Slashdot Mirror


SpaceX Will Launch Secretive X-37B Spaceplane's Next Mission (latimes.com)

schwit1 quotes a report from Los Angeles Times: SpaceX will launch the Air Force's X-37B experimental spaceplane later this year, in the military's latest vote of confidence in the Elon Musk-led space company. This will be the first time SpaceX has launched the uncrewed robotic vehicle. United Launch Alliance, a joint venture between Boeing Co. and Lockheed Martin Corp., has launched the spaceplane's previous four missions atop one of its Atlas V rockets. The Air Force Rapid Capabilities Office, which is responsible for the X-37B's experimental operations, said it was "very excited" for the fifth flight, which will test how special electronics and heat pipes will fare during a long-duration space mission. The Air Force has two of the spaceplanes, which look like miniature versions of the space shuttle and are known officially as X-37B Orbital Test Vehicles. The first X-37B was launched in 2010.

83 comments

  1. Secrets... are only secrets when you keep them by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Can't be too secretive, I just read an article about it.

    1. Re:Secrets... are only secrets when you keep them by sphealey · · Score: 4, Insightful

      = = = Can't be too secretive, I just read an article about it. = = =

      So what exactly does it do then?

    2. Re:Secrets... are only secrets when you keep them by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Since the craft is secretive, the secret must be that the craft is sentient enough to actively secret its sentience.

    3. Re:Secrets... are only secrets when you keep them by Salgak1 · · Score: 4, Funny

      It appears to be a space shuttle, scaled for squirrels. And it's classified.

      So, obviously, it's OFFICIALLY a Secret Squirrel Program. . . .

    4. Re:Secrets... are only secrets when you keep them by Rei · · Score: 2
      --
      We gotta go to a crappy town where I'm a hero.
    5. Re:Secrets... are only secrets when you keep them by BlueCoder · · Score: 1

      I've speculated on all sorts of things in the past. Primarily it's a movable spy satellite system. Both direct observation from the platform and deployment on micro satellites that are much harder to track. The drone can sit up there until it runs out of resources/fuel. It can also adjust it's orbit on demand.

      There are militaries the world over that track both commercial and government spy satellites that will save and hide their movement until a times when the satellites no longer have direct line of sight or are in other such blind spots. The X37b can do custom spying on demand. It can also be deployed to pick up telemetry from other satellites and possibly even to jam them.

    6. Re:Secrets... are only secrets when you keep them by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      It's a test vehicle.

      They're testing the technology they would use to build any of: a reusable surveillance platform, a system for capturing satellites, or an orbital weapons platform.

      It might be doing some surveillance on these missions, and it might be capable of a capture mission, but so far it seems to actually juts be "does it work in practice like the theory says it should". Remember, even the STS orbiters started with Enterprise which was simply an aerodynamics test.

    7. Re:Secrets... are only secrets when you keep them by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Hopefully they're planning to test those EmDrives in microgravity.

    8. Re:Secrets... are only secrets when you keep them by nitehawk214 · · Score: 1

      After launch, go to http://www.heavens-above.com/ to see exactly when the X-37B will be overhead and visible.

      --
      I'm a good cook. I'm a fantastic eater. - Steven Brust
    9. Re:Secrets... are only secrets when you keep them by PPH · · Score: 1

      So what exactly does it do then?

      Test how special electronics and heat pipes will fare during a long-duration space mission.

      There, the secret is out. Might as well just cancel the whole project.

      Or ... they wouldn't lie to us, would they?

      --
      Have gnu, will travel.
  2. "Vote of confidence" by Opportunist · · Score: 1, Flamebait

    More like "vote of cutting corners". Aka "you're cheaper, I'm insured, fire it up for all I care".

    --
    We used to have a Bill of Rights. Now, with the rights gone, all we have left is the bill.
    1. Re:"Vote of confidence" by oobayly · · Score: 2

      Surely the USAF self insures?

    2. Re:"Vote of confidence" by Rei · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Indeed. And I'm sure they have quite a bit of money wrapped up in the X-37B.

      --
      We gotta go to a crappy town where I'm a hero.
    3. Re:"Vote of confidence" by bill_mcgonigle · · Score: 4, Insightful

      It's the US Military - cost is not a factor.

      What excites the USAF brass is SpaceX turnaround. Musk is targeting 24 hrs for a Falcon 9b5 turnaround; with any extra capacity he could put another X37B into orbit with a few days' notice. That is tremendously advantageous for space soldiers and spies.

      --
      My God, it's Full of Source!
      OUTSIDE_IP=$(dig +short my.ip @outsideip.net)
    4. Re:"Vote of confidence" by drinkypoo · · Score: 1

      Keeping costs low makes it easier to hide programs that they don't want The People to know about, so there's benefit there as well.

      --
      "You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"
    5. Re:"Vote of confidence" by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Keeping the corporate handouts high makes it easier for a little to spill over into some general's private retirement fund.

    6. Re:"Vote of confidence" by Rockoon · · Score: 1

      Keeping costs low makes it easier to hide programs that they don't want

      sigh....

      Is this opposite day for you again?

      It is keeping budgets high that allows hiding expenditures, dumbass.

      --
      "His name was James Damore."
    7. Re:"Vote of confidence" by drinkypoo · · Score: 1

      Keeping costs low makes it easier to hide programs that they don't want

      It is keeping budgets high that allows hiding expenditures, dumbass.

      Costs != Budgets, kid. Keep trying though, son.

      --
      "You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"
    8. Re:"Vote of confidence" by HornWumpus · · Score: 1

      In the technology, not so much the prototype.

      Wanna bet the between flight overhaul cost is a big % of the per unit cost? How would we ever know?

      --
      John McAfee 'It was like that time I hired that Bangkok prostitute; to do my taxes, while I fucked my accountant'
  3. leak by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    mr Musk should leak all the details of the X37B cuz hes a computer person

    1. Re:leak by bobbied · · Score: 2

      mr Musk should leak all the details of the X37B cuz hes a computer person

      Apart from how much it weighs and the details of what orbit it's heading into, I doubt anybody at SpaceX actually knows what the X37B actually does, including Musk. One could speculate I suppose, but I'm sure the USAF is keeping the actual mission details to themselves...

      It's a contract launch that says... Here are the launch specifications, weight, center of gravity, size and on pad environmental requirements, here is the orbit we want and when we want it launched. Finally, here is the schedule of payments and the initial check for you to get started...

      --
      "File to fit, pound to insert, paint to match" - Aircraft Maintenance 101
    2. Re: leak by ColdWetDog · · Score: 1

      Trump will leak it to the Russians if he's in office long enough.

      I thought we weren't going to talk about the pee tapes here.

      --
      Faster! Faster! Faster would be better!
    3. Re:leak by nitehawk214 · · Score: 2

      X37-B does have cross-range capability, but not enough to evade people tracking it from the ground. http://www.heavens-above.com/ will show its location and orbit shortly after launch.

      --
      I'm a good cook. I'm a fantastic eater. - Steven Brust
    4. Re:leak by bobbied · · Score: 1

      Given the amount of the sky you can cover with a digital camera and a program that can do differential comparisons, unless you have a fairly large rocket stage it's going to be pretty hard to hide in space, even from the armature back yard guys. Even then, you are not going to hide for very long. My guess is that the goal isn't stealth anyway.

      --
      "File to fit, pound to insert, paint to match" - Aircraft Maintenance 101
  4. Whats experimental and secretive about it? by Viol8 · · Score: 1, Informative

    The USA managed to build and launch an airliner sized crewed reusable spaceplane called the shuttle in the 1970s. I'd love to know whats so cutting edge about the X35 that they're trying to keep this midget version of the shuttle secret. Warp engines? Dilithium crystals? Or just too embarresed to show that space technology has barely advanced in 40 years?

    1. Re:Whats experimental and secretive about it? by Luckyo · · Score: 3, Interesting

      Fucking with satellites of other nations?

    2. Re:Whats experimental and secretive about it? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I heard it's sporting a new Elerium-115 powered engine capable of anti-gravity levitation. The last mission was unmanned, but this one was rumored to have a 5-man crew sent out on an exploration mission across the extradimensional portal that opened near the orbit on June 30 1997. They want to avoid another T'leth.

    3. Re:Whats experimental and secretive about it? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      Most likely something to do with satellite tapping or interference. Or at least that would be one of the least surprising end goals of this whole project. They might start small scale by seeing how well the spacecraft can hide from being detected by monitoring stations on Earth.

    4. Re:Whats experimental and secretive about it? by sjbe · · Score: 5, Interesting

      The USA managed to build and launch an airliner sized crewed reusable spaceplane called the shuttle in the 1970s.

      At huge expense and suspect reliability. The shuttle never lived up to the expectations for the project. It was too expensive and complex. The shuttle wasn't in principle a bad idea but the final design was something we did because we could, not because it was the best approach. We probably should have done something more along the lines of the Apollo Applications Program had we known what we know now.

      I'd love to know whats so cutting edge about the X35 that they're trying to keep this midget version of the shuttle secret.

      Probably little or nothing to do with the external parts of the craft. Could be weapons, surveillance equipment, or it might just be a test bed for classified technology. It's staying in orbit for really long periods of time so that's probably a hint. Lots of potential reasons why it's all hush hush.

    5. Re:Whats experimental and secretive about it? by phayes · · Score: 4, Informative

      It can stay in orbit for months to validate technology which cannot be tested any other way.
      It soft-lands so that the experiments can be controlled and validated
      It can be launched on any EELV compliant launcher
      It doesn't cost >$1B to refurbish for each launch.

      I don't recall all of these existing 40 years ago in a single vehicle...

      --
      Democracy is a sheep and two wolves deciding what to have for lunch. Freedom is a well armed sheep contesting the issue
    6. Re:Whats experimental and secretive about it? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Kinetic weapons.

      Push a high density rod (depleted uranium or whatever) out with the force of a medium fart and it strikes the surface with the force of a nuke. Moves fast, can't be intercepted, tough to see.

    7. Re:Whats experimental and secretive about it? by DigiShaman · · Score: 1

      Yeah, pretty much. I mean, China is at least direct about it, blowing up sats and whatnot on a whim. I'm guessing we just do things differently for the sport of it. That, and keep shrapnel out of orbit.

      --
      Life is not for the lazy.
    8. Re:Whats experimental and secretive about it? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      The USA managed to build and launch an airliner sized crewed reusable spaceplane called the shuttle in the 1970s. I'd love to know whats so cutting edge about the X35 that they're trying to keep this midget version of the shuttle secret. Warp engines? Dilithium crystals? Or just too embarresed to show that space technology has barely advanced in 40 years?

      Technically speaking the first shuttle launch was in 1981 and not the 1970's. This is a tech site so accuracy should matter...:)

    9. Re:Whats experimental and secretive about it? by Rei · · Score: 1

      And costs an insane amount per shot, with very restrictive (and predictable) "firing" windows due to orbital dynamics. If you really want kinetic energy weapons, there's a much better way: railguns. The goal is to be able to fire a dozen or so rounds per minute, many tens to hundreds of kilometers, with precision hits having the ability to penetrate any armour and almost any traditional fortification, with ammunition being cheap (~$25k per shot) and able (due to its small size) to be stored onboard in great quantities with no risk of inadvertent explosion. Fragmenting shells should also make for superb air defense systems. The rail lifespan problem seems to have been largely solved; they should be able to get a thousand or so shots off between replacements.

      You'll never manage that sort of price performance with an orbital system.

      Now, there's somewhat of a chicken-and-egg problem with kinetic energy penetrators... the same problem that hit the Zumwalts' guns when the ship production numbers were slashed. GPS-guided artillery shells are certainly possible; see for example the M982 Excalibur, which has a CEP of around 5 meters, based on tech that's now over 10 years old. The issue is cost. You can get the ammunition down to just a couple tens of thousands of dollars per shot, since there's nothing fundamentally expensive about it - but you need to order it in huge quantities to do so. Meaning you have to make a big gamble that widespread deployment of all aspects of the system will work in order to justify such large purchases. If you purchase it in small quantities, you end up having to pay cruise missile-prices per shot, defeating a lot of the purpose. Widespread deployment doesn't come without a cost; you have to remove other combat systems to make space for the gun, its ammunition and capacitor buffer. Only the Zumwalt and Ford classes (3 ships total at present, and not many more in the near future) have enough power to run one directly; all other ships also require a battery bank.

      --
      We gotta go to a crappy town where I'm a hero.
    10. Re:Whats experimental and secretive about it? by Viol8 · · Score: 1

      The shuttle could have stayed in orbit for months if it didn't have a crew. And I don't see this thing taking a full crew + 22 ton payload anytime soon. I'm not saying the shuttle was the best there could have been, but compared to this thing it was a 747 compared to a cessna.

    11. Re:Whats experimental and secretive about it? by Viol8 · · Score: 1

      The shuttle was never used to its full capabilities. Nothing in the AAP could have safely brought a satellite back from orbit as the shuttle managed on 4 occasions.

    12. Re:Whats experimental and secretive about it? by idji · · Score: 2

      I really cannot imagine this. Whatever secret things this does in orbit, it cannot really hide it's orbit (see http://scalsky.com/ and it cannot change it's orbit by much, so any satellite owner can easily tell if their satellite is at any risk of being approached.
      Plus a ground based station is probably MUCH closer to a LEO satellite than the X-37B can reach, and would have far more power to interfere.
      I don't think it is interfering with space objects, but rather observing the ground.

    13. Re:Whats experimental and secretive about it? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Er, no it couldn't. STS used fuel cells for power, which would run out of fuel after about a month even with mission extension kits.

    14. Re:Whats experimental and secretive about it? by GNious · · Score: 1

      Should be easy enough to find out "whats so cutting edge about the X35" - it became the JSF.

      https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/...
      https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/...

    15. Re:Whats experimental and secretive about it? by idji · · Score: 1

      we know where mission OTV-4 travelled quite precisely. it's orbit did not change much over it's time in space. https://www.calsky.com/observe...

    16. Re:Whats experimental and secretive about it? by Billy+the+Mountain · · Score: 1

      Must not be doing a good job of trying to hide it--I've observed OTV4 (most recent mission) in orbit about four or five times.

      --
      That was the turning point of my life--I went from negative zero to positive zero.
    17. Re:Whats experimental and secretive about it? by ColdWetDog · · Score: 1

      Recall that a good number of Shuttle flights were run by the Air Force and that much of the flight manifest and records are classified. So, the Shuttle had some utility for the AF. Think of the XB-37 as Shuttle 2 - minus the meatsacs and a couple of other things that they found out they didn't need.

      My toy box. All mine.

      --
      Faster! Faster! Faster would be better!
    18. Re:Whats experimental and secretive about it? by Viol8 · · Score: 1

      Without a crew compartment you don't think they could have found space for a few more?

    19. Re:Whats experimental and secretive about it? by PPH · · Score: 1

      fuel cells for power, which would run out of fuel after about a month

      How much of that power was for life support for the meatsacks?

      --
      Have gnu, will travel.
    20. Re:Whats experimental and secretive about it? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      Yes, but you probably didn't see the ion-thruster microsats that it released in order to cause all manner of mischief and mayhem.

    21. Re:Whats experimental and secretive about it? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I don't think hiding is actually an option for anything in space. -Where- the X37B is is public information because any astronomer can track it. (There's no such thing as a completely invisible or non-reflective spacecraft) -What- it does while it spends in months and months in space is the secret part.

    22. Re:Whats experimental and secretive about it? by rkordmaa · · Score: 1

      Shuttle was the omnitool that could do everything. Problem was, as it is with all omnitools, it wasn't particularly good at any of the jobs it was capable of.

    23. Re:Whats experimental and secretive about it? by phayes · · Score: 1

      Any shuttle launched without a crew would have crashed and burned as the shuttles were unable to perform fully automated landings

      Stop trying to make the X-35b into what it isnt: a shuttle, SLS's time of >$1billlion per launch costs is thankfully in the past and is a poor yardstick to use in any case.

      --
      Democracy is a sheep and two wolves deciding what to have for lunch. Freedom is a well armed sheep contesting the issue
    24. Re:Whats experimental and secretive about it? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Exactly!

      This mini shuttle easily fits robotic arms, spy cameras, orbit fucking strapon boosters, RF gear, etc.
      AND
      It easily fits a human with full life support for those extra special orbital fuckery missions.

    25. Re:Whats experimental and secretive about it? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Probably involves testing the 20th-something generation of the EM Drive the public won't know about for another 100 years.

  5. Atlas by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Is a pagan rocket.

    1. Re:Atlas by Rei · · Score: 1

      A male Falcon rocket is technically known as a "tercel".

      --
      We gotta go to a crappy town where I'm a hero.
    2. Re:Atlas by drinkypoo · · Score: 1

      A male Falcon rocket is technically known as a "tercel".

      Aren't all rockets male? Maybe a space plane could be female...

      --
      "You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"
    3. Re:Atlas by batukhan · · Score: 1

      You would need to examine the docking parts

    4. Re:Atlas by apoc.famine · · Score: 3, Funny

      It doesn't matter what docking parts it has! Stop being a bigot. It should be able to go into the hanger it identifies with.

      --
      Velociraptor = Distiraptor / Timeraptor
    5. Re:Atlas by jlv · · Score: 1

      Mod +1 Funny

    6. Re:Atlas by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Let your girlfriend fuck you in the dick eye with her clit! Or at least mush it about. Anything is possible!

  6. Good launch to watch by Michael+Woodhams · · Score: 4, Interesting

    When they launched the spy satellite, it was the best launch coverage (streamed on youtube) to date, in my opinion. Rockets go up all the time, it is rockets coming back down which is unusual and special. Because of the payload, the coverage of that mission didn't look at stage II at all, so we got better coverage of the booster (stage I) return, including continuous launch-to-landing ground telescope images of the booster, plus continuous video from the booster. I have high hopes that this launch will be similar.

    --
    Quattuor res in hoc mundo sanctae sunt: libri, liberi, libertas et liberalitas.
  7. at what point... by drewsup · · Score: 2

    Do the drop the X designation?? Almost a decade if flight, I think it passed the test , and what would its new designator be ?

    1. Re:at what point... by peragrin · · Score: 1

      There's are two. It stays an X when it moves to mass production. Even the sr-71 had dozens of model built.

      Seriously how hard is it to not realize that the difference in designation is as simple as number of units built to a model.

      --
      i thought once I was found, but it was only a dream.
    2. Re:at what point... by jfdavis668 · · Score: 2

      X before something else is a pre-production test. Like XF-35, which will become the F-35. X alone is an aircraft to perform tests, like the X-15. The X-15 would still be called that even if we were still using it today.

    3. Re:at what point... by Fire_Wraith · · Score: 1

      Uh, no, the SR-71 didn't have an "X" designator. It was an "SR", not X(Experimental).

      X series planes do receive a new designation when they become slated for regular production - see the X-35 becoming the F-35: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/...
      The production version is technically new/different, but it's more the relationship of prototype and production model (though prototypes planned as such have a Y designation rather than X).

    4. Re:at what point... by Fire_Wraith · · Score: 1

      Generally if it becomes slated for mass production (even in small numbers) and regular operational use, it will trade the X designation for a regular one. The new designation would probably be based on the role. Per the Air Force designation rules (which are really more guidelines, given how often they choose to break with them), it would probably be something like RS-37 or RS-2 (meaning Reconnaissance Spaceplane) depending on whether they used the next available "Spaceplane" number, or retained the X series number (like they did with the F-35, rather than using the next F-series number, 24).

      They might also change their minds about it due to the fact that "S" is also used for Antisubmarine Warfare, and the S-2 designation previously belonged to a U.S. Navy ASW plane (and there was an RS-2 variant as well).

    5. Re:at what point... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Uh, no, the SR-71 didn't have an "X" designator. It was an "SR", not X(Experimental).

      Technically true, and its predecessor was the A-12, and none of them were built for the Air Force, they were all technically made for the CIA. Then when a modified version for the Air Force was made, it was changed to the SR-71 after a bomber variation was proposed. There's also the YF-12, which was a two-seater version, and the experimental drone-carrying version, the M-21.

    6. Re:at what point... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I was pointing out that "IF" they built a fleet of these, what would its designator be, Cant be an F or B, I dont recall if the space shuttle had an official designator other than "space shuttle". I was leaning towards SR, as the 71 is the closest thing we had to this, but it really is in a class by itself.

    7. Re:at what point... by sl3xd · · Score: 2

      My favorite useless fact about the SR-71: The armed forces have a standard for how they are designated, and that particular version of the plane was designated RS-71.

      But a General preferred "SR" over the standard, and had a speech by President Johnson altered to use SR-71 instead; but the Media's transcripts still had "RS" in it, leading the media to believe the POTUS misread it.

      The reason why it uses "71" instead of "12" (to go along with Y-12, A-12) is because there was a contemporary prototype, the XB-70 Valkyrie.

      The same General hated ICBM's, and went to absurd lengths to keep the Mach-3 heavy nuclear bomber. He tried to fund the RS-70 "reconnaissance" version of it... and so the RS-71 was given the next number after RS-70.

      Fortunately, the General's ambition for the RS-70 was foiled for a few reasons:

      * At the time, the XB-70 was, pound for pound, ten times more expensive than Gold -- and it weighed half a million pounds.
      * More careful thinkers realized flying a heavy nuclear bomber over the USSR to take photos would be indistinguishable from a first strike, leading to nuclear war.

      --
      -- Sometimes you have to turn the lights off in order to see.
    8. Re:at what point... by painandgreed · · Score: 1

      Do the drop the X designation?? Almost a decade if flight, I think it passed the test , and what would its new designator be ?

      I don't think so. All the X-planes have been test vehicles to test new tech that would hopefully be integrated into other designs. Quite a few of the x-planes have been space planes or lifting body tests that have probably contributed to the X-37B. Although most never made it to reality or flew, the Air Force has apparently been wanting a space plane for a long time, since the 60's at least with the X-20. That this one was built and has been flown several times, and that they have released some of the uses (experimental thrusters, for example), it is probably being used as a test bed for other tech that can be fit into the payload for use in other planes. No need for a production run and unless they develop some new spaceplane or lifting body tech, no need to build a new x-plane.

  8. Illudium Q-36 Explosive Space Modulator by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0
  9. "Congressional Mandate" by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    We've been told to do it, so we do it. Congresscritters are disgustingly cheap, and Musk has bought many of them.

    1. Re:"Congressional Mandate" by Opportunist · · Score: 1

      Whores generally aren't that expensive, what did you expect?

      --
      We used to have a Bill of Rights. Now, with the rights gone, all we have left is the bill.
  10. Stop the proliferation of satellites. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    There are many dangers: "any thing that goes up will go down" as bullets.

    It will kill humans on the Earth,

    Countries should moderate and control their satellites.

    1. Re:Stop the proliferation of satellites. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Something like the X37-B would be rather useful to help manage satellites that are on orbit already and need to be moved.

      But you know, be a Luddite.

    2. Re:Stop the proliferation of satellites. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      There are many dangers: "any thing that goes up will go down" as bullets.

      Most geostationary satellites when they've reach the end of their life are put in graveyard orbit. Most dead satellites are more of a danger to other space craft than they are to anybody on Earth.

      It will kill humans on the Earth,

      Tell me again how many people on Earth have been killed by a satellite landing on them? Oh you mean that big round number called ZERO.

      Put your tin foil hat back on.

    3. Re:Stop the proliferation of satellites. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You've got a better chance of being struck by lightning, while carrying the Power-ball winning ticket, shortly after surviving a shark attack. Satellite/meteorites hitting people/property is exceedingly rare, especially satellites as they are built pretty flimsily to decrease weight. Orbital launcher stages are a bit more dangerous (as they are often traveling at suborbital speeds and are built much more robustly) but they are often purposely directed into uninhabited areas.

  11. Re:All 12 in London "attack" released without char by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Kill yourself already and do the world a favorite. Just one bullet to your tiny brain should do the job.

  12. Not the Space Craft by sycodon · · Score: 1

    The Space Craft is not a secret.

    It's the cargo.

    --
    When Fascism comes to America, it will call itself Anti-Fascism, and tell you to give up your guns.
  13. The shuttle failed in its primary goal by sjbe · · Score: 2

    The shuttle was never used to its full capabilities.

    Disagree. The problem with the shuttle was that it's capabilities weren't what they needed to be. Technically it was reusable but so much work and expense went into each refurbishment that they may as well have not bothered. The shuttle was supposed to reduce cost to orbit and it did nothing of the sort. The fact that it was capable of bringing items back from orbit is a minor detail which misses the big picture. The shuttle wasn't economically capable of solving the space junk problem which is really the only common reason to bring most items back from orbit aside from science experiments and astronauts. Once you make getting to orbit economical THEN it is worth worrying about bringing stuff back economically. The shuttle design was simply not capable of doing that economically.

    Nothing in the AAP could have safely brought a satellite back from orbit as the shuttle managed on 4 occasions.

    I said "along the lines of the AAP", as in something similar. It didn't have to be that program specifically. It's an example of a type of program that would have been more likely to succeed. It's all moot at this point and SpaceX (and some others) are finally making progress on the problems. It's just a shame we wasted so much time and money on the shuttle.

  14. Design intent by sjbe · · Score: 1

    The shuttle could have stayed in orbit for months if it didn't have a crew.

    So what? It would still have been outrageously expensive to launch, overly complicated, unreliable (two failures in just over 100 missions), required substantial refurbishment between missions, etc. There simply are better ways to solve the problems the shuttle was supposed to tackle. It was a design by committee that ultimately failed in its primary purpose which was to reduce cost to orbit and allow more rapid launches. This isn't to say it wasn't a capable vehicle but the economics of it were poor and it held us back for several decades.

    And I don't see this thing taking a full crew + 22 ton payload anytime soon.

    Presumably it wasn't designed to do that so why is that a problem?

  15. Hugo Drax, errr, Elon Musk by Thud457 · · Score: 1

    What ever happened to his motto "Don't be evil"?

    Oh, wait. That was some other guys. He never said that.

    --

    the preceding comment is my own and in no way reflects the opinion of the Joint Chiefs of Staff

    1. Re:Hugo Drax, errr, Elon Musk by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      He's Seth Effrikan evil is the default state

  16. Nothing cheaply by sjbe · · Score: 1

    Shuttle was the omnitool that could do everything.

    It could do a lot but it could not do anything cheaply. It was too complicated, too expensive, too unreliable, and unfocused. We got ahead of ourselves with the shuttle and turned a reasonable idea (reusable flight vehicle) into a jobs program which needlessly cost 14 astronauts their lives and held our space program back for three decades.