ok, what if we run openssh on a linux box? are we still in danger of compromise?
According to the scant information available, yes, Linux useres are at risk. Keep in mind, their warnings could also be a case where the OpenSSH people are telling people that every platform is at risk in order to not give nasty-people any additional infomration.
I'd beleive the OpenSSH people at face value and upgrade myself.
Our military had a hand in urging Nasa to use rockets - any discoveries that Nasa made could be then used to perfect ICBMs.
Granted rockets have *lots* of drawbacks for space flight, but are the delivery method of choice for nuclear weapons. They are quick, don't require runways, cheap and their altitude makes them harder to shoot down.
Quick hacks to fix:
filter out port 22 on your firewall.
shut down sshd process.
Proper fix:
Upgrade to OpenSSH 3.3 and you *must* have privilage separation on. Then, after Monday, upgrade to the new OpenSHH that will be released.
3.3 is only vunerable if pivilage separaiton is off. No true patches are being released as nasty-type people will be able to quickly find trhe vunerability by reading the patch.
For your consideration:
As a tempory hack, I ssh'ed into my servers, started Telnetd and loged into them via Telnet. I then killed telnetd, and kept my open Telnet connection. I've left these open telnet connections in case I have to manage my servers. I've firewalled port 22 from the outside and will upgrade the systems at my leasure when the new version of SSH comes out around monday or tuesday.
My gradmother was a telephone operator - she could keep track of routing twenty diferent calls at a time and do it with grace. She could also type 40 WPM, flawlessly.
Vi, if she wanted to learn it, would take he 30 minuits of man vi and some scratch paper for notes.
The older generations fixed their own cars, invented the computer, and overcame polio - all without a talking paperclip leading the way.
> BoneFlower asks: "Anonymous remailers are >> all well and good, but sometimes people use >> them to abuse people through email or through >> trolling newsgroups. I've had limited >> results filtering "anonymous" on a USENET >> group I frequent but many anonymous remailer >> trolls get through. The group was nearly >> unuseable for over a week due to the volume >> of anonymous remailer trolls. Does anyone have >> tips on filtering them out? I personally use >> Forte Agent 1.9.1, many others >> use Netscape/Mozilla, OE, and various others. >> If you could help us out, we'd appreciate it."
I have serveral clients with too much money on their hands that have wanted a fileserver for home - Usually I take an older ATX box of theirs, put it in a decent case with a good and quite powersupply (Antec/PC Power And Cooling) and replace the processor fan. Plop in FreeBSD, Samba and hide it in the closet.
Last week, we used an IMac for filserving and as a novelty - the machine sits in the den, where the kids can play DVDs and listen to MP3, and the Samba filserver keeps on ticking. It's the first time that I've felt confortable having little kids play games with on a computer that, at the same time, is serving files. So far, there have been no lockups or crashes.
There are several benefits that I like with this situation - the customer gets a fun toy to play with, the "fileserver" is quiet and can nativly RSync it's precious files back to my servers for an offsite backup, and best of all - I get a reliable computer thats good for my reputation.
Really, the fullfilment of dream for an easy to use Unix has snuck up on us in the form of a Luxo Jr. lamp.
It was, but I already own a Thinkpad 380D and a (I think, it's at the office so I can't varify) a 21A.
The 21A was purchased for the reasons you mentioned, and for it's serial port - somthing that is often lacking in newer laptops and is vital for me to manage all the headless unix boxes. At the time, IBM offered its three year warranty - so this actually made the price irrelevent for me as I knew that I'd get three solid years of service out of the bugger.
IBM laptops are one of those happy cases where paying for quality is actually cheaper in the long run - I'm lazy and cheap so this fist in very well with me;)
As an aside, I do own a disposible Toshiba laptop for times when I'm worried about theft - I pop in a PC-Card Smartmedia adapter and backup data onto it when I leave the hotel room, the Smartmedia fits in my wallet.
A Psion Revo fits the bill when I'm in the woods hiking or on a mountain climbing - with the Iridium phone, I can telnet into a box, SSH out of there and manage any of my servers. Thats after a client calls - they, of course, get a nasty bill for distrubing my wilderness experience. The whole phone, cable and Psion package weighs 3.2 pounds soking wet - I'd cary the Iridium phone anyways for safty.
Maybe you should come back when you can show me a better tool for development instead of boo hoo-ing...
Come back when you get a few years experience. You will then realise that...
1) Any language that is only, as you state, "a couple months" old has bugs... 2) Now one developemnt enviroument can be the best at everything. 3) Good programmers know mutiple tools and can pick and choose amung them. 4) Your favorite tool for your favorite type of app can quite often be the worst tool for a diferent type of app. 5) Non-crossplatform tools hurt you in the long run.
I'm not imppressed at all the the IDE for the new Visual Studio is done in C#; C#, and more specifically, it's libraries were designed from the ground up to make 32-bit Windows GUI apps.
Get back to me when someone writes a device driver in C#, then I'll be impressed.
There's nothing wrong with C# if you're making quick and dirty 32-bit Windows apps, but to say is the 'best' at everything, especially when it won't even work for embedded applications, betrayes a lack of experience.
I have to agree,.NET is simply the best tool out there for development
Possibly - if you don't mind that any large.NET app is locked into a single operating system family running on a single hardware platform with a single language vendor.
You say.NET is the best. Sure that may be true for limited values of best.
In fact.NET is soooooo goooood that there are:
No operating systems written with.NET No comercial games written with.NET No office suites written with.NET No drivers written with.NET No large apps at all with.NET except.NET itself
(perhaps I'm wrong and someones cobbeled somthing together in these catagories, I don't keep active track)
Come back later when you've actually written somthing non trvial with.NET and we can discuss it.
I guess I wasen't clear enough, another person made the same leap that you did.
I diden't say IBM is going to OEM their laptops only that they could - especially considering that the seem to be pulling out of any commodity market. Cheap desktops, disk drives and keyboards to name a few that they have pulled out of.
I was unaware that they built their Aptivas - I assumed that they were OEMd due to their suckyness. They really reminded me of Compaqs cunsumer Presario line - and the kicker was that the Aptiva's were expensive.
Whatever the cost-cutting measures IBM pulled with the Aptiva - wether they did the design or someone else did - I hope they don't do with the Thinkpads.
Whenever a quality manufacturer faces a commodity market they can race to the bottom and get killed or they can go the Boutique route - I hope they follow the latter.
"You may not use or distribute this Software or any derivative works in any form for commercial purposes."
Rotor on Linux is as about as usefull, to me, as a Corvette is on Mt. Everest.
Except that the Corvette is cool, and Microsoft.NET is a spasdic mess of Windows APIs, p-code, neutered languages and FUD against Sun all wrapped in a license that sucks.
I said nothing about the bulid quality of Thinkpads.
If I did, I would say that they are excelent - THATS WHY I OWN SEVERAL.
They are preceved, rightly or wrongly, by the market as being expensive.
As for IBM slapping a sticker on someone elses product - they have done it already with the Aptiva.
I also did not say the *will*, I said they could, and this would explain the dropping of Linux support.
It seems that we both agree that, *if* they did this, it would be a mistake - I'd stop buying Thinkpads if they did, and I imagine a lot of other people would as well.
PS. The BMW 5 and 3 series automatic transmissions are designed and built by GM. So yes, BMW does stick it's sticker on a Chevy;) more info - look at the application notes.
IBM designs their laptops and either makes them or has someone else make them to their design. So somebody probably got the bright idea to just buy random Taiwan made laptops and slap an IBM logo on them - they think that this will reduce costs and increase competitiveness with new designs intoduced monthly.
The only have to look at thir Aptiva line of desktops to see where this stratigy will go - their good name will carry a few customers for a while, but in the end, nobody will pay a premium IBM price for a non-IBM product with an IBM sticker slaped on the front.
Well to be fair, it look lie IBM did design the plastic bezel for the Aptivas.
What does this have to do with Linux? We'll getting Linux to run of crappy hardware with Win-Modems and no name audio chips is a pain in the butt - if IBM was to suppot Linux, assuming they are going where I think they are going, they would have to pay a lot of money to get it done right.
Eithr that or the Microsoft OEM contract is up for review.....
Actually there a *bunch* of us nasty capialist pig types that think that legalization of soft drugs makes perfect sense, but what throws some us off is that the pot-heads want legalization are the same types that don't want personal responsibility, want to take our 2nd ammendment righs away, want to tax us into poverty.
We don't like them on a personal level, and were nasy enough to let them rot in jail. We know it wont happen to us, so it not considered a pressing issue.
If there was some sort of deal where we could legalize pot and get rid of welfare for anybody that decided to use the now-legal pot, then it'd be done in an instant.
It's alsoan image problem - it's hard to take people seriously when their argument is "dude, like, make the good weed legal" or "Sop 'opressin me, lay off my pipe". Right or wrong, that's the image amung the working classes.
I don't know the answer, and quite frankly, what motivates me more about druge legalisation is the tax savings. Perhaps thats a good argument to put forward.
Read this [sentencingproject.org] or other documents like it before making ridiculous claims about the efficacy of the U.S. prison system.
Who was making claims?
I'm fully away that a bunch of low level pot heads and crack whores are stuck in jail. While I think we are ill served by our "War on Drugs," - I'm not too happy with the kind of people who can't keep the bong out of their mouths when the cops show up.
If half the pot heads took their heads out of the purple haze and voted they might make a diferance. Instead, the they mimble obscure Noam quotes and take delight in pissing off the working classes. Hell, they so pissy, that we can't even use the weed for it's medicle uses because it has gotten such a bad reputation by being associated with the Microbus crowd.
Anyways, I think both of us would agree that the pot heads should get treatment and a job medicating claucoma and cancer patients.
Personally, I can't afford to lose 5% of my business; it croggles me that online outfits will cheerfully accept even 10-20% "can't even get in the store"
Hopefully that mentality is going away with the fall of easy VC money. My own company is standards complient due lazyness - we don't want to waste time dealing with any gripes. We've found that doing it right the first time is actaully the lazy way - a we like being lazy. Give us more time to post to Slashdot!
moneyed corporations? really? mind explaining that one to me?
A monyed corporation is diferent than others in that they are for profit. You local Red Cross is a corportation, but not a moneyed one. The phrase also features promently in the writings of Thomas Jefferson.
Slashdot Mirror
Fixing mailbox bugs in Outlook alone cover my car payments.
ok, what if we run openssh on a linux box? are we still in danger of compromise?
According to the scant information available, yes, Linux useres are at risk. Keep in mind, their warnings could also be a case where the OpenSSH people are telling people that every platform is at risk in order to not give nasty-people any additional infomration.
I'd beleive the OpenSSH people at face value and upgrade myself.
Our military had a hand in urging Nasa to use rockets - any discoveries that Nasa made could be then used to perfect ICBMs.
Granted rockets have *lots* of drawbacks for space flight, but are the delivery method of choice for nuclear weapons. They are quick, don't require runways, cheap and their altitude makes them harder to shoot down.
Run *BSD? Chances are that your SSH *will* be comprimised sometime after tuesday.
www.deadly.org
Quick hacks to fix:
filter out port 22 on your firewall.
shut down sshd process.
Proper fix:
Upgrade to OpenSSH 3.3 and you *must* have privilage separation on. Then, after Monday, upgrade to the new OpenSHH that will be released.
3.3 is only vunerable if pivilage separaiton is off. No true patches are being released as nasty-type people will be able to quickly find trhe vunerability by reading the patch.
For your consideration:
As a tempory hack, I ssh'ed into my servers, started Telnetd and loged into them via Telnet. I then killed telnetd, and kept my open Telnet connection. I've left these open telnet connections in case I have to manage my servers.
I've firewalled port 22 from the outside and will upgrade the systems at my leasure when the new version of SSH comes out around monday or tuesday.
Great! Let's see your grandma using Vi.
My gradmother was a telephone operator - she could keep track of routing twenty diferent calls at a time and do it with grace. She could also type 40 WPM, flawlessly.
Vi, if she wanted to learn it, would take he 30 minuits of man vi and some scratch paper for notes.
The older generations fixed their own cars, invented the computer, and overcame polio - all without a talking paperclip leading the way.
> BoneFlower asks: "Anonymous remailers are
;) ;) ;) ;)
>> all well and good, but sometimes people use
>> them to abuse people through email or through
>> trolling newsgroups. I've had limited
>> results filtering "anonymous" on a USENET
>> group I frequent but many anonymous remailer
>> trolls get through. The group was nearly
>> unuseable for over a week due to the volume
>> of anonymous remailer trolls. Does anyone have
>> tips on filtering them out? I personally use
>> Forte Agent 1.9.1, many others
>> use Netscape/Mozilla, OE, and various others.
>> If you could help us out, we'd appreciate it."
MEEE TOO!
I'M AN AOL TROLL!
BYE
That was on purpose
No worries, my spelling is horrible. It's so bad, that I can count it as a foreign language for purpouses of college admissions.
Two *NEW* species? And I thought I exausted all my hot-monkey-sex options.
Gotta go!
the European Space Agency study involved 14 male volunteers spending 3 months carrying out all activities whilst lying on their backs,
Well, when the female volunteers start up, I'll be willing to help the poor things with whatever they need.
Specifically I would like to offer customers solutions using Python. But if they want .NET integration, what do I tell them? It's not possible at all?
.NET to Unix, you could bring Unix to .NET via Cygwin?
Perhaps if you can't bring
You'd still be running a 'chalenged' server software, but it's an option.
Yep!
I have serveral clients with too much money on their hands that have wanted a fileserver for home - Usually I take an older ATX box of theirs, put it in a decent case with a good and quite powersupply (Antec/PC Power And Cooling) and replace the processor fan. Plop in FreeBSD, Samba and hide it in the closet.
Last week, we used an IMac for filserving and as a novelty - the machine sits in the den, where the kids can play DVDs and listen to MP3, and the Samba filserver keeps on ticking. It's the first time that I've felt confortable having little kids play games with on a computer that, at the same time, is serving files. So far, there have been no lockups or crashes.
There are several benefits that I like with this situation - the customer gets a fun toy to play with, the "fileserver" is quiet and can nativly RSync it's precious files back to my servers for an offsite backup, and best of all - I get a reliable computer thats good for my reputation.
Really, the fullfilment of dream for an easy to use Unix has snuck up on us in the form of a Luxo Jr. lamp.
I hope this was educational.
;)
It was, but I already own a Thinkpad 380D and a (I think, it's at the office so I can't varify) a 21A.
The 21A was purchased for the reasons you mentioned, and for it's serial port - somthing that is often lacking in newer laptops and is vital for me to manage all the headless unix boxes. At the time, IBM offered its three year warranty - so this actually made the price irrelevent for me as I knew that I'd get three solid years of service out of the bugger.
IBM laptops are one of those happy cases where paying for quality is actually cheaper in the long run - I'm lazy and cheap so this fist in very well with me
As an aside,
I do own a disposible Toshiba laptop for times when I'm worried about theft - I pop in a PC-Card Smartmedia adapter and backup data onto it when I leave the hotel room, the Smartmedia fits in my wallet.
A Psion Revo fits the bill when I'm in the woods hiking or on a mountain climbing - with the Iridium phone, I can telnet into a box, SSH out of there and manage any of my servers. Thats after a client calls - they, of course, get a nasty bill for distrubing my wilderness experience. The whole phone, cable and Psion package weighs 3.2 pounds soking wet - I'd cary the Iridium phone anyways for safty.
Cheers.
Maybe you should come back when you can show me a better tool for development instead of boo hoo-ing...
Come back when you get a few years experience. You will then realise that...
1) Any language that is only, as you state, "a couple months" old has bugs...
2) Now one developemnt enviroument can be the best at everything.
3) Good programmers know mutiple tools and can pick and choose amung them.
4) Your favorite tool for your favorite type of app can quite often be the worst tool for a diferent type of app.
5) Non-crossplatform tools hurt you in the long run.
I'm not imppressed at all the the IDE for the new Visual Studio is done in C#; C#, and more specifically, it's libraries were designed from the ground up to make 32-bit Windows GUI apps.
Get back to me when someone writes a device driver in C#, then I'll be impressed.
There's nothing wrong with C# if you're making quick and dirty 32-bit Windows apps, but to say is the 'best' at everything, especially when it won't even work for embedded applications, betrayes a lack of experience.
Net is no more spastic mess than Java 2/J2EE
You said it yourself. Not me.
I have to agree, .NET is simply the best tool out there for development
.NET app is locked into a single operating system family running on a single hardware platform with a single language vendor.
.NET is the best. Sure that may be true for limited values of best.
.NET is soooooo goooood that there are:
.NET .NET .NET .NET .NET except .NET itself
.NET and we can discuss it.
Possibly - if you don't mind that any large
You say
In fact
No operating systems written with
No comercial games written with
No office suites written with
No drivers written with
No large apps at all with
(perhaps I'm wrong and someones cobbeled somthing together in these catagories, I don't keep active track)
Come back later when you've actually written somthing non trvial with
I guess I wasen't clear enough, another person made the same leap that you did.
I diden't say IBM is going to OEM their laptops only that they could - especially considering that the seem to be pulling out of any commodity market.
Cheap desktops, disk drives and keyboards to name a few that they have pulled out of.
I was unaware that they built their Aptivas - I assumed that they were OEMd due to their suckyness. They really reminded me of Compaqs cunsumer Presario line - and the kicker was that the Aptiva's were expensive.
Whatever the cost-cutting measures IBM pulled with the Aptiva - wether they did the design or someone else did - I hope they don't do with the Thinkpads.
Whenever a quality manufacturer faces a commodity market they can race to the bottom and get killed or they can go the Boutique route - I hope they follow the latter.
From the licence attached with Rotor:
"You may not use or distribute this Software or any derivative works in any form for commercial purposes."
Rotor on Linux is as about as usefull, to me, as a Corvette is on Mt. Everest.
Except that the Corvette is cool, and Microsoft
Did you actually *read* my coment?
;)
I said nothing about the bulid quality of Thinkpads.
If I did, I would say that they are excelent - THATS WHY I OWN SEVERAL.
They are preceved, rightly or wrongly, by the market as being expensive.
As for IBM slapping a sticker on someone elses product - they have done it already with the Aptiva.
I also did not say the *will*, I said they could, and this would explain the dropping of Linux support.
It seems that we both agree that, *if* they did this, it would be a mistake - I'd stop buying Thinkpads if they did, and I imagine a lot of other people would as well.
PS. The BMW 5 and 3 series automatic transmissions are designed and built by GM. So yes, BMW does stick it's sticker on a Chevy
more info - look at the application notes.
IBM designs their laptops and either makes them or has someone else make them to their design. So somebody probably got the bright idea to just buy random Taiwan made laptops and slap an IBM logo on them - they think that this will reduce costs and increase competitiveness with new designs intoduced monthly.
The only have to look at thir Aptiva line of desktops to see where this stratigy will go - their good name will carry a few customers for a while, but in the end, nobody will pay a premium IBM price for a non-IBM product with an IBM sticker slaped on the front.
Well to be fair, it look lie IBM did design the plastic bezel for the Aptivas.
What does this have to do with Linux? We'll getting Linux to run of crappy hardware with Win-Modems and no name audio chips is a pain in the butt - if IBM was to suppot Linux, assuming they are going where I think they are going, they would have to pay a lot of money to get it done right.
Eithr that or the Microsoft OEM contract is up for review.....
Actually there a *bunch* of us nasty capialist pig types that think that legalization of soft drugs makes perfect sense, but what throws some us off is that the pot-heads want legalization are the same types that don't want personal responsibility, want to take our 2nd ammendment righs away, want to tax us into poverty.
We don't like them on a personal level, and were nasy enough to let them rot in jail. We know it wont happen to us, so it not considered a pressing issue.
If there was some sort of deal where we could legalize pot and get rid of welfare for anybody that decided to use the now-legal pot, then it'd be done in an instant.
It's alsoan image problem - it's hard to take people seriously when their argument is "dude, like, make the good weed legal" or "Sop 'opressin me, lay off my pipe". Right or wrong, that's the image amung the working classes.
I don't know the answer, and quite frankly, what motivates me more about druge legalisation is the tax savings. Perhaps thats a good argument to put forward.
I don't know where people got the impression that a company is plural, but it's not.
In America it's singular, in England it's been simplified to the plural during the last 80 years or so.
Treating a Company, made up of group of people, as singular is a special case and isen't terrbily logical when you think about it:
The programmers were stupid. (American, English)
Microsoft was stupid. (American, older English)
Microsoft were stupid (Modern simplified English)
It's easier to teach children that a company is plural, and unfortunatly ease has won in certain circles and the special case has been forgoten.
I'm glad I'm European.
I'm glad your European; Somebody has to keep reminding us that metric is cool, guns are evil, and football is played with a round ball.
Read this [sentencingproject.org] or other documents like it before making ridiculous claims about the efficacy of the U.S. prison system.
Who was making claims?
I'm fully away that a bunch of low level pot heads and crack whores are stuck in jail. While I think we are ill served by our "War on Drugs," - I'm not too happy with the kind of people who can't keep the bong out of their mouths when the cops show up.
If half the pot heads took their heads out of the purple haze and voted they might make a diferance. Instead, the they mimble obscure Noam quotes and take delight in pissing off the working classes. Hell, they so pissy, that we can't even use the weed for it's medicle uses because it has gotten such a bad reputation by being associated with the Microbus crowd.
Anyways,
I think both of us would agree that the pot heads should get treatment and a job medicating claucoma and cancer patients.
Personally, I can't afford to lose 5% of my business; it croggles me that online outfits will cheerfully accept even 10-20% "can't even get in the store"
Hopefully that mentality is going away with the fall of easy VC money. My own company is standards complient due lazyness - we don't want to waste time dealing with any gripes. We've found that doing it right the first time is actaully the lazy way - a we like being lazy. Give us more time to post to Slashdot!
moneyed corporations? really? mind explaining that one to me?
A monyed corporation is diferent than others in that they are for profit. You local Red Cross is a corportation, but not a moneyed one. The phrase also features promently in the writings of Thomas Jefferson.