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Cringely's Final Predictions: Apple Becomes a Financial Service and Hedge Fund (cringely.com)

For 22 years technology writer Robert X. Cringely has been making predictions for the year to come -- but this year may be his last. So at age 66, he's promising his 2019 predictions will also "take a look out several years...because I sense the tech industry about to enter an unprecedented correction."

And last week he unveiled his first prediction -- that Apple under Tim Cook "emulates GE under Jack Welch.... Jack Welch took GE into financial services in 1981, transforming the company and increasing its market cap by 4000 percent over his 20 years. "

Tim Cook has already started in 2019 along the same path forged by GE's Jack Welch back in 1981. This strategic shift started to show just this week with Apple directly financing iPhone sales in China and announcing an Apple credit card with Goldman Sachs... Look for Apple to start financing lots of things in 2019. Remember your car dealer would rather lend you money than have you pay cash for that ride because financing is its own profit center. So iPhone prices will continue to rise, but iPhone payments will probably decline as Apple cuts out middle men and efficiently sucks-up that aspect of the phone supply chain. This is how Apple will arrest iPhone market share declines -- by assisting sales and making even more money in the process.

I expect Apple to not just make strategic investments, but participate in strategic financing as well.... What Apple is probably closest to becoming is a hedge fund -- a very big hedge fund in fact. Apple's available financial power is approximately equal to that of the world's two largest hedge funds -- Bridgewater Associates and AQM Capital Management -- combined. So when someone tells you Apple is in decline or doesn't have a clue, they are wrong. Apple will continue to compete in its established technology markets as well as new ones. But Apple has also found a $200 billion hobby that will keep it growing for the next decade no matter where the Information Technology market goes.

Cringely notes that services "are more profitable than hardware." But Cringley has always been gracious about entertaining other opinions. In 2000 he answered questions from Slashdot readers, and last week he reminded his readers again that as technology completes its next great transitions, "I'd really like to hear your thoughts, too."

As dramatic changes (including AI) kick off what may be a new 50-year-cycle, "Everything is changing and nothing -- nothing -- will ever be the same again. I hope that's a good thing."

75 of 152 comments (clear)

  1. Financial services? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

    Well, I guess since Tim Crook is terrible at technology this is a good course for Apple. I just hope for the sake of everyone they stop making their awful products. It's been long enough under Tim Crock that Apple is unlikely to ever innovate again.

    1. Re: Financial services? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Interesting

      I have a really fat 50 year old business book (over 3100 pages) and the end part of it basically suggests that once any business has enough financial leverage / savings that it's best to just get into financing/lending/banking, period.

    2. Re: Financial services? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful

      I have a really fat 50 year old business book (over 3100 pages) and the end part of it basically suggests that once any business has enough financial leverage / savings that it's best to just get into financing/lending/banking, period.

      So, once you amass enough money that paying someone else to shove it in their mattress becomes irresponsible from a financial standpoint, you get into the mattress business.

      Seems logical enough to not validate this as some kind of magical "prediction", and more like common sense and business investing 101.

      This has far less to do with a company dying on the innovation vine as it does leaving money on the table by not participating in the financial sector, especially when you have the funds to back it. Doesn't matter if you're making a popular smartphone or rubber dogshit. Get a business big enough, and you will up in banking, because it's a solid revenue stream.

    3. Re: Financial services? by Cmdln+Daco · · Score: 5, Interesting

      Doesn't matter if you're making a popular smartphone or rubber dogshit.

      The best part about discussions like this is that it's near conceded that Apple is now 'a smartphone maker.' The Mac is just about dead.

    4. Re: Financial services? by fuzzyfuzzyfungus · · Score: 1

      I suspect that the interesting thing to watch is whether Apple gets into obvious ancillary financial services(as they are already doing to an extent, something like "AppleCare+ with Theft and Loss" is basically an insurance product backed by Apple's competitive advantage in performing repairs where those are more cost effective, something competing insurers are less able to do); consumer credit for purchases of their products being the big one(and proven by the car manufacturers to be quite a profitable sideline); whether they get into those and some financial services that wouldn't be possible without integration with their products(also a largely foregone conclusion at this point, offering billing services through ITMS and Apple pay are both exactly that; and probably have some further logical expansions); and whether they sprout a division that has nothing whatsoever to do with their traditional core products and services except to put their giant pile of cash to work.

      Given what Apple has already done; 'predicting' the first and second of these is really just knowing your recent history and making a couple of highly plausible extrapolations at this point. The third option also isn't wildly unlikely; but it will be interesting to see to what degree it occurs(Apple obviously isn't storing its spare cash under a mattress somewhere at HQ; so it's obviously doing some amount of investing; but there's "I have money and want to put it into a diversified range of investments" and there's "I'm starting a hedge fund"); and whether Apple's financial activities remain fairly closely tied to their products(selling the credit you use to buy them and the payment processing built into them; while investing the profits) or whether the financial side takes on a life of its own that gradually eclipses the other activity.

    5. Re: Financial services? by ramlaljhon · · Score: 1

      Google seems to be better understanding of their ecosystem.

    6. Re: Financial services? by supremebob · · Score: 1

      I figured that Apple would eventually go the IBM route, and start buying other companies in order to keep their product line fresh. Perhaps they'll

      Like Big Blue, it seems that they forgot how to innovate, and have just been coasting with incremental improvements to their products for the past five years.

    7. Re: Financial services? by supremebob · · Score: 1

      Grr... I meant to say that perhaps they'll buy a company like Nvidia to expand into the gaming market, or a company like Twitter if they want to go the Social route.

      They might even surprise us an try making a business play by buying a company like Salesforce, but that's less likely.

    8. Re: Financial services? by null+etc. · · Score: 1

      once any business has enough financial leverage / savings that it's best to just get into financing/lending/banking, period

      Especially if you're a non-profit, like Harvard University, which has a 37 BILLION DOLLAR TAX-FREE endowment.

    9. Re: Financial services? by Shotgun · · Score: 1

      Just one nit. How do American consumers differ from all other nationalities along this axis?

      --
      Aah, change is good. -- Rafiki
      Yeah, but it ain't easy. -- Simba
    10. Re: Financial services? by Altus · · Score: 1

      Yes they seem to have an excellent understanding of their advertising ecosystem

      --

      "In America, first you get the sugar, then you get the power, then you get the women..." -H. Simpson

    11. Re: Financial services? by dgatwood · · Score: 2

      Remove that, you kill the Mac because it will lose all of the Adobe apps, the ability to run Windows either directly or via VM, the ability to run Windows apps via WINE, a ton of software originally written for Linux, and more. It will completely kill the software ecosystem on the Mac and make it literally unusable for a ton of developers who rely on x86-64.

      Adobe has been porting Photoshop to iOS for several years in anticipation of just such a move. By the time Apple switches CPUs, a substantial percentage of the Desktop version of Photoshop (if not the entire code base) will have already been ported to run on ARM. I would not be surprised if their other project teams are doing something similar.

      What moving to ARM will do, unfortunately, is create a big barrier for anyone still running Photoshop CS6 and Lightroom 6, i.e. the people who refuse to switch to a subscription model. It is unlikely that very many of those users will still be running Photoshop after that, so Adobe's overall market share will take a beating pretty quickly. I hope that the rise of alternative products will fill that gap well enough that Adobe will find themselves pressured to restore their software sales model, but I'm not holding my breath. Either way, my first ARM-based Mac will mark the end of Adobe products for me. I'm done with them.

      As for Linux and Windows apps, maybe you missed it, but Windows started transitioning to ARM in 2016, with hardware shipping in late 2017, and Linux has run on ARM processors since the last part of the 20th century. Any software that has strong ties to x86 will have to be rewritten anyway, no matter what Apple does.

      --

      Check out my sci-fi/humor trilogy at PatriotsBooks.

    12. Re:Financial services? by Hognoxious · · Score: 1

      Does "Tim Cock" make you feel better?

      --
      Confucius say, "Find worm in apple - bad. Find half a worm - worse."
    13. Re: Financial services? by Rob+Y. · · Score: 1

      That 'Ability to run Windows apps via WINE' is a big one for me. I have a win32 app that I use WINE to run on Macs (and Linux boxes). That'd be fine if I could build it for ARM and have a WINE for ARM version that'd still run it. But I don't see that appearing any time soon. It took long enough to get WINE up and running for Intel Mac's.

      Maybe my app's done for (or ready for a rewrite - not gonna happen, though). But I've relied on the ubiquity of Win32/Intel to keep that thing viable for 30 years. Even Windows ARM machines are supposed to have IA32 emulation to keep that stuff alive - which only goes to show how even Microsoft is stuck supporting it. Apple has broken backward compatibility many times in the past, though, so maybe WINE on Mac will die off - or embrace emulation too...

      --
      Posted from my Android phone. Oh, I can change this? There, that's better...
    14. Re: Financial services? by dgatwood · · Score: 1

      That 'Ability to run Windows apps via WINE' is a big one for me. I have a win32 app that I use WINE to run on Macs (and Linux boxes). That'd be fine if I could build it for ARM and have a WINE for ARM version that'd still run it. But I don't see that appearing any time soon. It took long enough to get WINE up and running for Intel Mac's.

      The API that they're emulating is still the same, and there has been a WINE version that runs ARM Windows binaries on ARM Linux for at least a year. Assuming the code is architected sanely, it ought to require little more than a recompile to port it to macOS.

      --

      Check out my sci-fi/humor trilogy at PatriotsBooks.

    15. Re: Financial services? by blind+biker · · Score: 1

      This is exactly what happened to GE, the largest (by number of employees) company in the world.

      And as for the company with the largest income, which would be Saudi Aramco, I wonder if they went into financial services, too?

      --
      "The agriculture ministry is not in charge of Gundam" - Japanese ministry official.
    16. Re: Financial services? by jcr · · Score: 1

      Apple has transitioned the Mac across CPU architectures three times already. 6800 to 68K (before it shipped), 68K to PPC, and PPC to Intel, not to mention dealing with the 24-bit to 32-bit address space issue in the 68K days, and the 64-bit transition in the PPC days.

      CPU migration hasn't killed the Mac yet, why would it this time?

      -jcr

      --
      The only title of honor that a tyrant can grant is "Enemy of the State."
    17. Re: Financial services? by jcr · · Score: 1

      Bullshit. People buy Macs to run Mac apps.

      -jcr

      --
      The only title of honor that a tyrant can grant is "Enemy of the State."
  2. /. editors are retarded, here is the link by jdoeii · · Score: 5, Informative

    This is the link to the actual post by Cringely with the Apple prediction: https://www.cringely.com/2019/...

    1. Re: /. editors are retarded, here is the link by Cmdln+Daco · · Score: 1

      How did you mangle the spelling of "James Patterson" so badly?

    2. Re:/. editors are retarded, here is the link by msauve · · Score: 1

      "Cringely" is actually a pseudonym posted under my multiple people.

      Well, it was, until Mark Stephens basically stole the pseudonym from Infoworld. I always liked Mike Swaine's backpage columns better.

      --
      "National Security is the chief cause of national insecurity." - Celine's First Law
  3. Well... by Kokuyo · · Score: 5, Insightful

    ...they're certainly not gaining points through engineering and innovation lately, that's for sure.

    1. Re:Well... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      Except engineering for increased costs, right? Then again, the financing plans are inevitable artifacts of pushing the products into markets that can't take the one-time cost. How many US customers actually pays their phones upfront? The contracts have been financing plans all along for selling phones to people who can't actually afford them. Soon, NVidia GPU Plans for gamers and professionals.

    2. Re: Well... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      Dairy farms Apple should open dairy farms

    3. Re: Well... by Cmdln+Daco · · Score: 1

      Apple should buy Adobe and start making Adobe Creative Appliances and end Adobe making software for anything else. And then shut down a year later.

  4. Bob's sharp! by aglider · · Score: 4, Interesting

    Bob's predictions haven't been right all the time. But never at 50-50. More something like 75-25 or even 80-20.
    The good part of Bob's predictions is how acute and sharp he's been so far.
    And not just the predictions, but also any other piece he'd added to his blog (or whatever else you define it), one or a kind.
    Going far beyond the pure appearance and surface, adding thought value by interconnecting news and facts from different sources and, of course, putting in a good dose of his own sharp intelligence.

    I would suggest anyone how likes seeing things under a different light and yet getting most of those right, go heave a deep read to that blog.
    It's worth every single information bit.

    --
    Sent as ripples into the electromagnetic field. No single photon has been harmed in the process.
    1. Re:Bob's sharp! by 110010001000 · · Score: 4, Insightful

      That is because his "predictions" are for things that have already happened. For example he "predicted" this last year:
       
      "The H-1B visa problem will NOT go away. Immigration reform will have little actual effect on H-1B visa abuse".
       
      Oh wow. Massive prediction there from 2017. Here is MY Prediction for 2019: "The H-1B visa problem will NOT go away. Immigration reform will have little actual effect on H-1B visa abuse"
       
      Everything he listed is a multiyear issue. Completely idiotic.

    2. Re:Bob's sharp! by 110010001000 · · Score: 2

      Say wha? A Nazi? Didn't we kill all you guys in the 40s?

    3. Re:Bob's sharp! by dissy · · Score: 5, Interesting

      Bob's predictions haven't been right all the time. But never at 50-50. More something like 75-25 or even 80-20.

      I mention this purely as friendly banter.

      Robert was actually an employee for Steve Jobs back when Apple was in his home garage, I think he was the 11th or 12th employee back in the mid/late 70's.
      In the beginning Jobs had some difficulties getting funding to get Apple off the ground so offered stock options in place of pay. Robert was one of the few that turned down that offer wanting cash instead.

      Not an unreasonable choice over all, but I would guess he's still kicking himself today over that prediction!

    4. Re:Bob's sharp! by Hognoxious · · Score: 1

      Going far beyond the pure appearance and surface, adding thought value by interconnecting news and facts from different sources

      He bestraddles the warp of the attention economy with the weft of long-tail synergies.

      --
      Confucius say, "Find worm in apple - bad. Find half a worm - worse."
    5. Re:Bob's sharp! by aglider · · Score: 1

      Try read all other articles from his web site.
      I haven't said there's no bullsh!t, like those about the iPhone decryption case...
      But the interesting thoughts of his are so much more than the bullsh!t that it deserves our time.

      --
      Sent as ripples into the electromagnetic field. No single photon has been harmed in the process.
    6. Re:Bob's sharp! by aglider · · Score: 1
      --
      Sent as ripples into the electromagnetic field. No single photon has been harmed in the process.
    7. Re:Bob's sharp! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      He said his mother still reminds him of that incident! Triumph of the Nerds was epic!

    8. Re:Bob's sharp! by 110010001000 · · Score: 1

      I don't know what SHUL is, but I enjoy lying immensely.

    9. Re:Bob's sharp! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Interesting

      Robert Cringley was found to have lied about having a PhD from Stanford, and lied about having been a professor there. He claims to have been Apple employee #12, but there's no corroborating evidence and another person is well-known to have been employee #12 at Apple.

      Basically, the guy is a fraud.

  5. Meh by JaredOfEuropa · · Score: 4, Insightful

    “Assisting sales”, financing phones, or even dramatically lowering their profit margins is in itself not enough to arrest the decline of market share. Apple needs to offer compelling reasons for us to not buy Android, the mobile OS that everyone else is using. Switching between OSes is a giant pain in the rear, so they have some leeway there, but if Apple hardware, their OS, their services and integration with other services start to lag behind, people will switch and likely not come back. Having a walled garden is a liability if you do not take good care of it: most people (myself included) know the walls are there but we cannot see them for all the lovely trees in the garden, but Apple hasn’t been watering and trimming them very well lately, and things are starting to look a little shabby. And there are a couple of very good Android phones out there these days; time perhaps to move to greener pastures.

    Google seems to better understand how to care for their ecosystem, not just the core OS but all the services around it: mapping, translation, voice recognition, and so on, all top of the bill stuff. Apple’s services are also-rans. If Apple doesn’t keep up innovation and doesn’t invest some of that vast capital into making their ecosystem the very best, sales will decline. And that means Apple will decline as a tech company. Even with billions in the bank. Same as the guy down the street running a video rental store; he made a killing back in the 80s and saved enough to comfortably retire on, but he keeps the doors to his shop open. Good for him, but I wouldn’t exactly consider him a relevant factor in local commerce.

    --
    If construction was anything like programming, an incorrectly fitted lock would bring down the entire building...
    1. Re:Meh by Cmdln+Daco · · Score: 1

      Indeed it is. Except that means nothing at all.

    2. Re: Meh by cyber-vandal · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Google seems to better understand how to care for their ecosystem, not just the core OS

      LMFAO. If you call abandoning devices after 18 months "caring".

    3. Re:Meh by NicBenjamin · · Score: 1

      From my point of view a huge part of their current problem is that they don't actually offer any products I want. My cell phone is not even Android and I'm content. My Mac is a tower. If they'd make a Mac Mini that was a little less "I'm thin pay extra" I might buy it, but they just do not offer hardware I want. And, as far as I can tell, it's because they are trying to turn all their hardware into iPhones. Beautiful industrial design, thin as possible, and let's call the hi-end of the mid-range the low-end.

      If you add in the lack of attention to detail on some of their releases there's just no reason for me to send them money.

    4. Re: Meh by JaredOfEuropa · · Score: 2

      Good point, and one of the issues I have with Android devices is the craptastic update policies many vendors have. Another one is that Apple seems to do a much better job of keeping malware out of the App Store. Apple doesn't get everything wrong, and by the same token Google doesn't get everything right. But a lot of the available peripheral services and devices for Android just seem to be of higher quality. And there's a reason for that. Google is in the data business and all of those services are potential profit centers for them; it makes sense to invest in them. For Apple, they are cost centers. But they seem to have forgotten that they are still necessary underpinnings of their core business.

      --
      If construction was anything like programming, an incorrectly fitted lock would bring down the entire building...
    5. Re: Meh by Cmdln+Daco · · Score: 1

      Apple don't make ant Mac hardware anymore that's not made out of laptop parts..

    6. Re: Meh by Zocalo · · Score: 2

      Yes, but that's more a function (or lack thereof) of the Android appliance vendor, no? Google, for their part, does seem somewhat better than some of the Android OEMs in this regard, especially in the IoT sector where many of the devices seem to become abandonware almost as soon as they hit the virtual shelves, as they're stock enough to let you install a few more major updates even after official support stops. I can be a real crapshoot if you try shoving Oreo or Pie on someone else's hardware that hasn't been updated for a few versions, but the Pixels etc. will generally take it without too much fuss (YMMV on performance though). Google have also been working on moving more of the code out of the vendor specific patches and into apps they can update through the store (e.g. the various "Play Services"), reducing the reliance on OEM updates for security fixes, so they've clearly realised there is an issue and trying to improve matters.

      Neither Apple or Google is perfect, of course. But, with a few exceptions, I also tend to find that Android's peripheral services, etc. are at least slightly better than Apple's versions, and often significantly so - Maps, anyone?

      --
      UNIX? They're not even circumcised! Savages!
    7. Re:Meh by hairyfeet · · Score: 4, Interesting

      I'd say the real problem is they shat all over their ecosystem, peed in their chili if you will, by refusing to service their own products and blocking the others like Rossman that were willing to do the work.

      I HAD (key word had) several customers that WERE very loyal to Apple but it was because everything "just worked" together, their iPhone into their Macbook Airs into their iPads...then Apple stopped repairing their Macbooks (Steve Jobs gotta be spinning like a top in his grave over that one) and their iPads, the rep on the new Macbooks is so bad even these non tech savvy users didn't want them, and then it came out they were fucking users by gimping performance on older phones when they were updated....well it don't take that much to REALLY piss off a customer when they've spent 5k+ at your store and can't even get their products serviced so...they are now all using Samsung Galaxy into nice HP business class laptops they had me spec for them that honestly gave them better performance at a cheaper price.

      Apple is making a serious fuck up that you are 100% correct on, you HAVE to keep them "in the garden" but the way you do that is by not only making products they want to buy but servicing (or making it easy for third parties to service) the older gear. Remember this gear ain't cheap folks and your non tech types? Can get attached to their gear. Apple saying "fuck you we won't fix it" while simultaneously blocking others from fixing it? Well like I said my customers USED to buy all their gear from Apple, and being doctors they had plenty of money to buy the nicest gear, hell one even had her entire office running on iPads...now they are on new Surface units.

      --
      ACs don't waste your time replying, your posts are never seen by me.
    8. Re:Meh by mlw4428 · · Score: 1

      I enjoy that this ignores many of the issues that Google brings. Apple doesn't spy on its users and sell that data to third parties. Google and companies that operate like them are having difficulty navigating under laws like GDPR, Right to be Forgotten, etc. Their only saving grace is that US Republicans still favor businesses over people. As attitudes change towards a more privacy conscious society (not all of us want our employers to be able to buy up marketing data to use in their recruitment processes), companies like Google will find it very challenging to operate in that kind of environment.

      Apple has been making investment in its AI and has recently brought on key talent to revamp those services. But there should be no illusion, when you don't collect and store terabytes of data on each of your users, it may BE harder to develop amazingly accurate AI services. When you don't read every single email, message, and spy on every single bit of web traffic, it's more challenging to build up a picture of a person without all of the data points. I don't personally give a fuck that Siri can't read my mind. I don't want it to. I don't need someone to be able to make a call for me to setup an appointment. Those things I can do myself.

    9. Re: Meh by molnarcs · · Score: 1

      Google seems to better understand how to care for their ecosystem, not just the core OS

      LMFAO. If you call abandoning devices after 18 months "caring".

      They made steps to mitigate this problem. And now, we have a variety of Android One devices with pretty decent support. My current phone, a Xiaomi mi A1 came out in 2017 with Android Nougat, and runs the latest Android (9.0 Pie) with regular monthly security updates. That's not bad for an $200 phone. There is plenty of choice now with long(ish) term support for devices from a variety of vendors.

    10. Re:Meh by Headw1nd · · Score: 1

      What declining market share are you referencing? iOS has held relatively at 13-14% steady for years now. iPhone sales peak in Q4 around product launches, but otherwise have also held more or less at 14% market share.

    11. Re: Meh by cyber-vandal · · Score: 1

      You can get the Google services on Apple if you want.

    12. Re: Meh by cyber-vandal · · Score: 1

      Of course you can't repair the screens on an iPhone can you. Do you think it's reasonable for something you pay a lot of money for, such as the Pixel, is abandoned after 18 months? I'm happy with my 6s - I don't see anything special about any of the phones that have come out in the last 3 years that would be worth spending silly money on another phone from any manufacturer.

    13. Re: Meh by cyber-vandal · · Score: 1

      A 2 year update guarantee is pretty good for such a cheap phone. How long do the expensive ones such as the Pixel receive updates for? I bet it's not 5 years even though they cost similar silly money as Apple.

  6. Cringely is neglecting the interest rate... by mccalli · · Score: 1

    0%. Apple is trying to get people to buy devices, not create a financial powerhouse.

    1. Re:Cringely is neglecting the interest rate... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Why not? Apple could start leasing their phones out, with or without data and voice plans attached. Minimum contract 18 months / 2 years.

      It's probably the only way some of their poorer customers could afford the expensive new shiny things they crave.

      It could be a (financially) clever move.

    2. Re:Cringely is neglecting the interest rate... by Joe_Dragon · · Score: 1

      with 30% APR

    3. Re:Cringely is neglecting the interest rate... by mccalli · · Score: 2

      In the EU at least that's illegal - unbundling laws happened a few years ago and you are charged for device and plan separately. You could do minimum voice/data of 2 years I think, but you can't do the same for the device - it's a separate finance agreement.

  7. Re:Apple does buy up competition by Cmdln+Daco · · Score: 1

    WTF? Sony was making what were perceived as 'top end' electronics when Apple's founders were making illegal blue-boxes for foreign students to steal long distance time from the phone companies.

  8. "Financial services" is another way to say by mark_reh · · Score: 2

    loan sharking. Apple will become a huge loan sharking operation that uses their phones to get into your wallet (instead of the more traditional sports book). How else is Apple going to get people to spend more and more on new phones? They're already over $1k. Right now ATT and Verizon are capturing all that revenue. I can't imagine they are going to be very happy about Apple's moves to take that revenue from them.

    The same thing is happening in many industries. Corporations are buying up individual and group owned dental practices and doing a lot of advertising on TV. Under their careful and care-full management, many, many more people get the dentures they "need" for "affordable monthly payments". A word of advice: if you spend more time talking to the staff about financial arrangements than you do with the dentist, find another dentist.

  9. Just like the old GM by known_coward_69 · · Score: 1

    up until chapter 11 it was one of the largest health insurance companies and a bank that just happened to make cars.

    when the hardware becomes a commodity and profit margins drop, you suck up all the money spent around your hardware

    1. Re:Just like the old GM by Gilgaron · · Score: 1

      Hmm... with the cash reserves they have, now I'm wondering if their service wouldn't end up being to lease the phones instead of selling them.

    2. Re:Just like the old GM by dasunt · · Score: 2

      up until chapter 11 it was one of the largest health insurance companies and a bank that just happened to make cars.

      The old banking business of GM is alive and well. It used to be known as GMAC. But you likely have heard of their new name: Ally Financial.

      They offer an online only banking system that is known for having really great savings and CD rates (2.20% APR for savings, 2.75% for a 12 month CD).

  10. Every Company that does this Fails by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Interesting

    Every single company that decides that "services are more profitable than productivity" eventually fails big and has to correct.

    I've worked for GE, Honeywell, and a couple of other fortune 500s, and each time I got to witness the destruction from the inside that comes from the CEO and board deciding that they want to be a services company rather than a company that makes things.

    I got to witness the wholesale destruction of jobs as each company outsourced those services to low-cost countries and had only a staff of "front men" in the US to pretend they were the competence behind those services.

    It worked great until their customers realized they could just outsource those services themselves and not have a middleman.

    What Apple looks like it is trying to do is lock its stupidly hyper-loyal fanbase into a cycle of insurmountable debt, turning them into modern-day digital sharecroppers. "Sure we've raised the price of our phones to $1200, but we'll finance it at high rates and a term longer than the lifetime of the product, and when it dies and you need a new one, we'll conveniently refinance the rest of the loan into the loan on the new phone. And oh by the way, if you don't buy a new phone with this convenient rollover financing, you'll have to pay off the note on your dead phone in full right away because we've lost our security."

    Predatory lending at its best.

    1. Re:Every Company that does this Fails by epine · · Score: 1

      I got to witness the wholesale destruction of jobs as each company outsourced those services to low-cost countries ...

      Yeah, there's this one guy in India, who has more work to do than you could possibly imagine, but it barely makes ends meet, so he's reluctant to relax his outsource monopoly.

    2. Re:Every Company that does this Fails by umghhh · · Score: 1

      My thoughts too. What I saw so far is that services connected to the stuff we made were to be major source of income. That was decades ago. In fact we could see that services were bringing a lots of money. Only the art of the services was overlooked by the BMA drones - that the services were directly linked to the stuff we produced. In other words: if we skip producing stuff we have not much to offer that commands a premium from customers. It is not to say it is not possible to have a profitable service based company. Only this is more difficult than to skip current manufacturing that company has and move on to service sector where market share was directly linked to this manufacturing that we just closed.

    3. Re:Every Company that does this Fails by stuff-n-things · · Score: 3, Interesting

      Yes, indeed. GE is effectively gone, replaced by a retailer in the Dow Jones (https://www.marketwatch.com/story/general-electric-booted-from-dow-jones-industrial-average-2018-06-19). Apple may be just a bank in 20 years, and it will be just a bit player. Past time for Tim to go.

    4. Re:Every Company that does this Fails by timeOday · · Score: 1

      Good post, but does any of it mean Cringely's prediction of them following this path is incorrect? Maybe it's sort of a black hole that companies get pulled into when they are too successful for too long and the money pushes out the actual business.

    5. Re:Every Company that does this Fails by Shotgun · · Score: 1

      Every single company that decides that "services are more profitable than productivity" eventually fails big and has to correct.

      You'll need to define "fails big" in this instance.

      Every year around where I live, farmers go out with these big machines and DESTROY THEIR OWN CROPS. They call it "harvesting", but the end result is that they completely ravage and destroy every single one of the plants they just spent all year to grow.

      From the C-level view of the world, these are businesses, not religions. If there is more short-term money to be made in finances, that is clearly the path to go. Build it up, then harvest it.

      --
      Aah, change is good. -- Rafiki
      Yeah, but it ain't easy. -- Simba
    6. Re:Every Company that does this Fails by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      Yes, indeed. GE is effectively gone

      In 2018, GE ranked among the Fortune 500 as the 18th-largest firm in the U.S. by gross revenue. I'd like to be that gone.

  11. Re:Blast from the past. by Applehu+Akbar · · Score: 1

    And I can renember when Microsoft was the dinky, revered upstart against the hated empire of IBM.

  12. Right, because... by Maury+Markowitz · · Score: 1

    > and announcing an Apple credit card with Goldman Sachs

    My grocery store chain has a credit card too. So does that mean they're a financial services company too?

    > Jack Welch took GE into financial services in 1981, transforming the company and increasing its market cap by 4000 percent over his 20 years

    And then lost almost all of it when people stopped being enamoured with a single number on the quarterly reports. And I'm sorry, but Tim Cook does not inspire the same sort of loyalty among money men as Jack Welsh did on his worst day. Sturm und Drang is not his thing.

  13. ugh by negrace · · Score: 1

    What are his predictions doing on the first page? He is wrong most of the time, and then he cheats next year when he awards himself "I guessed it mostly correct", lol. His predictions are a big joke. Ask him about Minecraft though :)

  14. Re:GE and 1981.... by hey! · · Score: 2

    The hardest thing in business, and (equivalently) one that costs a lot of money: obtaining customers.

    Once you have the customer relationship you can buy or hire the expertise needed to exploit it different ways.

    --
    Post may contain irony: discontinue use if experiencing mood swings, nausea or elevated blood pressure.
  15. Good news, bad news by timholman · · Score: 1

    What Apple is probably closest to becoming is a hedge fund -- a very big hedge fund in fact.

    So good news for my Apple stock, bad news for my desire to buy a worthwhile replacement for my 7-year-old MacBook Pro.

    At this rate, I'll be calculating my Apple stock dividends on a Linux laptop a couple of years from now.

  16. Re:Apple does buy up competition by UnknownSoldier · · Score: 1

    Agree with your first half. However your time table is a just a little bit off:

    Sony was selling their transistor radio, TR-55, back in 1955 -- long BEFORE Apple. One of Sony's last mass popular consumer electronics was the Walkman which starting selling in 1979 -- the same year Apple was selling the Apple ][+.

    How is Sony copying Apple when they were selling electronics before Apple even existed???

    Sony makes MOST of its money (63%) selling insurance.

    Sony pivoted to finance from electronics a long time ago.

  17. Re:Apple does buy up competition by HornWumpus · · Score: 1

    You might have missed the whole 'playstation' thing. Pretty sure they all outsold the walkman.

    Also cameras, bet your phone has a Sony CCD in it. Of course I could be wrong, your phone might have a shitty camera.

    --
    John McAfee 'It was like that time I hired that Bangkok prostitute; to do my taxes, while I fucked my accountant'
  18. Re:Everyone Taking the Brazilian Model by HornWumpus · · Score: 1

    That's the 'shiney loving moron model'. It's worldwide to varying degrees and why about half of Americans have a negative net worth.

    --
    John McAfee 'It was like that time I hired that Bangkok prostitute; to do my taxes, while I fucked my accountant'
  19. Re:Apple does buy up competition by LostMyAccount · · Score: 2

    I actually think Sony is a cautionary tale for Apple. From about 1977 through the mid-80s or so, Sony was really the Apple of consumer audio and video products. Great design and high quality. It was peak Japanese high tech. There was even a professional studio version of their products, giving their consumer products a kind of "pro" seal of approval. Sony was even into their own "better' formats, like Betamax and later, Minidisc.

    If you were a balls-out stud in 1982 you had a Trinitron TV, a Walkman, and probably at least one Sony stereo component.

    But somehow they didn't transition well to digital besides Playstation. They became a commodity player, albeit expensive, and really only the TVs were at the top of the heap, and even they lost TVs in the move to flat panels.

    IMHO, Apple's problem is a lack of risk taking. They *should* be doing a Manhattan Project scale product development on something outside of iPhone/iPad with all their cash. The Manhattan project cost about $25 billion today's money, and the Apollo project around $200 billion. Apple literally has the resources to duplicate *both* those investments to scale.

    I don't know what $100-200 billion in R&D looks like, but I bet its pretty cool.

    Instead of taking those risks, Apple coasts on its iPhone, rigidly controlling the platform to prevent third parties and users from exploiting it in ways Apple doesn't control or undermine future half-step upgrades they want people to buy. They hoard cash, buy back stock and get into all the little financial gimmicks that please audit committees and institutional investors.

  20. Re:Apple does buy up competition by UnknownSoldier · · Score: 1

    1. Which is why I said "One of".

    2. The Walkman sold ~400 million (*) copies (~200 million were the cassette player). That is roughly on par with ALL the PlayStations combined (~434 million)

    PS1 = 102 million sales
    PS2 = 155 million sales
    PS3 = 83 million
    PS3 = 94 million

    (*) Not sure where the Verge is getting 400 million from. Wikipedia lists 385 million as of 2009.

    Regardless, while Sony has been extremely successful in the Electronics sector their bread-and-butter is still Insurance.