Slashdot Mirror
Netscape 4.7 Arrives on the Scene
Stephen Donner wrote to let us know that Netscape 4.7
is out and ready for download, albeit for UNIX/Macintosh systems. The FTP server is behaving like a slug so be patient. Here's to hoping that when I download it, it fixes some of these JavaScript "issues".
IE5 has got it right. First off, the "desktop integration" is down to IE3 levels, rather than IE4. But there are three main reasons I'm using it over Netscape right now:
1) It renders large tables almost on the fly.
2) You can customize the toolbar and take out all those buttons you never use (you can have a toolbar consisting of merely back, forward, and stop if you wanted.)
3) Drop down menu for language encoding. I can go to one of the many japanese sites in my bookmarks and it automatically decodes the JIS. I NEVER got this to work in Netscape.
-Lx?
The name of the environment variable that turns off the dns_helper is actually MOZILLA_NO_ASYNC_DNS
Well, maybe it is offtopic to compare the two browsers, but I support IE 5, and if it has not failed/hosed the os (if you are on windows) then you are lucky. I get at least one call each day from a tech with a customer that has an IE that will not open- no error, it just does not open. Repair, uninstall/reinstall does not fix it, and since there is no error, there is not really any way to troubleshoot the problem (fourtuneately since IE "becomes part of the OS" we can then refer them to the mfr. who will have them format and reinstall, and this is support for a company that is partly OWNED by microsoft). Add the supremely large acive x security hole to the mix, and I wouldn't install it on my computer, even if they did make one for my OS -which they won't. But I will give it this, IE 5's problems are at least less frequent than IE 4's (I still support it too), and 4's problems gave you a trashed os a lot more often than 5 does. At any rate, if you are using windows, the last thing I would advise is to install an application that makes the os less stable and secure, If Netscape crashes or becomes completely unusable, at least that is all that crashed.
_this is not a signature_
I don't know where the documentation (if any) is, I figured most of this out by reading the XFE code. From my .Xdefaults:
Netscape*toolBar.search.isEnabled: false
a me: separator
a me: compressAllFoldersi ng: Revealc on: Searcha tionString: Reveal filed messages
I haven't downloaded, but I bet I'm going to be adding a "shopping.isEnabled: false" line real soon now..Netscape*toolBar.destinations.isEnabled: false
Netscape*toolBar.numUserCommands: 1
Netscape*toolBar.userCommand1.commandName: findInObject
Netscape*toolBar.userCommand1.labelString: Find
Netscape*toolBar.userCommand1.commandIcon: Find
Netscape*MailThread*toolBar.numUserCommands: 2
Netscape*MailThread*toolBar.userCommand1.commandN
Netscape*MailThread*toolBar.userCommand2.commandN
Netscape*MailThread*toolBar.userCommand2.labelStr
Netscape*MailThread*toolBar.userCommand2.commandI
Netscape*MailThread*toolBar.userCommand2.document
Heh. I implemented these in the 3.02 codebase years ago. Plus S/MIME. Too bad they wouldn't let me release it as 3.1 back before 4.0 shipped. It would have been a "distraction", apparently.
Layers are non-standard and the decision was made to not support layers through Javascript. Mozilla will not support it. Instead, CSS should be used from now on.
The hell it's not. It was not designed that way, it was designed so that both processes would be idle until such time as the DNS server responded. See unix-dns.h. Someone must have botched things so that netlib is looping calling DNS_ServiceProcess() repeatedly, even though the fd returned by DNS_SpawnProcess() has not yet been marked readable.
This isn't too surprising, though, since netlib is such a mess that this "looping" failure mode is one of the most common things to go wrong.
But I gotta be honest -- I'm really unhappy with the last few versions of Netscape. They've been pulling a MS: building tonnes of extra (and, IMHO, unneeded) features in and sacrificing stability.
Netscape is the *only* application on my desktop that crashes chronically. I have to pull up a command line and kill -9 it at least 3-4 times a day. It's not like I'm doing anything but surfing /. and a few HOWTOs.
So, if there's anybody out there who has any pull at Netscape reading this: FIX THE STABILITY. This is your last chance with me and (I'm sure) a lot of other users.
Otherwise, hopefully Mozilla will be good when it finally comes out (anyone have any idea when that'll be?).
----
Every year during my review, I just pray the words "slashdot.org" aren't mentioned.
Okay, this has done wonders for me. I was constantly having Netscape puke on me. I turned off Java and Javascript. That help tons. Then, I got tired of not having javascript one day. I turned it back on and found that the majority of my stability issues were related to have Java turned on. So, I went on with Java disabled. Then, I came across this. Make sure you see: /root]# chkfontpath --list /usr/X11R6/lib/X11/fonts/misc:unscaled /usr/X11R6/lib/X11/fonts/75dpi:unscaled /usr/X11R6/lib/X11/fonts/100dpi:unscaled /usr/X11R6/lib/X11/fonts/misc /usr/X11R6/lib/X11/fonts/Type1 /usr/X11R6/lib/X11/fonts/Speedo /usr/X11R6/lib/X11/fonts/75dpi /usr/X11R6/lib/X11/fonts/100dpi
[root@mouse
Current directories in font path:
1:
2:
3:
4:
5:
6:
7:
8:
If you don't see this, add them! I now have had Java enabled for the last week and only had one crash (async DNS related). In short, I've been much happier. I no longer have to practice yoga for 12-hours a day to calm down and am now back drinking ten pots of coffee per day.
Hope it helps the rest of you!!!
I use KFM for most of my browsing as well. Except for right now, I'm on someone elses computer using Opera. KFM is pretty cool, I have a friend who made a torture test page that loads frames recursively. It will load a framset that splits the window into 2 sections, the page that it loads is itself. A refresh tag every couple of seconds and it quickly turns into hundreds and thousands of frames. KFM is the only browser that we have seen to handle this correctly, Netscape crashes, IE crashes, KFM keeps working until the computer completely runs out of memory (real and swap) and the process dies. This can take over a half hour, Netscape doesn't last 10min. Only time I saw a load of 16+ on a linux box.
-- Remember: Wherever you go, there you are!
This appears to be the 56 bit Standard (Exportable) Encryption version. I think I'll put off downloading/using this version until the 128 bit version is released. It will probably be a few days before their web pages are updated; which is too bad because they'll never let you ftp the files straight from them with all the encryption laws.
Anyone see the 128 bit Strong Encryption version floating around?
This is the kind of break through we've been waiting for for hundreds and hundreds of days!
But that's not all! A "Radio" thingy. Of course, the page is not found, but it's definitely a break through in convenience.
The release notes file is missing, too.
Upgrade immediately to get the satisfaction of 0.0.9th of a release.
"What's the point of going abroad, if you're just another tourist..."
If they fully implement PNG tomorrow, it'll still be 1-2 years before I can justify using it in site design (because you gotta let the don't-wanna-upgrade sect catch up). I don't wanna use UNISYS's .gifs anymore, but .jpgs don't work in all situations.
Another thing: let me shut off the ability for sites to spawn new windows. It don't want every damn site I go to sending me to porn sites and casino sites so the damned site owner can make a few cents. Shut it off, I'll turn it back on if I ever feel like smacking gophers.
----
Every year during my review, I just pray the words "slashdot.org" aren't mentioned.
more available as I get them . . .
SlashMirror: Where to put files for fellow /.'ers
SlashMirror: Where to put files for fellow /.'ers
Netscape 4.7 adds yet another button to the navigation toolbar, which is annoying because it further increases the amount of screen real estate required for me to be able to see the "Stop" button on the right. Right now, the "Shop", "My Netscape", and "Search" buttons are all candidates for removal -- if I could figure out how.
Does anyone know how to remove buttons from the toolbar? Is there some hack to the preferences.js file that would do it?
Netscape 4.xx and above: The feature is there, but it's buried under umpteen menus and hard to turn on or off.
That "feature" alone has made me never want to "upgrade" from 3.01.
Here's my "All I Ever Wanted From Netscape Or Mozilla" list, for which I've been waiting since Netscape 3.01:
If I have to download 50M of bloatware to get any or all of those four simple features, I'll do it over a 14.4k link and give you my snail-mail address and all the demographic data your marketers want. If I have to download 3M of the most elegantly-crafted code on God's green earth over a T-1, but lose the ability to easily enable/disable image autoloading that I have with NS3.01, it's still a downgrade, not an upgrade as far as I'm concerned :)
(Sounds better than "me too").
Each of these options is to die or (if you're thinking more clearly), to kill for.
<rant> KFM -- the times that I used it -- seemed a nice, minimal, fairly lightweight browser. I use Lynx a fair bit but it suffers grossly from poor page design. Opera is supposed to have a good, clean, client. How about a browser that's just a fscking browser, people? Any other suggestions out there?
</rant>
What part of "gestalt" don't you understand?
From: Daniel Veditz 7:55 PM Subject: Re: 4.7 Release for Windows? Resent-From: mozilla-builds@mozilla.org To: mozilla-builds@mozilla.org Newsgroups: netscape.public.mozilla.builds Stephen Donner wrote: > > http://slashdot.org/articles/99/09/28/1825256.shtm l > > I posted the release of 4.7 for the Mac and Unix platforms, when are we > going to see the Windows 9x/NT builds? 4.7 has not officially been released. If you happen to have found something calling itself on our servers consider it an early bonus. -Dan Veditz
The thing that got to me the most was the hanging - I'd close the browser and later start it again, only to find that a ghost had remained resident and prevented my new window to open! Then it would give me that not responding BS...
I surf with usually more than one browser window open - I'd hit one of my favorite pages and go to visit another window, only to click on the window later and see only a screen with the other window's contents, and the browser hanging on "contacting host." Or how about when you surf to a page and none of the links would be clickable - you try to shut down but it hangs!
One of my favorite sites, Thresh's Firingsquad, would freeze Netscape for about ten seconds while loading! This is on a dual Pentium III system folks, 256mb RAM, NT 4.0 with Service Pack 5, connected to a LAN. I don't think stability and dependability are too much to ask for considering these resources - apparently Netscape does because their software has gone in the crapper once version 4 came out.
Those damn illegal operations: surf with more than one window and close a window? Maybe it doesn't like that, illegal operation. Add a bookmark? Maybe it doesn't like that, illegal operation. Hell, when I'd finally restart again it would destroy the changes I made to my bookmark file - these past few months I've found myself arbitrarily copying my current URL with CTRL-C just in case Netscape crashes and it would destroy my history, no lie.
I'm tired of the crap, Netscape. Fix it: make it stable, light on its feet, and get rid of the crap nobody but braindead AOLers want - fix what's wrong with your software or I'll stay away forever.
I feel like a Nazi using IE5, but it is stable, light, dependable. I'll continue to use it until someone gives me what I want: a clean, sturdy, and stable version of Netscape, whether Netscape is the one to bring it to me or not.
--------
Oscarfish.com: tropical fish with attitude. Way t
Think Mozilla.
win32 (16.2MB) ftp://128.253.254.56/communi cator47/winpro/cp32e47.exe
mac (12.9MB) ftp://128.2 53.254.56/communicator47/maccomplete/Comm4.7_Compl ete_EX.bin
glibc2 (16.2MB) ftp://128.253.254.56/communicator47/glibc20complet e/communicator -v47-export.x86-unknown-linuxglibc2.0.tar.gz
libc5 (15.1MB) ftp://128.253.254.56/communicator47/libc5complete/ communicator-v47-expo rt.x86-unknown-linux2.0.tar.gz
SlashMirror: Where to put files for fellow /.'ers
SlashMirror: Where to put files for fellow /.'ers
The current potato has a Netscape which is linked against libc5, which has at least substantially reduced if not eliminated this problem for me (it hasn't happened since that change, but that says nothing.. :) ). A bit of a kludge (I think probably the actual problem is binary incompatibility with glibc2.1) but it works.
:-P
You should update your system more often if you want to live on the bleeding edge
Daniel
Hurry up and jump on the individualist bandwagon!
... that doesn't have any problems with Netscape?
I'm running NT4/SP5, 96mb of RAM, dual PPro 200 (yes, old school, I know). No problems. It starts up quickly, it runs well, it's kind of a dog when it comes to rendering pages.
I installed IE4 a while back to test it, and when it took a full 30 seconds to open, I uninstalled it. I think the main thing would be to only download what you need. If you don't need it for mail/news, DON'T DOWNLOAD COMMUNICATOR. Just download the browser.
I've visited all the URLs that people are saying hang their Netscapes, and it seems to be working just dandy for me. I have Javascript on, Java off.
I'm seeing a lot of "Netscape's crap" posts... does it work for anyone else, or am I alone on this one?
-- I can't think of anything witty to put here. Sorry.