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New Diesel and Petrol Vehicles To Be Banned From 2040 In UK (bbc.com)
New submitter puenktli writes: The UK is joining the list of the countries which are making a commitment towards diesel and petrol free vehicles. Other countries might be more progressive with such a ban (e.g. the Netherlands: by 2025), but at least it's a step in the right direction. However, if new bans are put forward at such a high rate as now, in 2040, the UK might be the only western country where petrol-fuelled cars are still on the road. Tesla at least will be happy about this ban, especially now with their Model 3. But these bans will inspire other car makers as well to invest more in EV. Maybe not such a bad idea after all: oil will run out one day, but the sun will always shine.
oil will run out one day, but the sun will always shine
Maybe another 4 billion years but hardly always.
the UK might be the only western country where petrol-fuelled cars are still on the road
No, the USA will be dead last
Car makers stay profitable by making the same car and selling it around the world (with a few planned modifications, such was flipping the steering wheel, and maybe a renaming). It keeps supply chains simple and amortizes design costs. If major markets in the rest of the world are banning new gas cars by 2025, 2030, or any year before 2040, then the UK won't actually have to do anything. GM isn't going to make an electric cars for other markets, and then have a special gas car for the UK; they'll just stop making gas cars. Legislation or not, by the year 2040 you won't be able to get a new gas car in the UK.
Some analysts are already predicting that the car market will be 50% EV by the mid-2020s, and will "tip" rapidly thereafter. This trend is mostly driven by the cost of Li-ion batteries, which has been falling at about 15%/yr for the last couple of decades. When it becomes possible to buy an entry-level EV for $20k or less, why would you even want an ICE vehicle?
The "fuel" price for EVs is a fraction of that for ICE, as is the maintenance cost. EVs only have a couple-dozen moving parts, compared to thousands in an ICE car. Of course, there will still be "gas car" enthusiasts in 2040, just as there are hobbyists who still maintain antique steam-powered farm equipment. But even by 2030, there will no longer be a need for this law, because the market will already have flipped.
XML is like violence. If it doesn't solve your problem, you're not using enough of it. --AC
What if this global warming thing is a big hoax and we make a better world for nothing?! ;)
Anons need not reply. Questions end with a question mark.
Maybe not... By the time the ban comes it, it might be hard to buy a combustion engine car. I expect there will be some specialist vehicles still on the market, but the vast majority will be electric.
const int one = 65536; (Silvermoon, Texture.cs)
SJW, n: "Someone I don't like, and by the way I'm a fuckwit" - AC
Even if you're burning gas and diesel at electrical plants to generate the electricity, there has to be some economies of scale at work here to give better efficiency. More than enough to outweigh transmission losses and battery charging losses.
At least for USians, a substantial part of the cost of gas or diesel is the tax earmarked for new roads and maintaining existing roads. That the EV owner currently does not pay these taxes could be regarded as a subsidy to encourage use of electric cars, but when EVs are numerous, this will change the fuel-cost calculation, especially against the coming generation of more fuel efficient IC engines.
In other news, rolling coal is alive and well in the US.
Yeah, those fucking idiots. I really, really hate those assholes. I fully support their right to do this in the confines of their garage. Preferably, with all of the doors closed and any ventilation sealed shut.
All that is necessary for the triumph of good is that evil men do nothing.
2040 is far enough off that the current politicians can make all the promises they want and not suffer any repercussions from failing to meet that goal nor any backlash from folks who object.
2040 is also far enough off that we might reasonably make the transition from fossil fuels by then as that is a long time in technological terms.
On the other hand, I have 1968, 1986, 1996 and 2004 delivery vans and there is not a whole lot of difference between them. They all get about the same gas mileage. In fact, they get about the same mileage full or empty. The biggest thing you can do when driving a larger vehicle is make sure you're always carrying at capacity for this reason. It's called backhauling. When we make deliveries we also pickup up spent barley and such for our pastured pig farm to optimize our time and vehicle usage. That makes more difference than doubling the gas mileage.
In Vermont, where we're located, they aren't quite as optimistic as the UK politicians so they set the deadline for this sort of thing to be 2050 to give another decade of slack.
> Because they have limited range, take too long to charge
Mostly this, right, trying to do a 1600km (1000 miles) trip in an ICE vehicle? I can do it with just 2 tanks of gas in 16h. However with an AV?
I don't know how you would do a 1600km (1000 mile) trip within Britain in any kind of car, electric or petrol. Unless it floats.
http://www.geoffreylandis.com
The UK politicians is more into all-controlling than the EU so I don't really know what you are thinking about?
Is it that UK politicians and state bureaucracy should have the freedom to remove freedoms from the people? Is so, yes exiting EU will provide more freedoms. But not for the people - the part of a society that I (and many others) consider the most important.
Otherwise you make no sense at all.
But those incentives aren't free. Everyone is paying for them, including those who purchase 'non-government-loved' cars, and their government is deciding who gets the option to partake (quid pro quo, you buy what the government approves of and they grease your palm).
Wrong thinking will be punished (if very indirectly); right thinking will be as quickly rewarded. Hold out your hand! Here's a rebate! Woohoo!
Electric cars suck.
I own an electric car, and am quite happy with it. It meets all my needs as a commuter and errand car. The range is limited, but my commute is only about 15 miles per day, so i only charge it once a week or so on standard US house current (120v).
Nobody wants one so the government is forcing you to buy a shit car.
I see scores of electric cars on the road every single day on my way to work. Clearly, your statement is without merit.
People who say "sheeple" have about as much sophistication as an AOL user, and in fact are probably actually AOL users.
It will then be replenished by the same processes that produce the oil we use today
Actually, it won't. Because we have oxygen in our atmosphere now.
Oil was produced by vast piles of organic matter being covered by sediments and baked for hundreds of millions of years. Once our atmosphere got a significant concentration of oxygen, those vast piles of organic matter no longer formed in the same way. The organic matter oxidizes too much before it can be buried. Instead much smaller molecules (aka natural gas) are created instead.
And before the post above asks, the problem with just relying on natural gas is it tends to not stay in the ground on its own. You need particular geology to hold it in place. So there's way less natural gas forming than the way oil formed 250M years ago.
American. Cheered for Brexit. A lot of us did
Of course you did, and were I American I probably would have done so too because it weakens one of your strongest economic rivals and pretty soon the UK will be turning up cap-in-hand to beg/negotiate a trade deal with the US which will be extremely favourable to the US because the UK will have very little leverage.
From the UK point of view it is going to be a complete disaster though. If you really believe that argument about freedom then are you also an advocate for states in the US all becoming free nations so they can choose their own course rather than being an economic engine attached to Washington's butt? Some of us prefer to think of the EU as our free nation where we enjoyed self-determination along with Germans, French, Poles, Danes etc. in exactly the same way that Californians, Iowans, Virginians etc. all enjoy self-determination together as a single free nation. The UK leaving the EU will be as big an upheaval as say California leaving the US.
There are certainly problems with the EU but show me a nation that does not have problems. The adult response to challenges like this is to work together to solve them, not to get in a hissy fit and take your ball home. I have always felt far more European than just British and now, having being denied the right to vote in the referendum, my EU citizenship is still going to be stripped from me. If this is the sort of "democracy" that a "free" Britain will have then I want none of it thanks.
Most people settle into the same state where they were born. Your idea of "real" is unrealistic. You should try getting out more to understand that there is a whole world around you, filled with people with different needs than yours.
http://www.pewsocialtrends.org/2008/12/17/who-moves-who-stays-put-wheres-home/
Among all respondents to the Pew Research Center survey, 57% say they have not lived in the U.S. outside their current state: 37% have never left their hometown and 20% have left their hometown (or native country) but not lived outside their current state.
Aah, change is good. -- Rafiki
Yeah, but it ain't easy. -- Simba
It will be easy to buy a combustion engine car, but hard to buy one without an added battery or other energy storage.
They are thinking of banning diesel & petrol only vehicles, not hybrids and plug in hybrids. The transition will be unnoticeable by then. They won't ban all combustion engines.
They do dribble out periodically. For example:
There are also many examples of lab successes in charging lithium and other batteries in times that are equivalent to supercapacitors and with cycle counts beyond 10,000 as shown by this announcement-de-jeur.
So, certainly batteries are going to be hard to beat. But I think supercapacitors will eventually win out due to weight, durability and raw material cost factors. And, I predict that the next 30 years will see as much development in the newly merged material / chemical / biological science as has happened in all of man's history. The problems will be solved.
I propose a deal:
You consider your use cases.
And I consider my use cases.
And please leave me alone while I consider my use cases as I will leave you alone when you consider yours!
Cost free eBook I read (by iBook/Kobo/Amazon/ObookO/Gutenberg etc.): "The Green Odyssey" by Philip Jose Farmer.