System76 Linux Computer Maker Offers a Sneak Peek Into Its New Factory (betanews.com)

BrianFagioli shares a report from BetaNews: System76 has long been a Linux computer seller, but recently, it has transitioned into a Linux computer maker. What's the difference, you ask? Well, currently, the company doesn't really make its own computers. System76's laptops, for instance, are made by other manufacturers, which it re-brands as its own. No, System76 doesn't just slap its name on other company's laptops and ship them out the door. Actually, it works closely with the manufacturers, tweaks firmware, and verifies that both Ubuntu and its Ubuntu-based Pop!_OS will work well on the hardware. System76 then offers top-notch support too. In other words, the company isn't just selling a computer, but an experience too. Unfortunately, when you rely on other computer manufacturers, you don't fully control the experience. Ultimately, System76 cannot achieve its true vision without building its own laptops. And so, that is exactly what it is going to do! Yes, System76 will be building and selling the computers right here in the USA (Denver, Colorado to be exact). I mean, when your company supports open source ideology and takes pride in being "Made in America," how can you go wrong?

Many folks in the Linux community are excited to see the fruits of System76's labor, and today, we get a small peek. No, the company isn't sharing any of its computer designs, but it is showing off its new manufacturing facility. In a new blog post by System76 customer service all-star Emma, she shares several photos of the new factory. [T]he space is absolutely massive! It seems System76 has very lofty goals. Exactly when these new computers both designed and manufactured by System76 will become available for purchase is anyone's guess. Quite frankly, based on the System76's blog post, it seems they are still at very early stages. With that said, it will be interesting to see what is born inside that factory in Colorado. The Linux community is anxiously awaiting something special.

Comments

Pop!_OS?

[fisted]

Seriously, "Pop!_OS"? That's the dumbest name I've heard in a while. I suppose the underscore is supposed to look "modern", because random punctuation is what the kids use -- oh wait, that was maybe 20 years ago.

Good fucking grief.

Re:Pop!_OS?

[fisted]

Nice ad, comrade.

Re:Pop!_OS?

[Anonymous Coward]

Seriously, "Pop!_OS"? That's the dumbest name I've heard in a while...

Given how long the *NIX community been embarrassing themselves with build names, this is par for the course, and actually an improvement. At least the name doesn't immediately conjure visions of a development team consisting of 40-year old Bronies running around in Pokemon pajamas speaking Klingon all day.

Re: Pop!_OS?

[Anonymous Coward]

Sand monkey cock in your mouth.

Re:Pop!_OS?

[Anonymous Coward]

I suppose the underscore is supposed to look "modern", because random punctuation is what the kids use

Underscores are a common Unix convention to allow spaces to be used as unambiguous separators between items in a list. (Compare: "Pop!_OS, Windows, and Linux" versus "Pop!, OS, Windows, and Linux".) For a Linux distribution, I think an underscore is just the right level of geeky.

The exclamation mark, though - that's just silly.

Re:Pop!_OS?

[Anonymous Coward]

chay' ngIl nIvnav Ha'DIbaH QujmeH moQ 'ej mu'qaD SoH!

Re:Pop!_OS?

[ctilsie242]

Just the name makes me think of advertising rhetoric or some guy in marketing talking about edgy, or throwing buzzwords at something.

Realistically, they should have made a name for the OS that is simple and understandable. Even something like 76OS would be useful.

Re:Pop!_OS?

[Anonymous Coward]

In the Xhosa language ! represents a clicking sound.
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/3/3c/Postalveolar_click.ogg

Re:Pop!_OS?

[fisted]

Ok, do we have any reason to assume that this is in fact supposed to be pronounced in the Xhosa language?

news flash

[Anonymous Coward]

system76 is hardly unique with their manufacturer-retailer relationship. over 95% of all laptops sold worldwide each year are not made by the name on the bezel. even with their facility, they're only taking over the job of assembling in the production chain.

Re:news flash

[mccalli]

Someone I used to know worked in a warranty repair centre in the UK, for televisions. He said that the BOSE televisions were Panasonics, as in if you removed the BOSE bezel the original Panasonic bezel was still there underneath.

This would be six-eight years ago and I'm passing on anecdote rather than having hard proof, but yeah - badge-engineering has long been a thing. Car industry is notorious for it.

Re:news flash

[KozmoStevnNaut]

Bang & Olufsen used to have a reputation for simply rebadging Philips TVs. Sure, they used Philips tubes, but that was because Philips was one of the best CRT makers in the business. Everything else was B&O designed and built.

However when it came to plasma TVs in particular, in some cases they literally took a Panasonic plasma display (meant for use with an external control box), glued aluminum trim to the front and supplied their own control box. And charged 5-10x as much for it as the exact same panel from Panasonic.

Re:news flash

[The Cynical Critic]

With the car industry it's typically either a parent company designed platform that the different brands use as basis for their cars or a product from under the same corporate umbrella. While cases like Tata tried to sell their Nano as a Rover were fairly common in the 1980s and early 1990s (Honda platform Rovers and Mazda platform Fords spring to mind), they're vastly outnumbered by common platform and re-brands from within the same company.

Re:news flash

[Anonymous Coward]

...badge-engineering has long been a thing. Car industry is notorious for it.

Reminds me of one of my first cars, a Plymouth Colt, which was nothing more than a re-badged Mitsubishi Mirage. Dodge Colt and Eagle Summit were the same exact re-badged car too, so you essentially had one maker and 3 clones.

Funny part is when the salesman popped the hood and my wife saw the Mitsubishi engine and said, "I thought we were buying American!"

Re:news flash

[Anonymous Coward]

...badge-engineering has long been a thing. Car industry is notorious for it.

Reminds me of one of my first cars, a Plymouth Colt, which was nothing more than a re-badged Mitsubishi Mirage. Dodge Colt and Eagle Summit were the same exact re-badged car too, so you essentially had one maker and 3 clones.

Funny part is when the salesman popped the hood and my wife saw the Mitsubishi engine and said, "I thought we were buying American!"

I always found that practice to be so strange where there were conflicting manufacturer names within the very engine bay like that, as well as other cases where the two car models are almost identically minus slightly different tail lights and door trim and made me wonder what the damn point even was of selling it under two names and having extra assembly processes for these minor differences. This seemed to get cut down on a lot after the bailout of the Big Three, a huge number of redundant brands and model lines got axed completely.

Re:news flash

[Anonymous Coward]

badge-engineering has long been a thing. Car industry is notorious for it.

What's the difference between a GMC and a Chevy?

About $10,000. That's really it.

Re:news flash

[Not-a-Neg]

I remember the day I was driving my shiny new 2001 Suzuki Vitara and pulled up alongside a Chevy Tracker at a red light. It was the same exact vehicle as mine but with a few different plastic trim pieces, different bumper covers and different wheels. I believe it had a different engine as well, they simply shared the same body and interior trims.

Re:news flash

[Anonymous Coward]

Sony had the top tube design for 3 decades running after buying off Chromatic Labs' design for what eventually became the Trinitron design. But Sony was bad at everything else that goes in a TV.

Re:news flash

[KozmoStevnNaut]

They were also very protective of their design, and refused to license it, or sell tubes to other TV manufacturers.

Made in America?

[Anonymous Coward]

Most likely 'Assembled in an American factory'.

Where do all those parts and software components come from?

Re: Made in America?

[Anonymous Coward]

Made in USA, America, as well as Europe or Africa, are continents.
What you do is like French decided one day that they are the Europeans, call their country Europe, and call the rest of the continent "The Europas".

Re:Made in America?

[BlueStrat]

Most likely 'Assembled in an American factory'.

Where do all those parts and software components come from?

Of course they're getting their active and passive components from the same places everyone else does who builds to that architecture. If they do it right, building the motherboards and assembling/testing the units in the US will make possible a much tighter quality control and inspection process and greater feature-flexibility.

Naturally, the 'holy grail' relating in large part to security, openness, and freedom in the manufacturing of personal computers is making your own CPUs/GPUs/etc etc, but that takes enormous capital and R&D, not to mention overcoming huge regulatory and legal hurdles and burdens.

In today's US economic/taxation/financial/environmental landscape and regulatory environment an Intel, AMD, or even a MS or Apple could not make a successful start. The big players use the government's powers to pull up the ladder after themselves through laws, Acts, and regulations. That's a danger anytime the government is allowed to broaden it powers & scope, and extend it's control into more markets and technologies.

Strat

Re:Made in America?

[Anonymous Coward]

As it stands now, if a small business had something cool, the owners will be given a deal they could not refuse: Be bought out, or face complete obliteration by patent and IP lawsuits in international courts. Some guy making something out of the garage doesn't have the resources to fight a billion dollar company out of Hong Kong.

Re:Made in America?

[Anonymous Coward]

If they want me to buy one of their laptops how about putting a 4:3 display in. Don't tell me it cant be done, Apple has only used 4:3 in the iPad and the larger ones are a good fit for an ultrabook. Buy from whoever makes those. Also better build quality. If its going to be plastic it needs to be tough plastic. Same with metal, don't use the softest aluminum you can find that scratches and dents every time you touch it.

Otherwise the best Linux laptop is an old Thinkpad.

Re:Made in America?

[Anonymous Coward]

Yep. It's impossible to get a motherboard that's made in the US (or anyplace else in N or S America). They all come from China. If the BIOS is soldered-on (as most are), that comes from China too - so embedded spyware is always a possibility. Might be funny (as in interesting, not comical) to see a hacked BIOS (by Chinese spy agencies) and a hacked OS (by US spy agencies) try to work around each other - as long as you don't expect to get any real work done.

If you have a surplus laptop that's in reasonable shape and can have the battery replaced, it might be better to just use that for Linux. Mint and several other Ubuntu variants work quite well (from personal experience in an old Asus laptop) in such machines.

Re:Made in America?

[ctilsie242]

If I wanted a laptop from the ground up for Linux, I wouldn't mind sacrificing a few millimeters of thickness for some useful features:

1: A rugged aluminum chassis with hard anodizing so it doesn't scratch if looked it.
2: Everything replaceable as much as possible, RAM, SSD, HDD, etc.
3: USB-C charging ability in and out.
4: Five year warranty.
5: OPAL, or other hardware encrypting SSD.
6: More than USB-C ports. A SD card, regular USB-A port, and even a combination USB/e-SATA port would be highly useful.
7: A Kensington lock slot, even if it done XJack style and slides out, or even better cleverly designed like the old Thinkpads to prevent the machine from being opened if it is in use.

Re:Made in America?

[Anonymous Coward]

In today's US economic/taxation/financial/environmental landscape and regulatory environment an Intel, AMD, or even a MS or Apple could not make a successful start. The big players use the government's powers to pull up the ladder after themselves through laws, Acts, and regulations. That's a danger anytime the government is allowed to broaden it powers & scope, and extend it's control into more markets and technologies.

You say regulatory capture, I say Uber. Every industry is built on the skeletons of giants and it continues. If a startup wanted to sell new and used books online today, of course they would be gobbled up by an incumbent. DUH. We’re still swimming in startups, and some of them we will be talking about ten years from now.

Re:Made in America?

[Anonymous Coward]

It's a step in the right direction.

Re:Made in America?

[PrimaryConsult]

I once toured an American factory for specialized communication equipment. They were proudly stating that all their products were made in America, but I couldn't take my eyes off the giant MADE IN CHINA emblazoned on the PCBs the workers were soldering things to.

I understand what they mean by Made in America, but China was pretty brilliant to get that stamp on the largest internal piece of hardware.

Re: Made in America?

[DamnOregonian]

Made in USA, America, as well as Europe or Africa, are continents.

America is not a continent. North America is a continent. The Americas are continents.
As far as North America is concerned, our satellite nations to the north and south can suck this one up. We were the first independent nation in both Americas, Native American sovereignty notwithstanding, and our country is literally named for that fact.
Canada isn't called the Canadian Republic of America. Mexico isn't called the Mexican Republic of America.
It's well established, even over seas, that "America" refers to the USA. Now, when we start using North America to refer to the USA, you can bitch.

What you do is like French decided one day that they are the Europeans, call their country Europe, and call the rest of the continent "The Europas".

Na, it'd be more like if The United Kingdom of Great Britain were simply called Great Britain sometimes... Oh wait, whoops.
Jackass.

Re:Made in America?

[tlhIngan]

Most likely 'Assembled in an American factory'.

Where do all those parts and software components come from?

Exactly.

And it's not their entire lineup, either. It's just the desktops that are being "made in America". The laptops are, and still will be, OEM designs that System76 buys from companies like Quanta and such and simply put their badge on it.

Re:Made in America?

[Medievalist]

I would buy that laptop.

But you have to understand that the goal of capital today is not to provide what people want, it's to make them want what only you can provide.

Re:Made in America?

[Anonymous Coward]

Well the CPUs at least are more than likely made in America. Pretty sure that Intel doesn't fab server or consumer chips outside of the US and AMD gets their silicon through Global Foundries who has a large amount of their high tech capacity in New York.

Re:Made in America?

[BlueStrat]

1: A rugged aluminum chassis with hard anodizing so it doesn't scratch if looked it.
2: Everything replaceable as much as possible, RAM, SSD, HDD, etc.
3: USB-C charging ability in and out.
4: Five year warranty.
5: OPAL, or other hardware encrypting SSD.
6: More than USB-C ports. A SD card, regular USB-A port, and even a combination USB/e-SATA port would be highly useful.
7: A Kensington lock slot, even if it done XJack style and slides out, or even better cleverly designed like the old Thinkpads to prevent the machine from being opened if it is in use.

8. All data ports, jacks, slots, and the like are disabled at the hardware level when the laptop is in sleep mode, logged out, placed into 'secure mode',etc, and cannot be enabled nor accessed unless the correct password is entered to unlock the machine (customizable to enable leaving the machine running closed and sending data,, audio/video, etc, if desired).

As long as we're making a list of important features that would be great to have on a laptop, there's the next item I thought belonged on that list.

Strat

Re:Made in America?

[lsatenstein]

Most likely 'Assembled in an American factory'.

Where do all those parts and software components come from?

Of course they're getting their active and passive components from the same places everyone else does who builds to that architecture. If they do it right, building the motherboards and assembling/testing the units in the US will make possible a much tighter quality control and inspection process and greater feature-flexibility.

Naturally, the 'holy grail' relating in large part to security, openness, and freedom in the manufacturing of personal computers is making your own CPUs/GPUs/etc etc, but that takes enormous capital and R&D, not to mention overcoming huge regulatory and legal hurdles and burdens.

In today's US economic/taxation/financial/environmental landscape and regulatory environment an Intel, AMD, or even a MS or Apple could not make a successful start. The big players use the government's powers to pull up the ladder after themselves through laws, Acts, and regulations. That's a danger anytime the government is allowed to broaden it powers & scope, and extend it's control into more markets and technologies.

Strat

The benefit they have is in purchasing power. We pay retail to Amazon, Newegg, etc. They purchase items at the same prices as the mentioned resellers.
And it is always easy to beat BB's prices.

bet the screen will still be awful

[Anonymous Coward]

Don't make a 16:9 display.
Make proper screen 2560x1600

Re:bet the screen will still be awful

[Anonymous Coward]

Yes, for the love of god, please spare us the short TV screens. 16:9 might be acceptable at >30", but certainly not in an notebook. 16:10 is okay, 3:2 would be better yet, or even 64:45.

Re:bet the screen will still be awful

[OrangeTide]

I'm fine with my laptop screen being whatever aspect ratio that my keyboard happens to be. I'd rather have a compact laptop that opens up in an airline seat or on a train than an ultra thin laptop that doesn't fit into a small bag.

fisted?

[Anonymous Coward]

Seriously. "fisted"? That's the cheesiest handle I've heard in a while. Handle? You get it? Hahaha.

C'mon. If you haven't anything better to say, you perhaps better shut up (roughly based on Wittgenstein).

Made in America

[Errol backfiring]

Especially when it comes to computers, "Made in America" is not really a mark of quality. I do not expect it to come with less spyware than a machine labelled "Made in China". "Made in Iceland" would probably be a far better deal.

Re:Made in America

[DNS-and-BIND]

When you think about it, what do you really have to fear from the Chinese government? What could they realistically do to you?

On the other hand the US government and its NSA will come down on you like a ton of bricks if they think you're organizing a movement to bring down their power. You always have more to fear from your own government than any foreigner. In fact, they have a rather bad track record of playing "blame the foreigner" to cover up their own shortcomings.

Re:Made in America

[Anonymous Coward]

I can think of one thing: They can sell the info they gather. The Chinese may not use the info, but it can be sold to those who would, and those people could be crazy ex-es, or anyone. Even terrorist groups looking for the best places to cause destruction.

Of course, industrial espionage is a thing too.

Re:Made in America

[Anonymous Coward]

The Chinese government could mandate poor or no encryption and backdoors making my computer vulnerable not only to them but local corporations, hackers and governments as well.

Please do it right!!

[Anonymous Coward]

Please use this to make laptops that aren't just copies of other manufacturers!!!

I want hardware ports - DisplayPort/HDMI, VGA, 3.5mm audio, RJ45, at least 5 USB sockets, an ExpressCard slot, camera, half decent speakers, a microphone!

I want status LEDs - Capslock, Numlock, Scrolllock, HDD activity, power, charge , Wifi/BT/WWAN status! Something like a ThinkLight or backlit keyboard too!

I want hardware buttons for turning WiFi etc on and off, changing audio volume, muting volume, muting microphone input WITH LED indicators indicating status!

I want the ability to add an extended battery for longer run-time! Or have 2 batteries!

And a nice keyboard and trackpad, maybe even a trackpoint too!

And modular components so it's easy to take apart to repair, replace fan, add RAM, upgrade HDD/SSD/M2, upgrade WWAN or WiFi module or even MXM card if that is still a thing!

And I want this in a 12-13" form factor that won't crack open if I knock it off the table!

Impossible you say?
Modern manufacturers would agree - This is why I am *still* using a Thinkpad X220!!!
Please make something I can upgrade to that isn't worse than what I already have!

Re: Please do it right!!

[orlanz]

Kind of difficult. A lot of what you want is dependent on the motherboard which is linked to the CPU. So basically Intel.

It's not a technical issue. You could always drop in an extra chip as middleware or get a custom motherboard. But the problem is that you are now the deviation. Your materials, assembly, and support costs will reflect that.

The laptop is a commodities market. So any cost deviation from market is a no starter.

Re:Please do it right!!

[jellomizer]

How many of these ports do you really use? If you are using all of them why don't you save some money and get a desktop?

You can get laptops with all this stuff, but they are big and bulky, and for the most part are not currently popular enough for most mainstream company to sell.

These ports take up space, and they use power even if not being used. Many of these buttons and switches are not hard cutoff items, but asks the OS if it ok to turn this off now. Relying on extra divers to support it.

Re:Please do it right!!

[Anonymous Coward]

I want hardware ports - DisplayPort/HDMI, VGA, 3.5mm audio, RJ45, at least 5 USB sockets, an ExpressCard slot, camera, half decent speakers, a microphone!

I know it's expensive, but Thunderbolt would be pretty cool, too. I assume it works on Linux now, right? In any case, the idea of being able to add an external graphics card sounds like a great way to extend the usefulness of a laptop you'd want to use for playing games on.

I want status LEDs - Capslock, Numlock, Scrolllock, HDD activity, power, charge , Wifi/BT/WWAN status! Something like a ThinkLight or backlit keyboard too!

The lack of decent LED feedback in laptops is truly sad. It barely uses any electricity to light up an LED and how often are you in caps lock, anyway? It's because of the lack of a Caps Lock LED in my past few laptops why I've replaced it with a Hyper key. Out of habit I do that on my desktop systems now, too. Seeing as I do like having a Hyper key, I guess I can't complain too much though... it does make my pinkies hurt more when I shout, though. :)

I want hardware buttons for turning WiFi etc on and off, changing audio volume, muting volume, muting microphone input WITH LED indicators indicating status!

For WiFi I'd prefer a physical on/off switch, not a button.

I want the ability to add an extended battery for longer run-time! Or have 2 batteries!

Swappable batteries would be nice. Carry a spare in your bag, maybe have the ability to swap them out when the system is hibernating.

And a nice keyboard and trackpad, maybe even a trackpoint too!

The keyboard should be mechanical, and the trackpad should FUCKING DIE DIE DIE DIE DIE. Why can't laptops have trackballs? Just a little one I can flick around with my thumb, with a locking/unlocking mechanism that lets me pop out and clean the balls... that sounded wrong.

And modular components so it's easy to take apart to repair, replace fan, add RAM, upgrade HDD/SSD/M2, upgrade WWAN or WiFi module or even MXM card if that is still a thing!

And I want this in a 12-13" form factor that won't crack open if I knock it off the table!

Okay, now you're asking for too much. :)

So what you want is a PC in a 12-13" form factor. I wish that could be a thing, too, but... geez man, how? That's some serious engineering you're talking about there. I can understand replacing and adding the RAM and storage drives, maybe the fans too, but the WiFi module? That's typically just a chip soldered right onto the motherboard, isn't it? I don't know if you can even buy laptop WiFi chipsets off the shelf at computer stores, there'd be no market for it even if they did make it possible.

A better option would be to not include an onboard WiFi chip at all, and just stuff the machine full of a crazy number of USB ports in case you do want to add things like WiFi, Bluetooth, etc. Easier to make a laptop into a hardware-airgapped machine that way, and you could have a system marketable to paranoid people and spies.

Re: Please do it right!!

[jabuzz]

Yes and no. A decade ago now I had the idea that you can for example detect if a cable is plugged in to the ethernet port with a microswitch at the back of the socket that is closed when you physically plug the cable in. No physical cable plugged in, power down the ethernet. You could do something similar for other sockets too, certainly USB both type A and C, as well as SD cards. What other ports do you actually need?

Re: Please do it right!!

[Anonymous Coward]

If I buy the system 76 Intel nuc and screw it into the back of my Chinese tv, all I will need is a robot to fetch beer as I make my couchlife complete.

Durability

[phantomfive]

Does anyone have one of their laptops? How is the durability? I got a Dell laptop recently, and the durability of the case is miserable. There are so many parts made out of plastic, and the hinge is not strong at all. Makes me miss the metal Apple cases (but not the lousy keyboard and weird bar).

Re:Durability

[jercul79]

I recently bought a Gazelle with RAM upgrade. This came to about ~1000$, similar to my low-end gaming laptop from a well known name.

Delivery:
Arrived about 2 weeks after purchase.
Boxed fine.

SW:
It got stuck during installation, I had to hard reset.
Other than that it is typical Ubuntu. (I didn't get pop os)

HW:
Looks stylish
Plastic is flimsy, feels cheap and light.

I did my duty to Linux community and donated money to the cause. I will not buy again, I do not recommend either. I'd rather but another gaming laptop and install ubuntu myself.

I wouldn't write this comment but I am seeing so many ads and "good things" about System76, I had to get it out of me.

Re:Durability

[Anonymous Coward]

I bought a Dell Precision 3520 18 months ago and it is now on its third repair! I will be looking very closely this fall for a system76 laptop!
I work in a data center and the newest Dell servers are total garbage. So far 28% of the new servers are DOA. Amazing
They also messed up the management stuff (iDrac)
The joke around here is that a bunch of micro$oft people are now designing Dell
I know this: I will never buy a 'new' Dell again. I buy older refurb machines - they are still solid!

Re:Durability

[Anonymous Coward]

Have a friend who bought the Gazelle aswell, flimsy plastic and acceptable keyboard but was fine otherwise.
A used ThinkPad is probably the best bet for a Linux laptop nowadays (the new ones are too expensive), but if you really care about Free Software I would probably buy a Purism Librem 13.

Re:Durability

[Anonymous Coward]

They are re-branded Clevo systems - so Sager, Eurocom, Xotic, MALIBAL, ProStar are all clevo resellers.

Re:Durability

[bromoseltzer]

I had that feeling when I got this all-plastic Toshiba Satellite. It replaced an old Sony Vaio that had a metal case. The Toshiba feels "soft", I'll grant, but it has been very reliable. Knock on ... plastic.

Re:Durability

[Luthair]

Metal isn't a good material for laptops, just look at all the macbooks with dented edges.

Re:Durability

[virtig01]

Survivorship bias. The Macbooks may have dented edges, but the plastic laptops have cracked and have been taken out of circulation. You see the dented MBPs because they survived being dropped on the concrete floor by clumsy TSA agents ( /me examines dent on current MBP...).

Re:Durability

[gameguy1957]

I got a 15" Oryx Pro a couple of years ago to replace a 2012 Macbook Pro that was showing its age. The Oryx Pro doesn't feel as solid as the MBP, but it's handled the everyday abuse I put on it over the past two years. It travels in a backpack that's frequently tossed around into the back seat of the car or a chair at the office or house. None of the parts feel loose or worn on it at this point. I guess a bonus that comes from it not having as solid of a feel to it is that it does not show dents and dings like the MBP. Pros: Got it with 32GB of Ram and 2TB SSD storage space for less than the cost of a current MBP (64GB Ram was available at the time). It also has a very nice video and audio card. I got it with a matte screen, which Apple dropped from their linup years ago. Cons: Doesn't jump between network settings as easily as the MBP and only has about two hours of battery life. I still use the MBP for testing wireless setups and it still has a battery life of about four hours on it. Another drawback is that it runs very hot when it's under load.

Re:Durability

[ausekilis]

I bought a Gazelle some 4-5 years ago - it has a 4000 series i7 inside and no dedicated graphics card.

I've installed Fedora and Ubuntu on it, I've run virtual machines, I've developed code, built stuff in Unity 3D, played a handful of games (on lower settings). Overall it has been a very solid laptop and I've not had any problems with it. The battery doesn't live like it used to, but that's always the case over years of use and abuse.

The plastic of the Clevo-built laptop does feel a bit flimsy, but I've never had anything break or crack. The screen still looks crisp and sharp. I've had HP, Toshiba and Dell laptops that basically self-destruct after 2-3 years. Overall, I'd buy System76 again, though next time around I'd get a dedicated graphics card built-in. Intel just doesn't have their act together when it comes to pushing polygons.

Re:Durability

[phantomfive]

: Doesn't jump between network settings as easily as the MBP and only has about two hours of battery life.

Woah.

Re:Durability

[phantomfive]

I'd rather but another gaming laptop and install ubuntu myself.

Which gaming laptop?

Re:Durability

[Anonymous Coward]

That's weird about the install. Personally, I like the cheap and flimsy plastic. I don't like metal. It's heavy, and bulky. It's a computer, not an ornament! Don't get me wrong. I'm not criticizing your opinion. I'm just saying that I liked it myself.

Re:Durability

[Anonymous Coward]

Buy a gaming laptop that weighs as much as a car and heats up like a motorcycle? Why would you want that on your lap?
Look, get an e-gpu instead: https://mymantiz.com/products/mz-02-venus

Re:Durability

[gameguy1957]

To be fair, I did know about the short battery run time before the purchse it, so I have no complaints about it.

Re:Durability

[Anonymous Coward]

The problem with System76's systems are not that some parts get manufactured by Clevo as Clevo manufacturers for EVERYONE. People who are saying System76 is just re-branding are mentally challenged, but the truth is System76 isn't competent to do what needs to be done to put out a line-up of systems that can be properly supported. System76 doesn't need to design a case- which is all this is actually amounting to from what I've heard. They're not actually doing anything of significance here. With Clevo you can select the motherboards and the chips roughly speaking and they haven't even gotten that right. This is why you will find people bitching about 2 hour batteries which should get getting 6-7. This is why you will find that there are support issues with graphics and wireless. Yes- you can find a few people who have purchased systems that work really well- but it was by chance and not by design. System76 is simply throwing out systems that are basically designed for Microsoft Windows- but shipping with Linux. There are much better options from other Linux retailers who actually understand that to get a properly supported system the community has to be in control of the sources. One of the real reasons companies are shipping with "custom" operating systems like Pop! is because they don't know how to design a system that can be properly supported across the board by all distributions. Design it right and every distribution will be able to support it and will support it- and while a given distribution might not have support initially- it will with a future release.

There are probably one of only a handful of companies that have people who are doing things properly and I'm not even saying they do everything well, but just that they understand what it takes to ensure a system can be properly supported. One of them doesn't even ship new systems, but refurbished Lenovos, but with the proper parts, and built off the right chipsets: https://minifree.org/ and another company ThinkPenguin has been successfully getting code released for critical chipsets in different areas that for without them in some cases it would be impossible to even design a properly supported device/system. ThinkPenguin's founder also led the campaign to fight the FCC which undermined our ability to control our wireless routers and devices. He worked on and got a complete set of source code released for ath9k-htc (modern USB wifi chips) and the company supports the only 100% free embedded distribution for routers that you can actually buy hardware with. There are a bunch of other things, but these are a few I am aware of off the top of my head. ThinkPenguin is the company that others in this arena should be looking up to as an example of what to do. They don't do the public relations stunts that System76 does and rarely do they get the attention they deserve for the real work that almost no other companies are doing (though there are a lot of specific individuals who deserve credit). The founder also co-hosts two radio shows and is starting a third www.freedomdecrypted.com that regularly promotes Linux, freedom, privacy, and free software across hundreds of radio stations. Free Talk Live airs 7-days a week from 7-10PM on 200 radio stations across the US, satellite in multiple countries (a few radio stations as well outside the US), and online. And humorously Slashdot has had news stories about Linux adds in years past that ran a handful of times at best- when there is an actual radio show that regularly promotes Linux and free software regularly to ordinary folk.

Re:Durability

[skogs]

I'll stick up for System76 on this one. You say Gazelle, which is only slightly beefier than the ultra portable Galago. You can't complain about 'flimsy cheap and light' on what is essentially a low end laptop with crappy CPU run integrated video. I've had their other laptops and they are fantastic build quality.

You then complain about getting a gaming laptop and doing it all yourself - here is an idea - don't compare a 1700 gaming laptop to an ultra portable. Even the Oryx isn't the mightiest gaming laptop; but I use it as one and honestly was very competitively priced against other manufacturers.

Re:Durability

[pots]

I have a Zareason laptop (System76 competitor) which I'm typing on right now. Also a Clevo rebrand, also feels cheap, etc. Same experience as you really. It might be fairer to judge these companies on their desktops, rather than their laptops, since they have many more options for sourcing those. At least insofar as judging their capability or dedication. Every complaint I have about this is really directed at Clevo.

Consequently, I'm hoping for great things from this factory. I'll keep an eye on it, but for now I'm just planning on avoiding another Clevo.

Color

[Anonymous Coward]

Are they only available in pink?

Nice.

[Qbertino]

Custom built hardware for a thankful niche audience. I like it. System76 has been doing some neat stuff in the Linux Hardware Camp and I wish them well with their new endeavor.

A Taz does not a factory make

[Anonymous Coward]

Really, the only thing I saw in the photos capable of making something was a lulzbot Taz. They've got a long way to go to fill up all that empty manufacturing space with, well, manufacturing equipment.

Slashvertisement

[Anonymous Coward]

Wow, this story seems like nothing more than an ad, especially the writing style. It's like one of those infomercials that pretends to be a news broadcast with a skeptical reporter. How unprofessional.

Re:Slashvertisement

[Luthair]

The submitter also the author, as a spammer he's just trying to get people to click through.

Reality distortion field

[Anonymous Coward]

Woah. Those iPhones must all have a tiny bit of Steve Jobs tissue in them: their RDF is really strong.

Ad, not news

[Anonymous Coward]

"In other words, the company isn't just selling a computer, but an experience too."
"how can you go wrong"
"customer service all-star" ...seriously?

Re:Ad, not news

[m.alessandrini]

Also... They don't build their laptops... (a few lines later)... And they build them in the USA!!! Yeaaaah!!!

Re:Ad, not news

[Anonymous Coward]

They don't NOW. They WILL build in the USA in their brand new factory, which is what the whole summary is all about. Are you on drugs or something?

Linux

[Anonymous Coward]

Never seen another person have /use a Linux computer nor one for sale in any store !!

Re:Linux

[Zobeid]

Thanks for explaining that to us. We are all enlightened by your analysis. :P

More to the point, somebody has been buying computers from System76. They've been in business for years, and they only seem to keep getting bigger.

Not worth it

[Anonymous Coward]

I don't use Linux exclusively I tend to stick with Windows. But seriously, the custom Linux PC's seem really over priced when you factor in the OS is free and there is no licensing fee. Most people I know buy a inexpensive Windows PC that is spec'd out to run a Linux desktop OS and simply goes that route. That System 76 Pop OS is the dumbest ideal yet in Linux desktops. Its a knee jerk reaction to Ubuntu going back to Gnome 3 from Unity and Pop OS is so not what most want in a Linux desktop.

Re:Not worth it

[jellomizer]

I looked at their models and comparing their Oryx Pro with the Dell XPS
You can configure a much more powerful system with the System 76 (Faster SSD) and way more storage options. And still be in the same Price range with the Dell. Windows License cost for most of these systems are often the least of the concerns.

In general if I find a system that is well supported by Linux distributions, they also run very well on Windows Systems. Mostly due to hardware makers making drivers for windows first then for linux. So if Linux has Mature drivers that work well, then the Drivers for Windows are just as good if not better. Making Windows run rather stable.

Re:Not worth it

[Anonymous Coward]

Yes, if you just look at the tech specs. However, the reviews of the Oryx Pro I read all comment on it being BIG and HEAVY. (Especially the humongous power brick, if you're taking it anywhere for extended periods) Also, it has a relatively lousy battery life if you load it up with the high-end graphics/storage options. Laptop price has an inverse correlation with portability to some extent, so if the weight/portability has value to the buyer, it the XPS may be worth the extra price.

I personally would go for the extra features, but others may differ. Thank goodness for competition.

Re:Not worth it

[Gavagai80]

Depends on how much research you're willing to do / capable of doing and how much you value the research time at, and how willing you are to still end up making a mistake. I run Linux exclusively but have always bought cheap Windows PCs to do so. Several times that's come back to bite me with hardware that has no driver, or for which the driver disappears after a time. For example I got a netbook with an Intel graphics chip because I read Intel was the only company with open source 3D drivers at the time... but it turned out Intel GMA 500 was outsourced by Intel to another company and thus closed source. I had specifically verified that it worked with Linux too, which it did... for a while, until I could no longer keep using the one ancient kernel which the binary blob driver worked with. Since then, no 3D acceleration and suspend / hibernate don't work.

Now if they only had interresting products

[Anonymous Coward]

Their smallest one seems to be 13", which is already quite a lot. However that doesn't have an easy to replace battery and is terribly expensive. Considering you can get a Thinkpad X.200 for far less theese days, I don't see anything desirable.

Made by spies.

[Anonymous Coward]

Why would an open-source machine come with spyware?

Re:Made by spies.

[jellomizer]

What does the license of of the software have to do with what the software does?

Heck if I wanted to spy on somewhere a Linux System that comes preinstalled would be a good spot for this.

I have the source code, I can embed the spyware in a vital process (perhaps directly in the kernel itself) compile it and give the executable to be part of the base install. Sure GNU says that you should release the source for all your changes, but if you are going to spy on someone illegally, would the GPL really stop you?

Now you have spywhere on a system, where a number of people trust because it is open source. But they will not check the Complied code to the Source Given to make sure it matches up.

Tailor-made.

[Anonymous Coward]

[T]he space is absolutely massive! It seems System76 has very lofty goals.

Or space is very cheap. You lease what's available.

A long way to go

[Matt_Bennett]

What I saw was open floor space and some tables- small for a "computer factory" tiny if it is also to include warehouse space. A factory requires a massive amount of infrastructure and capital investment. If they are also taking more development on, the amount of test space is significant as well. Commercial rent is not cheap in Denver, nor is the cost of living- I live in Austin, TX- relatively expensive for Texas, and Denver is about 10% higher than here. This is the type of move they need to grow, I'm sure. I hope it works.

Re:A long way to go

[Anonymous Coward]

I've worked at a company that manufactured scientific equipment (ion chromatography systems) in a factory that size. It will most likely be a simple assembly operation, taking mainboards made for them in China out of ESD bags, testing them, screwing them into cases that are also pre-made for them, connecting all the wires and bits then testing before boxing for shipment. I doubt they will be manufacturing the mainboards and cases themselves. It does appear that they will be doing their own design prototyping though. The company I was at had a little over 50 people per shift working 2-3 shifts a day depending on order volume. They would box systems up at the end of the final testing line, place the box on a pallet and then full pallets would be taken over to a small shipping dock to have shipping labels applied and be ready for UPS to pick everything up. Testing was done both before any of the electronic boards were installed (to verify each board worked) and after full system assembly was completed.

Made in America --

[Anonymous Coward]

Spyware guaranteed to be built in. Courtesy of NSA.

I don't think this does much for the appeal or the perceived honesty of System76 to let everyone know their machines are wholly built in the USA.

If other prominent or crucial computer products or softwares from the U.S. get the NSA backdoor-treatment, why wouldn't System76's machines get it?

After all, people buy the machines thinking they are getting a safe and secure Linux machine.

Not so much the case now.

Ubuntu Only

[Anonymous Coward]

" tweaks firmware, and verifies that both Ubuntu and its Ubuntu-based Pop!_OS will work well on the hardware"

This means that the firmware is "tweaked" so that it works with Ubuntu and systemd, even if it breaks compatibility with Linux.

Yes, I just said that Ubuntu isn't Linux. Call me a troll if you like, but if you search your feelings, you know this to be true.

Re:Ubuntu Only

[Anonymous Coward]

The first thing I did when my System76 Wild Dog Performance arrived was flatten the partition table and install Arch Linux.

I have been running this installation for over four years now without any of this "compatibility breaking" you speak of.

You are a troll.

Customer Service All-Star

[bobbutts]

Flag this article as trash written by an idiot.

Better hardware at a lesser price

[Anonymous Coward]

Writing this post from 4 year old System76 laptop. Had some hiccups in the beginning but they serviced it.
Four years ago 16GB ram and i7 4 core/8 threads cpu spec at the price that was still way cheaper than Mac was fantastic!
I constantly run multiple virtual machines and do heavy development and I am quite happy with it.
For my next replacement, I will definitely go with System76. This is the best deal for native Linux laptops for sure.
Thanks System76 and hope you become a company to reckon with!

Yes, another Linux custom distro!

[m.alessandrini]

Just what the world needed!

Re:Yes, another Linux custom distro!

[PrimaryConsult]

If they had gone with Fedora and/or CentOS they could have nabbed a slice of the business market. I have nothing against Ubuntu at all, but TPTB in IT shops will go with RedHat based distros more often than not when purposely ordering something for Linux use.

Not that the OS that comes on it has much bearing. It was quite satisfying the other day taking a brand new server the other day and wiping out the preinstalled Server 2016 to install RHEL 7.

That blonde girl, tho.

[Anonymous Coward]

Man, she's scary looking.

All that pink, too. *shudders*

Re:you insqensitive 3lod!

[Anonymous Coward]

What language was this translated from and what translator did you use?

Buy American!

[Anonymous Coward]

Support racists and climate change deniers.

2076 is the year of the Linux desktop!

[Anonymous Coward]

I expect the tomb slab of Linus Torvalds to have a spare space where you can mount a Linux desktop once its year has arrived.

ubuntu

[bigtreeman]

pity it's ubuntu and not debian