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Trump Endorses Permanent Daylight Savings Time (thehill.com)

President Trump on Monday threw his support behind efforts to keep the United States permanently on daylight saving time, which took effect Sunday morning. "Making Daylight Saving Time permanent is O.K. with me!" Trump tweeted. The Hill reports: California and several other states are considering measures that would end the biannual clock changes between standard and daylight saving time. Three GOP lawmakers from Florida introduced legislation in Congress this month that would end the November clock change from daylight saving time back to standard time. The measures, introduced by Sens. Marco Rubio and Rick Scott and Rep. Vern Buchanan, would keep the country in daylight saving time, the clock change made in early March that is observed by most states for eight months of the year. Rubio introduced a similar measure in 2018. That bill did not advance in the Senate.

49 of 376 comments (clear)

  1. Just pick a damned time by Snotnose · · Score: 5, Informative

    I don't care if it's DST or standard, just quit changing the damn thing twice a year. Myself, I prefer it getting darker later, whichever one that is. But I don't care enough to change my damned sleep cycle twice a year.

    1. Re:Just pick a damned time by supremebob · · Score: 5, Insightful

      I never really understood why we "fell back" to standard time during winter, the one time of the year where the extra hour of daylight in the evening was the most useful.

      Daylight until 8:30 PM during Summer never seemed all that helpful, but daylight when you're trying to drive home from work around 5:30? Now THAT is useful!

      Yeah, sure... It would be better yet if management left everyone leave at 4 PM during Winter to improve their commutes, but we all know that's not going to happen in most organizations.

    2. Re:Just pick a damned time by Rick+Schumann · · Score: 2, Informative

      DST was originally to benefit farmers whose workday was dictated by daylight hours. Since that's not an issue anymore we don't need DST.

    3. Re:Just pick a damned time by rahvin112 · · Score: 2

      Because daylight earlier in the morning helps people wake up. I know it helps me.

      Permanent day light savings time would be fine with me though. But congress is the only one that can change it. Individual states can't.

    4. Re:Just pick a damned time by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Why would farmers care what time the clock showed?

    5. Re:Just pick a damned time by Beeftopia · · Score: 5, Interesting

      A more "colorful" history of DST:

      At some point in elementary school, many American children learn that Daylight Saving Time was originally intended to give farmers an extra hour of light to work the fields.

      That is, in fact, a lie.

      Farmers actually hated the practice, because it cut an hour of daylight in the morning, leaving them with an hour less to get goods to market, according to Michael Downing, author of the book Spring Forward: The Annual Madness of Daylight Saving Time. In reality, the extra hour of evening daylight was good for one thing: selling products. ...

      Specifically we have the candy lobby, the barbecue lobby, and the golf ball lobby to thank for modern American Daylight Saving Time. But we’ll get to that in a second.

      And another article, from Smithsonian magazine.

    6. Re:Just pick a damned time by angel'o'sphere · · Score: 3, Informative

      No, the idea was to save electricity, as in switching on lights later etc.
      For farmers it does not matter at all, they don't care what time is displayed on their watch.

      --
      Cost free eBook I read (by iBook/Kobo/Amazon/ObookO/Gutenberg etc.): "The Green Odyssey" by Philip Jose Farmer.
    7. Re:Just pick a damned time by magarity · · Score: 4, Informative

      Then again, I'm sort of a diehard UTC person. College caught me that who cares what time you wake up on the clock. Especially with the global economy I know business meetings across 4 timezones and all their nuances would go a lot smoother if we just set UTC meeting times.

      China has all one time zone - it's rather strange to fly west 4 hours and not change your watch. And the sun comes up at 3 am. Although their mentality about it is that Beijing is the center of their universe so everyone is on that city's time.

    8. Re:Just pick a damned time by XanC · · Score: 2

      They can opt out, but they can't go for permanent DST without Congressional approval.

    9. Re:Just pick a damned time by mark-t · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Daylight until 8:30 PM during Summer never seemed all that helpful, but daylight when you're trying to drive home from work around 5:30? Now THAT is useful!

      Not nearly as useful as having exposure to at least *some* sunlight in the morning before a person start's their work day. While it's true that many people begin their commute while it is still dark in the winter, a *vast* majority of them still get to experience at least some sunlight before heading indoors at the end of their commute. Exposure to even just 15 minutes of sunlight in the morning boosts seratonin levels, which in turn boosts melatonin production in the evening and is vital for having healthy and restful sleep... delaying exposure to sunlight until later in the day does not boost seratonin levels as high as it will in the morning and further delays melatonin production, leading to health problems related to the lack of restful sleep. You're talking about a "nice to have", but comparing it to something that we are biologically adapted to, which is to function primarily during the day.... well, as I've said before on this subject, evolution is not a democracy.

      And while you wouldn't get the sudden chaos that changing the clocks twice per year brings, instead slowly ramping up and then slowly ramping down throughout the winter, but keeping the clocks pushed ahead through the winter months would be certainly disasterous for a period of about 3 to 4 weeks in the middle of winter for people who live north of about 45 degrees, which while not a majority of Americans, is still not a small a number.

    10. Re: Just pick a damned time by Miamicanes · · Score: 2

      Morning traffic is naturally spread across a 3-5 hour window of time. In contrast, when DST ends, EVERYBODY (statistically) goes running for the door between 4:30 and 5:30pm, causing INSTANT gridlock that persists for hours.

      It's particularly graphic in South Florida. In the summer, people without kids tend to work later, avoiding the instant 5pm gridlock that happens during the winter.

      Think of it as time-domain multiplexing for freeways. If everyone on a cellular network tries to transfer a megabyte at 5pm, the network grinds to a halt and NOBODY'S data gets through. Stagger that same megabyte over a longer interval of time, and data gets through. When the sun sets early, it induces people to all hit the roads at once.

    11. Re:Just pick a damned time by yorgasor · · Score: 5, Informative

      They never did. They get up when the animals do or when the fields need taking care of. They couldn't care less what the clock says.

      --
      Looking for a computer support specialist for your small business? Check out
    12. Re: Just pick a damned time by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Funny

      Can I come visit you in binary world sometime, where people live either on the southern or northern border and the season is either the heart of summer or the deep of winter.

    13. Re: Just pick a damned time by houghi · · Score: 2

      I was thinking about the times you stated an then realized that the whole of the US is more south than Europe.

      So in summer it is light for a few more hours in many places.

      --
      Don't fight for your country, if your country does not fight for you.
    14. Re: Just pick a damned time by Cederic · · Score: 3, Funny

      if you want to have a been

      What the fuck?

      The length of a daylight in a day does not change, regardless if the sun rises at 4am, 9pm or whatever

      No, but whether it's light when you go to work/school or light when you get home from work/school does change and does matter to people.

    15. Re: Just pick a damned time by Shotgun · · Score: 2

      So? Go to the school board meeting or talk to your manager to get the start/stop time changed. Why do we need to fuck up every clock in the nation twice a year to accomodate local variances?

      --
      Aah, change is good. -- Rafiki
      Yeah, but it ain't easy. -- Simba
    16. Re:Just pick a damned time by Shotgun · · Score: 2

      You can muck with the hands or digits on your clocks all you want. It will make not one iota in the lightness or darkness of mornings or evenings anywhere. That is controlled by the tilt and speed of the Earth's rotation, not the arbitrary numbers on your clock.

      --
      Aah, change is good. -- Rafiki
      Yeah, but it ain't easy. -- Simba
    17. Re: Just pick a damned time by Martin+Blank · · Score: 2

      They're not going to change opening hours for one person, or even for a few people. Too much of the world works on expectations of business opening times of 9:00, not a shifting time throughout the year based on sunrise. It has these expectations because they work, otherwise you're back to cities 100 miles apart working on slightly different schedules based on their local sunrise and sunset. We got rid of that for a reason.

      --
      You can never go home again... but I guess you can shop there.
  2. About damned time by Y2K+is+bogus · · Score: 5, Funny

    Trump says something that isn't completely idiotic!

    1. Re:About damned time by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Funny

      And he even got the Daylight vs Standard Time distinction correct, and expressed a policy choice succinctly.

      Which means somebody else wrote the tweet.

    2. Re:About damned time by Tablizer · · Score: 2, Funny

      About time he says something right. [paraphrased]

      You know what they say about a broken daylight savings clock being right twice a year.

    3. Re:About damned time by rnturn · · Score: 5, Funny

      Yeah but there's always the chance that he said that because he thinks it's actually saving daylight.

      --
      CUR ALLOC 20195.....5804M
    4. Re:About damned time by Rick+Schumann · · Score: 2

      Trump says something that isn't completely idiotic!
      Could have been just dumb luck, it's a simple binary choice.

    5. Re:About damned time by spitzak · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Even a stopped clock is right twice a day!

    6. Re:About damned time by Krishnoid · · Score: 3, Interesting

      And he said 'Saving' instead of 'Savings'. I'm suspicious.

    7. Re:About damned time by Aighearach · · Score: 4, Interesting

      That's the joke; it is suspicious because it is a common mistake, but he didn't make it. And he makes a lot of grammatical and spelling mistakes.

    8. Re:About damned time by AmiMoJo · · Score: 2

      Not when the clocks go forward and we lose an hour. That day it's never 01:30!

      --
      const int one = 65536; (Silvermoon, Texture.cs)
      SJW, n: "Someone I don't like, and by the way I'm a fuckwit" - AC
    9. Re:About damned time by spitzak · · Score: 2

      On the day clocks go back a stopped clock can be right 3 times, however. So it makes up for it.

  3. knowing that guy... by Tablizer · · Score: 5, Funny

    I bet he asked it be named, "Trump Standard Time". And maybe "Time Force" the second option.

  4. For how long? by Gravis+Zero · · Score: 2

    If you know this president then it's that he flip-flops when the pressure is on. As soon as a Republican objects he will change his position. Count on it.

    --
    Anons need not reply. Questions end with a question mark.
  5. Standard all year by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Informative

    Thoose advocating year round DST don't remember the disaster in the mid-70s. The country switched to year round DST for two years. It was quickly killed for many reasons. Scvhool children going to class in the dark was one, another was that people in cold country discovered that an extra hour of sun in the evening was of no benefit, but darkness until 8:320 or 9 was a pain.
    I hope rational heads will prevail on this, at a minimum keep the current system, or better yet, kill DST altogether.

    1. Re:Standard all year by MikeDataLink · · Score: 2

      This argument baffles me. Here's a concept. Get up earlier or go to bed later. The amount of time in the day is unchanged.

      What? It's dark for kids? You know schools can choose what hours they open and close?

      What? Construction workers have to work in the dark? They too can change what hours they work. Just like they do when it rains.

      --
      Mike @ The Geek Pub. Let's Make Stuff!
  6. Split the diff - go 30 minutes by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Look I get it - Winter is dark up north. And the sun comes up really early in the summer (I have daylight from 5ish AM to almost 10pm where I live). Fireworks don't start until 9:30.

    But I too hate the 1 hour forward/back. It's miserable. Why not get the benefits of both and pick the middle.

  7. Wait until he finds out Obama's position... by bussdriver · · Score: 2

    FOX mistakenly probably gave him the idea with the yearly bitching that losing an hour causes; they'll set him straight on if he gets serious... unless they poll it gains him a few points... They've still got to win over the smarter portion of the below average IQ voters.

    Stupid or Evil. Ignorance of him is no longer an excuse.

  8. Re:Exactly:About damned time by Major_Disorder · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Trump says many things that are not idiotic.

    Citation needed.
    I have listened to him speak, and read many of his tweets. This is sufficient for me to know without a shred of doubt, that he is a moron.

    --
    First law of people: People are generally stupid.
  9. So much for drive-in movies. by Ungrounded+Lightning · · Score: 4, Interesting

    darker later is the way to go.

    IMHO Daylight Savings Time was much of what killed the drive in theatres. Come summer, with DST, there wasn't enough time after sunset to attend a double feature and still get home and to bed in time to get up before sunrise and make it to work.

    In the summer what we're short of isn't light. It's darkness. If the government must screw around with the clocks twice a year, they should move them BACK in the spring and return them to standard in the fall.

    I call it "Night Life Savings Time".

    --
    Bantam Dominique roosters crow a four-note song. Once you've heard it as "Happy BIRTHday" you can't NOT hear it that way
    1. Re:So much for drive-in movies. by Waffle+Iron · · Score: 5, Insightful

      If the government must screw around with the clocks twice a year, they should move them BACK in the spring and return them to standard in the fall.

      I call it "Night Life Savings Time".

      Hmmm... a real dilemma: No drive-in theaters vs. the sun streaming in at 3:30am in the summer.

      I'll side with 99.9% of the population and ditch the drive-ins.

    2. Re:So much for drive-in movies. by GoingDown · · Score: 2

      In Finland, we had poll about whether to stay on DST or winter time. Result was 52% in winter time and 48% in DST. Of course because this was a public poll results are only giving a direction, but it is nowhere near 99% vs 1%.

      I myself really do not care. If we all go to DST, then slowly and gradually our wake-up hours will shift little bit later and later, until we see that when previously we were living in (for example) 7-22 wake-up hours, then after years of permanent DST wake-up hours shift for 8-23.

      It really would not matter. People to tend to go to sleep too late anyway, and wake up with too little sleep.

  10. Now, if he'd come out in favor of universal UTC by 93+Escort+Wagon · · Score: 2

    A million Unix sysadmins' heads would explode.

    --
    #DeleteChrome
    1. Re:Now, if he'd come out in favor of universal UTC by TeknoHog · · Score: 2

      We don't care what time it is in Greenwich, UK.

      Those who work with people in other countries would care a lot, and those who do any long-distance travel. Which not a small bunch. For those, a global standard time would be extremely convenient.

      Of course, this would mean a lot of adjustment for your local time. But DST already makes solar noon at 1 PM, which is not its natural time. Your local working hours would still be around solar noon, just not using numbers like 8 AM to 5 PM. Especially when "AM" and "PM" refer to before and after noon -- you really should move on to 24-hour time by then.

      --
      Escher was the first MC and Giger invented the HR department.
  11. Re:To kill fewer children. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Interesting

    You got a source for that claim? This talks about the 1974 experiment. Says it ended before Halloween, and mentions not a word about a spike in car-pedestrian accidents.

    https://www.mercurynews.com/2016/10/30/the-year-daylight-saving-time-went-too-far/ (not Ad Blocker friendly)

    But this article says that studies have shown that changing the clock twice a year has actual health risks.
    https://www.inc.com/jessica-stillman/experts-to-public-daylight-savings-time-is-a-434m-problem-we-could-easily-fix.html

  12. WON'T SOMEBODY THINK OF THE CHILDREN?!!11111 by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Funny

    I swear to GOD. Kids fuck everything up.

  13. Re:To kill fewer children. by mark-t · · Score: 3, Interesting

    Except it doesn't actually save energy. The last study which suggested it does was conducted in the 1970's and was the impetus behind the most recent change to the DST schedule in 1996 which lengthened it by several weeks throughout the year, and while the study predicted a measurable energy savings even for those few weeks, those savings completely failed to materialize, showing very clearly that the energy demands which the study had examined and predicted a savings on were an artifact of how energy was used at the time, and not reflective of how we use energy today. The reason the clocks were not changed back was because of the expense of invoking yet another change to DST. Abolishing it entirely, by comparison, would not produce anywhere nearly as much expense because there are many places that already do not observe DST.

  14. Stop calling it "Permanent DST" by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Insightful

    For those who advocate "permanent DST", let's apply a little terminology. "DST" is a term that applies to the practice of changing the clock to something other than your actual time zone. It's not an actual time zone like EST or PST. If DST is made permanent, you're not in "DST" anymore, because the term is then meaningless. Rather, you're in the next time zone to the east of you.

    So let's call a spade a spade here. If your standard time zone is PST and you advocate "permanent DST", what you really want is to switch from Pacific Time to Mountain Time -- even though you live in San Francisco. If you live in Texas and like the idea of "permanent DST", what you really want is to switch from Central Time to Eastern Time -- even though you live in the middle of the damn country. And so on.

    Now we can finally see that the idea of "permanent DST" is ridiculous, confusing, and short-sighted. To be clear, if the stupid practice of changing the clocks was never invented in the first place, we would have all gone about our lives happily ever after, and never gave a second thought to it. But because we spent a few decades clinging to this stupid practice, now we have a debate. I say get over it, accept the time zone you live in, and wake up an hour early if you truly want to. Nobody is preventing you from doing that.

  15. Beyond stupid... by Pyramid · · Score: 4, Insightful

    You can't make a rope longer by cutting a foot off one end and attaching it to the other. "Permanent DST" is identical to getting up 1 hour earlier. Just leave how we indicate time alone so the sun is (roughly) at its greatest height on the ecliptic at noon in any given time zone instead of playing a stupid shell game that doesn't do anything but mess up astronomical time.

    --
    ~Any apparent grammatical or typographic errors are caused by defects in your display device.
  16. Re:Idiocracy by Pyramid · · Score: 2

    There's an easy solution to this. It's called, "getting up an hour earlier".

    --
    ~Any apparent grammatical or typographic errors are caused by defects in your display device.
  17. Re:To kill fewer children. by bobschmagogee · · Score: 2

    Have you talked to a kid lately? They're idiots. They need more school, not less.

  18. Just how the law got written by sjbe · · Score: 2

    Why can't the individual States decide?

    Because that's the way the laws were written a few decades back when they implemented the current system. Not saying it is good or bad, just that that's what happened. Canada evidently wrote their laws differently which is neither better nor worse - just a different solution to the same problem. For whatever reason the federal law in the US allows states to opt out of DST permanently but does not permit opting in permanently. Not sure why but that's what happened. Since this is a federal law it requires congress to change it.

    There is evidently a workaround that at least one state is considering which is to move their time zone to the next one over (which states evidently can do) and then opt out of DST. Same effect on a technicality in the law.

    For the record I'm STRONGLY in favor of DST all year round. More daylight in the evening is a good thing.

  19. Re:Exactly:About damned time by Areyoukiddingme · · Score: 2

    How is it that a moron beat out so many other people for the presidency?

    He's a moron with a message other morons can relate to. And most of the time he's a really affable guy. He's eminently electable. Totally incompetent. But perfectly electable.