I had a friend by name Dave, who worked with me at a certain national lab on AI.
He's probably the only guy in AI I know who's praying hard that he's _not_ the the first person to create sentient AI, says he has a feeling that nature would play a cruel joke on him if he ever did.
I wish he does, though. It would be poetic justice;)
And the worst part? He actually watches Reality Shows.
And the competitors in India and China don't have this certification rubbish.
Any and all electrical and electronic equipment in the US is subject to regulations, whether they are manufactured inhouse or imported - to prevent unwanted and potentially harmful interference.
bureaucratic goverment drones like you impose a mountain of useless paperwork on small businesses.
I happen to be the owner of a small business myself, and I find the regulations to be quite useful and justified, they're the reasons we do not have a million conflicting parts and standards out there.
But a small business is killed by such stuff.
Yes, and people are killed if there were no regulations. Would you rather have someone die because an CD-player interfered with their pacemaker interfered, or would you rather help small businesses "prosper".
Btw, the reason China is providing cheap stuff is because they have little or no laws on labour condition and blatantly practice harmful trade practices like under-pricing. I guess if we could make you work in a sweatshop for 20 hours a day for a pittance, you would be happy?
Get your facts straight before talking through your ass.
(I was not the AC you responded to, but thought I'd reply)
See, the unfortunate thing is that startups are not easy, and the initial investment is really really high. You do have a point - and a very valid one at that. However the fact that it can be abused, and the fact that it could cause more harm than good in the process is why those regulations are in place.
Look at it this way - already all our equipments are made by the lowest bidder in some cheap factory off China or Taiwan.
There is nothing to prevent Toshiba from hiring a bunch of smaller new companies to be exempt of this, why should they spend more and follow the rules when you, the smaller company, do not have to? It would result in more chaos.
The problems that these could cause are genuine - when the equipment in a hospital goes haywire because some of interference from some kid's CD player, killing some poor guy. Imagine those situations and imagine the consequences for the manufacturer and users in terms of damages -- legal, monetary and what not.
You must be a geek, not the business guy. Have you looked at renting vs buying this kind of equipment? It's not like renting office space.
True, but you can have an arrangement with such organizations for providing you with access to such equipment -- at a price, ofcourse. It's not easy, but it is possible. Another thing to do is to tie-up with educational institutions (for instance, my University has an arm to help out startups).
You had said elsewhere that you were not a startup anymore, but a Multi-M$ business. In which case, I'm sure you could help out the smaller businesses in this field by providing them with access to your facilities at a subsidised price, and the like. That way, you win and they win. You get the goodwill (and maybe a stake, and some cash) while the startups get access to facilities and your expertise.
I think that is probably a better solution, especially since the consequences of non-certified equipment can even be fatal.
The thing is, I understand your plight completely.
I run a small startup too, and I know _exactly_ what you are talking about.
However, as an ECE engineer, I must say that it is all probably for a good reason. Interference with devices is a genuine problem not just because it may interfere with the odd radio, but because it may interfere with devices such as medical equipment, pace-makers and the like as well as other critical equipment. These days, electronic equipments and microprocessors are ubiquitous - hell, even my bike has some cool stuff on it. However, this also causes problems in terms of more equipment that are affected by interference and the like.
Compounded with the amount of stuff out there, this may lead to some very genuine problems. Not just a noisy radio, but crashes, accidents, deaths, medical equipment failure and the like.
Who knows, some day there may be a balance that may be stuck. But for the moment, I would side with caution. IMHO, ofcourse:)
The problem is that while in your particular instance it may seem stiffling to your company, those regulations are in place because not all companies can be trusted to stick with the specs in that case.
It becomes a question of business ethics, and we all know how most companies are when it comes to those. This device probably passes the test, where probably has a probability of 0.00001.
_That_ is why strict regulations are needed, IMHO.
And oh btw, nice players at Slim Devices, quite the coolness.
And the (CNet) article points out something of relevance - with so many new devices and what not, our radio spectrum is increasingly becoming very muddled and interference a lot more commonplace. I wonder if existing regulations would do, or if new ones be required.
Something to think about.
And I wonder how powerful that signal must have been to have caused such interference. Either that, or the receiving satellites must be having one hell of a resolution capability.
The latter also provides some food for thought - if their satellite equipment is sensitive enough to find out interfering signals from a Television set, wonder what else they can (and do) eavesdrop:)
What kind of Tempest attacks do take place, I wonder. Satellite Van Eck Phreaking?
That is not the point - the point is actual implementation. Google is at liberty to implement what serves their needs best.
But why does Microsoft not go ahead and implement it in their systems? The system was introduced in June-July, and the last time I checked, guess which of Microsoft's mail services have SPF implemented? Microsft? Hotmail? MSN? Xbox? Nope.
NONE of the above.
That is the difference - not suggesting new technologies, but going ahead and implementing them so that people adopt. I mean, they are so good at doing that for other things, why not for something useful?
Overclocking these days is nowhere close to the kind it was. There was another reason for it, too - back then the tech was a lot simpler, and easier to hack up without causing damage.
Although I've not worked on Kaypro, I remember working on the Osbourne 1. It used the Z-80 too, but the 4 MHz version. I had a cousin who used to do stuff like overclocking and coding on it, and he had got one a lot later to hack it up. I remember that as being one of my earliest inspirations.
I think the Z-80 was probably Zilog's best ever microprocessor. I don't think they came up with anything after that. Wonder why.
It's one thing to come up with technology, it's another to use it in a way that is beneficial.
Additionally, Yahoo! is working with Sendmail to develop a DomainKey implementation for their popular MTA (both the commercial and freeware versions).
While other comanies are still working, Google has already started signing their outgoing mails. Developing new solutions is only the beginning, implementing them and fostering adaptation is the hard part.
Xerox came up with the UI, it took Apple (and later on Microsoft) to popularize it.
And name calling isn't going to change that. Yahoo! was once a company that was leading the pack, not anymore.
I personally don't care who leads the pack - as an end user, I care about who is going to help solve _my_ technology problems without trying to screw me in the process. And right now, Google ranks pretty high on the scale, nothing more. Yahoo! does too, but they've fallen because of their own making.
Let Yahoo! go ahead and innovate - not merely develop cool technology but make people adopt it too, then I'll gladly accept what you say.
And learn to give credit where it is due, doesn't hurt.
In all fairness, I would give Microsoft credit where it's due.
But this is one of those times where they do not deserve it - they own perhaps the world's largest webmail service, and if they were to implement something like this, it would have helped cut down spam by a significant percentage.
They have the power, the resources and the technology. And nobody could have said NO to them, simply because of the number of Hotmail users.
Then why didn't they? Because they simply don't care. And that is what sucks.
Trust me, I'm largely technology agnostic. But sometimes I can't help but question the intentions behind some of MS's actions, or like in this case, the lack of it.
Nobody is going to call you evil for trying to implement a technology that's going to be largely beneficial to everyone. Hell, even right now they can implement it, following Google's example.
But they won't. Why? Because they don't care.
There is a reason why sometimes people consider Microsoft the way they do. And more often than not, they deserve it.
DomainKeys is _not_ that simple. Not just that, it takes an effort (and willingness) on the part of anyone with a mail provider service to go the lengths to implement something like that.
Will it ever catch on? If enough people implement and use it, then yes.
Why not? If Google can grow to be numero uno in free webmail providers, that in itself will be a strong convincing factor.
The thing I like about Google - they do good things which forces other companies to follow them. Take search, for instance. Other companies had such horribly cramped search interfaces and ads, until Google came up with a clean and mean interface.
I'm sure that if Gmail was to pick up momentum, the sheer number of users and need for interoperability would kinda force others to follow suit.
All these other providers had the means and the option, but did not do so. MS has so much funds and Hotmail in itself is responsible for a good chunk of spam - if MS had taken this stance, they could easily force other providers to adopt this technology and help decrease spam in the process.
Funny thing, I read that article and a popup for spyware comes up, defying even Firefox's popup blocker. Ironically, the popup said that the computer has spyware installed.
First off, I'm a HCI major, and I've worked on designing human factors related stuff.
Now, leave everything else - this is simply pointless.
When I go shopping, I just go shopping. I would not bother making a list, e-mailing it them and what not. They forget the human-factors part of it - people will not go to the lengths to do something like this (atleast I won't). These are the same people who find it hard to move their mice up 2 cms to click a button - they're actually going to go to this lengths to do this?
NO WAY.
And usually, when I visit the supermarket, I go in a specific order that I'm used to. As and when I go through the things, I look at what I need to buy and buy it -- it's something that my brain is used to. And people who're used to writing lists, will continue to write lists and strike them off. This new fangled way is just asking for too much effort on the part of the user.
Man, why do they try and throw technology to each and every problem? As though it's a panacea of some sort.
Slashdot Mirror
I had a friend by name Dave, who worked with me at a certain national lab on AI.
;)
He's probably the only guy in AI I know who's praying hard that he's _not_ the the first person to create sentient AI, says he has a feeling that nature would play a cruel joke on him if he ever did.
I wish he does, though. It would be poetic justice
And the worst part? He actually watches Reality Shows.
Maybe I should forward this to him...
You are an idiot.
And the competitors in India and China don't have this certification rubbish.
Any and all electrical and electronic equipment in the US is subject to regulations, whether they are manufactured inhouse or imported - to prevent unwanted and potentially harmful interference.
bureaucratic goverment drones like you impose a mountain of useless paperwork on small businesses.
I happen to be the owner of a small business myself, and I find the regulations to be quite useful and justified, they're the reasons we do not have a million conflicting parts and standards out there.
But a small business is killed by such stuff.
Yes, and people are killed if there were no regulations. Would you rather have someone die because an CD-player interfered with their pacemaker interfered, or would you rather help small businesses "prosper".
Btw, the reason China is providing cheap stuff is because they have little or no laws on labour condition and blatantly practice harmful trade practices like under-pricing. I guess if we could make you work in a sweatshop for 20 hours a day for a pittance, you would be happy?
Get your facts straight before talking through your ass.
(I was not the AC you responded to, but thought I'd reply)
See, the unfortunate thing is that startups are not easy, and the initial investment is really really high. You do have a point - and a very valid one at that. However the fact that it can be abused, and the fact that it could cause more harm than good in the process is why those regulations are in place.
Look at it this way - already all our equipments are made by the lowest bidder in some cheap factory off China or Taiwan.
There is nothing to prevent Toshiba from hiring a bunch of smaller new companies to be exempt of this, why should they spend more and follow the rules when you, the smaller company, do not have to? It would result in more chaos.
The problems that these could cause are genuine - when the equipment in a hospital goes haywire because some of interference from some kid's CD player, killing some poor guy. Imagine those situations and imagine the consequences for the manufacturer and users in terms of damages -- legal, monetary and what not.
You must be a geek, not the business guy. Have you looked at renting vs buying this kind of equipment? It's not like renting office space.
True, but you can have an arrangement with such organizations for providing you with access to such equipment -- at a price, ofcourse. It's not easy, but it is possible. Another thing to do is to tie-up with educational institutions (for instance, my University has an arm to help out startups).
You had said elsewhere that you were not a startup anymore, but a Multi-M$ business. In which case, I'm sure you could help out the smaller businesses in this field by providing them with access to your facilities at a subsidised price, and the like. That way, you win and they win. You get the goodwill (and maybe a stake, and some cash) while the startups get access to facilities and your expertise.
I think that is probably a better solution, especially since the consequences of non-certified equipment can even be fatal.
The thing is, I understand your plight completely.
:)
I run a small startup too, and I know _exactly_ what you are talking about.
However, as an ECE engineer, I must say that it is all probably for a good reason. Interference with devices is a genuine problem not just because it may interfere with the odd radio, but because it may interfere with devices such as medical equipment, pace-makers and the like as well as other critical equipment. These days, electronic equipments and microprocessors are ubiquitous - hell, even my bike has some cool stuff on it. However, this also causes problems in terms of more equipment that are affected by interference and the like.
Compounded with the amount of stuff out there, this may lead to some very genuine problems. Not just a noisy radio, but crashes, accidents, deaths, medical equipment failure and the like.
Who knows, some day there may be a balance that may be stuck. But for the moment, I would side with caution. IMHO, ofcourse
The problem is that while in your particular instance it may seem stiffling to your company, those regulations are in place because not all companies can be trusted to stick with the specs in that case.
It becomes a question of business ethics, and we all know how most companies are when it comes to those. This device probably passes the test, where probably has a probability of 0.00001.
_That_ is why strict regulations are needed, IMHO.
And oh btw, nice players at Slim Devices, quite the coolness.
I'd originally read this on CNet a while ago.
And the (CNet) article points out something of relevance - with so many new devices and what not, our radio spectrum is increasingly becoming very muddled and interference a lot more commonplace. I wonder if existing regulations would do, or if new ones be required.
Something to think about.
And I wonder how powerful that signal must have been to have caused such interference. Either that, or the receiving satellites must be having one hell of a resolution capability.
The latter also provides some food for thought - if their satellite equipment is sensitive enough to find out interfering signals from a Television set, wonder what else they can (and do) eavesdrop
What kind of Tempest attacks do take place, I wonder. Satellite Van Eck Phreaking?
~adjusts tinfoil hat~
I had something else in mind. ;-)
Something a little more *ahem* revealing about the British culture. And stuff.
You know?
Heh.
So much for subscriber preview.
I saw the mistake and mailed dear old Timothy about it, but looks like my mail headed for the trash-can.
Oh well. Strike Grammar Nazis, strike. May the force be with ya'll.
Read this article. Google also endorsed SPF, I do not know what happened.
But you're missing my point.
Even I've come up with a solution to combat spam.
That is not the point - the point is actual implementation. Google is at liberty to implement what serves their needs best.
But why does Microsoft not go ahead and implement it in their systems? The system was introduced in June-July, and the last time I checked, guess which of Microsoft's mail services have SPF implemented? Microsft? Hotmail? MSN? Xbox? Nope.
NONE of the above.
That is the difference - not suggesting new technologies, but going ahead and implementing them so that people adopt. I mean, they are so good at doing that for other things, why not for something useful?
That's what I feel bad about.
I agree.
Overclocking these days is nowhere close to the kind it was. There was another reason for it, too - back then the tech was a lot simpler, and easier to hack up without causing damage.
Although I've not worked on Kaypro, I remember working on the Osbourne 1. It used the Z-80 too, but the 4 MHz version. I had a cousin who used to do stuff like overclocking and coding on it, and he had got one a lot later to hack it up.
I remember that as being one of my earliest inspirations.
I think the Z-80 was probably Zilog's best ever microprocessor. I don't think they came up with anything after that. Wonder why.
Yup, agreed.
;)
And nothing's better than a story on that being posted by someone with the name RaD Man [ACiD] =)
_And_ his website is called DarkDomain.
COOL!
Now, all that's left is a link to VCL and some ASCII pr0n
It's one thing to come up with technology, it's another to use it in a way that is beneficial.
Additionally, Yahoo! is working with Sendmail to develop a DomainKey implementation for their popular MTA (both the commercial and freeware versions).
While other comanies are still working, Google has already started signing their outgoing mails. Developing new solutions is only the beginning, implementing them and fostering adaptation is the hard part.
Xerox came up with the UI, it took Apple (and later on Microsoft) to popularize it.
And name calling isn't going to change that. Yahoo! was once a company that was leading the pack, not anymore.
I personally don't care who leads the pack - as an end user, I care about who is going to help solve _my_ technology problems without trying to screw me in the process. And right now, Google ranks pretty high on the scale, nothing more. Yahoo! does too, but they've fallen because of their own making.
Let Yahoo! go ahead and innovate - not merely develop cool technology but make people adopt it too, then I'll gladly accept what you say.
And learn to give credit where it is due, doesn't hurt.
In all fairness, I would give Microsoft credit where it's due.
But this is one of those times where they do not deserve it - they own perhaps the world's largest webmail service, and if they were to implement something like this, it would have helped cut down spam by a significant percentage.
They have the power, the resources and the technology. And nobody could have said NO to them, simply because of the number of Hotmail users.
Then why didn't they? Because they simply don't care. And that is what sucks.
Trust me, I'm largely technology agnostic. But sometimes I can't help but question the intentions behind some of MS's actions, or like in this case, the lack of it.
Nobody is going to call you evil for trying to implement a technology that's going to be largely beneficial to everyone. Hell, even right now they can implement it, following Google's example.
But they won't. Why? Because they don't care.
There is a reason why sometimes people consider Microsoft the way they do. And more often than not, they deserve it.
Brimming with optimism, are we?
:p
Good day for it too, oh yes indeed!
Come on mods, the parent was on topic and funny.
DomainKeys is _not_ that simple. Not just that, it takes an effort (and willingness) on the part of anyone with a mail provider service to go the lengths to implement something like that.
Especially a free provider like Google.
Someone mod parent up, please.
Will it ever catch on? If enough people implement and use it, then yes.
Why not? If Google can grow to be numero uno in free webmail providers, that in itself will be a strong convincing factor.
The thing I like about Google - they do good things which forces other companies to follow them. Take search, for instance. Other companies had such horribly cramped search interfaces and ads, until Google came up with a clean and mean interface.
Now everyone - Yahoo!, Altavista, MSN Search - follow's Google's example.
I'm sure that if Gmail was to pick up momentum, the sheer number of users and need for interoperability would kinda force others to follow suit.
All these other providers had the means and the option, but did not do so. MS has so much funds and Hotmail in itself is responsible for a good chunk of spam - if MS had taken this stance, they could easily force other providers to adopt this technology and help decrease spam in the process.
But no.
_This_ is why I like Google. Way to go, guys.
That's exactly what I was talking about, you retard.
The Microsoft look and feel image that popped up said that the computer had spyware.
D'oh. What an idiot.
Funny thing, I read that article and a popup for spyware comes up, defying even Firefox's popup blocker. Ironically, the popup said that the computer has spyware installed.
Eh.
Actually, Satellites crashing may not be a bad idea.
I could sell one of these things off ebay and buy me some sweet loving.
But I suspect that in China, the only sweet lovin' I'd get would be from them gubmint men in red.
Those are _my_ opinions based on my experience.
*shrug*
It's not like am offering my professional opinon on Slashdot. Those were personal statements, nothing more.
Get a life.
Not that I know of.
I know several people in my school who work with wearable computing, and wear this stuff 24/7.
If anything, it seems quite useful and consequently, addictive.
I already have a professor who has been doing that for a while now.
Well, look at it this way.
;)
All the chicks will hear it out loud and know you for the man you are
First off, I'm a HCI major, and I've worked on designing human factors related stuff.
Now, leave everything else - this is simply pointless.
When I go shopping, I just go shopping. I would not bother making a list, e-mailing it them and what not. They forget the human-factors part of it - people will not go to the lengths to do something like this (atleast I won't). These are the same people who find it hard to move their mice up 2 cms to click a button - they're actually going to go to this lengths to do this?
NO WAY.
And usually, when I visit the supermarket, I go in a specific order that I'm used to. As and when I go through the things, I look at what I need to buy and buy it -- it's something that my brain is used to. And people who're used to writing lists, will continue to write lists and strike them off. This new fangled way is just asking for too much effort on the part of the user.
Man, why do they try and throw technology to each and every problem? As though it's a panacea of some sort.
But... but....yoosa not tell us who shot first? :-(