Some of the major trade shows (LWCE in ny or san jose, or comdex, etc) can cost upwards of $100k per show, and that's just for the floor space. on top of that, there's your fancy booth, travel expenses, employee uniforms perhaps, etc etc.
With the number of shows that Eazel went to, that should be a cool $1M right there.
Then consider their big bandwidth costs, rent for their office, computers, and all that jazz....that's big money.
Marketting: it costs a hell of a lot to advertise in magazines, especially when you want to be in all of them. then there's web ads too. a years worth of hard advertising would be $1M or $2M. Remember, they're trying their hardest to seem like a big, huge, successful company...there's a lot of image to sustain.
Staff: how many employees do they have? 20? 20 @ $50k/year each would be $1M/year.
most of these dot-com companies are always trying to be bigger, better, faster. they're competing to see who can burn money the fastest.
-Doviende
"The value of a man resides in what he gives,
and not in what he is capable of receiving."
you're quite mistaken here, and you've ignored the important parts of what was said. let me summarize so that it's easier for you:
1) Linux is GPLed
2) glibc is LGPLed
according to (1), anything that links with linux must itself be GPLed.
according to (2), something may link with glibc without necessarily being
free software. Please read the LGPL for more information.
now, if i remember correctly, there's an exception in the linux license to allow binary-only loadable modules, but i'm not too clear on that part.
but my main point, is that stallman was quite clear in his language in the article. he didn't "go off on a rant", and link has the same definition in both cases. the difference was the license (GPL vs LGPL).
to put it another way, if you link with a GPL program,
All your code are belong to us! Take off every 'zig'!!
;)
-Doviende
"The value of a man resides in what he gives,
and not in what he is capable of receiving."
i still find it hilarious that in this day and age, microsoft is still limited to 3-character extensions on files.
Perhaps they could add another paragraph of advice:
You need to inform your customers of the risks of installing operating systems that allow file extensions of more than 3 characters. They could be open to legal risks if they have four-letter extensions that might include such things as "mpeg", "divx", or other uncommon words like "f***" or "sh**" that might go against local obscenity laws. To expose your customers to this legal risk is irresponsible, and wouldn't they rather have Windows anyway?
-Doviende
"The value of a man resides in what he gives,
and not in what he is capable of receiving."
As you yourself impied, if I give someone your software in such a way to violate your license, you still have your software.
Good point. I'd say that if you wish to make a derivative product that is not GPL (or perhaps links with a troublesome library like the older versions of Qt), then i would discuss some alternative licensing scheme according to your needs. but, if you want to take the software and make some proprietary add-on and restrict people's freedoms, then i don't want to let you do it.
being forced to give everyone else the same rights that one has, is (in my view) a small price to pay compared to having others take away more freedom by making a proprietary derivative.
if (or when) the present copyright system is gone, you will in fact have the right to do whatever you want with my software...but i will also have the right to do the same with yours. At the present time, you have the right to do almost anything with my software, but if it wasn't GPLed then some people could try to take away those rights.
What intellectual sophistry to assume that anyone disagreeing with you is ignorant of the topic!
He doesn't have to agree. The issue was that he was putting words in the mouth of the other poster. He claimed that the first person (and RMS) would call him evil if he didn't give away his refridgerator, when this was definitely not something claimed by the original poster (or RMS). That's why i said that he was unfamiliar with the exact statement that the original poster was making, and he should go read it more carefully.
You're completely ignoring Locke,
i'm afraid you're correct on that point. I haven't had time to read Locke yet. I'm presently reading Kant's "critique of pure reason", but it's slow going....I'll consider reading something from Locke immediately afterwards though. thanks for the suggestion.
For a radical look at a world where software is owned in the absence of any government recognition of it, see Intellectual Property Rights Viewed As Contracts.
Thanks! i'll go read that too.:)
i appreciate you taking the time to discuss this with me:)
-Doviende
"The value of a man resides in what he gives,
and not in what he is capable of receiving."
It would probably do you some good to read the Debian Social Contract. It explains many of these things. I'll give a brief refresher as i go through your comment.
they're an often politically obnoxious organization threatening to push away corporate newcomers to the Linux movement
That's silly. I work at a company that makes a commercial distribution of debian, with some custom add-ons (the company is Stormix). Also, here's a quote from the Social Contract:
We won't object to commercial software that is intended to run on Debian systems, and we'll allow others to create value-added distributions containing both Debian and commercial software, without any fee from us. To support these goals, we will provide an integrated system of high-quality, 100% free software, with no legal restrictions that would prevent these kinds of use.
So, you see, Debian has explicitly stated that they are trying to make sure anyone can make a derivative work without being encumbered by bad licenses
And because it's GPLed like everything else from Debian,
According to the Social Contract, any software written for Debian must be under license that meets the Debian Free Software Guidelines. This could be BSD license, or MPL, or numerous other licenses...it doesn't have to be GPL. GPL just seems to be the most common choice.
even if they try to change future liscensing, this distribution will make for at least one more before they do so. Let's hope they never pursue that course.
The social contract specifically says that Debian's priorities are the Users and Free Software. If Debian "sold out" or some such non-sense, it would cease to be Debian. There will never be a non-free release of Debian.
So, don't worry about getting one more free release of Debian before it goes sour. It just won't happen.
-Doviende
"The value of a man resides in what he gives,
and not in what he is capable of receiving."
what a terribly small world you must live in when your morality depends on giving away 100% of your property.
actually, some of us believe that something that can be duplicated for no cost can not be considered a possession.
... be decried evil because I didn't give him my refrigerator,...
if i give someone my refridgerator, i no longer have a refridgerator. If i give someone my software, i still have my software. the two cases are quite different.
... Even the FSF copyrights their own software....
the FSF does not take any rights away from me. They use the present system of copyright to ensure that freedoms will be preserved (in a world that frequently likes to deny freedoms). Notice they always use the word copyleft to distinguish their use from the regular use of the existing legal structure.
Some people say that by clearly defining the argument, you have half-way won it already. Sometimes an argument may be clearly defined, but some people choose to ignore the definition and argue it on incorrect premises. I'd suggest you go back and carefully read the opinions of others in this topic. Perhaps you won't listen to Richard Stallman's arguments, but how about others like Proudhon, Mill, Emma Goldman, and numerous others?
If, after becoming familiar with what your opponent says, you'd like to come back and talk, I would be happy to discuss things further:)
-Doviende
"The value of a man resides in what he gives,
and not in what he is capable of receiving."
hey taco! haven't you tried the Storm Package Manager? it's got all the features of apt, in a nice GUI interface. from what i've heard, it does more then gnome-apt, and it'll be included in Woody some time soon.
you can get it right now, along with other nifty additions like the Storm Adminstration System, from the stormix ftp site.
Or, add the following line to your/etc/apt/sources.list file and do an "apt-get update; apt-get install stormpkg":
deb http://ftp.stormix.com/storm hail main contrib
blatant plug: try out the new Storm Linux distribution (called Hail) that just got released, based on the latest debian potato. I wrote part of the ftp install:)
-Doviende
"The value of a man resides in what he gives,
and not in what he is capable of receiving."
i didn't see who the leading proprietary databases were that they competed against....anyone else find some details?
also, i'm all for postgres, but doesn't it seem funny that their business is based on postgres solutions, and now they come out with this "independant benchmark" claiming that postgres is the best?
This could be another attempt at "benchmarketing";)
-Doviende
"The value of a man resides in what he gives,
and not in what he is capable of receiving."
Instead of continually listening to Katz Rantz, can we have an interview with someone like Noam Chomsky?
I'm sure he has plenty to say about the growing corporatism and its affect on U.S. foreign policies ( ie Encryption ) , and our personal freedoms. - Doviende
"The value of a man resides in what he gives, and not in what he is capable of receiving."
Re:MPAA's VP of Public Relations says: Sigma
on
Protesting DMCA
·
· Score: 1
i betchya it won't be open-sourced, or they might not be technically ALLOWED to open-source it, since it is, as you say, "correctly licensed".
"The value of a man resides in what he gives, and not in what he is capable of receiving."
just a note on your last paragraph...when Storm boots up, it displays an almost-splash screen, but it has this viewing window in the middle of it where the boot messages are displayed. So, it looks pretty for those who want a pretty boot up, but it also satisfies the need for informative boot messages.
Pete Lypkie
"The value of a man resides in what he gives, and not in what he is capable of receiving."
In the case that a new client does more sophisticated processing in roughly the same time, it would have to return a slightly different completion indicator....then in your stats engine you just count the "New and Improved" work units as maybe 4 times the value of the old ones. That way, it's in every kiddie's interest to upgrade to the new client.
-Doviende
"The value of a man resides in what he gives, and not in what he is capable of receiving."
actually, i don't think that your Consumer Reports example is the same idea as your gun makers example.
Any way you try to dance around it, guns are for hurting. and don't start saying that you use them for target shooting. bulls**t....use a pellet gun or something. same idea, but you can't kill people with it too.
Anyway...back to the topic at hand. If DVDs were designed with the intent to kill humans, then i think that copying DVDs would be bad.
Since DVDs are not actually designed to kill humans, then i think they should only be going after the pirates, and not the people who expose the flaws in their so-called security methods.
This is just like your consumer reports example, and not like the gun example.
"The value of a man resides in what he gives, and not in what he is capable of receiving."
i was thinking of using gogo for my broadcasting project, but both gogo and lame don't allow bitrates below 32kbps. I wanted to have a 24kbps stream, but i'll have to use some other encoder in order to get that.
anyone know where i can get more info on all of this patching the kernel business involved in using Xing? I was gonna bill the radio station for an extra $20 and buy Xing.
Doviende
"The value of a man resides in what he gives, and not in what he is capable of receiving."
Thermite, of course! Thermite is fun stuff that can turn sand into glass and melt rocks and stuff.
They used it during construction of railroads way back when, to melt the iron and join it together.
It's basically aluminum and rust. When you ignite it (using something extremely hot, like burning magnesium), the oxygen seperates form the rust, and this allows the aluminum to burn. You're left with aluminum oxide and molten iron.
The problem is, where the heck do you get enough rust? This magical stuff that the guy used is the answer to your Thermite woes:)
Warning: do not try this at home.
IANAFM (i am not a fire marshal).
"The value of a man resides in what he gives, and not in what he is capable of receiving."
This guy is a goofball. He's claiming to have "discovered" that all of our address problems can be solved by just adding more numbers (like adding an area code to the front of a telephone number).
He says that we don't actually need IPv6...we just need IPv4 with 64 or 128 bit addresses.
DUH! what'd he think the biggest improvement of IPv6 over IPv4 was???
also, i think he just doesn't "get" the ideas of binary, decimal, hex, or any simple math concepts at all.
"The value of a man resides in what he gives, and not in what he is capable of receiving."
you must have an incredibly old monitor...I have a low end 19" (an optiquest v95), and it will happily do 1800x1440 (great for having a whole bunch of files displayed when you're coding).
Like some other people have mentioned, you probably want to shell out some cash for your monitor. It's one of the parts of your computer that will actually last more than a few years, so go ahead and splurge on it.
"The value of a man resides in what he gives, and not in what he is capable of receiving."
ok guys....tomorrow (wednesday) morning at 7:10am Pacific time, Vancouver radio station 99.3 the Fox will have an interview with Trey Parker and Matt Stone (creators and voices of South Park). Two crazy local DJs, Larry and Willy, will be interviewing them supposedly. There will be a LIVE web feed from their web page (www.cfox.com....see link above).
-Doviende
"The value of a man resides in what he gives, and not in what he is capable of receiving."
If the workaround is "disable the feature", that's fairly useless if you really need to use the feature. I could have said right away that to prevent people from getting ReWT aWn yEr BAwX, just stop using IIS-4 until the fix comes out....oh sure, you lose some features, but oh well.
Obviously this is a silly answer...the real answer is the complete fix so that people can continue using that feature without fear of root compromises.
-Doviende
"The value of a man resides in what he gives, and not in what he is capable of receiving."
appropriate name for the device?
on
Digital VCRs
·
· Score: 2
Just a technicallity, but wouldn't such a device be a Video Hard Disk Recorder, or a Video FlashRom Recorder instead of Video Cassette Recorder?
that would be VHDR or VFRR instead of VCR:)
-Doviende
"The value of a man resides in what he gives, and not in what he is capable of receiving."
From what i've heard, the freeswan guys have to do a huge re-write before it will work with 2.2.x kernels, so this is definitely useless for those of us who have upgraded their kernel in the past year....i can hardly remember the last time i used a 2.0.x kernel.
Does anyone know of an alternate that doesn't force you to use ancient kernels?
-Doviende
"The value of a man resides in what he gives, and not in what he is capable of receiving."
Slashdot Mirror
opera still doesn't comply with a bunch of CSS and CSS2 features, and mozilla does almost all of them perfectly.
With the number of shows that Eazel went to, that should be a cool $1M right there.
Then consider their big bandwidth costs, rent for their office, computers, and all that jazz....that's big money.
Marketting: it costs a hell of a lot to advertise in magazines, especially when you want to be in all of them. then there's web ads too. a years worth of hard advertising would be $1M or $2M. Remember, they're trying their hardest to seem like a big, huge, successful company...there's a lot of image to sustain.
Staff: how many employees do they have? 20? 20 @ $50k/year each would be $1M/year.
most of these dot-com companies are always trying to be bigger, better, faster. they're competing to see who can burn money the fastest.
-Doviende
"The value of a man resides in what he gives,
and not in what he is capable of receiving."
1) Linux is GPLed
2) glibc is LGPLed
according to (1), anything that links with linux must itself be GPLed.
according to (2), something may link with glibc without necessarily being free software. Please read the LGPL for more information.
now, if i remember correctly, there's an exception in the linux license to allow binary-only loadable modules, but i'm not too clear on that part.
but my main point, is that stallman was quite clear in his language in the article. he didn't "go off on a rant", and link has the same definition in both cases. the difference was the license (GPL vs LGPL).
to put it another way, if you link with a GPL program,
All your code are belong to us! Take off every 'zig'!!
-Doviende
"The value of a man resides in what he gives,
and not in what he is capable of receiving."
i still find it hilarious that in this day and age, microsoft is still limited to 3-character extensions on files.
Perhaps they could add another paragraph of advice:
You need to inform your customers of the risks of installing operating systems that allow file extensions of more than 3 characters. They could be open to legal risks if they have four-letter extensions that might include such things as "mpeg", "divx", or other uncommon words like "f***" or "sh**" that might go against local obscenity laws. To expose your customers to this legal risk is irresponsible, and wouldn't they rather have Windows anyway?
-Doviende
"The value of a man resides in what he gives,
and not in what he is capable of receiving."
If treaties superceded the constitution, then treaties are the answer to all those pesky things like free speech.
just make a treaty with [insert tiny controllable country here] that says "U.S. must enforce anything it wants regardless of its own constitution"
so, if treaties supercede the U.S. constitution, then the constitution is then ruled invalid and useless.
-Doviende
"The value of a man resides in what he gives,
and not in what he is capable of receiving."
As you yourself impied, if I give someone your software in such a way to violate your license, you still have your software.
Good point. I'd say that if you wish to make a derivative product that is not GPL (or perhaps links with a troublesome library like the older versions of Qt), then i would discuss some alternative licensing scheme according to your needs. but, if you want to take the software and make some proprietary add-on and restrict people's freedoms, then i don't want to let you do it.
being forced to give everyone else the same rights that one has, is (in my view) a small price to pay compared to having others take away more freedom by making a proprietary derivative.
if (or when) the present copyright system is gone, you will in fact have the right to do whatever you want with my software...but i will also have the right to do the same with yours. At the present time, you have the right to do almost anything with my software, but if it wasn't GPLed then some people could try to take away those rights.
What intellectual sophistry to assume that anyone disagreeing with you is ignorant of the topic!
He doesn't have to agree. The issue was that he was putting words in the mouth of the other poster. He claimed that the first person (and RMS) would call him evil if he didn't give away his refridgerator, when this was definitely not something claimed by the original poster (or RMS). That's why i said that he was unfamiliar with the exact statement that the original poster was making, and he should go read it more carefully.
You're completely ignoring Locke,
i'm afraid you're correct on that point. I haven't had time to read Locke yet. I'm presently reading Kant's "critique of pure reason", but it's slow going....I'll consider reading something from Locke immediately afterwards though. thanks for the suggestion.
For a radical look at a world where software is owned in the absence of any government recognition of it, see Intellectual Property Rights Viewed As Contracts.
Thanks! i'll go read that too. :)
i appreciate you taking the time to discuss this with me :)
-Doviende
"The value of a man resides in what he gives,
and not in what he is capable of receiving."
It would probably do you some good to read the Debian Social Contract. It explains many of these things. I'll give a brief refresher as i go through your comment.
they're an often politically obnoxious organization threatening to push away corporate newcomers to the Linux movement
That's silly. I work at a company that makes a commercial distribution of debian, with some custom add-ons (the company is Stormix). Also, here's a quote from the Social Contract:
We won't object to commercial software that is intended to run on Debian systems, and we'll allow others to create value-added distributions containing both Debian and commercial software, without any fee from us. To support these goals, we will provide an integrated system of high-quality, 100% free software, with no legal restrictions that would prevent these kinds of use.So, you see, Debian has explicitly stated that they are trying to make sure anyone can make a derivative work without being encumbered by bad licenses
And because it's GPLed like everything else from Debian,
According to the Social Contract, any software written for Debian must be under license that meets the Debian Free Software Guidelines. This could be BSD license, or MPL, or numerous other licenses...it doesn't have to be GPL. GPL just seems to be the most common choice.
even if they try to change future liscensing, this distribution will make for at least one more before they do so. Let's hope they never pursue that course.
The social contract specifically says that Debian's priorities are the Users and Free Software. If Debian "sold out" or some such non-sense, it would cease to be Debian. There will never be a non-free release of Debian.
So, don't worry about getting one more free release of Debian before it goes sour. It just won't happen.
-Doviende
"The value of a man resides in what he gives,
and not in what he is capable of receiving."
what a terribly small world you must live in when your morality depends on giving away 100% of your property.
actually, some of us believe that something that can be duplicated for no cost can not be considered a possession.
... be decried evil because I didn't give him my refrigerator, ...
if i give someone my refridgerator, i no longer have a refridgerator. If i give someone my software, i still have my software. the two cases are quite different.
the FSF does not take any rights away from me. They use the present system of copyright to ensure that freedoms will be preserved (in a world that frequently likes to deny freedoms). Notice they always use the word copyleft to distinguish their use from the regular use of the existing legal structure.
Some people say that by clearly defining the argument, you have half-way won it already. Sometimes an argument may be clearly defined, but some people choose to ignore the definition and argue it on incorrect premises. I'd suggest you go back and carefully read the opinions of others in this topic. Perhaps you won't listen to Richard Stallman's arguments, but how about others like Proudhon, Mill, Emma Goldman, and numerous others?
If, after becoming familiar with what your opponent says, you'd like to come back and talk, I would be happy to discuss things further :)
-Doviende
"The value of a man resides in what he gives,
and not in what he is capable of receiving."
Maybe it's a version war thing?
Perhaps there's a Slackware 17.0 coming in the near future ;)
-Doviende
"The value of a man resides in what he gives,
and not in what he is capable of receiving."
hey taco! haven't you tried the Storm Package Manager? it's got all the features of apt, in a nice GUI interface. from what i've heard, it does more then gnome-apt, and it'll be included in Woody some time soon.
you can get it right now, along with other nifty additions like the Storm Adminstration System, from the stormix ftp site.
Or, add the following line to your /etc/apt/sources.list file and do an "apt-get update; apt-get install stormpkg":
deb http://ftp.stormix.com/storm hail main contrib
blatant plug: try out the new Storm Linux distribution (called Hail) that just got released, based on the latest debian potato. I wrote part of the ftp install :)
-Doviende
"The value of a man resides in what he gives,
and not in what he is capable of receiving."
also, i'm all for postgres, but doesn't it seem funny that their business is based on postgres solutions, and now they come out with this "independant benchmark" claiming that postgres is the best?
This could be another attempt at "benchmarketing" ;)
-Doviende
"The value of a man resides in what he gives,
and not in what he is capable of receiving."
also, most places in Ottawa are about 15 minutes away from the Quebec border.
"The value of a man resides in what he gives,
and not in what he is capable of receiving."
I'm sure he has plenty to say about the growing corporatism and its affect on U.S. foreign policies ( ie Encryption ) , and our personal freedoms.
- Doviende
"The value of a man resides in what he gives,
and not in what he is capable of receiving."
"The value of a man resides in what he gives,
and not in what he is capable of receiving."
Pete Lypkie
"The value of a man resides in what he gives,
and not in what he is capable of receiving."
-Doviende
"The value of a man resides in what he gives,
and not in what he is capable of receiving."
Any way you try to dance around it, guns are for hurting. and don't start saying that you use them for target shooting. bulls**t....use a pellet gun or something. same idea, but you can't kill people with it too.
Anyway...back to the topic at hand. If DVDs were designed with the intent to kill humans, then i think that copying DVDs would be bad.
Since DVDs are not actually designed to kill humans, then i think they should only be going after the pirates, and not the people who expose the flaws in their so-called security methods.
This is just like your consumer reports example, and not like the gun example.
"The value of a man resides in what he gives,
and not in what he is capable of receiving."
anyone know where i can get more info on all of this patching the kernel business involved in using Xing? I was gonna bill the radio station for an extra $20 and buy Xing.
Doviende
"The value of a man resides in what he gives,
and not in what he is capable of receiving."
They used it during construction of railroads way back when, to melt the iron and join it together.
It's basically aluminum and rust. When you ignite it (using something extremely hot, like burning magnesium), the oxygen seperates form the rust, and this allows the aluminum to burn. You're left with aluminum oxide and molten iron.
The problem is, where the heck do you get enough rust? This magical stuff that the guy used is the answer to your Thermite woes :)
Warning: do not try this at home.
IANAFM (i am not a fire marshal).
"The value of a man resides in what he gives,
and not in what he is capable of receiving."
He says that we don't actually need IPv6...we just need IPv4 with 64 or 128 bit addresses.
DUH! what'd he think the biggest improvement of IPv6 over IPv4 was???
also, i think he just doesn't "get" the ideas of binary, decimal, hex, or any simple math concepts at all.
"The value of a man resides in what he gives,
and not in what he is capable of receiving."
Like some other people have mentioned, you probably want to shell out some cash for your monitor. It's one of the parts of your computer that will actually last more than a few years, so go ahead and splurge on it.
"The value of a man resides in what he gives,
and not in what he is capable of receiving."
-Doviende
"The value of a man resides in what he gives,
and not in what he is capable of receiving."
Obviously this is a silly answer...the real answer is the complete fix so that people can continue using that feature without fear of root compromises.
-Doviende
"The value of a man resides in what he gives,
and not in what he is capable of receiving."
that would be VHDR or VFRR instead of VCR :)
-Doviende
"The value of a man resides in what he gives,
and not in what he is capable of receiving."
Does anyone know of an alternate that doesn't force you to use ancient kernels?
-Doviende
"The value of a man resides in what he gives,
and not in what he is capable of receiving."