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A 21st-Century Version Of OS/2 Warp May Be Released Soon (arcanoae.com)

dryriver writes: A company named Arca Noae is working on a new release of the X86 OS/2 operating system code named "Blue Lion" and likely called ArcaOS 5 in its final release. Blue Lion wants to be a modern 21st Century OS/2 Warp, with support for the latest hardware and networking standards, a modern accelerated graphics driver, support for new cryptographic security standards, full backward compatibility with legacy OS/2, DOS and Windows 3.1 applications, suitability for use in mission-critical applications, and also, it appears, the ability to run "ported Linux applications". Blue Lion, which appears to be in closed beta with March 31st 2017 cited as the target release date, will come with up to date Firefox browser and Thunderbird mail client, Apache OpenOffice, other productivity tools, a new package manager, and software update and support subscription to ensure system stability. It is unclear from the information provided whether Blue Lion will be able to run modern Windows applications.

28 of 232 comments (clear)

  1. Uh, why? by drinkypoo · · Score: 4, Insightful

    There have been operating systems which have come and gone which have reasons to exist today, like BeOS. But OS/2 is not among them. Windows 3.1 support? That's not a relevant feature. Please tell me that their actual planned release date is April 1.

    --
    "You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"
    1. Re:Uh, why? by nine-times · · Score: 3

      Windows 3.1 support? That's not a relevant feature.

      Not for most circumstances, no. On the other hand, there may be old legacy systems that ran on Windows 3.1 that people will want to be able to run. I don't know what the current state of compatibility is for Windows 10, but having a modern/updated OS that can run Windows 3.1 apps may be useful to someone.

    2. Re: Uh, why? by drinkypoo · · Score: 2

      Or were simply running it under different constraints than you were.

      There is no version of OS/2 (except perhaps those which are too old) which should not run properly on a 486SLC2-66 with 8MB of RAM.

      --
      "You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"
    3. Re:Uh, why? by wierd_w · · Score: 2

      100% with dosbox. Dosbox runs windows 3.1, can do network encapsulation/passthrough, and runs on modern windows.

      It is also FOSS, and if you absolutely need a way to keep that legacy shit running, you can adapt dosbox to suit your business use case. Considering the low system requirements, you can virtualize the shit out of it.

    4. Re:Uh, why? by KiloByte · · Score: 3, Funny

      and runs on modern windows.

      I don't think anyone would run something as sensitive as an ATM on Windows.

      --
      The creatures outside looked from Alt-Right to Antifa; but already it was impossible to say which was which.
    5. Re: Uh, why? by pD-brane · · Score: 2

      Yes, some ATMs do run Windows. A very bad example: Around 2005 I saw an ATM (Rabobank) with an error revealing that it ran Windows 98.

    6. Re:Uh, why? by newcastlejon · · Score: 4, Informative

      I don't think anyone would run something as sensitive as an ATM on Windows.

      They can, and do. In the past I've seen crashed ATMs running NT4, XP, XP Embedded, 2k and... OS/2.

      Banks are a bit like the military when it comes to IT: they stick with what works long after others have replaced it with something new.

      --
      If God forks the Universe every time you roll a die, he'd better have a damned good memory.
    7. Re: Uh, why? by dryeo · · Score: 2

      Warp v4+ requires 16 MBs of ram and a 486DX with many current programs requiring an i686.
      I ran Warp v3 on a 386 with 4MBs of ram that eventually became a 486slc with 8 MBs. It ran fine once you stripped it down (no WPS).
      Today, there are memory problems. Run Firefox, Thunderbird and OpenOffice and ram will get fragmented forcing a reboot every few days. Run older programs and lots of people report long up times.
      49 days after OS/2 2.0 was released, the bug reports came flowing in, OS/2 couldn't handle the up time counter overflowing and it was fixed shortly after. For comparison, it took years for someone to keep Win95 up long enough to find the similar bug.

      --
      https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inverted_totalitarianism
    8. Re: Uh, why? by dromgodis · · Score: 2

      Ahh, thanks for the fond memories. I also ran a DOS-based BBS under OS/2 while developing DOS-based games on the same machine. OS/2 was at the time the best platform for DOS program (it wasn't all apps back then) development since it didn't require a reboot whenever the program crashed.

      Also - to make it more interesting - there were different versions of the Mach64 hardware. Some of it didn't work well will the drivers (DAMHIK).

      Today I think OS/2 has played out its role with all the major OS:es being robust and having more features. I would even go as far as saying that by todays standards, it is rather crappy. However, in those days, the alternatives on PC hardware were crappier (DOS and Win95 crashing if you breathed incorrectly while NT was stable but you couldn't run games, Linux was ... just different).

      An anecdote though: Around -94 I built some customer-specific hardware and wrote OS/2 software that used it in an industrial environment. A few years ago, they called me and asked if I could build some more hardware since they were expanding. They didn't ask for replacement of the software on a more contemporary platform.

    9. Re:Uh, why? by thinkwaitfast · · Score: 2

      If it is anything like aerospace, they certify complete systems, hardware and software configurations. You can't change the software and remain certified.

    10. Re:Uh, why? by dbreeze · · Score: 4, Interesting

      I repair ancient Mazak CNC controls and other industrial controls. All the software is DOS/Win3.1 era stuff. No one wants to bite the bullet for new CNC systems because they can't find the mechanical quality to compare at a reasonable price. Unfortunately, there's probably not a single piece of electronics for these systems left in the world that hasn't already been through one repair cycle. Most of the PCB's I see have been patched, doctored, and abused to near death, but they keep coming. Mazak has quit all support for these dinosaurs, but they're still sitting on most of the schematics, source code, etc.
      My boss would love to see a modern OS with good support for his ancient software packages that all the original vendors have walked away from supporting, and won't release anything for others to work with.

      If Trump wants to impress me, he'll get around to doing something to clean up the copyright/patent fiasco that is killing so many smaller players like us.

      --
      When the king heard the words of the Book of the Law he tore his robes.2Kings22:11
    11. Re:Uh, why? by jwhyche · · Score: 2

      I don't remember if windows 3.1 apps are 8bit or 16 bit. I believe they are 16 bit, in that case I think the 32 bit version of windows 10 might be able to run them. I know the 64 bit versions of any windows won't run 16 bit anything.

      That is what my heart tells me. My head says fat chance. Lets go with the latter.

      --
      I read at +2. If your post doesn't reach that level I will not see or respond to it.
    12. Re:Uh, why? by jwhyche · · Score: 2

      I don't think anyone would run something as sensitive as an ATM on Windows.

      You would be surprised. I saw a ATM at one of those home town ATM with the blue screen of death on it. Saw a gas pump a few weeks ago with one too.

      --
      I read at +2. If your post doesn't reach that level I will not see or respond to it.
    13. Re:Uh, why? by joemck · · Score: 2

      >I don't know what the current state of compatibility is for Windows 10

      32 bit Windows 10 still runs Windows 3.1 programs. I'm not sure how good the compatibility is, but it works. 64 bit can't run them at all because VM86 mode isn't available from in 64 bit mode on the CPU.

      Linux also runs Windows 3.1 programs pretty well, with Wine.

    14. Re:Uh, why? by nine-times · · Score: 2

      Yeah, I don't know anything about your particular situation, but it was the kind of thing I was thinking of when I wrote my post. People have a tendency to think, "Why would you bother to support old [DOS | Windows 3.1 | Windows 95 | whatever] apps? Nobody uses that anymore." And it's true that it's very rare to see a normal person still using Windows 3.1 as their desktop OS. However, there are still various systems that businesses have in place, that may have been build decades ago with an old OS, still in operation. I don't know that OS/2 is the right choice for those systems, but it's one reason why legacy OS support might not be completely worthless.

    15. Re: Uh, why? by jwhyche · · Score: 2

      Kind of makes you want to start burying your money in your back yard.

      --
      I read at +2. If your post doesn't reach that level I will not see or respond to it.
    16. Re:Uh, why? by Billly+Gates · · Score: 2

      We love bashing Windows but banks LOVE that platform.

      Windows NT has Digital VMS style security, advanced auditing, acl, advanced permissions, lock down support, and a rich win32 API that maybe cryptic but has rich functionality to customize the shit out of. Every c++ programmer knows it overseas where they can save money on development platforms.

      These customized versions of XP go on lockdown as soon as you plug in a keyboard. They use x25 networking with remote shut off if they stop receiving tokens on the network. The auditing and logging is next to none and group policy customizations and security make it the best OS

      Linux is behind in these areas though SystemD is trying to catch up poorly. These are not the shitty default XP from your Dell out of the box.

  2. Workplace Shell & virtualisation engine by Heebie · · Score: 2

    Will it have the Workplace Shell? Some virtualisation engine for running other OS's under it? (other than the DOS/Windows 3.x bits, which are "thunked" rather than emulated) These are what I want to know! I would *LOVE* to have workplace shell on Linux, and would run OS/2 again if I was able to run WPS and use other OS's in virtualisation!

    1. Re:Workplace Shell & virtualisation engine by martiniturbide · · Score: 3, Interesting

      ArcaOS will have all that is on OS/2 Warp 4.52, Workplace Shell, SOM, Presentation Manager, DOS/Win16 (embedded). Running WPS on Linux may be harder, CPI needs to be cloned and open source so PM, SOM and WPS can be run over it. Visit OS2World.com forums if you have more questions.

  3. Re:Team OS/2 Forever! by martiniturbide · · Score: 2

    Check out: http://www.warpstock.eu/ May 20, 21 in Rotterdam. The next Warpstock in North America is going to be announced soon: http://www.warpstock.org/

  4. Competition is good by quonset · · Score: 4, Interesting

    If it can compete against the steaming pile that is Windows 10 and the eye candy which is Macs, this is a good thing. Being able to buy a license for a machine and use it without being forced to "upgrade" or have updates automatically installed whether you want them or not would be a great leap forward.

    Being able to run software which is a few years old but does what you want would also be a big plus.

    1. Re:Competition is good by DontBeAMoran · · Score: 2

      The problem with recent Mac OS releases is their seemingly anti-user direction. Style - not over function, but - against function. Thinner fonts that look like crap on regular, non-HiDPI monitors? Check. Pale pastel colours? Check. Removing any hint about widgets outlines? Check. Hiding or even removing functions because most people don't use them, even if they were available before? Check.

      Things started to fall apart when "Mr. Industrial Designer" became in charge of GUI design. Hint: industrial design does not equal user interface design.

      --
      #DeleteFacebook
  5. I was at the dawn of OS/2... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Interesting

    ...in 1988, back while IBM and Microsoft thought they could work together. HA! I was a contractor and I made much money in my entire career working on the installation package with an in-house language that lack the ability for simple Boolean functions! That's right - no AND or OR or NOT! We beg to do it in C but were overruled. It was a such a stupid project. I learn that if stupidity is profitable, it will be repeated.

    While Windows start-of-art was 3.11, OS/2 came out with Presentation Manager and true multitasking and I was in love! This was before Linux, before the Wide World Web and we crave to upgraded to an PS/2 Model 70 with a blazing 16 mHz 32-bit processor and curse to slow transistion from 5.25 to 3.5" floppy disks!

    My favorite part was the clean interface, especially the Font Palette. I could set a font and and will be EVERYWHERE. I had just two folders on my desktop, Programs and Data. It's the cleanest, more elegant interface of my life.

    All the lead people are mainframers. We used the same email system as Oliver North did. The low point of my three years there is when the Lead Designer, the Big Cheese of the project, went on a massive rant about the GUI and wanting me to justified it over the command line. He hated mice! He hated color - anything beyond monochrome was inappropriate for business! It was a obscenity-filled, homophobic rant.

    Then the Great War between Microsoft and IBM started. I think over REXX and Visual Basic. IBM loved REXX and want to include for free but Bill Gates was reported to have something like, "Over my death body, they can buy my Basic". But truly, it was a Big Dick contest and they parted ways and Microsoft beget Windows 95 and IBM OS/2 Warp and eventually IBM threw in the throw and ECOMstation took over OS/2 in Europe. I just checked, ECOMstation2 does not Windows (yay) but still does DOS (in a box).

    I never heard of a single report of malware for a native OS/2 or ECOMstation application. Ever. Have you?

  6. Seems a bit pointless. by Gravis+Zero · · Score: 5, Informative

    If you need your OS/2 apps badly, you can already freely download IBM OS2 Warp 4.0 and run it in a VM or some old metal. As for DOS, FreeDOS reliably runs even on modern hardware though you can also use ReactOS which implements it faithfully. Finally, Win 3.x apps are old hat for WINE. You can SkiFree all day if you want! ;)

    --
    Anons need not reply. Questions end with a question mark.
  7. Re: slashdotted by grub · · Score: 2

    I have never seen such a vivid graphical representation of /dev/null before. Thank you!

    --
    Trolling is a art,
  8. Re:Sorry, it's time has passed by bill_mcgonigle · · Score: 5, Interesting

    OS/2 got interrupt handling exactly right. I could format a floppy, play Wolfenstein in a window, and have a mod tracker playing in the background on a 486/25. BeOS got close but was never quite as good.

    My Linux machine today can't copy to a USB hard drive without making the rest of the system unusable.

    It seems like Linux could still learn some tricks from these old OS's.

    --
    My God, it's Full of Source!
    OUTSIDE_IP=$(dig +short my.ip @outsideip.net)
  9. OS/2 is dead by dhalsim2 · · Score: 2

    I was an OS/2 evangelist and apologist, a major fan. I mourned for OS/2 during it's slow, agonizing death and was likely in a state of denial for a while after it did die. However, at this point, anyone who thinks that OS/2 is viable for anything is really just engaging in necrophilia.

  10. Re:Sorry, it's time has passed by dbIII · · Score: 2

    My Linux machine today can't copy to a USB hard drive without making the rest of the system unusable.

    That's due to the bridge chips being a bottleneck and it impacts on everything - MS Windows, Solaris etc also act that way on the same hardware. It becomes painfully obvious on things like the Raspberry Pi (where a broadcom chip is the weakest link and used for usb, network, etc) but it applies elsewhere. That old system you describe was dealing with it in the cpu so it's much easier to divide up the load.