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'No, Amazon Cannot Replace Libraries' (vice.com)

Over the weekend, Forbes published an article titled "Amazon Should Replace Local Libraries to Save Taxpayers Money," in which the author Panos Mourdoukoutas argued that libraries are no longer important to the community as the result of alternative "third places" like Starbucks, and "no shortage of places to hold community events," as well as streaming services like Netflix and Amazon Prime and the rise of e-books that have "turned physical books into collector's items, effectively eliminating the need for library borrowing services." The article did not bode well with many, including several librarians. Forbes has since taken down the article. From a report: Hundreds of Twitter users took to the platform to share both their anger with the piece and their love for libraries. People seemed to especially take issue with the author picking Amazon --notorious for its horrible treatment of employees, and accusations of ruining the cities it opens warehouses in -- as a potential replacement. Obviously, as the outrage from these users demonstrates, libraries are beloved and important in communities.

Mourdoukoutas's argument that libraries are becoming less useful is patently false, in a way that's fairly obvious. But the notion that libraries aren't worth their value to taxpayers -- one that fails to take into account the financial returns of a library and expenses of buying these items on one's own -- fails to address the vast importance a library has on its community as a physical space open to anyone in the public. Most of the utilities of libraries are quite obvious, like how they're essential to lowering the barrier of entry on activities that may be cost prohibitive. But many of us aren't aware of the impact our libraries have on our own communities, nor the programs they offer.

16 of 214 comments (clear)

  1. All the content is available on the Internet, but, by chubs · · Score: 4, Insightful

    All the content is available on the Internet, but that means you have to sift through all the content on the internet. The benefit of libraries is that its curated. You can ask a librarian questions that Amazon's search service can't comprehend. It's the same reason professional conferences are still relevant. You can find everything presented in a conference on the internet, but until it's been presented to you, you don't have a clue what's worth searching for.

  2. Yes Starbucks have replaced libraries. by SuperKendall · · Score: 4, Funny

    Since anyone can now poop there and the WiFi is free, Starbucks are now effectively a library replacement.

    Only one more step remains, Starbucks needs to implement a policy where customers sitting in the shop are required to hand over laptops to homeless to watch at least five minutes of porn when asked.

    --
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    1. Re:Yes Starbucks have replaced libraries. by sgt_doom · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Starbucks is essentially for consumers who don't read books and have no taste in coffees.

  3. Its simple by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Insightful

    If libraries are being used by a lot of people, then they are providing value. If there are little or no people using them, then they are providing little value.

    If certain books haven't been checked out in 20 years, maybe its best to have an on-line version available and kiosks instead of shelves.

    1. Re:Its simple by satsuke · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Libraries act as a backstop to services that have become critical to living in our world.

      e.g. internet access for job search, research, free meeting spaces for students and community groups (sure those can happen in Starbucks, but not everyone has the desire or ability to pay for overpriced coffee), checking out media/movies / documentaries.

      tutoring help, Librarians knowing how to navigate internet searches, old people .. simply holding a book in your hands and reading it.

  4. Books in libraries don't suddenly disappear by Guy+Smiley · · Score: 4, Interesting

    The other important factor with libraries is that books don't suddenly disappear en-masse like they can with a virtual/centrally-controlled commercial entity... People should remember the particularly ironic case of Amazon removing copies of 1984 from everyone's Kindle, as reported in the New York Times and The Guardian.

  5. Re:All the content is available on the Internet, b by Jason1729 · · Score: 5, Informative

    It's not fair to say the content is available on the internnet.

    Much of the content my library offers is in the form of access to very expensive online data services that are offered for free to library patrons. There's well over 100 services I get free at my library. I have free access to Lynda.com which would otherwise cost around $30/month. The city's largest newspaper has an online archive of every page they printed going back to the mid 19'th century. They charge $100/year for access. Or free at the library. And that's only 2 of the services.

    I can borrow just about any new release DVD for free within a month of release date.

    My library offers access to high end 3D printers at a cost of 3 cents/gram. Just order online by uploading your stl files, and pick up at the branch in a few days. And considering I don't have to pay for spoiled prints or babysit a wonky $500 printer, their price is actually fantastic. I haven't used them yet, but they also have a CNC milling machine and vinyl cutting machine that can be used on the same basis.

    They also have a video studio greenroom I can use for free and a music recording studio I can I use for free. I can borrow a gopro camera for free too.

    Oh yeah, I think my library also gives me access to books and magazines for free. I guess, maybe, amazon could help with that one. Though I do take issue with the article saying amazon ebooks can replace real books. I read around 100 books a year, I haven't read an ebook in over 10 years, I didn't like the experience then and I don't think I'd like it now.

    And especially with Amazon. I remember shortly after Kindle came out, they remotely deleted all the George Orwell books people had bought for their kindles when the publisher changed their mind about licensing the books. If I buy a print book, Amazon can't (legally, yet) break into my home and take back the book when they change their mind about selling it. For that reason alone, I will *never* use amazon for ebooks.

  6. ETHICS! by N_Piper · · Score: 5, Insightful

    I will not speak of Amazon's data policies but the ALA to a man, woman, or other will SLAM their fist down upon the drive wipe button if someone comes in thinking their warrant means something. This isn't just a threat, many did as soon as "The Patriot Act" was even being considered.
    http://www.ala.org/aboutala/go...

  7. Small government folks... by The+Original+CDR · · Score: 4, Interesting

    Seems like every community has a group of small government folks that are trying to reduce the size of government. My community has a group that has been trying to shut down the libraries for decades. The latest tactic is to reduce the number of full-time librarains and increase the number of volunteers. Most volunteers are not trained librarians or student librarians.

  8. All the content is NOT available on the Internet by DogDude · · Score: 5, Insightful

    All the content is available on the Internet,

    What in the hell does this mean? Do you know that libraries contain *books* that anybody can read and check out for free? The only books available on the Internet are a handful of 100+ year old out-of-copyright books.

    --
    I don't respond to AC's.
  9. Amazon "could' replace libraries but... by shayd2 · · Score: 4, Insightful

    My problem with this, with ANY internet service replacing paper books, is 1984

    When a book (or as has happened the Declaration of Independence) is prohibited, it could just disappear. Worse, particular words could be dropped or added (say, the word "Not") seamlessly

    Having real books removed or modified is much harder

  10. Re:Isn't this a local decision? by jittles · · Score: 4, Insightful

    I know it's trendy for half the country to force their views on the other half but this is a local decision. If the local population wants to close the libraries that's their choice since they are the ones paying for them.

    I agree. And I want my money back from social security. Oh yeah and I don’t have any children in schools so I want that money back. I walk everywhere I go and therefore interstates don’t benefit me directly so I want that money back as well. I have never had to call the police on anyone, so let’s stop paying for that. I’ve never had to deal with the fire department either, let’s defund that. I mean, you’re forcing your views on what a community needs on me and that’s not fair, right?

  11. Re:All the content is available on the Internet, b by Jason+Levine · · Score: 4, Interesting

    My library has a 3D printer that's free to use. My kids love going there, finding a pattern on Thingiverse, and printing out something. (One day I might even try designing my own pattern.) We use the DVD rentals at our library also as well as audiobooks, events, and so much more. I know people love complaining about taxes, but I'd willingly double the amount of taxes that I pay for my local library. The more resources they have, the more awesome they are, and the more kids will be exposed to the awesome public libraries.

    --
    My sci-fi novel, Ghost Thief, is now available from Amazon.com.
  12. I love libraries by Jason+Levine · · Score: 4, Interesting

    When I was a kid, my local librarians knew me by name. I would come into the library, take out a stack of books, come back a week later, return them, and take out another stack. Now that I'm a father, my boys love going to the library. Yes, there are still books there and they enjoy that, but there are also movies, music, audio books, museum passes, 3D printers, computers, and so much more.

    I'll admit that I like Amazon. Their Prime service is very nice and I like being able to fit thousands of books on my Kindle. Still, they are no library replacement. Not even close. Replacing libraries with Amazon.com would be a travesty.

    --
    My sci-fi novel, Ghost Thief, is now available from Amazon.com.
  13. Re:Isn't this a local decision? by PopeRatzo · · Score: 4, Interesting

    If the local population wants to close the libraries that's their choice since they are the ones paying for them.

    This article has nothing to do with a "local decision". It's the opinion of some Economics professor at a third-rate university that Amazon should replace libraries. It has absolutely nothing to do with "local populations".

    In fact, I would be surprised if you could find a single community that wants to close its public library. Pew Research did a study that showed nearly 90% of people believe that closing the local public library would have a negative effect on their community, with 65% of those people saying it would have a major negative effect.

    Communities love their libraries.

    To summarize: This is not the decision of a local population. There is no indication that any local populations want to get rid of their libraries. It's some academic in a pseudo-scientific field, Economics, which is actually less rigorous than parapsychology, giving his own idiotic opinion. His name is Panos Mourdoukoutas, which sounds like some flaming dish you'd order at the Greek Islands Restaurant on Halsted Street. He's gotten his 15 seconds of fame out of his stupid opinion, which was so bad that Forbes Magazine has deleted it from their site out of sheer embarrassment.

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    You are welcome on my lawn.
  14. It's not about small government by rsilvergun · · Score: 4, Insightful

    they want to pocket the tax money going to the libraries for themselves. They're not small government when it comes to the government contracts going to their business or the subsidies or the free roads or the developed land or anything else the government does that benefits them personally.

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