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Chinese Workers Abandon Silicon Valley for Riches Back Home (bloomberg.com)
From a report on Bloomberg: U.S.-trained Chinese-born talent is becoming a key force in driving Chinese companies' global expansion and the country's efforts to dominate next-generation technologies like artificial intelligence and machine learning. Where college graduates once coveted a prestigious overseas job and foreign citizenship, many today gravitate toward career opportunities at home, where venture capital is now plentiful and the government dangles financial incentives for cutting-edge research. "More and more talent is moving over because China is really getting momentum in the innovation area," said Ken Qi, a headhunter for Spencer Stuart and leader of its technology practice. "This is only the beginning."
Chinese have worked or studied abroad and then returned home long enough that there's a term for them -- "sea turtles." But while a job at a U.S. tech giant once conferred near-unparalleled status, homegrown companies -- from giants like Tencent to up-and-comers like news giant Toutiao -- are now often just as prestigious. Baidu Inc. -- a search giant little-known outside of China -- convinced ex-Microsoft standout Qi Lu to helm its efforts in AI, making him one of the highest-profile returnees of recent years.
Chinese have worked or studied abroad and then returned home long enough that there's a term for them -- "sea turtles." But while a job at a U.S. tech giant once conferred near-unparalleled status, homegrown companies -- from giants like Tencent to up-and-comers like news giant Toutiao -- are now often just as prestigious. Baidu Inc. -- a search giant little-known outside of China -- convinced ex-Microsoft standout Qi Lu to helm its efforts in AI, making him one of the highest-profile returnees of recent years.
This is Fine. This will make America wealthier. The market will provide.
Universities will not re-think allowing so many foreign students to take the seats of Americans.
E Proelio Veritas.
Don't let the door hit you!
Comment removed based on user account deletion
The worst part is when they heat up their disgusting lunches in the microwave and stink up the entire floor.
The work culture in China is much more hierarchical and labor protections are non-existent. Sex and age discrimination are rampant. There's more pollution and healthcare is worse in China as well (as much of a joke as US healthcare is, it's still better than chinese healthcare). Only status seeking imbeciles would consider returning a better choice than staying in US.
and living expenses. The nice thing about foreign students isn't just that they pay more, it's that they have the money to pay. We've been cutting federal funding to Public Us non-stop since Clinton. Hell, I was there in the mid 90s when my school's paper started talking about how the cuts meant tuition would be over $10k by 2020. They were wrong, we passed that milestone in the mid 2000s. The schools didn't get that much more expensive to run either. Nor did the salaries go up all that much (the admin staff always made a tidy sum). We cut the funding, and it had to come from somewhere. Those tax cuts don't really pay for themselves, ya know.
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Imagine that. A communist country overtaking a capitalist country in terms of innovation and quality of living. This goes against many discussions I have had here.
Laws are rules for the court, but merely a bottom bar to hit for life. Think beyond laws in your actions always.
I don't know why people are getting mad or anxious about this.
It's a totally normal and expected development. People came here for the money (and a little prestige) and now that their own country has developed are finding they can get a better deal back home.
That's all there ever was to it. It's not as if they considered the USA their "homeland" or anything like that. So I must agree to some extant with the posters who say they won't be missed. America was just a hotel to them.
Those Asians leaving help make your great country American again.
Just goes to show that conditions in China are vastly superior to shithole India. Why be treated like a street shitting Hindu in a code sweatshop in the valley and pay $5000 rent when you could live in a world class modern city like Shanghai.
Any riches that exist in China are poor copies of those items from the West.
They can replicate, but they cannot imaginate.
Well, their absence will certainly improve the population's overall internalization of Germ Theory.
Until now, we have relied on our Oriental friends to help maintain a low stray dog population. Now that they are all going home, who will continue to eat these strays?
I fear the homeless shelters will become overloaded with starving dogs that previously would have met a quick and painless death at the hands of an Oriental butcher.
Don't worry. India still does not want the Sea Turtles back. So there will be enough Indian Americans to keep America on top.
sed -e 's/Chuck Norris/Rajnikant/g' joke > fact
Have taught us well
not even a little bit. They're a Kleptocracy. Calling them communist a) gives their system of government more legitimacy than it deserves and b) puts a bad shine on Democratic Socialism, which thanks to a decades long campaign of attacks by various members of the ruling class gets associated with Chinese style Kleptocracy.
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Go get em F.B.I.!
Of course I don't believe any of this. Source is some red chinese disinformation machine. Never trust a chinaman.
We could dangle financial success as the motivator for getting good talent over here. That's always been understood to be a temporary thing given that the rest of the world can only get richer. Passing laws over here that encouraged outsourcing wealth-generating industries like manufacturing to there hurried that along faster than was good for America, however.
"No worries!" proclaimed the coastal elistists, "for American freedom entices the whole world to flock here!" Well, in principle yes. But given the way Big Tech in Silicon Valley seems to be about as open and tolerance as Mao's China or Pol Pot's Cambodia (that's not as big of an exaggeration as it used to be, for you can now be fired and blacklisted from tech for your politics), we can't really claim that as an advantage either.
So let's look inward and ask ourselves an honest question: We've got money, we've got clean air and "green" but they also have money, and the comfort of the home culture and neither one of us has more freedom than the other, and while their schools don't measure up to ours (yet), our schools are at best a decade from all turning into Evergreen State. Berkeley has already fallen down that moronic rabbit hole. What do we do to make America a desirable place to be again? This is a practical question. The foreigners with means to leave are the canaries in the coal mine. Listen carefully and you'll hear people who already have power and influence (cough Bernie Sanders, cough cough) itching for policies that will turn this place into Venezuela. Venezuela used to be rich and no one would have thought twenty years ago that it would go so far down in such a short amount of time.
Race to the bottom. Funding public school advanced placement and university research is not a priority. Funding the "special" interests, sports, human resources, and technology are high priority. Go figure.
Given what we've seen out of Silicon Valley lately, I doubt we will see much in the way of cutting-edge out of China any time soon.
Go Murica!
From the viewpoint that the US is not highly welcoming of highly educated US-educated PhDs and Masters from other nations, unlike most EU nations and Canada, it makes sense that they would return to China, where they don't prop up failing fossil fuel industries and have high speed rail, instead of trying to remain in a country in denial that it's the 21st Century already.
Now, this does point out that it would be in America's interest to encourage highly-educated US-educated PhDs and Masters recipients to remain, via expedited citizenship procedures, as occurs in the EU, UK, and Canada. But that's just an objective viewpoint.
-- Tigger warning: This post may contain tiggers! --
They're a Kleptocracy. .
so is the USA, with its police asset confiscation, and its eminent domain.
you can put a price to everything... if you so choose.
what is the price to "everything" ? how is it paid?
you're a fucking cretin!
“When it gets down to it — talking trade balances here — once we've brain-drained all our technology into other countries, once things have evened out, they're making cars in Bolivia and microwave ovens in Tadzhikistan and selling them here — once our edge in natural resources has been made irrelevant by giant Hong Kong ships and dirigibles that can ship North Dakota all the way to New Zealand for a nickel — once the Invisible Hand has taken away all those historical inequities and smeared them out into a broad global layer of what a Pakistani brickmaker would consider to be prosperity — y'know what? There's only four things we do better than anyone else:
music
movies
microcode (software)
high-speed pizza delivery”
I don't think Slashdot posters represent all America.
Plus assholes have always posted frequenty to websites... wait a minute!...
As the rest of the world evolves onward to the future, America's nazi republican government is reprogramming their idiot voter base into an Egyptian Pharaoh/slave type system.
How nice!
'Nuff said.
I used a Chinese Neural Network for my bot training, but 30 milliseconds later, they wanted to propagate again.
I have no idea why your post has been modded as Funny. This is very very true. I am not Chinese, but I grew up in Soviet Russia. That is a very precise definition of any communist society that is, was or ever will be. If everything is common property, then everything is kinda mine, is not it? Surely I can help myself! - these a thoughts of every citizen under communist rule. Also, there is no god, right? So if no one can see me, then it never happened.
Just one more bit of evidence that the American Empire is failing. Hard times ahead, I wish we could be preparing for them.
So many Negative Nancies on this website.
SOME Chinese are going back home not because the US is terrible, but because China has gotten BETTER!
You guys are letting your biases blind you to what is happening.
You can't stop China getting better. People EMIGRATE when their country sucks. If it doesn't suck, they WON'T LEAVE IT.
Understand the basic driver of migration.
...employers' IP they've stolen? That could never happen, right?
As long as you do not contradict Communist Party you can do all you want there.
The longer that Chinese citizens enjoy various freedoms in America, the more they will want to loosen or evade the restrictions on those freedoms in China, if they move back there. I expect some to refuse to go back, simply because of the differences in freedoms allowed. Eventually, those "sea turtles" will even affect Chinese policy toward super-repressive North Korea....
They were highly educated and trained when they arrived. It's YOU who owe THEM, for all the hard work and innovation they've been doing for your tech sector. Not the other way around. First generation immigrants on H1B visas are literally carrying your tech sector on their shoulders, don't pretend anything else.
Sex discrimination is actually a boon. That is, you don't have to work for yourself and plus all the women which you are collectively guilty of oppressing for the last millennium or two. Age discrimination means that if you have strength to work you don't wait for all the unionized old geezers that cannot work to retire in order for you to get your raise.
My old supervisor went back to China after his retirement. He has a PhD in Nuclear Physics. He figure there were more opportunities for an old nuke guy in China.
The soviets did get to Space first so not like being beaten by Communists is something new for USA
**Life is too short to be serious**
The actual practice of power in the US is also via PACs , thinktanks, media houses, AIPAC, ACLU etc. The elections are for show.
**Life is too short to be serious**
The CIA hoped the graduates would return home with ideas of democracy and change China within a generation.
China only sent over its smartest and most ideologically trusted students to the USA. They returned with all the US gov, mil, academic methods and did not change politically after years of study in the USA.
The best US education on offer was just used to build China up. The US educated its competitors for free always thinking it would export democracy back into China.
The CIA did not even get to tempt people to spy back to China for all that freedom, money, education and lifestyle on offer. The USA got nothing but debt after educating another nations students for generations.
Domestic spying is now "Benign Information Gathering"
For the tech elite, quality is good. Main issues is uneasiness about the government and being able to breath.
But for the bottom 80%, they are still an underdeveloped and struggling.
Mind you, I would not want to be poor in the USA either. But certainly the bottom 50% of non-US western countries lives better than most Chinese.
Not entirely true that the Chinese students did not pick up anything about freedom, democracy and the civil society. That is why the Chinese government has started to actively discourage western education as leading to "cultural incompatibility".
China is changing again, fast. And this time not for the better. Xi Jinping is taking them towards a dark place. Total control by a hierarchical party, enforced by all encompassing technology. Social media is a tool for control, not freedom, if used "correctly". An the AI the Chinese want is to control.
What will happen when, inevitably, the economy stops growing so fast and corruption becomes more obvious? When a leader claws his way to the top that is not as cunning as Xi Jinping, and causes grief. Unlike Trump, they cannot be voted out.
Taiwan is toast. But what about the rest of us?
Why is it the "that's not real socialism" argument yet again? This is cliche at this point. Of course China is communist. They know more about communism than any American leftist. They lived and breathed it for decades and murdered any right wingers who got in their way. Today China is achieving socialism by the capitalist road. This is a heresy, no wonder you're screeching against it, but it's what they arrived at from their own experience. And it's working.
Shutting down free speech with violence isn't fighting fascism. It IS fascism!
The truth is there are more personal freedoms in China than in US. As oppose to political freedoms which are important but not in everyday life. I would imagine in China you can say the N word and have no consequences to your life. Or you might be a male and get more money for better quality work.
Considering how there are pretty much ZERO chances for nuke work in the USA, I would guess he is right!
"there are more personal freedoms in China than in US"
You have got to be kidding! I have nothing against China and the people I meet on my trips there are always friendly even when the find out I am an American. China is damn near the only country the US has never invaded or attacked. Had Mao not grabbed power after WW2 ended the China-US relationship would be very different. Hell even today they still look like better allies than any other country claiming to be US allies. China is one the US's most successful regime change operation. Starting with Nixon in 1972 the US helped change China from a closed and destitute Communist state to a Capitalist state that is integrated with the international trade and financial markets. The US just had to show the Chinese leadership how rich they could become by supporting international trade. The US reaped the benefits and profits by expanding trade with the Chinese.
However China doesn't have anything like a codified US Constitution or Bill of Rights. They do not have Freedom the Press, Freedom of Speech, or any of the other citizen rights like those in the US. And any Chinese citizen daring to challenge the Party line in protest will face some immediate and severe government intervention. The only public protest that are allowed is those the government organizes. China has government censors who monitor all forms of media to control what the citizens see or read. Their internet firewalls, site or service restrictions, and electronic monitoring is comprehensive and effective. The reason all these efforts are pretty much successful is that the Chinese citizens also know what punishments are handed out for any online transgressions.
And there may be a few exceptions but the Chinese who are returning home will not be paid as much as they could have by working in the US.
They recently moved to Silicon Valley and say things like "China sucks. Fuck that place I'm never going back."
You are talking about political freedoms. Like, having good stable election system or freedom of speech.
But these are not the only freedoms that are there. In US, you have to lie about , to subscribe to the ever increased list of reality-denying things about race, sex, economics, public morals, or else your life will be ruined. In China, you there to make money, there is nothing of the sort, save some ritual worship of the Communist Party.
This has some negative consequences, like running environment, but also is the reason for all this growth: people can simply work and make money, not spending lifetimes conforming to this and that SJW theory.
You're a hydrid Marxist apologist dupe who is asserting BOTH that "the wrong people did it" AND that "they did it the wrong way".
Ha ha.
Ususally, the useful idiots only use one of those excuses at a time to explain why a specific Marxist example has, like every other example in human history, failed to produce the promised utopia.
Go and read F.A.Hayek's "The Road to Surfdom" and you will either finally realize why this NEVER works and NEVER CAN work, or you will prove yourself terminologically irrational.
Told you so
30 years ago when this shit started
it was self evident that the trade practice and techniques were going to go BACK and bankrupt the people who labored to create the industry
And the answer was always "We know what we're doing.
Better quarterlies now, and we'll buy them up later"
Well now they have bought up your profitable businesses, or put them out of business, creating wage stagnation and job insecurity even among your highly skilled labor force and they voted their anger, and now you have tRump and Putin running things
Happy now?
A lot of people in the "West" believe that everyone from other parts of the world all want to immigrate. If you travel a bit, or work with foreign workers, you quickly hear that the vast majority value family and friends over money. It simply isn't worth it.
right? If I said I was the undisputed King of the World would you bow down before me and shower me with riches? Maybe I should try that...
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tax the billionaires who benefit from a skilled workforce to pay for maintaining that skilled workforce. It's called paying ones dues. They benefit the most from that work force so they bloody damn well should pay for it. By "exporting" education America's 1% no longer need to maintain funding to schools here. And it shows, they've slashed budgets non-stop for 30 years in the name of 'fiscal responsibility', all the while cutting their taxes via loopholes and offshore banks.
The reason to bring those folks overseas isn't to fund our education. It's exactly the opposite. It's so somebody else (them and their home country) can pay for it. This is also why we need so many H1-Bs. If you're not going to pay for Americans to go to school and instead rely on foreign countries to do it then you need import those workers too.
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I was on a grad admissions committee during the transition. The economy was gung ho and few Americans applied to our Stanford department. We had lots of research money and let qualified foreigners in greater numbers.
It was a little painful first, because new students may take a while to acquire daily English fluency. They may ace the written tests, but listening may take some time.