Slashdot Mirror
Flight-Simulator Enthusiasts Confident of Real-World Skills (wsj.com)
Two anonymous readers share a report: When the ground-services employee who stole a turboprop airliner last week declined air-traffic controllers' piloting advice, saying he had played videogames, it was no surprise to some devotees of intricate home flight-simulation programs [Editor's note: the link may be paywalled; an alternative source wasn't immediately available.]. Such software can mimic many phases of aircraft operations, including takeoffs, as well as how to respond to heavy weather and emergencies, pilots and software makers say. The simulators are also more affordable than pursuing a pilot's license and can help satisfy a lifelong obsession with flying.
Last year, two million units of vehicle-simulation games for PCs and consoles were sold world-wide, the most common being flight simulators, according to the market-research firm NPD Group. Home programs have evolved over more than three decades. They can represent all types of aircraft, from wartime bombers to modern-day passenger airliners. A setup can cost a few dozen dollars for a videogame to thousands for software with intricate renderings of cockpits and real-world environments. A new conference called FlightSimExpo held in Las Vegas in June drew around 1,100 people, its organizers said. FlightSimCon held its sixth annual gathering in Dallas in June, according to its website. Many hobbyists say they don't think of simulators in the same vein as traditional videogames, because they aren't trying to rack up points or compete. They simply focus on flying.
Last year, two million units of vehicle-simulation games for PCs and consoles were sold world-wide, the most common being flight simulators, according to the market-research firm NPD Group. Home programs have evolved over more than three decades. They can represent all types of aircraft, from wartime bombers to modern-day passenger airliners. A setup can cost a few dozen dollars for a videogame to thousands for software with intricate renderings of cockpits and real-world environments. A new conference called FlightSimExpo held in Las Vegas in June drew around 1,100 people, its organizers said. FlightSimCon held its sixth annual gathering in Dallas in June, according to its website. Many hobbyists say they don't think of simulators in the same vein as traditional videogames, because they aren't trying to rack up points or compete. They simply focus on flying.
Not only did he manage to do a few barrels roles, but he really stuck the landing!
"There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
Ok, that may not have worked out so well for this guy, but I'm sure that using guns in games totally carries over, and I'm sure any number of public figures will back me up on this.
When someone says, "Any fool can see
Of course they are useful to non-pilots for training, real pilots train in simulators, especially for practicing the dangerous or simply procedural things. I learned how to fly various IFR approaches, going though the procedures at home instead of paying for flying hours in real aircraft. Saved me a bundle.
However, they do not train you on what it really looks, sounds and feels like when you fly. There is a lot of information you need when flying that comes from the seat of your pants and though the windscreen that is really hard to simulate at reasonable cost at home. Also, it's really hard to accurately simulate the visuals during approach and landing, especially when you get into the ground effect just before touch down. It's just not the same.
"File to fit, pound to insert, paint to match" - Aircraft Maintenance 101
I'm sure people who jack-off a lot to porn think they'd be pretty good at sex, too.
You are welcome on my lawn.
... know perfectly well that stealing someone else's vehicle and taking it for a joy ride is not a thing you should do.
Do you see people worrying over "drive simulators" whenever a kid steals daddy's car and ends up crashing it, usually not too far from daddy's driveway?
He is a snapshot of the state of society. For that hour, he was more free than any of us will ever be.
.. I've cut my instruction hours on real aircraft by more than a half. Way to go!
https://www.avsim.com/forums/topic/540555-flight-sim-enthusiasts-confident-of-real-world-skills-sarah-n-wsj/?page=2&tab=comments#comment-3885629
This is the tower, we have a hot air balloon coming in at MACH 1!
I'm a good cook. I'm a fantastic eater. - Steven Brust
So, people who play on flight simulators really believe they know how to fly a plane?
That's why this guy went SPLAT!.
Idjits are too dumb to know they're idjits.
And played flight simulator in my room.
Where is control-g on the instrument panel?
I'm a "mid-range" flight sim enthusiast (I have a hotas and headtracker, no. VR or customized chair, about 600hrs in fsx/fsw/il2/dcs). I'm 99% sure I could take a small plane for a spin (take off, fly according to flight plan, land) with minimum assistance under ideal conditions. By that I mean - day, nice weather, calm wind, smaller airport that's not busy, no stress and someone who can take over if I start panicking or making wrong decisions. As my middle age crisis I'm probably gonna a get an ultralight and a pilot license.
I think the point being made is that the guy had true freedom for a short period to do what he wanted to do. Freedom has MANY problems. As a commentary on the society, there are multiple ways one could interpret the posting.
It says something about our society that sad people like that think they can do such things; after all, they are free from consequences once they no longer fear death. Imagine what many people would do if there were no consequence? If you had the power of god... what would you do? Most people would end up doing some really bad stuff after a while... arguably it would only be a matter of time. I see it as more of a human issue than society; but differences in society will only impact the odds of such things happening.
Democracy Now! - uncensored, anti-establishment news
I play racing sims, and while they help in simply having a head start on knowing a course, in no way do they prepare you for all the physical experience of actually driving a vehicle.
That only gets you so far. I've flown in a few different varieties of light aircraft and had a chance to "take the controls" several times and have been able to manage to keep the plane level, do basic turns, etc with no issue. One of the people who took me up for one of the flights remarked that I was doing better than the expected for a full novice and I mentioned that I'd used a lot of flight sims/sim-ish games and the basic skills seemed to translate fine.
That said - these flights were in a small aircraft with basic controls, at relatively low speed in uncrowded airspace, and on days with calm, near perfect weather. Under those conditions I would expect anyone who can drive a car could fly those types of plane in a straight line or a gentle turn with very little coaching. I would NOT expect that they would be able to land easily without someone experienced sitting idle at the controls right next to them talking them through the process. Also on flying in a straight line, add any inclement weather or heavy turbulence to the mix and the novice will probably commit some sort of fatal mistake not long after.
So yeah, getting the plane in the air under good conditions isn't really hard. It's the stuff that comes after getting it up there that is where the issue lies.
Hmmmmm...I've done many simulations of sex with stewardesses online. I think I will be good at it too!
(-1: Post disagrees with my already-settled worldview) is not a valid mod option.
Hopefully, this will drive the point home to anybody else who might consider attempting to fly an aircraft with only simulator experience.
The experience depends heavily on the quality of the simulator. Airline pilots who have trained on a new aircraft will fly it for the first time with only simulator experience on it. Of course they train on commercial simulators which are quite a bit more realistic than what your home PC can manage and they have to pass rigorous tests on the simulator. Nevertheless, they initially fly with only simulator experience of the plane.
I doubt that pilotless passenger aircraft will become a reality for a long time yet. Having a highly trained human onboard whose survival depends on landing the plane safely is a great thing to have when dealing with the unusual situations associated with emergencies.
I've noticed a dangerous trend, far beyond this ... heck, people seem to think they can learn any skill just from YouTube videos, not just simulators.
(Now some skills, you can - e.g. HTML, PHP, whittling a moose from a block of wood, etc. Or some people can, anyway. I wouldn't want to take the chance on "piloting an aircraft", though.)
The coolest flight simulator with the steepest learning curve is without a doubt Falcon BMS.
It doesn't have to be like this. All we need to do is make sure we keep talking.
When I decided to become a commercial helicopter pilot, I first spent a few months reading books and practicing in Microsoft flight simulator and X-plane. ...it was an effortless transition. In fact, flying a helicopter IRL is way easier because you can rely more on proprioception.
On my first day of flight school, the instructor gave me the controls and I could fly. End of story.
I never went through the rodeo
The flight school thought I was an undercover FAA inspector doing a safety audit.
And this is not wanton self aggrandizement- anyone can do this...its how I started teaching MY students, and it works like a charm...its also dirt cheap.
I have used simulators back as far as I can remember. They all have their flaws and the worst is that a real airplane behaves a bit different then a simulator in some situations. But more disturbing about this is how easily a person can gain access to a aircraft and how easy it is to learn to fly one in the privacy of your own home. When it comes to terrorism this is proof we need more control over aircraft.
I think people preparing for Driving License exams/tests would really appreciate a 3d game company making an advanced car/truck driving simulation (under all kinds of different road, traffic, weather etc conditions).
I think it is really odd that there is such a big need for such simulation software and yet no company making it!!!
Itâ(TM)s time to ban flight simulators!!
s/Flight-Simulator/Porn/
If any part of that YouTube channel qualifies as "training", then there's a problem somewhere.
That's one way to simulate catastrophic failure.
Non paywalled version:
https://www.avsim.com/forums/topic/540555-flight-sim-enthusiasts-confident-of-real-world-skills-sarah-n-wsj/?page=2&tab=comments#comment-3885629
They won't necessarily make you a good pilot, and they'll never make you an experienced pilot. But you can learn to pilot a plane on a sim, and even reduce the odds of killing yourself down to below 50%.
And having been in the pilot seat of a 30-year-old 747 simulator I can tell you that was ultra-realistic which is why hours in them count as hours flying the real thing.
By the way, putting a 747 into a dive from 10,000 feet because you approached the runway too high doesn't work just in case someone wants to try it in real life.
https://home.flightgear.org/ - no need to spend a dime on software.
Before spending any cash, try the F/LOSS stuff first. FlightGear integrates with the world-wide ATC everyone uses already.
FlightGear is cross platform, but why would anyone choose to use an inferior platform?
There has never been a more clear indication when government intervention is necessary. We simply cannot continue to allow such realistic flight simulators to be sold by anyone who wants to make one. Realistic flight simulator software should be regulated and limited to use by flight schools and licensed pilots. Entertainment flight simulators do not need to use real physics or mimic real flight controls or operations. It's as simple as that.
If you take real simulator enthusiasts, then yes they could fly the plane on a regular non-complicated flight, ATC communication and weather prediction included. These X-planes simulators are super realistic, including the whole checklist before take-off etc...
They know all the switches, all the procedures, but I'm talking about the die-hard fans here. Just check youtube for some regular flights, these dudes ain't "just playing a game".
Anecdote. I started taking lessons to get my license after thousands of teenage hours spent in flight simulators. Sitting in the plane I felt like I'd been there before. Even the ATC calls, courtesy of radio chatter mods, were as I expected. The first lesson was great. We flew around and saw where I lived from the air, all cool stuff.
It's time to go back and the instructor asks if I can find my way back. I said yes, tuned the GVE VOR and started flying to the radial back to KCHO. I explained what I was doing and then he asked why I was doing it. I said "It's the only way I can find the airport."
He shook his head and said "look out the window". Sure enough, there it was near the horizon. Big green spinning light staring at me.
Derp derp. That was the bad thing for me. I never could get used to flying and looking out the window. :/
If people want to get in a huff, a truck/construction vehicle simulator would be great for jihadi training for killdozers and VBIED's, though we have yet to see an actual terrorist train hijacking where they could control the train though...
usually works
outline.com has you covered. https://outline.com/https://www.wsj.com/articles/flight-simulator-enthusiasts-confident-of-real-world-skills-1534446556
So he's in a commercial grade turbo prop aircraft that's empty and he can do some tricks. He can do them because it is that type of aircraft and it is empty. Let him try that with a full aircraft, or with a small plane. He would have broken the plane.
Not impressed. Reminds me of the barefoot bandit from a few years ago. Just another criminal.