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Rideshare Boycott Sparked By Murders In China (theatlantic.com)

Following a string of murders by drivers of China's top ridesharing app, Didi Chuxing, users are deleting the app in large numbers and calling for others to boycott the service. According to The Atlantic, "the hashtag #BoycottDidi on Weibo has garnered more than 1 million views." From the report: Over the weekend, the driver confessed to local police to raping and stabbing his 20-year-old passenger on her way to a friend's birthday party. The murder is the second in three months -- this May, a young flight attendant was killed by her Didi driver. It is the third in a year -- last May, according to Caixin Global, another woman was strangled and killed by her driver. And it is the fourth in two years -- the year before that, a female teacher was robbed and killed after threats from her driver.

"As a platform, we have disappointed the public's trust in us and cannot shirk this responsibility," Didi said in a statement, admitting to failing to react quickly to another passenger's complaint filed against the driver the day before the murder. The rideshare company has suspended its Hitch services (as it did after the last murder) and fired two senior executives, one in charge of Hitch, its intercity carpooling service, and the other in charge of customer service. The Didi president, Jean Liu, oft-regarded as a hero for Chinese women in business, issued an apology on Tuesday. China's government is now cracking down on reform across the transportation sector.

38 of 76 comments (clear)

  1. They allowed drivers to rate passengers appearance by Ritual · · Score: 5, Interesting

    I heard that the problem came down to drivers being allowed to add notes to each customers profile of how attractive they were. Predator drivers would then selectively choose passengers based on their appearance score, and then rape them. After it happened the first few times the company did not make any changes to their app, and I guess it started to become a repeat problem. Something tells me because its China that there are probably a lot more rapes and murders that don't get reported on because of the whole cultural thing of trying to keep up appearances. I don't know how much rape and sexual assault occurs in China, but it must be pretty bad if this started a rebellion against the company because that in itself is pretty rare in a country like China. Usually dissent is not something allowed.

  2. Why only in China? by sad_ · · Score: 1

    never crossed my mind, that ridesharing could bring you in contact dangerous people like rapists and murderers, which was perhaps naive of me.
    however, i wonder why this is such a big problem in China, i never hear about uber rapes/murders in US/EU.

    must admit that i've never used these services, so can somebody explain how they prevent these things from happening?

    --
    On a long enough timeline, the survival rate for everyone drops to zero.
    1. Re:Why only in China? by blindseer · · Score: 1

      however, i wonder why this is such a big problem in China, i never hear about uber rapes/murders in US/EU.

      I've heard of rapes and murders related to Uber, taxi services, and the like, before in the USA. It's usually the driver that's the victim though. You can run the drivers through a background check but the passengers then become the unknown factor.

      It's not like background checks are infallible. I've heard of people passing background checks only to buy guns and shoot up schools and churches. I've seen outright criminal behavior, or just plain creepy behavior that might not technically be illegal, by police, fire, teachers, military, and so on that passed background checks. Even so a background check will reduce repeats of bad behavior.

      Oh, and often I hear people mocking the USA on its high prison population. Well, the tendency for the USA to put criminals in prison, and keep them there for a while, might be why such incidents are rare. Think about that.

      must admit that i've never used these services, so can somebody explain how they prevent these things from happening?

      They learned to do criminal checks on people after some drivers were caught molesting women. I recall reading about at least one of these incidents on Slashdot before. My guess is that in the USA young women are able to easily obtain OC spray, knives, handguns, stun guns, and other tools of self defense with relative ease, and the low life scum that might consider taking advantage of these women think twice before trying anything.

      It appears that Uber and Lyft ban passengers and drivers from being armed but there's no real way to enforce that. My guess is that the low life scum know this as well.

      --
      I am armed because I am free. I am free because I am armed.
    2. Re:Why only in China? by cascadingstylesheet · · Score: 3, Insightful

      never crossed my mind, that ridesharing could bring you in contact dangerous people like rapists and murderers, which was perhaps naive of me. however, i wonder why this is such a big problem in China, i never hear about uber rapes/murders in US/EU.

      Is it a big problem?

      It is the third in a year

      How big is this rideshare service in China? How big is China? What is the murder rate overall? What is the murder rate from taxi drivers?

      I mean, it might be a big problem (relative to other problems; obviously all murder is a problem). It would take some context to know if it is though.

    3. Re:Why only in China? by Narcocide · · Score: 1

      I seem to recall India having serious issues with this too though...

    4. Re:Why only in China? by dryeo · · Score: 1

      Your guesses don't cover the EU or other places like Canada that don't have such high prison populations and women aren't usually armed.

      --
      https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inverted_totalitarianism
    5. Re:Why only in China? by tlhIngan · · Score: 1

      Oh, and often I hear people mocking the USA on its high prison population. Well, the tendency for the USA to put criminals in prison, and keep them there for a while, might be why such incidents are rare. Think about that.

      Except they aren't. The US murder rate is amongst the highest in the world (as is the suicide rate), especially in the big cities. Compare it with other western nations, even Canada (who is probably the closest culturally to the US) and obviously something is wrong.

      The prison population is large because most offenders in there are nonviolent ones, tossed in jail because of war on drugs and the like, coupled with a for-profit prison system ensuring that the more you house, the closer the CEO gets to this next new yacht/plane/mansion/etc.

      There are places where the rate is lower. Some are authoritarian like Singapore, where dealing drugs is an instant death penalty (and if you're cynical, so is speaking out against government or "disrupting law and order').

    6. Re:Why only in China? by ewibble · · Score: 1

      What nonsense of course they have a moral code, it maybe different but they have one.

      Here are the stats (wikipedia) on murder for china 0.62 per 100,0000 people the USA is 5.35 per 100,0000.

      Just because their morals don't match yours does not mean they have none. Based on the statistics and not your personal biased opinion (since everyone's opinion is biased) you could argue that the US has much less morals than China. Assuming your moral code says murder is bad.

    7. Re:Why only in China? by Highdude702 · · Score: 1

      Agreed. I have been to prison, for a violent crime. I did my time I learned my lesson. However I met a lot of people that should not have been to prison. One instance is a celly I had that happened to be a Limo/Taxi driver, he occasionally did meth. He got divorced from his wife before that happened(or so he says, there's a saying you can look it up). He was in a custody battle, and his ex wife found out about him doing drugs. He got drug tested and failed, The child was out of state, He had a shitty lawyer(who probably had backroom deals set up) and convinced him to take some plea deal over it saying he was only gonna get probation. He ended up with a 14-30 month(Give or take, in Nevada they do a 40%/100% front number structure) sentence. His conviction was "Child Endangerment".

    8. Re:Why only in China? by Highdude702 · · Score: 1

      True, the scummy rat gangsters would though.

    9. Re:Why only in China? by Highdude702 · · Score: 1

      Yes people do crazy shit. Especially people with a lot of time on their hands(Uber drivers and the such).

    10. Re:Why only in China? by Highdude702 · · Score: 1

      Yep, How the world has changed...

  3. As a free market capitalist... by blindseer · · Score: 1

    This is the kind of outcome I would expect in an unregulated industry. That doesn't mean we need government involvement, but it does mean some kind of assurance to the customers of a product that is safe.

    I remember a short anecdote of a vegetable farmer being interviewed on the topic of government inspectors. He said the government inspectors he could handle, it was the inspectors from the restaurants and grocers that were brutal. Where's the equivalent on this new trend in taxi services? Is there a way to check on the drivers beyond a checkbox on the app on not being murdered on the way to one's destination?

    What is just maddening about this was the comment in one of the articles on how we shouldn't have to expect women to defend themselves but instead expect men to not abuse women. Well, sorry folks, that's simply not going to happen. People will have to be able to defend themselves, men and women, because not everyone looks at the social contract on good behavior with the same eyes. Should men behave themselves? Absolutely. When (not if) one of them don't then they should expect a face full of OC spray, a few grams of lead sent at great speed into vital organs, a several thousand volt surprise, or some other means to deter their crimes. Just knowing that such defensive measures are possible have a deterrent effect on their own.

    I do see free market forces at work. If this company can't get it's act together and make people feel safe using their services then I can expect them to go out of business. If you want a cheap ride then you can take your chances with a company that doesn't check out their drivers before sending them to pick you up.

    --
    I am armed because I am free. I am free because I am armed.
    1. Re:As a free market capitalist... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      After enough murders and rapes people will stop using the service (as they are now) - the free market works!

    2. Re:As a free market capitalist... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Meanwhile, in the US, we are attempting to prevent women under 21 from obtaining firearms and concealed carry permits.
      I'll leave it up to you to figure out why some people think that is a good idea.

    3. Re:As a free market capitalist... by 110010001000 · · Score: 1

      "Unregulated" taxi services do as much vetting of their drivers as regulated ones do: not much.

    4. Re:As a free market capitalist... by cascadingstylesheet · · Score: 3, Interesting

      I do see free market forces at work. If this company can't get it's act together and make people feel safe using their services then I can expect them to go out of business. If you want a cheap ride then you can take your chances with a company that doesn't check out their drivers before sending them to pick you up.

      I do wonder about these stories ... I mean, murder is obviously already illegal.

      Do taxi medallions have some special anti-murder properties, to make regular taxis safer than these services?

    5. Re:As a free market capitalist... by blindseer · · Score: 1

      I do wonder about these stories ... I mean, murder is obviously already illegal.

      And people do illegal things. When it comes to women getting abused and murdered it may be wise for women to protect themselves against law breakers. I suggest getting one of those noise makers that can get people's attention. I understand Smith and Wesson makes a nice one, called the "LadySmith". It can carry 5 noise making cartridges in a compact and simple to operate device. It's not exactly cheap but I have seen it get very good reviews.

      Do taxi medallions have some special anti-murder properties, to make regular taxis safer than these services?

      Yes, and no. Nothing "magical" about them but the government that issues them will keep an eye on the owners, and the people that own the medallions aren't likely to be fly by night losers that kill their passengers. This is merely one means to offer oversight and market forces to keep getting from one place to another safer.

      What's happened is that we're seeing a kind of battle between old taxi services and new business models that provide much the same services. Both will have to adapt to compete and we will all benefit from it.

      --
      I am armed because I am free. I am free because I am armed.
    6. Re:As a free market capitalist... by dryeo · · Score: 1

      This is the kind of outcome I would expect in an unregulated industry. That doesn't mean we need government involvement, but it does mean some kind of assurance to the customers of a product that is safe.

      I remember a short anecdote of a vegetable farmer being interviewed on the topic of government inspectors. He said the government inspectors he could handle, it was the inspectors from the restaurants and grocers that were brutal. ...

      The government inspectors are probably looking at health concerns such as bacteria, easy to pass by being clean, whereas the grocers etc are probably looking for blemishes, size and colour, something harder to pass. The free market often decides that looks are more important then other things and the same thing is likely to happen with ride sharing, more important to have a nice car and be clean cut and not look like a criminal. Things like this boycott will hopefully change what they inspect for.

      --
      https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inverted_totalitarianism
    7. Re:As a free market capitalist... by sarren1901 · · Score: 1

      You don't really think the medallion holder is actually DRIVING the car do you? Get real. The owner is just that. The owner. They pay some slob to drive and then rake in most of the profits.

    8. Re:As a free market capitalist... by ewibble · · Score: 1

      Yes because the moment a woman feels threatened by you she has every right to turn around and shoot you.

      Guess what when more people walk around with weapons everybody is less safe.

      If you are a rational thief and you think the person you are robbing has a gun you shoot them, if you think they are unarmed you let them live because its less of a crime.

      Same with rape, if you think the person are raping may have weapon, and you are more likely to get a weapon and use it if you feel threatened, you clearly don't care about the person you are raping

    9. Re:As a free market capitalist... by Highdude702 · · Score: 1

      Sorry, I used to rob drug dealers.. The ones without guns were an easy lick, I didn't want to have to shoot anyone. But things happen.. And the self preservation part of a human stopped me from robbing known armed drug dealers when I didn't have to.

  4. You call that a string of murders? by sabbede · · Score: 4, Insightful
    Four in two years? Given that they have two million drivers, for only four murderers to have slipped through isn't that bad. Relatively.

    As a comparison, http://www.whosdrivingyou.org/...

    1. Re:You call that a string of murders? by Teddy+Beartuzzi · · Score: 1

      "An initiative of the Taxicab Association to 'highlight' the risks of Uber and Lfyt". AKA they're intentionally not listing taxi incidents, because they don't actually give a damn about rider safety, just protecting their own members.

  5. Re:A good pretext for excluding foreign companies by alvinrod · · Score: 1

    That may not even be necessary for China. They already have limitations in place for many industries as to how much of it can be foreign owned. Since a lot of them cap out a 50%, it means that regardless of which company comes out on top, Chinese investors will benefit. There's no point in trying to ban foreign competition when you guarantee that it's actually half-local competition.

  6. what about the same background checks that taxi dr by Joe_Dragon · · Score: 1

    what about the same background checks that taxi drivers need need to have? and Yes that means uber and lift as well.

  7. Re:No way by 110010001000 · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Yeah, good idea. That way they don't run a 0.000000000000001% change of getting murdered by one of the drivers.

  8. One exception by alternative_right · · Score: 1

    There's no point in trying to ban foreign competition when you guarantee that it's actually half-local competition.

    If you want total control, having a domestic company which does not report its statistics outside your borders can be helpful. A regime may wish to avoid ride-sharing that allows people to attend demonstrations or get to forbidden locations, for example.

  9. "Rideshare"? by K.+S.+Kyosuke · · Score: 1

    Surely you mean "taxi"?

    --
    Ezekiel 23:20
  10. Long-term misogyny going full tilt. by Qbertino · · Score: 1

    No surprise here. For ages China and India have treated women as second and third grade citizens to the point that anyone who can afford it aborts pregnancies with female babies, because the dowry and other duties coming with female offspring are a measurable burden on families.

    China has a male to female ratio of two to one in some places due to the one child policy having everyone aim for a male son.
    Same thing in India.

    I've seen this coming for decades and it's going to get worse. A lot worse, amplified by male sexual frustration. That has been my hunch for quite some time now anyway.

    My 2 eurocents.

    --
    We suffer more in our imagination than in reality. - Seneca
    1. Re:Long-term misogyny going full tilt. by HeckRuler · · Score: 1

      For ages China and India have treated women as second and third grade citizens

      Sure. But NOT treating women like 2nd/3rd class citizens (or chattel) is a recent development. At least when you start talking about "ages". Remember that whole "witch burning" phenomenon in Europe? But now they have rights and can vote and stuff. Just not in China, that'd be silly, none of them vote over there.

      China has a male to female ratio of two to one in some places due to the one child policy having everyone aim for a male son.

      China, at birth: 1.15 male(s)/female (2015)

      In the USA, 2010, At birth: 1.048 male or female

      America has a male to female ratio of about 15 to 1 in some places due to the fact none of them want to be software engineers.

      Same thing in India.

      Well it's certainly not exactly the same in India, they don't have a 1-child policy.

      A 2011 census had a ratio of births was 1.09. So... about halfway between the US and China.

      Thing is about all this, historically when there's a big sexual imbalance, the thing nations did with all those extra people was to send them to war. But things have changed since then.

    2. Re:Long-term misogyny going full tilt. by WhiplashII · · Score: 1

      But things have changed since then.

      Citation required

      --
      while (sig==sig) sig=!sig;
    3. Re:Long-term misogyny going full tilt. by HeckRuler · · Score: 1
  11. Re:They allowed drivers to rate passengers appeara by Guppy · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Didi did more than allow an appearance-rating system to emerge. Apparently, they recruited male drivers using suggestive ads, hinting that hook-ups and relationships with female passengers could be a possibility, and promoted a case where a male driver who ended up marrying one of his female passengers.

    https://www.nytimes.com/2018/0...

  12. Relative risk by BenBoy · · Score: 1

    Subtracting the emotional aspect (which I myself find non-trivial), I wonder what the actual risk of death is versus, say, death by auto accident, particularly if drinking is involved. I'm not trying to present this as a dichotomy ... you could also, say, take a regular cab, or not drink to excess before driving, or walk, or ... There's never a good control group around when I need 'em :-)

  13. Activism in China by HeckRuler · · Score: 1

    Hmmmm, "activism in China".... That historically hasn't gone very well. At least any time a story got news worthy enough to jump the ocean so we actually hear about it. But this isn't against the government, but rather against a chinese company. And the government is, essentially, participating with regulation lockdowns as you'd expect a functioning government to do when there's troubles.

    But it'll be interesting if the masses start to realize that they have power and can change things.

  14. Kalanick by guygo · · Score: 1

    Sounds like Kalanick found a new place to work... for a while.

  15. Re:A good pretext for excluding foreign companies by Highdude702 · · Score: 1

    Have you ever thought maybe killing people is fun?