1. Don't restrict things and punish those that break the law after they've broken it. 2. Restrict things only for those that would use them in a way that would break the law. 3. Restrict things for everybody, even those who don't need the restriction.
The only viable option is option one. Two was stated by you to be impossible and three is repugnant.
I in fact do think that screaming fire at the back of a crowded theater should be free speech. And if people were injured because of that, or if property was damaged because of it, I should be held liable.
However I should not be liable if someone in the theater decided to commit suicide in the theater rather than try to exit it.
There is a difference between my actions causing the death of another through accident, or mishap, etc., and someone deciding that it's easier to kill themselves rather than deal with name calling or other harassment.
In the movie theater example my actions caused a panic and that panic caused bad things to happen. I should be held responsible for that panic.
In the harassment example my actions caused you to feel bad and have some emotional distress. I should not be responsible for your decision to off yourself.
If my harassment falls afoul of harassment laws then I should be punished for those offenses, but that is a far cry from being responsible for your death.
By the way, fantastic insults! I had to look up homunculous.
"Anonymous Cowards are the bravest souls in the universe!"
Just because it was written doesn't make it so.
I was talking about something a bit lower level than they were. If living were a right then how you kill anything to eat? It is that brocolli stalks right to live, how dare you kill it so that you can live?
The point is this, life is difficult, only those who try the hardest (or get really lucky) get to win. The sooner that people figure that out the better off they are.
Wow, who ever said that I didn't benefit from governemt spending, of course I do. I love the roads I drive on. I love being defended from outside invaders. The governement is necessesary for infrastructure and such. No argument there.
If the jobs moved out of the city then perhaps the people should have too hmm?
The proposal is unfair because it gets made unfair in congress, that makes a lot of sense. How about just making sure that the income exemption levels stay high? Then would it be fair? I don't want to punish the poor, I just want them to not get any more handouts than are necessary to get them to not be poor anymore. This would require them to be not only not lazy but very hardworking.
The balance between employer and employee is what it is. If you don't like the balance, shift it. Make yourself worth more, get better educated, get a new skill, work harder than the guy next to you, do whatever it takes to shift that balance. Just don't whine about it.
I deprived nobody of a job. If there were more qualified applicants than myself they would have gotten the job.
I did not HAVE to work 2 jobs to live, I chose to because the other option, taking many years to correct my mistakes, was not good enough for me. Had I not made those mistakes I could have lived on what I made from one job.
You make it sound like it is everybodys right to have a job, that living is a right. I hate to tell you this but that is not the way the world works. If living were a right then mana would fall from the sky and we could spend all day pondering the reality of our navels.
The real world is harsh and we must make our way in it. If you want to eat you have to either kill something, plant or animal, and eat it or you have to pay somebody something of worth to do the killing for you. That is a simplistic view, but it scales nicely if you ask me.
As for respect, it is something else that is not a right. Respect must be earned. That being said, it is not hard to earn my respect. That guy who picks the cabbage all day has my respect if he does it to the best of his ability. The one who wipes the grandma's ass gets the same if he does it to the best of his ability. Just because they are doing manual labor does not mean that I don't respect them.
However if Mr. Cabbage Picker instead of doing his best work decides to slack off and do just enough to not get fired, no respect to him. Unfortunately this seems to be the way that a large slice of the US population acts. I cannot fathom it as I value respect and want to be able to respect myself.
As to your last statement, life is not pretty, nor is it humane, get used to it.
An excellent idea, but shouldn't all jobs pay a living wage? And depending on location, living wage jobs can be hard to get.
Nope, all jobs should pay what the employees and employers agree upon.
Four years ago I worked three jobs for six months in order to be able to pay my bills, pay off debt, and save money to move to Gainesville, FL to go to school.
Prior to that I worked two jobs to make ends meet and pay off debt.
Prior to that I worked one job and mades stupid decisions which caused the debt I had to work off.
I no longer have to work three jobs, but I am working full time to be able to pay my way through school, no financial aid.
For example, if getting a Corpfoo Enterprise Linux cert of some kind costs $5000 and the program only pays for $3000 that makes it harder for lower income folks to take advantage of the program.
Then she should get a second job for a couple of months to be able to pay that extra $2000.
But middle class folks aren't as affected and can take advantage of it.
They are just as affected by it, they just have worked to give themselves the resources to be able to take advantage of it.
Every year, there's fewer and fewer lower income people in higher education.
There are other ways to make it in life than higher education, learning a trade for example.
Maybe not a dick, but we're all in this together, and you personally may have benefited from government in ways you might not have noticed.
Perhaps I have, but I know I have worked my ass off for everything I have.
I also know I try my damndest not to make stupid errors like buying $15 fruit juice on food stamps. I would really like to have an LCD monitor for my desktop at home but I have higher priority things to purchase with my money at the time being so I don't buy one.
The woman who purchased $15 juice very obviously had more important things to purchase with my money, but chose to spend it frivolously.
Or perhaps she didn't really need the food stamps and could spend them frivolously, but that is for a different discussion.
Could you define lower middle class for me, because I've met far too many people who say they weren't affluent, but when you get to the details they were.
Sure thing, my parents made about $30,000 a year when I was growing up for a family of 5. I certainly would not call that affluent, would you?
Nobody truly makes it on their own anymore. But what do you propose we do with those you believe do not deserve to make it? Bring back indentured servitude or slavery?
Perhaps you're right and nobody makes it on their own anymore, though I disagree. I hold that I have been given nothing other than the house over my head, clothes, food, and love that my parents provided as I was growing up. After I left their house I provided everything for myself. Until I married that is, and then I provided all of that for myself and my wife with her aid.
All things that were not needed for survival when I lived with my parents, I provided for myself. My car I bought for myself. The insurance and gas for that care, purchased by me. My computer equipment, bought by me. You see where I'm going here I'm sure.
As to what to do with those that cannot make it on their own, let happen to them what will. There are charitable organisations that will take care of some, prisons to take care of those who turn to crime, and mother nature to take care of the rest.
A lot of folks say what you do, "It's because they make bad judgements that people are poor." Everybody makes bad judgements, but I think folks like you say that to absolve your self of any responsibility to help anyone other than yourself. If it's their fault then you don't have to care, and you can complain about your taxes. Maybe the real problem is that her job doesn't pay a living wage.
You're right, alot of folks do say people stay poor because they make bad judgements, because it's true.
I don't have any responsibility to help anyone other than myself or my family, but I may choose to.
If the woman has a job that does not pay a living wage then she should get another job. If she doesn't have any skills then she should get some, there are free programs that will allow her to do so.
I really hate it that people not only don't take responsibility for their own actions but tell me I'm a dick for not wanting to take responsibility for them.
The bottom line is people like that woman need to wake the fuck up and fix their lives rather than live off of the government teat for the rest of their lives. If they can't make it to their feet on their own then we give them a hand up, after that they're on their own.
I came from a lower middle class family and have had to work my way up from the bottom, nothing was handed to me. As far as I'm concerned, those who cannot make it (mostly) on their own do not deserve to make it.
Those who buy $15 fruit juice when they're getting a hand up are an example of those who don't deserve to, and probably won't, make it.
time spent waiting for second meal: ~20 minutes about the same that I spent waiting for the first.
extras: free desert(which I declined)
As long as you're not a douche bag to the staff you don't generally get extra bodily fluids. Actually not being a douche bag tends to work well in most situations.
Owning a speedboat and a truck doesn't make one not environmentally aware.
What good does it do to be environmentally aware if you do nothing about that awareness?
"I'm aware that we all need to do something to stop the devastation of our environment, but I'm too busy driving my Hummer and my speedboat around to actually do anything about it. Sorry."
I'm sick of people saying that everybody other than themselves has to do something for the environment. Hypocrites.
As a moral atheist i have to say that i agree with your sentiment that my morality is based upon that of Christianity and Judaism. However I don't see where your problem is with that. I don't need to take your "it's a code of ethics that is inherently divine" to heart. Just because you believe that these ethics which make sense are divine does not mean that I need to.
Take a look at the ten commandments for instance. If you remove the religious ones, idolatry and name in vein etc. the rest of them make sense in order to live in polite society.
I don't need divinity to make me behave in a way that makes society run better, common sense does that for me.
Slashdot Mirror
If your options are:
1. Don't restrict things and punish those that break the law after they've broken it.
2. Restrict things only for those that would use them in a way that would break the law.
3. Restrict things for everybody, even those who don't need the restriction.
The only viable option is option one. Two was stated by you to be impossible and three is repugnant.
I have absolutely no problem with higher taxes for more benefits.
My only problem comes from taxing the same money twice. I find that to be kind of ridiculous.
Wealth tax? Really?
So if i make 100 dollars I pay an income tax on that 100 dollars. No problem.
Then I put the remaining 75 dollars in the bank.
Then I get taxed on the 75 dollar balance that I already paid taxes on? Wow, that's ridiculous.
Tax on dividends? No problem, it's additional income.
Tax on money I've already been taxed on? Fucked.
I in fact do think that screaming fire at the back of a crowded theater should be free speech. And if people were injured because of that, or if property was damaged because of it, I should be held liable.
However I should not be liable if someone in the theater decided to commit suicide in the theater rather than try to exit it.
There is a difference between my actions causing the death of another through accident, or mishap, etc., and someone deciding that it's easier to kill themselves rather than deal with name calling or other harassment.
In the movie theater example my actions caused a panic and that panic caused bad things to happen. I should be held responsible for that panic.
In the harassment example my actions caused you to feel bad and have some emotional distress. I should not be responsible for your decision to off yourself.
If my harassment falls afoul of harassment laws then I should be punished for those offenses, but that is a far cry from being responsible for your death.
By the way, fantastic insults! I had to look up homunculous.
Not really.
Calling someone a name is not the same as stating a false fact about somebody.
If I said somebody liked to wear ladies shoes and that was not true then it would be libelous.
Calling someone a douche-bag would not be libelous, just rude.
Sorry, but if you kill yourself because I call you a fucking pansy I should not be held responsible for that act.
You killed yourself.
I did not kill you. I called you a name.
Last I checked name calling was legal.
And you know what, it always should be.
You fucking pansy.
I thought it was capitalist pigdogs
"Anonymous Cowards are the bravest souls in the universe!"
Just because it was written doesn't make it so.
I was talking about something a bit lower level than they were. If living were a right then how you kill anything to eat? It is that brocolli stalks right to live, how dare you kill it so that you can live?
The point is this, life is difficult, only those who try the hardest (or get really lucky) get to win. The sooner that people figure that out the better off they are.
Wow, who ever said that I didn't benefit from governemt spending, of course I do. I love the roads I drive on. I love being defended from outside invaders. The governement is necessesary for infrastructure and such. No argument there.
If the jobs moved out of the city then perhaps the people should have too hmm?
The proposal is unfair because it gets made unfair in congress, that makes a lot of sense. How about just making sure that the income exemption levels stay high? Then would it be fair? I don't want to punish the poor, I just want them to not get any more handouts than are necessary to get them to not be poor anymore. This would require them to be not only not lazy but very hardworking.
The balance between employer and employee is what it is. If you don't like the balance, shift it. Make yourself worth more, get better educated, get a new skill, work harder than the guy next to you, do whatever it takes to shift that balance. Just don't whine about it.
I deprived nobody of a job. If there were more qualified applicants than myself they would have gotten the job.
I did not HAVE to work 2 jobs to live, I chose to because the other option, taking many years to correct my mistakes, was not good enough for me. Had I not made those mistakes I could have lived on what I made from one job.
You make it sound like it is everybodys right to have a job, that living is a right. I hate to tell you this but that is not the way the world works. If living were a right then mana would fall from the sky and we could spend all day pondering the reality of our navels.
The real world is harsh and we must make our way in it. If you want to eat you have to either kill something, plant or animal, and eat it or you have to pay somebody something of worth to do the killing for you. That is a simplistic view, but it scales nicely if you ask me.
As for respect, it is something else that is not a right. Respect must be earned. That being said, it is not hard to earn my respect. That guy who picks the cabbage all day has my respect if he does it to the best of his ability. The one who wipes the grandma's ass gets the same if he does it to the best of his ability. Just because they are doing manual labor does not mean that I don't respect them.
However if Mr. Cabbage Picker instead of doing his best work decides to slack off and do just enough to not get fired, no respect to him. Unfortunately this seems to be the way that a large slice of the US population acts. I cannot fathom it as I value respect and want to be able to respect myself.
As to your last statement, life is not pretty, nor is it humane, get used to it.
Explain to me how the government not taking money that is not theirs is welfare for me?
The way I read your comment you think that the money I work for belongs to the government and I just get to keep some.
I certainly agree that there are too many loopholes in the tax code. I would say that the most promising fix to this would be the fair tax.
An excellent idea, but shouldn't all jobs pay a living wage? And depending on location, living wage jobs can be hard to get.
Nope, all jobs should pay what the employees and employers agree upon.
Four years ago I worked three jobs for six months in order to be able to pay my bills, pay off debt, and save money to move to Gainesville, FL to go to school.
Prior to that I worked two jobs to make ends meet and pay off debt.
Prior to that I worked one job and mades stupid decisions which caused the debt I had to work off.
I no longer have to work three jobs, but I am working full time to be able to pay my way through school, no financial aid.
For example, if getting a Corpfoo Enterprise Linux cert of some kind costs $5000 and the program only pays for $3000 that makes it harder for lower income folks to take advantage of the program.
Then she should get a second job for a couple of months to be able to pay that extra $2000.
But middle class folks aren't as affected and can take advantage of it.
They are just as affected by it, they just have worked to give themselves the resources to be able to take advantage of it.
Every year, there's fewer and fewer lower income people in higher education.
There are other ways to make it in life than higher education, learning a trade for example.
Maybe not a dick, but we're all in this together, and you personally may have benefited from government in ways you might not have noticed.
Perhaps I have, but I know I have worked my ass off for everything I have.
I also know I try my damndest not to make stupid errors like buying $15 fruit juice on food stamps. I would really like to have an LCD monitor for my desktop at home but I have higher priority things to purchase with my money at the time being so I don't buy one.
The woman who purchased $15 juice very obviously had more important things to purchase with my money, but chose to spend it frivolously.
Or perhaps she didn't really need the food stamps and could spend them frivolously, but that is for a different discussion.
Could you define lower middle class for me, because I've met far too many people who say they weren't affluent, but when you get to the details they were.
Sure thing, my parents made about $30,000 a year when I was growing up for a family of 5. I certainly would not call that affluent, would you?
Nobody truly makes it on their own anymore. But what do you propose we do with those you believe do not deserve to make it? Bring back indentured servitude or slavery?
Perhaps you're right and nobody makes it on their own anymore, though I disagree. I hold that I have been given nothing other than the house over my head, clothes, food, and love that my parents provided as I was growing up. After I left their house I provided everything for myself. Until I married that is, and then I provided all of that for myself and my wife with her aid.
All things that were not needed for survival when I lived with my parents, I provided for myself. My car I bought for myself. The insurance and gas for that care, purchased by me. My computer equipment, bought by me. You see where I'm going here I'm sure.
As to what to do with those that cannot make it on their own, let happen to them what will. There are charitable organisations that will take care of some, prisons to take care of those who turn to crime, and mother nature to take care of the rest.
A lot of folks say what you do, "It's because they make bad judgements that people are poor." Everybody makes bad judgements, but I think folks like you say that to absolve your self of any responsibility to help anyone other than yourself. If it's their fault then you don't have to care, and you can complain about your taxes. Maybe the real problem is that her job doesn't pay a living wage.
You're right, alot of folks do say people stay poor because they make bad judgements, because it's true.
I don't have any responsibility to help anyone other than myself or my family, but I may choose to.
If the woman has a job that does not pay a living wage then she should get another job. If she doesn't have any skills then she should get some, there are free programs that will allow her to do so.
I really hate it that people not only don't take responsibility for their own actions but tell me I'm a dick for not wanting to take responsibility for them.
The bottom line is people like that woman need to wake the fuck up and fix their lives rather than live off of the government teat for the rest of their lives. If they can't make it to their feet on their own then we give them a hand up, after that they're on their own.
I came from a lower middle class family and have had to work my way up from the bottom, nothing was handed to me. As far as I'm concerned, those who cannot make it (mostly) on their own do not deserve to make it.
Those who buy $15 fruit juice when they're getting a hand up are an example of those who don't deserve to, and probably won't, make it.
Here's a hint:
When picking on someone for their spelling, don't misspell words.
Ignorat twit.
incorrect with "they're" and correct with "there"
"they are probably are not as many opportunities"
not so much
"there probably are not as many opportunities"
better
You got it.
Texas Roadhouse
Eau Gallie Blvd.
Melbourne, FL
dish ordered: prime rib w/ loaded baked potato
sent back because of: excessive gristle & bad potato
exchanged for: fillet mignon w/ loaded baked potato
time spent waiting for second meal: ~20 minutes about the same that I spent waiting for the first.
extras: free desert(which I declined)
As long as you're not a douche bag to the staff you don't generally get extra bodily fluids. Actually not being a douche bag tends to work well in most situations.
If you're dining at a restaurant and you pay for food you do not like then that is your problem.
If I'm dining out I do NOT pay for food that I don't like, I send it back and get something that does not suck.
[sic] is used when you are quoting something to show that the typo is not yours.
No problem. I hate bad moderation by people to lazy to figure it out.
This is totally not off topic as he actually has an explanation down page.
Her right ear is 1/4" lower than her right ear?
That would explain her smashing good looks.
What good does it do to be environmentally aware if you do nothing about that awareness?
"I'm aware that we all need to do something to stop the devastation of our environment, but I'm too busy driving my Hummer and my speedboat around to actually do anything about it. Sorry."
I'm sick of people saying that everybody other than themselves has to do something for the environment. Hypocrites.
No, but it would lend him a bit more credibility then if he were just some fiction writer.
http://www.1and1.com/ And their hosting plans aren't bad either
As a moral atheist i have to say that i agree with your sentiment that my morality is based upon that of Christianity and Judaism. However I don't see where your problem is with that. I don't need to take your "it's a code of ethics that is inherently divine" to heart. Just because you believe that these ethics which make sense are divine does not mean that I need to.
Take a look at the ten commandments for instance. If you remove the religious ones, idolatry and name in vein etc. the rest of them make sense in order to live in polite society.
I don't need divinity to make me behave in a way that makes society run better, common sense does that for me.