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Australia Bans Huawei, ZTE From Supplying Technology For Its 5G Network (techcrunch.com)

Posted by BeauHD on from the national-security dept.

An anonymous reader quotes a report from TechCrunch: Australia has blocked Huawei and ZTE from providing equipment for its 5G network, which is set to launch commercially next year. In a tweet, Huawei stated that the Australian government told the company that both it and ZTE are banned from supplying 5G technology to the country, despite Huawei's assurances that it does not pose a threat to national security. Earlier today, the Australian government issued new security guidelines for 5G carriers. Although it did not mention Huawei, ZTE or China specifically, it did strongly hint at them by stating "the Government considers that the involvement of vendors who are likely to be subject to extrajudicial directions from foreign government that conflict with Australian law, may risk failure by the carrier to adequately protect a 5G network from unauthorized access or interference." In its new security guidelines, the Australian government stated that differences in the way 5G operates compared to previous network generations introduces new risks to national security. In particular, it noted the diminishing distinctions between the core network, where more sensitive functions like access control and data routing occur, and the edge, or radios that connect customer equipment, like laptops and mobile phones, to the core. Huawei Australia said in a statement: "We have been informed by the Govt that Huawei & ZTE have been banned from providing 5G technology to Australia. This is a extremely disappointing result for consumers. Huawei is a world leader in 5G. Has safely & securely delivered wireless technology in Aust for close to 15 yrs."

36 of 77 comments (clear)

  1. Any Evidence?? by pablo_max · · Score: 3, Insightful

    I have heard a lot of people screaming about these two companies, but so far, no one has produced any evidence of wrong doing. At least not that I have read about.

    Is this just cold war scaremongering or is there actually something behind it.

    It seems like a political statement more than anything. Perhaps some protectionism for other network infrastructure providers. Huawei has dominated in LTE. It is actually hard to find a network configuration that is not Huawei at the moment.

    1. Re: Any Evidence?? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      It is wise to not blindly trust a company that is based in the morally loose fascist communist country of China.

    2. Re:Any Evidence?? by benjfowler · · Score: 1

      Sounds like Russia.

      NO EVIDENCE! Ree reee reeee!!

    3. Re:Any Evidence?? by jonwil · · Score: 5, Informative

      The problem is that the laws in China are such that at any time China could order Huawei or ZTE to use their installed gear to provide backdoors into western telecommunications networks. And if they say no all their top people will end up in the Chinese version of Federal Pound me in the A** Prison (which probably makes the US version look like a 5 star hotel) or in front of a firing squad.

      The western governments don't want to allow gear into their networks that could be opened up to the Chinese government and their version of the NSA at any time because (for reasons I cant understand) they think the Chinese care about what us Aussies are doing on our phones (anyone sending anything classified, sensitive, commercially valuable or otherwise worth stealing is going to be encrypting it or not using public 5G networks at all so I dont get what the Chinese are supposedly going to be able to steal if they have these backdoors)

    4. Re: Any Evidence?? by Nadir · · Score: 2, Insightful

      As opposed to the morally loose fascist country of the United States of America.

      --
      --
      The world is divided in two categories:
      those with a loaded gun and those who dig. You dig.
    5. Re:Any Evidence?? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      The problem is that the laws in China are such that at any time China could order Huawei or ZTE to use their installed gear to provide backdoors into western telecommunications networks.

      Bah, the fucking PATRIOT Act allows the same goddamned thing.

      So why would anybody else in the world trust US technology any more than Chinese technology?

      Are we supposed to take on faith that America aren't assholes? Because I see no reason to believe that.

    6. Re: Any Evidence?? by Austerity+Empowers · · Score: 1

      I am very certain that the USA does do this. So you have to decide who you want to spy on you, or roll your own (in which case, you will certainly add your own backdoors!).

      I would rather be spied on by Europe/Australia than China, if anything Europe stays closer to their ideology and would make a good watchdog. China pretty much wants the same evil they do in their own country.

      I think it's clear nobody wants to be spied on by Russia.

    7. Re: Any Evidence?? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful

      American companies arenÃ(TM)t partly owned by the government.

      Correct. Here in the United States, the government is owned by the American companies.

    8. Re: Any Evidence?? by Megol · · Score: 1

      â(TM)idiotâ(TM).

  2. we only let america spy on us by redback · · Score: 4, Insightful

    We don't want china to spy on us, we only let america do that.

    1. Re:we only let america spy on us by benjfowler · · Score: 3, Funny

      Yep. Because everyone spies. But the Americans are 100% friends to the hilt, and the Chinese are competitors, if not adversaries.

      It's highly disingenuous to equate authoritarian kleptocracies like Russia and China with civilised Western countries. Don't do it.

    2. Re: we only let america spy on us by ChunderDownunder · · Score: 1

      Australia has been in lockstep with the USA on national security for decades thanks to ANZUS. So we'll play by their rules, particularly as there's an American military intelligence base near Alice Springs. Assuming Pine Gap uses some sort of terrestrial communications in addition to satellite then Huawei and ZTE might pose a threat to US security if deployed in Australia.

      But the Aussie government hasn't yet tried to ban ZTE nor Huawei phones.

    3. Re: we only let america spy on us by benjfowler · · Score: 1

      Australia has shown huge balls to stand up to China, which is commendable. They are going toe-to-toe with the Communist thugs in a way that America has yet wouldn't dream of.

      It's effective. And we know, because of the shrill screams of 'WAAAAYCISSS' coming out of CCP mouthpieces like the Global Times. The grubby mainlanders always play the race card when they're losing :-D

    4. Re:we only let america spy on us by lrichardson · · Score: 1

      Yep, kinda like the NSA hacking into Petrobras, and the data somehow finding its way to Halliburton, while the former CEO was veep ... Pretty sure the official response, when the Snowden papers came out, was along the lines of 'Oh noes, we would *nevah* do industrial spying, is only fer NATIONAL SECURITY! hehehehe '

    5. Re:we only let america spy on us by glowworm · · Score: 1

      But the Americans are 100% friends to the hilt

      I guess it all depends on if one believes the CIA "stole" Harold Holt, or the Chinese "stole" Harold Holt.

      As for 100% friends, nah. 80% at most. The USA would have no qualms in informing the sitting PM of the week about the dirt they hold on him so they get their way with B2 bombers in Darwin and spy stations near Alice.

      --
      Orationem pulchram non habens, scribo ista linea in lingua Latina
  3. The banned companies don't concern me by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

    I'm more concerned about the companies which the government approves.

    BTW: this is the same government that less than a week ago proposed laws that would be more suitable in former East Germany.

    Also, the same government which, a couple of years ago, required telecoms carriers log all data for 2 years. (At least /. is now SSL.)

  4. Why not Cisco? by ArhcAngel · · Score: 4, Insightful

    How many back doors have discovered in Cisco switches and routers in the last year? If you don't know they are in double digit territory.

    --
    "A person is smart. People are dumb, panicky dangerous animals and you know it." - K
    1. Re:Why not Cisco? by scdeimos · · Score: 1

      You should have a browse through the CERT database some time. Last time I checked (earlier this year) there were over 360 advisories for hard coded credentials in Cisco products - and each advisory typically mentions multiple products.

    2. Re:Why not Cisco? by benjfowler · · Score: 1

      Sure. After all, authoritarian kleptocracies like Russia and China are completely morally equivalent to the Western countries. Totally.

    3. Re:Why not Cisco? by Puls4r · · Score: 1, Troll

      Whatabout whatabout whatabout. Nice deflection. We're talking about Chinese products supply critical US infrastructure. Trying to change the topic to talk about US companies doesn't address the point at all - it just tries to redirect the conversation. Short version: we MUST not allow foreign nation-state corporations to supply critical US infrastructure.

    4. Re:Why not Cisco? by ArhcAngel · · Score: 1

      I knew it was high...but WOW! I was just referencing all the ones found and reported on in just the last 12 months.

      --
      "A person is smart. People are dumb, panicky dangerous animals and you know it." - K
    5. Re:Why not Cisco? by ArhcAngel · · Score: 1

      I believe the conversation was about Australia. But nice deflection.

      --
      "A person is smart. People are dumb, panicky dangerous animals and you know it." - K
    6. Re:Why not Cisco? by thegarbz · · Score: 1

      You don't understand. It's okay as long as a Chinese person isn't spying on us. America is an "ally"

    7. Re:Why not Cisco? by jabuzz · · Score: 2

      I got as far as 1801-1805 "First Barbary War". Right so America decides to go to war with a bunch of real high seas Pirates that where also busy raiding the coastline of Europe and kidnapping people for slaves.

      From Wikipedia; The cause of the U.S. participation was pirates from the Barbary States seizing American merchant ships and holding the crews for ransom, demanding the U.S. pay tribute to the Barbary rulers.

      So yes America and later Britain where wholey morally justified in giving them a through pasting. Noting that to finally put an end to their practices European powers had to occupy north Africa, something north African's in the 21st century seem reluctant to admit too. You got colonized by Europeans because you where a bunch of evil bastards who would not leave us alone, and that is the truth of it.

    8. Re:Why not Cisco? by Puls4r · · Score: 2

      Ok. I admit I laughed. But the message should remain the same for any sovereign country. Don't let foreigners run your critical infrastructure. It's a disaster waiting to happen.

    9. Re:Why not Cisco? by Megol · · Score: 1

      The one holding the leash is never an ally.

  5. Precautions ? by spinitch · · Score: 1

    It might be over blown now but if trade tensions rise then having critical equipment supplied by a potential adversary conceivably seems riskier. Then limit to a secondary supplier for which can still help overall competition and price. Politics and xenophobia playing its part too.

  6. Remaining competitors by Luckyo · · Score: 4, Informative

    If I remember 2017 numbers right on mobile infrastructure market, Huawei was the biggest with just below 30% of global market, with Ericsson right on its heels, followed by Nokia that had slightly below 25% and ZTE at below 15%. And Huawei's market share was growin while Ericsson's and Nokia's were shrinking.

    This is going to be another big win for Ericsson and Nokia it seems, following the similar trend in US recently.

  7. Just helping out our Chinese friends by hyades1 · · Score: 1

    'Huawei stated that the Australian government told the company that both it and ZTE are banned from supplying 5G technology to the country, despite Huawei's assurances that it does not pose a threat to national security at the moment ."

    Fixed that for ya, Huawei!

    You're welcome

    --
    I've calculated my velocity with such exquisite precision that I have no idea where I am.
  8. Who fills in the gap? by reanjr · · Score: 1

    So, are they going to rely on domestic suppliers or are they going to rely on American suppliers? Cause if it's American suppliers, I've got some news for you regarding government backdoors...

    1. Re: Who fills in the gap? by Traxton · · Score: 1

      Swedish company Ericsson has all the gear they could ever want to buy when it comes to 5G or any other mobile communication infrastructure.

  9. evidence from cisco by johnjones · · Score: 1

    well here is a pretty blatant copying

    https://blogs.cisco.com/news/huawei-and-ciscos-source-code-correcting-the-record

    but hey using google is hard...

  10. adjust your figures by johnjones · · Score: 1

    Huawei and ZTE switching equipment numbers are heavily skewed by their home market i.e. selling into the chinese government

    Nokia and Ericsson are rightly seen as neutral compared to american firms

    1. Re:adjust your figures by Luckyo · · Score: 1

      First this isn't about switching equipment but radio towers and entirety of infrastructure. The actual switching hardware in that is typically done by 3rd party hardware afaik, outside some critical elements. The value addition these companies produce comes from everything else related to having the actual infrastructure. Everything from radio beam forming at the tower antenna to network coherence as a whole.

      And numbers wise, while true, this is fairly irrelevant in this scope. Chinese are not going to stop favouring home grown corporations, and their market is likely to stay at least as big as it is today for foreseeable future, even if it doesn't grow. So this portion of the market is theirs to hold, while this market remains relevant to everyone else, as Ericsson and Nokia are in fact supplying infrastructure to China and do hold a sizable chunk of the market. Which is, as you note, much smaller than their worldwide average due to locals favouring local producers.

  11. Good for Australians by w1zz4 · · Score: 1

    Should have somethings like that when one of our dumb project manager decided to buy a shitload of Huawei DWDM NE. We had to isolate all the Huawei DWDMs last year because government here refuse that their data transit on those abberation.

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