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China Expands Research Funding, Luring US Scientists and Students (npr.org)
An anonymous reader quotes a report from NPR: In the past decade or so, China has been expanding its commitment to scientific research, and it shows. Chinese researchers now produce more scientific publications than U.S. scientists do, and the global ratings of Chinese universities are rising. Five years ago [professor of chemistry at the University of California, San Diego, JaySiegel] became dean of the school of pharmaceutical science and technology at Tianjin University. He says the university president recruited him to build an undergraduate program that would attract students from all over -- not just China. Siegel says the program is taught entirely in English. There's another aspect of getting a pharmaceutical science degree at Tianjin that Siegel expects students from throughout the world to find particularly attractive: The Chinese government plans to offer scholarships to cover the cost for students who enroll. Siegel says this is all part of China's effort to attract international scientists. Of course, there are some drawbacks with working in China. There are internet restrictions, making it difficult to reach certain websites; English isn't spoken throughout most of the country, posing a problem for many foreign visitors; and free speech isn't the same concept as it is in the United States. With that said, "There's no interference politically on the science," says Greg Herczeg, an astronomer at the Kavli Institute for Astronomy and Astrophysics at Peking University.
"We've had no political restrictions," says Siegel. "I know that people talk about them being out there, and I've heard rumors of things. But, for us personally, I would have to say no, I've not had that experience."
"We've had no political restrictions," says Siegel. "I know that people talk about them being out there, and I've heard rumors of things. But, for us personally, I would have to say no, I've not had that experience."
"Want to make astounding and unsubstantiated claims about scientific discoveries? Move your research to beautiful China, where you can get a government grant to publish basically whatever you want with almost no peer-review."
"Of course, there are some drawbacks with working in China." Yeah being disappeared is a drawback.
The more money gets spent on science, the better. Some of it will be wasted, of course, but that's reality. If they even invent one great thing, make one great discovery, then all of humanity benefits.
"First they came for the slanderers and i said nothing."
... put your face on the side of a bus.
They're seeing how divided other countries are, and offering the same thing to the world's scientists that the USA offered, just after the 1st world war. Now, if only they had the freedoms that we used to have...
Politics; n. : A religion whereby man is god.
The problem with US scientific research is that public sources of funding keep getting cut. A large part of basic scientific research and a significant amount of applied scientific research in the US occurs at universities. It just isn't profitable enough in the short term for such research to turn profits that help quarterly earnings, so businesses are less interested in conducting such research. While some universities have been successful at tapping into significant private funding, many highly-ranked universities, including in the Midwest, have been losing research funding. States are cutting higher education budgets, facilities and administration percentages keep rising, and public sources of funding are becoming less abundant.
If you want US research, increase the amount of public funding, both at the state and federal levels. Increase the budget to the National Science Foundation and decrease the proposal review times. For a lot of programs, it's a six month review process, and it often takes multiple iterations to get even good proposals funded. I don't see a good reason why the review time couldn't be cut in half and the rate of funded proposals increased. Scientific research isn't free. If you want to keep the scientists in the US and keep our universities producing high-quality research, you have to pay for it.
By the way, I posted almost this same comment a few moments ago. Initially, it appeared that the comment had been posted, but it seems to have disappeared. Either there's a glitch in Slashdot or posts are being deleted.
He says the university president recruited him to build an undergraduate program that would attract students from all over -- not just China.
That's how, in the long term, you gain an economic advantage. The US operates like that (even now), being a place the best and brightest wanted to go to attend uni. Many of those minds stayed in the US, and set up companies and contributed in major ways to the economy. Some of the world's biggest success stories came up via that route.
China is Orwellian and dystopian, but they are taking a very long term view in almost every domain. They're working hard to lock up as many natural resources as possible so that 500 years from now, they'll have industrial advantages and others will be dependent on them. Remains to be seen whether their long term view will be enough to offset the disadvantages of being a dystopian society, but once your population gets used to things like "social credit scores and don't you dare criticize the Party or we'll lock you out of society and round up your relatives", they don't seem to mind too much. People can get used to almost anything. The ones who mind, like the Tibetans or the Uyghurs are being culturally destroyed and assimilated into mainstream China. The ones who won't assimilate are being sent to "re-education" camps by the millions.
Come back in 100, maybe 200 years. My bet's on a Chinese Hegemony. This situation is nothing at all like what people were claiming about Japan in the 80's. China has the population Japan doesn't, it has the natural resources Japan doesn't, it's not shy about throwing its weight around and using every trick or corruption it can to get what it sees as its rightful place in the world. They'll have ups and downs like anybody, but their trend is really, really up.
Scientists gonna science. Fund 'em or loose 'em.
Anons need not reply. Questions end with a question mark.
China is a meritocracy with tight media control. First, they know the importance of scientific development. Second, they have no need to politicise science to reward rich donors who help elect presidents and congresscritters as in the US.
As in, there is none. "There's no political interference," he said, under threat of joining the millions of others in "reeducation" concentration camps.
Does it cause Seasonal Affective Disorder?
For this reason, God sends them a powerful delusion(operation of wandering)(planet) so that they will believe the lie.
Working of Error
We could learn from the Chinese.
What on earth gave you any of those ideas? China is a bullshitocracy in which "science" all but can't exist due to the culture of complete dishonesty and corruption in academia and research.
A bullet may have your name on it but splash damage is addressed "To whom it may concern."
It could be that they are truly hands off in the research. It could also be that they simply don't fund research that might have political connotations.
My Other Computer Is A Data General Nova III.
When their research leads to new weapons development and they balk, ala Google, watch what happens.
He and the Chinese just want the same thing... for now...
Chinese pronunciation is the only weird thing about the language. Otherwise, there are no irregular verbs mainly because verbs aren't conjugated in the first place. There's no gender assignment to any words like in French or Spanish. The sentence order is like basic English structure: subject - verb - object.
If you go live there full time it's fairly easy to learn to speak.
There is corruption in China, for sure, though there have been attempts to rein it in in recent years. Also, I agree there is plenty of questionable science coming from Chinese institutions, though I suspect there is at least as much coming from Western start-ups looking for funding.
With all the issues, China should not be underestimated. A country does not achieve sustained rapid growth and improvement in living standards over 30 years without doing a lot right. Those at the highest levels of government have made good decisions more often than in most of its competitors.
China actually scares me, partly because of its success. They believe they should again be the dominant force in Asia as they were centuries ago. Increasingly, they are going to be in a position to seize what they believe they are entitled to. That is not good for other countries in the region.
Primarily because they value education. I can't tell you how many parents I know in the US that just don't care what grades their kids get as long as they have a good experience. The next generation is completely unmotivated in the science and engineering fields because the experience is boring.
"A country does not achieve sustained rapid growth and improvement in living standards over 30 years without doing a lot right." Or starting from a really shitty position and marginally improving 20% or so... whichever is true.
Also that's a period of extreme change gifted to them by western markets, without which their transformation would not really have been at all possible... but yeah, it's better than the 1950's famines for most. For now.
They haven't reigned in any corruption.
Comment removed based on user account deletion
This must be the third or fourth time slashdot has reported in glowing terms on China's research spending. What's with all the blatant pro-chinese propaganda? Sure, research in china is great, if you want to publish unsubstantiated lies without any peer review or oversight of any kind.
What happens when one of these pharmacy students mentions the Tiananmen square massacre on their social media?
"science" all but can't exist due to the culture of complete dishonesty and corruption in academia and research.
Any citations or proof for that?
Cost free eBook I read (by iBook/Kobo/Amazon/ObookO/Gutenberg etc.): "The Green Odyssey" by Philip Jose Farmer.
So why haven't any other big countries managed to do it? They are all still stuck in the shitty position and marginally improving, or going backwards. Despite elections and freedoms etc the Chinese never had.
to attend uni
Kendall, please tell me you're a Brit and not an American trying to sound like one...
I don't like soap in my coffee.
'Nuff said?
"There's no interference politically on the science" sounds great, here in the West, political correctness within science is a catastrophic paradigm.
The Chinese give no F's, and it can be better for science that way. Why should feelings matter more than facts?
As long as your research agrees with the politics of bejing. Any speech or resource that disagrees and you can expect to quietly disappear for using your freedom poorly.
âoeTolerance applies only to persons, but never to truth. Intolerance applies only to truth, but never to persons.
Cold fusion.
There's tons of countries TODAY in shitty positions. I work in one. They arnt going anywhere.
China did.
I think China will become one of the most developed countries in the world in the future, they have chosen the right strategy, many students dream of working there, because there are good salaries and a high standard of living, I can help students with writing an essay for college, you can go to the site Paperial.com where You will find all the necessary information on this issue.
After watching the reports on their Social Credit System no way....
Between that and their human genetic research they are heading for a world of hurt.
End of Line.
Another potential issue is that China plays a lot faster and looser around ethics than most Western nations. Want to do human genetic experimentation with minimal oversight? How about accelerate your AI research with even looser data privacy and controls than the already weak protections by American tech companies?
your mission if you decide to accept it is to
if you, or any of your team, is caught we will deny any acknowledgement.
say you want to gene-doctor babies before they are born, go for it, but remember that we will not support you (publicly).
On a long enough timeline, the survival rate for everyone drops to zero.