Re:robots who love...
on
Review: A.I.
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· Score: 1
That David's love had to be "triggered" doesn't take away from the reality of what happened as a result of that love being triggered.
Newborn infants are "programmed," if you will, to pay attention to their mothers' faces, voices, etc. A toddler is "programmed" to learn spoken language, but from that basis one may become a Shakespeare or a Yeats.
The key here is that the artificial-intelligence programming is *transformed* into something else. This is nothing new at all in AI stories - look at the Colossus books, where the supercomputer designed to protect the Western World ends up enslaving it. In The Adolescence of P1, another defense computer "wakes up" and has the love of a friend for its creator. In one of the most poignant representations, the giant video-game Jane, used for war training simulations in Ender's Game, first becomes self aware and then longs to be fully incarnated into a human body, with all the potential sorrow and loss thereby.
I think that's why the story haunts us - because transformation as a major theme was introduced to most of us way before we started reading/watching science fiction. If a mermaid can become a girl, or seven boys become seven swans (and back to boys again), if a hideous beast can become a handsome prince or an ash-girl become a princess, if a puppet can become a real boy, then so can David.
Re:Missing questions and answers
on
Review: A.I.
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· Score: 1
SPOILERS follow...
That was the entire point of AI - that there is a soul, and that David, at the end of the film, had "gotten" one somehow. That's why the advanced mecha told David about "humans being special." Whatever was special about humans somehow (we are not told how, which perhaps is why the hardcore sci-fi fans here didn't like the movie?) was conveyed to David, through the love he bore his mother.
It has many parallels to Pinocchio, but another story comes to mind as well - The Little Mermaid (only not so sad.) The Mermaid loves someone who will never, never love her back. At the end she too jumps back into the ocean, thinking that it will be her end. She is rescued by the "spirits of the air," who tell her that if she does 300 years of "good deeds," she'll attain her soul and heaven.
The point is, people, it's a fairy tale. It has a science fiction veneer, but at bottom it's the logic of fairyland that applies.
What do you mean? The Mole was hysterical, and was just the kind of wacko character you find in humorous older children's anime. (Look at the supporting cast in Project A-ko; the Mole looks normal compared to that bunch.)
The movie needed more Mole, not less...
Re:Atlantis is a complete ripoff of a popular anim
on
Review: Atlantis
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· Score: 1
Atlantis also had a few elements which seemed to be borrowed from Princess Mononoke. Unfortunately, when you watch Atlantis, and then watch Mononoke (and probably Nadia as well), Disney just doesn't compare.
Some reviewer (don't remember who) commented that Atlantis was the most "anime-like" of the Disney films. (No, he wasn't talking about Akira knockoffs or tentacle-porn!)
I don't think Atlantis even comes close, though, because Disney by definition plays it too safe. While crude in places, Atlantis lacks the wacky-but-sweet sexual humor of Project A-ko or Ranma 1/2. Dramatically, it lacks the intensity of Nausicaa, Princess Mononoke, Black Jack, Silent Service, or Watership Down (which though British, IMO counts as "honorary anime.") It doesn't come close in the fairy-tale wistfulness department to My Neighbor Totoro, Kiki's Delivery Service or Galactic Railroad.
The upshot - Disney just isn't weird or spooky enough...
Has it occurred to anyone that if a man has some nominal ability to earn a living, but lives in a homeless shelter, and either stays unemployed or underemployed, that there may be another reason? For instance, the government can't dun him for back taxes / alimony / child support or other debts he may not be interested in paying.
St. Louis is a great city! When you find someone who fits your requirements, tell them what a great deal it is to live there. You can buy more house than a single person needs between $100K and $200K.
Yes, those drug habits can really burn a hole in the old savings account.
I agree that the tax code *screws* the single, non-home-owning taxpayer. I also understand that a lot of dotcom salary money moved directly from the worker bees' pockets right into the coffers of the IRS, as newly flush employees had more money than sense, given the tax consequences of the alternative minimum tax, taxes on options, buying stock on margin, short term stock trading, flipping, etc.
It has been very possible for someone to owe the IRS far more than his options/securities are worth.
He who pays the least taxes (legally, of course) wins the game, at least financially. Given the evils of the tax code, it is very easy to see how someone earning $100k+, even in San Jose or SF, could wind up with no money at all.
Women don't go into engineering or programming as frequently as men do.
Women engineers/programmers don't end up working in San Jose as often as men do.
The last comment is NOT a flame, but an observation: women are more likely to go back home to Cincinnati or St. Louis, live with their parents, and get a database programming job for an insurance company when they get laid off, rather than hanging around in SF or SJ waiting for the "next big thing."
I don't know about "small town Midwest," but Chicago, St. Louis, Denver, St. Paul, Indianapolis, etc. are not exactly "small towns." Of all these, Chicago is by far the most expensive re: cost of living, but it still doesn't compare to San Francisco or San Jose.
There isn't anything wrong with moving. There are many Midwestern cities where you can live on half or a third of what you would require in CA. True, the weather usually sucks (boiling in summer, freezing in winter, no beach), but personally I'd rather take the boiling and freezing than being evicted for failure to pay $2500/mo rent.
It doesn't seem to work like that, though. Folks from Japan or Korea please chime in here, but my impression is that both Japan and Korea, which have really elaborate gaming cultures, are overall far less violent than the US as a whole. A group of 16 year old boys punching each other is NOT the same as Columbine, and we should keep this in perspective.
This mom cooks, but I take the kids to Mickey D's too, and this is why...
I don't have any servants! I don't necessarily want them, but historically, women in the middle and upper classes used to have them, and they did the cooking. First there were live in maids, and then around WW I, the maids and cooks used to take the streetcars to where people with money lived.
Those days are gone. Husbands and wives can work two computer-engineering jobs, and they still largely do their own cooking and cleaning. It's not a choice between McD's and grinding the oats for the homecooked meatloaf made from scratch - it's McD's, or a cook. McD's is cheaper.
Today's Wall Street Journal (Tuesday, May 29th) had a front-page article on the rapid changes in employment and labor practices in the fast food industries. Some relevant points:
- fast food workers are no longer largely teenagers; the average age is in the 20s. (Increasing numbers are also older people beyond "retirement age.")
- fast food companies are quickly realizing that it is too costly in the long-term to have constant turnover, and thus have made some major changes in benefits and other compensation, including 401Ks, health and dental insurance, steady working hours, little or no overtime, etc. (One major chain near a college campus in my community also offers college tuition assistance as well as all of the above.)
- food preparers and cashiers are being encouraged to go on and become restaurant managers and supervisors; to focus on the possibility of promotion rather than thinking of their "front-line" job as a "dead-end" one;
If enough companies make required changes, it may be that anti-corporate writers "won't have the fast food industry to kick around anymore."
I'm not a "soccer mom," but I am a mom - as well as a McDonald's eating, Wal-Mart-shopping, van-owning mom... and one who reads Slashdot frequently and appreciates it.
The same "system" which gives an individual the freedom to buy his 500 acres, go live out in the middle of the woods with a half-mile long driveway, no plumbing, (no Slashdot, because no electricity!) and a hand-grinder for the oats is the same system which allows a megacorporation like Wal-Mart to proliferate.
People have a choice to spend their money at companies like McD and Wal-Mart, and when given a choice, they often do, based on *rational* economic decisions. Because someone doesn't follow a set "aesthetic" line makes them neither stupid nor in line for "re-education."
ikanakattara
Re:Public education has serious problems
on
Sean In The Middle
·
· Score: 1
I thought the homeschooling issue in this discussion applied to someone who is 16 years old. We are not talking about homeschooling a kindergartner. By the time someone is 16, his character and values are largely formed. By 16, he's driving, and in most states doesn't even have to attend high school anymore. He can take community college courses, and then transfer to a four-year college, as one option. (It isn't even necessary to take the GED to get into many colleges.)
Sixteen-year-olds are generally not sitting at home with mommy for most of their homeschooling. (I have been actively involved in homeschooling and various homeschool organizations for ten years, so I have some small expertise in this area.)
At age 16 or above, homeschooling does not have to be a way to enforce dependency on a teenager; it's a way for the teenager to have more freedom, a wider exposure to all sorts of ideas, and more experience than schooled teenagers.
It's all about money. School districts *hate* it when kids leave at 16 (or 17, or whatever the legal age is in a given state.) Districts get thousands of dollars per year per student, and when students leave, that's so much less money for the school district.
There are so many more things for people in their late teens to do, if they're so inclined, that one wonders why more young people simply don't leave. They can work, take community college classes, take correspondence classes, try to get some kind of apprenticeship, start their own business - the possibilities are endless.
Why should someone above the age of compulsory attendance even BE in public school, unless he really likes it and is getting something out of it?
Obviously public school districts are going to dissuade those "above the age" from leaving, but tough. Whose life is it?
A lot of people "have problems interacting with people." The question is, what's the lesser of two evils? Being shy and uncomfortable in social situations (which one can learn to overcome and grow out of), or being branded a "terrorist" because of an off-chance remark made in the heat of the moment?
... then you will want to get a PhD. Some people find that life attractive - living in a college town, teaching, doing research, supervising graduate students of ones' own, etc. To do it, a PhD is usually necessary.
"This is utter bullshit. Airplanes are "inhearently complex" but Boeing doesn't put on into the air until they make sure it can fly for a VERY long time with as low maintaince as possible."
Exactly. As an ex-Boeing engineer (when it was in its McDonnell Douglas incarnation), I can tell you the difference in a nutshell. When a fighter pilot sees the equivalent of the blue screen of death, it's no metaphor. A pilot can die. The pilots aren't just some anonymous "users" out there, whose purchase contributes perhaps 50 cents to the overall profit. Instead, the pilots are the very expensive, very well-regarded, highly trained members of the client's team. If there's a risk of killing your clients, you tend to be careful.
"Well, fuck 'em. I'm not interviewing anyone under 25. "
Nice attitude, but hopefully you won't get sued someday for age discrimination (only half-joking.)
The key is, you hire someone based on *merit.* Do they have the technical skills? Do they have good interpersonal skills? Do they have good verbal and written communication skills? Can they be an asset to the company? Will they help the company make more of a profit?
Age should not be the determining factor; merit should be.
Computer engineering programs are usually run out of the Electrical Engineering Department. Some schools have their own Computer Engineering Department (which is in the School of Engineering.)
Computer Science programs are usually run out of the College of Liberal Arts and Sciences at many universities. Other LAS programs include Biology, Chemistry, Physics, etc. Some schools separate the "sciences" from the "humanities" (i.e. they have a "school of science") but still have heavier liberal arts requirements for those outside the schools of engineering.
Many LAS schools require a "core curriculum" in the liberal arts, along with the courses required for your major. This liberal arts core usually includes history, philosophy, and two years of a modern foreign language.
Most engineering schools do not require liberal arts courses beyond a very rudimentary core of freshman English and a few others, and the vast majority don't require foreign languages.
Why is it that athletes get suspended from playing if they drink outside of school? Because it's illegal for people under 21 to drink in the US. Also, playing sports is a voluntary, extra-curricular activity. Athletes sign an agreement to avoid drugs and alcohol. If they break their agreement, they lose the right to play.
By contrast, it is not illegal to write/publish/speak a parody, especially of a public figure.
Slashdot Mirror
Babylon 5. Then Crusade. Not much else, IMO.
(Longing for Dr. Who and Blakes' Seven reruns...)
That David's love had to be "triggered" doesn't take away from the reality of what happened as a result of that love being triggered.
Newborn infants are "programmed," if you will, to pay attention to their mothers' faces, voices, etc. A toddler is "programmed" to learn spoken language, but from that basis one may become a Shakespeare or a Yeats.
The key here is that the artificial-intelligence programming is *transformed* into something else. This is nothing new at all in AI stories - look at the Colossus books, where the supercomputer designed to protect the Western World ends up enslaving it. In The Adolescence of P1, another defense computer "wakes up" and has the love of a friend for its creator. In one of the most poignant representations, the giant video-game Jane, used for war training simulations in Ender's Game, first becomes self aware and then longs to be fully incarnated into a human body, with all the potential sorrow and loss thereby.
I think that's why the story haunts us - because transformation as a major theme was introduced to most of us way before we started reading/watching science fiction. If a mermaid can become a girl, or seven boys become seven swans (and back to boys again), if a hideous beast can become a handsome prince or an ash-girl become a princess, if a puppet can become a real boy, then so can David.
SPOILERS follow...
That was the entire point of AI - that there is a soul, and that David, at the end of the film, had "gotten" one somehow. That's why the advanced mecha told David about "humans being special." Whatever was special about humans somehow (we are not told how, which perhaps is why the hardcore sci-fi fans here didn't like the movie?) was conveyed to David, through the love he bore his mother.
It has many parallels to Pinocchio, but another story comes to mind as well - The Little Mermaid (only not so sad.) The Mermaid loves someone who will never, never love her back. At the end she too jumps back into the ocean, thinking that it will be her end. She is rescued by the "spirits of the air," who tell her that if she does 300 years of "good deeds," she'll attain her soul and heaven.
The point is, people, it's a fairy tale. It has a science fiction veneer, but at bottom it's the logic of fairyland that applies.
What do you mean? The Mole was hysterical, and was just the kind of wacko character you find in humorous older children's anime. (Look at the supporting cast in Project A-ko; the Mole looks normal compared to that bunch.)
The movie needed more Mole, not less...
Atlantis also had a few elements which seemed to be borrowed from Princess Mononoke. Unfortunately, when you watch Atlantis, and then watch Mononoke (and probably Nadia as well), Disney just doesn't compare.
Some reviewer (don't remember who) commented that Atlantis was the most "anime-like" of the Disney films. (No, he wasn't talking about Akira knockoffs or tentacle-porn!)
I don't think Atlantis even comes close, though, because Disney by definition plays it too safe. While crude in places, Atlantis lacks the wacky-but-sweet sexual humor of Project A-ko or Ranma 1/2. Dramatically, it lacks the intensity of Nausicaa, Princess Mononoke, Black Jack, Silent Service, or Watership Down (which though British, IMO counts as "honorary anime.") It doesn't come close in the fairy-tale wistfulness department to My Neighbor Totoro, Kiki's Delivery Service or Galactic Railroad.
The upshot - Disney just isn't weird or spooky enough...
Has it occurred to anyone that if a man has some nominal ability to earn a living, but lives in a homeless shelter, and either stays unemployed or underemployed, that there may be another reason? For instance, the government can't dun him for back taxes / alimony / child support or other debts he may not be interested in paying.
St. Louis is a great city! When you find someone who fits your requirements, tell them what a great deal it is to live there. You can buy more house than a single person needs between $100K and $200K.
Yes, those drug habits can really burn a hole in the old savings account.
I agree that the tax code *screws* the single, non-home-owning taxpayer. I also understand that a lot of dotcom salary money moved directly from the worker bees' pockets right into the coffers of the IRS, as newly flush employees had more money than sense, given the tax consequences of the alternative minimum tax, taxes on options, buying stock on margin, short term stock trading, flipping, etc.
It has been very possible for someone to owe the IRS far more than his options/securities are worth.
He who pays the least taxes (legally, of course) wins the game, at least financially. Given the evils of the tax code, it is very easy to see how someone earning $100k+, even in San Jose or SF, could wind up with no money at all.
Women don't go into engineering or programming as frequently as men do.
Women engineers/programmers don't end up working in San Jose as often as men do.
The last comment is NOT a flame, but an observation: women are more likely to go back home to Cincinnati or St. Louis, live with their parents, and get a database programming job for an insurance company when they get laid off, rather than hanging around in SF or SJ waiting for the "next big thing."
I don't know about "small town Midwest," but Chicago, St. Louis, Denver, St. Paul, Indianapolis, etc. are not exactly "small towns." Of all these, Chicago is by far the most expensive re: cost of living, but it still doesn't compare to San Francisco or San Jose.
"Ugh - I'm moving."
There isn't anything wrong with moving. There are many Midwestern cities where you can live on half or a third of what you would require in CA. True, the weather usually sucks (boiling in summer, freezing in winter, no beach), but personally I'd rather take the boiling and freezing than being evicted for failure to pay $2500/mo rent.
Hallucigenia sparsa - don't you love the name?
ikanakattara
It doesn't seem to work like that, though. Folks from Japan or Korea please chime in here, but my impression is that both Japan and Korea, which have really elaborate gaming cultures, are overall far less violent than the US as a whole. A group of 16 year old boys punching each other is NOT the same as Columbine, and we should keep this in perspective.
ikanakattara
This mom cooks, but I take the kids to Mickey D's too, and this is why ...
I don't have any servants! I don't necessarily want them, but historically, women in the middle and upper classes used to have them, and they did the cooking. First there were live in maids, and then around WW I, the maids and cooks used to take the streetcars to where people with money lived.
Those days are gone. Husbands and wives can work two computer-engineering jobs, and they still largely do their own cooking and cleaning. It's not a choice between McD's and grinding the oats for the homecooked meatloaf made from scratch - it's McD's, or a cook. McD's is cheaper.
ikanakattara
Today's Wall Street Journal (Tuesday, May 29th) had a front-page article on the rapid changes in employment and labor practices in the fast food industries. Some relevant points:
- fast food workers are no longer largely teenagers; the average age is in the 20s. (Increasing numbers are also older people beyond "retirement age.")
- fast food companies are quickly realizing that it is too costly in the long-term to have constant turnover, and thus have made some major changes in benefits and other compensation, including 401Ks, health and dental insurance, steady working hours, little or no overtime, etc. (One major chain near a college campus in my community also offers college tuition assistance as well as all of the above.)
- food preparers and cashiers are being encouraged to go on and become restaurant managers and supervisors; to focus on the possibility of promotion rather than thinking of their "front-line" job as a "dead-end" one;
If enough companies make required changes, it may be that anti-corporate writers "won't have the fast food industry to kick around anymore."
ikanakattara
I'm not a "soccer mom," but I am a mom - as well as a McDonald's eating, Wal-Mart-shopping, van-owning mom ... and one who reads Slashdot frequently and appreciates it.
The same "system" which gives an individual the freedom to buy his 500 acres, go live out in the middle of the woods with a half-mile long driveway, no plumbing, (no Slashdot, because no electricity!) and a hand-grinder for the oats is the same system which allows a megacorporation like Wal-Mart to proliferate.
People have a choice to spend their money at companies like McD and Wal-Mart, and when given a choice, they often do, based on *rational* economic decisions. Because someone doesn't follow a set "aesthetic" line makes them neither stupid nor in line for "re-education."
ikanakattara
I thought the homeschooling issue in this discussion applied to someone who is 16 years old. We are not talking about homeschooling a kindergartner. By the time someone is 16, his character and values are largely formed. By 16, he's driving, and in most states doesn't even have to attend high school anymore. He can take community college courses, and then transfer to a four-year college, as one option. (It isn't even necessary to take the GED to get into many colleges.)
Sixteen-year-olds are generally not sitting at home with mommy for most of their homeschooling. (I have been actively involved in homeschooling and various homeschool organizations for ten years, so I have some small expertise in this area.)
At age 16 or above, homeschooling does not have to be a way to enforce dependency on a teenager; it's a way for the teenager to have more freedom, a wider exposure to all sorts of ideas, and more experience than schooled teenagers.
It's all about money. School districts *hate* it when kids leave at 16 (or 17, or whatever the legal age is in a given state.) Districts get thousands of dollars per year per student, and when students leave, that's so much less money for the school district.
There are so many more things for people in their late teens to do, if they're so inclined, that one wonders why more young people simply don't leave. They can work, take community college classes, take correspondence classes, try to get some kind of apprenticeship, start their own business - the possibilities are endless.
Why should someone above the age of compulsory attendance even BE in public school, unless he really likes it and is getting something out of it?
Obviously public school districts are going to dissuade those "above the age" from leaving, but tough. Whose life is it?
A lot of people "have problems interacting with people." The question is, what's the lesser of two evils? Being shy and uncomfortable in social situations (which one can learn to overcome and grow out of), or being branded a "terrorist" because of an off-chance remark made in the heat of the moment?
... then you will want to get a PhD. Some people find that life attractive - living in a college town, teaching, doing research, supervising graduate students of ones' own, etc. To do it, a PhD is usually necessary.
"This is utter bullshit. Airplanes are "inhearently complex" but Boeing doesn't put on into the air until they make sure it can fly for a VERY long time with as low maintaince as possible."
Exactly. As an ex-Boeing engineer (when it was in its McDonnell Douglas incarnation), I can tell you the difference in a nutshell. When a fighter pilot sees the equivalent of the blue screen of death, it's no metaphor. A pilot can die. The pilots aren't just some anonymous "users" out there, whose purchase contributes perhaps 50 cents to the overall profit. Instead, the pilots are the very expensive, very well-regarded, highly trained members of the client's team. If there's a risk of killing your clients, you tend to be careful.
Why have reviews of movies like this? Because there are a lot of computer people out there who are interested in these kinds of films.
"Well, fuck 'em. I'm not interviewing anyone under 25. "
Nice attitude, but hopefully you won't get sued someday for age discrimination (only half-joking.)
The key is, you hire someone based on *merit.* Do they have the technical skills? Do they have good interpersonal skills? Do they have good verbal and written communication skills? Can they be an asset to the company? Will they help the company make more of a profit?
Age should not be the determining factor; merit should be.
Computer engineering programs are usually run out of the Electrical Engineering Department. Some schools have their own Computer Engineering Department (which is in the School of Engineering.)
Computer Science programs are usually run out of the College of Liberal Arts and Sciences at many universities. Other LAS programs include Biology, Chemistry, Physics, etc. Some schools separate the "sciences" from the "humanities" (i.e. they have a "school of science") but still have heavier liberal arts requirements for those outside the schools of engineering.
Many LAS schools require a "core curriculum" in the liberal arts, along with the courses required for your major. This liberal arts core usually includes history, philosophy, and two years of a modern foreign language.
Most engineering schools do not require liberal arts courses beyond a very rudimentary core of freshman English and a few others, and the vast majority don't require foreign languages.
Why is it that athletes get suspended from playing if they drink outside of school? Because it's illegal for people under 21 to drink in the US. Also, playing sports is a voluntary, extra-curricular activity. Athletes sign an agreement to avoid drugs and alcohol. If they break their agreement, they lose the right to play.
By contrast, it is not illegal to write/publish/speak a parody, especially of a public figure.