Hum....10 hours a day programming....another 5-6 on my own time...get paid pretty well for it...nope not a programmer...fortran LOL...yeah I give my boss shit for programming in fortran. The programm I am working on at home is about 30,000 lines. (not millions...I am by myself), all C++, full integrated CADD programm complete with scripting langauge and IDE. Not a mathemetician, you are right, but my lively hood is based on mathmatics...pretty sure I know quite a bit of math....suprised you would say this after completing a quantum class.
"Chances are you aren't trained to design efficient algorithms "
Hum lets see 4 books on CS algorithms and two Computational gemoetry books on the shelf..I might know a thing about it...not from the books mind you, but experience. Everything I do is dependand upon speed. So yes I know quite a bit about algorithms....and I often times write code to run on SSE registers as well as parallel computing.
"ta reduction from monomorphic dispatch devirtualization" You are correct...I have no clue what that is.
Also I don't think a 16 year old can learn what it takes to be a great algorithm programmer. But they can learn a shit load of the basics and aquire some hands on experience...that really was my point...With prgramming anyone can read the books, but you are quite right. It takes years to become well versed in the art. Taking an algorithms class in college does not make one great at algorithms...years of experience and trial and error help one learn when and were to apply what algorithm. So yeah you are right someone "anyone" with a couple of years of experience (most CS grads straight out of school) is not gonna be the same caliber as someone who has done it for years. there are aspects of what you do that I wouldn't understand...probably be very frustrated at the development cycles that you guy's/gals must go through...It is necassary for you on those large projects...but to think that I can't program on your level becuase I am not a CS grad. LOL...that truely is funny.
Cost of living can very well go down...I would bet my life that you will see this happen in silicon valley, boston and LA.
You are right my number 2 point is not gonna help anyone right now, but then the world doesn't revolve around right now.
I also have a job that I consider to be mostly safe...I to am single with a small financial burnden...I won a duplex and rent out half of it....perhaps others should do the same. I honestly do feel bad for those with 3 kids and no jobs. Perhaps people should be more aware of their financial burdens before they have three kids???
Also I don't want them to retrain...if they are truely good at it then you and I...both fresh out of school be promptly loosing our jobs!
These people did invest their whole lives...but then people invest in lots of things and lose it. Don't get me wrong. I wish everyone could be gauranteed a great life...but there are no guarnatees in this world.
ah...yeah...go get a job framing houses or something...anyone with half-assed people skills can earn a descent salary. Quit bitching and do something. Start a company. Get specialized in an area that is hard to outource and program in that area.
Well I work as a computational chemist....I do all my own design, analysis and programming. yep I have an itch I scratch it. I have been programming since I was about 6 and I am 30 now. Yeah I do other things at my job and the programming is value added....but then It would be very hard to grab a CS student from from any where and expect him to do quantum chemisty programming. You see standard programming is a commodity...hell I could program as well as half the CS students at the college I attended when I was 13. For me programming is only a tool. I love algorithm design and analysis, but it is an ends to a means. I would never do contract programming work for another company...do damned boring. I need it all the design and implementation.
People when your skill can be learned by a sixteen year old who has access to a computer with an internet connection it is time to realize that the barrier to entry is very small...this results in price wars ala...lowered programming wages.
I do feel bad and I think out sourcing should stop...but I also think that good coders are here to stay. yeah $100,000 HTML coders are a think of the past...as they should be. There are plenty of programming jobs that are still in this country.
I am sure that I have pissed a lot of people off and I assure you I meant no harm or disrespect.
I think that with your attitude you will do quite well. Love what you do. Have pasion for it. Yes you will find work. For me finding a specialized area is what worked I have a PhD in medicinal chemsitry, but I have programmed computers since the commadore 64 days. Now I write cool code (ok cool to me) to solve some really tough computational chemistry problems. I think that people who continue to only write code for "whatever" project is thrown at them will be outsourced. But those who become very specialized in a particular area....AI, aerospace, robotics, etc... will do will I think.
I need to correct myself. I wrote: "OO langauges are far far superior to procedural langauges"
I meant to say that OO langauges are superior for GUI development. Sorry for starting a flamewar here....I guess I was a little cranky last night. So I apologize to the original poster for being a prick.
"You may find it interesting to know that a number of companies actually request that Trolltech does not publish the fact they're using Qt, because they see Qt as an essential competitive advantage they don't want the competition to be made aware of."
Glad I don't work for a company as out of touch as that....However I like you found it very easy to get my compnay to spring for a QT license.
"KDE, being based on Qt is pretty much limited to C++ and closely related OO crap"
You certainly showed your ignorance here....sheesh...Even most die hard C fans...I am one...know good and god *&^% well that OO langauges are far far superior to procedural langauges...not saying you can't do all the same things, just saying from a "design to implementaion time" perspective it is a total blow out.
I hope you fo to jail the next time you do anything that is even remotely wrong...instead of breaking into a long rant i will just tell you flat out that you are totally pathetic.
couldn't have said it better myself.....I date a librarian and we debate/argue this all the time....I love books...she loves books....be the next generation or two will not feel this same dependance that we have.
I agree with you much. I am dating a librarian and we have these duscusions/arguments regularly.
I believe that out generation and perhaps one more will be dependant upon books...but future generations will likely not feel so inclined towards a book.
Man...I missed it. I really really really want one of these! If you find it in your kind heart could you send one of those links to jrflnx@yahoo.com PLEASE!!!!!
"Who says you have this 'right' to make money in any way you please?"
I won't disagree with this statment. Perhaps we use the "right" in slightly different ways. I agree that pretty much the only thing we have the right to is life. However in modern society (granted isn't the best) we earn our keep by doing things that are productive or useful for other people. Musicians provide an entertainment service much like a bar or restaurant. No one would assume that a restaruant/bar should be free....so why should a musician give everything away for free.
BTW I wasn't saying that I didn't think that the record companies couldn't stanbd to change. I was however saying that musicians have a "right" to make money off what they do. If enough people disagree with me then the musicians will either do it for free or quit because noone will buy their albums.
"This is known as a changing business model, and the music industry will have to adapt to freely available copies of their music."
Will they? It would be nice...but are you sure that they will...perhaps it wil be the musicians that will ultimiately quit using the record labels to promote their music...or scary still perhaps we will wage a "war" on music piracy like our dumb asses did on drugs...perhaps music theft is the gateway drug..LOL (Nany Regan would be proud!)
You are right....everyone should demand zero salaries. Athletes, scientists, programmers, artisists, musicians. Anyone with talent that thinks they should be paid for that should be crucified...and while on the subject of relgion...religous people should do it for free as well. Oh fuck it...everything should be free. The whole world should operate like a giagantic start trek movie.
Dude...go some where and get a clue. Once you have clue...feel free to jump back into the game of life. People have a right to make money of talents and work. Some of us play music because we just love it...but trueth is. If we were good enough to make a million bucks playing music then we would all jump at the opportunity. You don't like musicians making money...quit listenting to music.
"That being said, I feel it's important to note that what needs evaluating isn't the violation of copyright, rather, the purpose and effect of copyright itself."
Wow...proof that intelligence does exsist on planet slashdot.
Amen. Lets quit amending the damned laws and start rethinking what their real purpose is.
Slashdot Mirror
Hum....10 hours a day programming....another 5-6 on my own time...get paid pretty well for it...nope not a programmer...fortran LOL...yeah I give my boss shit for programming in fortran. The programm I am working on at home is about 30,000 lines. (not millions...I am by myself), all C++, full integrated CADD programm complete with scripting langauge and IDE. Not a mathemetician, you are right, but my lively hood is based on mathmatics...pretty sure I know quite a bit of math....suprised you would say this after completing a quantum class.
"Chances are you aren't trained to design efficient algorithms "
Hum lets see 4 books on CS algorithms and two Computational gemoetry books on the shelf..I might know a thing about it...not from the books mind you, but experience. Everything I do is dependand upon speed. So yes I know quite a bit about algorithms....and I often times write code to run on SSE registers as well as parallel computing.
"ta reduction from monomorphic dispatch devirtualization"
You are correct...I have no clue what that is.
Also I don't think a 16 year old can learn what it takes to be a great algorithm programmer. But they can learn a shit load of the basics and aquire some hands on experience...that really was my point...With prgramming anyone can read the books, but you are quite right. It takes years to become well versed in the art. Taking an algorithms class in college does not make one great at algorithms...years of experience and trial and error help one learn when and were to apply what algorithm. So yeah you are right someone "anyone" with a couple of years of experience (most CS grads straight out of school) is not gonna be the same caliber as someone who has done it for years. there are aspects of what you do that I wouldn't understand...probably be very frustrated at the development cycles that you guy's/gals must go through...It is necassary for you on those large projects...but to think that I can't program on your level becuase I am not a CS grad. LOL...that truely is funny.
Your points on re-training are well taken.
..I to am single with a small financial burnden...I won a duplex and rent out half of it....perhaps others should do the same. I honestly do feel bad for those with 3 kids and no jobs. Perhaps people should be more aware of their financial burdens before they have three kids???
Cost of living can very well go down...I would bet my life that you will see this happen in silicon valley, boston and LA.
You are right my number 2 point is not gonna help anyone right now, but then the world doesn't revolve around right now.
I also have a job that I consider to be mostly safe.
Also I don't want them to retrain...if they are truely good at it then you and I...both fresh out of school be promptly loosing our jobs!
These people did invest their whole lives...but then people invest in lots of things and lose it. Don't get me wrong. I wish everyone could be gauranteed a great life...but there are no guarnatees in this world.
Or perhaps that cost of living will either:
1) Go down in this country so that we can again compete.
2) Sit still and wait for the rest of the world to catch up...so again we can still compete.
And yes you can retrain...remeber you are a smart CS student right? Aren't you smarter than most of the other college people?
Nice jackass...way to build those foreigh relations.
Smart man. But there are plenty of places were OSS does not compete....yet!
ah...yeah...go get a job framing houses or something...anyone with half-assed people skills can earn a descent salary. Quit bitching and do something. Start a company. Get specialized in an area that is hard to outource and program in that area.
Well I work as a computational chemist....I do all my own design, analysis and programming. yep I have an itch I scratch it. I have been programming since I was about 6 and I am 30 now. Yeah I do other things at my job and the programming is value added....but then It would be very hard to grab a CS student from from any where and expect him to do quantum chemisty programming. You see standard programming is a commodity...hell I could program as well as half the CS students at the college I attended when I was 13. For me programming is only a tool. I love algorithm design and analysis, but it is an ends to a means. I would never do contract programming work for another company...do damned boring. I need it all the design and implementation.
People when your skill can be learned by a sixteen year old who has access to a computer with an internet connection it is time to realize that the barrier to entry is very small...this results in price wars ala...lowered programming wages.
I do feel bad and I think out sourcing should stop...but I also think that good coders are here to stay. yeah $100,000 HTML coders are a think of the past...as they should be. There are plenty of programming jobs that are still in this country.
I am sure that I have pissed a lot of people off and I assure you I meant no harm or disrespect.
Flame on
I think that with your attitude you will do quite well. Love what you do. Have pasion for it. Yes you will find work. For me finding a specialized area is what worked I have a PhD in medicinal chemsitry, but I have programmed computers since the commadore 64 days. Now I write cool code (ok cool to me) to solve some really tough computational chemistry problems. I think that people who continue to only write code for "whatever" project is thrown at them will be outsourced. But those who become very specialized in a particular area....AI, aerospace, robotics, etc... will do will I think.
Good luck to you!
LOL yeah one Nissan Plant close to Jackson Mississippi! lol.
I need to correct myself. I wrote:
"OO langauges are far far superior to procedural langauges"
I meant to say that OO langauges are superior for GUI development. Sorry for starting a flamewar here....I guess I was a little cranky last night. So I apologize to the original poster for being a prick.
"You may find it interesting to know that a number of companies actually request that Trolltech does not publish the fact they're using Qt, because they see Qt as an essential competitive advantage they don't want the competition to be made aware of."
Glad I don't work for a company as out of touch as that....However I like you found it very easy to get my compnay to spring for a QT license.
"KDE, being based on Qt is pretty much limited to C++ and closely related OO crap"
You certainly showed your ignorance here....sheesh...Even most die hard C fans...I am one...know good and god *&^% well that OO langauges are far far superior to procedural langauges...not saying you can't do all the same things, just saying from a "design to implementaion time" perspective it is a total blow out.
Since I have not moderator points I will fake a moderation:
DORK -10
Quit with the dumbass soviet rossia jokes already. Sheesh
I will match your timecube and raise you $10,000.
I hope you fo to jail the next time you do anything that is even remotely wrong...instead of breaking into a long rant i will just tell you flat out that you are totally pathetic.
couldn't have said it better myself.....I date a librarian and we debate/argue this all the time....I love books...she loves books....be the next generation or two will not feel this same dependance that we have.
IMHO PDA's are still way to small to be of any use to me.
I agree with you much. I am dating a librarian and we have these duscusions/arguments regularly.
I believe that out generation and perhaps one more will be dependant upon books...but future generations will likely not feel so inclined towards a book.
Man...I missed it. I really really really want one of these! If you find it in your kind heart could you send one of those links to jrflnx@yahoo.com PLEASE!!!!!
Thanks either way.
I could care less about GMAIL until I can have an account
"Who says you have this 'right' to make money in any way you please?"
I won't disagree with this statment. Perhaps we use the "right" in slightly different ways. I agree that pretty much the only thing we have the right to is life. However in modern society (granted isn't the best) we earn our keep by doing things that are productive or useful for other people. Musicians provide an entertainment service much like a bar or restaurant. No one would assume that a restaruant/bar should be free....so why should a musician give everything away for free.
BTW I wasn't saying that I didn't think that the record companies couldn't stanbd to change. I was however saying that musicians have a "right" to make money off what they do. If enough people disagree with me then the musicians will either do it for free or quit because noone will buy their albums.
"This is known as a changing business model, and the music industry will have to adapt to freely available copies of their music."
Will they? It would be nice...but are you sure that they will...perhaps it wil be the musicians that will ultimiately quit using the record labels to promote their music...or scary still perhaps we will wage a "war" on music piracy like our dumb asses did on drugs...perhaps music theft is the gateway drug..LOL (Nany Regan would be proud!)
Cheers.
-John
You are right....everyone should demand zero salaries. Athletes, scientists, programmers, artisists, musicians. Anyone with talent that thinks they should be paid for that should be crucified...and while on the subject of relgion...religous people should do it for free as well. Oh fuck it...everything should be free. The whole world should operate like a giagantic start trek movie.
Dude...go some where and get a clue. Once you have clue...feel free to jump back into the game of life. People have a right to make money of talents and work. Some of us play music because we just love it...but trueth is. If we were good enough to make a million bucks playing music then we would all jump at the opportunity. You don't like musicians making money...quit listenting to music.
LOL yeah right. If you were a big enough linux person for microsft to sue don't you think you would at least have a slashdot name?
This has to be false. How can you sue someone for switching OS's?
I did a quick search on google and turned up nothing...but you never know.
"That being said, I feel it's important to note that what needs evaluating isn't the violation of copyright, rather, the purpose and effect of copyright itself."
Wow...proof that intelligence does exsist on planet slashdot.
Amen. Lets quit amending the damned laws and start rethinking what their real purpose is.