The founder of that group, Kiarash Poursaleh, who described himself in his profile as an 18-year-old living in Tehran, also listed "Mein Kampf" by Hitler as a favorite book...
You know, I'm more worried about the rise of organized groups, such as the German NPD or the Russian democratic party. Gentlemen such as Mr. Poursaleh somehow, deep down, seem to missing a somewhat fundamental point about how the people whose policies he's advocating might view his own particular ethnic group.
Crackpot pseudoscientific about racial biology and what defines "aryan", as a sometime student of history I'm not aware of Mr. Hilter & his merry gang of pirates ever planning to set up an division of Persian SS stormtroopers...
There's another typo-squatting game that only the big guys can play. In 2001, Microsoft rejiggered Internet Explorer so that if you type in a URL that doesn't exist, the browser will redirect you to a Microsoft page.
Well, actually, I wanted to put one of those damn x cams or whatever they were called on a Kyosho Mini-Z (I highly recommend this site -- they were super friendly with good prices).
This was supposed to be a combination of an "I can do this" project combined with an upskirt cam for the bank I worked in at the time. Unfortunately, in between my "ooh ooh ooh I want the Porsche" RC car spending spree (4 grown men buying about $2k worth of toys at once) and "oh fine I'll buy a goddamm camera just to see what it is" (back then my girlfriend never had time due to finals so I had some spare cash) I neglected to check how BIG those remote cams actually were...
While hanging around Mexico City airport with a few spare minutes, I decided to poke around their Prodigy pay-for-access service. I didn't get to the billing and actual access management bits, because it was pretty easy to find out passwords and architecture of their backend SAN components.
Actually getting info on how their systems were set up was, similiar to what's described in this article, just a matter of looking at webserver directory contents and checking out "hidden" links in their php scripts.
If you want whores, guns, gambling and drugs, go to borough XYZ in New York or Arr. xyz in Paris or whatever. If you want Heroin, go to Amsterdam and look for N. African looking guys to approach you (they will if you stand around long enough.)
Could I be more specific? Probably, if I asked around a bit. Would I be committing a crime? No. I would not. I would be exercising my right to free speech & expression. Period.
If I say "they have some music for dl over at acme.com", I am likewise not committing a crime, I don't care which legal statutes you judge it under. I see your point, but I'm sorry, this simply holds no water. There's no issue of complicity at all; you are not involved in he actual transfer of illegal information, nor are you aiding and abetting an illegal act any more than if you publish a manual on how to build a pipe bomb (Poor Man's James Bond, I forget the publisher.)
It's not a question of whether it's "right" or not. Fact is that there is a tremendous number of pirated Windows copies out there. These will be far more vulnerable than they are now; the result of this will initially be to hurt their owners, but in the end, everyone suffers due to an explosion of botnets/DDoS/spam gateways, etc. etc. etc.
I am even inclined to believe that even semi-clued kiddies will not be unduly affected by this because, as another poster pointed out, obtaining an illicit collection of updates probably won't be tremendously difficult.
Call me what you will, but somehow I doubt that most prison inmates are there because of activities and thoughts against the prevailing political order.
The American revolution revolved around taxation without representation, and several related issues; many others have come about to deal with issues ranging from democratic representation and freedom from oppression to economic injustice, what have you.
While I'm sure there are people incarcerated in American jails because of conscious activities against unjust laws, I'll go out on a limb and claim that theft, assault, extortion, murder and their ilk are not in the same class, say what you will about profiling and the "war on drugs".
Most people in jail are simply not patriots, freedom fighters, revolutionaries, whatever--they committed a crime for personal motives.
This isn't the first or the last time this sort of thing has happened. A minor issue about metric vs. imperial comes to mind, and didn't someone forget to remove a lens cap from the Hubble space telescope before it launched?
"Hey, perfessor, lookit, we got us a high resolution image of the 'REMOVE BEFORE LAUNCH' galaxy!'
It's pretty amazing, all right. However, for the low low cost of 2-3 tanks of gas, many people with cars have the option of driving far enough out to see some pretty amazing stuff.
Here in Switzerland, I think the closest are some regions of the mountains in winter when the sky's pretty clear, and it's going to be difficult in reasonably flat, built-up regions (a lot of western Europe, East coast of the US). However, with just a few hours' worth of trip, I've seen night skies to rival those I've had the fortune to view in the S. Pacific, Arizona, Mexico and North Africa.
I think a lot of people never bother to look at a map to see what's outside of their immediate area of familiarity--even if you look at a map of a lot of the surroundings of many large cities, you'll eventually find some place where there's little light pollution. Not nearly perfect, naturally, but still a good start.
It's nice to see someone cut through the irrational vitriol on the one side, and sanctimonious pseud-freemarketry (n.b. I am a very convinced free-trader, and agree strongly with what the above poster states--I see no conflict there) presented by opponents/adherents of limited visas.
My mom, who runs a small placement firm in the hospitality industry (chefs and restaurant managers, no Romanian hos, sorry guys) has noted on numerous occasions that large parts of the US restaurant/hotel scene would simply cease to function if Mexican, Guatamalan, and other Latin American illegal immigrants were cracked down on--they tend to be hardworking, dedicated, and willing to do shit jobs to start at the very bottom of the ladder.
I've heard opinions stating that the US should build a fence--to keep them in, natch, not the other way around. Ditto goes for immigrants like the ideal ones described above. Hooray.
I'm in the same country; following some of the Swiss ISPs' discussions on related topics on the SwiNOG list brings up a few pretty scary issues.
Frankly, what can one do? The EU and its ilk have been soundly defeated in two major national referenda here, and yet successive governments bulldoze ahead with plans to join up at any cost. Nobody seems to give a flying shit about issues like these
Swiss ideas about data protection always relied on the premise that the government is trustworthy, which it usually was. Now we start seeing a prime example why "trust us, we'll never misuse the information/capability to gather information" is a load of bull.
As to what individuals can do, I can think of three easy things:
* Make your acquaintances, family and colleagues understand, as simply as possible, the consequences of unimpeded governmental authority to collect data, and of what can go wrong with it, using real-life examples. * Vote against every single politician who makes noise about allowing this sort of crap * Obfuscate, obfuscate, obfuscate. Use SSL. Use PGP. Use SSH. Store data on PGPDisk, GBDE, CFS, or some of the Linux methods mentioned here. There's not a whole hell of a lot you can do about voice, until someone comes up with a simple, compatible, free/low cost VoIP or analog line encryption method. None of these things is impossible to break through or get around for a really determined eavesdropper, but you can sure do your tiny little bit to make it harder for "them".
Frankly, I think it's ironic that, in the last national vote about joining the EU, the most vocal voices against it from among my colleagues came from, you guessed it, expats from EU countries who moved here exactly because they hoped Switzerland would not follow the lead of the rest of this continent in issues like this.
This is pretty well-stated. The problem is that in a lot of environments, the admin is in a "lose-lose" situation.
As a consultant, I try to advise clients on what's the optimal thing to do for their own good in the long run, but also cover my ass with documentation and so. As a sysadmin of any kind, you often tend to run into issues where, even if you can show "I told you so", no matter how civilly or correctly it's documented, presented, whatnot, it's still your fault.
Remember also that professors are not usually the most rational of people--someone whose grant money feeds a large amount of IT services is not going to be as easy to corral as a middle manager who has to answer to a more highly defined company hierarchy.
That said, your statement about trust is about one of the most insightful things I've seen in a while.
Regardless, there are a _few_ passive mechanisms you can use if "having a strong security/usage policy", "getting on well with users" and "changing jobs" are not an option.
Things like http traffic inspection (transparent proxying), a good running/incremental backup model for desktops (with that much access they _will_ fuck it up) combined with an easy rescue & restore mechanism, and one-way firewalling (outbound OK, inbound not OK) in front of the group of people most likely to collaborate over a network (research team, prof & secretary, whatnot) are a good start.
Oh come on, don't be so uptight. Most slashdot readers are probably to young to have experienced the glory of real, balls-out usenet flame wars.
Blog comments and various chat angryfests ("I r0x0r j00 teh GAY D00D!!!111") just don't do it.
Things like this are hilarious in their own right, and give today's impressionable youth at least an introduction to the righteous sort of group abuse for which the Internet was invented!
It's not an issue of privacy, it's an issue of control.
To stretch an analogy, this is similar to requiring individuals to show ID when boarding a plane, or to remove the shoes before doing the same. It does not safeguard against those with malicious intent, but it does establish precedent for more intrusive measures. Among these, as much as I hate to say it, is the idea that "if you're innocent, you have nothing to hide/fear."
I think a more relevant comparison would be one that is made with various proposals to embed black boxes in cars--it will someday probably be illegal to remove or tamper with them (or at least it will affect your insurance or the likes) and once an initial usage for nominally kosher law enforcement purposes has been set, a precedent exists for further nefarious abuse.
I don't hesitate for a moment to think that the legitimation of spyware on platforms of convenience (Windows/IE) creates a very convenient and dangerous basis, at least in the minds of some police/politicians, to mandate this sort of functionality in the future, no matter what you're using.
Similar to the UK RIP (regulation of investigatory powers) act, which, if I understand correctly, makes a crime of inability or refusal to surrender decryption keys for a given set of data to law enforcement, the dark future may bring ideas such as "you can run whatever OS/programs you want, but unless the police receive signal xyz from your computer, you are committing a crime."
To use a completely oversimplified analogy, the end result probably won't be much different than a big fat 'grep'.
However, grepping through 15 million volumes of text and making an attempt at ranking results by relevance through a fancy perl script probably would require a bit of time and resources:-)
Well golly gee, if you hadn't spent your school years downloading files called PicOfStoneTemplePilots.exe, you might now be a brain surgeon like your mom intended, and you'd have a fancy midtown apartment with an ATM drop in the living room!
(ducks cow dung thrown from middle of fscking nowhere...)
Good point, actually--you don't even need a good blocking system; just dump a couple of manuals in their room, or at least a Linux/FreeBSD installation CD with a post-it note saying "THE MANUALS ARE IN/USR/SHARE/DOC" and let them figure it out from there. Let them do their homework on a stripped-down Winblows box without a network card; I'm sure the PCs at their local library will give them the net access they need for research on school projects.
You wouldn't literally be forcing them to code something up from binary, but they might actually learn something in the process. As in "You wanted a car. Here's a 1974 Monte Carlo. It's not running. Here's the Time-Life book of the family car and a toolkit, have fun. Oh, and don't forget that you'll need gas & insurance money."
As for having Internet access as the only means of control over your kids, I don't have any myself but ffs, that makes about as little sense as anything I've ever heard about child psychology.
Quite possibly you're right--I have read neither site enough to judge it. However, what vmyths currently has on its front page is little short of cretinous.
Poorly researched, not founded in facts, throwing out a few terms with no background information, all to justify overly sweeping claims and opinions.
It may be a fine site for all I know, but they sure ought to consider filtering their front page content a bit better!
"Ramen" virus indeed. I sure hope that's a pisstake.:)
Just for your edification, "Fred", if that REALLY IS YOUR NAME, the Andromeda Strain was the result of a biological warfare satellite crashing back to earth:-)
Your point makes perfect sense, in a natural environment. So does the concept of estrus, when you think of it, as well as many other things that bug us tremendously, or would if we had to endure them.
My whole point is that we have the scientific capability (or the mental ability to develop said capability) to overcome these limitations--not just your absolutely correct built-in prevention of food supply exhaustion, but also what would get us to that point in the first place if we were practically immortal--overpopulation itself.
I'm not a religious nut, nor am I a believer in science as a fix-all, but I do think we should use what we can to overcome our natural limitations whenever possible. And I definitely would want to live 1000 years! At least I do right now; I'd probably get tired of it around 700 or so....
...yes, I read it. If you're responsible for a disaster like this, that is regardless of whether you cause it or it just happens on your watch, you should be held accountable for it. In fact, 5 of the 7 guys in our company are Indians, and from talking to them I have no doubt that Indian government officials are no less venal, corrupt and accountable than those elsewhere.
My beef is just with people who say "you hate freedom!" or something similarly stupid if person x caused event y and someone calls for him to be judged on that fact.
And yes I probably have been trolled, but the point holds.
And what's that reason? In response you can bring two arguments:
* "That's just the way it should be" -- no it isn't. I don't want to ever die (at least not right now.) When I do, it should be my choice, if the science to keep me happy and kicking is available.
* Physiological limitations -- yup, exactly the point. Currently we do not know of a way to prolong your life by thousands of years. Currently. And there you go.
Slashdot Mirror
The founder of that group, Kiarash Poursaleh, who described himself in his profile as an 18-year-old living in Tehran, also listed "Mein Kampf" by Hitler as a favorite book...
You know, I'm more worried about the rise of organized groups, such as the German NPD or the Russian democratic party. Gentlemen such as Mr. Poursaleh somehow, deep down, seem to missing a somewhat fundamental point about how the people whose policies he's advocating might view his own particular ethnic group.
Crackpot pseudoscientific about racial biology and what defines "aryan", as a sometime student of history I'm not aware of Mr. Hilter & his merry gang of pirates ever planning to set up an division of Persian SS stormtroopers...
There's another typo-squatting game that only the big guys can play. In 2001, Microsoft rejiggered Internet Explorer so that if you type in a URL that doesn't exist, the browser will redirect you to a Microsoft page.
*Cough*Verisign SiteFinder*cough*
Well, actually, I wanted to put one of those damn x cams or whatever they were called on a Kyosho Mini-Z (I highly recommend this site -- they were super friendly with good prices).
This was supposed to be a combination of an "I can do this" project combined with an upskirt cam for the bank I worked in at the time. Unfortunately, in between my "ooh ooh ooh I want the Porsche" RC car spending spree (4 grown men buying about $2k worth of toys at once) and "oh fine I'll buy a goddamm camera just to see what it is" (back then my girlfriend never had time due to finals so I had some spare cash) I neglected to check how BIG those remote cams actually were...
While hanging around Mexico City airport with a few spare minutes, I decided to poke around their Prodigy pay-for-access service. I didn't get to the billing and actual access management bits, because it was pretty easy to find out passwords and architecture of their backend SAN components.
Actually getting info on how their systems were set up was, similiar to what's described in this article, just a matter of looking at webserver directory contents and checking out "hidden" links in their php scripts.
M$'s revenue stream will collapse, due to a fairly large number of pissed off corporate customers.
:-)
Any other questions?
If you want whores, guns, gambling and drugs, go to borough XYZ in New York or Arr. xyz in Paris or whatever. If you want Heroin, go to Amsterdam and look for N. African looking guys to approach you (they will if you stand around long enough.)
Could I be more specific? Probably, if I asked around a bit. Would I be committing a crime? No. I would not. I would be exercising my right to free speech & expression. Period.
If I say "they have some music for dl over at acme.com", I am likewise not committing a crime, I don't care which legal statutes you judge it under. I see your point, but I'm sorry, this simply holds no water. There's no issue of complicity at all; you are not involved in he actual transfer of illegal information, nor are you aiding and abetting an illegal act any more than if you publish a manual on how to build a pipe bomb (Poor Man's James Bond, I forget the publisher.)
Hi,
It's not a question of whether it's "right" or not. Fact is that there is a tremendous number of pirated Windows copies out there. These will be far more vulnerable than they are now; the result of this will initially be to hurt their owners, but in the end, everyone suffers due to an explosion of botnets/DDoS/spam gateways, etc. etc. etc.
I am even inclined to believe that even semi-clued kiddies will not be unduly affected by this because, as another poster pointed out, obtaining an illicit collection of updates probably won't be tremendously difficult.
Call me what you will, but somehow I doubt that most prison inmates are there because of activities and thoughts against the prevailing political order.
The American revolution revolved around taxation without representation, and several related issues; many others have come about to deal with issues ranging from democratic representation and freedom from oppression to economic injustice, what have you.
While I'm sure there are people incarcerated in American jails because of conscious activities against unjust laws, I'll go out on a limb and claim that theft, assault, extortion, murder and their ilk are not in the same class, say what you will about profiling and the "war on drugs".
Most people in jail are simply not patriots, freedom fighters, revolutionaries, whatever--they committed a crime for personal motives.
This isn't the first or the last time this sort of thing has happened. A minor issue about metric vs. imperial comes to mind, and didn't someone forget to remove a lens cap from the Hubble space telescope before it launched?
"Hey, perfessor, lookit, we got us a high resolution image of the 'REMOVE BEFORE LAUNCH' galaxy!'
It's pretty amazing, all right. However, for the low low cost of 2-3 tanks of gas, many people with cars have the option of driving far enough out to see some pretty amazing stuff.
Here in Switzerland, I think the closest are some regions of the mountains in winter when the sky's pretty clear, and it's going to be difficult in reasonably flat, built-up regions (a lot of western Europe, East coast of the US). However, with just a few hours' worth of trip, I've seen night skies to rival those I've had the fortune to view in the S. Pacific, Arizona, Mexico and North Africa.
I think a lot of people never bother to look at a map to see what's outside of their immediate area of familiarity--even if you look at a map of a lot of the surroundings of many large cities, you'll eventually find some place where there's little light pollution. Not nearly perfect, naturally, but still a good start.
Fantastic point, mod up mod up!
It's nice to see someone cut through the irrational vitriol on the one side, and sanctimonious pseud-freemarketry (n.b. I am a very convinced free-trader, and agree strongly with what the above poster states--I see no conflict there) presented by opponents/adherents of limited visas.
My mom, who runs a small placement firm in the hospitality industry (chefs and restaurant managers, no Romanian hos, sorry guys) has noted on numerous occasions that large parts of the US restaurant/hotel scene would simply cease to function if Mexican, Guatamalan, and other Latin American illegal immigrants were cracked down on--they tend to be hardworking, dedicated, and willing to do shit jobs to start at the very bottom of the ladder.
I've heard opinions stating that the US should build a fence--to keep them in, natch, not the other way around. Ditto goes for immigrants like the ideal ones described above. Hooray.
I'm in the same country; following some of the Swiss ISPs' discussions on related topics on the SwiNOG list brings up a few pretty scary issues.
Frankly, what can one do? The EU and its ilk have been soundly defeated in two major national referenda here, and yet successive governments bulldoze ahead with plans to join up at any cost. Nobody seems to give a flying shit about issues like these
Swiss ideas about data protection always relied on the premise that the government is trustworthy, which it usually was. Now we start seeing a prime example why "trust us, we'll never misuse the information/capability to gather information" is a load of bull.
As to what individuals can do, I can think of three easy things:
* Make your acquaintances, family and colleagues understand, as simply as possible, the consequences of unimpeded governmental authority to collect data, and of what can go wrong with it, using real-life examples.
* Vote against every single politician who makes noise about allowing this sort of crap
* Obfuscate, obfuscate, obfuscate. Use SSL. Use PGP. Use SSH. Store data on PGPDisk, GBDE, CFS, or some of the Linux methods mentioned here.
There's not a whole hell of a lot you can do about voice, until someone comes up with a simple, compatible, free/low cost VoIP or analog line encryption method. None of these things is impossible to break through or get around for a really determined eavesdropper, but you can sure do your tiny little bit to make it harder for "them".
Frankly, I think it's ironic that, in the last national vote about joining the EU, the most vocal voices against it from among my colleagues came from, you guessed it, expats from EU countries who moved here exactly because they hoped Switzerland would not follow the lead of the rest of this continent in issues like this.
This is pretty well-stated. The problem is that in a lot of environments, the admin is in a "lose-lose" situation.
As a consultant, I try to advise clients on what's the optimal thing to do for their own good in the long run, but also cover my ass with documentation and so. As a sysadmin of any kind, you often tend to run into issues where, even if you can show "I told you so", no matter how civilly or correctly it's documented, presented, whatnot, it's still your fault.
Remember also that professors are not usually the most rational of people--someone whose grant money feeds a large amount of IT services is not going to be as easy to corral as a middle manager who has to answer to a more highly defined company hierarchy.
That said, your statement about trust is about one of the most insightful things I've seen in a while.
Regardless, there are a _few_ passive mechanisms you can use if "having a strong security/usage policy", "getting on well with users" and "changing jobs" are not an option.
Things like http traffic inspection (transparent proxying), a good running/incremental backup model for desktops (with that much access they _will_ fuck it up) combined with an easy rescue & restore mechanism, and one-way firewalling (outbound OK, inbound not OK) in front of the group of people most likely to collaborate over a network (research team, prof & secretary, whatnot) are a good start.
Oh come on, don't be so uptight. Most slashdot readers are probably to young to have experienced the glory of real, balls-out usenet flame wars.
Blog comments and various chat angryfests ("I r0x0r j00 teh GAY D00D!!!111") just don't do it.
Things like this are hilarious in their own right, and give today's impressionable youth at least an introduction to the righteous sort of group abuse for which the Internet was invented!
It's not an issue of privacy, it's an issue of control.
To stretch an analogy, this is similar to requiring individuals to show ID when boarding a plane, or to remove the shoes before doing the same. It does not safeguard against those with malicious intent, but it does establish precedent for more intrusive measures. Among these, as much as I hate to say it, is the idea that "if you're innocent, you have nothing to hide/fear."
I think a more relevant comparison would be one that is made with various proposals to embed black boxes in cars--it will someday probably be illegal to remove or tamper with them (or at least it will affect your insurance or the likes) and once an initial usage for nominally kosher law enforcement purposes has been set, a precedent exists for further nefarious abuse.
I don't hesitate for a moment to think that the legitimation of spyware on platforms of convenience (Windows/IE) creates a very convenient and dangerous basis, at least in the minds of some police/politicians, to mandate this sort of functionality in the future, no matter what you're using.
Similar to the UK RIP (regulation of investigatory powers) act, which, if I understand correctly, makes a crime of inability or refusal to surrender decryption keys for a given set of data to law enforcement, the dark future may bring ideas such as "you can run whatever OS/programs you want, but unless the police receive signal xyz from your computer, you are committing a crime."
Bleh.
To use a completely oversimplified analogy, the end result probably won't be much different than a big fat 'grep'.
:-)
However, grepping through 15 million volumes of text and making an attempt at ranking results by relevance through a fancy perl script probably would require a bit of time and resources
Well golly gee, if you hadn't spent your school years downloading files called PicOfStoneTemplePilots.exe, you might now be a brain surgeon like your mom intended, and you'd have a fancy midtown apartment with an ATM drop in the living room!
(ducks cow dung thrown from middle of fscking nowhere...)
Good point, actually--you don't even need a good blocking system; just dump a couple of manuals in their room, or at least a Linux/FreeBSD installation CD with a post-it note saying "THE MANUALS ARE IN /USR/SHARE/DOC" and let them figure it out from there. Let them do their homework on a stripped-down Winblows box without a network card; I'm sure the PCs at their local library will give them the net access they need for research on school projects.
You wouldn't literally be forcing them to code something up from binary, but they might actually learn something in the process. As in "You wanted a car. Here's a 1974 Monte Carlo. It's not running. Here's the Time-Life book of the family car and a toolkit, have fun. Oh, and don't forget that you'll need gas & insurance money."
As for having Internet access as the only means of control over your kids, I don't have any myself but ffs, that makes about as little sense as anything I've ever heard about child psychology.
Ewps my bad, not front page content, rather the link in your .sig. The article's still date-stamped 3 days late...
Quite possibly you're right--I have read neither site enough to judge it. However, what vmyths currently has on its front page is little short of cretinous.
:)
Poorly researched, not founded in facts, throwing out a few terms with no background information, all to justify overly sweeping claims and opinions.
It may be a fine site for all I know, but they sure ought to consider filtering their front page content a bit better!
"Ramen" virus indeed. I sure hope that's a pisstake.
It's a fascinating event, especially if you can make out the "ALL THESE WORLDS ARE YOURS" stamped on it in big glowing letters.
Oh wait, that's Jupiter's moon.
Just for your edification, "Fred", if that REALLY IS YOUR NAME, the Andromeda Strain was the result of a biological warfare satellite crashing back to earth :-)
Your point makes perfect sense, in a natural environment. So does the concept of estrus, when you think of it, as well as many other things that bug us tremendously, or would if we had to endure them.
My whole point is that we have the scientific capability (or the mental ability to develop said capability) to overcome these limitations--not just your absolutely correct built-in prevention of food supply exhaustion, but also what would get us to that point in the first place if we were practically immortal--overpopulation itself.
I'm not a religious nut, nor am I a believer in science as a fix-all, but I do think we should use what we can to overcome our natural limitations whenever possible. And I definitely would want to live 1000 years! At least I do right now; I'd probably get tired of it around 700 or so....
...yes, I read it. If you're responsible for a disaster like this, that is regardless of whether you cause it or it just happens on your watch, you should be held accountable for it. In fact, 5 of the 7 guys in our company are Indians, and from talking to them I have no doubt that Indian government officials are no less venal, corrupt and accountable than those elsewhere.
My beef is just with people who say "you hate freedom!" or something similarly stupid if person x caused event y and someone calls for him to be judged on that fact.
And yes I probably have been trolled, but the point holds.
And what's that reason? In response you can bring two arguments:
* "That's just the way it should be" -- no it isn't. I don't want to ever die (at least not right now.) When I do, it should be my choice, if the science to keep me happy and kicking is available.
* Physiological limitations -- yup, exactly the point. Currently we do not know of a way to prolong your life by thousands of years. Currently. And there you go.