Why does everyone love to quote The Prince, a book about running a tyranny, but no one quotes Machiavelli's Discourses on Livy, an equally insightful book about running a Republic?
1.) Commerce Clause. We may not like it, but it exists, and has been used in this fashion for decades. The issue was decided by the Supreme Court, long ago, and therefore, it's use it, by definition, constitutional.
2.) Obamacare will reduce the deficit, as the non-paertisan CBO points out.
3.) Obama did the same thing.
4.) Obama's plan does not include a public option. Thankfully for point 2 above, Obama's plan DOES include insurance price controls, the only way to reduce healthcare costs in this country short of a public option.
5.) So, you are saying that Mittens' plan is less detailed and comprehensive? And you are furthermore claiming that 2,000 pages is too long to read and understand?
6.) Obama's plan does not cut medicare, nor raise taxes.
Well, The American Conservative plainly states Oamacare is Romneycare, and they quote plenty of examples from pundits, both left and right leaning, stating exactly why and how the two plans are alike.
You twist facts, conflating those who opposed healthcare reform as doing to little with those who think it went too far. Only by putting both of those very different categories together in one can you say that a majority of people opposed health care reform when Obama first proposed it.
It's called "RomneyCare" not "ObamaCare" because it is exactly the plan that Mittens Romney come up with during the Clinton administration, individual mandate and all.
All you need to do is point out where I am wrong. Which you haven't done. Why not? You say it is easy, but you have not done it. Perhaps YOU are the one hoping no one will read the link...
The "National Archive" of your imagination does not count, here are some real facts and figures (bonus points when you scream "But wiki!" then read the linked citations and realize, no it isn't just wikipedia saying this):
Oh, don't get me wrong. Obama is not doing the right thing by using executive orders. But he has issued orders of magnitude less of them than Bush, and I'd be wiling to bet you didn't speak out about Bush's executive orders.
The majority of citizens want Obamacare, according to the most recent polls. Of the ones who do not like Obamacare, like me, most actually wanted single payer, like they have in the rest of the civilized world. You can't have a free market in health care, people simply do not make rational decisions about health.
Right now, our health care system is simply a bunch of leaches. Now, real leaches have actual medical value, but I am talking about the3 paper pushing, money wasting kind. Too much of our GDP goes to health care. We pay more than any place else in the world, for very mediocre outcomes. Our health care is the most expensive, and amongst the least effective. That is what the free market does, in health care. Socialism just works better for some types of problems that the market can not handle.
You mean RomneyCare? The bill that Mittens tried to put up as an alternative to single payer back in Clinton's first term? ObamaCare is exactly the same bill, right down to the individual mandate, which Republicans pushed as "individual responsibility."
You DO know that most of that 55% who don't like it wanted a single payer system, right?
Really? The Tea Party says Obama is a Muslim Kenyan terrorist and all liberals are traitors who should be shot. What do we say that is even 1/100th as crazy?
It's amazing they would operate their business that way. Ah, no, I guess the word is "disgusting." I consider it borderline fraud, as they do not clearly explain that they retain ownership of the pictures they take.
I give you every opportunity to actually debate. I will not accord anyone respect they haven't earned. You do not get to act like a child, but get treated like an adult. If you have a position, put it out there and I will debate without name calling or rancor. Just don't think that you can act like an evil, spoiled child and then whine about it when others don't treat you with respect.
Look up the history of Executive Order. Who issued the most executive orders, hmm? Bush Jr. HOw much do the Republicans care about protecting the minority when they are in power? None. And you DO realize that Democrats still control the Senate and the Executive office, and Republicans do not have a solid majority even in the house, right? Democrats still control government. Obama does not need to use the executive order precedent set by Bush.
I actually thought the teabaggers were going to compromise
And I never thought liberals would stop referring to libertarians and conservatives using sexual slang, and instead debate based on ideas.
Looks like I was right. I wonder what else all of the Tea Party members have been right about while you've been mocking them?
Nothing. The Tea Party has been right about absolutely nothing. They are crazy. They do not deserve respect, or a place at the civilized people's table. Nobody wants to debate crazy, it isn't a debate, it is just crazy yelling DIE! DIE! DIE! at you. Seriously, what is there to debate? You make it sound as though the Tea Party has been espousing sensible positions, hell, they haven't been espousing positions at all. The only thing I hear from the Tea Party is an unintelligible scream of rage. The only position they hold true to is a position of unrelenting fear and hatred of the undeserving "other" who is bent on destroying America. The Tea Party thinks that I and everyone like me is a terrorist bent on destroying America. How can you have a debate with that? You can't.
The Tea Party has never said anything comprehensible enough to be refuted. The American Public rejected the Tea Party at the polls, in fact the Tea Party cost the Republicans quite a few seats. If you have a political position, you should state what it is. Then we can debate it. As for the Tea Party itself, I have no respect for the loons who identify with the Tea Party. You may as well ask why I do not debate Charles Manson over the morality of getting others to kill strangers for you. Because there is nothing to debate there.
The Tea Party gets my respect when it's members earn it by acting like grown ups. Until then, I can only engage them on the preschool playground level they seem to prefer.
This particular corner of the madhouse predates the DMCA and the Internet by a good many decades. Photo studios have been scamming consumers this way for a long time.
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Why does everyone love to quote The Prince, a book about running a tyranny, but no one quotes Machiavelli's Discourses on Livy, an equally insightful book about running a Republic?
1.) Commerce Clause. We may not like it, but it exists, and has been used in this fashion for decades. The issue was decided by the Supreme Court, long ago, and therefore, it's use it, by definition, constitutional.
2.) Obamacare will reduce the deficit, as the non-paertisan CBO points out.
3.) Obama did the same thing.
4.) Obama's plan does not include a public option. Thankfully for point 2 above, Obama's plan DOES include insurance price controls, the only way to reduce healthcare costs in this country short of a public option.
5.) So, you are saying that Mittens' plan is less detailed and comprehensive? And you are furthermore claiming that 2,000 pages is too long to read and understand?
6.) Obama's plan does not cut medicare, nor raise taxes.
Got any more bullshit you wish debunked?
Well, The American Conservative plainly states Oamacare is Romneycare, and they quote plenty of examples from pundits, both left and right leaning, stating exactly why and how the two plans are alike.
So you admit that Obamacare is the same thing as Romneycare? Who cares what it is called, it is a Republican plan.
You twist facts, conflating those who opposed healthcare reform as doing to little with those who think it went too far. Only by putting both of those very different categories together in one can you say that a majority of people opposed health care reform when Obama first proposed it.
It's called "RomneyCare" not "ObamaCare" because it is exactly the plan that Mittens Romney come up with during the Clinton administration, individual mandate and all.
All you need to do is point out where I am wrong. Which you haven't done. Why not? You say it is easy, but you have not done it. Perhaps YOU are the one hoping no one will read the link...
Hey, you know, this being the Internet and all, I'm sure you can point to some of your previous anti-Bush comments about his use of executive orders.
The "National Archive" of your imagination does not count, here are some real facts and figures (bonus points when you scream "But wiki!" then read the linked citations and realize, no it isn't just wikipedia saying this):
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Executive_order_(United_States)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_United_States_federal_executive_orders
Are you trying to make a joke, or do you simply not know any history or current events?
Oh, don't get me wrong. Obama is not doing the right thing by using executive orders. But he has issued orders of magnitude less of them than Bush, and I'd be wiling to bet you didn't speak out about Bush's executive orders.
The majority of citizens want Obamacare, according to the most recent polls. Of the ones who do not like Obamacare, like me, most actually wanted single payer, like they have in the rest of the civilized world. You can't have a free market in health care, people simply do not make rational decisions about health.
Right now, our health care system is simply a bunch of leaches. Now, real leaches have actual medical value, but I am talking about the3 paper pushing, money wasting kind. Too much of our GDP goes to health care. We pay more than any place else in the world, for very mediocre outcomes. Our health care is the most expensive, and amongst the least effective. That is what the free market does, in health care. Socialism just works better for some types of problems that the market can not handle.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tea_Party_movement#Controversies
Give me something to refute, then. What is the Tea Party platform? Come on, quite whining and state your position.
You mean RomneyCare? The bill that Mittens tried to put up as an alternative to single payer back in Clinton's first term? ObamaCare is exactly the same bill, right down to the individual mandate, which Republicans pushed as "individual responsibility."
You DO know that most of that 55% who don't like it wanted a single payer system, right?
First sentence in that article starts: "While losses by Tea Party-backed candidates may have helped cost Republicans control of the U.S. Senate, "
Seriously, a scant handful of Republicans masquerading as the "Tea Party" won a few seats, and this is somehow indicative of a public mandate?
Really? The Tea Party says Obama is a Muslim Kenyan terrorist and all liberals are traitors who should be shot. What do we say that is even 1/100th as crazy?
They called it Inception. It wasn't very good. But Keanu looked more animated than I have ever seen him before. He must have taken acting lessons.
It's amazing they would operate their business that way. Ah, no, I guess the word is "disgusting." I consider it borderline fraud, as they do not clearly explain that they retain ownership of the pictures they take.
I give you every opportunity to actually debate. I will not accord anyone respect they haven't earned. You do not get to act like a child, but get treated like an adult. If you have a position, put it out there and I will debate without name calling or rancor. Just don't think that you can act like an evil, spoiled child and then whine about it when others don't treat you with respect.
You want a debate? Bring it. State your position.
Look up the history of Executive Order. Who issued the most executive orders, hmm? Bush Jr. HOw much do the Republicans care about protecting the minority when they are in power? None. And you DO realize that Democrats still control the Senate and the Executive office, and Republicans do not have a solid majority even in the house, right? Democrats still control government. Obama does not need to use the executive order precedent set by Bush.
I actually thought the teabaggers were going to compromise
And I never thought liberals would stop referring to libertarians and conservatives using sexual slang, and instead debate based on ideas.
Looks like I was right. I wonder what else all of the Tea Party members have been right about while you've been mocking them?
Nothing. The Tea Party has been right about absolutely nothing. They are crazy. They do not deserve respect, or a place at the civilized people's table. Nobody wants to debate crazy, it isn't a debate, it is just crazy yelling DIE! DIE! DIE! at you. Seriously, what is there to debate? You make it sound as though the Tea Party has been espousing sensible positions, hell, they haven't been espousing positions at all. The only thing I hear from the Tea Party is an unintelligible scream of rage. The only position they hold true to is a position of unrelenting fear and hatred of the undeserving "other" who is bent on destroying America. The Tea Party thinks that I and everyone like me is a terrorist bent on destroying America. How can you have a debate with that? You can't.
Please quote the "Well thought out factual criticism" that you feel the White House has failed to respond to.
The Tea Party has never said anything comprehensible enough to be refuted. The American Public rejected the Tea Party at the polls, in fact the Tea Party cost the Republicans quite a few seats. If you have a political position, you should state what it is. Then we can debate it. As for the Tea Party itself, I have no respect for the loons who identify with the Tea Party. You may as well ask why I do not debate Charles Manson over the morality of getting others to kill strangers for you. Because there is nothing to debate there.
The Tea Party gets my respect when it's members earn it by acting like grown ups. Until then, I can only engage them on the preschool playground level they seem to prefer.
This particular corner of the madhouse predates the DMCA and the Internet by a good many decades. Photo studios have been scamming consumers this way for a long time.