Slashdot Mirror
Diversity At Google Hasn't Changed Much Over the Last Year (cnet.com)
An anonymous reader quotes a report from CNET: Not much changed at Google over the last year when it came to the diversity of the tech giant's workforce. Google released its annual diversity report on Thursday detailing the composition of its workforce. The percentage of female employees rose by .1 percent to 30.9 percent. The percentage of Asian employees grew by 1.6 percent to 36.3 percent. The number of black and Latino employees grew by .1 percent to 2.5 percent and 3.6 percent, respectively.
"Google's workforce data demonstrates that if we want a better outcome, we need to evolve our approach," said Danielle Brown, chief diversity and inclusion officer at Google, in the report. "That's why from now on ownership for diversity and inclusion will be shared between Google's leadership team, People Operations and Googlers. Our strategy doesn't provide all the answers, but we believe it will help us find them."
"Google's workforce data demonstrates that if we want a better outcome, we need to evolve our approach," said Danielle Brown, chief diversity and inclusion officer at Google, in the report. "That's why from now on ownership for diversity and inclusion will be shared between Google's leadership team, People Operations and Googlers. Our strategy doesn't provide all the answers, but we believe it will help us find them."
What's the purpose of this article supposed to be?
"Google's workforce data demonstrates that if we want a better outcome, we need to evolve our approach," said Danielle Brown, chief diversity and inclusion officer at Google
If you had listened to James Damore instead of doing the same illegal things over and over again, you might get a better result.
Is the goal to have a 50% female workforce even though there's almost no chance of that happening in terms of interest in the general population for the foreseeable future so they'll have to resort to lowering standards or upping hires for more diversity officers and other nontech positions basically defeating the supposed reason they're concerned? What happens if they overshoot the goal and men dip under 50%. Are they just going to not care and ignore it like for how women now earn significantly more college degrees and dominate middle bureaucratic management and nobody gives a crap?
Who wants to bet their next paycheck that Google's recruiters have never darkened the door at a career fair at a HBC? Where do they think they're likely to find a huge group of black Computer Science majors who aren't African or Caribbean immigrants outside of that?
Google's not stupid. They know where they could aggressively recruit young black people trying to get engineering degrees, but HBCs are too prole for a company that typically only recruits "from the best." And Google doesn't want proles because they might bring truly shocking perspectives like telling Mr. I Identify as a Dragon that he's a total whack job who needs to stop mixing crystal meth and D&D instead of nodding along. (Working and middle class black people tend to be refreshingly willing to call you on your bullshit compared to the upper class yuppies that dominate places like SV)
62% of the population, but only 53% of Google employees... how would this come about except through strong discrimination in hiring practices?
Hillary you're drunk, go home.
So, which law is it you're saying Trump violated when Greenburg approached Stone to tell him he had information the campaign might want to hear? Is it the same legal territory you might discuss when the DNC/Clinton machine spent money to hire foreign agents to spend time in Russia obtaining phony info from government agents there? Please catch your breath from your shrieking for a moment, and be specific on the statutes involved. No? Don't have that handy to copy/paste like the anonymous troll you are? Didn't think so.
Don't disappoint your bird dog. Go to the range.
I want Google to be as 'diverse' as possible. That's because I'd personally like to see them fail as a business, because in my opinion they aren't good for the Internet, and for the software industry in general. And if there's one guaranteed way to make a company irrelevant, and eventually a total failure, it's to hire based on 'diversity' instead of skill and merit.
None of the top executives at Alphabet are black or hispanic, Larry and Sergei are both white males. For such an important issue, they should be willing to give up their positions to historically disadvantaged people.
Or is this the usual "diversity for thee, but not for me" situation?
I'm pretty sure there was a memo/manifesto on this that received a great deal of attention...
The funniest thing is that despite not being adept at office and internet politics, Damore was actually pretty empathetic. He pointed out that the job description and environment were optimized towards what white men want.
SJWs responded by assuming that the only rational way to interpret it was that women weren't fit for the job, ignoring the possibility that the job wasn't fit for women.
So, it looks like Damore was right and insightful, even if he's already been converted to full Nazi. I don't really blame him in that scenario, given that his views were rejected by SJWs, and embraced by racist and sexist assholes. People are often going to associate with people that don't treat them as shitty as other people do.
This is my signature. There are many like it, but this one is mine.
and islam is asshole cancer.
Because it cannot be done!
There is NO way you cannot tell me those money grubbing hacks @ Google would not hire 100% purple poka-dotted zebras if purple poka-dotted zebras made them more profitable.
The fact is that there are significant cultural differences between demographic segments. And there is NOTHING wrong with that.
But, ultimately it translates into only 2.5% of the black population cuts the mustard at Google. It's not Google's issue, it's black culture as a wholes' issue.
When the percentage of black people or Latina's or females who value schooling and work ethics like oriental people do then you will automatically see a reversal of these numbers.
Governments, corporations, and educational facilities should not be in the business of cultural modification because we all know, assuming we are honest, that family and extended family/friends are the ultimate cultural arbitrator.
Caution: Contents under pressure
Considering the lengths to which they've recently gone to increase skin-level diversity, which includes literally suspending all application processes for lower level positions where the applicant is white or asian, I do have to say that I am somewhat surprised by how little they've been able to move the needle.
Kind of makes you wonder what could have nullified their efforts this heavily. I know they've had some well meaning changes that have made their minority hires feel genuinely uncomfortable, like how the traditional mentoring of new hires has been changed so that your mentor will always be of the same race, but I didn't imagine they'd be able to take as many steps backwards as forwards like this. Either that or then they've knocked some sense into their hiring practices, which should have come with such a big backlash it would be well known to people outside the organization, so I can't image anything could explain this except well meaning policies that have backfired strongly enough to make their diversity hires leave in the same numbers as they're able to shepherd them in.
I guess that's good for them as nobody deserves to work in a place that makes you feel uncomfortable enough to make you want to quit your job. However I am somewhat worried about their remaining staff because if I know these diversity types, a setback will only cause them to double their efforts rather than take a moment to think about what they're actually doing.
"Why should I want to make anything up? Life's bad enough as it is without wanting to invent any more of it."
That's a pretty big change in just one year since it's 4% greater. The article is misleading.
I did a series of interviews at Google in Kirkland, WA (between Seattle and Microsoft) because I had a free place to stay a couple of blocks away for a friend that's out of the country for two years working for Microsoft in Dublin that was looking for a house sitter. I also had two other friends that are also black that did the same. All three of us gave up before the end of the process. Despite being able to get rid of $1,500 a month and live somewhere nice and have a higher paying job, Google's interview process just made it not worth it. My two friends also gave up since both of them ran out of vacation time to take off from their current jobs to keep going back to Google.
The way I feel about the process is that if you screen resumes well, do a good phone screening, then in person interviews with three or four people, then another interview with someone more senior and you still can't make-up your mind then the problem is with your process, not the candidate. It shouldn't take six months of waffling to make a decision.
Yeah, that's the mental gymnastics of having actually read the memo, instead of regurgitating a third-hand report of how someone on Jezebel was offended.
This is my signature. There are many like it, but this one is mine.
You do understand that all (most) these Manafort things they are looking at are from before he was associated with Trump in any way? And more to the point, he was working for the Podesta Group at the time...
Should Trump have done better homework before he hired him? Probably, but that's about all you can put on Trump in any way for that.
You mean religion in general is cancer.
Right, because Christianity and Judaism have been so toxic that cultures that live consistent with Judaeo-Christian norms have failed miserably.
Oh, wait, that didn't happen. Look at Israel and compare it to it's neighbors. The nation that exists, and was created, as a sanctuary for Jews in the world has the ability to produce all the water and food it needs for itself and then some. They produce some of the best technology and are able to fend off attackers which consistently have more numbers and resources but also a religion that leads them to a path of suicide. This suicide is quite literal, they will strap bombs to their bodies and detonate them to "win" a war. While Europe was looking at the stars and plotting the motion of the planets there were cultures in the Americas and Africa that were sacrificing themselves and their children to their gods.
That's not saying that Europeans were entirely peaceful and intellectual, they had plenty of wars based on national borders and their interpretation of how to best worship a god. I will also admit that cultures in Asia prospered without a Judaeo-Christian culture. They still had their own religion and also had incredible advancements in science and technology.
Religion is not cancer. You could argue that people can be peaceful, intellectual, and also without religion. I'd like to see an example of such a culture. Best we see of that is a culture that replaces worship of a god or gods with worship of a leader or of government. Such cultures tend to devolve into shit holes like North Korea. Islam is cancer and we see this play out every day in the news. Many of these Muslim nations exist only because of trade with nations that do not practice Islam. Had they been left to their own devices they'd slowly revert to goat herders as the infrastructure they imported decayed into dust.
Perhaps someday Islam will evolve into a religion that is not bent on suicide. I see hints of this in Saudi Arabia, where they have begun to allow women to get an education and drive a car. A culture that keeps half their population ignorant and sheltered will continually be outdone by cultures that do not. It might also help if they don't strap bombs to their children and blow them up.
I am armed because I am free. I am free because I am armed.
Have you tried reading the post you reply to? The point is that Google has mostly high-stress, high-pay jobs where you are expected to work all of the time. That's a formula for single white dudes, given our current social values
This is my signature. There are many like it, but this one is mine.
Google's feelings of diversity are just like that of California universities:
Multiple skin colors, all 51 genders,* and all 187 sexual orientations.**
* Diversity of opinion is not permitted.
** Cisexual cismales with white skin must choose one of the other 50 genders and/or one of the 186 other sexualities. Your skin color will be decided by your diversity officer fairly using diversity standard skin tone swatches.
Is the goal to have a 50% female workforce even though there's almost no chance of that happening
The goal is probably to have well above average female participation, as a kind of virtue signal.
What no-one seems to think about is that all of these large companies offering very high salary and bonuses for the small pool of potential technical female employees, what does that do for participation in smaller companies?
They simply have no way to complete for female employees, which means that females are inevitably poorly represented in smaller companies. That is really unfortunate because a smaller company is I think a generally nicer work environment for anyone, female or male... you simple have no room for the kind of nonsense that can get by at larger companies because everyone has to be productive and largely professional at a smaller company or they are gone.
If you have any kids just going to college about now you'd have to be insane too have them study anything but computers or some other engineering, they can do really, really well even just on internships over the summer (I have a friend with a daughter who just finished a CS degree and she had companies fighting for her like mad all through school).
She did sadly end up working for one of the large companies in part because of a huge bonus, that's what led me to mention that as a caution as I feel a little bit sad that will be her entry position in the technical world, when I think a smaller company would have suited her better.
"There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
I've seen a number of good people leave Google over the past year. The completely toxic culture that Google created by doubling down on their abusive rhetoric can very-well drive people away.
Any guest worker system is indistinguishable from indentured servitude.
Can you find any raw figures in the Google diversity annual report 2018? "Sometimes it is percentages that are given and raw figures that are missing," warns How to Lie With Statistics , "and this can be deceptive too." And yet the lack of raw figures doesn't keep Google from boasting, "We are further increasing transparency. Google's publication of workforce representation data in 2014 helped shape the current industry conversation on diversity in tech. We aim to take the conversation-and our work to the next level as we further refine our approach, so this year we've published new and more detailed workforce representation data."
I don't think you're missing out on anything, frankly. Google's days as a technology innovator are long gone.
-jcr
The only title of honor that a tyrant can grant is "Enemy of the State."
Merely because the people whose land was stolen are pissed and are fighting to get it back?
Israel, as it exists today, was created in 1947. That's over 70 years go. The people that had this land "stolen" are quite likely all dead. The few that remain, if any, are not likely in fighting form. The people fighting today are the grandchildren and great grandchildren of that generation. How many generations removed can they still call this their land?
I grew up in the USA, as did my parents and grandparents. If I go back far enough I can find ancestors from Germany and other European nations. Does this mean I can go back and claim land there? I don't think so. What point was that right lost? Give me a number of generations. It's not "their land" any more than some piece of Germany is my land.
Also, while 75% (give or take) of people in Israel are Jewish the rest are not. They weren't killed off or relocated out of the country. Those that can behave themselves and not be pissed about a 70 year old gripe will live in peace and prosperity within the borders of Israel. Those that can't will be imprisoned, not killed or forced out.
And you think that shows Religion in a good light?
I think this shows Jews in a good light. Muslims? Not so much.
If Israel really was the bloodthirsty culture you believe it to be then they'd bomb the Gaza Strip until it glowed in the dark. The Gaza Strip is 99.9% Muslim, why is that? Could it be because the Jews and Christians were largely killed or forcefully relocated? All the rockets that go over that border originate from Gaza and land in Israel. Sure, the Israeli Army will defend it's border with lethal force so bullets and grenades do cross from Israel into Gaza. They do this because they know if the border is breached that those that cross will do so with the intent to kill as many Jews as they can. This isn't about land any more, no one fighting this war has ever set foot in Israel before.
Israel is showing considerable restraint and diplomacy. This has not been reciprocated by its neighbors. I read my history and know of the Six Day War. Israel has a far superior military than any of its neighbors. If they wanted to take the Sinai Peninsula again, and keep it, then they could do so at any time. But they gave it back as an offering to hopefully reach peace. All they got in return was more rockets fired at them.
This is not a political war. Maybe in 1947, or perhaps 1967, it was but no more. All those warriors from then are dead or senile. This is a one sided religious war, Muslims wanting to kill Jews or die trying.
I am armed because I am free. I am free because I am armed.
Are you talking about claims he made or just ones that seem implicit? His main actual sin that I saw was that seemed to be leaning to heavy on claims of the difference between genders being biological, when we are much better able to measure the cocktail of nature and nurture.
Again, I feel a lot of the criticism tends to be not on what he said, but on what was implied by what he said. But drawing conclusions requires preconceptions to fill in the blanks, particularly the overall legitimacy of corporate structure and management.
Now, it's quite possible that he's just a sexist jerk. But the memo is still quite readable if one operates under the assumption that traditional management and business structure is garbage that is heavily biased in favor of "rugged invididualism"-type affluent men. The jobs in question make up some of the main exceptions to overtime laws, and one biological difference between men and women is the women generally need more hours of sleep to not have impairments. Women are socially expected to be the one that takes care of a child, and these positions have horrible work-life balance. The traditions of promotion encourage aggressive behavior, which men are inculcated to engage in while women are inculcated to avoid. It's not hard to see how a lot of higher positions are deeply antagonistic towards women by design. And the obvious solution would not be to throw more women into the pool of candidates, but to alter the environment so that it's not hostile. And I believe that those changes would result in a HUGE improvement for diversity and productivity that dwarfs their current initiative.
Like I said, it's possible that Damore didn't intend for this kind of interpretation, but this makes for a far more interesting discussion than the conventional read on it.
This is my signature. There are many like it, but this one is mine.
This is mindless SJWism and everyone knows it but the cultists.
But any company that takes this seriously should put their existential future where their stupid mouths are... and just kill their company.
Hire people that aren't qualified merely on the basis of who is more or less statistically represented.
Burn the company to the ground. And when there's nothing left but ashes and finger pointing... the industry can be rebuilt by people with the courage and integrity to stand their ground.
I'm sure there are devotees of the cult that are offended by the statement, I am not an adherent to your religion.
I find the suggestion that I should take it seriously as silly as you would take the suggestion that only Christians following christian doctrine should be hired. Its that absurd.
But obviously fundamentalists are not known for being sensible. So this is going to continue until they burn it down. We already are seeing companies leave not only the bay area but California entirely. And not merely for tax or real estate issues but literally because the culture has gone toxic.
I know I know... The great sage has prophesied that when the planets align your golden age will come to pass... which is why everyone else has to get on the right side of history... because these people on top of everything else think they have an accurate prophesy of the future. Literally. Otherwise how would they know what was the "right side of history"... they're saying that in the end they'll get what they want. And yet the industry is already very international and most of the international partners on top of the domestic companies that are leaving are not ascribing to this stuff.
Its not good for any industry in which it takes over. Its even f'ing up hollywood, journalism, and academia is lousy with it.
But these people are not open to correction. They were told the word of god at some point and anyone that disagrees is a dirty infidel. So this is just going to have to play out to the pain.
I'm enjoying the show.
I've decided to stop wasting my time responding to AC trolls/sockpuppets... so if you want a response from me... login.
It really is fun watching the Shillaries unable to ever actually talk about the substance of any single thing. And then they wonder why they lost nearly a thousand legislative seats, most of the governorships, both houses of congress, the White House, the Supreme Court, and millions of two-time Obama voters who can't stand people like you any more. Carry on! More! It will help again in the next round. Thanks!
Don't disappoint your bird dog. Go to the range.
The University of Chicago just announced last week that going forward, SAT scores will be "optional" when determining admission standards. Others, no doubt, will follow suit.
https://www.usatoday.com/story...
Guess who tends to do better on SAT tests? That's right - whites and asians. Blacks and Hispanics, on average, do far less well on SAT tests. Notice I said "on average". Obviously there are some Black and Hispanic students that do exceptionally well on the SAT tests but overall, as a group, they don't do as well as whites and asians do as a group. It's just a fact.
I suspect that at least one of the reasons that the University of Chicago chose to take this path is to "right" a supposed "wrong". Google has a very low percentage of black and Hispanic employees and Facebook and Microsoft are probably about the same. I don't know this for a fact but I would be willing to bet it is the case.
So the U of C has now "leveled" (i.e. tilted) the playing field in favor of two groups that traditionally don't do well on standardized tests. What could possibly go wrong?
Diversity for diversity sake is a totally misguided approach to... well, anything actually except maybe winning a diversity trophy.
If any group faces higher obstacles than others, that needs to be addressed. If any group is statistically significantly under-represented, that might justify checking for why it is so.
But intentionally hiring one group over another is actually the definition of discrimination, even if you do it in the name of enriching diversity.
Assorted stuff I do sometimes: Lemuria.org
most the people who make up America chose to come here
No, the vast majority of the people who make up America were born there, and had no say in the matter.
Tell us how you REALLY feel.
Seriously, you're going to let something as temporal as the POTUS drive you THIS fucking bug-nuts?
Do you ENJOY flagellating yourself this much?
You don't like him, you don't like his supporters.
FINE.
He's gone in 4 years IF YOU ACT LIKE SANE PEOPLE.
He's gone in 8 if you continue acting this way (and then gets replaced by someone just like him).
Don't you see how this sort of crazed, bitchy, vindictive behavior is simply pushing people in the near left and center ever further right, even as you and your compatriots dash ever further left?
Chas - The one, the only.
THANK GOD!!!
A more interesting question is how they managed to go from 59.6% white techies in 2014 to 50.7% white techies in 2018. That's an 8.9% drop in four years. Presumably they're not preferentially firing white techies, nor are they preferentially quitting. That leaves hiring, which for some reason has fallen off a cliff, versus non-whites. Is there any innocent explanation for this?
On top of that, female techies have gone from 16.6% to 21.4% over the same four years. Since many of these new hires are undoubtedly white, that means that white male techies have fallen even more than the above stats would indicate. We need more data, but I'm guessing 15 or 20% over four years.
This seems almost beyond belief, and yet no one else seems to be discussing it. Am I all wet here? Or maybe Google screwed up their numbers?
How many generations removed can they still call this their land?
Wait - you’re claiming that the religious zealots from Europe who said they have an eternal homeland after 2000 years are reasonable but the second and third generation of the people displaced are not, even though they are still stateless and occupied by said European religious zealots?
Those that can behave themselves and not be pissed about a 70 year old gripe will live in peace and prosperity within the borders of Israel. Those that can't will be imprisoned, not killed or forced out.
You seem to not know a heck of a lot about this, so it’s unsurprising you are parroting propaganda, but the Palestinians both in Gaza and the West Bank face starvation rations and no clean water in one case and dispossession in the other, and both face near-daily violence from Israelis. You should open a newspaper or two, or maybe read a book.
If Israel really was the bloodthirsty culture you believe it to be then they'd bomb the Gaza Strip until it glowed in the dark. The Gaza Strip is 99.9% Muslim, why is that? Could it be because the Jews and Christians were largely killed or forcefully relocated? All the rockets that go over that border originate from Gaza and land in Israel. Sure, the Israeli Army will defend it's border with lethal force so bullets and grenades do cross from Israel into Gaza. They do this because they know if the border is breached that those that cross will do so with the intent to kill as many Jews as they can. This isn't about land any more, no one fighting this war has ever set foot in Israel before.
I think you’ll find it’s about occupation and Israeli brutality. Seriously, the level of ignorance you’re showing here is embarrassing. Even the Israelis admit that they have a brutal occupation with the intent of starving the Palestinians into acquiescence. They just can’t mass murder the Palestinians because then they’d be subjected to sanctions, and they rely on massive aid handouts from the EU and US just to survive.
I read my history and know of the Six Day War. Israel has a far superior military than any of its neighbors. If they wanted to take the Sinai Peninsula again, and keep it, then they could do so at any time. But they gave it back as an offering to hopefully reach peace. All they got in return was more rockets fired at them.
Ouch! You really should open a book about the Yom Kippur war, where Egypt steamrolled over Israeli forces almost by accident, and discovered that they could do that again and again if they had better preparation. Isarel and Egypt were discussing peace a year later, and a peace treaty was signed shortly after that. What rockets do you think go from Egypt to Israel, or vice versa? Egypt was Israel’s second Middle East ally.
Work like no one is watching. Dance like you've never been hurt. Make love like you don't need the money.
The US population is 62% white. Google's employee population is 53.1% white and new hires are 45.2% white. That seems like a pretty serious bias to me, but it's a private business and they can do what they want. What I don't understand is what "better outcome" they actually want to achieve. Dose Google want to become a "majority minority" company?