --
      The world's burning. Moped Jesus spotted on I50. Details at 11.
    2. Re:Pretty common by lgw · · Score: 3, Insightful

      It's what happens when you let sociopaths into senior management.

      Corporate management selects for only 2 things: sociopathy and ability to deliver results. The higher up the ladder you climb, the more that it becomes entirely about sociopathy. This is true of almost any large organization, but especially corporations. It's not clear how to fix this, given humans are what they are, but at least recognize the world you live in.

      --
      Socialism: a lie told by totalitarians and believed by fools.
  16. Eric Holder will get to the bottom of it! by TykeClone · · Score: 0

    His plan is to sexually harass staff until he determines who is sexually harassing the staff!

    --
    A fine is a tax you pay for doing wrong and a tax is a fine you pay for doing all right.
  17. Not so fast... by bobbied · · Score: 0

    If this story is really true, there is a huge lawsuit in Uber's future... Given that there really hasn't been such a lawsuit yet, I'm a bit hesitant to just accept all this at face value.

    ANY attorney who can pass the bar could win a civil judgment of epic proportions if there is *any* evidence to substantiate that this kind of harassment is a regular happening and the company isn't doing anything to curb it. Now I'm not saying that it's not happening, only that I'm a bit skeptical about such stories coming from people who are not availing themselves of the legal protections they have. Especially when it would literally cost them nothing to get a lawyer to take this on contingency. It's not like lawyers are hard to find... (Yes, honest ones are rare, but you don't need an honest one here..)

    --
    "File to fit, pound to insert, paint to match" - Aircraft Maintenance 101
    1. Re:Not so fast... by epine · · Score: 1

      Especially when it would literally cost them nothing to get a lawyer to take this on contingency.

      Your shallow grasp of the cost function of suing a big, madhouse employer (while you're quietly vesting, among other things) leaves pretty much the whole of human history unexplored.

      Of course, if you have no supportive social network within your professional niche worth two nickles to rub together, this is an easy trap to fall into.

      "Oh, the gap in my resume circa 2017? That's when I took off an entire year to sue my former employer for a HUGE punitive settlement over a toxic, offhand comment by a testosterone-fuelled, bottom-line-driven corporate executive during a late-night outing at some drunken corporate retreat."

      But then, you're probably much better at explaining things than I am. After you explain it, the response would probably be, "well, son, that's exactly how we roll around here: zero tolerance. We like your spunk. Welcome on board. You start tomorrow."

      Just guessing, there. IANALC, I could be wrong.

      [*] I Am Not A Life Coach

    2. Re:Not so fast... by bobbied · · Score: 2

      I've been sued by a former employer who I had felt it necessary to quit without notice with a wife that was 9 months pregnant and no job prospects in sight. I think I understand the implications of what I'm saying here. Try to get a job when your last employer is lying about you, basically accusing you of all sorts of unethical behavior and threatening to sue prospective employers if they hire you. It was a bad time, a new baby, medical bills and paying a lawyer, but staying would have been worse so I'm glad I quit. I had good reasons to quit and having stuff thrown at me one morning and being verbally threatened was the last straw so I was no longer their employee that afternoon.

      NEVER abide a bad situation if you have *any* other options. If you are in a hostile environment like this one (or the one I was in) run, don't walk, away as fast as you can. I know I kept telling myself it would get better, just a little longer, they will eventually come around. Chances are they won't and what was once a daily ball of stress and abuse never got better. In the end for me, it was a mess of lawsuits, lawyers and legal fees, which resulted in me getting paid some lost wages and their dropping all their claims.

      So, I do kind of understand what I'm advising folks to do... It's not easy and yes it affects your professional career in the short term, but long term, you have to deal with this garbage sooner rather than later. The longer you wait, the worse it gets when you try to unwind all the garbage. So deal with it now.

      Seriously, if garbage like described in the article is going on, they NEED to be sued, or at least threated with legal action. Sure, get yourself another job if you can stand it before hiring a lawyer, but don't delay. Do something, ASAP.

      --
      "File to fit, pound to insert, paint to match" - Aircraft Maintenance 101
  18. Leaving a bit out by russotto · · Score: 4, Informative

    The boob-grabber got fired, as CNBC fails to note (but BusinessInsider does)

    The baseball bat thing is probably a reference to Scarface. Whether a manager actually was referencing the movie when making the "threat" or the person talking to the reporter was using it for inspiration for making shit up, I couldn't say.

    1. Re:Leaving a bit out by avandesande · · Score: 1

      While I do agree the fact that he was fired is significant, you have to wonder what kind of culture is at the company where he thought this was something he could get away with.

      --
      love is just extroverted narcissism
    2. Re:Leaving a bit out by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      There's exactly one named source here and claims of 30 anonymous interviews and other documents, none of which are given to us to evaluate. Given that they claim to have witnessed cocaine use, which is a felony, I have to question why they did not go to the cops at any time. Incidentally, the boob-grabber was fired within 12 hours. I don't think any more could reasonably be expected of Uber.

      We don't have the information to judge them, they should go to the courts. The fact that they have gone to the press instead of to court is itself a red flag.

    3. Re:Leaving a bit out by russotto · · Score: 1

      While I do agree the fact that he was fired is significant, you have to wonder what kind of culture is at the company where he thought this was something he could get away with.

      Since this was at a "company retreat in Las Vegas", I'm going to guess it had less to do with company culture and more to do with Mr. Grabby drinking too much to worry about consequences.

    4. Re:Leaving a bit out by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      TIL that pointing out facts is 'defending'

    5. Re:Leaving a bit out by geek · · Score: 1

      Baseball bat would have been from Untouchables not Scarface.

    6. Re:Leaving a bit out by PopeRatzo · · Score: 1

      "enthusiasms"

      --
      You are welcome on my lawn.
    7. Re:Leaving a bit out by chispito · · Score: 1

      While I do agree the fact that he was fired is significant, you have to wonder what kind of culture is at the company where he thought this was something he could get away with.

      That's a real work of circular logic there. Even though it was not tolerated, the fact it occurred shows that the company tolerates it.

      --
      The Daddy casts sleep on the Baby. The Baby resists!
    8. Re:Leaving a bit out by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      "Part. Of. A. Team."

    9. Re:Leaving a bit out by avandesande · · Score: 1

      It's not ridiculous to question why someone would do something so egregious. I've never seen a case where someone physically assaulted a coworker in 25 + years of work.

      --
      love is just extroverted narcissism
    10. Re:Leaving a bit out by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Casino also comes to mind.

    11. Re:Leaving a bit out by lgw · · Score: 4, Insightful

      So you're defending them. Nice...

      God dam it. The truth is more important that which side you're on. FFS, this attitude is why American (heck, Western) politics is so toxic.

      --
      Socialism: a lie told by totalitarians and believed by fools.
    12. Re:Leaving a bit out by avandesande · · Score: 1

      baseball bat overshadowed by vise scene....

      --
      love is just extroverted narcissism
    13. Re:Leaving a bit out by Dripdry · · Score: 1

      You would get mod points if I had them.
      The idiocy comes from a lack of compassion or at least critical thinking, plus overly-emotional decisions along with lack of knowledge.

      --
      -
    14. Re:Leaving a bit out by Dripdry · · Score: 1

      It could also be the woman acting flirty, then blowing up when someone grabs her tits.
      It could also be the woman manipulating someone whose job she wants to get.

      There are lots of possibilities, and the total lack of ability to know what the issues at hand might have been is one reason journalism like this is practically worthless: It sets things in a direction they might not need to go.

      --
      -
    15. Re:Leaving a bit out by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      So you're defending them. Nice...

      God dam it. The truth is more important that which side you're on. FFS, this attitude is why American (heck, Western) politics is so toxic.

      I think Slashdot needs sticks. Fuck, can this be our manifesto?

  19. No Coffee by Bodhammer · · Score: 1

    "Coffee's for closers only."

    --
    "I say we take off, nuke the site from orbit. It's the only way to be sure."
    1. Re:No Coffee by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      The leads are weak!

  20. Re: I was raped there by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Are you sure that did not happen to you in Germany or Sweden?

  21. Re:I was raped there by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    *woosh*

  22. Technology Assholes by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Reading Slashdot and interacting with so many engineers on various project, the impression gained consistently is that high tech people tend to be assholes.

    1. Re:Technology Assholes by jfdavis668 · · Score: 1

      I take it that they are the same people who are assholes on the Internet.

    2. Re:Technology Assholes by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Hey dumbfuck - it is not an "impression"!

  23. Re:Mostly, send the snowflakes to Venezuela by MightyMartian · · Score: 1

    Wow, so you think any kind of expectation of good behavior is fascism? I suspect in real life you don't behave that way, but the Internet and anonymity affords you the freedom to make believe that you're some sort of Milo-like entity. And look where his big mouth got him.

    --
    The world's burning. Moped Jesus spotted on I50. Details at 11.
  24. Re:Mostly, send the snowflakes to Venezuela by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    so in your mind, treating people the way you would want to be treated is fascism?

  25. My experiences in other companies and opinions... by joboss · · Score: 1

    Comparing my experiences to those people describe in Uber I would say that Uber slipped on discipline to an extent. The muddies are watered however because a lot of people have unreasonably high standards which can be for a number of reasons. However in any companies or large group of people you have incidents like this. It makes it hard to really measure the problem and if it's really that big. I would say however the reported response to serious incidents looks insufficient to me.

    > workers are sometimes pitted against one another and where

    I've seen this in some places where I work. Give two people the same task and see who finishes first. I've also seen this happen where multiple companies working together on projects are all given the same task by a client (either abusively or out of lack of coordination) who thinks its clever but the end result is loads of pointless work and a massive tangle of stepping on toes. It can become extremely demoralising and sabotages everyone. It's artificial competition and doesn't reap the benefits people think it might. I have seen companies destroyed by their client like that. You need to have division of responsibilities and not a free for all like feeding pidgeons. The problem manifests in a lot of ways. I hate when I have a list of ten tasks on my list, I am working on the first one and others try to steal one or might of the pending nine even though they either have other things to do or aren't suited to do those tasks properly.

    I've also seen hire to try where two candidates will be hired, given tasks and then the one that appears to hit the deck running (more likely crawls a bit faster) will be kept and the other fired a few weeks later usually because of rush hiring and a desperation to fill a seat rather than fill a position with someone actually qualified for the job. You then get stuck with such people that can really not always work out well. Something like one in five or one in ten might work out as productive and talented but by their the seat is filled and after a certain period of employment laws make it hard to fire people (not that the law is at fault, you see people who shouldn't have been hired at all).

    > a blind eye is turned to infractions from top performers

    This is normal and it's not always bad. Some people earn their tenure, salt, prove their worth, loyalty, etc and in certain areas strict rules aren't particularly helpful. That can't be anything goes however. The infractions have to be things that don't really matter. In my experience this has for example been an issue with dress code. It gets to a point where the things you're doing are so important that arbitrary restraints become just stupid. Ultimately like a lot of things, it has to be taken on a case by case basis.

    The reports seem to lump things together. I consider only these serious offences:

    > One Uber manager groped female co-workers' breasts at a company retreat in Las Vegas.
    > Another manager threatened to beat an underperforming employee's head in with a baseball bat.
    > Uber employees did cocaine in the bathrooms at private parties

    Unfortunately cocaine use by employees seems endemic among "high performing" industries. I've seen a lot of personal use although it wont normally be brought into the work. It's not always a problem but the complete apathy does raise concern. Groping should be a zero-tolerance matter as should be issuing genuine and precise threats of violence.

    Debatable offence:

    > A director shouted a homophobic slur at a subordinate during a heated confrontation in a meeting.

    I wouldn't care about that too much unless there were more to the situation. It seems possibly more of a problem that it got that heated. If it were under my watch I might mention informally to an employee that did that to have more control. It would be a serious issue if the subordinate were actually gay and being bullied or ragged on for it or if prospective investors for ex

  26. Re: I was raped there by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Exactly. When you are raped you don't think straight, and I bet HR bullied her into not going to the police. That guy just doesn't get it!

  27. Re:Mostly, send the snowflakes to Venezuela by MightyMartian · · Score: 1

    Because that's the only standard of behavior that matters. "Does it make money?"

    You do realize the Alt-right are the conservative's new useful idiots, and as Milo's exile shows, once the idiots cease to be useful...

    --
    The world's burning. Moped Jesus spotted on I50. Details at 11.
  28. Re:Mostly, send the snowflakes to Venezuela by fahrbot-bot · · Score: 4, Funny

    ... make believe that you're some sort of Milo-like entity. And look where his big mouth got him.

    A date to the junior high prom?

    --
    It must have been something you assimilated. . . .
  29. Re:Mostly, send the snowflakes to Venezuela by WaffleMonster · · Score: 2

    So you think managers threatening to kill someone or calling them a homosexual slur is just fine?

    Could be. Depends on context. Lots of people have told me they were going to kill me.. slurs are rarely invoked in a literal sense. Language isn't an exact science and like it or not language belongs to everyone. Not just you or a minority of perpetually offended loudmouths who demand language be (re)interpreted in ways that draw maximal offense.

    Coupled with an agenda or specific worldview common understandings of messy imprecise language can be wildly distorted with ease.

    Just because a person from one tribe swears profusely or lacks manners doesn't make them any more or less decent than individuals from another tribe with different customs.

    If I was in charge, there would be a whole lot of people being marched out the door. I certainly would never tolerate anything like that (I'm management now). Manager or regular employee, if you cannot behave with a modicum of decency and manners, then you won't long have a job anywhere I manage.

    You know nothing about this situation other than hearsay from a media article naturally biased towards hyperbole.

  30. Re:Mostly, send the snowflakes to Venezuela by Dutch+Gun · · Score: 4, Insightful

    I heard a rather heated argument the other day at work. It was heated because the devs were up against a deadline, and the debate was (from what I gathered) whether to push a fix forward or not for the next release. Not once did I hear any rudeness toward other team members by those in the debate. Any swearing and most of the frustration was directed at the code and process, not other people.

    More to the point, such a culture is set by the guys at the top. Our boss isn't the type to rant or yell at others, and in turn, everyone understands that such behavior doesn't belong at our company. Simple as that.

    It's entirely possible to remain civil with fellow employees at all times, even when you're frustrated or tense. It's not exactly *necessary* for a company to behave that way to be successful, but all in all, I'm going to prefer working at a company in which people are expected to remain civil with each other.

    --
    Irony: Agile development has too much intertia to be abandoned now.
  31. Re:My experiences in other companies and opinions. by MightyMartian · · Score: 1

    In general I would frown on any employees, but in particular a manager, getting into a shouting match, homophobic slur or otherwise. In a manager I would find this particularly disturbing, because you should really be promoting managers based on leadership qualities, and shouting at your subordinates doesn't display leadership, it displays bullying. As to a specifically homophobic slur, like it or not, we live in a litigatory age, and, as you point out, if the staff member being yelled at were gay, then your manager has crossed a realm into pain. As others have pointed out, this kind of culture comes down from the top. Good sound senior management would not allow the workplace to behave this way.

    The fact is that in any workplace, but particularly a large one, you're going to have conflicts, and on occasion they may get out of hand. I agree that the homophobic slur is the least serious of them, but it still isn't something that should be tolerated. An off the record warning would be exactly how I'd deal with that as well, but if the employee persisted in that sort of conduct, then it would have to move on to a more formal disciplinary process.

    Oh, and to all those brave alt-right haters, want to end up in court, go tell a subordinate who complains they were threatened or abused to suck it up.

    --
    The world's burning. Moped Jesus spotted on I50. Details at 11.
  32. Re:Mostly, send the snowflakes to Venezuela by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Because that's the only standard of behavior that matters.

    It is to the left. The left loves money. Specifically other people's money. If you have them, but don't give the left any (worse, give them to somebody else like conservatives), the left will hate you and demonize you as one of them evil 1%ers

    The left's favorite way of punishing people they don't like is to try and get them fired and cut off their source of income (not everybody is like Milo who can find another job after having their character assassinated)

    Their political candidates usually outspend the opposition

    The left doesn't care for standards in gender or sexuality or family structure (they're just social constructs!), and object to any attempts to establish standards on such. They care for things like the minimum wage getting raised and the gender pay gap. You know, MONEY matters.

  33. And went to... by SuperKendall · · Score: 1

    I documented all of this, got supporting statements from my colleagues, and went to HR

    Aha, I see your mistake.

    When your "I went to..." statement does not end with "the troublesome's persons direct supervisor", then you have done nothing except cause grief for yourself.

    Companies don't change in response to HR reported threats. They clam up and protect the status quo. Hint: you reporting a problem is not the status quo...

    If instead you report to a manager above the troubled employee, well now you are giving the company a chance to quietly sweep a problem under the rug... there is nothing large companies and high level executives like more than some good rug sweeping. Heck, they might even lay off her whole division just to be sure!

    --
    "There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
    1. Re:And went to... by Notabadguy · · Score: 1

      I documented all of this, got supporting statements from my colleagues, and went to HR

      Aha, I see your mistake.

      When your "I went to..." statement does not end with "the troublesome's persons direct supervisor", then you have done nothing except cause grief for yourself.

      Companies don't change in response to HR reported threats. They clam up and protect the status quo. Hint: you reporting a problem is not the status quo...

      If instead you report to a manager above the troubled employee, well now you are giving the company a chance to quietly sweep a problem under the rug... there is nothing large companies and high level executives like more than some good rug sweeping. Heck, they might even lay off her whole division just to be sure!

      Actually, in both cases I did go to the person's direct supervisor.

      In the incident of the poker game at my house, there were 10-15 other people there - all co-workers. The story made it to her boss (my boss' boss) before I talked to him next. He was an empty suit - GE has its share of people who talk a good talk, but don't follow through on anything.

      In the incident of the finance lady, I actually started with my boss. I was so enraged that I wanted to violence this person - I went to talk to my boss, took his advice to write it all up, go to HR....and while I called and left a message (and sent an e-mail) to her boss, my own boss had warned me that he was an empty suit, and nothing would happen. True to form, he didn't even bother to return my call or respond to my e-mail.

  34. It's OK! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    They're just disrupting the paradigm of HR and workforce relations! It'll be great, honest, and will save you a lot of money! You'll like it!

  35. Re:Mostly, send the snowflakes to Venezuela by MightyMartian · · Score: 1

    This is why I wish Slashdot would get rid of ACs. I have no idea who I'm debating. Are they responding to what I wrote? Are they the parent?

    AT any rate, lots of people of every stripe care about money. Whoever you are, the AC I was responding to heavily suggested that Milo is vindicated because he makes lots of money. How that squares with your post is beyond me.

    --
    The world's burning. Moped Jesus spotted on I50. Details at 11.
  36. Well isn't that just aw-ful. by tietokone-olmi · · Score: 1

    >A director shouted a homophobic slur at a subordinate during a heated confrontation in a meeting.

    If this is such a major sin by Uber's standards that it's worth mentioning in a slam piece, then Uber must be far cleaner than their business practices would suggest. It's not like undercutting established taxi service with VC money is in any way "innovation", or "disruption" except in the sense of what George Soros likes to do.

  37. Re:Mostly, send the snowflakes to Venezuela by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

    People tend to hire people who are like themselves. Uber is like that because Uber's owners are like that.

    If you owned Uber, it would probably be different from top to bottom. And it would probably never have gotten to the size that Uber is, since you probably wouldn't have had the ego to flagrantly violate the law and advance your company in the market through assholery.

  38. Re:My experiences in other companies and opinions. by lgw · · Score: 1

    In a manager I would find this particularly disturbing, because you should really be promoting managers based on leadership qualities, and shouting at your subordinates doesn't display leadership, it displays bullying.

    Shouty managers were common for Baby Boomers and earlier. There's still a bit of that culture around, and I've had a few shouty managers over the years (mostly guys born before 1960, one born in the 60s). It's an effective way to deliver the emotional message that someone is underperforming and needs to change, when sometimes trying to connect rationally doesn't work. I'm glad it's now mostly faded from current management, but it's a valid approach for leadership (there's a reason drill sergeants and marine DIs shout a lot - it works).

    The better criticism is that it's unprofessional. We should all be fighting to increase the perceived professionalism of software development. I've seen so much dignity stripped from developers over the past 25 years, and it's bullshit and needs to reverse. We're professionals like doctors and lawyers (and in some countries, better paid than doctors or lawyers). Can you imagine a doctor or lawyer, past the early career years, who doesn't have an office? Who doesn't have assistants to do the shit work?

    --
    Socialism: a lie told by totalitarians and believed by fools.
  39. Bullies aren't actually funny by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    A director shouted a homophobic slur at a subordinate during a heated confrontation in a meeting. Another manager threatened to beat an underperforming employee's head in with a baseball bat.

    If people find this shocking God knows what they'd think if they went onto a school playing field. You'd be called a faggot ten times per day and physical threats are the norm.

    I would consider that unacceptable behavior on a school playing field. This is what bullies do.

    Of course, children have the common sense to brush off such language as banter with no real meaning.

    Children learn very quickly that when a kid threatens in public to beat other children in the head with a baseball bat and the adults say "it's just banter," that kid is the one who will actually beat them up when the adults aren't watching.

    That kid who threatens other kids on the school playing field is a psychopath.

  40. Re:My experiences in other companies and opinions. by avandesande · · Score: 1

    A lot if business culture was borrowed from the military and there were a lot of vets from WW2, so a military style tongue-lashing made more sense then.

    --
    love is just extroverted narcissism
  41. Re:Mostly, send the snowflakes to Venezuela by jedidiah · · Score: 2

    Oddly enough, one of the best teams I was ever on was a group where people didn't collectively have steel rods up their asses. It ran well and efficiently. Teamwork was excellent. The boss was demanding but did a very good job at cultivating talent being much more effective at genuine "social justice" than most people that like to whine about it loudly.

    It actually worked better than a climate of terror inspired by threats of litigation.

    Despite the apparent "evil locker room atmosphere", people didn't push individual tolerances too much. Any real nonsense would have been dealt with most severely. If there was a problem you dealt with it then and there.

    This Uber situation is basic leadership fail rather than a lack of political correctness or decorum.

    --
    A Pirate and a Puritan look the same on a balance sheet.
  42. trying to be funny by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Uh, the post is made up by somebody trying to be funny by echoing the Rolling Stone story.

  43. Re:Mostly, send the snowflakes to Venezuela by jedidiah · · Score: 2

    > so in your mind, treating people the way you would want to be treated is fascism?

    That is such a stupid way to put things. You have no idea how people want to be treated. You very likely couldn't handle being treated the way that that many of us would happily tolerate or even prefer.

    That's not even getting into the interesting stuff.

    You would melt into a puddle of goo if I applied the Golden Rule you.

    --
    A Pirate and a Puritan look the same on a balance sheet.
  44. Re:My experiences in other companies and opinions. by MightyMartian · · Score: 1

    Of course there has been in a lot of research on management styles, some of it predating WWII which suggested that bullying management style may bring about short-term gains, but usually at the cost of a paranoid and low-morale organization which can negatively effect long term performance.

    I've only been yelled at once in my working life, and while it scared the shit out of me to be sure, the only take-away I had was that my boss was a fucking asshole. I could only work as fast as I was going, and because he was a cheap asshole, he wouldn't hire someone else to take over some of my sysadmin role so I could more coding.

    --
    The world's burning. Moped Jesus spotted on I50. Details at 11.
  45. Re:to any original stragglers out there by jedidiah · · Score: 1

    That certainly explains all of the virtue signalling and SJW propaganda.

    --
    A Pirate and a Puritan look the same on a balance sheet.
  46. Not suprising by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful

    I had an issue with my manager once (not about sexual harassment, but about an ethic issue since one of the company value is conduct business with uncompromising integrity and professionalism) and I went to the HR. The HR wasn't very helpful and unless I want to make a big issue out of it, there is nothing they are willing to do. The best they could do is if the manager decide to retaliate and there is a paper trail, then they might do something about it. Reading between the line, they infer I should transfer out and that's what I did. I went and talk to other people that dealt with HR before and they schooled me on the true function of HR.

    The purpose of HR is not to help you the individual employee. The true purpose is to protect company from liability and any issues that might result in hurting company's profitability. In Uber's case, the HR did exactly that, protect the company from loosing "high performing" manager since Fowler is just another engineer that they could have replaced. In their view, she is nothing special and would only hurt company's profitability while losing a "high performing employee" that would help the company make money. So they would do anything to help sweep the problem under the rug. I'll bet once the investigation has concluded, they would make an example out of that manager and make some cosmetic changes. Once this blows over, everything will back to the same ol' same ol'.

  47. As someone who just left Uber, I'm not surprised by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Posting anonymously as I am a stockholder and a former employee. I absolutely believe Susan Fowler, and in my years at the company I saw very egregious behavior from some senior managers. They acted invincible, and largely, they were. There are lots of great people at Uber, but there are also some very powerful sociopaths. If they had fixed that before I quit, I probably would have stayed. Hopefully they fix it now, but I'm not optimistic.

  48. Re:Jealous by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Offended? Can't take the heat? Don't let the doorknob get stuck in your vagina on the way out.

    I'm guessing that there's a reason why this is in reference to your "old job." And I'm guessing it's not because you were considered one of their star players who they couldn't do without.

  49. Re:My experiences in other companies and opinions. by avandesande · · Score: 1

    Yeah I can't imagine working like this either. I've always been lucky enough to have managers that you could rate 'passable' or better.

    --
    love is just extroverted narcissism
  50. Re:Mostly, send the snowflakes to Venezuela by Darinbob · · Score: 2

    Send the bigot to Venezuela and Somalia instead? Why keep those assholes around? Just because he's the CEO's college drinking buddy doesn't mean he's worth keeping around. Awww, did the executive whine when he got laid off, send him to Uzbekistan!

    This is a WORKPLACE, you have to be part of a TEAM. If you start fighting amongst yourselves and shouting abuse because your mother never taught you how to behave in public, then you deserve to be fired.

    Now let's sing along together. Uber(tm), Uber(tm), Uber Alles...

  51. Re:My experiences in other companies and opinions. by joboss · · Score: 1

    I personally find this whole wordcrime stuff a disturbing side of out society. Whether an anti-homosexual slur is bad or not is subjective and I will be loath to support the people who want to make a huge thing out of something based on superstition or because they can. It's deeply disturbing that our society is so childish and the solution often seems to be more childishness. There's an amusing snag. Millions of people, even homosexual people use anti-homosexual slurs. For me it's part of my language and while it might be within other people's belief system that to use some words is the worst thing they shouldn't have the authority to impose it on others.

    Same as when on a social I drink around some of the Muslims I work with, they aren't petty and don't make a fuss about it. They'll happily sell me bacon at their store. I don't make a fuss about their rituals or impose my own personal standards on them either when there's no real problem or need. This whole word crime thing is a social construct.

    It's still a concern in terms of setting an example but being insensitive shouldn't necessarily be a crime especially when the fault tends to really lie in others being over sensitive. Ultimately people are responsible for their own internal states and if they get upset too easily... You might say well technically in some way these words are homophobic based on some research, guilt by association and desire to project some kind of control but in reality it's an invented problem, there's nothing strictly wrong with the usage in and of itself. Half the people are only really worried that someone else's usage will somehow get them into trouble as a collective. It's a fault (one of many to this effect) in human social instinct and ironically a form of phobia that allows these little taboos to propagate so easily.

    I say bugger a lot or call someone a sod quite often which were also anti-homosexual slurs. I can't imagine that all the horrors and bad things that have ever happened are due to merely that somehow these evil magical words came into the dictionary. I find it religious discrimination because I don't believe in magic. Problems come from underlying beliefs or attitudes in society. When it comes to words such as sod and bugger among many others they lost their magic so to speak as society changed and people become more reasonable. Alternatively from the fact that humans are flawed and some given anything will mess up although you have things like that someone is more likely to mess up with a fork than a spoon but even saying that there are a whole range of words out there that are entirely legitimate that people abuse far more than any of the forbidden words.

    The usage would be the biggest genuine problem if as I said it was actually an attack on the individual on account of being gay. For me that's instantly intolerable. There's nothing to indicate that here and you have to be careful with the standards you impose on others especially if you aren't subject to them.

    We're on the same page that if the manager did that all the time then it would be an issue but once and in a tense situation? I don't find it disturbing at all. There is indeed a risk that someone really homosexual might get caught in the cross hairs or that someone might overhear it and think that employee is genuinely gay. The problem with insults though is that they aren't meant to be literal. If you call someone a dick doesn't mean that they literally are or that you're against dicks. I know people who love dick, practically worship it but still call people a dick in heated debates. If it makes a whole lot of trouble work in a country with good courts or hire real lawyers and not genuinely be guilty.

    The main reason it can make a whole load of trouble is that there are forces that even if wrong you have to abide to. If all the customers want something daft you can't do much about it. Lots of problems like that in society. As I said one way to do it is to joke about the risk in a mocking way to make t

  52. Re:Mostly, send the snowflakes to Venezuela by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Say that word around me and you get a fist to the face. Unless I'm your supervisor, then I can't legally punch you without getting the company involved. So you're fired. Welcome to reality.
    Andrew Dice Clay played out your shtick 30+ years ago. Nobody has to pretend your edgy dismissal of people who aren't you is unique, special, or meaningful. Demanding that they do is what makes you the most special snowflake of all. Go get yourself a real personality.

  53. I was confused. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I had just read an article about the planned opening of the new Apple monolith and when I read this I thought it was just reminiscing about Apple in the early days - then the word "Uber" finally sunk in.

  54. Re:Mostly, send the snowflakes to Venezuela by Agiailotes · · Score: 0

    If I was in charge, there would be a whole lot of people being marched out the door

    Probably why you're not in charge of anything. You don't understand human dynamics or what it takes to run a business.

    The simple truth that you justice warriors don't understand about life: your ideals amount to nothing in terms of creativity. Your sanitized model of existence does not support innovation.

    You need colorful people with spirit to innovate and maneuver. You need to accept these people and negotiate with them, not deliver them ultimatums.

    You can run in circles weeping about all the injustice, but you're just being disruptive and you will find your place on the sidelines as soon as the media fervor about "justice" actually starts tanking the economy.

  55. Re:Mostly, send the snowflakes to Venezuela by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Say that word around me and you get a fist to the face.

    Probably wasn't "faggot". More likely "cocksucker".

  56. we dodged a bullet by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    You're very right that "they got that way by demonstrating, at the very top, that corruption was tolerated". We almost got that in the USA. I find it horrifying that anybody would vote for an obviously corrupt person.

  57. Homophobia and suicide by DrYak · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Awww, did someone call you a faggot? He's a meanie!

    There's solid data showing that suicide rate is higher among bi- and homo- sexual youth (teens and young adult) than among their heterosexual peers.
    This is believed to be strongly linked to the difficulty of feeling accepted. The more a young individual with an unorthodox sexuality and/or gender identity feels rejected by the surrounding society, the higher the risks of suicide.

    Check again the summary, it was not a young internet shouting homophobic slurs at a senior officer, it was the other way around.
    By keeping a climate were "being [homophobic slur]" is considered as a bad thing, that senior officer is actively contributing in a small part in the lack of self acceptance and higher suicide rates among non-heterosexual young people.

    It's not about being ridiculously excessively nice to people so they feel special snowflake.
    It's avoid to keep a general situation were young persons feel so much rejected by the society that suicide seems a better alternative.

    --
    "Sufficiently advanced satire is indistinguishable from reality." - [Tips: 1DrYakQDKCQ6y52z6QbnkxHXAocMZJE61o ]
  58. Re:My experiences in other companies and opinions. by joboss · · Score: 1

    All of this is correct but overlooks when shouty isn't necessarily a bad thing. The world try as hard as you like is not perfect. There are going to sometimes be problems and issues worth getting into a shouting match about. It might be a serious issue like how to avoid laying off staff, keeping the business afloat, etc. You really don't know. You can try to imagine us being Vulcan's but we're not. You know it's also only when people get angry sometimes and disinhibited that something might shake loose.

    There's a few different types of shouty. Obviously how dare I not get my own way or irritable over other things in their life types are a problem. Sometimes it can arise from frustration in a situation because something is lost in translation or some other kind of issue of mutual comprehension. This happens a lot. I get shouty a lot when it comes to hard problems with no perfect solution. Dilemmas. Sometimes it is such that the decision might as well be the flip of the coin.

  59. Re:Mostly, send the snowflakes to Venezuela by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    *applause* well played sir! well played!

    rofl, captcha, "uncouth"

  60. Uber can't exist for much longer by mtmiller100 · · Score: 1

    This very well written blog about Uber's culture is not the first, nor the last to come out. The blatant violations of the law, the blatant cover-ups, and the lies cannot go unpunished forever. With so many angry ex-employees, there must be a class-action lawsuit in the works that will (rightfully) ruin that company.

  61. Silicon valley is insular and out of touch by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    And Uber proves it by their ridiculous culture.

  62. Re:Mostly, send the snowflakes to Venezuela by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    And the pussification of America continues...

  63. Re:My experiences in other companies and opinions. by MightyMartian · · Score: 1

    The problem is that it is a shitty manager who insults any subordinate. If you have a problem with a member of your team, you take them aside and try to deal with it. If it rates disciplinary action, then so be it, but that can still be done respectfully. Either we are adults who can behave with some decorum, or we are unruly children. I won't have unruly children as managers, period. Behave appropriately or you will be demoted. Calling anyone a "fag", get into shouting matches with them, and I will be making you apologize to the persons involved and to anyone who overheard them, and do it repeatedly, and you'll be shown the door. A work place should not be a place where people with power feel some right to behave badly to other people.

    --
    The world's burning. Moped Jesus spotted on I50. Details at 11.
  64. Re:Mostly, send the snowflakes to Venezuela by michael_wojcik · · Score: 1

    If I was in charge, there would be a whole lot of people being marched out the door

    Yes. Including a number of people in HR, based on Fowler's account - and she says she has evidence (email logs and the like). Not that I'm inclined to doubt her anyway; her story is completely in keeping with previous Uber scandals.

    The responses she reports getting from HR are not just unethical; several of them are outright illegal. This is systematic lawbreaking, not simply bad corporate culture. I wouldn't be surprised if some enterprising legal firm isn't looking up former female employees and trying to put together a class-action suit.

  65. Please help ScentCone! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    If you look through ScentCone's history you'll find multiple threads of his that boil down to the same theme as this one. The man is stuck in a time loop and we need to help him get out of it.