While E has gone to E17(still beta), it's not replacing X11 yet.
I liked E when I last looked at it, but I didn't know it was intended as a potential replacement for X. How portable is E? Can it drive an RS6000, an ancient SunOS box, Macs, DECTerms,...?
And how exactly does remote X with a modern UI toolkit differ from VNC?
Holy crap; you really don't get "client server".
I want "my program" to be running on the honking biggest and fastest box to which I have access. I want that process to display its results on the dinky, pathetic little thing in front of me that I have to use to tell it to do that. I don't want that dinky, pathetic, under-powered and poorly implemented piece of crap in my hand to have to do any more than it absolutely has to, because it sucks at even that!
Play around with "ssh -X" for a few days and get back to us. VNC, Jeebus.
The fact that some people have better tolerances than others is not license for greater mistreatment of those people.
You're not thinking like a tyrant (to your credit:-). If you were, you'd notice that some of your victims have very little difficulty handling the punishments you're meeting out, so you need to step up your game and come up with really intolerable punishments. Sweden's definition of solitary sounds damned near idyllic compared to some of the environments I've experienced, and I've read and heard about far worse ones (ie. Cambodia under the Khmer Rouge, or Solzhenitsyn's Gulag Archipelago).
As for rape, consider the life of a brothel slave of the Romans in Herculaneum, prior to Vesuvius' eruption. Death would have been considered a precious gift from Heaven.
I now tend to automatically roll my eyes whenever I hear an opensource community mention "rewrite" or "replacement".
They mean it doesn't look enough like Win* or Macs. Just be thankful you don't have to use it (as opposed to when the same's done on Win* & Macs). "apt-get install fluxbox..."
Oh and those legacy cruft ridden bits of code which you don't use and are paged out onto disk are actually taking up positively kilobytes of RAM which make my Sun 3/60 really REALLY slow.
[Is this sarcasm? Or am I even slower than I think I am this morning?] Well, there's your problem! Geez, Sun video has *always* sucked (I once owned a U30). When I was first playing around with Linux on an i486 peecee, then was introduced to a current Sun workstation, I couldn't believe how pathetic it was. Max eight colors, or something?!? Are you kidding me?!? The crappy video artifacts brought out by Linux & *BSD on Sun hardware was pathetic.
I must admit, I'm a bit confused reading this thread at the moment (it's early for me; I was up late). However, who could possibly care that a terminal is slow? I've never seen my CPU spike trying to dump chars to a screen or scroll its contents. The stuff I run from that CLI spikes the CPU; not *rxvt, not xterm,...
For me, whether I use *rxvt or xterm depends on what I'm running in it, and how that looks in *rxvt vs. xterm, and no, I don't kanything, and gterm is just insulting (yeah, prejudiced wrt both, sorry).
Theres so much legacy garbage in the current X protocol that just wastes resources and makes it nearly impossible to maintain.
I've heard much the same thing said about rxvt vs. xterm. I like xterm, and its devs have done brilliant stuff over the years keeping it relevant, fast, and working. rxvt does 99.999% of what xterm does, and does it well (except for corner cases).
I guess all of the X11 developers that are the ones developing Wayland don't understand X11 that well.
"Don't understand X11 that well", I don't know (though I'd doubt they don't understand X). As for whether X11 needs replacing; not here, no.
I do worry that they're ignoring the ideals of X, and focusing too much on cellphone/*pad interfaces, as opposed to the original X ideal (any device *should* be able to handle it, regardless of what your particular prejudices might be).
Examples would be [Paul Bernardo] [wikipedia.org] who's locked up in solitary 23hrs a day, because he'd be dead in the general population...
Bernardo was a piker. Cf. Jeffrey Dahmer. "At his sentencing hearing, Dahmer expressed remorse for his actions, and said that he wished for his own death." "Dahmer served his time at the Columbia Correctional Institution in Portage, Wisconsin, where he ultimately declared himself a born-again Christian. "
"While doing janitorial work in the prison gym, Dahmer and another inmate, Jesse Anderson, were severely beaten by fellow inmate Christopher Scarver with a broomstick handle on November 28, 1994.[51] Dahmer died of severe head trauma while on his way to the hospital in an ambulance."
Nelson: "Ha haaa." He got his wish. Who says prison is cruel?
Hackers could probably handle being alone a lot better.
That's like saying when a woman gets raped, it's not as bad because they can handle it better.
I usually enjoy your posts and sympathize with your POV, but that's BS. You've ignored the fact that there are many different manifestations of "solitary confinement." Sweden's sounds particularly benign. Read up on Japan's. That sounds like pure torture. I can only imagine Mexico's or Ecuador's or Syria's or Turkey's.
A room to myself, with TV, access to the library, regular visits with family or friends, shopping for smokes or candy two times a week,... Hell, that's like living in Mom's basement, and he doesn't even need to leave the premises to shop. Rent free! They probably even do his laundry.
Some may argue that the potential of hacking has only touched the tip of the iceberg. W/b hacking the power grid during a heat strike & causing some deaths of the young & elderly? Or causing a component at a factory to explode by overriding it's original programming? It's no longer about gaining user names / passwords to pron sites and finding out-dated wordpresses. Something like stuxnet has shown the dangers of the next level.
This makes [Sweden] a worse torturer than the U.S. under George Bush!!!!
That's sarcasm, yes? If not, then you think a private room with TV and library privileges and access to regular visitors is worse than Abu Graib and waterboarding? Uh huh.
So, should we have a lottery to determine which CongressCritter will introduce a bill making open WiFi illegal?
In their perspective, it doesn't matter if your WiFi is open. If it was, letter one will tell you to close it (along with instructions).
Why should I close it? Because it inconveniences the Imaginary Property crowd? Fsck them; make me! I like to give free access to the net to those who can't afford it. And by the way (again), fsck 'em!
BTW, no my WiFi isn't open, but I'll defend to death those who do want to leave theirs open.
Isn't California supposed to be falling into the Ocean any minute now? What's taking so long? Damnit.
That's not true. I'm listening to Who's Next at the moment. I own a legally bought copy of it, and I've LOVED the damned thing for, what, twenty years? Thirty? Forty-one! Holy !@#$, I'm getting old.
In fact, I think I've legally owned both the LP and the cassette tape versions. Now, I can just go to YouTube and play it from there. I love this. "But my dreams aren't as empty, as my conscience seems to be... Nobody knows what it feels like to feel these feelings, like I do..."
You don't have to be like me, having bought two copies of the thing, to enjoy the YouTube copy, and I'm serving right now as the best advertising for The Who that they can possibly get. Free advertising from a WAAAAAAY (Holy !@#$!) satisfied customer!
"... pick up my guitar and play, and I get on my knees and pray, we don't get fooled again!!!!111"
Tell people here that you use GPL-licensed code in a closed-source product and see how fast you'll be accused of stealing.
If you hire me to do work for you, everything I do for you is owned completely by you. No contest.
If I do something for myself and incidentally release it to the world to use for free, and you take that free thing for yourself to charge your customers for my work, you bet your ass you're stealing!
Oh yeah, and you're a douchbag if you think that's civilized bahaviour.
Copyright infringement is about as serious a matter as parking in a loading zone.
You would think that. Well, until you watch a DVD and learn that there's a quarter of a million dollars on the line if you copy it and they catch you. I think that raises some fairly serious issues. Ie., your politicos have been bought, and you are legal cannon fodder for the legacy entertainment industry.
That kind of insanity makes me pretty angry, and I don't even "pirate." I'm resentful that such unjust stuff even exists.
It is stealing in the core, meaningful sense of the word.
BS. The copyright holders have lost nothing except a "potential" sale. There's plenty of studies out there proving that "pirates" spend a hell of a lot more than the rest of us buying legal copies.
This is a horrible, horrible way to treat your most prolific customers. This is a vile and disgusting way to do business.
So, should we have a lottery to determine which CongressCritter will introduce a bill making open WiFi illegal? That is the only defence, yes? [An IP addy does not point to an individual person.]
I say again, boycott Hollywood; no-one really needs that shiat. Yes, I'm peeing into the wind...
For me, "Flamebait" is (eg.) Apple fanbois dissing Google/Android egregiously, or Android fanbois dissing Apple egregiously, or Linux fanbois dissing (Apple|MS|...) egregiously,...
Sucks to be us. I wish we could just all get along. "Trolling" is just dorks trying to get a rise out of anyone that falls for their schpiel. A la spam.
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While E has gone to E17(still beta), it's not replacing X11 yet.
I liked E when I last looked at it, but I didn't know it was intended as a potential replacement for X. How portable is E? Can it drive an RS6000, an ancient SunOS box, Macs, DECTerms, ...?
Accessing, ...
And how exactly does remote X with a modern UI toolkit differ from VNC?
Holy crap; you really don't get "client server".
I want "my program" to be running on the honking biggest and fastest box to which I have access. I want that process to display its results on the dinky, pathetic little thing in front of me that I have to use to tell it to do that. I don't want that dinky, pathetic, under-powered and poorly implemented piece of crap in my hand to have to do any more than it absolutely has to, because it sucks at even that!
Play around with "ssh -X" for a few days and get back to us. VNC, Jeebus.
The fact that some people have better tolerances than others is not license for greater mistreatment of those people.
You're not thinking like a tyrant (to your credit :-). If you were, you'd notice that some of your victims have very little difficulty handling the punishments you're meeting out, so you need to step up your game and come up with really intolerable punishments. Sweden's definition of solitary sounds damned near idyllic compared to some of the environments I've experienced, and I've read and heard about far worse ones (ie. Cambodia under the Khmer Rouge, or Solzhenitsyn's Gulag Archipelago).
As for rape, consider the life of a brothel slave of the Romans in Herculaneum, prior to Vesuvius' eruption. Death would have been considered a precious gift from Heaven.
any device *should* be able to handle it
How can you tell that someone has never developed for cellphones/*pad? Guess...
How can you tell if someone's a Java developer? Guess...
I now tend to automatically roll my eyes whenever I hear an opensource community mention "rewrite" or "replacement".
They mean it doesn't look enough like Win* or Macs. Just be thankful you don't have to use it (as opposed to when the same's done on Win* & Macs). "apt-get install fluxbox ..."
Oh and those legacy cruft ridden bits of code which you don't use and are paged out onto disk are actually taking up positively kilobytes of RAM which make my Sun 3/60 really REALLY slow.
[Is this sarcasm? Or am I even slower than I think I am this morning?] Well, there's your problem! Geez, Sun video has *always* sucked (I once owned a U30). When I was first playing around with Linux on an i486 peecee, then was introduced to a current Sun workstation, I couldn't believe how pathetic it was. Max eight colors, or something?!? Are you kidding me?!? The crappy video artifacts brought out by Linux & *BSD on Sun hardware was pathetic.
I must admit, I'm a bit confused reading this thread at the moment (it's early for me; I was up late). However, who could possibly care that a terminal is slow? I've never seen my CPU spike trying to dump chars to a screen or scroll its contents. The stuff I run from that CLI spikes the CPU; not *rxvt, not xterm, ...
For me, whether I use *rxvt or xterm depends on what I'm running in it, and how that looks in *rxvt vs. xterm, and no, I don't kanything, and gterm is just insulting (yeah, prejudiced wrt both, sorry).
More Scotch ..., er coffee.
Not you again.
Fuck. Off. Asshole.
Theres so much legacy garbage in the current X protocol that just wastes resources and makes it nearly impossible to maintain.
I've heard much the same thing said about rxvt vs. xterm. I like xterm, and its devs have done brilliant stuff over the years keeping it relevant, fast, and working. rxvt does 99.999% of what xterm does, and does it well (except for corner cases).
Why do I feel like I'm stirring entrails?
I guess all of the X11 developers that are the ones developing Wayland don't understand X11 that well.
"Don't understand X11 that well", I don't know (though I'd doubt they don't understand X). As for whether X11 needs replacing; not here, no.
I do worry that they're ignoring the ideals of X, and focusing too much on cellphone/*pad interfaces, as opposed to the original X ideal (any device *should* be able to handle it, regardless of what your particular prejudices might be).
Does Fluxbox run on Wayland? If so, I'll try it.
But an introvert? Oh please. If you want to torture an introvert, force them to go to parties and dance with a bunch of people they don't know.
Hell, just send me to an interview with a potential client. "Yes, I can do miracles. What's with all these stupid questions?!?"
Examples would be [Paul Bernardo] [wikipedia.org] who's locked up in solitary 23hrs a day, because he'd be dead in the general population ...
Bernardo was a piker. Cf. Jeffrey Dahmer. "At his sentencing hearing, Dahmer expressed remorse for his actions, and said that he wished for his own death. " "Dahmer served his time at the Columbia Correctional Institution in Portage, Wisconsin, where he ultimately declared himself a born-again Christian. "
"While doing janitorial work in the prison gym, Dahmer and another inmate, Jesse Anderson, were severely beaten by fellow inmate Christopher Scarver with a broomstick handle on November 28, 1994.[51] Dahmer died of severe head trauma while on his way to the hospital in an ambulance."
Nelson: "Ha haaa." He got his wish. Who says prison is cruel?
Hackers could probably handle being alone a lot better.
That's like saying when a woman gets raped, it's not as bad because they can handle it better.
I usually enjoy your posts and sympathize with your POV, but that's BS. You've ignored the fact that there are many different manifestations of "solitary confinement." Sweden's sounds particularly benign. Read up on Japan's. That sounds like pure torture. I can only imagine Mexico's or Ecuador's or Syria's or Turkey's.
A room to myself, with TV, access to the library, regular visits with family or friends, shopping for smokes or candy two times a week, ... Hell, that's like living in Mom's basement, and he doesn't even need to leave the premises to shop. Rent free! They probably even do his laundry.
Some may argue that the potential of hacking has only touched the tip of the iceberg. W/b hacking the power grid during a heat strike & causing some deaths of the young & elderly? Or causing a component at a factory to explode by overriding it's original programming? It's no longer about gaining user names / passwords to pron sites and finding out-dated wordpresses. Something like stuxnet has shown the dangers of the next level.
Yeah, about that, ...
This makes [Sweden] a worse torturer than the U.S. under George Bush!!!!
That's sarcasm, yes? If not, then you think a private room with TV and library privileges and access to regular visitors is worse than Abu Graib and waterboarding? Uh huh.
Where are those customers going to go after being attacked?
Starbucks, McD's, the airport, Plus 15 walkways downtown, shopping centres, ...
I can't wait to see the shitstorm happen when all of them are getting termination threats from their providers.
Are you aware that your initials spell "git"? Which is kind of funny, and pretty cool. :-)
If we're going to have a measuring contest over who can nitpick the best, I'm going to win.
Yes, you are. Rock on. Go git.
So, should we have a lottery to determine which CongressCritter will introduce a bill making open WiFi illegal?
In their perspective, it doesn't matter if your WiFi is open. If it was, letter one will tell you to close it (along with instructions).
Why should I close it? Because it inconveniences the Imaginary Property crowd? Fsck them; make me! I like to give free access to the net to those who can't afford it. And by the way (again), fsck 'em!
BTW, no my WiFi isn't open, but I'll defend to death those who do want to leave theirs open.
Isn't California supposed to be falling into the Ocean any minute now? What's taking so long? Damnit.
Pirating a song has no commercial profit motive.
That's not true. I'm listening to Who's Next at the moment. I own a legally bought copy of it, and I've LOVED the damned thing for, what, twenty years? Thirty? Forty-one! Holy !@#$, I'm getting old.
In fact, I think I've legally owned both the LP and the cassette tape versions. Now, I can just go to YouTube and play it from there. I love this. "But my dreams aren't as empty, as my conscience seems to be ... Nobody knows what it feels like to feel these feelings, like I do ..."
You don't have to be like me, having bought two copies of the thing, to enjoy the YouTube copy, and I'm serving right now as the best advertising for The Who that they can possibly get. Free advertising from a WAAAAAAY (Holy !@#$!) satisfied customer!
"... pick up my guitar and play, and I get on my knees and pray, we don't get fooled again!!!!111"
HooRah! Woof, woof, woof! Piracy? What's that?
Tell people here that you use GPL-licensed code in a closed-source product and see how fast you'll be accused of stealing.
If you hire me to do work for you, everything I do for you is owned completely by you. No contest.
If I do something for myself and incidentally release it to the world to use for free, and you take that free thing for yourself to charge your customers for my work, you bet your ass you're stealing!
Oh yeah, and you're a douchbag if you think that's civilized bahaviour.
Copyright infringement is about as serious a matter as parking in a loading zone.
You would think that. Well, until you watch a DVD and learn that there's a quarter of a million dollars on the line if you copy it and they catch you. I think that raises some fairly serious issues. Ie., your politicos have been bought, and you are legal cannon fodder for the legacy entertainment industry.
That kind of insanity makes me pretty angry, and I don't even "pirate." I'm resentful that such unjust stuff even exists.
It is stealing in the core, meaningful sense of the word.
BS. The copyright holders have lost nothing except a "potential" sale. There's plenty of studies out there proving that "pirates" spend a hell of a lot more than the rest of us buying legal copies.
This is a horrible, horrible way to treat your most prolific customers. This is a vile and disgusting way to do business.
Boycott!
This day is brought to you by collusion and RICO.
So, should we have a lottery to determine which CongressCritter will introduce a bill making open WiFi illegal? That is the only defence, yes? [An IP addy does not point to an individual person.]
I say again, boycott Hollywood; no-one really needs that shiat. Yes, I'm peeing into the wind ...
They're not finished yet.
We have come from all corners of the Earth escaping bastards such as yourself and seeking a common goal.
I'm Canadian. You're an idiot. Just sayin'. Holy fsck, some of you Murricans are stupid.
For me, "Flamebait" is (eg.) Apple fanbois dissing Google/Android egregiously, or Android fanbois dissing Apple egregiously, or Linux fanbois dissing (Apple|MS|...) egregiously, ...
Sucks to be us. I wish we could just all get along. "Trolling" is just dorks trying to get a rise out of anyone that falls for their schpiel. A la spam.
Good morning! Well, soon methinks.
[FLOSS fanboi here, if it's not obvious.]
Holy !@#$, mods! You think that's flamebait?!? Jeebus. :-P