Programming logo or basic was offered in most schools I have attended on euro-asian continent, nevermind speed of the machines. Programming can be like lego or other, if simple enough blocks are used. Main thing is to teach students a self reward system, for programming. Get stuff done, fast enough that it will bring gratification for cool things, like moving turtle across the screen.
Anyway that trend, lack of those games etc, can be seen on different areas, schooling, daily entertainment. Everything is being wired closer to reaction level, advertisement, movies. Not to logical level... just my 2c.
Not to get defencive here, but TV is much more brain damaging then any computer game has ever seen. As well, follow the ying yang - balance is paramount.
It is theft, because provider does not have billing scheme for the users that abuse the service. Company could've referred to collection agencies for collecting dollar amount. What it seems is that there was major miscommunication on all company levels, so company will suffer majorly, because now customers are fair game to ISP, and customers will not want to be connected to ISP that uses such drastic measures to deal with "bad" customers.
> Lets continue to play with facts and not play their game of cat and mouse. We won't gain anything the way they play and it will only make us look like hypocrites.
Well said!!! It has been said awhile ago by code linux geeks. And we must carry flame forward, like that. How? By learning system, putting forward the word, but leaving dogma to our flame posts on usenet, and being intelligent when talking to windows heads. Main thing is... we do it for *ourselves*. Make it for ourselves and our families to use, and fuck corporations and what they think about us, all opinions from them are contaminated one way or the other. Money tained.(Money is good! but mixed with views, they distort reality to direct people such way, that other make dollars) Anyway, do your stuff, learn about code, software setups, design of this and that, keep objective, keep cool, and don't pay attention to those who have hidden agenda. You will get much farther that way, and so will the rest of the world.
It is hard... but it must be done. Most stars, I doubt read these news sites, because they are so engrossed in what they do day-to-day - progamming kernels, guis, paying attention to their loved ones. The only way you can fight it, is by spreading knowlege love and confidence, not fear hate and ignorance. cheers!
Many seasoned programmers I have known have jumped onto bandwagon of java, and got burnt here and there, so they are not so excited about java anymore. For clean style and programming you can use Jython, which is Java generator, but also integrates tightly with Java and its frameworks, including J2ME. I know C++, Perl, Python and Java, of them all I find python most clean and easy to work and maintain. So if I would have something to do and I can do it in Python(Jython) i'd use that...
to shortly put it, if they don't know then it won't hurt you. Considering most companies that get rid of workers, rarely spy on ex-employees, unless it is like a military establishment. Most businesses don't care if you take something and put it to other business, as long as you don't tell them. If you confront them with it, then obviously it is worth your time talking about it to them, they will want to charge you for it, negotiate whatever. However if its a small part of product, hidden underneath, it does not matter.
Business is dirty thing, for business it is in most interest is to collect most amount of dollars expending minimal effort. So if you work for large company and you used to work for small one. Previous company may demand large dollar amount, so to sustain their business. But if they see that company does not really have much money, they will not attempt to waste time, they are in business in the end of the day.
So I'd say don't worry about it, unless you are gonna upsell feature as one of the 10 top reasons to buy solution from you.
Now they are will try milk they customer base for all its worth. If my cost goes over 60$/mo, I will be starting a wireless service myself. Because most people will not tolerate over here bill of over 60$ for something they use so little.
Screwing people in IT is hard too, because as it happens, IT has some of the brightest and least tolerant people(towards abuse of them and others by large entities) so there will be a revolt. Many small broadband companies will start. 802.11a is around the corner and it is almost as good as cable, has good distance and scalability. If price of service goes up I would be damned stupid not to start my own ISP on top of the hill I live on and serve customers below, many customers. Since I can band up with few friends, costs will be low. Internet boom has come and gone and now there is loads of competition to sell uplinks, hence prices are going lower. Plus there may be some perks. Like mail2pager... and other alike convinience services.
Bandwidth is not unlimited, so you can do per-tcp bandwidth limiting -> doable on small scale, so if someone uploads ISOs, give them 10-20K, per-tcp. Internal connections would be bandwidth unlimited. Like ones in between customers, so they can share all they want. -> that what cable companies should've done, make bandwidth unlimited for traffic within their network. Think proportions of @home network that was dead!
Now GO and start your cheching around your area, to start a wirless service.
use of multicast will bring down majority of traffic hogs, news , movies etc. And will give power to hands of joes to distribute information they want at no virtually no cost. It may be pirated content, or just their own programming.
Most likely it will start out to be pirated content, then it will get oversaturated, and people will look towards alternative stations for truly creative content.
Time to migrate to IPv6, so those providers will stop dropping like flies. Make a mandate for companies to convert to IPv6 and start gradually fining those who don't comply. In the end they will be dead, because they are inflexible, those who will master IPv6 will bring power to the people.
If you read the story of building arsdigita, you will see the same, they went to market which MS would not even dare to touch - more profitable ventures, now they replicate ideas arsdigita has planted - application server, database web applications, enterprise level. Many others do too. There were reasons they could not grow geometrically - they were partly support company and hiring people that know what to do, was hard in those times, especially with brand new technology, that was deemed not too current, or cool, sort of grey technology, that has technical value, but now WOW value at the time. ... 2c.
Do you really see the trend? First company presidents were sitting in on the coding sessions, helping newhired hammer out the bugs, at appropriate times, they were going to pitch new products to large customers. It was like a family.
More and more later, started having offices with doors, which where often shut. Talking about programming started to be very unpopular topic, with managerial and semi-business types. Technical meetings still were had, but to hammer out specs.
Now meetings are rare, most specifications are handed down to programmers, written off the wall, in vague language. Meetings now happen only in between managerial staff. CEOs/presidents/CTOs don't even bother.
Soon most work will be shipped off overseas, and managers don't even have to see scruffy, unshaved programmers, mumbling about some nonsense!
What I see is constant gap widening between those who make the goods of the company, and those who sell it. Maybe its a race for higher wages. Shipping off programmers to countries across the ocean is not a bad idea, but attitude most people have is cost cutting, without even looking at innovatie ideas that can be applied right at home - XP programmers, bonus on completion.etc etc. Thats what MBA teaches you - to constantly reduce risk by making least innovative decisions... so we get situation like that.
If you wish to ship projects offshore make sure you have incentive program, that will pace developer across the ocean to deliver goods at paced rate - see eXtreme Programming. Nail donw requirements. Write them out, get one translator to translate them into hindu and second one, to translate from hindu to english, see if it makes sense - communication breakdown is too common in it companies, keep communication errors to a minimum.
In the end its attitude and direction what counts .
What about open h323. Wasn't that a standard for making reliable phonecalls over packet streams? Time to go with industry standard people. Last place I worked at, we have implemented H.323 gateway and it worked like magic, coupled up with outher gateways. ... dunno, looks like guys reinventing the wheel all over again. p.
they are a business, and at that successful one until now. Today they are scrambling to grab on to whatever they can, because they know they are history.
Remember business is everything that makes money. If dissatisfaction factor is big, then people get government to do something about it. Average dissasifaction is low then they will continue as planned. So pirates at sea were a reasonable business, but many were dissasfied with the impact byproducts of business in their lives, so they got government to sink some of those. Margins were high for a while, so many people were refilling the niche. And they still do. Illegal is just a figment of our imagination. We may or may not stop people from doing business, until there is no more incentive to do business - no money. Then it will all naturally dissolve.
Ok, so the proportion of geeks who go for the movie is N, and when movie comes out, it will be very close, or over N. Now, imagine all companies that actually have *real* projects going on now, that will affect company bottom line.
Geeks who take a day or two off, even sick is not going to add too much more to businesses who are overrun with problems of overzelaous managers, poor project management and overall opaqueness in communications channels of the company. Does this remind you of your own company? We booboo, many people ride to their fame on announcing the bad and the evils of the world, riding waves created by bigger causes like large corporations with large promotional budgets.
At the end geeks who will attend the movie will have great time and will code better in weeks to come. Now was that accounted for?
Oh wait, tomorrow our economy may collapse because maybe binladen has biologial weapons capsules planted in water distribution systems of possible large cities of western world.
Yes, people should be paid for amount of outcome they have produced, some complex evaluations may apply. I droned to people, if programming is not your love and but you thing computers are cool, and you still want to have nice house/car/kids, time to open that business, if it fails try again, learn from losses, everything adds to your wisdom. On other hand programmers are, writers, artists. This was a high time for them, but it will gradually will level off for most, except those with business sense.
So we do the business rules and programming, so what do the business people do? Nothing? Thats pretty good job for wearing suits all day, and sittingly in nicely furnished offices. As it stands now most business people as they were in between boom times, are back biting, trying to wield power, have job security, stay wealthy. As such they have no apparent interest in the bottom line of the company. Programmers are often responsible to untangle the mess they leave around, and make some sense of it. And no programmer is not a cobbler. He is a writer. Maybe we should outsource our journalists to china too, they'd work for cheap!
I never had a computer, once I did when 12 or something it had no manuals, so I donwloaded programs, from table, pressed break and looked at statement in the listing(yes basic!) and that ways learned most of the syntax. I was writing 1000 line programs by the end of few months... My computer fit only 2k programs, so after while I hit dead end, my hobby stopped. No I don't think I had uptitude/tools to hack assembly of unknown CPU, computer books in russia at the time, where I lived were sparse. Until someone loaned me a 286 pc. I remember playing with windows 3.0 on some pc, it was crashing and stuff, but I was impressed with gui idea. There were already some ZX-Spectrum programs my friends had, like paint ones, with gui, but that was different game(no I did not have ZX, though I wish). I was starting to code my own windowing interface on turbo c++. After while pc was taken away, so I had to go to universety, there they had an XT... my god it was slow, and crashy. TC++1.0 was just terrible... well I moved to canada after a break, I had my hands on Mac classic II around the time, it was amazing, it could do things windows. And Think Pascal was great... after while my parents bought be 486. I got doom from one of my friends, and so sleepness night of playing game it was. Now I code perl,python, java, C++.
What is most negative trend is the industry is dilution of interest. People want to make software, just like they make a car and sell it million times. And they want to get rich, so the whole industry is plagued by control mania. People want to control other people's thoughts so they can make money on it, so those who surrender to the present order, would feel themselves flowing into mediocricity. I would rather work for other industries, if I had ability to, considered computer peripherals, books - software did not cost so much. You always have to get new stuff and it costs muchos, most hardworking professions don't pay all that well.
Programmer job is not dead. There will be thorough cleaning in the industry in next 2-3 years, really good jobs will be surfacing after this while wash of homecleaning soap is washed away - i certainly hope so.
life is life... get your MBA, and you still can hack in the office and hang out with programmer dudes. If it is part of you, you will allways find time to dedicate yourself to it. p.
Slashdot Mirror
Programming logo or basic was offered in most schools I have attended on euro-asian continent, nevermind speed of the machines. Programming can be like lego or other, if simple enough blocks are used. Main thing is to teach students a self reward system, for programming. Get stuff done,
fast enough that it will bring gratification for cool things, like moving turtle across the screen.
Anyway that trend, lack of those games etc, can be seen on different areas, schooling, daily entertainment. Everything is being wired closer to reaction level, advertisement, movies. Not to logical level...
just my 2c.
Not to get defencive here, but TV is much more brain damaging then any computer game has ever seen.
As well, follow the ying yang - balance is paramount.
vim ~/t00r/public_html/flamer.html :wq
<here write the flame, defamation or other>
touch -t 199901021212.20 ~/t00r/public_html/flamer.html
done and done!
It is theft, because provider does not have billing scheme for the users that abuse the service. Company could've referred to collection agencies for collecting dollar amount. What it seems is that there was major miscommunication on all company levels, so company will suffer majorly, because now customers are fair game to ISP, and customers will not want to be connected to ISP that uses such drastic measures to deal with "bad" customers.
> Lets continue to play with facts and not play their game of cat and mouse. We won't gain anything the way they play and it will only make us look like hypocrites.
Well said!!! It has been said awhile ago by code linux geeks. And we must carry flame forward, like that. How? By learning system, putting forward the word, but leaving dogma to our flame posts on usenet, and being intelligent when talking to windows heads.
Main thing is... we do it for *ourselves*. Make it for ourselves and our families to use, and fuck corporations and what they think about us, all opinions from them are contaminated one way or the other. Money tained.(Money is good! but mixed with views, they distort reality to direct people such way, that other make dollars)
Anyway, do your stuff, learn about code, software setups, design of this and that, keep objective, keep cool, and don't pay attention to those who have hidden agenda. You will get much farther that way, and so will the rest of the world.
It is hard... but it must be done. Most stars, I doubt read these news sites, because they are so engrossed in what they do day-to-day - progamming kernels, guis, paying attention to their loved ones. The only way you can fight it, is by spreading knowlege love and confidence, not fear hate and ignorance.
cheers!
Many seasoned programmers I have known have jumped onto bandwagon of java, and got burnt here and there, so they are not so excited about java anymore. For clean style and programming you can use Jython, which is Java generator, but also integrates tightly with Java and its frameworks, including J2ME. I know C++, Perl, Python and Java, of them all I find python most clean and easy to work and maintain. So if I would have something to do and I can do it in Python(Jython) i'd use that...
to shortly put it, if they don't know then it won't hurt you. Considering most companies that get rid of workers, rarely spy on ex-employees, unless it is like a military establishment.
Most businesses don't care if you take something and put it to other business, as long as you don't tell them. If you confront them with it, then obviously it is worth your time talking about it to them, they will want to charge you for it, negotiate whatever. However if its a small part of product, hidden underneath, it does not matter.
Business is dirty thing, for business it is in most interest is to collect most amount of dollars expending minimal effort. So if you work for large company and you used to work for small one. Previous company may demand large dollar amount, so to sustain their business. But if they see that company does not really have much money, they will not attempt to waste time, they are in business in the end of the day.
So I'd say don't worry about it, unless you are gonna upsell feature as one of the 10 top reasons to buy solution from you.
And as result may spend more on the disks. PFYs working at fast food joints, are less likely to have money to spend on CDs.
p.
I heard making computer cases out of granit blocks makes them more secure too. ;-)
Now they are will try milk they customer base for all its worth. If my cost goes over 60$/mo, I will be starting a wireless service myself. Because most people will not tolerate over here
... and other alike convinience services.
bill of over 60$ for something they use so little.
Screwing people in IT is hard too, because as it happens, IT has some of the brightest and least tolerant people(towards abuse of them and others by large entities) so there will be a revolt. Many small broadband companies will start. 802.11a is around the corner and it is almost as good as cable, has good distance and scalability.
If price of service goes up I would be damned stupid not to start my own ISP on top of the hill I live on and serve customers below, many customers. Since I can band up with few friends, costs will be low. Internet boom has come and gone and now there is loads of competition to sell uplinks, hence prices are going lower.
Plus there may be some perks. Like mail2pager
Bandwidth is not unlimited, so you can do per-tcp bandwidth limiting -> doable on small scale, so if someone uploads ISOs, give them 10-20K, per-tcp. Internal connections would be bandwidth unlimited. Like ones in between customers, so they can share all they want. -> that what cable companies should've done, make bandwidth unlimited for traffic within their network. Think proportions of @home network that was dead!
Now GO and start your cheching around your area, to start a wirless service.
Look at all those companies! Linux designed by committee... no further things need to be said.
use of multicast will bring down majority of traffic hogs, news , movies etc. And will give power to hands of joes to distribute information they want at no virtually no cost. It may be pirated content, or just their own programming.
Most likely it will start out to be pirated content, then it will get oversaturated, and people will look towards alternative stations for truly creative content.
Time to migrate to IPv6, so those providers will stop dropping like flies. Make a mandate for companies to convert to IPv6 and start gradually fining those who don't comply. In the end they will be dead, because they are inflexible, those who will master IPv6 will bring power to the people.
If you read the story of building arsdigita, you will see the same, they went to market which MS would not even dare to touch - more profitable ventures, now they replicate ideas arsdigita has planted - application server, database web applications, enterprise level. Many others do too. There were reasons they could not grow geometrically - they were partly support company and hiring people that know what to do, was hard in those times, especially with brand new technology, that was deemed not too current, or cool, sort of grey technology, that has technical value, but now WOW value at the time.
...
2c.
Do you really see the trend? First company presidents were sitting in on the coding sessions, helping newhired hammer out the bugs, at appropriate times, they were going to pitch new products to large customers. It was like a family.
.etc etc. Thats what MBA teaches you - to constantly reduce risk by making least innovative decisions... so we get situation like that.
More and more later, started having offices with doors, which where often shut. Talking about programming started to be very unpopular topic, with managerial and semi-business types. Technical meetings still were had, but to hammer out specs.
Now meetings are rare, most specifications are handed down to programmers, written off the wall, in vague language. Meetings now happen only in between managerial staff. CEOs/presidents/CTOs don't even bother.
Soon most work will be shipped off overseas, and managers don't even have to see scruffy, unshaved programmers, mumbling about some nonsense!
What I see is constant gap widening between those who make the goods of the company, and those who sell it. Maybe its a race for higher wages. Shipping off programmers to countries across the ocean is not a bad idea, but attitude most people have is cost cutting, without even looking at innovatie ideas that can be applied right at home - XP programmers, bonus on completion
If you wish to ship projects offshore make sure you have incentive program, that will pace developer across the ocean to deliver goods at paced rate - see eXtreme Programming.
Nail donw requirements. Write them out, get one translator to translate them into hindu and second one, to translate from hindu to english,
see if it makes sense - communication breakdown is too common in it companies, keep communication errors to a minimum.
In the end its attitude and direction what counts .
> Frankly, I don't understand why a US company would consider going anywhere else.
Interesting... but its because all canadian programmers are in US, making real dollars. Ick, i am canadian too =)
2c
What about open h323. Wasn't that a standard for making reliable phonecalls over packet streams?
Time to go with industry standard people. Last
place I worked at, we have implemented H.323 gateway
and it worked like magic, coupled up with outher
gateways.
... dunno, looks like guys reinventing the wheel all over again.
p.
they are a business, and at that successful one until now. Today they are scrambling to grab on to whatever they can, because they know they are history.
Remember business is everything that makes money. If dissatisfaction factor is big, then people get government to do something about it. Average dissasifaction is low then they will continue as planned. So pirates at sea were a reasonable business, but many were dissasfied with the impact byproducts of business in their lives, so they got government to sink some of those. Margins were high for a while, so many people were refilling the niche. And they still do.
Illegal is just a figment of our imagination. We may or may not stop people from doing business, until there is no more incentive to do business - no money. Then it will all naturally dissolve.
Ok, so the proportion of geeks who go for the movie is N, and when movie comes out, it will be very close, or over N. Now, imagine all companies that actually have *real* projects going on now, that will affect company bottom line.
Geeks who take a day or two off, even sick is not going to add too much more to businesses who are overrun with problems of overzelaous managers, poor project management and overall opaqueness in communications channels of the company. Does this remind you of your own company? We booboo, many people ride to their fame on announcing the bad and the evils of the world, riding waves created by bigger causes like large corporations with large promotional budgets.
At the end geeks who will attend the movie will have great time and will code better in weeks to come. Now was that accounted for?
Oh wait, tomorrow our economy may collapse because maybe binladen has biologial weapons capsules planted in water distribution systems of possible large cities of western world.
Or firing everyone from second floor.
Like morgage, car payments etc. Even moderately "dressed" family can suffer consequences of paycuts.
Yes, people should be paid for amount of outcome they have produced, some complex evaluations may apply. I droned to people, if programming is not your love and but you thing computers are cool, and you still want to have nice house/car/kids, time to open that business, if it fails try again, learn from losses, everything adds to your wisdom. On other hand programmers are, writers, artists. This was a high time for them, but it will gradually will level off for most, except those with business sense.
So we do the business rules and programming, so what do the business people do? Nothing? Thats pretty good job for wearing suits all day, and sittingly in nicely furnished offices. As it stands now most business people as they were in between boom times, are back biting, trying to wield power, have job security, stay wealthy. As such they have no apparent interest in the bottom line of the company. Programmers are often responsible to untangle the mess they leave around, and make some sense of it.
And no programmer is not a cobbler. He is a writer. Maybe we should outsource our journalists to china too, they'd work for cheap!
Have you *read* the articles?
I never had a computer, once I did when 12 or something it had no manuals, so I donwloaded programs, from table, pressed break and looked at statement in the listing(yes basic!) and that ways learned most of the syntax. I was writing 1000 line programs by the end of few months... My computer fit only 2k programs, so after while I hit dead end, my hobby stopped. No I don't think I had uptitude/tools to hack assembly of unknown CPU, computer books in russia at the time, where I lived were sparse. Until someone loaned me a 286 pc. I remember playing with windows 3.0 on some pc, it was crashing and stuff, but I was impressed with gui idea. There were already some ZX-Spectrum programs my friends had, like paint ones, with gui, but that was different game(no I did not have ZX, though I wish). I was starting to code my own windowing interface on turbo c++. After while pc was taken away, so I had to go to universety, there they had an XT... my god it was slow, and crashy. TC++1.0 was just terrible... well I moved to canada after a break, I had my hands on Mac classic II around the time, it was amazing, it could do things windows. And Think Pascal was great... after while my parents bought be 486. I got doom from one of my friends, and so sleepness night of playing game it was.
Now I code perl,python, java, C++.
What is most negative trend is the industry is dilution of interest. People want to make software, just like they make a car and sell it million times. And they want to get rich, so the whole industry is plagued by control mania. People want to control other people's thoughts so they can make money on it, so those who surrender to the present order, would feel themselves flowing into mediocricity. I would rather work for other industries, if I had ability to, considered computer peripherals, books - software did not cost so much. You always have to get new stuff and it costs muchos, most hardworking professions don't pay all that well.
Programmer job is not dead. There will be thorough cleaning in the industry in next 2-3 years, really good jobs will be surfacing after this while wash of homecleaning soap is washed away - i certainly hope so.
life is life... get your MBA, and you still can hack in the office and hang out with programmer dudes. If it is part of you, you will allways find time to dedicate yourself to it.
p.