US Pressed Chinese Firms To Show One Example of When They Resisted Request For Data From Chinese Government, But They Have Never Done So: WSJ (wsj.com)

The latest in the Huawei saga, which is increasing tension between the U.S. and China. WSJ reports about a remarkable event: Confronted with U.S. accusations of cyber espionage, Chinese companies and government officials often accuse Washington of hypocrisy, pointing to allegations in 2013 by former NSA contractor Edward Snowden that the U.S. had been hacking into key Chinese networks for years. Western officials say systems of checks and balances in their countries allow for companies to challenge those demands, unlike in China.

To further highlight that difference, U.S. officials have repeatedly pressed Chinese companies to demonstrate to them one example of a time they resisted a request for data from the Chinese government, but they have never done so, according to a person familiar with those conversations. U.S. intelligence officials have suggested at times that their views on Huawei are informed by definitive examples of malfeasance, though they have so far refused to share such evidence publicly. When the House Intelligence Committee in 2012 published an unclassified report naming Huawei as a security risk, it spoke generally about a lack of trust lawmakers placed in China but steered clear of providing concrete examples of the company being caught engaging in nefarious activity.

Comments

Well, there was that one time

[WillAffleckUW]

But those execs are in the Human Plastic Show right now.

Re:Well, there was that one time

[zlives]

wow China should totally implement the rubber stamp FISA system, heck just back date some warrants and call it good. Justice is served.

Re:Well, there was that one time

[ShanghaiBill]

TFA is just a long Whataboutism rant. The fact that Chinese firms acquiesce to demands from the Chinese government, in no way whatsoever excuses the misbehavior of the American government.

The Chinese judicial system is not comparable to the American system. They do not have an independent judiciary, so expecting a company to "challenge" an order doesn't make much sense. They also do not have an adversarial system, with a defense attorney and prosecutor trying to "win" regardless of the merits of the case, with an impartial judge as arbitrator. In China, the judge is often actively involved in the investigation, and will directly question witnesses. Their justice system works completely differently, in both good ways and bad.

Re:Well, there was that one time

[Shaitan]

"in no way whatsoever excuses the misbehavior of the American government"

This story isn't about alleged misbehavior on the part of the American government. If Chinese companies do not fight government requests then what is to stop the government from gaining access to American trade secrets those companies become privy to including their own trade secrets where the companies are branches of US companies operating in China?

Re:Well, there was that one time

[arglebargle_xiv]

It's not Whataboutism, it's just Wot? The headline "US Pressed Chinese Firms To Show One Example of When They Resisted Request For Data From Chinese Government, But They Have Never Done So" tells me I'm supposed to be outraged about something, but it's phrased in such an obtuse manner that I have no idea what it is. Something about China, by the looks of it, and being asked to prove a negative.

When did you stop beating your wife?

[shking]

Sounds like the spin doctors have thrown the old loaded question fallacy against the wall to see if it will stick

Re: When did you stop beating your wife?

[Anonymous Coward]

The journalist Alistair Cook pointed this out in the 1970's. It's a linguistic thing. In Mandarin, China is not a geographical space in which the government, people and corporations are separate and distinct actors. China is the government, and the people and corporations are permitted to be extensions of that.

US directly spied on China. China uses companies.

[ITRambo]

The issue is that Chinese firms directly are owned and micro managed by the Chinese government. The US chooses to avoid electronics that are shown to have been part of China's spy efforts. China will, naturally, downplay this difference as if there is no difference at all. There is. Chinese companies directly assist China in spying on the West. US firms do not directly do so.

Re:So what?

[RightwingNutjob]

Apple and FBI. Quite public, too.

Why would they admit to a crime?

[misnohmer]

Working against the government in China is a crime (or at the very least gets you on a bad side of the dictatorial government). Why would any company admit to doing it, even if they did?

Re:Bizzare expections

[Impy the Impiuos Imp]

Moreover they do have the right to resist, as rights are inherent in you as a person, and therefore cannot be granted by other, angry people with guns. They can, however, step all over your rights.

I'm sure there will be kibitzers who disagree, but why would you grant other people the philosophical power to grant you rights on their whim? What a subservient loser they must be.