Slashdot Mirror
Tesla Model 3 Now Offers 'Summon' Self-Parking Feature (autoblog.com)
The "Summon" feature that the Model S and Model X have had for a while is now available in the Tesla Model 3. The feature allows the car to park autonomously without anyone in the car; it can even operate the garage door as it parks and powers down, or when it is called out of its parking spot by the owner. Autoblog reports: Tesla tweeted the news in response to a video showing a Model 3 park itself in a tight space in a home garage, before the garage door closes behind it. Elon Musk replied to Tesla's tweet by assuring viewers, "Note, no one is in the car or controlling remotely. Car is driving entirely by itself." The feature comes via an over-the-air software update.
Big liability issue and eula will not save them if it went the wrong way and run over an kid on the sidewalk.
It's only been 5 hours since the last Elon Musk article.
I was getting very nervous and feared the worse. I'm glad everything is OK.
Nothing could go wrong, unless it mistakes the garage for a police car.
At some point, you have to admit that Tesla continues to break new ground and drive auto/manmufacturing technology harder and faster than any other automaker. :-) .
Are they perfect and able (yet) to churn out 2 million vehicles a year? Nope, but they are sure as shit shaking up the traditional automakers, who desperately needed it. I'm rooting for the guy to win Bigly(TM)
Rather, who was there first, when two of these spot the same parking space and try to park there at the same time. Autonomous road rage?
Works beautifully except for that one time it goes through the wall.
The feature allows the car to park autonomously without anyone in the car
The feature can operate electric motors capable of moving this heavy machinery with no human at the controls and able to stop it, in the event of an emergency. What happens in the event of a computer or actuator malfunction?
Keep in mind, the motors in the Tesla are capable of moving the vehicle at high speed. What kind of safety protocols are in place to make sure that if something goes wrong the car will not suddenly launch at high speed if there's a malfunction or continue driving if it crashes into something?
What kind of protections are there to prevent someone else from running up to the car and jumping in its path, or a thief running up yanking the door open, getting in the seat and driving away ---- Stealing the vehicle while it was in the process of parking?
This is a great milestone on the way to the feature we all want where the car avoids parking fees by reparking itself every 2 hours!
Any sufficiently unpopular but cohesive argument is indistinguishable from trolling.
If this requires the parking spot to be a well defined position programmed in advance, like my garage, its a bit of a gimmick with limited practical use. A lot of people have a door straight through to their house from the garage, and in hot or cold climates they aren't going to want to get in or out of the car outside. What I really want is a car that can drop me at the door of Walmart, then go and find a parking spot by itself. And as I pull my phone out to pay at the checkout I can summon it to come and pick me up from the door again. This requires significantly better autonomous driving skills - a supermarket carpark has a lot more pedestrians stepping out from between cars than your average suburban neighborhood, and the AI needs to recognise the difference between a vacant parking spot and a lane between two blocks of parking, and it needs to make that recognition even when some asshole has already parked in half that lane. Probably a good strategy would be to drive to the outer limit of the carpark where it is generally empty except for staff cars, which would also limit the outrage from the general public about unsupervised cars driving around the lot and stealing their parks.
It doesn't. It's situation-adaptive, making use of the ultrasonic sensors
It's not perfect, though. It's slow, and when there's uncertainty it prefers to give up rather than risk hitting something (particularly noteworthy in really tight situations, where you want summon the most). And there have been some rare instances where things have been hit, although it's not common. For most people, it's just a party trick. But it does occasionally come in handy, for things like the "car parked in a puddle" situation and the like. It's not yet to the point of "drop you off at the door and then go find a parking space", and it's not clear when, if ever, it will be (self-driving optimists would say "soon"; I'm not among them). But some more speed and reliability would make summon (and autoparking) see significantly more use.
Why must all aquatic villains play the organ?
You would dismiss the vehicle when you no longer need it, you would summon it when you need it.
--- Keep the choice with the user..
As long as the thing that it occasionally hits is not your 3yo daughter who has wandered into the garage and is playing in the corner while you are walking in the front door.
I have to say without being particularly for or against Musk that this kind of stuff is really cool and for some people with a little garage fantastic as you don't need to open the doors once parked. I have had a garage so tight that you could not have a passenger in the car due to the door being too close to the wall once parked. Also a pain to get in when leaving the house as you need to drive the car out then load the passenger. Now the garage just needs to fit the car not the door swing also.
I've seen a number of Model S owners complain that there was really no use-case for summon except the "gee whiz" factor of showing off your car entering or exiting the garage without you in it first .... until they needed to park in a really tight space. Saves you from having to worry about opening your door and hitting something next to you.
It's ok. We understand.
It's MUCH better that YOU kill your 3 year old daughter than a car sense her presence and avoid hitting her.
No problem. We know it's better that she die than an AI park your car. After all, the computer is flawed, right? The actual death count is irrelevant, so long as you get to make the final decision to kill her.
The bloody pulp that was your daughter very much respects your decision to avoid any technology that might have saved her life. It's all good. You've stopped that evil that might not have squished her, as opposed to you, who put a tire right over her body and splattered her guts all over the garage wall.
Problem solved. You can always make another.
I use it when I wash my car in the garage and want to move it outside to do the door jambs etc. Then I summon it back in. It works reasonably well and like anything in life you learn its capabilities and limitations and proceed accordingly. It's also handy to pull out of spots if someone parks you in or to pull INTO spots that are too tight, ie: if the charger is mostly blocked but the car will fit if you don't have to get in/out of the door you can still get it in close enough to charge.
Because no piece of software has ever had a bug.
Tesla was designed to run off the toad, hit concrete barriers at high speed, run over pedestrians, run into parked cop cars as well as parked fire trucks.
Nope. No bugs at all with ye olde autopilot sensors and response wares.
We are not opposed to self driving cars.
We are opposed to being beta testers and vehicular man slaughter victims for your nerd-God, Musk.
Yes self driving cars are coming and very welcomed. After real manufacturers who are more responsible than hypesters start shipping them and dont pull shit like: oh autopilot doesnt mean it drives itself, that just means you have to pay just as much attention as if you were driving and we charge you five grand for the pleasure!
Idiots.
Also, software can never ever be patched afterwards, so you'll have these bugs for as long as you have that Tesla.
/s
Self driving cars might happen... one day...
The 80:20 rule still applies, and we might be close to the 80% that can be done in 20% of the time. The last 20% will need 80% of the time and we haven't even touched that yet.
Yes, Waymo is pretty impressive... In good weather and well mapped areas. But they still would cause a crash every 5000 miles or so if the human operator didn't intervene. Even if I assume that not every intervention prevented a crash and say it's only every third, that's still a pretty lousy driving record. I expect a self driving car to be able to work everywhere a human operated car can operate and in all weather situations a good human driver can handle. That includes gravel roads that don't appear on any map.
Soon.. the car can take a drive on its own. .. no owner or users needed... oh wait...
until they needed to park in a really tight space. Saves you from having to worry about opening your door and hitting something next to you.
Except for the other cars that still need to open their doors. If an asshole Tesla parks suck that I can’t get into my car, their paint job is getting redecorated with my keys.
You can’t patch in a lack of hardware like lidar retard.
As of today, there isn't a single certified self-driving car on the planet available to a consumer. From any manufacturer.
They are ALL still just driver-assist. If that car kills a toddler by squishing them in that garage... STILL ALL YOUR FAULT. You go to jail. If that car hits another while pulling out of the garage. If it trashes your garage. If it doesn't stop and just drives into the road and trundles off to work on its own while you stand by the kerb baffled what happened? STILL ALL YOUR FAULT. You'll be charged for driving without due care, because you're not in charge of the vehicle.
There is no such thing as a self-driving car, because NOBODY is taking responsibility for their driving, not even the manufacturers themselves, whether by certifying them, insuring them, or putting in waivers that they'll represent you in court. Which means they have zero confidence in their ability to actually self-drive.
Such "self-driving" cars in this manner have been around since the days of filming the A-Team and driving a dummy car up a ramp and into a barrel of explosives. They are no different. The only personal responsible is the person controlling it, and even if they control it or trust it, they are fully legally liable and can get themselves jailed just by LETTING it self-drive (the guy who sat in the passenger seat while the Tesla "drove", etc.).
The irony? We could have self-driving cars as you state. We could have had 20, 30, 40 years ago. Just isolate them from "real" traffic and they can be properly self-driving, there's little enough risk to others that you can just insure against hitting another automated vehicle (rather than pedestrians, cyclists unpredictable unautomated vehicles etc.), We have self-driving (as in properly automated) trains, self-driving cars is just a train without a rail. It's actually easier to JUST PUT IN RAILS to limit disaster potential than it is to try to interpret the world via AI and other nonsense.
Of course we'll get them at some point. There are entire MINES in some countries where every vehicle and robot is fully self-driving and controlled. There have been for 20 years. But you know what? I wonder why we didn't have self-driving golf carts, self-driving in-site delivery trucks, self-driving kiddies rides around Disneyworld (not on rails, but through the normal pedestrian / vehicle routes) first. Because that's EASIER. It's cheaper. It's legally much simpler. You could prototype so much better. It's safer. It's lower speed (nowhere near as demanding) and in a controlled environment.
But, we never did. Tesla are jumping straight into on-road vehicles and then selling them as self-driving (they're technically not but look at the wording "this car has no driver", etc. - they're saying it's self-driving without actually being allowed to say the words). If they'd proven themselves first, I'd agree. But we're already picking up deaths because of self-driving modes that aren't.
P.S. Even Tesla themselves admit that they can only "self-drive" in any fashion on a freeway/motorway-like environment with clear lane markings where confusing hotspots are tracked and even then they still have "whoops, didn't see that HUGE CONCRETE DIVIDER" instantaneous deaths.
Not saying this stuff isn't POSSIBLE. It's out there. There are open mines that are entirely automated with HUGE 100-ton automated trucks moving around. What we're saying it that this stuff isn't READY, especially the consumer stuff, especially fighting against humans (the mines are generally no-go-zones for humans while in operation), especially while they CANNOT gain certification as "self-driving" from any country in the world.
But, most especially, while the manufacturers push all the liability to YOU, the driver. Until someone says "We'll pay all legal bills related to any accident deemed to be due to the error of our vehicle" then they have no confidence in their own system.
Stupid thing to do. Now the guy you blocked in keys your car because he has trouble getting into his car.
And dumbass Tesla owner would deserve a good keying for being that kind of selfish prick.
My keys are mightier than your paint job, Teslassholes.
You have been warned.
Because no piece of software has ever had a bug.
ISO 26262. *
Trying to argue why "software may theoretically have bugs" is a bad argument will take too much time. It is a lot easier for both of us if you just read the standard. (Or IEC 61508 if you want to, the safety related parts should be fairly equivalent.)
Just to get an idea of the scope, a system developed according to the standard will be able to manage a situation where a transistor in the CPU stops working, for example if the ALU no longer can set the zero-flag and conditional branches no longer is possible.
Yep, you so called "safe" high level languages means jack shit when it comes to designing safe systems. Your built in super-automatic buffer overrun check isn't guaranteed to work.
The software should be bug-free, but even if it isn't then it shouldn't cause a safety issue.
* I do not assume that Tesla actually follows the standard even if they are legally required to.
...who are mad that the car doesn't appear next to them when they raise a staff in the air and shout gibberish.
That guy is lucky he wasnt seriously injured.
Ugh I cant get those 2 minutes back. Dont bother with this link unless you love something dripping in sarcasm.
There are already too many jack-wagons where I live that drop someone off in front of the store and then STAY PARKED IN THE FIRE LANE waiting for that person to come out.
If I we also had people summoning their vehicles to constantly wait in front of the building it would be impossible to access.
Parking lots work because they are spread out, if everyone were to get in/out of their vehicle directly in front of the store it would be a nightmare.
You would end up having to summon your car to meet you 50-100 yards from the store entrance. In which case, you could just leave the damn thing parked. Feel free to turn it on remotely and let the climate control make it comfortable, that seems completely reasonable.
How is this breaking new ground? How is this worthy of the adulation?
Self park/summon is a feature that has long been available on the Model S and X.
Frankly I'm shocked - shocked I say - to hear that the Model 3 has not had this all along. Why didn't the Model 3 have it? And, is Tesla's ability to copy/paste really worthy of worshiping Elon?
There are already too many jack-wagons where I live that drop someone off in front of the store and then STAY PARKED IN THE FIRE LANE waiting for that person to come out.
In one small town I lived in the main grocery store got tired of that and asked the cops to ticket people parked in the fire lane. Every few months a cop would grab a lawn chair, park it in the shade of the building, and just sit there. People would drive by him, park in the fire lane, and he'd write up the ticket, wander over, hand it to them, and then head back and sit down.
It was like shooting fish in a barrel. And it didn't seem to make much difference in the long run.
Velociraptor = Distiraptor / Timeraptor
Probably a good strategy would be to drive to the outer limit of the carpark where it is generally empty except for staff cars, which would also limit the outrage from the general public about unsupervised cars driving around the lot and stealing their parks.
I predict in the next 5 years someone is going to paint corners on parking spaces specifically to enable self-driving cars to pick them out easier.
Nope, no sig
With how dramatically wrong Tesla's super-cruise features have gone on their vehicles, I fully expect that car to end up... "I'm sorry Dave, I missed the garage door but on the bright side your garage now has a new enterance!" :)
If you use the Summon feature while Ludicrous mode is active, the car will do a handbrake turn when arriving at your location.
Bracing for the news reports of people getting hit by Teslas in parking lots, or Teslas running into buildings/closed garage doors, because the half-assed excuse for AI that everyone keeps trying to use like a human brain isn't and never will be 'smart' enough to fucking do shit like this without completely fucking it up!
If the space next to you is that tight, it's because of YOUR parking. You're the selfish asshole here.
When it backs into my garage door, can I sue Tesla for a new door? What about if it doesn't pull in far enough and the garage door closes on it? Can I force Tesla to pay for new paint on the trunk?
"One day" is now down to within two years. The cars will be on the road in production quantities then. Your crash numbers are at least 10 years old. The cars are operating in Michigan in the winter now.
And it's down to the last 0.1% or less now. 20% was many years ago.
And good luck finding your hypothetical unmapped road.
I dont live wherever the hell you do where you have enough giant spots for everyone. The topic was Tesla-asshole parking on top of someone. Pay attention and stay on topic.
Spots here are tight even when people park perfectly centered and if I am to the side of my spot it is because some selfish idiot parked over my line. If you park your pos Tesla on top of me and block me in you are buying a new paint job, asshole.
You succinctly put a spotlight directly on OP's point. You are a Slashdot Luddite.
Naysayers gonna naysay.
You cannot save and restore to avoid an accident in real life, idiot. Once a pedestrian is maimed or dead, they stay that way.
Fucking gamers, do you ever go out of that basement?
Don't use keys, that's easy to fix. Use a small cutter, and try to cut short, but deep and try to make it so that they have to repaint the whole car. That is, don't cut the middle of the hood, but try to get the hood and the side, or door and side.
Less work, more bang.
I recommend an angle grinder. Why stop at just the paint? Put some body damage as well.
Tesla’s golfcarts are significantly wider than real cars.
You must be a stupid code monkey. It is enough to damage the galvanized layer under the paint. No need for heavy instruments, all it takes is a 2-inch cut with a 1 dollar box cutter.
Finding unmapped roads is easy, just visit a new subdevelopment.
Kind of a narrow-minded assumption that it would be another car on each side making the space tight, though, isn't it?
I love how all the Tesla haters jumped on this to rant about keying the car or ruining its whole paint job....
I'm thinking more of situations I've been in, in the past, where there might have been just enough space to fit my car between a concrete wall on one side and something like a trash dumpster on the other. Nobody parked there, even though the rest of the lot was packed, because it was too difficult to get out. But if you can slot the car in there automatically, cool .... You just took advantage of the space.
You can’t patch in a lack of hardware like lidar retard.
1: Other car manufacturers have been "patching" hardware for decades. It's called a product recall. Sure, patching in a whole new and improved piece of hardware such as Lidar to replace their existing tech is a big costly thing to do, but it would have to be done if Lidar were actually needed.
2: These cars don't seem to need Lidar (consider that ALL of them should be failing quite often without a required piece of navigation hardware)
3: dumbass
You cannot save and restore to avoid an accident in real life, idiot. Once a pedestrian is maimed or dead, they stay that way.
Fucking gamers, do you ever go out of that basement?
No shit Sherlock.
But I missed the part where I stated any of that
Are you trying to imply that the traffic related death rate for autonomous drivers is higher than the death rate from human drivers?
Or are you trying to imply that Tesla should get their shit together and release an absolutely perfect car on day one just like every other car manufacturer?
What are you? A stable genius®?
Because no piece of software has ever had a bug.
ISO 26262. *
Trying to argue why "software may theoretically have bugs" is a bad argument will take too much time. It is a lot easier for both of us if you just read the standard. (Or IEC 61508 if you want to, the safety related parts should be fairly equivalent.)
Just to get an idea of the scope, a system developed according to the standard will be able to manage a situation where a transistor in the CPU stops working, for example if the ALU no longer can set the zero-flag and conditional branches no longer is possible. Yep, you so called "safe" high level languages means jack shit when it comes to designing safe systems. Your built in super-automatic buffer overrun check isn't guaranteed to work.
The software should be bug-free, but even if it isn't then it shouldn't cause a safety issue.
Completely agree
However, my snark was more to do with the way certain internet commenters have this incredibly high standard placed upon Tesla, yet if an existing car manufacturer for example has a tech flaw, there isn't nearly the same level of outrage/concern/whatever
Could it be that "electric cars" and "autonomous driving" are a threat to people who's ePeen is attached to their ability to own and operate a big V8?
Note: I'm not saying that Tesla should get a pass for whatever may be wrong in their cars. I'm saying that the level of wrath directed towards Tesla seems to be people getting defensive over their toys being slowly taken away. I suspect that most of these people have never even heard of Lidar until it became a talking point for Tesla
* I do not assume that Tesla actually follows the standard even if they are legally required to.
I just hope that they're doing a better job of it than Toyota
and I say all of this while I tend to avoid American cars due to hardware reliability concerns (hoping Tesla will be the exception here)
And another perk, is that they can park on handicap-spots.
Because compared to (most) human drivers, they are definitely differently abled.