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Hyperloop One Announces 11 Possible US Routes, Completes Vegas Test Track (theverge.com)
An anonymous reader writes:
Thursday Hyperloop One executives announced that they've finished constructing their 1,640-foot-long "DevLoop" test track in the desert outside Las Vegas. But they also revealed possible U.S. routes for their high-speed transportation solution "to initiate a nationwide conversation about the future of American transportation" -- five of them suggested by state transportation department officials from Texas, Florida, Colorado, Nevada and Missouri.
Last May the company invited pitches for routes to various cities, and Thursday's 11 pitches were chosen from 2,600 participants. These 11 pitches will compete with 24 other pitches from around the globe to be one of the three chosen to "work closely with Hyperloop One engineering and business development teams to explore project development and financing." And Thursday they also announced that "by year's end the company will have a team of 500 engineers, fabricators, scientists and other employees dedicated to bringing the technology to life."
Click through for more information, and the list of the 11 U.S. cities being suggested for hyperloop destinations.
Last May the company invited pitches for routes to various cities, and Thursday's 11 pitches were chosen from 2,600 participants. These 11 pitches will compete with 24 other pitches from around the globe to be one of the three chosen to "work closely with Hyperloop One engineering and business development teams to explore project development and financing." And Thursday they also announced that "by year's end the company will have a team of 500 engineers, fabricators, scientists and other employees dedicated to bringing the technology to life."
Click through for more information, and the list of the 11 U.S. cities being suggested for hyperloop destinations.
- Boston-Somerset-Providence
- Cheyenne-Houston
- Chicago-Columbus-Pittsburgh
- Denver-Colorado Springs
- Denver-Vail
- Kansas City-St. Louis
- Los Angeles-San Diego
- Miami-Orlando
- Reno-Las Vegas
- Seattle-Portland
- Dallas/Fort Worth-Austin-San Antonio-Houston
"The event in the nation's capital is being billed as the company's official US launch," writes The Verge, noting the company's current feasiblity studies have been looking at the United Arab Emirates, Finland and Sweden, the Netherlands, Switzerland, Moscow, and the U.K. "Meanwhile, Hyperloop One's main competitor, Hyperloop Transportation Technologies (also LA-based), is currently exploring building hyperloops in a half-dozen countries in Asia, Europe, and the Middle East." But the senior VP of global operations for Hyperloop One said this week that "We always thought that North America is going to be our biggest market globally."
Elon ought to build the first one down here. It would be great to take a train to New Orleans for lunch, maybe hear a band in Jackson Square, have BBQ at the Broken Spoke in Austin for dinner, catch maybe a Joe Ely show and sleep in my own bed in Houston that same night.
Plus, there ain't shit in between Houston, New Orleans and Austin, so nobody will be inconvenienced.
You are welcome on my lawn.
That video says, there are only artist renditions. This article says, there is a test track in the desert outside Las Vegas.
Either the test track doesn't exist, or the cited video is obsolete/bullshit. Easily verifiable.
Want to go from City A to City B at 500mph? No problem. We already have a complete infrastructure in place that will allow you to go from just about any city to just about any other city at high speed.
It's called airplanes and airports and has existed since before you were born.
The actual flight part of an airplane trip may be fast, but getting to and from the airport generally is not, because airports generally can't be built right in the center of a city. For short domestic flights, the actual flight time is often only a fraction of the overall trip time. I haven't studied these hyperloop proposals, so I don't know where they're proposing to put the stations, but if they can put them close to city centers, then they could have a huge advantage over airplanes.
Oh no... it's the future.
Want to go from City A to City B at 500mph? No problem. We already have a complete infrastructure in place that will allow you to go from just about any city to just about any other city at high speed. It's called airplanes and airports and has existed since before you were born.
This method is uncomfortable (legroom), nauseating (turbulence), frequently delayed or cancelled (weather), with inherent capacity limits (airspace, runway space), and long lines for creepy invasive security checks (TSA) before you get on. High speed trains have none of that.
You should try taking a high speed train some time in Europe or Asia. The station is downtown, often right next to your destination or a quick subway ride away. You can arrive 5 minutes before departure and get on with no problems. There is no security check, just a guy at the platform entrance to check that you have a ticket. The train leaves exactly on time and arrives exactly on time pretty much every trip (and by "on time" I mean actually on time, not within the half hour padding that airplane schedules have to boost on-time rates). The ride is perfectly smooth and quiet, often with free wifi, and plenty of leg room. For trips of 150 to 400 miles, it's frequently the fastest option door-to-door as well. Just try this once, and I think your opinion of high speed rail will change.
Additional Benefits over Air Travel:
- Hyperloop is capable of carrying you car. So basically, you can "drive" from your home in Denver to you hotel in San Antonio in a couple of hours at most. And have your own car to boot!
- Hyperloop will never be affected by weather cancellations. Ever. OK - so a direct hit by a tornado, maybe.
Ever taken one of the European bullet trains? You can take Ryanair cheap between London and Paris, but the train will get you faster from center to center, and without all the airport hassle.
I se a different problem with Hyperloop, the lack of intermediate stations between the end points.. Any practical implementation should have a provision for a small number of intermediate stops. Offline stations (stopped train nit blocking the right of way) would add flexibility.
"We already have a complete infrastructure in place that will allow you to go from just about any city to just about any other city at high speed."
Sure -- assuming that you don't count the hour getting to the airport, the ever shrinking seats, the two hour "security" delay, the overnight stay when you miss your connection in Chicago, Atlanta, or some other garden spot, and the hour collecting your luggage (if it takes the same flight(s)) and getting from your putative destination to where you really want to be. And also assuming that it's not raining or snowing anywhere in North America.
But what the Hell. Maybe The Donald will rein in the TSA and make the planes fly on time.
You can't see ANYTHING from a car, You've got to get out of the goddamned contraption and walk...Edward Abbey
Vacuum Tube Train Transportation
"Evacuated Tube Transport (ETT) is a new kind of transportation system that requires less than two percent of the energy of current transportation methods. It is also much safer, and can be faster. [...]"
https://tech.slashdot.org/stor...
We often (possibly usually) don't want to go to the center of the city. I want to go to suppliers in Auburn Hills (not Detroit proper) or to a plant in Claycomo (not Kansas City), or to Miami Beach (not the City of Miami). Granted, the airport isn't always closest to the majority of final destinations, but the city center isn't necessarily any better.
--Jim (me)
Yeah, but in an airplane you have to deal with your fragile assembly of carbon, nitrogen, oxygen and a couple of patented molecules hunched into a thin, lightweight tube of aluminum and other insubstantial materials at speeds of a significant fraction of sound.
Whereas in a Hyperloop.....
And hell, the TSA would have their sticky little clutches in this industry before you can say 'may I see your passport, please'.
Faster! Faster! Faster would be better!
500 mph? Yes, that is what today's turbojets do.
Thankfully, hyperloop does a minimum, not a max, of 700 mph.
So, quite a bit faster.
And quit a bit cheaper in terms of energy.
I prefer the "u" in honour as it seems to be missing these days.
yeah, I can see why you remain AC. I would too after putting such BS out there.
I prefer the "u" in honour as it seems to be missing these days.
Sure -- assuming that you don't count the hour getting to the airport
The same hour it will take to get to the hyper loop station.
the ever shrinking seats
That hyper loop will also have because they need to pack people in to have a change to even make it economical.
the two hour "security" delay
Security only takes 5 minutes in the real world.
the overnight stay when you miss your connection in
The same over night delays you have with hyper loop when you miss your connection because the track is down for various reasons.
How timely the trains are depends a bit on country. E.g. France has a relatively low frequency of trains but aside from natural disaster they are usually on the minute. Switzerland on the other hand has a relatively slow train network, because the Swiss prefer timely trains over fast trains. So it can happen that a train is standing in a station for half an hour to pick up travelers from connecting trains.
In Germany it depends on route and time of the year or what ever construction project is going on. Often the trains are super timely. But then again there periods of months were everything is delayed.
But my trip from Karlsruhe to Paris, about 550km, takes more less exactly 3h. I start from walking distance of my home (or 4 stations with a tram) and end up in Gare de l'Est 5 or 6 metro stations from the place I live in Paris. Bottom line significantly less than 4h. With a a car, besides the "not so far distance" you need easy 6h - 8h. And flying would mean: I end outside of Paris. Need nearly an hour to get to my destination. And: I have 60 - 90 minutes travel to the next air port close to my town. (And have to be min. 45 mins early for check in procedure)
Depending where you want to go and in which order, using a train is most likely the most comfortable traveling in Europe.
Cost free eBook I read (by iBook/Kobo/Amazon/ObookO/Gutenberg etc.): "The Green Odyssey" by Philip Jose Farmer.
yeah, it is not like they will just keep the moisture and air out of the tubes all the time.
I prefer the "u" in honour as it seems to be missing these days.
This sort of thing would never fly (so to speak) in the US. We could never put the stations anywhere near city center because it would take 100 years to deal with all the lawsuits from the permitting process. In the unlikely event that you could actually build it, you can bet your shoes that the TSA would have all those 'excess' scanners that they pulled out of airports (because they didn't work) placed inconveniently at the station. For your safety and 'security' of course.
And after you replaced your clothes and dusted off your dignity, sat down in a seat designed for an anorexic midget and made it to your designation, you'd find out that being at the City Center wasn't all that helpful because the rest of the mass transit system was an ancient, underfunded, broken down mess.
You must live in some sort of worker's paradise.
Faster! Faster! Faster would be better!
yeah, it is not like they will just keep the moisture and air out of the tubes all the time.
Except when they want to load and unload passengers and need to put air back into the tube.
If you talk to Vail locals who knew the original founders (there's plenty still around), they will tell you that Vail's site was chosen in part because it's on the opposite side of Vail Pass from Denver, thus making it hard for large numbers of people to get in after a big snow dump. I don't think Vail would want this tunnel thing.
Trains remind me of trains, with trains running around all over the place. I like trains.
And quit a bit cheaper in terms of energy.
Except for the massive amount of energy needed to operate the vacuum pumps 24/7 to maintain your vacuum pressure.
Security only takes 5 minutes. You must be be Rei (See his/her Slashdot alias)
Guns don't kill people; Physics kills people! - John Lithgow as Dick Solomon on Third Rock From The Sun
So now you think you are God? ROTFLMAO
Guns don't kill people; Physics kills people! - John Lithgow as Dick Solomon on Third Rock From The Sun
Holy Shit ... The irony ... it burns!
Guns don't kill people; Physics kills people! - John Lithgow as Dick Solomon on Third Rock From The Sun
Hyperloop will never be affected by weather cancellations.
...because they'll never be built.
Just cruising through this digital world at 33 1/3 rpm...
Learn how vacuum system work before you comment you fucking moron.
^^^^^^This, time 1000.
Obtaining and maintaining thevacuum level that would be required for the hyperloop to work is no small task. Most people don't understand what's required to pull a decent vacuum and keep it at an acceptable level.
For a structure as big as the hyperloop just the outgassing of the cars and other internal parts alone will be a major impediment to achieving the required vacuum.
Even worse, you re-expose the entire vehicle to atmosphere regularly giving it no real chance to ever fully degas.
The hyperloop will never be built to any real scale and will never, ever fulfill the grandeur of its claims.
Just cruising through this digital world at 33 1/3 rpm...
Hyperloops have nothing to do with "vacuum systems".
What kind of head injury do you have, Angel? The whole premise of the hyperloop is that the vehicles run in a vacuum. That's literally what it's all about.
Just cruising through this digital world at 33 1/3 rpm...
yeah, I can see why you remain AC. I would too after putting such BS out there.
The fact is that, anonymous or not, he's right.
Pulling a vacuum in all the miles and miles and miles of tubing will require an immense amount of power to acheive, and an immense amount of power to keep it under useable vacuum.
The expansion and shrinkage of the tunnel is also an enormous engineering obstacle that is unlikely to be solved at any practical price.
Just cruising through this digital world at 33 1/3 rpm...
Building fast trains in Switzerland is highly nontrivial because of all the mountains. Not even the Swiss are rich enough to build all the tunnels and bridges that would be necessary.
entropy happens
It is conceivable that a tube wall sturdy enough to hold up under 15 psi = 103kPa pressure won't leak a whole lot. I'm assuming sliding or dilating or something-ing barriers at the stations to keep trash, luggage, small children, etc from being sucked into the traveling portion of the tube.
OTOH, the cost of a hyperloop tube -- whether buried, run along the surface, or suspended from giant genetically modified vultures -- is likely to be pretty high compared to a rail line. It might be cheaper to have a SpaceX rockets fly you from LA to San Diego than to buy a hyperloop ticket.
You can't see ANYTHING from a car, You've got to get out of the goddamned contraption and walk...Edward Abbey
Of course, God Emperor Trump will solve everything.
If it goes to Rockway, Ogdenville, and North Haverbrook, I'm all for it. It'll put them on the map for sure.
"How many billion dollars has "Thunderf00t" made with his space and car companies? Yes, it's the same number as you - none"
About the same number as Musk's high tech schema also. Solar Cities seems to be (have been?) a money sucking disaster whose troubles have been hidden by tucking it into Tesla . Many folks think it was/is a scam aimed a skimming off government subsidies and leaving homeowners with an incomprehensible, unbreakable lease on equipment that doesn't work as promised. Tesla looks likely to be a monumental bubble although it possibly has some chance of pulling through. The battery factory may well be OK although it faces REALLY stiff East Asian competition. Space X is an admirable effort and it may eventually show significant profits depending on how many of the reused rockets self destruct leaving the company with a bill for the destruction. But if you believe the WSJ, SpaceX profits were slim in 2014, negative in 2015 and probably minimal to non-existent in 2016.
You can't see ANYTHING from a car, You've got to get out of the goddamned contraption and walk...Edward Abbey
LOL.
Only if it is leaking. And with no leaks, no big deal.
I prefer the "u" in honour as it seems to be missing these days.
lets see.
A loading tube where passengers get into cars. Door ahead of car(s) opens. The cars go into the variable length tube area. In doing so, it will push the majority of air that is in the tube out.
So, now door closes, and values open into another side tube that was previously evacuated (which has pumps always working to lower the pressure for the next car). Most air rushes out, values close, and several pumps start working on evacuating the rest.
With the little bit that was left, it is gone in a minute or two. 2nd door in front opens and car(s) enter the main tube and leave.
Issues solved.
I prefer the "u" in honour as it seems to be missing these days.
nope. Heck, they do this now with Large Hadron Collider.
In fact, there are a number of companies that deal with this that say it is a none issue.
I prefer the "u" in honour as it seems to be missing these days.
darn good thing that you and the others around here have nothing to do with submarines, or space craft.
YOu would never have accomplished a thing.
I prefer the "u" in honour as it seems to be missing these days.
Heck, they do this now with Large Hadron Collider
At an incredible expense. Plus that vacuum chamber has a diameter of a few centimeters. Now where near the two meter diameter hyper loop will require.
Calling it: in before Hyperloop travel becomes unsustainably slow due to terrorism concerns.
The Lege is currently working on legislation meant to restrict the ability of transportation projects, specifically high speed rail, to use state funds and emminent domain to complete the projects.
And why do you need state funds to build something so obviously profitable? Private companies are going into space now, why not the ground.
If they were building an pipeline, that would be great.
And what is the Hyperloop but the ultimate pipeline?
Austin you are stuck on unreliable busses.
Not when self driving taxis become commonplace (~3 years)
"There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
but if they can put them close go city centers, then they could have a huge advantage over airplanes
Approaching the city center implies rapidly escalating costs for right-of-way.
If I understand the Hyperloop correctly, it is more or less as rigidly constrained in its design as a pneumatic tube or a pipeline. Even the gentlest of curves become a problem. You can't simply route around obstructions that would be too expensive to clear.
Given the urban sprawl and ubiquitous cars there is no real point in connecting old city centers with other city centers.
One of the suggested routes is Chicago-Pittsburgh. The distance between I76-I79 intersection north of Pittsburgh and I294-I80 intersection south of Chicago is about 480 miles. A non stop train at 160 mph can cover it in 3 hours. If it is possible to drive a car on to a flat bed car at I76-I79, park and sit inside the car for three hours while the train hauls you up to I80-I294 could be developed at reasonable cost. Add a few passenger cars for "first class" and let people sit in their own cars for "economy". Add concessionaires for food service for another line of revenue.
If highway intersections about 450 miles apart are connected by such trains covering them in 3 hours, and if there is a network of them and if the service has enough frequency, there will be enough demand for it. You save on rental cars where you go, and you can travel 900 miles a night on two legs, without paying for motel/hotel. Saving on tolls too.
Rolling friction between steel wheels and steel rails is so low, a two ton car goes 225 miles on a gallon of gas. 450 miles in three hours for a 2 ton car and five passengers can be priced competitively with gas and tolls. For USA such a solution that allows you to take the car with you is a lot more appealing because of the car culture and the lower population density.
I grew up in India with very cheap trains. I could catch a train at 10pm in Bangalore, with a sleeper berth, and wake up in Chennai or Hyderabad after a good night sleep. I have seen how expensive it is to grade and level and lay tracks. It is a criminal waste we let wonderfully graded rail right of ways decay and rot without proper maintenance. Worse, we let the continuous rights of way be broken into fragments by selling off a few parcels of land along the way. We won't be able to rebuild them ever.
sed -e 's/Chuck Norris/Rajnikant/g' joke > fact
Even the LHC is tiny by comparison to the proposed tracks, and it has suffered many leaks. It also is located underground and further temperature controlled giving it a far more stable heat expansion of just a 1mm, but even that they have to be careful with. The hyperloop propose is in a completely different ballpark as far as technical issues. Even if they could solve thermal expansion, tectonic plate shifting, vacuum maintenance, etc, they still ultimately have the biggest issue, the tube is SERIOUSLY dangerous if damaged as it has an absolutely insane amount of energy potential in that huge vacuum and the passengers are fundamentally right at ground zero of that danger.
The city center *is* better, in the sense that you can catch a cab in or out any time of day or night. Try flagging a cab at 3 AM in Auburn Hills. They probably went home after the bars closed and they took all the drunks on the scenic route.
How is the Riemann zeta function like Trump rallies? Both have an endless number of trivial zeros.
I love how you declare they'll have none of that when obviously they'll have at least some of it.
The first terror attack that blows a hole in the pipe and kills everyone in the tunnel system will at least give you the same security/wait issues.
Heck, they do this now with Large Hadron Collider.
LOL!
The tube diameter of the LHC is 5cm (external diameter 53 mm, wall thickness 1.5 mm). So it's only 5 cm across while the hyperbullshit loop is supposed to be 2 meters across.
The LHC is a bitch to evacuate and keep evacuated, and they almost never EVER vent it to atmosphere, unlike parts of the hyperbullshit loop which will be regularly and frequently vented to raw atmosphere.
.
Oh, and don't forget that the Large Hadron Collider doesn't have multiple vehicles zooming around inside it at 200 MPH.
If you can't see the basic flaws in your (lack of) reasoning, no amount of information will clue you in to just how impractical the hyperbullshit loop really is.
It's just NOT going to happen, no matter how bad the hyperloop fanbois want it to happen.
Just cruising through this digital world at 33 1/3 rpm...
California has mountains, and mountains block high speed rail, unless you drill tunnels through them, and tunnels are very expensive. France has flat land, which is cheap for HSR. China and Japan had enough population density to make it worthwhile to deal with some mountains. California and Australia don't have enough people to make it worthwhile. But hey, politicians want HSR, just like France.
Oh yeah, because as we well know trains are never late. Our train services have been the epitome of punctuality to the point that I have probably not arrived on time more than twice in the past five years and have still have to leave an hour and a half early every day to account for the delays. - signed: Germany
So many people lost their lives when we undertook learning to fly, all the way through to rocketry and going to outer space. Every step of the way there were failures and we learned something new re engineered and now we take flying for granted. So maybe someday this kind of travel will be workable, but I dont see it anytime soon.
I just can't get the idea out of my head that when this idea fails, its going to fail in a very catastrophic way, something that 'wasn't considered possible', or wasn't even considered. The forces involved here are pretty hefty, the environment uncontrollable and unforgiving. Let alone any consideration for vandalism or worse, a structure like that seems especially vulnerable to those kinds of things.
The current holder of the angel'o'sphere or whatever account bought it from someone who had quit Slashdot, came around and acted like a retard a year or two back, left, and now either:
A: They have returned, acting just as retarded as before.
B: Some other retard bought the account from the first retard who bought it from the original user.
Just ignore it, like the 11001011whatever guy and MightyMartian.
What happens when there's a breach or rupture in the tube? The pressure rises gradually.
In the same way that a balloon pops gradually, sure.
A minimum of 700 mph requires Infinite G force.
I've made a huge mistake.
I thought one of the advantages of the hyperloop idea was that you can have loads of intermediate stations. Because people travel in small pods, they don't need to stop at every intermediate station like a regular train. Unless you live in the city, you still need to travel quite a bit to catch a high speed train, but your suburb or village could have its own hyperloop station, allowing you to travel long distance from craphole to 2 horse town without changing transportation (which is the real time sink in travel, especially air travel).
If construction was anything like programming, an incorrectly fitted lock would bring down the entire building...
Surely you mean "Click through for more information, and the list of the 22 U.S. cities being suggested for hyperloop destinations."
Unless of course they're makng a big star with a switch in the middle
Actually, the best experts on vacuum in Europe are partnering with hyperloop because they claim it works easily.
I prefer the "u" in honour as it seems to be missing these days.
Want to go from City A to City B at 500mph? No problem. We already have a complete infrastructure in place
Really? Because in general what I see in major airports is that they aren't actually anywhere within the city limits. That's before you consider the arrive 2 hours before hand garbage.
They should try China instead. The USA is not even very interested in looking after the infrastructure already in place.
signed: Germany
Please don't sign on behalf of Germany. Rather sign on behalf of the one city you're likely having problems with.
signed: The rest of Germany which has no problems with trains.
"Try to" exterminate?
The dangers of excessive individualism are nothing compared to the oppressiveness of excessive collectivism
That's nice of you to report in, That-One-Village-In-Germany-That-Does-Not-Have-Delays? http://www.handelsblatt.com/un...
These videos mostly either deliberately mis-state or overstate the issues - try some fact checking for once. They are made by someone who makes money by stirring controversy to push up his video views and make money and "debunking" hyperloop is a massive cash cow for him. He started off with fairly reputable science analysis but over the years moved to more emotive/controversial topics as these made him money.
A lot of the arguments in the video are based on the "alpha document". The document itself points out it is about ideas and not detailed either in engineering or physics analysis - just a starting point for detail to be added later and ideas to be used or discarded with further analysis. It is not a fixed blueprint for the final design.
SpaceX/Hyperloop themselves say "low pressure" and not "vacuum" - the pressure in the tubes is expected to be around the same as a jet plane experiences which is easy to maintain compared to a hard vacuum. The 99.9% vacuum that is often stated did not offically come from Hyperloop but is a figure that was mentioned as a "possible/maybe" very early on by latched onto by the media after one person gave an off the cuff remark.
Low pressure will be less force on the walls compared to what is stated in the videos.
The crossbraces shown in images of the pipes are for transport/lifting support where there will be uneven forces (not the same as the even pressure forces once sealed) and once the pipes are joined and mounted are not needed.
The mythbusters experiments showed that they had to do *significant damage* for the tanker to collapse and tankers have much thinner skins than the hyperloop track does.
Sudden shock point pressure on a surface/material/tube is not the same as constant or slowly changing uniform pressure.
Sealed expansion joints are a many times solved thing for low pressure systems and long pipelines even on the scale we are talking about for hyperloop.
As are station "airlocks" and emergency air for passengers
The crash/failure would not be as stated because 1) low pressure not vacuum and 2) vehicles will not be tight to the walls as in the youtube glass tube experiments.
Cars being pushed then released on a surface lose speed due to friction once not being pushed - surprise! Physics working as expected. The competition was about an effective shape of the pod in low pressure in the tube and not about propulsion/drive/levitation/wheel friction for the final system. Also is it a surprise that a very short test track can't reach the speed in 10 seconds AND THEN STOP safely before hitting the end where the speed of a full scale system could over several minutes of acceleration over several dozen miles?.
[The Universe] has gone offline.
Major advantage of the hyper loop is billions in government subsidies to build it. Note also that they are assuming that they won't have to pay any property taxes. Curious, that assumption.
Also, all efficiencies of the European passenger trains are based on a horrible flaw of pushing freight into the roads. In the US, we have about half the carbon footprint per net ton-mile of freight due to the aggressive use of trains.
Does this give new life to the phrase 'Totally Tubular?'
That does not make it a "vacuum system" as the parent implies who tries to explain us with insults since 10 posts that the pipe will need to get a new vacuum for every trip, hence needs to be evacuated for every trip and will not work because of moisture ... etc. p.p.
Cost free eBook I read (by iBook/Kobo/Amazon/ObookO/Gutenberg etc.): "The Green Odyssey" by Philip Jose Farmer.
Thursday Hyperloop One executives announced
When did Thursday become an adjective? Was it supposed to say thirty? Or thirsty?
systemd is Roko's Basilisk.
Overpressure Physical Effects 20 psi Heavily built concrete buildings are severely damaged or demolished. 10 psi Reinforced concrete buildings are severely damaged or demolished. Most people are killed. 5 psi Most buildings collapse. Injuries are universal, fatalities are widespread. 3 psi Residential structures collapse. Serious injuries are common, fatalities may occur. 1 psi Window glass shatters Light injuries from fragments occur.
http://www.atomicarchive.com/E... It will utterly obliterate any and every pod in the tube. You'd be hard pressed to find a piece of human meat bigger than a baseball. And that is really just one concern of a dozen.
I'm skeptical myself of the business practicality of this. Given enough $$'s I'm sure it could be made to work, but how does that translate to ticket prices? Having said that, they are starting with some small-scale prototypes. This should give the engineers and business types some actual numbers to play with. And start to find some of those unknown-unknowns...I don't think this will work out, but I'm hoping I'm wrong.
That does not make it a "vacuum system"
Yes, that is exactly what it is, in every sense of the word. As someone below said, "You're a complete moron."
The entire hyperbullshit loop is a vacuum system, that's the very basis of its design. The fact that you don't understand this means that you are, in fact, an idiot.
-
that the pipe will need to get a new vacuum for every trip, hence needs to be evacuated for every trip and will not work because of moisture
No, that's not what's been said. The entire hyperbullshit loop will have to be pumped down and kept pumped down, which is where a lot of the expense and impracticability will come into play. I worked with vacuum extensively early in my career and I can tell you that you simply do not know what you're talking about. Getting a good, clean vacuum in the size of container they're proposing is incredibly difficult at best, and is never going to be practical at the scale they intend.
To recap:
1) The entire hyperbullshit loop is a complex vacuum system that will be very difficult and expensive to operate effectively, and,
2) You're a moron.
Just cruising through this digital world at 33 1/3 rpm...
The actual flight part of an airplane trip may be fast, but getting to and from the airport generally is not
Only because the USA refuses to build trains. In a city like Stockholm you board a high-speed train at the airport. 20 minutes later you're downtown. Missed the train? No problem, there's another one in 10 minutes.
The stronger the vacuum the less air friction and therefore the higher the maximum speed possible. The system can work at full air pressure but it would be very slow. So it's a trade-off between speed and cost (to maintain vacuum).
The TSA will be all over any commercial hyperloop system. The security checks are not going away.
Major advantage of the hyper loop is billions in government subsidies to build it.
That's the point of government subsidies. To build / run stuff for the public that benefits the citizenry.
Hyperloop should be cheaper than normal rail because you can make it elevated (off the ground) and therefore don't need to own the ground. Normal rail is cheaper than roads because twin track takes up the same space as a 2 lane back road but caries the same as a 12 lane superhighway.
Lets see, DB, the main carrier in Germany a country of 80million people with one of the largest train networks in the world taking 40000 trips per day serving 1.8million people per day, ... all it takes is every train to be late by 10 seconds to get to that 3.79million minutes figure.
Context: It matters!
And as someone who travels daily on DB intercity, and twice a week internationally I will fully stand behind my claim when I say there is no more punctual mode of transport available to people. Fuck 2 weeks ago I drove by car because I had to make an intermediate stop. Traffic changed my trip from 2 hours to 4 hours. Coming into Hamburg a few weeks ago by plane was delayed. No actually that's not true at all. My plane was outright cancelled, I got to Hamburg 2 days later than planned.
Major train delays beyond like a minute or two are incredibly rare compared to delays incurred with every other form of transport.
Context: It matters!
Why? Ummm, so people can get in and out, you fool.
WTF, what is wrong with you?
The people don't "exit the train into the former vaccum" walk out of the tunnel, close the tunnel again, pump out air again. That would be completely silly and technically much to complicated anyway. Why would anyone do that and why are you so dumb to think that? And insult people here with _YOUR_ stupidity?
The tunnel keeps its vacuum. Either you
a) have docking tubes that connect the car with the exit, and people walk through that
b) the nose of the car docks with the tunnel end, you seal off the car with a ballon/tire like seal
(Even though they may be floating on mag lev, the weight still has to go somewhere, science-boy. That's basic basic basic physics.)
Yes, obviously. But as the car touches nothing it is irrelevant how fast it runs, except for energy to accelerate and breaking.
All your fluffy arguments are just bollocks, but I give up to talk to someone who does not grasp basic physics and is to lazy to read up how the hyperloop is supposed to work and instead of this always invents "fake facts" why it can not work. And on top of that because of his own lack of knowledge is insulting his discussion partners constantly ... so farewell.
Cost free eBook I read (by iBook/Kobo/Amazon/ObookO/Gutenberg etc.): "The Green Odyssey" by Philip Jose Farmer.
Once again, some random old guy on Slashdot has all the answers that teams of highly paid engineers and PhDs building an actual system have failed to account for.
Ah, so that's why my steel balloons didn't work.
The Donald can't even rein in his own hair.
http://newatlas.com/vacuum-com...
I prefer the "u" in honour as it seems to be missing these days.
The stronger the vacuum the less air friction and therefore the higher the maximum speed possible.
Thanks, Captain Obvious.
You're missing the point. That has nothing to do with what's being discussed.
Just cruising through this digital world at 33 1/3 rpm...
Once again, some random old guy on Slashdot has all the answers that teams of highly paid engineers and PhDs building an actual system have failed to account for.
That is correct.
And by the way, I'm not the only one pointing out all the places they fucked up when squirting out their engineering fantasy.
Why don't you hop in your flying car and zoom down there, let us know how they're coming along?
Just cruising through this digital world at 33 1/3 rpm...
The Japanese did "try" to spread plague with bombs made out fleas ment to infect rats to in turn infect and kill humans! But who cares about that shit, HERE COMES MONGO!
oyeeesh.
Can you just go back to waving your cane at twitter users, Mr Old Guy? That's funny to watch. This by contrast is just painful.
PS Are you still convinced I'm a Trump supporter?
SJW n. One who posts facts.
Except when they want to load and unload passengers and need to put air back into the tube.
So... you think they refill the entire tube each time so let the passengers out? Trust me, it's not Rei who's a dumbass. Also WTF? You bothered to register a username just to have a go at another poster? Priorities, dude!
SJW n. One who posts facts.
Can you just go back to waving your cane at twitter users, Mr Old Guy?
I don't have a cane, so no, I can't.
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That's funny to watch. This by contrast is just painful.
Yes, science is often funny to those who don't understand it.
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PS Are you still convinced I'm a Trump supporter?
Are you now admitting you're not?
Just cruising through this digital world at 33 1/3 rpm...
so you can train while you train.
So...the trains will have training wheels?
Ezekiel 23:20
No, it's not. It's only operated under significantly diminished pressure, but vacuum is not required, and in the aerodynamic lift proposals, it's actually impossible for the capsules to operate in it.
Ezekiel 23:20
Is there something about Cheyenne that makes the whole population travel happy?
Making a metro area of less than 100k people a major travel destination sounds a bit like bullshit to me.
No, your children are not the special ones. Nor are your pets.
So pretty much half of the time, I'm breathing vacuum! :]
Ezekiel 23:20
Yes it is stupid - unless the real goal is to get in on the flow of government money.
Recycled failed ideas are the norm of our time..
Hyperloops will have similar, perhaps even worse, issues with legroom, nausea, and a lack of capacity, plus additional issues with noise, and that's if they're able to resolve the other issues.
You are not alone. This is not normal. None of this is normal.
If the train station were in Auburn Hills, then it would be pretty much identical to the situation with airports today, i.e., there'd be a taxi stand with lots of taxis.
Actually, Auburn Hills and DTW are pretty bad examples. There's not much of a taxi culture here.
--Jim (me)
Anyway, my wife says I now have to go and drink whisky, so ttyl.
The drinking explains a lot of your comments.
Just cruising through this digital world at 33 1/3 rpm...
The drinking explains a lot of your comments.
Quite possibly, but at least my posts have an explanation.
Still decided whether or not I'm a Trumpanzee?
SJW n. One who posts facts.
Actually it is a perfectly normal speed train. Arlanda is 45km away from both Stockholm and Uppsala. It runs at about 150km/h (100m/h)
I agree. I think if hyperloops have a place, it's on long straight flat routes like Chicago-Dallas where many of those issues are avoided. Not on relatively short routes like LA-San Francisco where traditional high speed rail is appropriate.
It's called airplanes and airports and has existed since before you were born.
You mean since World War II, and there are people alive today who were born earlier. Off my lawn with you, young fool.
Airplanes were invented waaay before ww2.
Wanna buy a shirt?
https://www.redbubble.com/people/stealthfinger/shop?asc=u
Once again, some random old guy on Slashdot has all the answers that teams of highly paid engineers and PhDs building an actual system have failed to account for.
That is correct.
And by the way, I'm not the only one pointing out all the places they fucked up when squirting out their engineering fantasy.
Why don't you hop in your flying car and zoom down there, let us know how they're coming along?
Not being funny, but I'm just a random guy with no real experience in vacuum at all and even I know it's never gunna fucking work.
Wanna buy a shirt?
https://www.redbubble.com/people/stealthfinger/shop?asc=u
If only they had hired you. I'm sure this terror attack thing flew right under their radar.
So what, are they thinking it won't be a target or that it's damage/sabotage proof?
Wanna buy a shirt?
https://www.redbubble.com/people/stealthfinger/shop?asc=u
The Donald can't even rein in his own hair.
I can't be sure but I think it's supposed to look like that.
Wanna buy a shirt?
https://www.redbubble.com/people/stealthfinger/shop?asc=u
I didn't realize deer were that strong!
They carry some pretty high-power rifles these days
Wanna buy a shirt?
https://www.redbubble.com/people/stealthfinger/shop?asc=u
The train leaves exactly on time and arrives exactly on time pretty much every trip (and by "on time" I mean actually on time,
OOOOHHHH KAY.
You had me up to here.
You've clearly never taken trains in Europe. Their on time performance makes the Airline industry look good (which actually isn't bad over here). I live in the UK and always give myself at least 30 mins padding on any rail journey. Even though London is a mere 45 mins away, getting on the tube increases that time by at least half an hour. You'd best hope there are no leaves on the track or a signal failure somewhere near Blackpool or you London based train will be delayed.
Compared to the US, air travel is actually quite well organised and easy to take. With regional airports and automatic or web check in, I can rock up at a regional airport like Southampton with less than an hour to spare. Beats taking a train and the tube to get to the Eurostar at St Pancras, then getting on an Intercity in Brussels to get to Amsterdam. Sure the train is more comfortable but its more hassle and takes considerably longer than flying SOU-AMS.
OK, I'm being a bit harsh on trains, but they aren't the magic bullet people think they are. They're great if you've got a line that goes direct, however changing trains is a right PITA. if you're going to be spending more than 2.5 hours extra on the train, it's faster to fly in Europe.
I'm flying out of Heathrow tomorrow. I'm giving it plenty of time but honestly, I think I'm going to spend most of it sitting at a pub airside having a few pints. I expect I'm going to spend more time on ze M3 getting there than going through Heathrow security.
Calling someone a "hater" only means you can not rationally rebut their argument.
It would help you if you actually read more thoroughly. DB does not even track delays shorter than six minutes. The fact that it is late all the time is not even disputed by DB at this point, who blame it on the fact that they have too much money and keep renovating their routes.
If you are interested in anecdotal evidence, I am yet to travel from Frankfurt Airport and arrive on time. And if we want to talk about context, yes, trains are fantastic, if you travel in Japan, they are utter trash if you travel in Germany or some third world cesspool. Implementation, it matters.
I have taken trains in Europe, but not in the UK, maybe it's worse there.
I think air travel is more reliable in Europe than the US, probably because there are fewer major weather events (thunderstorms and blizzards).
Feel free to try and drive to Frankfurt. Give me a call if you get there. I'm not even going to say "when".
People like to shit on their lawn saying the grass is greener on the other side, without realising how very nice their garden actually is. German trains are still incredibly reliable in the grand scheme of things.
By the way greetings from emsland. It only took me an hour longer than expected to drive here today. I would have caught a train if I found a connection which worked.
For sure, the rail system in the UK is worse that in Europe (or at least worse than high speed France and Belgium).
The UK is also the most expensive train tickets in Europe. There is no hight speed rail at all. It costs far more, and is slower and less reliable to travel from Kent to London that it does to go from Paris to Brussels.
I spend 7 hours going from London to Norfolk, the train stopped for no obvious reason 1/2 way, then later one we all had to get out and get on buses to complete the journey. It was damn expensive too.
"The best part? I became an ordained minister while not wearing pants." -- CleverNickName
Hyperloop will never be affected by weather cancellations.
...because they'll never be built.
And they'll have a 100% safety record!
To have a right to do a thing is not at all the same as to be right in doing it
^^^^^^This, time 1000.
Obtaining and maintaining thevacuum level that would be required for the hyperloop to work is no small task. Most people don't understand what's required to pull a decent vacuum and keep it at an acceptable level.
I've had some exposure to vacuums and creating them (although I specialized in the thermal gas sources) and I have been wondering about how they plan to do it although they seem to be well within mechanical pump range and not needing anything to exotic like diffusion pumps. It also does pose some interesting ideas. That you have a tube with a large car (piston) basically means you have made the entire apparatus into a large mechanical pump. Move the car at slower speeds down the tube with higher pressure ahead of it past various pump/vent stations to help clear it, and once in operation, just the action of using it might provide the pumping action needed to keep it at acceptable levels.
Ah, so that's why my steel balloons didn't work.
Perhaps you should try lead.
And quit a bit cheaper in terms of energy.
Except for the massive amount of energy needed to operate the vacuum pumps 24/7 to maintain your vacuum pressure.
Thing is that the car moving down the tube will work like the world's largest mechanical pump during normal operation. Builds up a pressure in front of it that can be vented off at periodic stations along the way.
Moisture in the air has no affect on the ability to create a vacuum. Get your retarded shill ass out of here so that you will not make even more people stupid.
Actually, i think one of the main points of the hyperloop is for it to be in a tube kept at near-vacuum condition. Therefore there will be no 'wall of air' traveling in front of the train, the near vacuum condition prevents air resistance from slowing down the train, and would also prevent a 'wall of air' scenario in front of the tube.
earlier on, musk had proposed a complete vacuum in the tube. This would be extremely costly AND would mean that any crack or leak in the tube would cause loss of operation and perhaps some explosive effects due to the rapid pressure differential. Using an almost-vacuum was supposed to get us the best of both worlds, low air resistance and no disasters when cracks or leaks inevitably form due to normal wear and tear.
That you have a tube with a large car (piston) basically means you have made the entire apparatus into a large mechanical pump.
Maybe, but I don't think there's an airtight seal between the car and the tube, in fact I think the whole design calls for a minimum clearance to prevent contact problems that would occur at the speeds they're claiming to operate at.
So although you might get some modest leading pressure wave that could be used to help evacuate some of the bulk air, the level at which laminar flow and molecular flow would occur never be reached at all by the vehicle acting as a piston.
Just cruising through this digital world at 33 1/3 rpm...
..because they'll never be built.
And they'll have a 100% safety record!
Well, you're not wrong there, lol. (Not counting construction mishaps and fatalities, that is.)
Just cruising through this digital world at 33 1/3 rpm...
Quite possibly, but at least my posts have an explanation.
So does the way a monkey flings its poop.
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Still decided whether or not I'm a Trumpanzee?
You seem obsessed with my opinion on this, which is both flattering and disturbing.
Just cruising through this digital world at 33 1/3 rpm...
You seem obsessed with my opinion on this, which is both flattering and disturbing.
Fascinated more than obsessed I'd say. It's like watching a train wreck, you don't really want to see it but it's hard not to watch if it's happening in front of you.
SJW n. One who posts facts.
Fascinated more than obsessed I'd say.
I'm flattered that you find what I do to be so fascinating.
Just cruising through this digital world at 33 1/3 rpm...
I'm flattered that you find what I do to be so fascinating.
Flattered? Welp... That's kinda like being flattered by the police attention you 'd get for indecent exposure, but sure, whatever floats your boat.
SJW n. One who posts facts.
Maybe, but I don't think there's an airtight seal between the car and the tube ... actually ... you think? I mean ... you suddenly are thinking?
You
Wow ...
Cost free eBook I read (by iBook/Kobo/Amazon/ObookO/Gutenberg etc.): "The Green Odyssey" by Philip Jose Farmer.
Consider my boat floated.
Just cruising through this digital world at 33 1/3 rpm...
You ... actually ... you think?
Yes, you should try it some time if you ever leave your basement and your fictional wife.
Just cruising through this digital world at 33 1/3 rpm...
ew.
SJW n. One who posts facts.