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Experts Cast Doubt on 'Alien Alloys' in the New York Times' UFO Story (scientificamerican.com)
What to make of a Las Vegas building full of unidentified alloys? The New York Times published a stunning story last week revealing that the U.S. Department of Defense (DOD) had, between 2007 and 2012, funded a $22 million program for investigating UFOs (Editor's note: the link may be paywalled; alternative source). The story included three revelations that were tailored to blow readers' minds: 1. Many high-ranking people in the federal government believe aliens have visited planet Earth. 2. Military pilots have recorded videos of UFOs with capabilities that seem to outstrip all known human aircraft, changing direction and accelerating in ways no fighter jet or helicopter could ever accomplish. 3. In a group of buildings in Las Vegas, the government stockpiles alloys and other materials believed to be associated with UFOs. From a Scientific American report: Points one and two are weird, but not all that compelling on their own: The world already knew that plenty of smart folks believe in alien visitors, and that pilots sometimes encounter strange phenomena in the upper atmosphere. Point No. 3, though -- those buildings full of alloys and other materials -- that's a little harder to hand wave away. Is there really a DOD cache full of materials from out of this world? Here's the thing, though: The chemists and metallurgists Live Science spoke to -- experts in identifying unusual alloys -- don't buy it. "I don't think it's plausible that there's any alloys that we can't identify," Richard Sachleben, a retired chemist and member of the American Chemical Society's panel of experts, told Live Science. "My opinion? That's quite impossible." Alloys are mixtures of different kinds of elemental metals. They're very common -- in fact, Sachleben said, they're more common on Earth than pure elemental metals are -- and very well understood.
Clearly these so called "experts" haven't ran their little tests on Twinkies or Mountain Dew... there's nothing in either of those that can be identified.
Fascism: An authoritarian and nationalistic right-wing system of government and social organization. See also: NAZI's
Every time I hear anything New York-related I get annoyed. To paraphrase Ghandi - "I like New York, but I can't stand New Yorkers".
I do not see any contradiction in those statemenst. As an example IF I analyze graphene with an AAS (a techniques for knowing the element of your sample) or with an XPS or with secondary scatter emission or with XRD (powder not monocrystal) I would find that graphene is made of C and this is correct. That won't explain ANY of its unusual and wonder properties.
So you can have an alloy with known element with unknown properties. If you gave graphene or even a metamaterial to a scientist to analyse to a scientist 20 years ago he would have probably said "these are unknown materials". it does mean:"we do probably know how they look and what are their elements but we do not know how they made it or what are their properties".
So some people seem to read and understand only what want to see and understand...
Reality is a network of simulations of 'reality'. That 'reality' is what we experience. If some wish UFOs to be real, and others wish it all to be bull, then Reality will attempt to arbitrate between them. In this way all natural laws are created to satisfy demand of Mind. You just gotta believe in UFOs enough and reality will change course. Be a real scientist: do the experiment.
[ Post anonymously, then ducks as the claims of 'bullshit' go flying over my head. ]
Why is there no mention that this was a Harry Reid pork program to funnel money to one of his donors.
So the NYT is credulous on aliens but not on dirty Democrat politicians.
Are these the same experts that keep claiming the sky is falling due to climate cgange? Trump tells me climate change is fake, so any scientist doubting the validity of these alien alloys must be a deplorable liar as well.
God put these alien alloys here thousands of years ago as a test of our faith, sheeple. Wake up!
Like brass, bronze, stainless steel, or even just ordinary high carbon steel?
Unless the ETs have some element we haven't discovered yet.
Or their metallurgy surpasses ours and they really have figured out useful alloys that we haven't discovered yet. But AFAIK simple spectroscopic analysis will tell you what's in an alloy.
And objects that accelerate or change directions faster than any tech we have now? I've been hearing about that about UFOs for my whole life.
What exactly is the news here?
You may want to believe, but you are fooling yourself, and you don't believe it. Come on!
Or, as I like to say it when I'm at the YMCA
You see the world through your cynical eyes
You're a troubled young man I can tell
You've got it all in the palm of your hand
But your hand's wet with sweat and your head needs a rest
And you're fooling yourself if you don't believe it
You're killing yourself if you don't believe it
Why must you be such an angry young man
When your future looks quite bright to me
And how can there be such a sinister plan
That could hide such a lamb, such a caring young man
And you're fooling yourself if you don't believe it
You're killing yourself if you don't believe it
Get up, get back on your feet ... oh, wait.
You're the one they can't beat and you know it
Come on, let's see what you've got
Just take your best shot and don't blow it
Look at the uses for high-temperature alloys like Inconel and Hastelloy. Everything from cryogenic conditions to rocket engine parts and nuclear reactors. Just the things you would want from a UFO
https://www.hpalloy.com/Alloys...
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/...
But rocket motors are already beyond alloys. They also require ceramics and other materials based on silica
https://www.extremetech.com/ex...
https://ntrs.nasa.gov/archive/...
Vintage computer adverts: http://www.vintageadbrowser.com/computers-and-software-ads
that they can make unidentifiable alloys, how come they can't keep pieces of their space ships from falling off? How come so much of the stuff falls off that it takes "a group of buildings" in Vegas to hold all of it?
I'd expect this sort of BS from Fox News "science" reporting (like the mystery planet that was supposed to crash into earth about a month ago), but NYT?
Two words:
Dark Matter.
(Drops mic)
It seems that the message You're welcome is not working.
They (the visitors) did prefer the another way: to not alarm the people.
Or their metallurgy surpasses ours and they really have figured out useful alloys that we haven't discovered yet. But AFAIK simple spectroscopic analysis will tell you what's in an alloy.
But simple spectroscopic analysis won't necessarily tell you how it behaves or what its properties are.
Alien alloys and materials would have to be the best kept secret since, ever though. And that seems quite unlikely.
FTA:
Here's the thing, though: The chemists and metallurgists Live Science spoke to -- experts in identifying unusual alloys -- don't buy it. "I don't think it's plausible that there's any alloys that we can't identify," Richard Sachleben, a retired chemist and member of the American Chemical Society's panel of experts, told Live Science. "My opinion? That's quite impossible." Alloys are mixtures of different kinds of elemental metals. They're very common -- in fact, Sachleben said, they're more common on Earth than pure elemental metals are -- and very well understood.
Just because you know the composition of something doesn't mean you know how to make it. Nobody knows how to make real Damascus steel anymore. There are still discoveries being made about new crystal structures, compounds and alloys. That is before you get into the many different ways to temper or treat metals in the process of creating a particular alloy. Even if you can find one way to create a particular alloy, does the process scale to industrial levels? Creating a few molecules in a lab with special equipment and processes is a very different thing than creating it by the ton in high speed processes. Even using the same recipe with different equipment can potentially produce different outcomes.
Consider FOGBANK
much of left-wing thought is a kind of playing with fire by people who don't even know that fire is hot - George Orwell
For $22 million, unless the people in charge of the project were clueless quacks, they would have learned *something* about the materials, their structure, even their behavior. I gotta call BS. Strong evidence of BS here is lack of any real content in terms of evidence. They don't share any research data, no academic papers, nothing but campfire tales.
Further, if there was something truly amazing in there, useful information about it would have leaked.
More likely this was a convenient way to move some money around, and nothing more.
Peeps be reading too much Whitley Strieber.
Take your stupid and fuck off troll.
See subject: 22 million of U.S. spending went to him & I'm personally not against it (I posted recently & in the past on UFO's I've literally seen in my youth along w/ 2 witnesses in 1975 (1 is still living & can verify it)) - I know what I saw & it wasn't a 'weather balloon' or 'swamp gas', etc. - et al.
* The odds of us being "completely alone" in the known universe (until we hit the 'bug races' background radiation signal of the 'big bang' as we theorize it currently & the limit of light travelling outward 'barrier' of what we can see)? Low imo... & wouldn't make a ton of sense.
From a biblical perspective - We're said to be "God's favorite children' (pretty damn arrogant imo) BUT not his ONLY children (& earth itself shows us there are many kinds of life w/in its biosphere alone - yes, related closely enough sometime but varying).
APK
P.S.=> The ONLY thing that makes me wonder though is what Ben Rich of Lockheed Martin said "We now have the technology to take ET home" which is, in & of itself, a basic admission there IS an "ET" & that SOME of what we see MAY BE IN FACT OUR OWN TECH (FTL drive, antigravity etc. that Indian text spoke of from AGES ago regarding Vishnu & the VIMANA machines)... apk
Humanity knew properties of graphite, but graphene (which should be same thing) turned to be very different.
...points to the materials being non-terrestrial. I am way out of my league here, but this seems like a plausible reality that may be connected to the story. Of course this does not mean they are "alien" unless they are truly alloys (which I suppose would require intelligence to fashion) made of non-terrestrial materials. I am just trying to connect the dots between reality and what gets reported in the NYT.
See subject: Paul Hellyer (former Canadian Defense Minister) on YouTube - see what HE says on the UFO phenomenon also...
* I find this stuff interesting - it's not as "cut & dried" BORING as say, Comp. Sci. stuff (imo @ least it's been largely explored save TRUE AI (dangerous imo)) + speculative conversation imo? "Lights up the mind"... & it's ANYONE's game then (as we really do not have all the answers - yet).
Per my last post I am responding to as an addendum now? Even Jimmy Carter's seen UFO's (as has Hellyer I note now). I'm not alone in it & have pretty good company (& this is a FAR from complete sampleset).
APK
P.S.=> In fact, the last time we had talks like this here? I truly IMMENSELY enjoyed myself (no trolls attacking me, very few unjustified downmods etc.) - lots of "pro & con" well-reasoned out conversation too... apk
I love my compass, you insensitive clod!
--Troglodyte
I've worked as a research scientist in research groups that belonged to the absolute top of the field for over 15 years and I never saw any influence of aliens into our field. I worked for many years in nanotechnology, a field in which if the story about those alloys is true you would expect aliens to meddle. I am very sure that every high-tech thing on this planet is conceived and built by people, whether in the past (pyramids, the tomb of Tutanchamon) or now.
-- Cheers!
Yes. Yes. It's difficult to stay abreast of all the enhancement technologies. Even those of us who are not fans of silicone enhancement will agree that analysis would find it different from NaCl-infused H2O enhancement, but this would be very confusing to analysts of yore.
Yore with me on this, right?
I've fallen off your lawn, and I can't get up.
Twinkies have been thoroughly deconstructed and analyzed.
Mit der Dummheit kämpfen Götter selbst vergebens
Could be full of Chobham armour....it's known but the knowledge to produce it is evn now still pretty secret
Opinion is news....
I totally support this idea; it'll come to fruition sooner or lacer, we'll simply have to take the plunge. Our cup will truly runneth over. When historians discuss among themselves of when metallurgy went all soft and rounded, they will naturally cleave to our age, +5 insightful, politely asking each other, "a nipple for your thoughts, good sir?" It is virtually certain that some will make some excellent points, erecting fine impressions upon the cloth of history.
I have to go take my meds now, sorry.
I've fallen off your lawn, and I can't get up.
Aliens have superior technology, obviously. So why would they cast doubt when 3-D printing doubt would be much more effective?
Alien alloys and materials would have to be the best kept secret since, ever though.
If that were correct, this discussion wouldn't be taking place.
Those who do not know much have a very large amount of unknown so it is very easy for every day things to fall into the scope of unkown.
To identify an alloy
a) take a sample and feed it into a mass spectrometer. You then have identified all the elements that make up your alloy.
b) take a sample of the alloy and put it under a scanning electron microscope or an atomic force microscope. That will allow you to map out the crystalline structure of the alloy.
Take a+b and job done.
They wanted to see which wonder material could evade radar detection among having some other useful electromagnetic properties for military applications. As part of the payload, they sent deformed humans coming from failed drug or radioactive experiments. These deformed humans were so shocking that it makes it easy to see if the aircraft was detected simply by monitoring the news media. Together with the fake news suggesting that these are extraterrestrials (tabloids were the Facebook of the yore), they have managed to deflect any suspicion of their materials and drugs research for the last 50 years or so.
I am often awe-struck by the Russian's cleverness. They are ridiculously dedicated to be excellent at strategy and intellectual prowess, if only they could direct that creative energy into making the world a better place. Unfortunately, their myopic pursuit of world power makes them do things that are morally reproachable and only causes the world to fear them. America might not have many allies today thanks to Trump who is Putin's puppet, but our allies loved us.
I once had a signature.
See subject: We're great 'copycats' & analysts for it. Math + physics show it. We're only describing "God's Engineering" quantifying & mapping it to OUR understanding to use it.
* I would add you SHOULD be modded up to +5 but? You are ALREADY there & should be!
APK
P.S.=> What have we REALLY 'invented' that's original? The wheel maybe?? The rest of emulating what we see around us OR using its properties (once we get a grasp of them & how they work/what they do) to utilizing to our advantage - Feel free to correct me where I am off/wrong here folks, but, that's how I see it (we're arrogant as hell if we think otherwise)... apk
19th century was the one we developed new alloys.
20th century we found new elements.
21th century looks to be the age of the layered metamaterials - computer chips, radar reflecting, hydrophobic sprays, that kind of thing.
I would expect aliens tech to be composed of elements we understand in peculiar manners.
excitingthingstodo.blogspot.com
The tilt only moves it towards the south, and gives it a shorter, lower track through the sky
OK, you complete retarded fucking idiot. The sun is "yellower" when it is lower in the sky precisely because it has to traverse more atmosphere. The atmosphere scatters the higher frequencies (blue light) and only the lower frequencies (redder/yellower) make it to you stupid fucking eyeball. That's why the sun gets yellower, then redder as the sun sets dipshit. You are a fucking piece of shit because you know this and want to spread misinformation like the dickless, child molester you are. Yes, that's right. I know for a fact that you are a child molester because only a child molester like you would spout off all this nonsense. Child Molester! Child Molester!
I remember the conniptions it took to get a 10 Meg hard drive in the 70's.
If somebody had handed me one 10 Gig usb stick then, it would have been near impossible to reverse engineer it without breaking it.
If I break it then I no longer have the only one.
Now think about if you were handed the flash drive in the 60, 50's, 40's, etc.
Now think if you knew the thing was flash drive with useful information from essentially, the future?
Think what it would be like to have pieces from a whole spacecraft capable of getting here.
The material technology would only be a small part of it.
Aside from staying together, how does it move, get energy, navigate, communicate, support life, and who knows what else?
What would be on it's hard drives?
The delemma as to how much to break and learn now versus save would be interesting to say the least.
From a tin foil hat standpoint, this whole thought path seems unlikely.
What are the odds that something like this would not have leaked out?
Sort of off topic, but there never seems to be accompanying reports of sonic booms when objects like this are spotted moving at impossible speeds and demonstrate "...capabilities that seem to outstrip all known human aircraft..." Either these objects are an illusion of earthly origin or they are real and do not displace air when moving. Assuming the second option is the correct one what interesting hypothesis can be dreamed up about how these objects might be propelled?
"It's fun to obey the machine" - Ralph Wiggum
The idea of flying saucers being interstellar spacecraft I would argue, for a thousand and one reasons, actually might be plausible. But I would argue this now as an extension of a rather interesting physics idea. But in summary a gyroscope inside a Bose-Einstein condensate is the technology in order to induce frame dragging within the fabric of spacetime surrounding the crafts immediate region. For a while now I've been saying that the one thing I want to see is what happens when a gyroscope rotates near absolute zero. I found this paper this week only adding to my conviction. https://arxiv.org/pdf/0806.227... But in order to communicate I guess the cosmological argument I am trying to develop I have done this write up. To be honest, I am not too happy with my own right up but I am at the start of developing my idea and doing lots of homework. But there is a sense of urgency in wanting to communicate my idea and myself trying exactly what I need to say.... the next argument is mathematical in trying to describe a series of mechanics that explain why spacetime is spacetime. i.e. Why is straight actually straight, why is there 3D spatial dimensions and 1D time? Here the link to my line of reasoning, which ties up the anomalies in the CMB. http://www.blackomega.co.uk/so... One good way of saying my idea is it to reframe the idea to consider it is we who travel at the speed of light and light is stationary. By cooling things down with direction and alignment a craft aligns itself to put on the brake and travel through spacetime.
> If you gave graphene or even a metamaterial to a scientist to analyse to a scientist 20 years ago he would have probably said "these are unknown materials".
Philip Russel Wallace published a thorough analysis of the properties of graphene in 1947. Others discussed it as early as 1856. In 1948 Ruess and Vogt published electron microscopy images of proto-graphene a few molecules thick. What was new 15 years ago was an efficient method of producing it (the scotch tape method).
Someone analyzing graphene 20 years ago would be able to very easily identify it as an extremely thin, one molecule thin, piece of graphite, and they could refer to the P.R. Wallace papers to learn about it's properties. They'd then ask "how did you slice it so thin?!"
Graphene 20 years ago was roughly like an ant today - we can't make an ant, we do understand them.
I bet some of it is a "diverted" shipment from the naquadah mines on P3X-4C3.
When director Robert Wise test screened his classic movie, The Day the Earth Stood Still, he was mortified when the audience laughed at certain scenes. Then he realized what they were laughing at: the futility of the military sending tanks to confront something so obviously beyond them. It was the dawn of what people were calling "the Atomic Age", and it didn't feel like a pinnacle in human history. More like standing for the first time on the shore of an ocean you hadn't realized existed.
Now let's imagine a civilization capable of interstellar travel visited the Earth. What reason would the have to be secretive about it? In fact it's presumptuous to assume they'd have any interest in us at all. To them we'd seem hardly different from animals. Chimps, after all, make twig-tools for fishing out termites. And the attitude that local populations and ecosystems need to be treated with respect is largely a product of our new awareness of Earth finite nature. When the planet seemed unbounded to us (as the cosmos would be for a spacefaring civilization) we had no compunctions about our impact on local fauna.
But rare visits by a civilization that had no particular interest in us could produce the appearance of more frequent but secretive visits. They wouldn't be hiding from us, so people would see them, but they wouldn't be visiting places like New York or Washington DC. Not visiting major centers of human power suggests to our parochial view that they're hiding from us, when it's just as possible that they're just picking random (to us) places, which on average will tend to be much more sparsely populated compared to a major metropolis.
Then what about the marvelous artifacts that supposedly exist? Why would they leave such precious things behind? Well, precious is in the eye of the beholder. Imagine you are exploring the home territory of an uncontacted people with stone age technology, if you dropped a gum wrapper the thing would be marvelous to them. Now as an enlightened modern person the notion would be mortifying; you'd pick up after yourself to avoid contaminating their culture. But if you had a more... Victorian attitude, you wouldn't give a flying fuck if the natives worked themselves up over a bit of tinfoil.
Post may contain irony: discontinue use if experiencing mood swings, nausea or elevated blood pressure.
Furthermore, if they discovered some graphene 20 years ago (from an acquired Russian object, meteor) it could easily sit in a secure location for decades before proper research results go public and it could sit decades afterwards as a forgotten item.
They could also just sit on the item for historical purposes because of related secrets still being kept. Some old Russian spy plane bits which no longer hold meaning, for example. Government over classifies and many times it is just to cover up possible mistakes. Some general could order something stored for any reason (being well educated is not a job requirement) and to remove a secure item MUST require more than 1 expert to sign off on it's removal simply for security purposes.
NYT might get somebody in government to inventory and clean house. It is not likely we will hear about it unless they need to downplay the importance of such a place.
Democracy Now! - uncensored, anti-establishment news
It's not just the elements you combine which matters. The amount of each element you add can change the final alloy's characteristics. For example, steel (alloy of iron and carbon) becomes stronger as you add carbon. The carbon atoms wedge themselves in between the crystalline iron grains, making it harder for them to slide around (sliding is what gives metals their malleability), thus making the steel stronger (less bendy) than iron. But if you add too much carbon, you reduce the malleability so much that it becomes brittle. The microscopic structure continues to become stronger (the iron atoms don't slide against each other making it almost diamond-like in toughness), but the macroscopic structure now fractures - the crystalline metal grains which used to absorb energy by sliding around now absorb it by separating. And the combined result is weaker than iron in practical applications. Where the steel falls along this spectrum depends on the amount of carbon you add.
If it were just a simple combination of elements, then there would be a limited number of alloys, and an "unidentifiable" alloy would imply an unknown/undiscovered element. But because the amount of each element matters, there are literally an infinite number of possible alloys. And some of them may have a "sweet spot" in their desirable characteristics (like carbon does with iron to create strong steel). Not enough or too much of the alloying material and you've completely missed the sweet spot. (And there may even be multiple sweet spots - it all depends on how the half dozen elements you're alloying together interact with each other.)
So of course the DoD is going to be running experiments combining all sorts of different materials in different combinations and concentrations in search of possible alloys we've overlooked or haven't stumbled upon yet. And if they're smart they'd be cataloging their findings and storing the resulting alloys in a warehouse in case it's ever needed for future testing (so they don't have to create it again). And if they've got a particular combination and concentration of elements nobody has tried before, that would make it an "unkonwn" or "unidentified" alloy. Unknown until they make it and test it, that is.
The part participle of "to run" is "run".
"UFOs are real, the Air Force doesn't exist." Alfred E. Newman. Also from the 60s
Simple Earth example, Nitinol. Yep, its a mix of Nickel & Titanium but knowing that wouldn't let you predict its shape-memory properties.
I thought this was going to be an article about how easy it is to break all those Harbor Freight tools made out of Chineseum.
Have gnu, will travel.
The problem is that it is doing this differently in winter than summer. This is why photographers reference winter sunlight.
So why is that? There is nothing special about the angles. The sun crosses the same angles in summer, but doesn't produce the same light.
There is a common trope that fox news if fake or wrong, but in general, the news other main stream news organizations are wrong far more often, and have been caught modifying the truth an incredible amount. However, because they preach to a narrative that you favor, you ignore this.
You live in a world of confirmation bias, and are unwilling to challenge your beliefs at all. This is very sad and worse, very dangerous.
and nodody got it yet? Damn people you are dumb fucks.
FFS look at his name. You are being taunted!
For fuck's sake don't feed this troll. He's got you right where he wants you.
Consider these are journalist and not scientists. In fact journalists are about as far as you can get from scientists. Consider how they hype 'global warming' and 'climate change' and then blame hurricanes on them (even though NOAA will say the two are not related every time there is a bad one). They use doomesday language like the world has 3 years to reverse course before total annihilation. So, as a researcher, you try leaking info to your friend at the times, how are you going to describe the research you are trying to do. Imagine some material you are looking at that can change shape based on some sort of electric signal or something... Maybe its an 'alloy' or a compound like graphine. OR, maybe its some form of nanotech and nobody has yet to understand how this thing can restructure itself. Maybe its a superconductor and yet trying to make the same thing out of its base elements fails to yield the same results. How do you convey this to a journalist, someone more in tune with language and grammar, than the scientific method, logic, and reasoning? You use layman terms and explain it the way you might have to explain it to your 12-year-old. Then said journalist goes and puts what they annotated into their OWN WORDS. Viola! You get 'mysterious alloys'. When really its more likely a mysterious 'material' whose properties have yet to be unlocked.
For the record I am not some 'believer' who wants to just believe in spite of evidence to the contrary. But at the same time, I know how these dingleberries who write for main stream media think, and logic often has its own definition in their minds. Remember these are the people that think if you pass a law making something illegal (ie guns), nobody would ever be able to kill someone ever again. Murder has been illegal in this country for 250 years now, and yet it happens almost every day in one form or another. Laws don't mean shit to someone who has no regard for them. Its amazing what you can accomplish when you have a complete disregard to law, order, regulation, and due process.
First they laugh at you.
Then they fight you.
Then you win.
You are on a flat Earth.
So what about the foo fighters reported by airmen as far back as 1941 in both the Pacific and Europe?
The only thing necessary for evil to triumph is for it to be pitted against a slightly greater evil
The summary says, "From a Scientific American report:" and that instantly makes me go to the next /. article. Scientific American stopped being scientific in about 2003 when they dumped their highly qualified columnists and began
relying on journalists for articles to the exclusion of scientists.
If you gave someone a modern processor chip in 1950's. I expect that they would see it as an alloy of silicon and a bunch of other strange elements, embedded in plastic. I can well believe that a more advanced civilization could build devices atom by atom, and we would just see those devices as a alloy.
(They) sure are hyping up the ufo and aliens thing suddenly.
fake alien false flag incomming.
I've been a pilot for 30 years, most of it in high performance military aircraft. I have never seen anything "weird" in the upper atmosphere, and most of us have not. I have never seen anything like what was described and shown in the ATFLIR video released. The video by itself is not particularly remarkable, FLIR just doesn't have the resolution at whatever range they are at, it just looks like a blob, but combined with the aircrew description it is quite compelling.
I call bullshit on storing alien parts. Around 95% of all contemporary spacecraft are built around a General Products hull, and they don't fall apart. Puppeteers don't build bullshit
If we actually had the technology to take any 'unknown' substance of any kind and tell exactly what it's physical properties were, then we'd be living in a very different world. The only way I'd start believing that someone had something of extra-terrestrial origin, is if the analysis of it indicated elements that don't occur in nature, and that our species does not have the technology to synthesize. Even then I'd sooner believe in there being a 'mad scientist' somewhere on this planet who'd found a way to create the aforementioned 'unnatural' element. Otherwise it's just all media hype and superstition.
Of course it's impossible that there's an unidentifiable alloy. Any alloy we can't identify will be given a new name, like X2, identifying it.
So Material Science and Engineering is a dead science? It's been entirely exhausted and we know everything? Someone better alert the grad schools. This one's done boys.
"Unfortunately, their myopic pursuit of world power makes them do things that are morally reproachable and only causes the world to fear them"
You're talking about America, right?
maybe the know the chemical composition, but not the molecular/atomic structure. and getting time on a xray device might be difficult.
In the last few weeks the MSM have robocalled people living in states that are aligned with non-derpstate to use gathered accusations as evidence to then try and persuade the voters of ill intent.
Rewind to the end of WWI and we have the NYT proving 6 million khazarians died in a holocaust (and it was germanys fault!). It took much effort to prove the NYT wrong and people lost their reputations doing it. But, ultimately, the NYT admitted it was made up and they appologised.
Now the NYT has grabbed a random person from a random 4 letter agency to discredit what could actually be real by arguing that they found someone willing to say they dont know and therefore list out 10 issues with their unknowingness. Is that not the logical fallacy of Argument of Ignorance? Maybe they should robocall and gather a large number to say the same thing (argument of numbers, argument from authority)?
No wonder Trump calls then the Fake News Media!
This subject has been so tangled up in willful ignorance that whatever truth remains in the evidence it's unlikely anyone would actually accept it when confronted with it. People who try to do the right thing by sharing their experiences with everyone are treated with scorn, doubt and ridicule, left humiliated and worse than when they started because they said to themselves "I've got to warn everyone." Fundamentalist denial and dogmatic skepticism, that's how we treat the Truth.
Case in point: How long were we warned that various intelligence agencies were spying on us. How were these people treated by "Experts"? Then one day Snowden came forward with undeniable evidence and everyone who poured forth scorn sat there dumbfounded in their silence trying to figure out a way not to look completely stupid now that their assumptions were proven utterly, undeniably wrong. These people are the enemy of truth, they could not bare their shame and now we have tacit acceptance of the security state paid for with post tax earnings for some phone that spies on us for intelligence and advertising data because they are unwilling to confront the humiliation they dished out. We call that freedom.
In the meantime science and examination of the evidence has been polluted with the dogma of those trying to protect their book sales, their financial and fiduciary interests, their positions of prestige. Let's be realistic, whatever the truth is few are prepared to challenge the dogma and risk the scorn of having a dissenting opinion. We like being molly coddled, padded and protected from reality because it's comfortable. No one wants to give up their comfort so we accept the messages that keep the populous calm, like cows and sheep. That's the "truth" we deserve.
As for intelligent species sharing our planet, even if they hovered above every major city with lights in English flashing "WE'RE HERE" no-one would stare up from their phone screen into the light polluted sky to acknowledge it and would instead rant on facebook 'where's the hard evidence ?', ignore it when presented with it, then rely on some "Expert" to come in and comfort us when we are confronted with something disturbing.
Case in point: Look at the geometry of the megalithic structures around the world. The genius of them created at the dawn of our civilization is de-bunked by the "Experts" as co-incidence easily because we are too distracted and mentally lazy to challenge the notion of how stone age humans could encapsulate advanced knowledge as math into them. No, it's much easier to believe a bunch of extrapolations from fragments of evidence by some "experts" with arts degrees who are able to maintain their academic tenure so we can stay comfortable. That's how a "fringe" idea becomes mainstream.
So how do you think information about UFOs will be treated when that's how we treat evidence in stone that we can touch and measure? That's how we treat the dimensions you can take from the Great Pyramids, load into GeoGebra in less than a day and confirm that the basis of our entire history is a complete fabrication. That's how the "Experts" convince us that it makes perfect sense for stone age hunters with no knowledge, no engineering skills, no libraries, no farming, no experience and no business building anything so complex that it would take an international effort to build it now. Yet we all hold that contradictory idea in our head without a moments thought. We don't even challenge the established notions of Human history rationally. We're not even qualified for the subject of extra-terrestrials and their vehicles.
Of course the pilots who spend their time in the air, who are trained to recognize aircraft and who we trusted not to start a nuclear war should have their stories hand waved away by the "Experts" at S.A. Of course the high ranking military officials who control the budgets and read the reports should not be believed, what would they know compared to the "Experts"?
We should all trust the "Experts" to tell us what to believe because they know better than everyone.
My ism, it's full of beliefs.
The US is both the most generous country in the world in terms of official foreign aid giving, and it also has the most generous private NGO givings. What Russia does with all that money behind closed curtain is to breed tonnes and tonnes of Anthrax so that even they have trouble handling the Anthrax properly.
It helps to have the correct perspective so we don't ask stupid questions.
I once had a signature.
No one else sees the word play?
With extreme-right-wing rhetoric as the top and bottom bread, and some vague rambling about the article in the middle, it's some kind of nutty sandwich.
Why do you think airmen have magic eyes? OMG, things with no good point of refererecne look out of place!!! oh noes!!!
This shit been debunked so many god damn times, can people just move on already?
here, I'll give you the umbrella reason why we do know know of any alien, or extraterrestrial being, items, or visitations:
Money.
If the military new about alien, especially in the 40's and 50's, they would announce it. T\You thing the red scare cost us money and advanced are military? nothing compared to 'aliens are attacking us' would be to ramp up all space programs. How much money do you think NASA and the military would be able to get?
The Kruger Dunning explains most post on
"They wanted to see which wonder material could evade radar detection "
because that don't have radars of there own?
The Kruger Dunning explains most post on
We don't attack and troll, we only point out how much of a retard you are.
Like your claims of China copying you.
Your use of out of context or disavowed or retracted quotes.
Your piss poor ability to use english or any language.
Your support for your points that includes an AOL radio program or some wanna be Kim Komando show.
Your bloated overly complex software.
Your inability to make an effective argument and respond with actual facts instead of opinion.
Your conspiracy theory fueled fervor, usually involving the jews, Soros, Hillary, aliens, and probably the Bavarian Illuminati.
Your blind adoration for Trump.
You prove that you are a retard with every post.
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* See subject & want more? Ask.
APK
P.S.=> China did imitate me http://www.theregister.co.uk/2017/04/26/boffins_supercharge_the_hosts_file_to_save_users_plagued_by_dns_outages/
To be honest, I doubt there's any such warehouse; so the whole question is bogus. But if there were, it does seem possible that we might not be able to identify the secret sauce, or reproduce the alloy.
I have a vague recollection (which could be totally wrong) that if a scientist from the 1930s were somehow given a transistor, they could not distinguish the P-doped and N-doped regions, because the doping levels were below the sensitivity of their tests. Nor, even if they were told about doping, could they re-create a transistor, because they couldn't produce sufficiently pure samples of silicon or germanium to start with. I suppose s.t. analogous to this could be true for alien alloys--they could have some crucial property which, for one reason or another, we could not detect and/or reproduce. Not necessarily a component that we could not detect, but maybe a configuration of a component that we could not detect. (By "configuration", I mean s.t. like the difference among graphene, diamond, and soot.)
It's also possible that the word "alloy" in this report means something other than blend of metals.
i'm late to the story so maybe nobody will read this but here goes anyways:
yeah, these supposed artifacts could be metamaterials or any of ~1 bazillion things we don't have a clue about. that part didn't bother me. the part that bothered me was how the materials have some kind of strange effects upon nearby humans. whether or not the stuff exists in Nevada, that sounds more like an excuse to not show the public (and to discourage snooping) than anything else.
I'm going to be mad if this story evaporates because i blew my free NYT article reads on it.
But the amount of atmosphere traversed is the same for any light coming up from the horizon -- East or South.
This is one place where you are wrong. The Sun rises further to the South in Winter, meaning the sunlight travels through more atmosphere to reach you. Think of the angles off of due East, the angle would increase as the Sun rises further South. The summer sun and winter sun are not at the same altitude in the sky, which is why they appear different. This is why, for example, you can have stationary canopies over windows which block out summer sun but let in winter sun. If you went to the equator (if you believe it exists) you would probably notice these effects decrease. Also, how do you explain how daylight behaves at the North/South poles?
Fact: There is a calculated 0% chance that Earth is the only place in the whole entire Universe where there is life!
Two possible explanations for UFOs and Aliens.
The highest probability is that of covert military programs. One post mentioned the SR-71. You realize of course that plane was contemporary with the 1957 Chevy car, right? Kelly Johnson of the Lockheed Skunkworks designed that plane, the U-2 and even the Lockheed P-38 WWII plane. So the SR-71 while cool predates most readers here.
That leaves us with over 60 years of Black Budget R&D (the SR-71 program was spun up in 18 months btw). Comparing the 1957 Chevrolet car with a Tesla, can you see the difference here? There MUST be advanced aircraft that the military has for our defense that make the SR-71 “look” like a 1957 Chevy in comparison. Plus, the USAF gives NASA the old stock of planes and the to play with so to speak, (NASA flies U-2 and SR-71s now as well as other de-milled air and space craft??)). Makes you wonder if Mercury, Gemini, and Apollo were “hand me downs”?
There is another more fantastic possibility as well that will likely cause much skepticism, namely Time Travel or dimensional hopping.
Given the probability that life in the visible universe (though probable) is likely very far away, and given that we have had many seemingly unexplained sightings of either air or sea craft that can't be explained, two possibilities remain most likely, aliens are either ourselves from the future, or perhaps visitors from another parallel universe or both.
If you subscribe to the M Brane theory of the multi-verse, we coexist with many parallel worlds occupying the same space but on different vibrational levels. If beings from these other dimensions were capable of "breaking through" they would be able to perform the same types of aerobatics that UFOs exhibit by passing between universes and selectively transitioning to the other appearing to observers to appear and disappear, and the emerging in spaces and places inexplicably fast compared to physical laws.
Conversely, if we were able to do this, we would potentially have the ability to leave our brane of the multi-universe and via a hop into a parallel one, jumping back into our universe at a place (and potentially time) of our choosing.
Preliminary work on would require large amounts of energy and a likely non portable system, in a geologically inactive and long term stable location such that locational displacements (via time dilation) would not result in emerging under water, inside a glacier, or other solid object.
Continued research would eventually produce portable craft (flying or perhaps underwater) that could accomplish the same results that through flight, could stay within the Earth/Moon/Sun/Galactic gravitational fields but not be limited to a specialized surficial location like Area 51 for instance in the middle of a large long dead desert.
The emergence to and from our dimension would explain the flight characteristics of UFOS and from a tactical and military standpoint provide a strategic advantage of deploying material by the armed forces almost instantaneously to any location and potentially any time.
This sounds fantastic and like Science Fiction, but Occam’s Razor predicts this very thing. Namely the simplest solution to the problem is the most likely explanation.
Call Girls and Junkets aside, what would 60+ years of R&D black budget money of the combined forces of USA, NAZI scientists and input from Russian and other groups result in?
Wright Brothers Flyer to SR-71 took 54 years. The moon effectively 10 more. Mind you this was pre transistors for the most part.
Although seemingly farfetched, advanced military projects and or inter dimensional travel is really the most likely scenario.
This scenario would explain a great many things.