Standing Desks Are Overrated (nytimes.com)

Standing desks have become trendy in recent years -- so much so that they have been promoted by some health officials as well as some countries. Research, however, suggests that warnings about sitting at work are overblown, and that standing desks are overrated as a way to improve health. From a report: Dr. David Rempel, a professor of medicine at the University of California, San Francisco, who has written on this issue, said, "Well-meaning safety professionals and some office furniture manufacturers are pushing sit-stand workstations as a way of improving cardiovascular health -- but there is no scientific evidence to support this recommendation." Let's start with what we know about research on sitting, then explain why it can be misleading as it relates to work. A number of studies have found a significant association between prolonged sitting time over a 24-hour period and increased risk for cardiovascular disease. A 2015 study, for instance, followed more than 150,000 older adults -- all of whom were healthy at the start of the study -- for almost seven years on average. Researchers found that those who sat at least 12 hours a day had significantly higher mortality than those who sat for less than five hours per day.

For convenience and comfort, it's nice to have options if you have various aches and pains -- "Alternating standing and sitting while using a computer may be useful for some people with low back or neck pain," he said -- but people shouldn't be under the illusion that they're getting exercise. A 2012 study in JAMA Internal Medicine followed more than 220,000 people for 2.8 years on average and found similar results. Prolonged sitting over the course of a day was associated with increased all-cause mortality across sexes, ages and body mass index. So did a smaller but longer (8.6 years on average) study published in 2015 in the Journal of Physical Activity & Health. Another study from 2015, which followed more than 50,000 adults for more than three years, also found this relationship. But it found that context mattered. Prolonged sitting in certain situations -- including when people were at work -- did not have this same effect.

Comments

Posers

[kackle]

Since they put the user in a statue-like position, I referred to them as "posers". At least two of the three posers in my office have resumed only sitting at their desks, after a year or two. I haven't checked in on the third guy lately...

Re:Posers

[bobstreo]

Since they put the user in a statue-like position, I referred to them as "posers". At least two of the three posers in my office have resumed only sitting at their desks, after a year or two. I haven't checked in on the third guy lately...

The third guy has probably died in his chair and nobody has noticed, yet.

Re: Posers

[Anonymous Coward]

Yes, I can see you hate posers.
Posers stand for most of the day but when they suddenly decide to concentrate then sit and do some work and not just stare at the screen. This probably happens every day, especially when their web browsing turns up something interesting

First Posting Not Associated With Health Problems

[Anonymous Coward]

AC, MD

"Science"

[fluffernutter]

This is why people rarely follow any kind of health science. Inconvenience yourself to follow some study today and it will likely be disproven in months.

Re:"Science"

[Anonymous Coward]

Remember, global cool, err warm, err climate change can be prevented by swapping out your lightbulbs and there are fifty genders.

What passes for science (hint: science isn't misinterpretations by journalists meant to sell clicks) and faith have become indistinguishable.

Re:"Science"

[hey!]

The problem isn't science. The problem is the public's understanding of science, even the reporters who are supposed to be covering science don't know how to understand scientific results.

The world is complex, and evidence always at least appears contradictory when you start looking at a question. This means a study that says standing desks are good for you is useless when deciding whether to get a standing desk. A follow up study that finds standing desks to be useless is also completely unreliable.

So basically news should never, ever report a study as proving anything.

What you need to go on is either (a) your extensive and deep familiarity with all the literature on a question or (b) someone else who has that familiarity. Fortunately, some else's expert judgment is regularly available in something called a "systematic review paper", which summarizes all the recent evidence on every side of a question.

You very seldom see systematic reviews reported on in the press, although you see individual studies reported almost every day. It should be the other way around.

Re:"Science"

[Darinbob]

Well, the reporters for the most part aren't lying, they're not saying "proven", but there is a lot of misunderstanding.

There are big problems though. The shotgun approach where you get a smattering of info from a variety of sciences, and no one is an expert on all of them and people won't be keeping track of the current state between one article and the next on a subject. A huge problem in my view however are the pseudo-sciences; people aren't good at the difference between a report on a real science study and some bullshit. Ie, nutritionists are not scientists and have no licensing requirements, whereas dieticians do have licenses in many instances. So if someone says "drink 8 glasses of water a day to be hydrated", it's not coming from any serious scientist and yet it's repeated by many like it's a fact.

Re:"Science"

[Anonymous Coward]

The parent wasn't talking about science: he was talking about science reporting and how if we followed the result of every study reported, we'd be wasting our time.
"Mozart Effect"?
It's good to be on top of things like Mercury in Tuna fish and other predatory fish. But then again, when we hear some wonderful benefit from something, we'd better hang out and see - sometimes for a long time: dietary fat anyone?

Re: "Science"

[Anonymous Coward]

Well, perhaps the part of the study one person finds interesting is incidental to someone else, who finds something else much more interesting. Publishers usually cater to the general public so you usually have to take the good with the unimportant. Take the office, for example. I find the people in my office fascinating. Does that mean I want to have lunch with them? Not really, but I will. I just like learning from them. If I need to buy snacks once a week to keep the peace I will. If I was offered a similar situation with no snack buying I would want that. On the other hand, I would not kick my incredibly helpful associates to the curb.

Re:"Science"

[Anonymous Coward]

The problem isn't science. The problem is the public's understanding of science, even the reporters who are supposed to be covering science don't know how to understand scientific results.

But this is a well known (and exploited) property of the system though. The published study itself might have no glaring process or conclusion errors of its own, but after being run through the university press office, some nearly-science-illiterate science journalists, some totally-science-illiterate mainstream journalists, and finally the drooling-retard general public who takes health advice from the news, all context and caveats are long forgotten and the story morphs into "Quit your desk job or you'll be dead at 40!" Clickbait articles get written, CNN interviews are booked, the university gets great publicity, and the scientists get fame and tenure. All by design and without anyone in the process ever manipulating any facts any more than their respective professions traditionally allow.

Re:"Science"

[Anonymous Coward]

The world is complex

No, the world is vicious. We find that making you sit on barbed wire and standing barefoot on broken glass and hot coals is far healthier than your sissy cushions.

Re:"Science"

[Anonymous Coward]

This is why people rarely follow any kind of health science.

People *DO* follow health science, just not those trendy pseudo science that makes no sense.

If 'standing desks' are so beneficial, human civilizations, over the millennia of trials and errors, would have adopted 'standing desks' as the de facto form, just like they have adopted round wheels and sloping roofs.

Re:"Science"

[Zontar The Mindless]

Actually, standing desks have been around for quite some time (as in "centuries"), as even a cursory glance at the Wikipedia article on the subject would tell you.

Re: "Science"

[Anonymous Coward]

Most assembly lines and factories have phased out standing workstations in favor of chairs. It makes me laugh seeing white collar workers brag about standing up to do a job.

Re:"Science"

[grep -v '.*' *]

This means a study that says standing desks are good for you

You *do* realize that you're greatly offending legless and paralyzed people stuck in wheelchairs. I feel offended, me with my two working legs -- you racist! Off with their heads!

Re:"Science"

[sjames]

Part of the problem is extrapolation. For example, the subjects who sat more than 12 hours a day were in worse health by the end of the study. Reporter conclusion, "sitting kills". Further analysis may well show that those who started sitting more than 12 hours a day did so BECAUSE of ill health.

Re: "Science"

[Anonymous Coward]

What about people standing at work makes you laugh? Why is it that most people choose to sit instead of stand?

Re: "Science"

[Anonymous Coward]

Basically, we've been laughing at the standing guys for centuries. Don't mind standing girls, but they don't exist. Maybe if we make standing desks popular enough, hire some Influencers and Astro Turf?

Re:"Science"

[thejam]

Please don't endorse licensing. It replaces one problem (labeling experts) with others (determining criteria for labeling experts, determining who performs said determinations, temptation to entrenchment and corruption of those in positions to do these activities, infantilization of everyone else as they are now reliant on "licensed experts [sic]" and thus relax vigilance).

Re:"Science"

[Gavagai80]

Reporters could write 500 accurate articles for every sensationalist one, and the sensationalist article is the only one the public will ever read. Because it's interesting. Nitty gritty details that all add up to "we have some hints that a complex set of circumstances may be unhealthy but we're not sure" are not interesting to anyone but a scientist.

Re: "Science"

[ckonestroh]

Haha! Worst of all in 10 years there will be a study that proves your in need of medical assistant. So the medical industry still wins. Lower back pain from standing to long :D

Re:"Science"

[dinfinity]

Reporters could write 500 accurate articles for every sensationalist one, and the sensationalist article is the only one the public will ever read.

Nonsense. Accurate articles can be very interesting, even to non-scientists. That easily written sensationalist articles with clickbait titles full of falsehoods are read a lot is independent of that. Your argument amounts to saying that the lies published in tabloids are the only thing the public will ever read, because accurate reports on the lives of celebrities are not interesting. This is simply untrue. It is true that these articles compete which each other for eyeballs, however.

The real problem lies in news outlets being commercial entities. Their responsibility is to make money, not to inform the public, which leads to publishing the lowest quality shit they can get away with. This is why public funding for journalism is very, very important.

Standing Desks have their uses

[rjune]

I have desk that I can raise and lower. It is most helpful after lunch when I'm fighting the food coma that usually occurs. It is nice to move around and stretch your legs, but I could survive without it. A nice option, but not strictly necessary.

Re: Standing Desks have their uses

[Anonymous Coward]

If someone sits across from you and you stand up and raise your desk, they are at eye level with your junk. Use this knowledge wisely.

Re: Standing Desks have their uses

[Anonymous Coward]

Iâ(TM)m just beginning to appreciate my desk. I usually sit but on occasion I have noticed that it is useful to stand. What I would really like is a change of scenery, such as doing some different work during the week, or in a different part of the office, or even in a different building. I think this would provide even more enjoyment than merely standing and sitting.

Re: Standing Desks have their uses

[HornWumpus]

Or wear pants, your call.

Re: Standing Desks have their uses

[Anonymous Coward]

Whenever I do, your mom pulls them off almost immediately and then gets to work on her salty surprise.

Re: Standing Desks have their uses

[Anonymous Coward]

Ew, I bet Horny Wuss' mom's mouth IS salty. Those ancient backwater Republicans still dry-brush their teeth with coal, for real. Then the chaw.. then the meth...

Re: Standing Desks have their uses

[Anonymous Coward]

We have one guy who was smug at first about getting a standing desk, his smugness faded when we gave him a ribbing every time we did see him sitting down "getting tired are you?"

When the remodeled out office they standardized on making everyones cube have a desk that is adjustable height, but because the cube walls are not full height it is awkward to stand up and be staring right at the person in the next cube and many people don't like the feeling of someone looking over their shoulder all day either. From what I've seen maybe 10% of employees actually use them.

As for myself, if I wanted to be on my feet all day I wouldn't work in an office to begin with. The only thing I've found useful is raising it up when you need to show someone something on your screens, it ends up being less awkward than someone leaning over your shoulder or trying to find another chair and then cramming it into your already small workspace.

Re:Standing Desks have their uses

[El Cubano]

I have desk that I can raise and lower. It is most helpful after lunch when I'm fighting the food coma that usually occurs. It is nice to move around and stretch your legs, but I could survive without it. A nice option, but not strictly necessary.

I don't know about the health benefits, but fighting the after lunch drag is definitely easier while standing. Also, there are times when when I am doing more thinking than typing and I find I can be more productive in a standing posture. Sometimes reading is easier while standing. The main thing is it enables to me to pace, walk to the whiteboard, go back to the desk, and immediately type stuff without having to sit first. It really is a productivity enhancer. A-plus, would recommend.

Re: Standing Desks have their uses

[Anonymous Coward]

Food coma? You should really improve your diet.

Re:Standing Desks have their uses

[kenai_alpenglow]

100% agree. I've got one (used to use a bunch of boxes)--not for any health benefits, just because they were more comfortable than sitting all day.

Re:Standing Desks have their uses

[hbackert]

love my standing desk at the office. But the important part is to be able to switch as needed resp. wanted: after lunch I prefer to stand. In the afternoon I prefer to sit. When thinking, I like to stand, but for mundane tasks sitting is better. Also I learned that standing all day is really bad for my shoulder. While sitting all day is bad for my back. There's zero exercise going on here though, but that was never my point why I wanted it.

Re: Standing Desks have their uses

[aix tom]

I'm in the same situation ( Adjustable desk because of back problems ), and we just lined up our monitors accordingly, so that my colleague doesn't have to see my junk when i'm standing, and I don't have to see his stupid face when I'm sitting.

Re: Standing Desks have their uses

[Anonymous Coward]

My raise lower desks, yes plural as I now have one at 2 locations I work at, helps me undo my hip, lower back issues. My hip flexors we're f'd over by several years of strictly sitting. That has real world implications long term. Being 40 and active, a sit stand desk is a requirement for me at this point. It may be difficult to find a new job which has that as the norm, but that's where I am for my personal health reasons.

Re:Standing Desks have their uses

[jimbo]

Indeed, all of the people I've worked with that got a standing desk got it because of their back and having more options for work positions during the day. Nobody (I know) ever claimed it had other health benefits, that some people think so is new to me.

Actually this is the point you also bring up about changing positions; I never had a standing desk, I always sat but I would change positions throughout the day; sitting straight (recommended position), switch chair back to front, lean back, sit on front edge of chair, fold a leg under me and I suspect that may be why I don't have back problems, changing position often - or I may just be lucky.

Heres comes fake rage

[Anonymous Coward]

Queue up the fake rage from cigarette shaped beta bearded males.

Standing desk with treadmill

[bobstreo]

is the only way to go. You get exercise and the company can generate "free" electricity. /s

I did notice, when I used to get up every hour or so, walk down 4 floors and walk back up it was way better than just sitting

Re: Standing desk with treadmill

[Anonymous Coward]

Your chain stretched that far?

Re: Standing desk with treadmill

[Anonymous Coward]

Your chain stretched that far?

He was attached to a bungie cord. He just never figured out his manager wanted him to use the window not the stairs.

If you're backs farked up they're a god send.

[rsilvergun]

You just can't sit that long with a bad back.

Re: If you're backs farked up they're a god send.

[Anonymous Coward]

The quotes in the article from an MD are very specific in saying people with lower back pain or neck pain can get comfort out of them, but in no way is standing / leaning on a desk for an hour or two "exercise"; this nuance is lost on shitty slashtard editors.

Re: If you're backs farked up they're a god send.

[Zontar The Mindless]

Who thinks standing in one place counts as "exercise" any more than sitting in one place does? I've never seen anyone make such a claim.

BTW, I got one 4 or 5 years ago, and standing for part of the day has been amazing for my back.

Re: If you're backs farked up they're a god send.

[Immerman]

I've heard it claimed it burns 50-100% more calories than sitting motionless, which is hardly in the same class as exercising, but better than nothing.

Re: If you're backs farked up they're a god send.

[Anonymous Coward]

Ditto. Never once thought about standing as exercise, only about not stressing my lower back.

Re: If you're backs farked up they're a god send.

[Anonymous Coward]

The quotes in the article from an MD are very specific in saying people with lower back pain or neck pain can get comfort out of them, but in no way is standing / leaning on a desk for an hour or two "exercise"; this nuance is lost on shitty slashtard editors.

If you stand with correct posture and contract your abdominal muscles, you will in fact burn more calories as well as strengthen your spine and core muscles.

Re: If you're backs farked up they're a god send.

[aaarrrgggh]

I have one, and have (/had) lower back pains. When I stood all day (about half of it balancing on an inverted Bosu) it really did help core muscle strength. Standing with knees locked obviously does not.

The real problem for me was that I lacked the focus when standing for that part of my job— writing a report became very hard.

Now my back is pretty good, mainly because I learned to stretch the specific muscles that caused problems in a way that did not further inflame the sciatic nerve. While I still stand a few hours per day, my favorite use for the desk is lowering it down to minimum height and taking a nap underneath it.

Re: If you're backs farked up they're a god send.

[UsuallyReasonable]

Same here. I only stand about 10 minutes an hour, but experience has shown that even that amount of unwinding from the sitting position has been VERY positive for my lower back.

Re: If you're backs farked up they're a god send.

[Stan92057]

Well its the swaying from one foot to the other because your feet start screaming in pain that's the exercise..Not saying that with a smirk either i have had bad feet all my life and sign the pain ......Back pain sure it help for a while until the pain starts shooting down your legs. And then its too late, nothing helps

Re: If you're backs farked up they're a god send.

[Anonymous Coward]

take this as you will given im posting AC but basically I had found a website that listed how many calories where burned sleeping, laying down, sitting, standing, walking at some pace, etc. The difference between sitting and standing was considerable compared to laying down and sitting and standing and walking. I did some napkin math and found if I stood all day and took a load off my feet during lunch I could burn more calories than if I sat and then bolted out of my seat and spent 100% of my lunch hour walking nonstop. And it beat it by a goodly sum. Its part of the reason I started standing and its one of those thing where once you do it you find its quite nice. Personally I like not getting up when I go places from my desk. Its stupid but it feels like I save allot of time and getting back to my desk I can get into work much easier. At first I sorta forced myself to stand for an hour and increased it over time, but now I mostly stand and let my body decide when to sit or whatnot. I also find lunch is allot more enjoyable in a way getting that sitting portion. More relaxing. It really tells my body and mind that indeed I am on break.

Sitting is bad unless you literally have a big ass

[Anonymous Coward]

You are skewing the blood pressure in the upper and lower part of the body by putting your whole body's weight on the thighs. If you have large amounts of seat musculature, then the body can more easily regulate to compensate for the effect on circulation from putting all that pressure on the thighs, but if you have thinner thighs and butt, then it's worse for you.

Nobody thinks they're getting fit from standing up, but the bad effects from prolonged sitting day after day, week after week, are not a joke.

Articles are overrated

[maxrate]

I have a standup desk (two years now). My back feels way better than it ever did. My point is, if something is working for you, keep doing what youâ(TM)re doing - no matter what an article says. I rarely sit at work now - I get more done. Itâ(TM)s working for me, I didnâ(TM)t think it would but I gave it a shot and Iâ(TM)m glad I did. It may or may not work for you. To each is own

Re:Articles are overrated

[Anonymous Coward]

You know what probably accounts for it? Lack of slouching. When you sit in a chair a while you tend to slouch without realizing it. Standing typing tends to reinforce not slouching, it's more conscious of posture. I think that's it.

Re:Articles are overrated

[skoskav]

You seem to be telling people to prefer anecdotes over clinical studies and recommended guidelines. Your comment could just as well be making the same argument for astrology, homeopathy or fake cancer treatments.

The article and its cited studies are mainly delving into the context of cardiovascular disease, mortality and general health markers. As for your specific case of back pain, the author even seems to agree with you:

[...], but like many things in life, they’re fine if you like them. And if it helps alleviate some back and neck pain, so much the better. It’s just that most people probably don’t need them.

For the record, I've been using a sit-stand desk at work (~80% of the day in standing mode) for four years, and I can't really detect any health difference. Though I appreciate that while sleep-deprived, standing up will prevent me from dozing off.

Re:Articles are overrated

[maxrate]

You're missing the point, that's not what I'm telling people at all. Lot's of comments on /. to read thru - my brevity seemed to fuel your need to dissect my truncated thoughts and address points I hadn't intended to elaborate on. The stand up desk improved my life as you have claimed yours as well. This article could easily put someone off purchasing one off it completely. For me, back pain is practically gone. When I get home, it's no longer painful to use the treadmill - meaning, better cardio function for me over all. When I sat all day at work, I thought of Newtons Law: objects at rest, remain at rest - that was me! Sitting supported my laziness. Now that I'm on my feet all day, the decision to walk in my place of work to get things done isn't a difficult one. I used to sit and procrastinate on any task that needed me to get my fat, lazy ass out of my chair. That's gone now. Last I checked walking improves cardio function, not sitting. My fit bit records 1800 more steps per day. I can only hope a fellow /. computer nerd/office worker reads my comments and decides to take the plunge and try it. It might make them feel better - and that's what matters the most. You've been doing it for 4 years now. If your boss is buying you the desk (not outta your pocket) and using it makes your life marginally better by merely passively using it - then why not? Varicose veins/heart disease comments in the article FUD (in my opinion) - remember when eating butter was bad for you? now they are saying it's fine? They tell you to eat a healthy diet but people still get cancer? We are all fucked - just do something that makes you feel better in the here and now so quality and enjoyment of life improve. No back pain = getting out and doing more. Life is short. Again, everyone is different & about the only thing doctors can actually universally agree on it that exercise is good. The stand up desk is a catalyst for that (at least for me). I come home at the end of the day and feel significantly less tired. It took me a couple of months to push thru and get used to standing while thinking, was worth it.

Re:Articles are overrated

[Anonymous Coward]

wow, you sound just like marketing for a supplement MLM/pyramid scheme... just try it, spend a few hundred, it might work for you!

Re:Articles are overrated

[Anonymous Coward]

No, they didn't miss the point. The point is the article is about studies and decisions for large populations. Yet you still continue to just respond with anecdotes, and MLM/pyramid scheme type reasoning.

Re:Articles are overrated

[aaarrrgggh]

For not irritating your back in the first place, not slouching is huge. But when you simply can’t sit, that isn’t even an option. I needed to stand exclusively for about two years. So nice to be able to sit comfortably again, but I am still happy to have positional flexibility.

Re:Articles are overrated

[TeknoHog]

This. A lot of people seem to misunderstand standing desks because they have never really tried them. For starters, it's not about standing in attention for hours, but letting your body move and find its natural positions freely. To me, there's a huge psychological element in not being tied to a chair. It seems to help with attention deficit issues to some extent.

One problem is that it takes a while to get used to standing desks to get all the benefit. For me it took a few months of alternating between sitting and standing, though I still prefer sitting by a table for many things -- there's no need to choose either-or. I started with ad-hoc setups with a stool or a table on top of a regular desk, and I only got a real standing desk about a year ago.

"This is the weapon of a jediknight"... apk

[Anonymous Coward]

"Not as clumsy/random as a blaster - An elegant weapon 4 a more civilized age" https://it.slashdot.org/commen...

* "For over a 1,000 generations Jedi Knights were guardians of peace & justice in the old Republic. Before the dark times. Before the EMPIRE"

(NOT "wannabe weapons" of TROLL shitlords on /. like ZIP https://it.slashdot.org/commen... - theirs = effete downmods I RUN 'EM DRY OF & lies & WHY they LOSE).

APK

P.S.=> Many here know https://linux.slashdot.org/com... & enjoy greater speed/security/reliability & anonymity hosts yield natively speeding you up 2 ways (adblocks & hardcodes that protect vs. DNS security issues in redirect poisoning + request tracking logs & RESOLVE FASTER locally from RAM driven by KERNELMODE speed vs. slow usermode in "solutions" packed w/ security issues (DNS/Antivirus) OR not working fully by default (adblock) in usermode addons easily detected by webmasters & blocked doing less but using more)... apk

Re: IMPERSONATING ME AGAIN? apk

[Anonymous Coward]

No one is impersonating you. Repeating the same lie won't make it true.

My barber could have told you that

[nospam007]

Standing the whole day is no fun.

Standing all day is really not good

[Anonymous Coward]

I once had a job where i stood for 8 hours a day, admittedly it wasn't at a desk, it was at a table packing stuff, but the principle remains the same. I have nerve damage in my right shoulder blade (from lack of arm support), inability to raise my right leg nearly as far as my left without severe pain in the bone of the thigh and what i believe to be the start of arthritis in my left ankle (front of the ankle joint has been burning for the past year or so steadily getting worse and worse to the point where stairs are becoming a real issue for me). And for a little bit of perspective i'm mid 30s.

I'm not doing that again; sure sitting introduces it's own problems and pains but at least you won't sacrifice your ability to walk comfortably.

Re:Standing all day is really not good

[UsuallyReasonable]

If you have sufficient lower back pain it unquestionably affects your ability to walk comfortably.

There's no lie in what you replied to OR here

[Anonymous Coward]

Not as clumsy/random as a blaster - An elegant weapon 4 a more civilized age" https://it.slashdot.org/commen...

* "For over a 1,000 generations Jedi Knights were guardians of peace & justice in the old Republic. Before the dark times. Before the EMPIRE"

(Vs. "wannabe weapons" of TROLL 'shitlord' ZIP https://it.slashdot.org/commen... & his effete downmods I RUN 'EM DRY OF).

APK

P.S.=> Many here know https://linux.slashdot.org/com... & enjoy greater speed/security/reliability & anonymity hosts yield natively speeding you up 2 ways (adblocks & hardcodes that protect vs. DNS security issues in redirect poisoning + request tracking logs & RESOLVE FASTER locally from RAM driven by KERNELMODE speed vs. slow usermode in "solutions" packed w/ security issues (DNS/Antivirus) OR not working fully by default (adblock) in usermode addons easily detected by webmasters & blocked doing less but using more)... apk

Re: IMPERSONATING ME AGAIN? apk

[Anonymous Coward]

This bullying guy is getting slack, or has poor programming skills. He's like fourth down the list. Poor form. Hopefully this means he's getting bored of his BS.

Standing all day almost, if not much, worse.

[Anonymous Coward]

Standing all day is almost worse for health because of the shit it does to your joints.
The body was not designed to be in a seated or standing position all day. It's horrible. Loads of people that work in retail can tell you those horror stories. Wasted joints, inflammation, etc. It makes for a horrible retirement, that's for sure.
The body very specifically evolved to be in motion, with periodic rests. The very act of moving cycles many systems in the body, including digestive tract, your vascular system, and cerebrospinal fluid. That latter item being a very important one! Lack of flow is directly linked to most mental illness, including the explosion of depression, since crap isn't being cleared out of the brain properly.
Being in either of the standing or seated stances for long periods does nothing to cycle these.

Exercise CAN be done in both, however. It just takes some careful consideration to both noise and inconvenience in performing said activity.
Even something as simple as a peddler under your desk and just peddling on it slowly can improve your health considerably over time. Likewise a stepper can also work. if you don't want either, even getting yourself in to the habit of manually exercising by tensing your muscles periodically can help. Just don't tense them too hard and pull a damn muscle. I do this regularly. Not the muscle pulling part, the tensing part.
Neither of these, however, cycle much in your body. I only do this to keep the heartbeat up and activate the muscles to prevent wastage over inactivity.
Some people have said a treadmill for standing, but it's quite a big thing and isn't too practical unless you have your own large space or work at home. It would need to be designed in such a way that you could rest your body against it for stability, if you were at a desk for example.
BUT, resting your ribs against the desk like that isn't going to be too good for you either. I know this personally from having a seat that was too big for my desk and I ended up leaning against the desk to get in further and it hurt. Got rid of that in a hurry.
Standing is much harder to deal with in terms of getting useful exercise without impacting the work you can do, but it is more helpful overall. It's a bit of a double-edged sword.

if you get the proper setup for both, it'll be great. But it's not going to be easy or cheap. Most systems that most of these people use are probably doing way more harm than good since they are very likely cheap!

Re:Standing all day almost, if not much, worse.

[Hognoxious]

Even something as simple as a peddler under your desk

If you can't find one of those try a hawker, a costermonger or a colporteur.

Get a better chair

[Burdell]

A lot of office chairs are crap, especially after a few years. I switched to a Tempur-pedic office chair and it is much better.

They're not overrated

[Monoman]

The problems is as always. Lazy people looking for an easy solution to a problem Standing all day has it's issues as well as sitting all day. They are not a replacement for exercise but they area great way to add variety to spending a day behind a desk.

Re:They're not overrated

[Anonymous Coward]

There is probably just a lot of corporate pressure to get rid of standing desks with the increasing "popularity" of waist high cubical walls. If research shows they don't do anything, then they won't be considered to fall under "reasonable accommodations."

Re:They're not overrated

[Anonymous Coward]

The problems is as always. Lazy people looking for an easy solution to a problem Standing all day has it's issues as well as sitting all day. They are not a replacement for exercise but they area great way to add variety to spending a day behind a desk.

Another reason I prefer working in my home office is the freedom to move around at will from time-to-time including walking between my sit-down desk and my bookcase(s), or from my stand-up desk which is atop a set of bookcases arranged to provide a work surface particularly in combination with an adjustable notebook computer workstation as I walk to retrieve a book from that set of bookcases. A bit of sitting, standing, walking, bending and stretching to reach for something while I working without actually exercising or even looking as though I am exercising.

Horrible.

[Anonymous Coward]

These lies being used to sell expensive furniture additions are outrageous.
I, for one, wont stand for it.

Captcha: physique

Correlation is not causation

[Anonymous Coward]

Wash. Rinse. Repeat.

Positives certainly but also a fad.

[AbRASiON]

It's kind of a merit badge in government to have one of these, for people who just want whatever they can get for free. Certainly a portion do need it but the amount of installs is clearly "oh me too!" In some offices anyhow.

That being said, one very believable claim, is that they promote more walking, as you're inclined to just walk over to people to discuss things, rather than use workplace instant messaging. Or any other thing you might say "I cant be bothered" on. Well you're already standing, so definitely more movement occurs.

However as someone with obscenely flat feet, poor posture, weak core, now in my 40s I'm noticing how most of my life, standing is very uncomfortable for me. I tend to sink into a hip and put all my weight to one side. Sometimes changing side. I imagine a standing desk would destroy me very quickly.

Finally it's all fine and dandy for a manager or someone with a need to move about and chat here and there, but I imagine the engineer types here on Slashdot are going to be concerntrating potentially for hours and hours on end. I need to think and ponder and test. I'm not so sure they suit the coder or sysadmin types of use case of a computer. Can anyone here vouch?

Re:Positives certainly but also a fad.

[aaarrrgggh]

For me, I have more trouble doing long focused tasks while standing, so it is best when I have the shorter or less focused tasks to do— conference calls, writing emails, checking work, reading /., reviewing financial statements, etc. It does not work well when I need to spend four straight hours writing a technical report.

As for flat feet, poor core strength, and age— those are all reasons to do something. Try standing on a balance board with proper insoles. Learn to tape your arches if it is really bad. That said, I have gone from a size 12 to a 13-14 in the past four years as my feet get flatter— might need something more supportive than my flip-flops.

I'm reading this article from a standing desk...

[PhantomHarlock]

I just converted my Ikea Jerker desk to standing height (still remains the most versatile computer desk of all time) due to lower back pain while sitting for long periods, and so far it's cured that problem. Also when I am waiting on short renders or compiles I tend to walk away or move around rather than start mindlessly surfing. Another advantage is that I can actually stand more in front of the monitor I am looking at the most rather than turning to face it from the center.

I intend to purchase a high task chair to go with it so I can sit or stand as the mood strikes. For now I have a stool from the shop.

I also found it immediately necessary to purchase a foot pad, as I am barefoot when in the office upstairs typically.

While I was at an office supply store looking for the high task chairs, I did sit in a few regular chairs that were super comfy and made me think "Gosh, if I had this chair I might not need a standing desk" but I think it's still nice to have the option to go back and forth.

It's been a few weeks now and we'll see how it plays out. So far I like it, and I still have my recliner for sitting and reading.

A friend who works for Google says that his entire office has the convertible sit / stand desks and they like them. He has also converted two of his three jerker desks at home to standing height.

Can't idle too long.

[antdude]

For my old body, I can't idle for too long. My body will get stiffed, ached, unhappy, etc. I have to move around often. :(

Standing desk with a treadmill

[SirMasterboy]

I spend some time every day taking my laptop to a standing desk that has a treadmill built in.

Pretty sure it's healthier than sitting all day.

Re: Standing desk with a treadmill

[Anonymous Coward]

It's not. Your co workers will eventually get sick of your holier than thou, self righteous, virtue signaling bullshit and kick your vegan ass down the twelve flights of stairs you brag about jogging up every day.

Re: Standing desk with a treadmill

[Anonymous Coward]

Enjoy your heart attack you fat fuck

Re: Sitting is bad unless you literally have a big

[Anonymous Coward]

Your posture is crap.

You're still bent

[rsilvergun]

that's the problem, at least for a lot of folks with back problems.

AKA everything in moderation

[gilgongo]

I have a variable height standing desk at work. I asked for a desk inspection (which the company gives for free as it's scared of litigation for things like carpel tunnel). The inspector told me how to configure the desk correctly for both standing and sitting, and said that I should neither stand nor sit too much during the day. Mix it up. I sometimes do the morning sitting, the afternoon standing or whole days on either, and other combinations. There are also operational pros and cons of each (when standing you can see people coming from further away, but have less desk space to use).

I'm not too bothered about my mortality, just my short-term musculoskeletal health. I should point out though that I've heard about the varicose veins thing and so I secretly wear compression socks to work now.

Re:AKA everything in moderation

[Nkwe]

Everything in moderation, including moderation.

Re: msmash is a Hairy Indochimp

[Anonymous Coward]

Sorry, your mom isn't coming back. She really wants nothing to do with you.

Re: Sitting is bad unless you literally have a big

[Anonymous Coward]

Your posture will not change the fact that, and the effects of you resting your whole body weight on your thighs. Your brain is crap.

Standing desk irrelevant; walking desk annoying

[drinkypoo]

We weren't evolved to stand around, but to walk around. And then to lay around while waiting for something edible to come along. Laying down doesn't let you make good use of your arms, so we adopted sitting so that we could get work done. Of course, you can't do most modern jobs while walking, either.

I used to be an avid walker, but these days walking hurts me because there is something wrong with my back. I like cycling much better for that reason, plus that it's more interesting because it's faster. Standing for long periods is right out.

Maybe for you

[drinkypoo]

My back is farked up, and I can't stand that long. Walking makes my back seize up eventually, but standing does it rapidly. Mind you, sitting also can cause me pain, but I have an Aeron chair at home and that has helped immensely. (Too bad about how hard the seat is, though. I've saved my back at the expense of my ass.)

Stationary

[Anonymous Coward]

There's the comfort, or lack thereof, when sitting. The other side is "how stationary are you?"

While standing I'm more likely to rock, squat a little, or otherwise move a bit. While sitting I'm just a blob. I'm also more likely to lean my head forward while sitting. So sitting is worse for both my back and my neck.

I have a desk that I can move up and down, but it generally stays in standing position. I have hard wood floors so I have anti-fatigue matts at the desk so my feet don't pay the price.

So, like many things, it isn't a question of "which is best", but a question of "which is best for you?"

./ fails to apply proper headline

[del_diablo]

No anon, article is terribly transplanted from whatever it originally was.
Sitting is bad, so the article says. Standing works fine.
What the headline wants to convey, and fails to do: Standing is inferior to walking. But if you are jailed in a office, you can't just walk around. So saying they are overrated is... weird.

This is about long term disease rate for the work force, where the ./ headline misses the point so badly i wonder what terrible sensationalist bot wrote it.

The office - standing desk

[burningcpu]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?...

IMPERSONATING ME AGAIN? apk

[Anonymous Coward]

gweihir KNOWS u IMPERSONATE me https://it.slashdot.org/commen... c6gunner proves it https://linux.slashdot.org/com... he forgot to SUBMIT as AC & using his registered 'lusrname' instead (because he tried to mock me both BEFORE & after I FAIRLY challenged him to show he's done better work - he had ZERO).

& NO WAY I'd "cry" like you "playing victim ne'er-do-wells" on /. (TROLL /.ers, not all) OR post on hosts offtopic.

YOU HELPED ME https://science.slashdot.org/c... (& you quit trying to make me look bad trying to "tell lies" on hosts as "ME" IN YOUR IMPERSONATIONS of me e.g. https://tech.slashdot.org/comm... as regards Intel speculative execution attack? Hosts PREVENT 'EM)

APK

P.S.=> I KNOW the 2nd to last link above's KILLING YOU - YOU ACTUALLY HELPED ME getting me to see if hosts stop more than portsmash (& Meltdown + Spectre too) & "lo & behold" - hosts WORK on 'em - U LOSE... apk

Lack of exercise not excess sitting

[Anonymous Coward]

Sitting doesn't hurt your heart, it's lack of exercise. Sitting all day vs standing all day and otherwise not getting exercise is going to have similar outcomes. The key is to just get up and walk around at least once an hour. If you can't get away from your computer long enough to stretch your legs with using a standing desk you have bigger issues.

Personally I want a desk that has the monitors mounted to the chain and will tilt back with the chair in order to achieve the optimum position for support and comfort. vs. putting all your weight on your tailbone and behind the knee cutting off circulation

The standing desk it dead!

[WorBlux]

Long live the hamster wheel cubicle!!

I Tend To Be Restless

[Anonymous Coward]

And I like to change my posture and position at intervals.

So a standing desk seems like a good idea for me, so long as I don't only have to stand. I can imagine using one at intervals, for perhaps an hour or so a day. Using one all day, every day? I'd get tired!

Hernias

[Anonymous Coward]

As us older folks know, sitting at a desk for decades contributes greatly to the possibility of developing abdominal wall and groin hernias.

Having a desk that doesn't encourage you to fold your body in certain predictable ways that create certain predictable weak points in your abdominal wall keeps hernias from developing and/or creates circumstances in which the abdominal wall, etc become stronger as a result of exercise.

Anyone who tells you otherwise obviously hasn't asked the people who asked for standing desks, WHY they wanted standing desks. WE have reasons. We''re not stupid. We know what we are doing.

Maybe you need more mature scientists.

~childo

CAPTCHA: "rooster"