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Apple Health Data Is Being Used As Evidence In a Rape and Murder Investigation (vice.com)

An anonymous reader quotes a report from Motherboard: Hussein K., an Afghan refugee in Freiburg, has been on trial since September for allegedly raping and murdering a student in Freiburg, and disposing of her body in a river. But many of the details of the trial have been hazy -- no one can agree on his real age, and most notably, there's a mysterious chunk of time missing from the geodata and surveillance video analysis of his whereabouts at the time of the crime. He refused to give authorities the passcode to his iPhone, but investigators hired a Munich company (which one is not publicly known) to gain access to his device, according to German news outlet Welt. They searched through Apple's Health app, which was added to all iPhones with the release of iOS 8 in 2014, and were able to gain more data about what he was doing that day. The app records how many steps he took and what kind of activity he was doing throughout that day. The app recorded a portion of his activity as "climbing stairs," which authorities were able to correlate with the time he would have dragged his victim down the river embankment, and then climbed back up. Freiburg police sent an investigator to the scene to replicate his movements, and sure enough, his Health app activity correlated with what was recorded on the defendant's phone.

185 comments

  1. During the time period the rape occurred, by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    The app reported his activity as 'Vigorous Intercourse'. Boom.... 99 to life.

  2. Attn: FBI by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Apparently they didn't need a backdoor to get the evidence they needed. They used brains and ingenuity.

    1. Re:Attn: FBI by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      no, they hired a company to exploit a backdoor to break into his phone, and then accessed the Health app

    2. Re: Attn: FBI by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I refuse to believe this data is only stored on the client.

    3. Re: Attn: FBI by saloomy · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Believe whatever you want. Network analysis would have determined ages ago if that app communicated with Apple servers, which would have to be periodic.

      Security researchers analyze network traffic in controlled environments all the time, and it would be a ton of damage control and egg on face if it was ever subpoenaed or hacked. I doubt this to be the case.

    4. Re:Attn: FBI by david_thornley · · Score: 2

      TFA said it was an iPhone 4S. That's two generations earlier than the Secure Enclave, and we already know iPhones without that can be hacked into. No mystery here.

      --
      "When you have eliminated the unacceptable, whatever is left, however improbable, must be the truthiness" - Holmes
    5. Re:Attn: FBI by ZorinLynx · · Score: 1

      Well this has even more holes in it, then.

      The iPhone 4S doesn't have the motion processor required to collect health data, including steps taken.

      It also can't obtain climbing data because it lacks the barometer that the iPhone 6 and newer use to collect that information.

      How exactly did the 4S have this info? I had an iPhone 5 and it lacked these features, and it was newer than the 4S.

    6. Re:Attn: FBI by david_thornley · · Score: 1

      iPhones have always had motion sensors. There was a neat app on my original that scrolled text by at a rate controlled by the angle the phone was held at. I don't know what the deal was on it. TFA is short, and I had to read the Google Translate version.

      --
      "When you have eliminated the unacceptable, whatever is left, however improbable, must be the truthiness" - Holmes
    7. Re:Attn: FBI by angel'o'sphere · · Score: 2

      An iPhone 4 has an accelerometer, so yes it can count steps etc.
      Further more it has GPS, so yes it can measure climbs. Considering that a climb is a low speed step with harder shock when setting down the food, it is easy to distinguish without GPS even. Especially if it is a downhill climb as in this example.

      --
      Cost free eBook I read (by iBook/Kobo/Amazon/ObookO/Gutenberg etc.): "The Green Odyssey" by Philip Jose Farmer.
    8. Re: Attn: FBI by BankRobberMBA · · Score: 1

      Well put. Thank you.

    9. Re:Attn: FBI by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      That app was using a gyroscope sensor to tell the angle your phone is at.

    10. Re: Attn: FBI by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      No, but someone forced entry through the back door to place it.

      Rapists are gonna rape.

    11. Re: Attn: FBI by jan_koch · · Score: 2

      Clarification: The phone was not an iPhone 4s, but an iPhone 6s. The "Die Welt" article only quotes a policeman as saying that "iPhones from 4s upwards cannot be accessed without the PIN", but makes no further statement as to the actual phone used by the accused. The original source, however, clearly states the phone model as an iPhone 6s:

      http://www.badische-zeitung.de...

    12. Re: Attn: FBI by Waccoon · · Score: 1

      I doubt analysis can identify all the encrypted packets coming out of a computer. There's a reason people are so spooked about Intel ME.

      I was rather amazed to find that new versions of Process Explorer will happily tell me my Win10 evaluation machine is at 0% CPU and 0% disk utilization, while older versions of Process Explorer clearly show all kinds of shit going on. Running both the new and old apps side-by-side is very interesting indeed. When it comes to 1st-party software (you know, made by the people who build the OS/computer), it's hard to tell when they're lying by omission. Like it or not, It's the way of the future.

    13. Re: Attn: FBI by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      This is going to trial? How can there not be some kind of "reasonable doubt" in relying on reconstructed heart rates and step counts to prove anything? They better have more than this to go on.

    14. Re: Attn: FBI by minstrelmike · · Score: 1

      They probably do have more evidence.
      The reasonable doubt is what a jury uses, not a police investigator and not even a prosecutor. A prosecutor looks at the likeliness of a jury granting reasonable doubt to the entire prosecution argument.

      There's a reason the police started looking at this guy in particular in the first place. Most people are killed by family and acquaintances, not by complete strangers.

    15. Re:Attn: FBI by doccus · · Score: 1

      Except he wasn't "climbing" stars. He was dragging the victim down a river embankment. They "correlated" thow it would relate to a staircase.. and I guess it did work..

    16. Re:Attn: FBI by angel'o'sphere · · Score: 1

      Was that not what I said?
      "Climbing" backward down a slope?

      --
      Cost free eBook I read (by iBook/Kobo/Amazon/ObookO/Gutenberg etc.): "The Green Odyssey" by Philip Jose Farmer.
    17. Re: Attn: FBI by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Drift from the âoefuzzâ on the GPS signal can make walking with your phone be reported as climbing stairs. Itâ(TM)s why the latest phones have barometers built in. I still get reported as climbing stairs in my one floor rental. Thereâ(TM)s a total of one step in the place, from the garage to the house. Getting into my car is a greater vertical transition ... just yesterday, in the house, and a trip to the store, reported Iâ(TM)d done 2 flights of stairs. But... I did zero.

  3. Note to self ... by pz · · Score: 4, Insightful

    ... do not carry phone when performing criminal acts.

    --

    Put my fist through my alarm clock with its ding-dong death inside my ear. - The Blackjacks.
    1. Re:Note to self ... by Carewolf · · Score: 2, Insightful

      ... do not carry phone when performing criminal acts.

      Maybe it would be better for everybody if you would just abstain from committing murder?

    2. Re:Note to self ... by pz · · Score: 4, Funny

      ... do not carry phone when performing criminal acts.

      Maybe it would be better for everybody if you would just abstain from committing murder?

      Oh, right. That's probably a better idea.

      --

      Put my fist through my alarm clock with its ding-dong death inside my ear. - The Blackjacks.
    3. Re:Note to self ... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      "I don't always commit criminal acts, but when I do I don't carry a tracking device."

    4. Re:Note to self ... by quantaman · · Score: 1

      ... do not carry phone when performing criminal acts.

      That seems like quite an inconvenience.

      Maybe I'll get a burner phone so I can still catch some Pokemon while I'm out murdering.

      --
      I stole this Sig
    5. Re:Note to self ... by 140Mandak262Jamuna · · Score: 2
      Note to self:

      First stop storing notes to self on phones.

      --
      sed -e 's/Chuck Norris/Rajnikant/g' joke > fact
    6. Re: Note to self ... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      But if you gotta...

    7. Re:Note to self ... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      somebody give this guy a "NO FUN" sign

    8. Re:Note to self ... by K.+S.+Kyosuke · · Score: 1

      Exactly, hire someone to do it for you. Much less messy!

      --
      Ezekiel 23:20
    9. Re:Note to self ... by networkBoy · · Score: 1

      you assumed murder, but simply speeding on the motorway is a criminal act that your phone (if GPS is on) certainly can tattle on you for.

      --
      whois gawk date unzip strip find touch finger mount join nice man top fsck grep eject more yes exit umount sleep dump
    10. Re:Note to self ... by uncqual · · Score: 1

      That's not an option for Dexter.

      --
      Why is there an "insightful" mod and why isn't it "-1"? If I wanted insight, I wouldn't be reading /.
    11. Re:Note to self ... by glenebob · · Score: 1

      But then how do you keep your rape victims from reporting you?

    12. Re:Note to self ... by Ungrounded+Lightning · · Score: 1

      ... do not carry phone when performing criminal acts.

      Or when NOT performing criminal acts - when somebody ELSE performs a criminal act that confused police might try to pin on you.

      Gosh: That's all the time, isn't it?

      --
      Bantam Dominique roosters crow a four-note song. Once you've heard it as "Happy BIRTHday" you can't NOT hear it that way
    13. Re:Note to self ... by The+Grim+Reefer · · Score: 2

      .. do not carry phone when performing criminal acts.

      The way things are going, not having your phone on and with you will become suspicious behavior, if not presumption of guilt.

    14. Re:Note to self ... by ark1 · · Score: 1

      carry someone's else phone.

    15. Re:Note to self ... by Khyber · · Score: 1, Flamebait

      Dick in the mouth to keep them from talking always worked for me! Caveat: You need at least 8 inches of cock for this to work.

      --
      Still waiting on Serviscope_minor to wake up to fucking reality and realize that Jessica Price isn't going to fuck him.
    16. Re:Note to self ... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Unless you're spending big money on a hit man you're hiring a thug. Not a smart move.

    17. Re:Note to self ... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      ... do not carry phone when performing criminal acts.

      Maybe it would be better for everybody if you would just abstain from committing murder?

      Oh, right. That's probably a better idea.

      Meh.

    18. Re:Note to self ... by rtb61 · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Have someone else commit rape and murder for you, kind of makes no sense. The rape bit was the intent, the murder bit was to get away with rape ie to the individual other people are just disposable, no value beyond how they can be used and abused. Forget phone stuff, how about testing for psychopathy before they are let into the country. Trial and prosecution well and good but still a person horribly abused and they killed for convenience, if the attacker had been tested before being let into the country and banned as a psychopath, the victim would not have become a victim nor the tens of thousands of others. Simply test for psychopathy prior to allowing entry for all refugees and immigrants and save the lives of thousands and save the suffering of millions. Psychopaths do not commit just one crime but routinely commit crime, daily, weekly, monthly, of never mind to them, as long as they believe they can get away with the crime, they will commit the crime, no matter how viscous, ugly or petty ie kill someone so that you can get away with raping them.

      --
      Chaos - everything, everywhere, everywhen
    19. Re: Note to self ... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0, Funny

      Testing, standards, littering, and merit to let someone in the country?

      You must be a racist trump voter. Everyone else believes in open borders and actively importing as many as possible from shitty countries.

    20. Re:Note to self ... by tsa · · Score: 1

      Too much information! Yuch...

      --

      -- Cheers!

    21. Re:Note to self ... by SuricouRaven · · Score: 1

      Tell us, how exactly does one go about 'testing for psychopathy' in a reliable manner? Or do you propose just turning refugees away if they fail a psychiatric evaluation, even if there is no evidence of any criminal history?

    22. Re:Note to self ... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Tell us, how exactly does one go about 'testing for psychopathy' in a reliable manner? Or do you propose just turning refugees away if they fail a psychiatric evaluation, even if there is no evidence of any criminal history?

      One of the hallmarks of psychopathy is a complete lack of empathy. so you can diagnose psychopathy through longer term observation since psychopaths slip up and reveal themselves. Another option is to simply ask them. Interviews between the subject and a specialist is often the simplest way since psychopaths can be surprisingly nonchalant and eager to talk about their condition and how it manifests itself.

    23. Re:Note to self ... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0
      Have someone else commit rape and murder for you, kind of makes no sense.

      I take it you haven't heard the term "snuff flick"?

    24. Re:Note to self ... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You test for psychopathy by asking "Are you a muslim?"
      That's pretty reliable.

    25. Re:Note to self ... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Exactly how long did it keep you quiet for?

    26. Re:Note to self ... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      There's a whole bunch of unsubstantiated bullshit going on in this post.

      "Simply test for psychopathy prior to allowing entry for all refugees and immigrants and save the lives of thousands and save the suffering of millions."

      What test would we use? How reliable is it? What is the false positive rate? Will there be a way to appeal the test's decision?

      "Psychopaths do not commit just one crime but routinely commit crime, daily, weekly, monthly, of never mind to them, as long as they believe they can get away with the crime, they will commit the crime, no matter how viscous, ugly or petty"

      You know this how? What evidence is there that all psychopaths routinely commit crime? Have studies been done?

      I would hope you recognize, though it seems you do not, that any time you label a group of people "X" (psychopath, jew, black, gypsy, communist, etc.) and then justify curtailing their rights based on supposed universal traits, abuses happen. Pretty much every time. What happens if your test for psychopathy ends up identifying you as a psychopath? Unthinkable, I know, but what if? Would you accept the diagnosis and leave the country? Somehow I doubt it .

    27. Re:Note to self ... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      buy nice mechanical watch and do not wear phone at all, trust me you don't need one.

    28. Re:Note to self ... by erapert · · Score: 1

      Voight Kampf...

    29. Re:Note to self ... by martinfb · · Score: 2

      I would if people would stop needing it!

      --


      Self-importance and self-indulgence is the root of ALL evil.
    30. Re:Note to self ... by 3vi1 · · Score: 1

      But then how are you going to live-tweet it?

    31. Re:Note to self ... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I'm not aware of any psychopathy tests that can be reliably performed on newborns...

    32. Re: Note to self ... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Would dexter kill dexter?

    33. Re:Note to self ... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Tell us, how exactly does one go about 'testing for psychopathy' in a reliable manner?

      Actually, this is quite easy and very accurate.

      However, I'm not going to tell any psychopaths who may be reading this how to defeat the test.

    34. Re:Note to self ... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Psychopaths do not commit just one crime but routinely commit crime, daily, weekly, monthly, of never mind to them, as long as they believe they can get away with the crime, they will commit the crime, no matter how viscous, ugly or petty ie kill someone so that you can get away with raping them.

      Not all psychopaths are criminals. Note that a lot of research on the condition is skewed, because it's easy to study the psychopaths that end up in prison. People with low empathy can still be high-functioning members of society as long as they have the right upbringing and so on.

  4. Re:What is this story doing on Slashdot? by HornWumpus · · Score: 3, Informative

    Perhaps you should stay on reddit? They don't allow discussion of uncomfortable facts, you'll fit right in.

    --
    John McAfee 'It was like that time I hired that Bangkok prostitute; to do my taxes, while I fucked my accountant'
  5. Re:What is this story doing on Slashdot? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Said the left wing troll.

  6. This is how it is now... by MalachiK · · Score: 3, Interesting

    I think we need to accept that, whether we like it or not, there's always going to be some data about what you are doing recorded somewhere. If you're carrying around a computer with GPS and an accelerometer that constantly reports back to who Google or Apple or whatever apps you have installed, you shouldn't be too surprised when someone with enough resources is able to put together a pretty good picture of what you've been up to.

    1. Re:This is how it is now... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      The devices you purchase can and will testify against you in court.

      The default legal advice to everyone being arrested is "answer no questions" because every answer can be used against.

      It would seem that "use no devices" is also sound legal advice.

    2. Re:This is how it is now... by gnasher719 · · Score: 1

      Your health data is not reported back to Apple. It's stored on your phone. And many people interested in their health _want it_ to be stored on their phone.

    3. Re:This is how it is now... by AHuxley · · Score: 1

      Re "whether we like it or not, there's always going to be some data about what you are doing recorded somewhere."
      Not so much if a person did not carry an Apple, Google product.
      Then it is only nation wide CCTV for face, gait, car drivers face, passengers face, license plates....

      --
      Domestic spying is now "Benign Information Gathering"
    4. Re:This is how it is now... by lucm · · Score: 1

      you shouldn't be too surprised when someone with enough resources is able to put together a pretty good picture of what you've been up to.

      This is scary.

      I'm old enough to have lived in a time when prank calls were common because there was no caller id. Now I have to leave my phone home when I go see my drug dealer in case the cops are using a stingray to identify his clients. I wonder how bad it will get in 100 or 2000 years.

      --
      lucm, indeed.
    5. Re:This is how it is now... by sad_ · · Score: 1

      don't know about an iphone, but you can turn all that tracking stuff off.
      i only turn all those things on when i go jogging or need active gps guidance.

      --
      On a long enough timeline, the survival rate for everyone drops to zero.
  7. So you are telling me ... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    ... that if i gain possession of someone's phone, carry it while I commit a crime, then bring it back to the original owner, I will be clear and the phone owner will be framed.
    Justice served!

    1. Re:So you are telling me ... by MalachiK · · Score: 1

      You know, I can see that happening one day. That's not to say that I'm very happy about it.

  8. Re:What is this story doing on Slashdot? by alvinrod · · Score: 1

    Yeah, the summary seems designed to bait people, but at least this story has some connection to technology unlike a lot of political crap that gets thrown up here some days. It would probably be better to leave the aspects unrelated to the technology side of it out, or it just stirs up shit in the comments. Or just more shit than usual I suppose.

  9. Re:What is this story doing on Slashdot? by christoofar · · Score: 3, Insightful

    The story is on Slashdot because you do not get to edit Slashdot. Sorry.

  10. Re:Smells like a political coverup by Knuckles · · Score: 1

    Missing chunks of data from both phone and video evidence when it involves a highly debated group that the ruling government says doesn't exist. Age can be determined by teeth.

    Merkel's propaganda machine hard at work while she's trying to cobble together her government.

    Using the wording "the ruling government" to make it appear mysteriously evil is a failure. Governments rule, that's not particularly sinister. So it's no surprise that you are lying, as the government is decidedly not saying that this group of people doesn't exist, and that you are wrong, teeth cannot be used to determine age with the precision and confidence necessary for immigration purposes.

    --
    "When I first heard Daydream Nation it quite frankly scared the living shit out of me." -- Matthew Stearns
  11. I agree, let the rapists rape by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Insightful

    We should absolutely all look the other way as groups of young men from misogynistic cultures are funneled in by the thousands and let loose. Who cares if a few hundred, or thousand, or tens of thousand of women get a little raped/stabbed? They led a privileged (and probably white) life so frankly (or should I say, Frankfurtly!) they deserve it.

    1. Re:I agree, let the rapists rape by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      totally agree the misogynistic cultures that produced Weinstein, Laur, Ailes, Reilly, Spacey ... need to be held accountable

    2. Re:I agree, let the rapists rape by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      They should be held accountable.
      You can't hold "society" accountable.
      Lame ass attempt at a gotcha.

    3. Re:I agree, let the rapists rape by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      totally agree the misogynistic cultures that produced Weinstein, Laur, Ailes, Reilly, Spacey ... need to be held accountable

      Or at least their mothers. These women must have done truly horrible things to their sons to turn them into such monsters.

    4. Re:I agree, let the rapists rape by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      The two are brothers, what do you expect.

  12. Re:What is this story doing on Slashdot? by MalachiK · · Score: 2

    Maybe one day, when there aren't as many asshats on the internet.

  13. if this is not an Apple ad by mapkinase · · Score: 1

    I do not know what is /s

    --
    I do not believe in karma. "Funny"=-6. Do good and forbid evil. Yours, Oft-Offtopic Flamebaiting Troll.
  14. Re:Smells like a political coverup by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

    >Age can be determined by teeth

    It might not say it in THIS specific article, but he had been analyzed for age, and it turns out this "child refugee" is in fact in his 30s. His father back in Afghanistan even confirmed it.

  15. no by AndyKron · · Score: 1

    Not evidence!

    1. Re:no by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You should look up the legal definition of evidence before making yourself look like an idiot in public.

  16. That's getting tenuous ... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I'm not saying this person is guilty or not, but this is some pretty indirect evidence.

    What other things can correlate to this? Vigorous masturbation? Going to the gym?

    I already have no interest in my phone tracking my location, my activity, or any of that crap. At the end of the day, all of that information about you is going to end up in the wrong hands or get misused.

    No thanks, I have shockingly little desire to carry around something which tracks my life to this detail.

    But, I guess the lesson is if you're going to go out and commit a crime, leave your phone at home. Apparently it will be your alibi.

    1. Re: That's getting tenuous ... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      GPS location data. Camera footage up to the area where the body was dumped. So yeah, if he just happened to be vigorously masturbating at the same location and time as someone dumping a body...oh well dude. Let this be a lesson to all of us: stop working out and masturbating on the public shore while you watch someone dump a body....the authorities could suspect you had something to do with it.

  17. Circumstantial evidence by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I'm not familiar with German courts, so I'm commenting on how this would be viewed in the United States.

    This is circumstantial evidence. The prosecutors have demonstrated that the Apple Health data is consistent with dumping a body in that river. There are certainly other alternate explanations, not the least of which is legitimately climbing stairs. It's not as damning as a GPS history would be, because it doesn't say where the activity was performed. If the defense offered another plausible explanation, especially with any other corroborating evidence, it would provide more than reasonable doubt.

    When you use features like activity tracking, you should expect that your activities are being tracked. If you don't want your activity tracked, turn the feature off, or don't carry the device with you. There are obviously ways to circumvent the encryption and access the data, if law enforcement is willing to pay for it. For lesser offenses, it probably isn't worth the effort for law enforcement to do so. In a case like murder or a mass shooting, there's more incentive for law enforcement to do what it takes to access the data. Ultimately, I believe that encryption is a much-needed check on law enforcement to not extend surveillance too far into our lives.

    1. Re:Circumstantial evidence by lucm · · Score: 1

      This is circumstantial evidence. The prosecutors have demonstrated that the Apple Health data is consistent with dumping a body in that river.

      There's 2 milion people incarcerated in the USA, almost half for violent crimes. You really think there was more than circumstantial evidence in all those 2 million cases?

      --
      lucm, indeed.
  18. Re:Smells like a political coverup by Hal_Porter · · Score: 4, Interesting

    Age can be determined by teeth.

    The Swedes tried to do that. Most refugees destroy their documents so they can't be deported and Sweden gives preference to children. It turned out that most of the 'child refugees' they were admitting were over 18.

    https://www.thelocal.se/201712...

    The Migration Agency has so far made 5,700 decisions on the basis of assessments carried out by Rättsmedicinalverket. In 79 percent of those cases the agency decided to formally consider the applicant as older than they had initially claimed in their asylum application, reports Svenska Dagbladet (SvD).

    Between mid-March and late October, Rättsmedicinalverket carried out a total of 7,858 age assessments. Of those, it found that their examination suggested 6,628 were 18 or older, and 112 "possibly" 18 or older.

    The left - who wanted to let in the refugees - claimed that doing tests were a violation of human rights of course and fought the introduction of them to the bitter end. You can expect something similar to happen in Germany.

    --
    echo -e 'global _start\n _start:\n mov eax, 2\n int 80h\n jmp _start' > a.asm; nasm a.asm -f elf; ld a.o -o a;
  19. This is why I will never be selected for Jury by DalM · · Score: 1

    If I was selected for a jury the prosecutor had better bring a lot more to the table than that. If that's the best evidence for their case I would acquit. Though I might consider that slightly better than eye witness testimony.

    1. Re:This is why I will never be selected for Jury by 93+Escort+Wagon · · Score: 1

      Of course, you have no idea whether this is the “best evidence” they have or not, given this submission is only about the tech angle.

      --
      #DeleteChrome
    2. Re:This is why I will never be selected for Jury by david_thornley · · Score: 1

      They had good reason to suspect the guy, or they wouldn't have had his phone hacked. Whatever reasons they used are probably additional evidence.

      --
      "When you have eliminated the unacceptable, whatever is left, however improbable, must be the truthiness" - Holmes
    3. Re:This is why I will never be selected for Jury by Registered+Coward+v2 · · Score: 1

      If I was selected for a jury the prosecutor had better bring a lot more to the table than that. If that's the best evidence for their case I would acquit. Though I might consider that slightly better than eye witness testimony.

      I doubt that is all they would use. It could be used to corroborate other facts in the case as to further prove this person actually committed the crime; for example it could fill in for missing pieces in the surveillance video if it correlated with his actions in the available videos. The defense would offer some alternate explanation and it would be up to jury to decide which facts seem most plausible and thus wether or not to convict. As a side note, he has apparently admitted to the murder.

      --
      I'm a consultant - I convert gibberish into cash-flow.
    4. Re:This is why I will never be selected for Jury by TechyImmigrant · · Score: 1

      If I was selected for a jury the prosecutor had better bring a lot more to the table than that. If that's the best evidence for their case I would acquit.

      Though I might consider that slightly better than eye witness testimony.

      I doubt that is all they would use. It could be used to corroborate other facts in the case as to further prove this person actually committed the crime; for example it could fill in for missing pieces in the surveillance video if it correlated with his actions in the available videos. The defense would offer some alternate explanation and it would be up to jury to decide which facts seem most plausible and thus wether or not to convict. As a side note, he has apparently admitted to the murder.

      You can't trust a murderer. If he admitted to it, he might be lying.

      --
      I should use this sig to advertise my book ISBN-13 : 978-1501515132.
    5. Re:This is why I will never be selected for Jury by angel'o'sphere · · Score: 2

      I think the rape is already proven by DNA tests. The murder he admitted, but he is silent about why he did all day.
      Hence they want to make a profile of his movements.
      Germany has no juries in trials, like most countries have none.

      --
      Cost free eBook I read (by iBook/Kobo/Amazon/ObookO/Gutenberg etc.): "The Green Odyssey" by Philip Jose Farmer.
    6. Re:This is why I will never be selected for Jury by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      According to the articles the suspect has already admitted to raping and strangling the victim until she was unconscious. That usually counts as good evidence. The suspect has not admitted to dragging her unconscious body down to the river and drowning her. It appears from the health/fitness app on his phone that the activity it recorded during that time matched those activities pretty close when an investigator took the same phone and app and repeated the motions believed to be involved in the actual murder. I assume they had ample evidence to arrest and charge him for the murder in the first place, and the iphone data is just one more piece of evidence.

      The suspect also claimed to be 17 at the time of the crime, and after the authorities got into his phone they called the contact that was marked in the phone as his dad and asked about him, to learn that the man believed to be his dad said that he was really 31 at the time of the murder.

      The suspect was also charged and found guilty of attempted murder in Greece in 2015, but was paroled due to prison overcrowding, and then failed to report to the parole officer after being released.

    7. Re:This is why I will never be selected for Jury by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      > If I was selected for a jury the prosecutor

      Luckily, Germany, like most countries of the world, use the modified Ancient Roman (Napoleonic) civil and criminal legal code, so there is no jury whatsoever, just one or three judges, who decide guilt and mete out punishment by themselves. Not just the defendant, but the public accuser also has the right to appeal a sentence, so murderers have very little chance to avoid punishment like the american trigger-happy cops do every week.

      (The so-called "common law" is actually rare outside the anglo-saxon-american sphere, despite the best efforts of Hollywood.)

  20. Re:Smells like a political coverup by Pinky's+Brain · · Score: 0

    What I can't find in any article is the court admitting it yet, only that they ruled him a minor the last time they had to decide.

    Ruling his age as adult has consequences, there are most likely hundreds of thousands of these "minors" in Europe after all. Admitting the lie is potentially dangerous, might give the extreme right ammunition.

  21. Wait, what? by QuietLagoon · · Score: 1

    ... investigators hired a Munich company (which one is not publicly known) to gain access to his device...

    I thought it was not possible to get into an iPhone without having a back door present?

    1. Re:Wait, what? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Some of the female iphone uses don't allow the backdoor. But 'bang on' for the men.

    2. Re:Wait, what? by david_thornley · · Score: 1

      Using Google Translate on TFA, it appears that the phone was a 4S. It's known to be possible to break into an iPhone older than 5S, when Apple introduced the Secure Enclave.

      Moral: If you're going to commit a heinous crime, and carry an iPhone while doing so, make sure it's a 5 or 5C or earlier, so the prosecution can gather more evidence. (I'm not on the side of people who commit heinous crimes, like rape and murder.)

      --
      "When you have eliminated the unacceptable, whatever is left, however improbable, must be the truthiness" - Holmes
  22. Re:What is this story doing on Slashdot? by Archangel+Michael · · Score: 2

    Lets hide facts, then the Alt-Right (or whatever) won't be able to use them.

    THEN, when some Alt-right guy finds the actual facts, and builds a racist case based on the "system hiding facts" as "proof" of some conspiracy (which is in fact a true conspiracy) he can use all of those actual facts that you wanted to hide as evidence of racial superiority, and recruitment goes through the roof as real facts aren't countered by alternative reasons because they are politically incorrect facts that were hidden.

    OR, you know, admit the facts, when they are bad for your cause, because hiding the truth never works out as intended.

    --
    Agent K: A *person* is smart. People are dumb, stupid, panicky animals, and you know it.
  23. Re:Smells like a political coverup by 93+Escort+Wagon · · Score: 4, Informative

    You might want to read the entire article you’re linking to, since it doesn’t seem to support the narrative you are trying to posit. Especially this line:

    ”The results of these checks don't give a picture of how accurate the given age of all asylum seekers in Sweden is, as the checks have only been carried out in cases where there was reason to doubt the person's given age.”

    So your statement that “most of the 'child refugees' they were admitting were over 18” is, in fact, not what the article says. Instead, what it does say is in those cases where the Swedish authorities suspected the person’s age was not in fact under 18, it turns out their suspicions were correct.

    The authorities were doing their job, in other words.

    In fact, the story doesn’t actually even claim these people were intentionally lying. It states that one possible explanation is that, during the eighteen months between the time the applications were originally filed and when they were considered, those people had simply aged past eighteen.

    --
    #DeleteChrome
  24. Re:What is this story doing on Slashdot? by Archangel+Michael · · Score: 2

    You must be new here.

    There have always been asshats.

    --
    Agent K: A *person* is smart. People are dumb, stupid, panicky animals, and you know it.
  25. Re:Smells like a political coverup by quantaman · · Score: 1

    Age can be determined by teeth.

    The Swedes tried to do that. Most refugees destroy their documents so they can't be deported and Sweden gives preference to children. It turned out that most of the 'child refugees' they were admitting were over 18.

    https://www.thelocal.se/201712...

    The Migration Agency has so far made 5,700 decisions on the basis of assessments carried out by Rättsmedicinalverket. In 79 percent of those cases the agency decided to formally consider the applicant as older than they had initially claimed in their asylum application, reports Svenska Dagbladet (SvD).

    Between mid-March and late October, Rättsmedicinalverket carried out a total of 7,858 age assessments. Of those, it found that their examination suggested 6,628 were 18 or older, and 112 "possibly" 18 or older.

    The left - who wanted to let in the refugees - claimed that doing tests were a violation of human rights of course and fought the introduction of them to the bitter end. You can expect something similar to happen in Germany.

    Wrong, most of the claimed child refugees submitted for testing were adults. But they only tested a refuge when they thought they were lying. No one is going to bother doing an assessment of a 10 year old.

    Further down in the same article:
    As a result, in September last year the government asked for medical age assessments to be carried out on a large scale.

    More than 80,000 minors (of whom 37,000 arrived in the country without a parent or guardian) applied for asylum in Sweden in 2015 and 2016. Medical age assessments are carried out only in cases where the Migration Agency believes there is reason to doubt their age.

    There's every reason to believe that a substantial majority of the child refugees are actually children.

    --
    I stole this Sig
  26. Re:Smells like a political coverup by Hal_Porter · · Score: 3, Informative

    https://www.thelocal.se/201609...

    Sweden will make medical age assessments of unaccompanied asylum seekers by examining their teeth and knee joints. The new system, unveiled on Friday by the national forensic medicine agency (Rättsmedicinalverket), aims to tackle doubts over the accurate age of those who seek asylum in the country.
    With over 35,000 coming last year alone, Sweden has taken in more unaccompanied children and young people than any other country in Europe, and many of them lack identity documents.

    The migration authority (Migrationsverket) makes an initial age assessment with every application, but the tests have been criticized for being ineffective. If a person is not clearly over 18, they are registered as a child.

    In the last year, several Swedish municipalities have reported suspected cases of adults being placed together with children at residential care homes for young people (known as HVB homes), as well as being sent to school with minors.

    According to the migration board, there are doubts about the accurate age of 70 percent of unaccompanied minors who have stated that they are between 15 and 17 years old.

    As a solution, the Swedish government asked for medical age assessments to be carried out on a large scale. Rättsmedicinalverket detailed at a media conference on Friday when that work will get under way and explained how it can be done.

    Between 15,000 and 18,000 age assessments will now be needed, the agency said. The two methods that will be used are dental maturity assessments involving wisdom teeth, and the examination of knee joints using MRI. The two examinations will be performed independently by MRI clinics and dental clinics.

    "Medical age assessments are an integral part of forensic medicine in many other countries, so it is only natural that we carry them out," Rättsmedicinalverket methodology manager Elias Palm commented.

    The agency expects to reach an agreement to outsource the assessments by December this year, with the goal of starting the tests during the first quarter of 2017.

    Earlier this week a Swedish pediatrician sparked debate when he criticized the current tests authorities use to verify the real age of asylum applicants, claiming some could even be as old as 40.

    "The refugee children who are in their early and mid-teens are the ones who end up paying the price for this. These are resources that have been earmarked for children, but are used for another age group," Josef Milerad told newspaper Expressen.

    Emphasis mine - the authorities thought 70% of them were lying. And there's still some debate as to whether the age tests are catching enough of them.

    I'm sure you'll find people in Sweden saying that there's no problem and anyone who says there is is a racist. It is Sweden after all.

    --
    echo -e 'global _start\n _start:\n mov eax, 2\n int 80h\n jmp _start' > a.asm; nasm a.asm -f elf; ld a.o -o a;
  27. Re:Smells like a political coverup by david_thornley · · Score: 2

    Your writing is no more coherent than what I can glean of your thoughts.

    There will be criminals in any large group. There are Muslims who will rape and murder. There are Christians who will rape and murder. There are Buddhists who will rape and murder. The idea is to make sure they get caught, and apparently the guy got caught and the prosecutors have evidence against him. The system is working.

    Age can't be determined just from teeth. There's no obvious natural aging process. Once the adult teeth are in, what we can find is damage from various causes, not aging.

    --
    "When you have eliminated the unacceptable, whatever is left, however improbable, must be the truthiness" - Holmes
  28. Re:What is this story doing on Slashdot? by pots · · Score: 2

    It's a story about gadgets gathering data their owners without their knowledge. It's a perfectly appropriate topic for Slashdot.

  29. Re:Smells like a political coverup by david_thornley · · Score: 1

    The extreme right doesn't need admissions. The extreme right doesn't need facts. (The same appears to be true of the extreme left, but for a change nobody here's complaining about them.)

    --
    "When you have eliminated the unacceptable, whatever is left, however improbable, must be the truthiness" - Holmes
  30. Re:Smells like a political coverup by AHuxley · · Score: 2

    Bones of their wrist works well too in any advanced nation. A persons age should be not be a mystery to law enforcement.

    --
    Domestic spying is now "Benign Information Gathering"
  31. Re:What is this story doing on Slashdot? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Maybe one day, when there aren't as many asshats on the internet.

    The intenet had asshats way back when it was impossible to explain to your mom what the internet was and most things were text based. I've had access to the internet for almost 30 years, and it had asshats even then. I'm betting before the 50th post on usenet someone was an asshat.

    There will always be asshats on the internet, it's kind of an in-built feature.

    See, in case you haven't noticed, in large enough sample sizes, humans are asshats. The internet makes people act even more like asshats.

    Hell, the original name was going to be the interasshats, but marketing but the whammy on that.

    Now we just have asshats, and people who like to say asshats.

  32. Re:What is this story doing on Slashdot? by DCFusor · · Score: 1

    All true, but then we either outnumbered or intimidated the asshats far better than now. Trying to mod slashdot is like trying to empty the ocean with a thimble.

    --
    Why guess when you can know? Measure!
  33. Top Tip! by TechyImmigrant · · Score: 1

    If you are murdering someone, don't bring your phone or smart watch with you.

    --
    I should use this sig to advertise my book ISBN-13 : 978-1501515132.
  34. Re:Smells like a political coverup by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

    First I do not agree with guruevi, however:

    Using the wording "the ruling government" to make it appear mysteriously evil is a failure.

    In this case it could be somewhat appropriate to distinguish it from the currently elected government. The election was months ago and the elected parties still haven't formed a new government. So the old government is still ruling.

    Personally I hoped they would fail to form a government and rerun the election. Instead it looks like the SPD may fail to uphold his promise of no great coalition and once again form a government with the CDU. In related news santa claus, the easter bunny and a honest politician walk into a bar ...

  35. Re:Smells like a political coverup by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Block the shithole countries

  36. Re:Smells like a political coverup by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    What group does "the ruling government", whatever that might mean, say "doesn't exist"?

    Be specific. Otherwise you're not even blowing smoke, you're just farting into the discourse.

  37. Re:Smells like a political coverup by guruevi · · Score: 2, Informative

    Learn some German politics. The current government is no longer elected, it's a leftover because Merkel has "failed" to create a new government knowing that her term is at an end.

    This government (Merkel and party) has indeed said and ran on the platform against the groups saying "many illegals are criminals claiming to be minors, raping and killing" is overblown rhethoric and no such persons exist.

    --
    Custom electronics and digital signage for your business: www.evcircuits.com
  38. Re:Smells like a political coverup by guruevi · · Score: 1

    I'm not saying there are no criminals in any group. Merkel ran on the platform that "criminal adults claiming to be minors" is not a thing, there is clear evidence that governments and media have been covering up these stories. Look up the Cologne new year attacks.

    --
    Custom electronics and digital signage for your business: www.evcircuits.com
  39. Re:Smells like a political coverup by angel'o'sphere · · Score: 1

    If you have evidence that there is something covered up, point it out.
    Otherwise you are just showing us that you believe in conspiracy theories.

    --
    Cost free eBook I read (by iBook/Kobo/Amazon/ObookO/Gutenberg etc.): "The Green Odyssey" by Philip Jose Farmer.
  40. Just one more reason to ignore Apple's Health App by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Not using it, no plans to use it and why would anyone want such data stored in cloud? Oh, yes! Health insurance companies would pay dearly for such info.

  41. Re:Smells like a political coverup by angel'o'sphere · · Score: 1

    In middle east countries new born often get their birth certificate up to half a year after birth.
    With an adjusted date. That means if one is born in January, the birth certificate and later the passport will show May or June.
    If they throw away the passport and claim to be 17, that still might be what they think as old they are, but in fact they are up to half a year older.
    The rational behind it is that they avoid counting child death in the first month. But for many children it later is disturbing, because the family wants to celebrate the real birthday, but officials e.g. schools etc. the fake birthday. For females it is even worth, as they are often made even younger. E.g. born June 1977 gets shifted to March 1978, so they look on paper nearly one year younger than they are.

    --
    Cost free eBook I read (by iBook/Kobo/Amazon/ObookO/Gutenberg etc.): "The Green Odyssey" by Philip Jose Farmer.
  42. This is fucking terrifying... by Nabeel_co · · Score: 0

    Because this data is VERY flawed. GPS has been shown to exaggerate travel distance by as much as 20% on average.

    And GPS is super precise by comparison, but relying on cell tower and gyro/accelerometer data?!

    Anyone who's tried to correlate this data with any real world measurements knows that the data is about as accurate as throwing darts blindfolded.

    I hope this guys lawyer moves to get that evidence thrown out of court.

    It definately doesn't belong there.

    1. Re:This is fucking terrifying... by Baron_Yam · · Score: 2

      > GPS has been shown to exaggerate travel distance by as much as 20% on average.

      Bullshit. GPS will frequently report ridiculous velocities as an inaccurate fix can jump from one side to the other of its approximate location. The further you go (and the longer it takes you), the more accurate the average becomes.

      Not only that, but generally the GPS string contains information on the fix quality so you can allow for what uncertainty exists.

      If your GPS isn't accurate to within 4m on average, you're not under open sky, you're being spoofed, or there is something wrong with your receiver.

      >relying on cell tower and gyro/accelerometer data?!

      Cell tower fixes can have accuracy measured in kilometers so absolutely, a cell tower fix is not a location at all, it's a region. However, the accuracy of the device accelerometer will be measurable, and you should certainly have different patterns for sitting, walking, running, and moving in a vehicle. You should also see differences for inclines, stairs, and flat surfaces.

      So long as the data is properly analyzed and interpreted by an expert, and is used as corroborative evidence and not primary evidence, I see no insurmountable issue with it being used in a courtroom.

    2. Re:This is fucking terrifying... by Nabeel_co · · Score: 1

      >" Bullshit. GPS will frequently report ridiculous velocities as an inaccurate fix can jump from one side to the other of its approximate location. The further you go (and the longer it takes you), the more accurate the average becomes.

      Not only that, but generally the GPS string contains information on the fix quality so you can allow for what uncertainty exists."

      That is not true. GPS does not give you velocity, it is extrapolated by the delta in two or more data points over time.

      As you said, best case scenario, each data point will have 4m accuracy vertically, horizontally it's closer to 10m. When you account for steeper grades at lower speeds, your accuracy can be way off. If your velocity increases, the delta between the data points are greater, therefor the effects of jitter are less noticable.

      All this, add in that those individual data points don't get stored, and usually an average get's stored, you quickly realize that in a best real world case GPS on a phone really can get you down to the level of a city block, that's about it.

      Don't beleive me? Take your phone out for a walk, with an app that allows you to export all the GPS data points to a gpx file, and import them to google earth, then, trace the path you actually walked in google earth.

      You'll see the GPS path will show multiple changes on all three axis by quite a wide margine.

      Now think: People don't hold their phones in the optimal location for GPS. So this will further degrade the data integrity.

      Now, I don't know about you, but I've been within a city block of a crime before that I had no involvement in or knowledge of, yet without a doubt, GPS could have places me at the scene of the crime.

      But here's the thing, GPS is line of sight, which means likely the location data was based off cell towers.

      As you said, the accuracy of this data is measured in kilometres. We've now gone from a city block to 6-10 city blocks along two axis. A single circular KM is a lot of space.

      Now moving to accelerometer data, It's meaningless, there is no way to conclusively tell what the person was doing, guess maybe, but prove beyond a reasnoble doubt? No way.

      But here's the most daming part of this info, the motion API in iPhones.

      What these apps get is an "activity" status, and a "confidence" status. Not raw data.

      Location is also garnered via guesses using things like SSID names in surrounding areas correlated with historic GPS data, a method that has to be used since most of the time, the phone is in a pocket and can't get a GPS signal at all.

      That kind of data should not be enough to garner a conviction, or even be admissible, it's so horribly flawed.

      I suggest you look at the raw data coming out of your phone. It really isn't very accurate at all.

  43. Re:Smells like a political coverup by lucm · · Score: 1, Insightful

    what it does say is in those cases where the Swedish authorities suspected the person’s age was not in fact under 18, it turns out their suspicions were correct.
    The authorities were doing their job, in other words.

    So the authorities were correct about the ones they investigated. Big round of applause for avoiding false positives. Now that we got that out of the way, maybe someone could take care of the busloads of rapists and murderers that Europe has welcomed and subsidized? Or is the world too busy getting their panties in a bunch over the Trump administration trying to avoid importing the same problem in America?

    --
    lucm, indeed.
  44. Re:Smells like a political coverup by lucm · · Score: 5, Informative

    Anyone who has tried to discuss this issue has been shamed and mocked.

    What we're currently experiencing is the buildup of another Rotherham.

    From the late 1980s until the 2010s, organised child sexual abuse continued almost unchallenged by legal authorities in the northern English town of Rotherham, South Yorkshire.
    [...]
    From January 2011 Andrew Norfolk of The Times pressed the issue, reporting in 2012 that the abuse in the town was widespread, and that the police and council had known about it for over ten years.
    [...]
    In August 2014 the Jay report concluded that an estimated 1,400 children, most of them white girls aged 11–16, but also british asian girls whose abuse mirrored the other victims, had been sexually abused in Rotherham between 1997 and 2013 by predominantly British-Pakistani men. A "common thread" was that taxi drivers had been picking the children up for sex from care homes and schools. The abuse included gang rape, forcing children to watch rape, dousing them with petrol and threatening to set them on fire, threatening to rape their mothers and younger sisters, and trafficking them to other towns.
    [...]
    The failure to address the abuse was attributed to a combination of factors revolving around race, class and gender—contemptuous and sexist attitudes toward the mostly working-class victims; fear that the perpetrators' ethnicity would trigger allegations of racism and damage community relations; the Labour council's reluctance to challenge a Labour-voting ethnic minority

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/...

    So go on, join the polite fiction. And when all this shit gets uncovered, after enough people have been raped, robbed and murdered, you can then join the chorus of offended people who don't understand how the authorities let that happen again.

    --
    lucm, indeed.
  45. Re:Smells like a political coverup by Pinky's+Brain · · Score: 1

    The truth doesn't matter when preaching to the choir, but all sides like to have some selective truth for propagandizing to the normies.

  46. Re:What is this story doing on Slashdot? by lucm · · Score: 1

    we either outnumbered or intimidated the asshats far better than now

    That's because back then they couldn't use #stopbullying to raise awareness about it

    --
    lucm, indeed.
  47. Re:What is this story doing on Slashdot? by Trailer+Trash · · Score: 2

    You are only feeding the alt-Right trolls with respect to Germany's empathy towards refugees.

    Yeah, because facts have a political bias.

    Geeze.

  48. Re:Smells like a political coverup by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Lol! The excuse factory is working overtime, apparently.

    Have you seen any pics of these guys who show up in the news for criminal reasons and it claims they are "children"? These guys have full beards and could always pass for 30. No way in hell they are children. Not even close. Your 1.5 year discrepancy doesn't explain that.

  49. Re:What is this story doing on Slashdot? by AmiMoJo · · Score: 3, Interesting

    It's being discussed at length on /r/The_Donald and /r/MetaCanada and /r/European and all the other usual places.

    Sorry, your Reddit censorship narrative is demonstrably wrong.

    --
    const int one = 65536; (Silvermoon, Texture.cs)
    SJW, n: "Someone I don't like, and by the way I'm a fuckwit" - AC
  50. Re:Smells like a political coverup by guruevi · · Score: 1

    As I said: Look up the Cologne new year attacks. Even ZDF eventually covered it after enough outrage.

    --
    Custom electronics and digital signage for your business: www.evcircuits.com
  51. Re:Smells like a political coverup by AmiMoJo · · Score: 0

    70% of people claiming to be between 15 and 17 years old. That's very different from "most of the child refugees", as originally claimed.

    So we have 70% checked, if which 70% were thought to be 18 or older. 49%, not "most". And of that 49% some unknown proportion simply aged between claiming asylum and being tested.

    There is no way to spin these numbers to make the original claim correct.

    --
    const int one = 65536; (Silvermoon, Texture.cs)
    SJW, n: "Someone I don't like, and by the way I'm a fuckwit" - AC
  52. Re:What is this story doing on Slashdot? by AmiMoJo · · Score: 0

    Specifically who is suppressing specifically what facts?

    --
    const int one = 65536; (Silvermoon, Texture.cs)
    SJW, n: "Someone I don't like, and by the way I'm a fuckwit" - AC
  53. DON'T... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Don't carry your when committing murder!
    Don't commit murder!
    Hire someone else to commit the murder!
    Don't use your phone to hire the someone else to commit the murder!!

    1. Re:DON'T... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      First of Anonymous Cowards

      Don't forget to check your comment post before you submit in case you forget 'phone' on the first line!

  54. Re:Smells like a political coverup by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    You are indeed correct. But what you may not know is it's actually possible to point out a fact and correct someone without succumbing to the overwhelming urge to interject your Trumpian political views and snarks.

    Engineers and scientists do it all the time. Discuss factual stuff while keeping the rage-meter dialed off.

    So protip: Shut off your daily dose of Fox News and try objectivity for a change...it's pretty refreshing. Just a thought.

  55. Let them replace a bank CEO for a day by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    If they are successful they are probably psychopats and should be denied entry.

  56. Re:Smells like a political coverup by Knuckles · · Score: 3, Informative

    Learn some German politics. The current government is no longer elected, it's a leftover because Merkel has "failed" to create a new government knowing that her term is at an end.

    This government (Merkel and party) has indeed said and ran on the platform against the groups saying "many illegals are criminals claiming to be minors, raping and killing" is overblown rhethoric and no such persons exist.

    I live in Germany. OK, I misunderstood your "ruling government" comment, sorry for this. In this sense, it is indeed the ruling government. However, it is still a lie that anyone said that no such persons exist.

    --
    "When I first heard Daydream Nation it quite frankly scared the living shit out of me." -- Matthew Stearns
  57. Re:Smells like a political coverup by Knuckles · · Score: 1

    First I do not agree with guruevi, however:

    Using the wording "the ruling government" to make it appear mysteriously evil is a failure.

    In this case it could be somewhat appropriate to distinguish it from the currently elected government. The election was months ago and the elected parties still haven't formed a new government. So the old government is still ruling.

    Personally I hoped they would fail to form a government and rerun the election. Instead it looks like the SPD may fail to uphold his promise of no great coalition and once again form a government with the CDU. In related news santa claus, the easter bunny and a honest politician walk into a bar ...

    I misunderstood the "ruling government" comment due to its context in the post, thanks for pointing it out

    --
    "When I first heard Daydream Nation it quite frankly scared the living shit out of me." -- Matthew Stearns
  58. Re: Smells like a political coverup by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Governments aren't elected. Members of parliament are. There is never an elected government.

  59. panoptic by Reverend+Green · · Score: 1

    Apple, now with iSnitch technology:

    It sees you when you're sleeping
    It knows when you're awake
    It knows if you've been bad or good
    So be good for goodness sake!

  60. Re: Smells like a political coverup by Reverend+Green · · Score: 1, Informative

    Trump stole my garden gnome.

  61. cool feature by apple health by coracle_india · · Score: 1

    cool feature by apple health. the murderer got his punishment. for more cool features of iPhones, visit here ==> http://www.coracle.in/

  62. Fucking Muslim "refugee" rapists strike again by Chrisq · · Score: 0

    Fucking Muslim "refugee" rapists strike again. Really we should follow Australia's example and keep these savages on an island until they can be sent back.

    1. Re:Fucking Muslim "refugee" rapists strike again by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Of course rape didn't exist in Germany until 2015

    2. Re:Fucking Muslim "refugee" rapists strike again by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      It wasn't at such a level that they would have to start women only carriages, water parks, and new year's parties. I know it's all nice and PC to pretend that Islam is the religion of peace and all religions and cultures are as good, but it just isn't true

  63. Re:Smells like a political coverup by Ihlosi · · Score: 1
    Age can be determined by teeth.

    Yes, yes. There are other ways. But none of them can be performed without either consent by or use of force on the person in question.

    So it goes like this.

    "I'm fourteen."

    "We doubt that, so we are going to perform procedure X on you to determine your age."

    "I don't consent to that!"

    "Then we will force you to comply with the procedure."

    "You can't! That's illegal! I am underage! You're a bunch of child-brutalizers!"

    "Then we'll deport you!"

    "You can't! I'm underage and in need of protection, you cruel scum!"

    "Ok, fine, you're fourteen. Go ahead."

  64. Re:Smells like a political coverup by Hal_Porter · · Score: 1

    You are indeed correct. But what you may not know is it's actually possible to point out a fact and correct someone without succumbing to the overwhelming urge to interject your Trumpian political views and snarks.

    Reality has a well known Trumpian bias

    --
    echo -e 'global _start\n _start:\n mov eax, 2\n int 80h\n jmp _start' > a.asm; nasm a.asm -f elf; ld a.o -o a;
  65. Afghan refugee's iPhone by eugend · · Score: 1

    Enough said

  66. Re:Smells like a political coverup by Hal_Porter · · Score: 1

    https://foreignpolicy.com/2016...

    After arriving at Central Station in the southern Swedish city of Malmö, the boys made their way to the Migration Agency registration office, where the agency assigned them to one of the 34 refugee residences here. In the youth residences, Afghan males dominate: another on-the-ground expression of a geopolitical reality. Because Sweden grants permanent residency to all Syrians, Syrian men don't need to pretend to be boys, and only 3,777 of the unaccompanied minors arriving in Sweden last year came from the ravaged country. But with no such blanket asylum in place for Afghans, they - and a likewise disproportionate number of Somalis and Eritreans - often appear to claim asylum as unaccompanied minors. Recent figures provided by the Migration Agency show that more than half of the 41,564 Afghans who arrived in Sweden in 2015 claimed as unaccompanied minors.

    I.e. it's pretty obvious a lot of people are lying about their age to get asylum.

    --
    echo -e 'global _start\n _start:\n mov eax, 2\n int 80h\n jmp _start' > a.asm; nasm a.asm -f elf; ld a.o -o a;
  67. There will be millions more rapes and murders... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    ... once the muslims reach critical mass.
    But all the Left wing, limp wristed, latte-sipping tossers on here will no doubt leap to the defence of monsters like this - which clearly shows you are INSANE.

    Good luck surviving when the civil war breaks out - all you Left wing scum are going to be the first to be killed - because BOTH sides (muslims AND non-muslims - that means all white people) are going to be trying to kill you, because YOU caused it to happen in the first place.

  68. Re:Smells like a political coverup by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

    Sweden isn't going to be Sweden for much longer - millions are going to be killed in the coming civil war, which is what muslims cause in EVERY country they infest.

  69. Re:Smells like a political coverup by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

    My favorite part of the Rotherham story is the one where the police took an underage rape victim back to her rapist and forced her to apologize for accusing him of rape.

    The stories those victims have to tell are horrifying. All of those government officials that knew should have been executed. You can say anything you want about "civilized countries", but those are people that are too dangerous to allow to live in a civilized society.

  70. Re:Smells like a political coverup by Hal_Porter · · Score: 0

    Yup. Who knew civilisation would collapse because fat, blue haired genderqueer womxn decided to open the city gates to the barbarians.

    --
    echo -e 'global _start\n _start:\n mov eax, 2\n int 80h\n jmp _start' > a.asm; nasm a.asm -f elf; ld a.o -o a;
  71. Re:Smells like a political coverup by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    This is why there are 25 year old men sitting in school classes next to 14 year old girls, thank your Left wing idiotic countrymen for this hellish state of affairs. EVERY 14 year old knows who is 14 and who is 18, even 16, THEY KNOW, and yet we have this insane situation, thanks to the Bolsheviks.

    There is going to be hell to pay for all the Left wing cretins who have forced this misery onto us... just you wait...

  72. Re: Smells like a political coverup by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    > ... Trump stole my garden gnome ...

    You are lucky

    Trump raped my garden gnome

  73. Re:Smells like a political coverup by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    It's almost as if they REALLY want to avoid being sent back to a country where they'll be killed or end up with an AK in their hand, then get killed. They must be crazy! Sounds like fun... maybe we should go there.

  74. Gotta love Apple by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Good for them for collecting the data.

    But I guess they love crime except when it's directed at them.

    Oh well.

  75. Re:Smells like a political coverup by mjwx · · Score: 0

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/...

    So go on, join the polite fiction. And when all this shit gets uncovered, after enough people have been raped, robbed and murdered, you can then join the chorus of offended people who don't understand how the authorities let that happen again.

    Because white people have never committed organised peadophelia and covered it up. No-siree, it's only those evil brown people.

    Indeed, here is a case from Australia, the UK and Ireland that had no white catholic priests in it what so ever

    To echo the long buried GGP... its not about race or religion. I can find cases of child rape from any culture. Being a part of any ethnic or religious group does not make one more predetermined towards it. The overwhelming majority of Muslims will be reviled by the thought of child rape... as will Christians, Buddhists, Atheists, LeVeyan Satanists or whomever else you care to mention.

    Hey, but try to point that out and you'll be censored by the Daily Mail readers who need to believe that anything not white and christian is wrong.

    --
    Calling someone a "hater" only means you can not rationally rebut their argument.
  76. Re:What is this story doing on Slashdot? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    That the races are in aggregate equal in terms of intelligence, emotional goodwill, and levels of psycopathy.

    Hint: The average African would be considered "very retarded" if they were to be moved to America. The average African IQ south of Egypt is around 62. That means 1/2 are even dumber (very retarded by American standards).

  77. Re:What is this story doing on Slashdot? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Um the commentors up above who said this should not be on slashdot cause it will inflame the comment section?

    Comeon Ami, keep up here.

  78. Re:Smells like a political coverup by Hal_Porter · · Score: 2

    Sweden can't afford to let the entire population of Afghanistan, Somalia and Eritrea in. Their population is only about 10 million. And most of the increase in the last 20 years is due to immigration.

    If Sweden has a majority of people coming from countries where you get 'killed or end up with an AK in their hand', isn't Sweden going to be like that too? Not to mention that no is going to give the original Swedes asylum and a load of benefits to leave like Sweden did for the third worlders. They'll be stuck there.

    --
    echo -e 'global _start\n _start:\n mov eax, 2\n int 80h\n jmp _start' > a.asm; nasm a.asm -f elf; ld a.o -o a;
  79. Re:Smells like a political coverup by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    without ... snarks.

    Shut off your daily dose of Fox News

    Well...done?

  80. Re:Smells like a political coverup by david_thornley · · Score: 1

    I'm continually amazed at the right-wing idiots who say there's no evidence for Russian involvement, posting from their shithole homes.

    --
    "When you have eliminated the unacceptable, whatever is left, however improbable, must be the truthiness" - Holmes
  81. Re:What is this story doing on Slashdot? by Archangel+Michael · · Score: 1

    Here is a fact for you to research ...

    Which group (because Black Lives Matters) has proportionally higher murder rate, white males vs black males.

    The fact is, the murder rate among blacks is higher than whites. That is an inconvenient fact. There are lots and lots of potential conclusions one could make on that fact, based on other facts (or lack of other facts). But our society doesn't mention this fact, because it appears "racist" using it at face value. White Supremacists use this fact as "proof" that blacks are inferior to whites. The fact is correct, their conclusion is wrong. Therefore we don't mention the fact (conspiracy to hide facts) and the White Supremacists use that to bolster their argument.

    The real answer is to not hide this inconvenient fact, but use it for a broader discussion (more speech, less self censorship) about root causes. It is inconvenient only

    --
    Agent K: A *person* is smart. People are dumb, stupid, panicky animals, and you know it.
  82. WHEEEW! by martinfb · · Score: 1

    Sure am glad that I wasn't climbing stairs at that same time!
    I might also be accused of this murder!

    --


    Self-importance and self-indulgence is the root of ALL evil.
  83. Re:What is this story doing on Slashdot? by Archangel+Michael · · Score: 1

    I'm going to revise one part of my comment.

    This applies only to Americans, and doesn't apply to any other country. But since we have a fairly high murder rate among blacks, and the corresponding racist white supremacists. It is only for discussion purposes and to give an example answer the question as asked. There are other facts that do apply and should be part of broader discussion.

    My personal view is that skin color doesn't indicate propensity to commit murder at all, but rather it is cultural (which isn't racial). Change the culture, and the rates of murder will change as well. People mistake culture for race all the time.

    --
    Agent K: A *person* is smart. People are dumb, stupid, panicky animals, and you know it.
  84. Librem 5 (open source phone) by erapert · · Score: 1
  85. Re:What is this story doing on Slashdot? by AmiMoJo · · Score: 1

    You say "society" doesn't mention this fact, but I see it mentioned all the time. Slashdot, Twitter, mainstream news, blogs, TV... I think it's a very well known statistic, and often forms the basis of arguments.

    In fact, BLM seems to have acknowledged it and moved on to the arguments over why it's that way literally years ago.

    --
    const int one = 65536; (Silvermoon, Texture.cs)
    SJW, n: "Someone I don't like, and by the way I'm a fuckwit" - AC
  86. Re:What is this story doing on Slashdot? by Archangel+Michael · · Score: 1

    http://heyjackass.com/

    It is cultural. Not race related. Yet we can't address it because just mentioning it triggers the kneejerk reaction .... "RACISM!!!!!!", "NAZI!!!!" , "KKK!!!!!"

    When the culture creates the spaces of honor for Gangster imagery to be promoted, then you get what you see here.

    Let me know when the NYT or MSNBC run week long expose on the ghetto / gang culture that perpetuates the high murder rate. Oh right, they can't because that wouldn't fit the "White Hetero Cis Gendered Males are the problem" narrative.

    --
    Agent K: A *person* is smart. People are dumb, stupid, panicky animals, and you know it.
  87. Re:Smells like a political coverup by guruevi · · Score: 1

    Legally speaking, the government has the right to establish age if there is reasonable doubt, even in Europe. The above exchange is obviously from an American perspective.

    Within Europe, this is pretty much the exchange:
    - "You're under arr..."
    - "That's racist, I know where you home is"
    - "Okay, carry-on"
    5 more Islam gang members come on the scene
    Police: "Let's get out of here, we have guns but we can't shoot unless someone shoots at us and kills someone"
    *bang* *bang*
    "He's not dead yet, we can't shoot back"
    *bang* *bang*

    --
    Custom electronics and digital signage for your business: www.evcircuits.com
  88. Not so reliable data collection. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    The Apple health app records me as taking stairs sometimes, just walking around my house. Itâ(TM)s a single floor. Using unreliable technology to determine this is wrong.

  89. Re:Smells like a political coverup by lucm · · Score: 1

    I'm continually amazed at the right-wing idiots who say there's no evidence for Russian involvement, posting from their shithole homes.

    I'm continually amazed at the even bigger idiots who keep saying that there is evidence but never provide any.

    --
    lucm, indeed.
  90. Re:Smells like a political coverup by lucm · · Score: 1

    Because white people have never committed organised peadophelia and covered it up. No-siree, it's only those evil brown people.

    Thank you for stepping forward to let everyone see how self-righteous cunts who let things like Rotherham happen justify their behavior.

    --
    lucm, indeed.
  91. Re:What is this story doing on Slashdot? by AmiMoJo · · Score: 1

    The fact that this website even exists is more evidence that your claim that its taboo is bollocks. We clearly can talk about it, we are talking about it now, and the only person screaming "racism" and "nazi" is you.

    --
    const int one = 65536; (Silvermoon, Texture.cs)
    SJW, n: "Someone I don't like, and by the way I'm a fuckwit" - AC
  92. Re: Smells like a political coverup by Plumpaquatsch · · Score: 1

    Trump is your garden gnome.

    FTFY

    --
    Of course news about a fake are Fake News.
  93. Re:What is this story doing on Slashdot? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    The fact that this website even exists is more evidence that your claim that its taboo is bollocks.

    No it doesn't. The claim was that certain facts are suppressed. "Suppressed" doesn't need to mean the facts is completely inaccessible everywhere, so that website simply existing doesn't invalidate the claim.

    That you won't accept his claim unless it's passed your high bar... is ironically the same logic as the alt-right.

    Alt-right on wage gap: "where's the law that says women must be paid 77 cents to the dollar? No such law exist and no company has such a policy! Therefore claims of wage gap being a problem is bollocks! It's jut all personal choices blah blah!"

    Alt-right on racism: "where's the law that says whites get privilege over others? There is none! Therefore racism is not a problem stop talking about it!"

    We clearly can talk about it, we are talking about it now

    See above. Using your standard, some crazy alt-right spreading fake news is also "talking about" the issue.

    the only person screaming "racism" and "nazi" is you.

    In other words, he's the only one who actually cares to fight racism and nazism, which helps EVERYONE, whereas you are more concerned with virtue signaling and making yourself feel good.

  94. Re:Smells like a political coverup by Plumpaquatsch · · Score: 1

    what it does say is in those cases where the Swedish authorities suspected the person’s age was not in fact under 18, it turns out their suspicions were correct. The authorities were doing their job, in other words.

    So the authorities were correct about the ones they investigated. Big round of applause for avoiding false positives.

    Have they checked your age already? Looking at your reading comprehension, you can't be older than 13. Because > 13.7% false positives is certainly not avoiding them. And that's before going into that's before even looking at the numbers of people they suspected to be older than 18 because they claimed to be adults back when first applying for asylum but turned out to be younger than 18 (even years later).

    --
    Of course news about a fake are Fake News.
  95. Re:Smells like a political coverup by Plumpaquatsch · · Score: 1

    I'm not saying there are no criminals in any group. Merkel ran on the platform that "criminal adults claiming to be minors" is not a thing, there is clear evidence that governments and media have been covering up these stories. Look up the Cologne new year attacks.

    They must also have hidden the "fact" that "Merkel ran on the platform that "criminal adults claiming to be minors" is not a thing".

    --
    Of course news about a fake are Fake News.
  96. Re:What is this story doing on Slashdot? by Plumpaquatsch · · Score: 1

    Hint: The average African would be considered "very retarded" if they were to be moved to America. The average African IQ south of Egypt is around 62. That means 1/2 are even dumber (very retarded by American standards).

    Fun fact: the study these numbers are from have based IQ stats for whole countries where they had no IQ test results available on the numbers from neighboring countries - where they had about a dozen results. IOW anyone quoting those numbers has a negative IQ.

    --
    Of course news about a fake are Fake News.
  97. Yawn, again by lucm · · Score: 1

    First you say this, trying to be clever:

    Looking at your reading comprehension, you can't be older than 13.

    But then you write this kind of nonsense:

    And that's before going into that's before even looking at the numbers of people

    Next time you want to be a cunt, read your own masterpieceofshit before posting.

    --
    lucm, indeed.
    1. Re:Yawn, again by Plumpaquatsch · · Score: 1

      First you say this, trying to be clever:

      Looking at your reading comprehension, you can't be older than 13.

      But then you write this kind of nonsense:

      And that's before going into that's before even looking at the numbers of people

      Next time you want to be a cunt, read your own masterpieceofshit before posting.

      So? I'm still older than you - not to mention smarter than you will ever be. Because you have terminal stupidity aka Naziism.

      --
      Of course news about a fake are Fake News.