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For Now, at Least, the World Isn't Making Enough Batteries (bloomberg.com)
An anonymous reader shares a report: Evidence of the battery-powered era is all around us. Electric vehicles are cruising down our freeways. Household appliances thrum with stored solar energy that was until recently a daytime-only power source. Governments from California to China and South Korea -- even Donald Trump's Washington -- have taken steps that will make battery power more ubiquitous. There's just one hitch to this battery boom: The world isn't making nearly enough. All of the new demand from North America, Europe and Asia is constrained at the moment by a market that remains heavily dependent on a few producers. Data on the global supply of batteries is hard to come by, but close observers of the industry have noticed evidence of the shortfall. "We've never seen such demand," said Yayoi Sekine, a New York-based analyst at Bloomberg NEF. "But the supply is struggling to keep up."
Oddly, however, lithium-ion battery-rack prices have continued their annual decline, even in the face of constrained supply and expectations of ever-growing demand. To get a clear sense of the near future, consider battery-powered cars: Today, there are more than 3 million electric vehicles on the road worldwide; by 2025, Volkswagen AG alone plans to build as many as 3 million electric vehicles per year. Those vehicle batteries -- in addition to storage batteries for homes, businesses and utilities -- will have to come from somewhere.
Oddly, however, lithium-ion battery-rack prices have continued their annual decline, even in the face of constrained supply and expectations of ever-growing demand. To get a clear sense of the near future, consider battery-powered cars: Today, there are more than 3 million electric vehicles on the road worldwide; by 2025, Volkswagen AG alone plans to build as many as 3 million electric vehicles per year. Those vehicle batteries -- in addition to storage batteries for homes, businesses and utilities -- will have to come from somewhere.
Someone should make a massive battery factory to profit off of this problem!
One of our competitors trademarked the term "hypothesis". From now on, we will call them "boneheaded ideas".
One of the benefits, is that you don't need to replace batteries at all.
Among other benefits.
http://progressquest.com/spoltog.php?name=Son+Of+Son+Of+DarkRookie
At 130$ /kWh there is demand for 300,000 units of 75 kWh batteris, may be a little more or little less. Model 3
At 160$ /kWh there is demand for just 25,000 units, (Bolt)
At 200$ /kWh there is demand for just 0 batteries. no one would buy it at that price
At 100$/kWh there will be demand for about 3 million units of 75 kWh a year. Tesla's projection of breakeven price between BEV and ICEV
At 80$/kWh there will be demand for something like 30 million units of 75 kWh battery packs a year or even more.
At 50$ /kWh the whole world will run solar and wind. We can store two or three days electricity usage of the whole world at affordable prices.
Moore' Law for batteries, is a 7 year half life. Energy density doubles and price halves every seven years for battery packs. Right now Tesla is at 130$ /kWh. In 7 years it will be at 65$/kWh. In 14 years, @ 32$ /kWh we are possibly looking at the greatest disruption the energy sector has seen since the switch from whale oil to coal, from coal to petroleum.
sed -e 's/Chuck Norris/Rajnikant/g' joke > fact
Now the limit on electric cars is cobalt for lithium-ion batteries. Until some clever person develops zinc-air batteries or carbon nanotube batteries or something even better. One way or the other, electric cars are coming.
Support Right To Repair Legislation.
"Governments from California to China and South Korea -- even Donald Trump's Washington"
Why this and not simply "Governments from California to China and South Korea and even the US Federal Government"
This extreme bias is persistent and spreading.
Tesla's technology is obsolete already. Also, Tesla's batteries are round. Automakers prefer flat batteries.
Add in the fact that Tesla is a money losing, cash flow negative, deeply in debt failure run by a liar and a narcissist, that factory won't be around - unless Musk can continue to lie and convince stupid people to dump money into the bottomless pit known as TEsla.
The ONLY reason Tesla is still around is because Musk is a great con-artist and convinces stupid people to give him more money. Tesla is incapable of sustaining itself because it is poorly managed by an idiot know as Elon Musk.
Oh, all the fanboys here on the Slashdot Tesla/Musk praising echo site are all retards.
Now, cue up the losers who are going to parrot Musk's bullshit and add in their own.
*Sold long position at $365, shorted and covered at $265. Kiss my dick while I rest on my pile of cash - taxed at 0% and 10% respectively. All taken out of the fanboy's pockets because the financial markets are a zero sum game.
AH! Hahahahahahahahahahhahahahah!
I'm Robin The Wall Street guy: I take from the stupid and give to myself!
Though, All the women will have to give up their vibrators.
Sorry Ladies, plenty of men around.
caption - winers
I might be interested for 5-10 cents per kwh and 400+ miles range.
The problem is that where I live, it is 28+ cents per Kwh, usage based, price goes up with usage, and we have vulnerable, limited capacity wires.
Yeah I believe them. They would never lie to us. /end sarcasm
"I disapprove of what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it." - historian Evelyn Beatrice Hall
Dude, we are making them.
Maybe you fail to realize that the entire West Coast is going to 100-120 percent Renewables. And, yes, we're using those batteries.
Wake me when you guys stop whining and start doing. We're most of North America's economy.
-- Tigger warning: This post may contain tiggers! --
batteries still got a ways to go.
[($)]
Range of gas/diesel cars has historically grown to save you driving to a gas station every day or every few days. But what if you live next to a gas station, or in the case of electric vehicles, your house is the electric charge point?
We have gotten used to plugging in our smartphones into a charger every night, didn't we? Treat your car like a smartphone and you only need 1 day of electric range, plus a bit extra for that small road deviation.
A smaller battery is cheaper, and lighter, so your car and its brakes can be lighter too, making it cheaper once more. And suddenly the world does not need that many batteries.
When we switch to a pony based economy, we will go back to using whale oil.
That largely depends on the relationship that Hasbro chooses to have with its fans.
Happy that the interest in energy storage through chemical technology is strong and growing. Just one minor detail that needs addressing... what to do with the old units. Recycling for lead-acid has had a century to be developed and is widely available. Not so much for the other metal/chemical technologies that are in use. While the demand for high energy capacity batteries may be soaring, in a few years there will be a big pile of spent batteries to go someplace. Don't know about anyplace else... we turn ours in to the hazardous waste people, who have said they go to a special landfil. Not a great idea for very long, considering the supply of some battery components is not unlimited.
where is the cobalt (a conflict resource) coming from? where's the lithium coming from? and how's the recycling coming along? also, do we have enough copper to supply absolutely everyone currently owning a car with their own personal 2 tonne electric vehicle? and what's the environmental cost of neodymium refining? https://www.theguardian.com/en...
In today's world, it costs a lot to raise batteries. Anodes and cathodes are thus waiting until they're older, while also having less batteries in total.
Range of gas/diesel cars has historically grown to save you driving to a gas station every day or every few days.
Within the constraint of being able to make cross-country trips without long pauses for refueling.
Because battery charging, even when blazingly fast with recent cell types, is still longer than a human-maintenance pit stop, they don't do well on long trips. So they need to have larger range than a fuel car or they are limited to a subset of the service types and you need two vehicles.
For instance: With something close to 300 miles of range an electric in Silicon Valley could handle both commutes and weekend excursions to Tahoe-area ski resorts or Reno-area entertainment and gaming, with a safety margin for contingencies like getting stuck in traffic jams during foul mountain weather. Under 250 miles of range and forget it.
(Don't say "rent something else for those non-commute trips". The time and hassle comes out of the precious vacation time, the cost from the budget, a breakdown is more likely and kills the vacation, and it leaves you driving a strange vehicle, a safety issue. You might consider that for a two-week vacation. But it kills weekenders, which is a drastic drop in quality of life.)
Bantam Dominique roosters crow a four-note song. Once you've heard it as "Happy BIRTHday" you can't NOT hear it that way
For instance: With something close to 300 miles of range an electric in Silicon Valley could handle both commutes and weekend excursions...
Los Angels - Las Vegas similarly, with a minimum of 350 miles range.
SF - LA is nearly 400 miles (383.1 center-to-center), the cities are spread out and the traffic is snared at both ends. So you need about 500 mile range for an electric to be practical for trips between them.
Bantam Dominique roosters crow a four-note song. Once you've heard it as "Happy BIRTHday" you can't NOT hear it that way
You start everyday with a full tank. You are saving 10 min every week by not filling up at the gas station. The time you save is what you spend on trips
sed -e 's/Chuck Norris/Rajnikant/g' joke > fact
In the world, I mean
Sent as ripples into the electromagnetic field. No single photon has been harmed in the process.
But you then have to waste an hour or two recharging your vehicle every time you go on a weekend trip that even slightly exceeds your range. Sounds like you aren't really 'saving' any time.
What if you can't charge at home? Running a long extension cord down the street would not be doable. So you'll need a working week of range plus extra, and then find a powerful public charger once a week.