REI justifies the higher prices with their 'membership dividend'... a store credit issued at the end of each fiscal year that returns a percentage of the member's purchases (not including sale items). If you ever step into one of their stores I'm sure you'll hear all about their membership benefits from every salesperson within earshot.
It's like $15 for a lifetime membership... and their flock of green vested employees (all duped into working for chickenfeed in exchange for the ability to order product at cost, that they can never afford because they work for chickenfeed) has been drilled in every possible response to every conceivable reservation a customer might have about purchasing membership.
It's a scary joint... like the mini-WalMart of the outdoor industry. Their website is thorough, and they are data rich (lots of good marketing data comes from all those memberships), so I wouldn't say they were behind the curve... more like they are just really good at capitalizing on suckers.
EVE is by no means 'won' or 'over'... you might do well to familiarize yourself with the changes introduced in the last major past (which, btw, does not require additional funding on top of the monthly fee).
The more complex processes required to take and defend territory have forced BoB onto the defensive (as there is no way they could instantly develop and defend all of the territory they previously laid claim to) and there is a lot of room for other corporations (EVE's version of the guild) and alliances to grab some land.
Their main challenge at this point appears to be support of large scale fleet battles. The new game mechanics call for huge fleet fights in contested regions, and the reality of these fights is a 600+ man lag fest.
If you left because you thought the fight was lost... hop on the forums and take a look at the latest maps... chances are the conquered stations where you left all of your gear are open again for business.
That was the prevailing mantra in fantasy based MMORPG's. And then WoW and GW came along and defied that mantra.... and kicked everyone else's asses.
Actually WoW rode on the success of a previous generation of 3D MMORPGs, of which your friend DAoC is a member. They were not the 'first' to any of this... DAoC and others already did the whole 'die and keep your gear' thing and yes, it was well received and made for some fun gameplay where people go totally balls-out because they know the worst that can happen is that you might need to drop a few plat to repair your stuff.
Its pretty clear that from a market/business/popularity perspective that the "You can lose months of work in 30 seconds"-thing lost-out in a huge way to the "safer", "nice-warm-bath" approach.
Years later, UO is still running as a 2D/crappy3D game... the ONLY reason many folks left Ultima Online (which still enjoys a subscriber base) is because they ditched the client revamp and people wanted eye-candy. Put the DAoC or WoW interface on UO and I am back in an instant. The move from UO to DAoC and the like is the move that you are giving WoW credit for.
When the space-based equivalent of WoW hits the shelves ("World of Starcraft", perhaps?) EVE is going to see far, far more attrition than they know. And for those who say "Yeah, but all those people with all that time invested -- those guys won't jump-ship"... well... that ain't what happened to DAoC, EQ, Asheron's or any of the others when WoW launched.
How does this comparison work? Ultimately you are talking about the 'price of death', right? So WoW's success over the other MMOs mentioned (same 'price of death') has some relevence to the ability of your "World of Starcraft" (totally different 'price of death') to deplete the EVE player base? WoW succeeded because it gave players of similarly styled games more of what they wanted, arguably the advantage of NOT being first to market. This argument loses steam when you start predicting the effects of a totally differently styled game on the player base of EVE.
Idunno, I guess some of the shallow grave stuff from the fantasy MMOs just doesn't feel like it would quite fit in the Sci-Fi ones... I can get into the idea of my Shadowblade respawning after death and still having armor and weapons and stuff, but watching my ship blow up and then respawning in it? That feels more like a spacefighter sim, or FPS (first person shipper?).
gawd was it really 50 days for covetor? no wonder my character still sucks:(
seriously though... what you are describing is the same experience you would get in DAoC if you never left Mag Mell in Hibernia... the game is 'open ended'... it is what you make of it... so if you choose to farm rocks solo in a mining barge then that is what you get.
that being said... skilling up for other ships/mods and running some different mission types should feel very different... and there is always lo-sec and no-sec... who knows what is going to happen out there from day to day?
for a start at PvP that is not in 0.0... look up Privateer Alliance and see if you can't get into one of their corps... they declare war on 0.0 alliances and then fight them in 'safe-space'... you would be a quick sell to them because you can mine... and in return you will be able to hunt war targets without having to go into the depths of lawless space to do it.
remember that the backstory is that this is human evolution wayyyy off in the future... they arent going to be speaking like an arthurian legend.
movies that might take place in the eve universe would be an example of proper role playing for futuristic space stories... like... hmmmm... ok, Pitch Black (vin diesel, radha mitchel, the earlier riddick movie)... here you have a space bounty hunter, a space criminal, and a hauler pilot involved. notice they are pretty much speaking english, full of profanity and sarcasm, but hey... that is what i would expect... these people supposedly evolved after being cut-off from earth and had to make it out in the middle of nowhere for generations.
so i guess, walking into a gatecamp and getting a convo that says '100mil or you're toast' is pretty dead on role playing as far as i am concerned. plus, you get into the whole political game and it gets very interesting... who cares how it's worded... a declaration of war between 2 huge alliances followed by mega huge fleet battles seems pretty 'in character'
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some acceptance of derived units might be wise, or do you want speedometers and signs calibrated to m/s? (- not personally opposed to this btw)
Let that be a lesson to everybody who thinks it's cool to wear coffee instead of drinking it!
I've got her convinced that I am listening to her while playing games and watching movies... this could bring down my whole house of cards!
REI justifies the higher prices with their 'membership dividend'... a store credit issued at the end of each fiscal year that returns a percentage of the member's purchases (not including sale items). If you ever step into one of their stores I'm sure you'll hear all about their membership benefits from every salesperson within earshot.
It's like $15 for a lifetime membership... and their flock of green vested employees (all duped into working for chickenfeed in exchange for the ability to order product at cost, that they can never afford because they work for chickenfeed) has been drilled in every possible response to every conceivable reservation a customer might have about purchasing membership.
It's a scary joint... like the mini-WalMart of the outdoor industry. Their website is thorough, and they are data rich (lots of good marketing data comes from all those memberships), so I wouldn't say they were behind the curve... more like they are just really good at capitalizing on suckers.
EVE is by no means 'won' or 'over'... you might do well to familiarize yourself with the changes introduced in the last major past (which, btw, does not require additional funding on top of the monthly fee).
The more complex processes required to take and defend territory have forced BoB onto the defensive (as there is no way they could instantly develop and defend all of the territory they previously laid claim to) and there is a lot of room for other corporations (EVE's version of the guild) and alliances to grab some land.
Their main challenge at this point appears to be support of large scale fleet battles. The new game mechanics call for huge fleet fights in contested regions, and the reality of these fights is a 600+ man lag fest.
If you left because you thought the fight was lost... hop on the forums and take a look at the latest maps... chances are the conquered stations where you left all of your gear are open again for business.
Good luck!
nah... nobody surfs the web from work... what a ridiculous concept!
That was the prevailing mantra in fantasy based MMORPG's. And then WoW and GW came along and defied that mantra. ... and kicked everyone else's asses.
Actually WoW rode on the success of a previous generation of 3D MMORPGs, of which your friend DAoC is a member. They were not the 'first' to any of this... DAoC and others already did the whole 'die and keep your gear' thing and yes, it was well received and made for some fun gameplay where people go totally balls-out because they know the worst that can happen is that you might need to drop a few plat to repair your stuff.
Its pretty clear that from a market/business/popularity perspective that the "You can lose months of work in 30 seconds"-thing lost-out in a huge way to the "safer", "nice-warm-bath" approach.
Years later, UO is still running as a 2D/crappy3D game... the ONLY reason many folks left Ultima Online (which still enjoys a subscriber base) is because they ditched the client revamp and people wanted eye-candy. Put the DAoC or WoW interface on UO and I am back in an instant. The move from UO to DAoC and the like is the move that you are giving WoW credit for.
When the space-based equivalent of WoW hits the shelves ("World of Starcraft", perhaps?) EVE is going to see far, far more attrition than they know. And for those who say "Yeah, but all those people with all that time invested -- those guys won't jump-ship"... well... that ain't what happened to DAoC, EQ, Asheron's or any of the others when WoW launched.
How does this comparison work? Ultimately you are talking about the 'price of death', right? So WoW's success over the other MMOs mentioned (same 'price of death') has some relevence to the ability of your "World of Starcraft" (totally different 'price of death') to deplete the EVE player base? WoW succeeded because it gave players of similarly styled games more of what they wanted, arguably the advantage of NOT being first to market. This argument loses steam when you start predicting the effects of a totally differently styled game on the player base of EVE.
Idunno, I guess some of the shallow grave stuff from the fantasy MMOs just doesn't feel like it would quite fit in the Sci-Fi ones... I can get into the idea of my Shadowblade respawning after death and still having armor and weapons and stuff, but watching my ship blow up and then respawning in it? That feels more like a spacefighter sim, or FPS (first person shipper?).
gawd was it really 50 days for covetor? no wonder my character still sucks :(
seriously though... what you are describing is the same experience you would get in DAoC if you never left Mag Mell in Hibernia... the game is 'open ended'... it is what you make of it... so if you choose to farm rocks solo in a mining barge then that is what you get.
that being said... skilling up for other ships/mods and running some different mission types should feel very different... and there is always lo-sec and no-sec... who knows what is going to happen out there from day to day?
for a start at PvP that is not in 0.0... look up Privateer Alliance and see if you can't get into one of their corps... they declare war on 0.0 alliances and then fight them in 'safe-space'... you would be a quick sell to them because you can mine... and in return you will be able to hunt war targets without having to go into the depths of lawless space to do it.
good luck!
remember that the backstory is that this is human evolution wayyyy off in the future... they arent going to be speaking like an arthurian legend.
movies that might take place in the eve universe would be an example of proper role playing for futuristic space stories... like... hmmmm... ok, Pitch Black (vin diesel, radha mitchel, the earlier riddick movie)... here you have a space bounty hunter, a space criminal, and a hauler pilot involved. notice they are pretty much speaking english, full of profanity and sarcasm, but hey... that is what i would expect... these people supposedly evolved after being cut-off from earth and had to make it out in the middle of nowhere for generations.
so i guess, walking into a gatecamp and getting a convo that says '100mil or you're toast' is pretty dead on role playing as far as i am concerned. plus, you get into the whole political game and it gets very interesting... who cares how it's worded... a declaration of war between 2 huge alliances followed by mega huge fleet battles seems pretty 'in character'