OK lets take a look at quotes from theregister article
"we checked it with Netscape 6 on Windows, and got in without trouble".
And it's not the web site, it's the digital certificates that cause problems
"Please note that if you wish to enrol for services that require a digital certificate, you may not be able to use the full range of browsers listed above. For example, Equifax certificates can currently only be used with Internet Explorer 5.01 or later (they do not work on any version of the Netscape browser); ChamberSign certificates can be used with both Nestcape Navigator and Internet Explorer, except they are not currently supported on version 6 of the Netscape browser. Please check your certificate provider's web site for more information about which browsers they support."
As for saying you can't do your tax return on-line in Netscape? Bollocks. It uses straight HTTPS. I've just completed mine.
Did any of you think to check for yourselves? I doubt it, you just saw "it was written by Microsoft" and your knees starting jerking.
No you're not. Only if you connect via BT. I'm using Easynet's ethernet offering, with a nice range of 16 IP addresses, with 4 PCs hooked up to it.
Mind you it is more expensive:)
>"Any job that expects you to carry a pager for freee, even if you are salary, is bullshitting you."
I had a pleasent shock with my job. Offically I do tech R&D, but as part of that involves speccing the networks and new large servers for clients I tended to monitor the hosting as well. Couple of weeks ago our hosting firm fucked the routing table for 4 of our cages, and 2 clients dropped off the face of the net for a while. We do have 24x7 support staff in 3 shifts at the hosting facility, but they weren't consultsed, the hosting people's excuse being that they didn't know enough about the overall infrastructure. After a lot fo shouting the hosting rabble are now told to call me should they ever want to change anything like this again, and because it's not going to happen often, and I'm well enough paid to simply play with toys, I was happy enough.
My boss emailed me once he found out about this offering £100 for each call, plus 1.5x/2x my equivilant hourly rate should I have to go to the hosting company, or spend any amount of time dealing with their little queries or fuckups. And he's putting ADSL in at my house, just in case:)
*sigh* I worked on the second incarnation of the Tesco web site. They gave me 1 month to do the interface and the ASP behind it, and requested that IE4 was the minimum browser, with *no* fall through. They're not the most internet aware of companies, despite me trying to educate them. Looks like it hasn;t improved in the last couple of years
Announcing it is rather different to releasing it. Having worked with the telecos, as it's part of my job, then current test implementations of GPRS are nowhere near 64k, more like 14.4, and in certain cases the base stations are drawing so much power, they catch fire (thanks Seimens).
GPRS is nothing more than hype right now, it your speed is never guareented.
Ah this I did forget *grin* However I seem to remember the Orcale machine costing in the millions of dollars, and the MS box costing just under $1 million.
It's amusing to hear US netizens complain about the spam cost, when some of us end up paying per second to download this crap.
I get spam in 3 ways,
From addresses harvested from web sites
From idiots who sign up to unverified lists
with one of my domain names, like idunno.org and the lists don't check (McAffee is the main culprit for this, they don't even answer my complaints, at least Microsoft Benelux answered and changed their list policy, and the apology came from the marketing director)
Spam from very very old lists when I used to use Usenet with a legitamate address, which was years ago
It's all bloody annoying, it all costs me, and worst of all, 99% of it is US centric. If there was a way to call US 800 numbers from the UK I'd use it to let them know exactly what I think, but instead I'm reduced to tracing it back when I can (Work uses Notes, which strips all the headers).
It is an annoyance, but pressing the delete key isn't enough, it still costs me and my ISP and the ISP it was sent through. Until ISPs themselves see the cost it's not going to stop.
You'd think so wouldn't you? But after Demon's stupidity with the Usenet ruling thats no longer the case. At the moment the legal position in the UK is rather vague, there's no such status as the US common carrier, and I can't blame ISPs for being very very touchy right now.
One of the two remaining is in the reception of the Foreign and Commonwealth Office in Whitehall. Not the most easy to see, but I do enjoy staring at it on the rare occasions I'm called there to tweak one of our systems.
Except geographically, GB is different to UK. It's Great Britain and Northern Ireland, so if you want to push us back to GB you will need a Northern Ireland domain.
We're had problems in the UK with Compuserve and AOL banning Scunthorpe (letters 2-5 are the key), then there's Cockermouth and so-on. The problem doesn't lie with the words, it lies with idiotic filters.
You seriously consider command.com and end user application? Or bash for that matter?
Can we define end user here? Personally I think it's different for Linux than it is for Windows.
Command line is all very well, but it's no good for my mother when she wants to type a letter telling me I forgot her birthday again.
For linux to become friendlier to the masses, we need a standard, open, user-friendly GUI. Correct, but then you quote vi and bash as better examples of their Windows equivilants, along with development versions of shells. Personally, this to me indicates that us techies still don't think about the end user, the end user doesn't want command lines, they want something they can switch on, use *easily* and switch off. Unforunately with the mindshare Windows has, in the minds of the end users, it wins.
Zealots bitching off about Microsoft's size/influence, or how Linux is free, or how configurable it is, or how the source code is available will not conver my mother over. Being able to load Word and Excel and get her email easily will.
The moderation on slashdot bears out a lot of the problems that poor author had. If you dare to point out any problems with Linux there's always some zealot ready to scream you down. Thats not they way we should be going, we should be *listening* and not *shouting*.
(Sitting back waiting to see how this gets moderated *grin*)
99.9% of the time I'm on an M$ OS on an X86. I've had the (dis)pleasure of using Plug&Pray devices, manually configuring DIPs (I'll take that anyday), Trying to get DOOM ][ to work properly with my USR 14400 (stupid connection strings) etc..., Bloatware installing crap & breaking things (See DLL Hell @ M$) Umpteen servicepacks from M$, Hotfixes galore AND different behaviour between software packages on the WIN platform.
But it's *exactly* the same under Linux. Why should the user have to recompile the kernel to stop security problems? Where does the user go get the kernel from? Why should the user have to go hunt for USB drivers, modem drives, sound card drivers? Why should the user have to twiddle with lots of config files to get X to run on a pretty standard card? (Guess why I did last week)
Linux is not an end user operating system. Until it gets to the stage where I can give my brother in law a Linux CD, it installs itself, configures itself, allows my sister to write her thesis in Microsoft Word format, without having to learn a new interface, allows him to connect to an ISP *easily* without me having to do it for him and has an update mechanism which is as easy to use a windowsupdate.microsoft.com it's not going to make inroads into consumer space.
What regular Joe user can track all of that themselves? Why should they?? I am regularly approached by one non-techie friend in particular wondering why "I can't get my new [device]to work in Windows" or, "[device/software] won't work anymore".
And you've never had this in Linux? Why doesn't my USB scanner work? Why doesn't my sound card work? Why doesn't my mouse work if I plug it into a switcher box? These aren't questions I've been asked from Windows users.
You what? So you're saying that because Gates is coupling up with Branson that every ecommerce site will check that you're on a Windows box, and if you're not, reject your order?
Can I have some of your drugs please?
Using a UK example, this is the same sort of thinking Marks and Spencer had when they refused to take any credit card except their own ChargeCard. Look where they got with that. I can't believe you think any retailer would be that stupid. Optimisation for browsing through Windows I might believe, but Windows only. Come on, that's just paranoia.
Slashdot Mirror
OK lets take a look at quotes from theregister article "we checked it with Netscape 6 on Windows, and got in without trouble". And it's not the web site, it's the digital certificates that cause problems "Please note that if you wish to enrol for services that require a digital certificate, you may not be able to use the full range of browsers listed above. For example, Equifax certificates can currently only be used with Internet Explorer 5.01 or later (they do not work on any version of the Netscape browser); ChamberSign certificates can be used with both Nestcape Navigator and Internet Explorer, except they are not currently supported on version 6 of the Netscape browser. Please check your certificate provider's web site for more information about which browsers they support." As for saying you can't do your tax return on-line in Netscape? Bollocks. It uses straight HTTPS. I've just completed mine. Did any of you think to check for yourselves? I doubt it, you just saw "it was written by Microsoft" and your knees starting jerking.
Windows executables have a version block as well. Right click, choose properties and if it's well written, there it is.
No you're not. Only if you connect via BT. I'm using Easynet's ethernet offering, with a nice range of 16 IP addresses, with 4 PCs hooked up to it. Mind you it is more expensive :)
1 language?
There were more, but I can't find the URL at home
TPS allows you to register on-line as well, and give links to the Fax Preference Service, and the UK DMA.
I had a pleasent shock with my job. Offically I do tech R&D, but as part of that involves speccing the networks and new large servers for clients I tended to monitor the hosting as well. Couple of weeks ago our hosting firm fucked the routing table for 4 of our cages, and 2 clients dropped off the face of the net for a while. We do have 24x7 support staff in 3 shifts at the hosting facility, but they weren't consultsed, the hosting people's excuse being that they didn't know enough about the overall infrastructure. After a lot fo shouting the hosting rabble are now told to call me should they ever want to change anything like this again, and because it's not going to happen often, and I'm well enough paid to simply play with toys, I was happy enough.
My boss emailed me once he found out about this offering £100 for each call, plus 1.5x/2x my equivilant hourly rate should I have to go to the hosting company, or spend any amount of time dealing with their little queries or fuckups. And he's putting ADSL in at my house, just in case :)
Ah but what can you do when the customer is always wrong?
Errr bollocks, Sainsburys
*sigh* I worked on the second incarnation of the Tesco web site. They gave me 1 month to do the interface and the ASP behind it, and requested that IE4 was the minimum browser, with *no* fall through. They're not the most internet aware of companies, despite me trying to educate them. Looks like it hasn;t improved in the last couple of years
(So no, not really, as long as you can keep it all seperate)
- Windows 95, IE 3, Netscape 3 - No flash/shockwave
- Windows NT, IE 4, Netscape 4 - Flash as part of the defaulr IE install
- Windows 98, IE5
- Win 2k, IE5.5 and the latest Mozilla/Netscape builds
Oh and I have lynx on a couple of the old Solaris boxes, along with the W3C validator on my Linux server.Now the deisgners here have *NO* excuse
Announcing it is rather different to releasing it. Having worked with the telecos, as it's part of my job, then current test implementations of GPRS are nowhere near 64k, more like 14.4, and in certain cases the base stations are drawing so much power, they catch fire (thanks Seimens).
GPRS is nothing more than hype right now, it your speed is never guareented.
Ah this I did forget *grin* However I seem to remember the Orcale machine costing in the millions of dollars, and the MS box costing just under $1 million.
Now this was the benchmark that Ellison was saying "Beat us and we'll give you cash" on, yet when MS did it, he didn't pay *grin*
For TPC-H see http://www.tpc.org/new_result/h-ttperf.i dc (although perhaps Orcale hasn't submitted any).
For an explanation of the TPC-C benchmark see http://www.tpc.org/faq_TPCC.html.
Satisfied?
Then again blink and layer are in the W3c specs are they? And they didn't come from Microsoft ...
It's amusing to hear US netizens complain about the spam cost, when some of us end up paying per second to download this crap.
I get spam in 3 ways,
It's all bloody annoying, it all costs me, and worst of all, 99% of it is US centric. If there was a way to call US 800 numbers from the UK I'd use it to let them know exactly what I think, but instead I'm reduced to tracing it back when I can (Work uses Notes, which strips all the headers).
It is an annoyance, but pressing the delete key isn't enough, it still costs me and my ISP and the ISP it was sent through. Until ISPs themselves see the cost it's not going to stop.
You'd think so wouldn't you? But after Demon's stupidity with the Usenet ruling thats no longer the case. At the moment the legal position in the UK is rather vague, there's no such status as the US common carrier, and I can't blame ISPs for being very very touchy right now.
One of the two remaining is in the reception of the Foreign and Commonwealth Office in Whitehall. Not the most easy to see, but I do enjoy staring at it on the rare occasions I'm called there to tweak one of our systems.
Except geographically, GB is different to UK. It's Great Britain and Northern Ireland, so if you want to push us back to GB you will need a Northern Ireland domain.
We're had problems in the UK with Compuserve and AOL banning Scunthorpe (letters 2-5 are the key), then there's Cockermouth and so-on. The problem doesn't lie with the words, it lies with idiotic filters.
You seriously consider command.com and end user application? Or bash for that matter?
Can we define end user here? Personally I think it's different for Linux than it is for Windows.
Command line is all very well, but it's no good for my mother when she wants to type a letter telling me I forgot her birthday again.
For linux to become friendlier to the masses, we need a standard, open, user-friendly GUI. Correct, but then you quote vi and bash as better examples of their Windows equivilants, along with development versions of shells. Personally, this to me indicates that us techies still don't think about the end user, the end user doesn't want command lines, they want something they can switch on, use *easily* and switch off. Unforunately with the mindshare Windows has, in the minds of the end users, it wins.
Zealots bitching off about Microsoft's size/influence, or how Linux is free, or how configurable it is, or how the source code is available will not conver my mother over. Being able to load Word and Excel and get her email easily will.
The moderation on slashdot bears out a lot of the problems that poor author had. If you dare to point out any problems with Linux there's always some zealot ready to scream you down. Thats not they way we should be going, we should be *listening* and not *shouting*.
(Sitting back waiting to see how this gets moderated *grin*)
99.9% of the time I'm on an M$ OS on an X86. I've had the (dis)pleasure of using Plug&Pray devices, manually configuring DIPs (I'll take that anyday), Trying to get DOOM ][ to work properly with my USR 14400 (stupid connection strings) etc..., Bloatware installing crap & breaking things (See DLL Hell @ M$) Umpteen servicepacks from M$, Hotfixes galore AND different behaviour between software packages on the WIN platform.
But it's *exactly* the same under Linux. Why should the user have to recompile the kernel to stop security problems? Where does the user go get the kernel from? Why should the user have to go hunt for USB drivers, modem drives, sound card drivers? Why should the user have to twiddle with lots of config files to get X to run on a pretty standard card? (Guess why I did last week)
Linux is not an end user operating system. Until it gets to the stage where I can give my brother in law a Linux CD, it installs itself, configures itself, allows my sister to write her thesis in Microsoft Word format, without having to learn a new interface, allows him to connect to an ISP *easily* without me having to do it for him and has an update mechanism which is as easy to use a windowsupdate.microsoft.com it's not going to make inroads into consumer space.
What regular Joe user can track all of that themselves? Why should they?? I am regularly approached by one non-techie friend in particular wondering why "I can't get my new [device]to work in Windows" or, "[device/software] won't work anymore".
And you've never had this in Linux? Why doesn't my USB scanner work? Why doesn't my sound card work? Why doesn't my mouse work if I plug it into a switcher box? These aren't questions I've been asked from Windows users.
Aren't they just being forced to off load Orange if the Mannesmann deal goes through? Thats not the same as selling the main Vodafone network
You're taking a Novell advisory as unbiased? When they're pushing NDS against ActiveDirectory?
You what? So you're saying that because Gates is coupling up with Branson that every ecommerce site will check that you're on a Windows box, and if you're not, reject your order?
Can I have some of your drugs please?
Using a UK example, this is the same sort of thinking Marks and Spencer had when they refused to take any credit card except their own ChargeCard. Look where they got with that. I can't believe you think any retailer would be that stupid. Optimisation for browsing through Windows I might believe, but Windows only. Come on, that's just paranoia.