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'No, Amazon Cannot Replace Libraries' (vice.com)
Over the weekend, Forbes published an article titled "Amazon Should Replace Local Libraries to Save Taxpayers Money," in which the author Panos Mourdoukoutas argued that libraries are no longer important to the community as the result of alternative "third places" like Starbucks, and "no shortage of places to hold community events," as well as streaming services like Netflix and Amazon Prime and the rise of e-books that have "turned physical books into collector's items, effectively eliminating the need for library borrowing services." The article did not bode well with many, including several librarians. Forbes has since taken down the article. From a report: Hundreds of Twitter users took to the platform to share both their anger with the piece and their love for libraries. People seemed to especially take issue with the author picking Amazon --notorious for its horrible treatment of employees, and accusations of ruining the cities it opens warehouses in -- as a potential replacement. Obviously, as the outrage from these users demonstrates, libraries are beloved and important in communities.
Mourdoukoutas's argument that libraries are becoming less useful is patently false, in a way that's fairly obvious. But the notion that libraries aren't worth their value to taxpayers -- one that fails to take into account the financial returns of a library and expenses of buying these items on one's own -- fails to address the vast importance a library has on its community as a physical space open to anyone in the public. Most of the utilities of libraries are quite obvious, like how they're essential to lowering the barrier of entry on activities that may be cost prohibitive. But many of us aren't aware of the impact our libraries have on our own communities, nor the programs they offer.
Mourdoukoutas's argument that libraries are becoming less useful is patently false, in a way that's fairly obvious. But the notion that libraries aren't worth their value to taxpayers -- one that fails to take into account the financial returns of a library and expenses of buying these items on one's own -- fails to address the vast importance a library has on its community as a physical space open to anyone in the public. Most of the utilities of libraries are quite obvious, like how they're essential to lowering the barrier of entry on activities that may be cost prohibitive. But many of us aren't aware of the impact our libraries have on our own communities, nor the programs they offer.
All the content is available on the Internet, but that means you have to sift through all the content on the internet. The benefit of libraries is that its curated. You can ask a librarian questions that Amazon's search service can't comprehend. It's the same reason professional conferences are still relevant. You can find everything presented in a conference on the internet, but until it's been presented to you, you don't have a clue what's worth searching for.
Since anyone can now poop there and the WiFi is free, Starbucks are now effectively a library replacement.
Only one more step remains, Starbucks needs to implement a policy where customers sitting in the shop are required to hand over laptops to homeless to watch at least five minutes of porn when asked.
"There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
If libraries are being used by a lot of people, then they are providing value. If there are little or no people using them, then they are providing little value.
If certain books haven't been checked out in 20 years, maybe its best to have an on-line version available and kiosks instead of shelves.
author Panos Mourdoukoutas argued that libraries are no longer important to the community
kalos malakas eisai kai su.
If AMZN wanted to open 15,000 brick-and-mortar book shops in underserved neighborhoods and small towns... they would be doing so. They aren't, and aren't about to start doing that. Even if some moron writes a think-piece about how nice it would be for them to to that.
The original article from Mourdoukoutas suggesting a corporate book store with wifi, coffee shop, a community bulletin board, bathrooms and chairs for the homeless to sit and read magazines. Hmm... toss in a stupid-hot goth checkout clerk and you've just reinvented my college-era Borders from 2001. Good times. Good times. They kinda went bankrupt with that model, though...
The phrase 'The article did not bode well' *should* mean something like 'The article posed an existential threat' for something (like libraries). Or 'The article portended doom' or 'The article foretold disaster'
I think the writer wanted to say 'The article did not sit well'
Sorry about the word-nazism, but this stuff really grates on me.
I know it's trendy for half the country to force their views on the other half but this is a local decision. If the local population wants to close the libraries that's their choice since they are the ones paying for them.
The other important factor with libraries is that books don't suddenly disappear en-masse like they can with a virtual/centrally-controlled commercial entity... People should remember the particularly ironic case of Amazon removing copies of 1984 from everyone's Kindle, as reported in the New York Times and The Guardian.
It's not fair to say the content is available on the internnet.
Much of the content my library offers is in the form of access to very expensive online data services that are offered for free to library patrons. There's well over 100 services I get free at my library. I have free access to Lynda.com which would otherwise cost around $30/month. The city's largest newspaper has an online archive of every page they printed going back to the mid 19'th century. They charge $100/year for access. Or free at the library. And that's only 2 of the services.
I can borrow just about any new release DVD for free within a month of release date.
My library offers access to high end 3D printers at a cost of 3 cents/gram. Just order online by uploading your stl files, and pick up at the branch in a few days. And considering I don't have to pay for spoiled prints or babysit a wonky $500 printer, their price is actually fantastic. I haven't used them yet, but they also have a CNC milling machine and vinyl cutting machine that can be used on the same basis.
They also have a video studio greenroom I can use for free and a music recording studio I can I use for free. I can borrow a gopro camera for free too.
Oh yeah, I think my library also gives me access to books and magazines for free. I guess, maybe, amazon could help with that one. Though I do take issue with the article saying amazon ebooks can replace real books. I read around 100 books a year, I haven't read an ebook in over 10 years, I didn't like the experience then and I don't think I'd like it now.
And especially with Amazon. I remember shortly after Kindle came out, they remotely deleted all the George Orwell books people had bought for their kindles when the publisher changed their mind about licensing the books. If I buy a print book, Amazon can't (legally, yet) break into my home and take back the book when they change their mind about selling it. For that reason alone, I will *never* use amazon for ebooks.
Libraries are free. Unlike e-books, their books don't need batteries to work. Even if you have a computer, they're also a lot cheaper and friendlier than KinkoFedex for copying and color printing.
And I have two on my walk home from work. Yay for living in a real city! WOOT!
I will not speak of Amazon's data policies but the ALA to a man, woman, or other will SLAM their fist down upon the drive wipe button if someone comes in thinking their warrant means something. This isn't just a threat, many did as soon as "The Patriot Act" was even being considered.
http://www.ala.org/aboutala/go...
I don't know about the libraries in Boston but the libraries in my city are well maintained and definitely get used. Parents with young kids are common visitors along with various groups using the meeting rooms. 60-80% of the computers are typically in use during the afternoon and evening by people of all sorts.
There are people who definitely go there to get work/studying done as opposed to sitting in a starbucks or coffee shop.
I've never seen any old men there playing checkers but I'm sure it happens.
Seems like every community has a group of small government folks that are trying to reduce the size of government. My community has a group that has been trying to shut down the libraries for decades. The latest tactic is to reduce the number of full-time librarains and increase the number of volunteers. Most volunteers are not trained librarians or student librarians.
All the content is available on the Internet,
What in the hell does this mean? Do you know that libraries contain *books* that anybody can read and check out for free? The only books available on the Internet are a handful of 100+ year old out-of-copyright books.
I don't respond to AC's.
So, then, money is all that matters in any societal-level discussion? That's really sad if that's what you think.
I don't respond to AC's.
Among the many, many, many problems with this horrible idea, there is the fact that private companies (such as Amazon and Starbucks) are not obliged to uphold the 1st Amendment to the Constitution. (Whenever unpopular speech is suppressed, for example on a platform like Facebook, the pro-suppression argument always leads off with "It's their platform and they have a right to kick you off it if they don't like your speech").
My problem with this, with ANY internet service replacing paper books, is 1984
When a book (or as has happened the Declaration of Independence) is prohibited, it could just disappear. Worse, particular words could be dropped or added (say, the word "Not") seamlessly
Having real books removed or modified is much harder
Content owners have a natural incentive to see libraries as a way that people can steal their stuff for free. That isn't an accurate description, of course, but that is how content owners see it. Borrowing IS stealing.
So, people in this group, and their sympathizers, level assaults against libraries in which they come up with bullshit reasons to try and convince everyone to get rid of them.
As far as I can tell, that's all this is.
Simply cough up enough money, and in 2 days there it is -- books and shelves and everything!!
(Some sorting and assembly required, building not included.)
If the universe is someone's simulation -- does that mean the stars are just stuck pixels?
I often have difficulty getting a parking space at our local library - its very popular.
My experience is that people who have the misguided opinion that libraries are obsolete haven't used them.
Greed is the root of all evil.
Libaries will vary. Often I find the quality of library varies with how much the community values them willing to spend on them. The library in my former town was basic and sparse and often empty. The library in my current town has modern faculties, computers, etc. They were almost the same size towns.
Well, there's spam egg sausage and spam, that's not got much spam in it.
Superfaggot Ken Doll
I find it interesting that through many years almost no-one has used the "Ken Doll" insult. Perhaps too obvious showing a lack of intelligence or creativity?
But I've also wondered if that doesn't backfire as an insult, since Ken is the most handsome and wealthy of all the dolls. It actually ends up being rather a complement to claim that I am rich, good looking, and date hot blonde women with ultra-smooth skin who have had a lot of work done.
As for "superfaggot" whenever I see that I smile, for all I can think of is "SuperKendall is super-on-fire!!" being really into British spelling. Woo!
So thanks for all that, it's a real lift for the day. :-)
"There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
My library has a 3D printer that's free to use. My kids love going there, finding a pattern on Thingiverse, and printing out something. (One day I might even try designing my own pattern.) We use the DVD rentals at our library also as well as audiobooks, events, and so much more. I know people love complaining about taxes, but I'd willingly double the amount of taxes that I pay for my local library. The more resources they have, the more awesome they are, and the more kids will be exposed to the awesome public libraries.
My sci-fi novel, Ghost Thief, is now available from Amazon.com.
Libraries are more than just a place to get free books.
Libraries have a lot of activities for kids. Small-scale showmen do magic shows, puppet plays, play music, our library has a Minecraft club to discuss creation ideas, methods, mod programming, and a lot of other things.
Our library has a section where students of various ages meet with their tutors.
Some of our nearby libraries have a decent (somewhat expensive, better than the cheapest things) 3d printer, and my son is very interested in learning about that. I like the idea of him learning on that, to see how far such interest goes, before investing in purchasing a machine for home. (and figuring out where to put one and supplies at home vs how often would it be used)
Our library has book clubs and other activities for adults as well.
Can Amazon replace all of that? No. Can Starbucks? Uh, have you ever seen magic shows or plays at a Starbucks? I havent...
I go there to work sometimes (anywhere I have WiFi internet and cellphone signal...) as it's generally quiet, and nearby to activities my son is doing for a while.
Sorry, but I only see benefits to our libraries, and do nto want to see them taken away for the benefit of Amazon and other establishments tha tdo not adequately replace the libraries.
When I was a kid, my local librarians knew me by name. I would come into the library, take out a stack of books, come back a week later, return them, and take out another stack. Now that I'm a father, my boys love going to the library. Yes, there are still books there and they enjoy that, but there are also movies, music, audio books, museum passes, 3D printers, computers, and so much more.
I'll admit that I like Amazon. Their Prime service is very nice and I like being able to fit thousands of books on my Kindle. Still, they are no library replacement. Not even close. Replacing libraries with Amazon.com would be a travesty.
My sci-fi novel, Ghost Thief, is now available from Amazon.com.
When you're trying to plunder the commons that's the way to go.
Yes, some regions are too poor to afford libraries. This is what federal grants are for. If you like science and technology you want a well educated population. A poorly educated population will, sooner or later, collapse and find themselves a dictator who promises to fix things. That never ends well for people who like science and technology. We tend to be considered dangerous when that happens.
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they want to pocket the tax money going to the libraries for themselves. They're not small government when it comes to the government contracts going to their business or the subsidies or the free roads or the developed land or anything else the government does that benefits them personally.
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I'm also talking about Google or Duck Duck Go or whatever your favorite search engine is. Sometimes a librarian can come up with a better set of search terms than you can, or they may know the answer, but that's just because they are a different person. It's isn't necessarily because they are a librarian.
The censorship issue is also not solved by a library. The librarian decides what books to buy and what magazines to subscribe to. They have community members who watch what they do and complain when community standards are violated. The most fascinating lie about censorship I've ever heard came from the mouth of a head librarian. You know, a government official with the power to keep published material out of the hands of the citizens. She denied there was any censorship at the library -- despite being the person most responsible for deciding which books would NOT be made available for free to the public in her county. (Yes, it's not true censorship because anyone can go to the next town over and hope they have the book there, or buy it themselves, but it fits "censorship" a lot better than a lot of things called "censorship" today.)
Libraries that have morphed into "community center" are surviving, bit not for the functions of a library. The number of people accessing the physical books is dwindling as the population ages and old people die. People don't "ask the librarian" as much anymore, especially if the question is in any way embarassing. It is truly better for the impersonal Google to cache your question about sex instead of having your neighbor the librarian knowing about it.
The "makerspace" function is surviving. The "meeting room" function is surviving. The "borrow a DVD so you can rip the content and have a free copy" function is growing. The online books function is growing (free books, by the way.)
And especially with Amazon. I remember shortly after Kindle came out, they remotely deleted all the George Orwell books people had bought
And your local librarian can walk over to the shelf and pull the copies the library has and send them to recycling, too. They pull old stuff all the time and nobody cares, because they need space to put the new books. They choose not to buy certain new books because they don't reflect community values or aren't perceived to be of sufficient interest to merit spending money on them. My "community values" means we gets several copies of Hillary's books and few, if any, of the opposing viewpoint. When I put a hold on "What Happened", or whatever it was called, I was a small number in line on a lot of copies. The same time I put a hold on a pro-Trump book, and I'm number 201 waiting for one copy.
If you think libraries are immune to such things with physical books, remember this. In the mid-50's, if I recall the year right, EVERY LIBRARY COPY of a Bell System Technical Journal had a couple of pages cut out of it. Those pages described the in-band long-distance signalling system that allowed hackers to build blue boxes and made Captain Crunch infamous. I checked. I found a college library that had copies of the journal and sure enough, it was missing those pages.
I didn't like the experience then and I don't think I'd like it now.
A few years ago I went to the library to read the magazines. It was a good experience. They had what I wanted, and they had nice comfy chairs to sit in while doing it. Not long ago I did the same thing. The selection was more limited and the comfy chairs had been replaced with hard-backed uncomfortable things. The place also smelled. (The
Why should the local taxpayers pay for your books and 3D printed gewgaws?
An excellent question. Here's another, why should my tax dollars pay for the education of your children?
I had someone argue with me that the Library of Congress was unconstitutional and a waste of taxpayer money. The library's original purpose was to be a resource for members of Congress, and others in government, so that they might be able to educate themselves on topics that concern the nation. To meet this purpose they kept not just books but also maps and other materials that would meet this purpose. The size of the library grew to a point that it was thought best to open access to the public, and to serve an additional purpose of maintaining a record of copyrighted works. That was my argument for the Library of Congress, to be a store of copyrighted works so that there is a store of what was copyrighted so that the government had a record of what works the copyright was granted. An additional purpose I pointed out for the Library of Congress is to be a store of the laws we are supposed to follow, and other records of importance.
On a local level a library can and should serve a similar purpose as the Library of Congress does on the federal level. A local government is not tasked with enforcing copyrights but every government on every level must keep records for the functioning of the government. It can also be a store of reference material for government employees. The lawmakers should have access to knowledge that concerns the area they govern. Other employees would need information on a variety of topics as well. A county medical examiner might need access to references on various diseases. A city engineer might need access to things like the strengths of materials, materials on how to manage traffic, and topographical maps. Getting to the point on public schools, the teachers and administrators will want to have books of all kinds for educating children.
So, why have a public library? Well, we could have each public school in an area maintain books for the students. The public hospital could maintain a library for their staff. The government might keep a library for it's lawmakers and civil servants. Or, we could consolidate all these materials into a central location, managed by people that specialize in managing large volumes of documents, and as an added bonus open this up to the public so that they can take advantage of this store of knowledge as well.
I'm convinced that governments on every level should keep a public library. I'm not so convinced we need public schools. Private schools, and their students, can take advantage of the works contained in a public library just as well as a public school could. Also, parent could educate his or her own children without the need of a public school so long as there is a public library.
I went to private schools as a kid, and we made regular trips to the library as a class. The schools had their own "library" as well but that was mostly for keeping track of the textbooks and keeping other materials of high demand close at hand. The public library was a resource for the students, teachers, government employees, and the community.
In other words, the public library is there so you can access books and make 3D printed trinkets. Just because you don't see value in it is your problem.
I am armed because I am free. I am free because I am armed.
(One day I might even try designing my own pattern.)
If you have a Windows 10 system kicking around anywhere, you may want to checkout the included "3D Builder" program.
It can import/export STL files and is a surprisingly good 3D design program for being Microsoft born.
I picked up the basic controls and functions within an hour, and after a few hours over a long weekend it no longer felt like I was fighting with 2d input devices in a 3d world.
My first project was to grab an NES cartridge slot lid from thingiverse and modify it for a retropie case mod.
I now have a lid with a hole and screw mounts for a 0.9" LCD, and the i2c wiring within the plastic running back to the hinge, as well as a custom logo cavity on the front.
Editing an existing design made it far quicker with the learning curve required and worked far better than KiCad for me. Perhaps once I get to making things from scratch I'll revisit higher end CAD programs, but for just dinking around to learn it works great.
It might even impress the kids by letting them throw their own little personal touches on an existing design without too much frustration.
GP is not the only poster to point out that "no one uses it" (the library), and go on to detail the few people who hang out there... ...but hang on there!
How does GP know how many people / who uses the library, at any time?
Since the simple answer is often correct I'll posit: They don't know! They're simply having a grumble at what they perceive as another example of government waste (their real beef) whilst having no clue as to what they're talking about.
Unless you're a regular visitor, across all times of day and days of the year, it's not possible to comment on who & how many use the library. And if you are a regular visitor then that puts a lie to any statement that the library is obsolete or unused.
Logic, it's not just for gates!