No, you're right. I use 'em all of the time... AT (cron), starting stopping services (with options), user rights management, etc. etc. Most of 'em are already there.
Based on the lukewarm adoption of a 100% free Linux, my guess, and also what Microsoft is thinking, too, is that free isn't top on the list of priorities for most people.
MS is #1 for a reason: they do what the users want. Sometimes it takes a while, but they have to prioritize, and usually, it gets there. If this shell is as good as they say, and it can be a part of W2K, they're going to absolutely pummel any competitors on the server end. This was one of the last holes they had to fill. They've got stability, they've got security, and now they're gonna have good scripting. Wow. Who would'a thunk?
Like the subject says, this kind of bullshit has been going on for many years on a much bigger scale. Marijuana, anyone? Even though any clinical study done (none within the US, of course... they're not allowed) has shown zero possibility for death, next to no physical addiction, and few few if any long term side effects, the US government has been saying for almost a century that marijuana is evil, bad for you, and has been locking up thousands of innocent people based on pure, unadulterated 100% scientific bullshit.
I hate to quote a movie, but, "You are not your job.". I firmly believe that.
And I agree, people do ask, "What do you do?". I started truly hearing that when I was unemployed, and it finally started to click with me that for most people, their jobs are their lives, whether or not they like those jobs. That's truly, literally, sad.
Well, I was unemployed for 6 months. I sure didn't sit on my ass. I got to read a ton of books I never had time to (no, not computer books... real books), I got to dive into my hobby (mountain biking) and got in great shape in the process, I took some cheap road trips, I spent a lot of time with my wife, I did a slew of things I wouldn't have done otherwise. I have a life outside of work. Unemployment was a great opportunity to live. Hell, I even decided to choose a new career while I was unemployed after a good bit of thought.
My point is that if you can't think of something better to do than work, you have some serious problems that you should consider looking into.
I find it really, really pathetic that these "people" (yes, I meant the quotes) have no life outside of work. What most people call work ends for them (ie: performing a task for compensation), and they're lost. They have to do "something". And that "something" is work for free. There sure are a lot of empty, sad people out there. If my life was so empty that I'd rather work for free then do something on my own time, I'd probably shoot myself.
So, on one hand, there's the giant Microsoft, which pays armies of coders, testers, etc. On the other hand, there's every other giant IT company that competes with them by bundling software that was created by a bunch of idealistic college kids that they don't have to pay. Hmmm...
Hey Trolling! Are you one of those sad kiddies that makes his computer case "kewl" to impress his friends, all the while having the social skills of a doorknob? And yes, I will continue to eat meat. It enables me to kick the asses of any pasty, weak vegetarians that piss me off.
'This kit is aimed at those who want the low noise operation of watercooling, but are confined to a somewhat small case and/or those who don't want to fool with extensive modding of their case to accommodate a watercooling setup
I think that it should really read:
This kit is aimed at those who have so much spare time and money to spend on video games that they rarely leave their house (or parents' basement). If you are l337 have a kewl box, then this is for you!
I would like the Framebuffer console; let's say, the 160x64 console, and let's say, maybe 5 or 8 virtual consoles, maybe running screen with cygwin bash. This is my standard terminal, it is my *favorite* video mode among all the options available to me, and it appears to be altogether IMPOSSIBLE in windows.
Or maybe there's no conference at all, and all of the spammers will finally get the email addresses of the anti-spam people that they've wanted for years. Sounds like a perfect evil plan to me.
Doesn't this seem just a bit fishy to anybody else?
Re:"artificial turkey for the vegetarians"
on
Christmas in 2050
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· Score: 1
When's the last time you ate meat plain? I don't think many people do, it wouldn't taste good if you didn't add a crapload of non-meat items to it.
All the time. It's called Sashimi. Steak tar-tar. Meat is good stuff. But I dunno... maybe if I exerted myself 0% a day, and only burned calories typing away at a keyboard all day and moving my eyeballs like some kind of bloated, beached whale, then I could go veggie.
All of that is true, but people who run companies still make decisions based on profit, either direct or indirect. Competent CEO's, VP's, etc. don't make decisions on whims. And, they've all made the decision to at least play around with OSS, but none have reported back, even in any informal annual reports or press releases, that their decision to develop/use/sell/support OSS was any help. Never. Or at least not in anything that I've ever read. Company leaders do make mistakes. For all we know, StarOffice opening up, and IBM's use of Linux, etc., etc. may just be mistakes that the CEO's are hoping that they won't have to own up to. But there definitely is no positive evidence that OSS helps out the bottom line at all.
How exactly do developers benefit? I hardly call moving from a job and paycheck to working for free a "win". I'm inclined to call it a major "loss" actually.
I understand what you're saying... but the big OSS movement is still in it's infancy. I have yet to hear of a company that is actually turning a profit selling/supporting/whatever with OSS. I've never heard an IBM press release or SEC filing that says, "our Linux division of the ABC123 mainframes made a profit of $xxx,xxx" or "due to our use of Linux in out ABC123 machines, we've managed to increase sales xx% and decrease costs by xx%". So in theory, it should work, but to say it's profitable right now may or may not be true. There's nothing positive that says it is working. The only evidence we have about the profitablity of open source software is in all of the various expired companies, and the few remaining who are struggling to stay in existence (Red Hat just posted their first profit ever... a paltry $300K). So, I'd wager that the big companies, overall, are *not* making money on OSS. Whether they will or not in the future is questionable.
IBM, SGI, Sun, and probably a lot of others that should pop into my mind all create opensource software, and profit by doing so.
Really? I had no idea. Are you an insider in all of these companies, or did you see something on their SEC filings that I didn't? I don't think that any of these companies has said publically that they're making a dime on open source software. As far as I can tell, these companies are all just jumping on the bandwagon. Open Source as a business model has not yet been proven. Ever. Not a single company has ever made a profit on open source software from what I've seen.
It is your resposibility as a human being to help others around you
So it's not possible to help and make a profit at the same time? That's the thing with you crackpots. It's either black and white. Good or bad. Free or draconian. I make a profit and I help people. And I don't need anybody to tell me that they work harder than I do, you fucking idealistic piece of shit. I'm not the one who has time to sit around in a circle and sing and paint, you stupid fuck. But you wouldn't understand. People like you never do. You think hard work is a yoga class, you smug, ivory tower, spoiled, lazy bastard. Don't preach to me about how much better you are and how much harder you work to 'help the community', you pretentious fuck.
OK, now. This is getting ridiculous. At least the "IN SOVIET RUSSIA" posts are funny, but these are just old. Yes, open source is wonderful. It solves every problem on the planet. It is the meaning of life. Come on now, this is ridiculous. Next thing that somebody will post is , "Hey, you think cancer could be cured if medicine was open sourced?"
"Selfish"?? Profit is "selfish"? Ha. That's pretty funny. I got a kick out of that one. You sound just like one of the very unfortunate characters out of "Atlas Shrugged". So naive and so clueless. You really have no idea how the world works, huh? Artist & musicians... hehe... I only wish that I was as blissfully ignorant as artists & musicians. What you fail to understand is that ownership makes the world go round. Without ownership, you have chaos & anarchy. Ownership and profit works. It's been played out in history time and time again. You can only afford to think the way you do because you can well... afford to.
Ah, good point. I guess that I was thinking about IBM's bundling of something OSS on their big hardware, and being able to grossly undercut the competition since they're not needing to develop AIX or whatever copy of software they need to run their big hardware. But even then, they're losing out on sales of software, so it might not even be that much of an advantage to them to be using, say Linux on a mainframe or mini. And yes, I was wrong about a company like Oracle. The GPL would essentially "pollute" their products, making them unsaleable (or at least according to the current lack of legal challenge on the GNU/GPL licensing stuff). Granted, Oracle does sell a good bit in support, but most of their income comes from pure software sales, from what I remember reading.
Slashdot Mirror
No, you're right. I use 'em all of the time... AT (cron), starting stopping services (with options), user rights management, etc. etc. Most of 'em are already there.
Based on the lukewarm adoption of a 100% free Linux, my guess, and also what Microsoft is thinking, too, is that free isn't top on the list of priorities for most people.
MS is #1 for a reason: they do what the users want. Sometimes it takes a while, but they have to prioritize, and usually, it gets there. If this shell is as good as they say, and it can be a part of W2K, they're going to absolutely pummel any competitors on the server end. This was one of the last holes they had to fill. They've got stability, they've got security, and now they're gonna have good scripting. Wow. Who would'a thunk?
Like the subject says, this kind of bullshit has been going on for many years on a much bigger scale. Marijuana, anyone? Even though any clinical study done (none within the US, of course... they're not allowed) has shown zero possibility for death, next to no physical addiction, and few few if any long term side effects, the US government has been saying for almost a century that marijuana is evil, bad for you, and has been locking up thousands of innocent people based on pure, unadulterated 100% scientific bullshit.
I hate to quote a movie, but, "You are not your job.". I firmly believe that.
And I agree, people do ask, "What do you do?". I started truly hearing that when I was unemployed, and it finally started to click with me that for most people, their jobs are their lives, whether or not they like those jobs. That's truly, literally, sad.
Well, I was unemployed for 6 months. I sure didn't sit on my ass. I got to read a ton of books I never had time to (no, not computer books... real books), I got to dive into my hobby (mountain biking) and got in great shape in the process, I took some cheap road trips, I spent a lot of time with my wife, I did a slew of things I wouldn't have done otherwise. I have a life outside of work. Unemployment was a great opportunity to live. Hell, I even decided to choose a new career while I was unemployed after a good bit of thought.
My point is that if you can't think of something better to do than work, you have some serious problems that you should consider looking into.
I find it really, really pathetic that these "people" (yes, I meant the quotes) have no life outside of work. What most people call work ends for them (ie: performing a task for compensation), and they're lost. They have to do "something". And that "something" is work for free. There sure are a lot of empty, sad people out there. If my life was so empty that I'd rather work for free then do something on my own time, I'd probably shoot myself.
So, on one hand, there's the giant Microsoft, which pays armies of coders, testers, etc. On the other hand, there's every other giant IT company that competes with them by bundling software that was created by a bunch of idealistic college kids that they don't have to pay. Hmmm...
Hey Trolling! Are you one of those sad kiddies that makes his computer case "kewl" to impress his friends, all the while having the social skills of a doorknob? And yes, I will continue to eat meat. It enables me to kick the asses of any pasty, weak vegetarians that piss me off.
'This kit is aimed at those who want the low noise operation of watercooling, but are confined to a somewhat small case and/or those who don't want to fool with extensive modding of their case to accommodate a watercooling setup
I think that it should really read:
This kit is aimed at those who have so much spare time and money to spend on video games that they rarely leave their house (or parents' basement). If you are l337 have a kewl box, then this is for you!
I'd call 'em just plain ol' "DD"s. "Digital Discs". Plus, the "DD" implies BIIIIG! Confused? See the link below.
I would like the Framebuffer console; let's say, the 160x64 console, and let's say, maybe 5 or 8 virtual consoles, maybe running screen with cygwin bash. This is my standard terminal, it is my *favorite* video mode among all the options available to me, and it appears to be altogether IMPOSSIBLE in windows.
What in the hell are you talking about, exactly?
Or maybe there's no conference at all, and all of the spammers will finally get the email addresses of the anti-spam people that they've wanted for years. Sounds like a perfect evil plan to me.
Doesn't this seem just a bit fishy to anybody else?
When's the last time you ate meat plain? I don't think many people do, it wouldn't taste good if you didn't add a crapload of non-meat items to it.
All the time. It's called Sashimi. Steak tar-tar. Meat is good stuff. But I dunno... maybe if I exerted myself 0% a day, and only burned calories typing away at a keyboard all day and moving my eyeballs like some kind of bloated, beached whale, then I could go veggie.
All of that is true, but people who run companies still make decisions based on profit, either direct or indirect. Competent CEO's, VP's, etc. don't make decisions on whims. And, they've all made the decision to at least play around with OSS, but none have reported back, even in any informal annual reports or press releases, that their decision to develop/use/sell/support OSS was any help. Never. Or at least not in anything that I've ever read. Company leaders do make mistakes. For all we know, StarOffice opening up, and IBM's use of Linux, etc., etc. may just be mistakes that the CEO's are hoping that they won't have to own up to. But there definitely is no positive evidence that OSS helps out the bottom line at all.
everybody (authors, users, community) wins
How exactly do developers benefit? I hardly call moving from a job and paycheck to working for free a "win". I'm inclined to call it a major "loss" actually.
I understand what you're saying... but the big OSS movement is still in it's infancy. I have yet to hear of a company that is actually turning a profit selling/supporting/whatever with OSS. I've never heard an IBM press release or SEC filing that says, "our Linux division of the ABC123 mainframes made a profit of $xxx,xxx" or "due to our use of Linux in out ABC123 machines, we've managed to increase sales xx% and decrease costs by xx%". So in theory, it should work, but to say it's profitable right now may or may not be true. There's nothing positive that says it is working. The only evidence we have about the profitablity of open source software is in all of the various expired companies, and the few remaining who are struggling to stay in existence (Red Hat just posted their first profit ever ... a paltry $300K). So, I'd wager that the big companies, overall, are *not* making money on OSS. Whether they will or not in the future is questionable.
"Rights"? Really? I had no idea that you had any rights to spread their information. Who granted you these rights to copy their information?
IBM, SGI, Sun, and probably a lot of others that should pop into my mind all create opensource software, and profit by doing so.
Really? I had no idea. Are you an insider in all of these companies, or did you see something on their SEC filings that I didn't? I don't think that any of these companies has said publically that they're making a dime on open source software. As far as I can tell, these companies are all just jumping on the bandwagon. Open Source as a business model has not yet been proven. Ever. Not a single company has ever made a profit on open source software from what I've seen.
Wow. You're a fuckin' nutcase.
It is your resposibility as a human being to help others around you
So it's not possible to help and make a profit at the same time? That's the thing with you crackpots. It's either black and white. Good or bad. Free or draconian. I make a profit and I help people. And I don't need anybody to tell me that they work harder than I do, you fucking idealistic piece of shit. I'm not the one who has time to sit around in a circle and sing and paint, you stupid fuck. But you wouldn't understand. People like you never do. You think hard work is a yoga class, you smug, ivory tower, spoiled, lazy bastard. Don't preach to me about how much better you are and how much harder you work to 'help the community', you pretentious fuck.
OK, now. This is getting ridiculous. At least the "IN SOVIET RUSSIA" posts are funny, but these are just old. Yes, open source is wonderful. It solves every problem on the planet. It is the meaning of life. Come on now, this is ridiculous. Next thing that somebody will post is , "Hey, you think cancer could be cured if medicine was open sourced?"
"Selfish"?? Profit is "selfish"? Ha. That's pretty funny. I got a kick out of that one. You sound just like one of the very unfortunate characters out of "Atlas Shrugged". So naive and so clueless. You really have no idea how the world works, huh? Artist & musicians... hehe... I only wish that I was as blissfully ignorant as artists & musicians. What you fail to understand is that ownership makes the world go round. Without ownership, you have chaos & anarchy. Ownership and profit works. It's been played out in history time and time again. You can only afford to think the way you do because you can well... afford to.
Ah, good point. I guess that I was thinking about IBM's bundling of something OSS on their big hardware, and being able to grossly undercut the competition since they're not needing to develop AIX or whatever copy of software they need to run their big hardware. But even then, they're losing out on sales of software, so it might not even be that much of an advantage to them to be using, say Linux on a mainframe or mini. And yes, I was wrong about a company like Oracle. The GPL would essentially "pollute" their products, making them unsaleable (or at least according to the current lack of legal challenge on the GNU/GPL licensing stuff). Granted, Oracle does sell a good bit in support, but most of their income comes from pure software sales, from what I remember reading.