That they were, but I just cited the magic trashcan because I've seen the benchmark run in person. It's kind of awesome.
It's odd that not a lot of people think about PCIe for SSDs. I know that "Bunch of RAM/Flash attached directly to the bus" has been done for decades though.
And whilst nothing like Apple's App Store existed until Apple created it, there was a pretty vibrant app scene back on those older mobile devices. To the extent of professional packages for doctors, pilots, estate agents etc. Lots of productivity apps. Plenty of games. Basically all the categories you get on iOS and Android now. Just fewer in number.
The part about confusing was that it reflected my experience with Windows Mobile application development.
So any notes apps that are like Vesper? Or any read later apps like Instapaper? Or even anything like Urban Spoon? Or... and I could go on.
The thing about the app space now is that while yes, part of this is a move in technology (we now have very fast mobile CPUs on relatively fast wireless cellular connections), the other half is that the ecosystem itself is more than just a build toolchain and the ability to side load from the internet.
Also, it helps that iOS is way more regular people friendly than the Psion was.
That's a different story. Scrublands in the desert is an ecosystem. I wouldn't call it as lush as a rainforest. The mobile ecosystem prior to the iPhone was pretty barren. I used to use a Windows mobile 5 iPaq back in the day and the ecosystem was bare AND confusing(Are you using a MIPS CE device? ARM? Do you even know? etc.).
The thing Apple is selling you, beside the hardware, is the complete integrated product. They take your money, they give you something that works, that's their sole "monetization" strategy. Unlike everyone else in the business, trying to suck you into their various creepy ad/clickstream/search front-running scams.
QFT.
I think though, that you're overselling the size of the vocal anti-Apple Android user base. I think they've just grown accustomed to hacking around bad design.
This quote comes to mind.
The reasonable man adapts himself to the world; the unreasonable one persists in trying to adapt the world to himself. Therefore all progress depends on the unreasonable man. - George Bernard Shaw
Android users think they're adapting tech to themselves, Apple users think Apple is adapting the tech industry to their whims.
In the end, the question is, who's design decisions do you trust, yourself or Apple's? I opt for Apple.
The point you're missing about maps is that maps in car play is fed via Apple maps. Which updates more frequently than maps for car systems.
Car manufacturers don't mind giving up control over things like the entertainment system provided it works better than what they can do. A lot of makers are signed up for it. From BMW to Hyundai to ford and GM.
USB OTG not good enough? Bluetooth not good enough?
The problem with expansion, especially using ExpressCard, is that there's a horrendous chicken/egg problem. very few express card peripherals exist, thus few express card slots are being included in modern machines.
It has nothing to do with intellectual competition. It's just that, most people's wants are served on board. Expansion's existed but as time has gone on, the need for PC Card and ExpressCard has gone away thanks to USB.
Oh, just Microsoft and Nintendo? So I can use a F22 Pro with some random USB HID class adapter board on the PS4? No? Hmm, didn't think so.
If the game supports generic flight sticks, sure. But that's true on PCs as well.
Yes, there is joy2key, but, holy crap is that a bad experience.
Again, you don't see it, so you don't believe in it. It is the very definition of the argument from ignorance.
Shouldn't games be fun to begin with?
There's lots of other things I want to do on the same machine I'm playing games on, especially if I'm doing it in the living room where there's just one big display. I might like to look up some reference for the game I'm playing, for example.
Vita, 3DS and PS3 can run their web browser while playing games. Not sure about 360, XB1 or PS4.
Also if I'm going to be doing that I'd rather just look down at the tablet that's as likely to be in my lap.
Well, there was a deep experience in being able to put in a cart and play. Then we got a different experience putting in a disc and maybe playing if it wasn't too scratched, the lens wasn't too dirty, and the optical drive was still working. Maybe you had to turn your playstation upside down, for example, before it would read a disc. The earliest optical drives for game consoles were all garbage, except the pop-top Sega CD which was simply lame. And by the time the later consoles came around, just put in a disc and play was over. Game consoles and games themselves now require updates!
The overheating PS problem was fixed in the 2nd rev of the console. The rest of this screed is basically, "Optical media sucks." Which it kind of does, but, again, not a console specific problem. How else do you ship a large volume of data when customers may or may not have broadband?
Sony has had their epic hardware failures as well, we tend to forget them because they are not from Microsoft. But the PS, PSOne, and original PS2 all had horrendously unreliable optical drives as well. Pretty pathetic when the company selling them is one of the inventors of the CDROM.
Numbers? 360 failed at a rate of 33%, and over many different revs of the console. PS2 and PS1 both were sorted out by the 2nd and 3rd revs of the console and at much lower rates of failure.
And I've also upgraded my 360's HDD, with a 160GB WD Caviar which came out of one of the small fleet of netbooks around here, and which I was able to convince the Xbox was a 120GB disk. Yep, I can use it on the Xbox by wasting part of it. Wow, I sure am getting a sweet deal with this whole console gaming thing! Having to boot a PC into DOS so that I could twiddle the drive firmware was so much easier than just slapping the disk into a PC and using the full capacity. The 60GB disk I was using just wasn't adequate any more, and I didn't feel like paying a special tax for a disk which has been blessed, even though any disk could technically work just fine.
Had you bought a PS3, you could've just opened the latch on the side, pulled the disk out, put a new one in and transferred your data. How is this a problem with consoles on a fundamental level? You bought a console that was designed by people with no taste.
You're talking about a handful of games which don't even appear on consoles. I agree that the file sizes have become offensive.
TF2 has the save behavior. Although I don't think that's endemic to PC gaming specifically, but I do see it more often on PCs rather than consoles.
Except games design isn't an engineering problem where you worry about 'use cases.'
Games design is about the expression and engagement of human being in a virtual world. It's not like you're driving a damned spreadsheet. Imagination and engagement have a place here.
You dismiss several other problems with console gaming as being a problem with specific companies, but it does not matter whose fault it is. The issues are real issues either way.
This isn't a, "Who's really got the crappy driver problem? nVidia or AMD?"" kind of question. The input issue and the internal storage issue are squarely problems with Microsoft and Nintendo. This isn't anything inherent in having a console itself. Kiss my ass.
That is not a feature. Also, some console games can be modded, but it's a massive pain in the ass. People still do it. Because it's a massive PITA it's not really a valid platform feature, but because people still do it it's clearly a desired one.
Some games like Minecraft lend themselves well to modding. However, I don't see the general purpose, "MODS! MODS EVERYWHERE!" attitude is a benefit for PC gaming. I want to play the base game. That someone can replace the dragons in Skyrim with The Macho Man Randy Savage isn't exciting to me because the base game isn't exciting to me.
Further more, mods open up an avenue for cheating too. Which is rampant in PC gaming.
Compared to PCs, it is very poor. This makes a massive difference for some types of game.
This is so subjective it hurts.
Here's your valid point. This is the only benefit to console gaming. But may I remind you of the RROD, and other massive console failures?
Again, why are you crucifying all console gaming with the problems Microsoft had? That's an Xbox problem, not a console problem.
Because you don't use it, it's not a feature.
Just because a PC can check email, go on IRC or be used to order pizza doesn't mean that I think it's lacking that the Xbox One or PS4 can't do either of those things. We're talking about a games console. For playing games on.
Console gaming is typically superior for just sitting down and playing. PC Gaming is superior in literally every other way. You have only one valid argument, and tried to somehow transform it into an entire debate with logical fallacies and self-centered thinking. Consoles used to have simplicity and reliability but now games get massive updates and games choke, crash and hang all the goddamned time, because consoles are just PCs with fancy memory architectures with all of the complexity that entails.
The thing you're missing is that there's a deep experience in the ability to just put in a disc and play.
Further more, on a lark, when I started getting in on this flame war, I decided to reboot into Windows so I could try some PC gaming. Fired up MWO and waited 2 hours for the game to patch itself with several gigs worth of patches. Generally console games don't see those kinds of updates. How the hell is that acceptable? Console games can get maybe 1 or 2 gig sized patches but it's never been PC gaming levels of bad.
Further more, games have been hanging, crashing and choking since the NES days. Sometimes rendering games completely unplayable. This has nothing to do with consoles being PCs with fancy memory architectures.
Also, I'm not sure what that means; this has been the case since the 2600. The 2600 and NES used 6502 variants, similar to what was in the C64 and Apple II. Genesis used a 68k chip, similar to the Mac and x68k. SNES used a 16 bit variant on the 6502. N64, PS1 and PS2 used MIPS chips. They're all just PCs with fancy architectures. This fact hasn't changed in 40 years.
You're missing my point. That games feel different with different control schemes. That not relying on WASD and a mouse can make for a very compelling experience.
Really, your only valid point. However, many MMOs still cling to subscription models. Plus the Wii U has free online.
your ability to use the input of your choosing,
This isn't a console problem specifically. That's a nintendo/microsoft/3rd party dev problem. Ps2, Ps3 and Ps4 all support standard devices over USB should the developers so choose. Unreal Tournament, Dust, Silent Scope and a bunch of other games supported using standard devices on the PS.
That's a feature on consoles. Games should be able to stand on their own.
graphical fidelity (Even $550 systems can do 1080P/60FPS at higher graphical fidelity than XB1/PS4),
Graphical fidelity isn't bad to begin with on consoles. There's also a human limit to which graphical fidelity can be achieved. Making more graphical detail costs money, time and man power.
Also, at what cost? Fiddly drivers, OSes and other things to futz around with? Not to mention to power all of that means I need some big noisy video card and CPU or fiddle around with low noise cooling solutions. Generally, not my idea of fun.
I also can't imagine how the PC gaming world is sustainable with games being so cheap, but yet somehow also looking so much better.
ability to upgrade and customize your system without being XBL banned (New HDD because 500GB is too small? Banhammer)
not being locked into buying officially supported peripherals,
Other than controllers, and even then developers can opt to support non-officially supported peripherals, the PS4 can use all manner of standard USB devices. Same with PS3, PS3 even goes further with controllers.
true multitasking
Again, that's not feature.
Seriously, not having to deal with other processes running in the background? Feature.
more exclusives
Any worth playing? Any worth making the absolute remark that PC gaming is superior? Should I trash my PS3 because I can't play Papers Please on it?
, friendlier for indie development,
Sure, but, again, like point above, should I completely ignore other gaming outlets over this? Some AAA titles are still worth the hype because they're lead by really smart people with a lot of resources at their fingertips.
and a more mature community.
Yet somehow I still get called racial, ethnic, sexual and sexuality based slurs online. The abuse is actually worse on PC than it is on either XBL or PSN.
Should I continue?
Sure, if it makes you feel better about it.
I'm not discounting the PC as a gaming platform where fun games can exist, but *superior*? You PC gaming people are nuts.
Flight sims? better with a keyboard and mouse instead of a HOTAS? You're bugnut fucking crazy. You also just dismiss Super Mario out of hand as a worthwhile game experience so, I don't know what to make of that. I can't sleep, so here goes a screed.
The overall point you're missing is that not all games are designed to be played with a pointing device. Music games SUCK on a keyboard. Fighting Games suck on a keyboard. Mech and Flight/Space sims suck on keyboard. Puzzle games can make wonderful use of a joypad.
Having to design a game where the guaranteed input device is a keyboard and mouse means you're designing games that are limited by the limitations of keyboards and mice. Games like Virtual On and Katamari Damashii don't work on mice or keyboards. They're designed with control schemes that are clearly NOT KB/M friendly. Beatmania doesn't work on a keyboard and lord knows I've -tried-.
Being able to move in non-discrete increments and move the camera also in non-discrete increments is something you can't do with a mouse and keyboard. Metal Gear works really well on a joypad, for instance. When you're not worried about shooting someone in the face, and worried more about sneaking around? The KB/Mouse combo becomes a liability.
The only games that benefit from a KB/M are games where the camera's fixed and being pixel perfect is an advantage. So RTS and FPS work out very well in those cases.
TPS? TPS games benefits from having the camera be on another non discrete control. MMOs that sit in the third person perspective are a mess of modifier keys that change how the mouse interacts with the UI. How MMO players deal with this is really beyond me. Granted, these games tend to also feature auto-targeting systems so you have one less thing to worry about too...
Game design in the aggregate shouldn't be locked into some soulless orthodoxy where you have to design your game this way or else you'll have players at your door with pitchforks and torches because they don't want to learn how to engage in diverse ways. I mean, games like Senjou No Kizuna just wouldn't work on a KB/M setup.
It's bad enough WASD is what ships standard and rebinding to ESDF means a lot of keys get bounced around(Seriously, who has their hands shifted off the home row? Doesn't anyone touch type anymore?). Heaven forbid you're not using a US style layout and suddenly keys aren't where you expect them to be. Poor French players who have to figure out what to do when games don't support rebinding.
There's this bizarre orthodoxy with you PC gamers. If things aren't exactly the way you demand them to be, everything's terrible and somehow no progress can be made. The only progress we can make is more polygons and more DPI on mice. Clicky keyboards too, make them clickier. more of the same! more of the same! It's ridiculous. I can't stand you people. You're what's wrong with gaming. Console gamers, as a culture, do have their orthodoxy, but it's not this bizarre cult like obsession I see with the Glorious PC Gaming Master Race.
So if you change the game in favor of the mouse then mouse players will win?
Not all games benefit from being pixel perfect. Nor should all games be designed like FPSes. Mechwarrior Online kind of sucks because of this weird focus on the mouse rather than on a joystick. The immersive feeling of holding something that feels otherworldly is amazing. Instead of feeling like a mech simulator, it just feels like COD with LRMs.
This is what I mean by saying that the KB/M limits gameplay.
I didn't say it was a great gaming device, just that it was aimed at gaming. I think Nintendo undershot the ROI curve on the investment in hardware. I don't think the tablet/gamepad combo was a terrible idea, I think they just executed poorly on it with regard to size and battery life. The fact that it has a sub 1 frame latency shows they care, but they have their priorities mixed up.
But there aren't many, if any, high visibility PC games that go out of their way to be hostile to KB/M. In fact, if you are, that's generally seen as a Bad Thing by PC gamers. That's the limitation. Further more, there's no unified controller to design against.
Valve's controller looked interesting, but I don't know if it'll register "Slightly up and to the left on one pad, and all the way down and to the right on the other pad"
Slashdot Mirror
depending on your usage patterns though, might not be a problem per se.
Long render? The extra few ms for disk seek might not be so bad.
Serving web pages? Those few extra ms will add up.
That they were, but I just cited the magic trashcan because I've seen the benchmark run in person. It's kind of awesome.
It's odd that not a lot of people think about PCIe for SSDs. I know that "Bunch of RAM/Flash attached directly to the bus" has been done for decades though.
PCIe SSDs are even faster. The one in the Mac Pro can hit 1gig read/write, for example.
You'd need a lot of disks to come even close to that. :)
And whilst nothing like Apple's App Store existed until Apple created it, there was a pretty vibrant app scene back on those older mobile devices. To the extent of professional packages for doctors, pilots, estate agents etc. Lots of productivity apps. Plenty of games. Basically all the categories you get on iOS and Android now. Just fewer in number.
The part about confusing was that it reflected my experience with Windows Mobile application development.
So any notes apps that are like Vesper? Or any read later apps like Instapaper? Or even anything like Urban Spoon? Or... and I could go on.
The thing about the app space now is that while yes, part of this is a move in technology (we now have very fast mobile CPUs on relatively fast wireless cellular connections), the other half is that the ecosystem itself is more than just a build toolchain and the ability to side load from the internet.
Also, it helps that iOS is way more regular people friendly than the Psion was.
If you're still using an Osborne I've got a lot of questions for you.
Mobile apps? no
Mobile *ecosystem*?
That's a different story. Scrublands in the desert is an ecosystem. I wouldn't call it as lush as a rainforest. The mobile ecosystem prior to the iPhone was pretty barren. I used to use a Windows mobile 5 iPaq back in the day and the ecosystem was bare AND confusing(Are you using a MIPS CE device? ARM? Do you even know? etc.).
The thing Apple is selling you, beside the hardware, is the complete integrated product. They take your money, they give you something that works, that's their sole "monetization" strategy. Unlike everyone else in the business, trying to suck you into their various creepy ad/clickstream/search front-running scams.
QFT.
I think though, that you're overselling the size of the vocal anti-Apple Android user base. I think they've just grown accustomed to hacking around bad design.
This quote comes to mind.
The reasonable man adapts himself to the world; the unreasonable one persists in trying to adapt the world to himself. Therefore all progress depends on the unreasonable man. - George Bernard Shaw
Android users think they're adapting tech to themselves, Apple users think Apple is adapting the tech industry to their whims.
In the end, the question is, who's design decisions do you trust, yourself or Apple's? I opt for Apple.
I slipped and busted my ass on a patch of ice outside of my apartment this morning.
That's who's to blame!
The point you're missing about maps is that maps in car play is fed via Apple maps. Which updates more frequently than maps for car systems.
Car manufacturers don't mind giving up control over things like the entertainment system provided it works better than what they can do. A lot of makers are signed up for it. From BMW to Hyundai to ford and GM.
How it'll do in the future... No one knows.
USB OTG not good enough? Bluetooth not good enough?
The problem with expansion, especially using ExpressCard, is that there's a horrendous chicken/egg problem. very few express card peripherals exist, thus few express card slots are being included in modern machines.
It has nothing to do with intellectual competition. It's just that, most people's wants are served on board. Expansion's existed but as time has gone on, the need for PC Card and ExpressCard has gone away thanks to USB.
I used Needle to describe something thinner than a stylus. :(
Flying from LA to Chicago or Seattle to Phoenix? Sure. Economy's just fine.
From NYC to Shanghai? Dallas to Rio? Anywhere to Honolulu or Juno?
More than 4 hours on a flight and pay the outrageous fees. your sanity will thank you for it.
Because typing on that tiny keyboard looks impossible with out some kind of typing needle.
Oh, just Microsoft and Nintendo? So I can use a F22 Pro with some random USB HID class adapter board on the PS4? No? Hmm, didn't think so.
If the game supports generic flight sticks, sure. But that's true on PCs as well.
Yes, there is joy2key, but, holy crap is that a bad experience.
Again, you don't see it, so you don't believe in it. It is the very definition of the argument from ignorance.
Shouldn't games be fun to begin with?
There's lots of other things I want to do on the same machine I'm playing games on, especially if I'm doing it in the living room where there's just one big display. I might like to look up some reference for the game I'm playing, for example.
Vita, 3DS and PS3 can run their web browser while playing games. Not sure about 360, XB1 or PS4.
Also if I'm going to be doing that I'd rather just look down at the tablet that's as likely to be in my lap.
Well, there was a deep experience in being able to put in a cart and play. Then we got a different experience putting in a disc and maybe playing if it wasn't too scratched, the lens wasn't too dirty, and the optical drive was still working. Maybe you had to turn your playstation upside down, for example, before it would read a disc. The earliest optical drives for game consoles were all garbage, except the pop-top Sega CD which was simply lame. And by the time the later consoles came around, just put in a disc and play was over. Game consoles and games themselves now require updates!
The overheating PS problem was fixed in the 2nd rev of the console. The rest of this screed is basically, "Optical media sucks." Which it kind of does, but, again, not a console specific problem. How else do you ship a large volume of data when customers may or may not have broadband?
Sony has had their epic hardware failures as well, we tend to forget them because they are not from Microsoft. But the PS, PSOne, and original PS2 all had horrendously unreliable optical drives as well. Pretty pathetic when the company selling them is one of the inventors of the CDROM.
Numbers? 360 failed at a rate of 33%, and over many different revs of the console. PS2 and PS1 both were sorted out by the 2nd and 3rd revs of the console and at much lower rates of failure.
And I've also upgraded my 360's HDD, with a 160GB WD Caviar which came out of one of the small fleet of netbooks around here, and which I was able to convince the Xbox was a 120GB disk. Yep, I can use it on the Xbox by wasting part of it. Wow, I sure am getting a sweet deal with this whole console gaming thing! Having to boot a PC into DOS so that I could twiddle the drive firmware was so much easier than just slapping the disk into a PC and using the full capacity. The 60GB disk I was using just wasn't adequate any more, and I didn't feel like paying a special tax for a disk which has been blessed, even though any disk could technically work just fine.
Had you bought a PS3, you could've just opened the latch on the side, pulled the disk out, put a new one in and transferred your data. How is this a problem with consoles on a fundamental level? You bought a console that was designed by people with no taste.
You're talking about a handful of games which don't even appear on consoles. I agree that the file sizes have become offensive.
TF2 has the save behavior. Although I don't think that's endemic to PC gaming specifically, but I do see it more often on PCs rather than consoles.
Except games design isn't an engineering problem where you worry about 'use cases.'
Games design is about the expression and engagement of human being in a virtual world. It's not like you're driving a damned spreadsheet. Imagination and engagement have a place here.
You dismiss several other problems with console gaming as being a problem with specific companies, but it does not matter whose fault it is. The issues are real issues either way.
This isn't a, "Who's really got the crappy driver problem? nVidia or AMD?"" kind of question. The input issue and the internal storage issue are squarely problems with Microsoft and Nintendo. This isn't anything inherent in having a console itself. Kiss my ass.
That is not a feature. Also, some console games can be modded, but it's a massive pain in the ass. People still do it. Because it's a massive PITA it's not really a valid platform feature, but because people still do it it's clearly a desired one.
Some games like Minecraft lend themselves well to modding. However, I don't see the general purpose, "MODS! MODS EVERYWHERE!" attitude is a benefit for PC gaming. I want to play the base game. That someone can replace the dragons in Skyrim with The Macho Man Randy Savage isn't exciting to me because the base game isn't exciting to me.
Further more, mods open up an avenue for cheating too. Which is rampant in PC gaming.
Compared to PCs, it is very poor. This makes a massive difference for some types of game.
This is so subjective it hurts.
Here's your valid point. This is the only benefit to console gaming. But may I remind you of the RROD, and other massive console failures?
Again, why are you crucifying all console gaming with the problems Microsoft had? That's an Xbox problem, not a console problem.
Because you don't use it, it's not a feature.
Just because a PC can check email, go on IRC or be used to order pizza doesn't mean that I think it's lacking that the Xbox One or PS4 can't do either of those things. We're talking about a games console. For playing games on.
Console gaming is typically superior for just sitting down and playing. PC Gaming is superior in literally every other way. You have only one valid argument, and tried to somehow transform it into an entire debate with logical fallacies and self-centered thinking. Consoles used to have simplicity and reliability but now games get massive updates and games choke, crash and hang all the goddamned time, because consoles are just PCs with fancy memory architectures with all of the complexity that entails.
The thing you're missing is that there's a deep experience in the ability to just put in a disc and play.
Further more, on a lark, when I started getting in on this flame war, I decided to reboot into Windows so I could try some PC gaming. Fired up MWO and waited 2 hours for the game to patch itself with several gigs worth of patches. Generally console games don't see those kinds of updates. How the hell is that acceptable? Console games can get maybe 1 or 2 gig sized patches but it's never been PC gaming levels of bad.
Further more, games have been hanging, crashing and choking since the NES days. Sometimes rendering games completely unplayable. This has nothing to do with consoles being PCs with fancy memory architectures.
Also, I'm not sure what that means; this has been the case since the 2600. The 2600 and NES used 6502 variants, similar to what was in the C64 and Apple II. Genesis used a 68k chip, similar to the Mac and x68k. SNES used a 16 bit variant on the 6502. N64, PS1 and PS2 used MIPS chips. They're all just PCs with fancy architectures. This fact hasn't changed in 40 years.
You're missing my point. That games feel different with different control schemes. That not relying on WASD and a mouse can make for a very compelling experience.
No paying to play online
Really, your only valid point. However, many MMOs still cling to subscription models. Plus the Wii U has free online.
your ability to use the input of your choosing,
This isn't a console problem specifically. That's a nintendo/microsoft/3rd party dev problem. Ps2, Ps3 and Ps4 all support standard devices over USB should the developers so choose. Unreal Tournament, Dust, Silent Scope and a bunch of other games supported using standard devices on the PS.
cheaper games,
...and? They're actually bad for the industry It's not like console games broke the bank to begin with. Not unless you were crazy and imported.
mod support,
That's a feature on consoles. Games should be able to stand on their own.
graphical fidelity (Even $550 systems can do 1080P/60FPS at higher graphical fidelity than XB1/PS4),
Graphical fidelity isn't bad to begin with on consoles. There's also a human limit to which graphical fidelity can be achieved. Making more graphical detail costs money, time and man power.
Also, at what cost? Fiddly drivers, OSes and other things to futz around with? Not to mention to power all of that means I need some big noisy video card and CPU or fiddle around with low noise cooling solutions. Generally, not my idea of fun.
I also can't imagine how the PC gaming world is sustainable with games being so cheap, but yet somehow also looking so much better.
ability to upgrade and customize your system without being XBL banned (New HDD because 500GB is too small? Banhammer)
This is an Xbox/Nintendo problem, not a console problem.
not being locked into buying officially supported peripherals,
Other than controllers, and even then developers can opt to support non-officially supported peripherals, the PS4 can use all manner of standard USB devices. Same with PS3, PS3 even goes further with controllers.
true multitasking
Again, that's not feature.
Seriously, not having to deal with other processes running in the background? Feature.
more exclusives
Any worth playing? Any worth making the absolute remark that PC gaming is superior? Should I trash my PS3 because I can't play Papers Please on it?
, friendlier for indie development,
Sure, but, again, like point above, should I completely ignore other gaming outlets over this? Some AAA titles are still worth the hype because they're lead by really smart people with a lot of resources at their fingertips.
and a more mature community.
Yet somehow I still get called racial, ethnic, sexual and sexuality based slurs online. The abuse is actually worse on PC than it is on either XBL or PSN.
Should I continue?
Sure, if it makes you feel better about it.
I'm not discounting the PC as a gaming platform where fun games can exist, but *superior*? You PC gaming people are nuts.
Flight sims? better with a keyboard and mouse instead of a HOTAS? You're bugnut fucking crazy. You also just dismiss Super Mario out of hand as a worthwhile game experience so, I don't know what to make of that. I can't sleep, so here goes a screed.
The overall point you're missing is that not all games are designed to be played with a pointing device. Music games SUCK on a keyboard. Fighting Games suck on a keyboard. Mech and Flight/Space sims suck on keyboard. Puzzle games can make wonderful use of a joypad.
Having to design a game where the guaranteed input device is a keyboard and mouse means you're designing games that are limited by the limitations of keyboards and mice. Games like Virtual On and Katamari Damashii don't work on mice or keyboards. They're designed with control schemes that are clearly NOT KB/M friendly. Beatmania doesn't work on a keyboard and lord knows I've -tried-.
Being able to move in non-discrete increments and move the camera also in non-discrete increments is something you can't do with a mouse and keyboard. Metal Gear works really well on a joypad, for instance. When you're not worried about shooting someone in the face, and worried more about sneaking around? The KB/Mouse combo becomes a liability.
The only games that benefit from a KB/M are games where the camera's fixed and being pixel perfect is an advantage. So RTS and FPS work out very well in those cases.
TPS? TPS games benefits from having the camera be on another non discrete control. MMOs that sit in the third person perspective are a mess of modifier keys that change how the mouse interacts with the UI. How MMO players deal with this is really beyond me. Granted, these games tend to also feature auto-targeting systems so you have one less thing to worry about too...
Game design in the aggregate shouldn't be locked into some soulless orthodoxy where you have to design your game this way or else you'll have players at your door with pitchforks and torches because they don't want to learn how to engage in diverse ways. I mean, games like Senjou No Kizuna just wouldn't work on a KB/M setup.
It's bad enough WASD is what ships standard and rebinding to ESDF means a lot of keys get bounced around(Seriously, who has their hands shifted off the home row? Doesn't anyone touch type anymore?). Heaven forbid you're not using a US style layout and suddenly keys aren't where you expect them to be. Poor French players who have to figure out what to do when games don't support rebinding.
There's this bizarre orthodoxy with you PC gamers. If things aren't exactly the way you demand them to be, everything's terrible and somehow no progress can be made. The only progress we can make is more polygons and more DPI on mice. Clicky keyboards too, make them clickier. more of the same! more of the same! It's ridiculous. I can't stand you people. You're what's wrong with gaming. Console gamers, as a culture, do have their orthodoxy, but it's not this bizarre cult like obsession I see with the Glorious PC Gaming Master Race.
Between your post and the parent post, tell me again why PC gaming is superior?
Which is it, AMD drivers suck or not?
So if you change the game in favor of the mouse then mouse players will win?
Not all games benefit from being pixel perfect. Nor should all games be designed like FPSes. Mechwarrior Online kind of sucks because of this weird focus on the mouse rather than on a joystick. The immersive feeling of holding something that feels otherworldly is amazing. Instead of feeling like a mech simulator, it just feels like COD with LRMs.
This is what I mean by saying that the KB/M limits gameplay.
Uhm?
Source?
True for FPS games, but not all games are FPSes.
Because the type of interaction you have with a joypad is different than a keyboard/mouse. More games should try different input types.
For instance, Katamari Damacy doesn't work on a mouse, period. I mean you could try, but I don't imagine it ending well.
I didn't say it was a great gaming device, just that it was aimed at gaming. I think Nintendo undershot the ROI curve on the investment in hardware. I don't think the tablet/gamepad combo was a terrible idea, I think they just executed poorly on it with regard to size and battery life. The fact that it has a sub 1 frame latency shows they care, but they have their priorities mixed up.
I did say that you can use gamepads on PC.
But there aren't many, if any, high visibility PC games that go out of their way to be hostile to KB/M. In fact, if you are, that's generally seen as a Bad Thing by PC gamers. That's the limitation. Further more, there's no unified controller to design against.
Valve's controller looked interesting, but I don't know if it'll register "Slightly up and to the left on one pad, and all the way down and to the right on the other pad"