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Alibaba Co-founder Says Many Americans 'Want To Stop China' From Upgrading Its Tech (cnbc.com)

With the threat of Trump's ever-looming trade war with China and his administration's sanctions on Chinese companies like ZTE, it's hard to remember a more contentious period between the two countries in recent times. Adding fuel to the conversation, an Alibaba co-founder alleged that many Americans want to stop China from upgrading its technology and from becoming more innovative. From a report: Chinese media outlets have repeatedly asserted that American complaints about the tech sector are really just efforts to slow the country's rise as a global power. "There's nothing wrong with a country wanting to upgrade its own manufacturing sector, go higher tech, be more innovative," Tsai said. "But then, from the Chinese perspective, what we're seeing is there are a lot of people in America that want to stop China from doing that." After three decades of producing low-end manufacturing goods, Tsai said, China recognizes the need to develop better technology, upgrade its manufacturing sector and focus more on value-added areas like robotics, aeronautics and high-tech medical equipment.

11 of 213 comments (clear)

  1. or... by GoTeam · · Score: 5, Interesting

    American companies prefer to not have their IP stolen by foreign companies. Also, don't start with something as silly and foolish as: "it's hard to remember a more contentious period between the two countries in recent times". Really? Is it that hard to remember more contentious countries? Let me get you started: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/...

  2. Contentiousness by JBMcB · · Score: 4, Insightful

    it's hard to remember a more contentious period between the two countries in recent times.

    Well, Saudi Arabia is bombing the crap out of Yemen. Russia has been covertly sending troops into Ukraine. Israel and Iran are almost at war.

    So yeah, one country increasing tariffs on another is probably the most contentious thing going on right now.

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    My Other Computer Is A Data General Nova III.
  3. Re:Well, we sure as hell can't innovate ourselves! by ranton · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Well, we sure as hell can't innovate ourselves! So our only recourse is to try to stop other countries from innovating! No way can we allow someone a chance at bettering themselves if we're not able to steal the betterment for our own use.

    Regardless of the many problems the US has, not being able to innovate certainly isn't one of them. China is playing catch up in innovation, and who do you think they are trying to catch up to? The US is having a hard time dealing with not being the only game in town, but it is still top dog. Possibly not for long but it certainly still is today.

    While there is certainly a significant portion of Americans who simply want China to fail, most of us just don't want China to steal. Even that is a bit misguided though since every developing nation (including the early US) steals while catching up. Americans fundamentally have to realize we cannot rest on our laurels. The lead we have right now will diminish and then evaporate and we will need to compete on a level playing field. That is already true with many developed countries, and it will soon be true with China.

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    -- All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing. -- Edmund Burke
  4. Maturity curve [Re:or...] by Tablizer · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Basically he's denying China cheats like the wind. To be fair, when USA industry was young, we played intellectual property games with Europe also.

    But when you become a trading super-power, your scrappy "street-smarts" 3rd-world tendencies need to be corrected or you will face retaliation. You can no longer fly under the radar. China has yet to kick its bad habits.

    1. Re:Maturity curve [Re:or...] by AmiMoJo · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Every country steals tech. The French were notorious for bugging Air France flights and doing state level industrial espionage. A lot of early nuclear tech was stolen by the US from Britain. European and US car-makers "adopted" a lot of Japanese tech to make their vehicles more reliable, after accusing the Japanese of copying them.

      Now China is filing a lot of patents. They are really leading with electric vehicle tech, for example. A lot of European and Japanese manufacturers that missed the boat are turning to them now while their own domestic suppliers try to catch up.

      This is just the way of the world. Everyone steals from everyone else, countries that were developing eventually start leading in some areas. Korea used to be a source of cheap labour, now they are leading manufacturers of memory, displays, batteries, phones, some kinds of software...

      If anything, I much prefer the Chinese attitude towards patents and IP to the American one. They get on and innovate without worrying too much about rounded corners and vague, obscure and never-used patents. And actually the west isn't that different - we just waste more time and money looking for trivial variations to get around patents and IP.

      I worked on a sensor product that three short sampling periods. I asked why not just use one longer sampling period and it turned out it was to get around a patent that covered the complex detection algorithm, and was of no benefit.

      --
      const int one = 65536; (Silvermoon, Texture.cs)
      SJW, n: "Someone I don't like, and by the way I'm a fuckwit" - AC
    2. Re:Maturity curve [Re:or...] by Frobnicator · · Score: 4, Interesting

      There is stealing tech like you described, and stealing tech like China is doing it.

      Industrial espionage is basically the acceptable form of doing it. If you can slip someone into the company, sneak up to the golden goose, and get out, that's a corporate success story. Alternatively if you can hire away their workers, or if you can reverse engineer technology, those are also generally acceptable. The goods are still protected by assorted laws, but if you can sneak some information out that's generally accepted.

      China's form is a mandate that every company doing business turns over the golden goose outright. If you want to do business in China you must turn over the technology, and you must pass along ownership to a mandatory Chinese business partner. Many times the mandated business partner takes the IP and makes their own products from it. They aren't adapting it, nor growing from it, nor trying to integrate it into their own. The law requires corporations give up their secrets, then those secrets are directly used against the corporation.

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      //TODO: Think of witty sig statement
  5. America's push to stop china's dumping/theft/etc by WindBourne · · Score: 4, Interesting

    China continues to require that nearly all companies that operate in CHina to have 51% chinese ownership (though cars are now exempted, though they will still pay high tariffs). Likewise, the companies will be required to turn over IP to Chinese owners.
    And yet, this is America's fault for a western company wanting to keep their IP, while Chinese companies will sue for theft of their IP.
    Yeah, totally makes sense.

    Now, if Trump would just do his GD job or at least keep a few of his promises esp for dealing with CHina.

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    I prefer the "u" in honour as it seems to be missing these days.
  6. Re:"becoming more innovative" by WindBourne · · Score: 4, Insightful

    that is not accurate.
    Yes, China steals a great deal. BUT, that does not mean that CHina's innovation is not up and coming. It is a horrible mistake to claim otherwise.
    Just like Japan and India today, you have many ppl in CHina that are learning and are as innovative as any others.

    --
    I prefer the "u" in honour as it seems to be missing these days.
  7. Re:More likely by cayenne8 · · Score: 4, Insightful
    Not to mention, they Chinese aren't mentioning that their plans to "upgrade their technology" is by way of stealing the tech from all the other major western nations.

    We do the R&D on new ideas, they use espionage (been going on for decades) to steal it and then "upgrade" their systems, to compete back with us.

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    Light travels faster than sound. This is why some people appear bright until you hear them speak.........
  8. Back here on Earth by sjbe · · Score: 4, Informative

    If you mean electric vehicle with EV, then no. america is decades behind Europe.

    What color is the sky on your planet? You certainly aren't basing that claim on any facts (nor did you provide any) so one has to presume you are talking about a different America and a different Europe than the one here on Earth.

    Tesla made a new and better battery and manages to sell a nice set of cars ... but in the vehicle itself is nothing really innovative.+

    Spare me your attempt to seem unimpressed. "Nothing really innovative"? You might have an argument if anyone else was making more innovative vehicles. Nobody has moved the auto industry more towards electrification than Tesla and to claim their cars aren't innovative is preposterous even if you don't like them.

  9. Re:We did it to the Brits by sit1963nz · · Score: 4, Informative

    And during WWII, the USA would only accept payment for weapons and aid in Gold.

    For centuries the "gold standard" and the "British Pound" were the defect standard currencies for trade. Because the UK gold reserves were stripped from them by the USA the pound was conferred no longer to have the backing of the gold held in treasuries, so to get international trade the US$ became the standard because they now had the most gold.