Stop Adding Cancer-Causing Chemicals To Bacon, Experts Tell Meat Industry (theguardian.com)

The reputation of the meat industry will sink to that of big tobacco unless it removes cancer-causing chemicals from processed products such as bacon and ham, a coalition of experts and politicians in UK warn this week. From a report: Led by Professor Chris Elliott, the food scientist who ran the UK government's investigation into the horse-meat scandal, and Dr Aseem Malhotra, a cardiologist, the coalition claims there is a "consensus of scientific opinion" that the nitrites used to cure meats produce carcinogens called nitrosamines when ingested. It says there is evidence that consumption of processed meats containing these chemicals results in 6,600 bowel cancer cases every year in the UK -- four times the fatalities on British roads -- and is campaigning for the issue to be taken as seriously as sugar levels in food.

"Government action to remove nitrites from processed meats should not be far away," Malhotra said. "Nor can a day of reckoning for those who dispute the incontrovertible facts. The meat industry must act fast, act now -- or be condemned to a similar reputational blow to that dealt to tobacco." [...] In a statement issued today, the coalition warns "that not enough is being done to raise awareness of nitrites in our processed meat and their health risks, in stark contrast to warnings regularly issued regarding sugar and fattening foods."

Comments

Sugar...

[js290]

Sugar is the most carcinogenic ingredient in cured bacon. Some butchers will have sugarless bacon. Cancer from a physicist's perspective: a new theory of cancer

Did something change?

[Presence Eternal]

IS there any alternative to nitrates/ites? My understanding is the alternative to nitrates is botulism.

Either that or lying about nitrate content. I've NEVER seen "nitrate free" meat that wasn't lying with fine print: "..except that which naturally occurs in celery powder" is the same thing as "contains no salt, except that which naturally occurs in seawater."

Re:Did something change?

[Misagon]

Modern meat-processing is clean and cold enough that there is no longer any case for using sodium-nitrite to prevent botulism.

The real reason for using nitrite is that it makes the meat products red -- making meat look like how consumers are used to.
Meat without nitrite is more grey, which looks less appetising.

Re:Did something change?

[larryjoe]

IS there any alternative to nitrates/ites? My understanding is the alternative to nitrates is botulism.

From Wikipedia: "While meat-preservation processes like curing were mainly developed in order to prevent disease and to increase food security, the advent of modern preservation methods mean that in most developed countries today curing is instead mainly practised for its cultural value and desirable impact on the texture and taste of food. For lesser-developed countries, curing remains a key process in the production, transport and availability of meat."

Curing in the developed world is not needed for safe food. It is used purely for taste and aesthetics. Of course, this is obvious. The same cuts of meat are commonly eaten in non-cured forms (either with artificial nitrate of celery-based nitrate) with no fears of botulism or other illnesses.

The big question is whether people are willing to eat gray hot dogs. Maybe we can swap out the nitrates with red food coloring ...

Re:Did something change?

[omnichad]

That's for fresh meat, not cured. Bacon stays colored during cooking (as does ham)

Come up with a way to make a ban work first

[Solandri]

Because nitrites are a natural component of certain vegetables - mainly celery extract. If you ban nitrites, you ban celery and most green vegetables. If you ban artificial nitrites, processed meat packagers will simply use celery extract as a preservative. That's what the "nitrite-free bacon" products do - if you read their list of ingredients, you'll find celery extract listed prominently. Because the natural nitrites in it are used to preserve the cured meat in lieu of artificially produced nitrites. The only difference is the former can be labeled "celery extract" while the latter must be labeled as "nitrties."

At some point you have to accept that lots of naturally-occurring substances can kill you. And stop going on witch hunts against things just because they have a scary name that you don't recognize even though you've been eating, breathing, or rolling around in it all your life.

The only way I can see this working is like how we recommend how much fish you should eat because of the different amounts of mercury they contain. Come up with a list of the maximum amount of a food you should eat in a week due to the nitrites they contain. Bacon, hot dogs, celery, cabbage, carrots, spinach, beets, etc. And publish those as health advisories.

Re:Come up with a way to make a ban work first

[Rutulian]

Agree with your general point, but this whole discussion seems to be a little confused about nitrates vs nitrites vs nitrosamines, so a quick chemistry overview for some clarity:

Nitrates (most oxidized form) -> nitrites (two-electron reduction of nitrate. Outside of industrial processes only occurs biologically by the bacterial enzyme nitrate reductase) -> Nitrosamines (reaction of nitrites with secondary amines. Requires heat and/or acidic conditions. These are generally stable compounds.) -> Hydroxylated nitrosamines (Unstable intermediate formed by enzymatic processes that mostly occur in the liver) -> Nitronium cation (spontaneous breakdown of the hydroxylated nitrosamine. Cation is an alkylating agent that can modify DNA.) -> DNA damage -> DNA repair or cancer

The basic gist here is to illustrate that there is clear mechanistic reasoning behind the notion that nitrates have a cancer risk associated with them. But it also illustrates that the transformation is complex and there are multiple ways for harm to be mitigated long before a cancer risk is ever truly a risk.

For example,
    Sodium nitrite in food cooked at high temperature with high protein content -> skips step 1 and facilitates direct production of nitrosamines that get ingested and transformed in the liver
    Sodium nitrate plus antioxidants -> hinders production of both nitrites and nitrosamines -> lower risk of being transformed in the liver
    Nitrates in vegetables -> typically have low protein content and lots of antioxidants, so low risk of producing nitrites or nitrosamines
    Celery juice -> naturally occurring nitrates -> no intrinsic risk of being converted to nitrites, especially if antioxidants are also present
    Celery powder -> evaporated celery juice (same as above)
    Cultured celery powder -> celery juice that is treated with bacteria and then evaporated -> this causes the nitrates to be converted to nitrites (by the bacteria) and presents a direct path to nitrosamine production if used to treat high protein content foods (aka meats)
    Bacon -> depending on above may have varying levels of nitrites or nitrosamines present after cooking, but generally low levels overall -> likely a low cancer risk, but may present a higher risk depending on frequency of consumption and other dietary factors
    Celery, arugula, beets -> high in nitrates, but no nitrites or nitrosamines present, even when cooked in the presence of meats (ex: stews) -> low, probably non-existent, cancer risk
    Cigarette smoke -> high concentration of nitrosamines inhaled directly into the lungs -> the nitrosamines still have to make their way to the liver, but represents a moderately high risk of cancer, especially considering the often habitual and frequent nature of smoking

   

Here's an explaination

[rsilvergun]

why nitrates in vegetables aren't really a problem

TL;DR; cooking a high protein food at high heat is what makes them cancerous.

Re:Here's an explaination

[Anonymous Coward]

When you use celery juice in natural cured bacon, you are not adding any nitrates. However when celery juice interacts with the meat over time,. it breaks down into a concentration of nitrates that is 4 times the legal limit of just adding nitrates. However since this is "naturally occurring" as part of celery, it's not banned or regulated.

Illiterate Republican stops reading at the truth?

[Anonymous Coward]

"Big tobacco" refers to a large cartel that pushed a dangerous carcinogenic product knowing it was super-addictive and cultivating that all while lying about it and putting out a campaign of disinformation for decades.

You're a coward hiding from a very common phrase, for whatever purpose of distracting bullshit you exist for these days Kohath. "Big Tobacco" exists, so dry your little eyes about it being referenced, snowflake.

Re:Stopped reading

[Misagon]

The words "big tobacco" came from the newspaper article, not from the scientists quoted in the article.
The use of those words do not make thier words less valid.

Re:Got It Backwards

[Anonymous Coward]

notorious for using intestines as casings for sausages

WHAT?? Notorious? For using a casing that's been used ever since sausage was invented? This is the kind of scare mongering that makes people ignore anything else attached.

Re: Illiterate Republican stops reading at the tru

[Anonymous Coward]

That would be fine if the cancer risk of bacon was anywhere near as bad as tobacco. Media sensationalism tried to push that narrative for clicks, namely by equating the certainty of nitrate cured meats being a carcinogen with tobacco's potency as a carcinogen, and a bunch of tards (especially militant vegans) still think that is the case, even though the WHO long since clarified their position (and stated that they don't think it needs the same response that tobacco needs.)

Nitrates in meat greatly reduce the time needed to cure (hence reducing the cost by a lot), make them taste better than curing with just salt, and make them more red in appearance (cosmetic only, but people prefer that color as opposed to the greyish color that comes from salt curing.)

IMO if anybody needs any punishment over this, it should be the stupid organic variations that claim to be nitrate free because they use "natural organic" celery juice to cure them, even though celery juice is very high in nitrates (duh) and doesn't make any difference, at all, vs mineral nitrates like potassium nitrate or sodium nitrate (and yes, these are actually mined, just like halite, so they're every bit as "natural".)

Hell, punish the whole organic movement while you're at it, it's so full of the cow shit it's made of (hence the rate of food poisoning is 10 times higher for organic produce, with no nutritional or taste benefit at all, not to mention insanely wasteful of natural resources and bad on the environment.)

More FUD

[crmarvin42]

Second /. Article today based on an entirely flawed premise (the one claiming that concer crops are somehow new or experimental being the other one).

Back when the UNs IARC labelled processed meats as carcinogenic the good Dr Carroll (professor at IU Medical School) pointed out that the actual risk of eating significantly more bacon than you used to is rather small. https://www.youtube.com/watch?...

Alternative?

[reanjr]

Is there an alternative to curing the meat with nitrites? Because if there isn't, this is just an academic conversation. We're not going to ban cured meats, and everyone already knows meat causes cancer. No one cares. Pigs are fucking delicious. Cows are fucking delicious. We've already decided it's worth it.

Re:I think the study came out last April

[justthinkit]

I was taught this in second year Organic Chemistry...in 1978.

We were told you needed two things: beer and meat pizza.
The nitrites were in the meat in the pizza.
The beer provided the amines.
Combine the two and you get the nitrosamines.

Pretty unforgettable lesson.

BTW, it is not really surprising this is only coming out now. Chicken feed contained an arsenic compound...for forty years.

Come to think of it, 1978+40=2018.

Re:Got It Backwards

[Waffle Iron]

You do realize that real intestines are significantly more expensive to obtain and fill than artificial casings, and only premium sausage products are packaged in them? (The same goes for condoms, BTW).

I don't really understand people who get squeamish about eating any animal organ other than muscle tissue. What makes intestines any more disgusting than muscles?

IARC Group 2A carcinogens

[N_Piper]

So that puts Nitrates on the same list ( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/...) as Vapors from frying
Hot beverages
Earl Grey Tea (Bergapten)
Coffee (Acrylamide)
Red Meat (Which already includes bacon)
Charred Meat (2-Amino-3-methylimidazo[4,5-f]quinoline)
All cooked and smoked meat (N-Nitrosodimethylamine)
and last but not least
Shift work that disrupts the circadian rhythm
Yeah all we need now is wheat and beans and Everything in British and American breakfasts will be cancerous...
On a more serious note:
I would like to reach across all the demographics of Slashdot commenters and try to get a thread going here telling the Admins that we are more critical thinkers than most and really don't appreciate this kind of clickbait alarmist fad science being posted here.
Everyone here knows that applying the linear no threshold model to anything that causes genetic damage is bull shit
You want a statistic bigger than 6600 cases of bowel cancer here's a statistic for you
In the United States alone 10,000 people die a year due to stress and hysteria over Radiation and Nuclear Energy ( https://www.nap.edu/catalog/12... )
Now Imagine how many cases of stomach and bowel cancer are caused by undereducated over read people getting their stomach in knots and their panties in a twist over bullshit overstated cancer headlines.
Right, Left, Others let's all say as one "Shut the fuck up!"

*slowly raises hand*

[magusxxx]

"What about making bacon in the microwave?"

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/p...

Yeah, I went there. ;)

Re:No real evidence

[jma05]

GMO activists aren't telling you that nitrites cause cancer, the scientists are.
Show me a scientific body that says nitrites are safe, not some health magazine or a "nutritionist".
The link isn't new and the concerns haven't abated at all.
There are always studies that go both ways in everything. An average Joe isn't equipped to weigh the evidence and understand the scientific consensus.
The industry also frequently tries to muddy the waters saying that the evidence is a wash.

Re:No real evidence

[Deef]

There's no real evidence that nitrate cause cancer, if anything it's useful to prevent foodborn illness like botulism.
Most studies that link nitrate to cancer have been disproved by other studies.

A number of consensus studies recently, such as those cited in the paper that the article is about, claim that there IS substantial evidence that nitrates cause cancer.

What is your evidence for your claim that "There's no real evidence that nitrate causes cancer."? Are you an expert in the field?

It appears to me that the experts claiming that there IS evidence have so far provided substantially more evidence for their point of view than you have.

Saying there's "no real evidence" sounds a lot like the No true scotsman fallacy.

Disregarding the consensus view of experts in a scientific field is something that should be done with great caution, and preferably with strong evidence of some kind, not just skepticism.

Re:As an Islamic country...

[serviscope_minor]

I'm not surprised the UK would begin attacking pork products. It was only a matter of time.

Well this as insightful shows how incredibly partisan and riht wing idiocy dominated this site has become. This whole "UK is islamic" is a weird fantasy of some segments of the American right wing, and seems poplar on Fox.

It is simply, utterly flat-out false.

Naturally I will be modded down for pointing this out.

Re:Socialism

[serviscope_minor]

In fact, in this case, it certainly *is* socialistic/totalitarian to *tell* people what they can and cannot eat*, particularly when the effects are highly dubious.

Now it's socialist for people to hear things that they might not like? Christ what a bunch of snowflakes. No one is forcing anyone to do anything here. All that's happening is some dude (with evidence) has written an open letter to an industry roup teling them he thinks they're causing trouble for themselves.

If you think private individuals writing open letters to trade organisations is socialist then you have a massively overdeveloped sense of persecution.

Re:As an Islamic country...

[Bearhouse]

Not sure if you're going for "flamebait" or "idiot" mod. points, but of all Western European and North American countries, England (but not the UK) is probably the worst example of a (potential) Islamic country, since it's the only one where Christianity is the state religion and the ruling head of state (monarch in the case of the England) is also the head of the church. Sometimes overlooked is the fact that the CofE is also head of the Anglican church worldwide, rather like the Pope for the Catholics.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/...
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/...

Contrast this to France, where the (republication) state expressly forbids alignment of state with religion, or even expressions / symbols of faith in public life, (a ban frequently flouted by all side, admittedly). Note that the % people declared practising Islam in both countries is a very scary.....5% In the USA of course, the danger is even more acute ;)

France : 51% Christians, 5.6% Islam
England : 59% Christians, 5% Islam
USA: 74% Christians, 0.8% Islam

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/...
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/...
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/...

Re:I think the study came out last April

[bill_mcgonigle]

You also learned that ascorbic acid will bind up most of it in the stomach too, then. Which is why most meat manufacturers add Vitamin C to their products.

But that makes for a boring headline in The DaIly Anecdote.

Re: Illiterate Republican stops reading at the tru

[Tough Love]

That would be fine if the cancer risk of bacon was anywhere near as bad as tobacco.

More people eat bacon than smoke tobacco... maybe.

Re: Illiterate Republican stops reading at the tru

[omnichad]

Uncured, by law (in the US), is cured meat with a natural source of nitrate or nitrite. Food producers are required to call it "uncured" even if they believe it's misleading and inaccurate.

Re:No real evidence

[Aighearach]

When you threaten the source of toxins, the neckbeard takes control of the host and releases chemicals into their brain that makes them feel as if the toxin is the mother they wished they had. They'll fight to the death for whatever cause their neckbeard tells them to support.

There is no reliable cure, even if there are anecdotal examples of somebody overcoming a neckbeard infection.