[off-topic] I attended school in Ireland... back in those days we were *SO* jealous of the neighbouring UK school system because of the use of the BBC/Acorn micros. Those were very nice machines. I wanted one so badly, but damn if they weren't expensive. We had to make do with a mishmash of Vic20s, a couple of Speccys and one Apple ][. Okay, I'm rambling, I'll shut up now.
Quite a few, as it happens. Many US Corporations locate there because it's part of the euro currency area, English is the local tongue and the education system produces plenty of highly-qualified graduates.
You are right in that I don't think this really qualifies as outsourcing either, since the actual cost comparison would be against other potential European locations, most of which are more expensive to do business in than the US, while looking to establish facilities to support the EU market, rather than backoffice work for the US market.
I was really just commenting on the parent post saying that there's no EU-wide minimum wage (which is true) and that it makes sense that this be dealt with on a national level, according to the EU principle of subsidiarity (i.e., that laws be enacted at the lowest level possible, rather than at the highest level).
I actually took my own advice, checked on the IMF website and found that your estimate is closer to being accurate than mine, and by a long shot. The IMF says
Despite the gains in the area of poverty reduction since Independence â"the poverty rate has fallen by over 20 percentage points since the 1950s and 1960s â"roughly 35 percent of the population still remains below the poverty line.2 Moreover, poverty statistics during the 1990s generally stagnated or, in some cases, worsened, and per capita income in India still lags well behind that in other fast-growing Asian economies. Notably, rural poverty rates have tended to increase and the regional distribution of income has become more stratified. This has reflected both weak fiscal discipline (constraining public development spending) and slowing structural reform (concentrating growth in the less-regulated services sector), which have left little scope for income gains for lower-skilled agricultural and industrial workers.
They have discovered that the British Isles are tilting, with the north of the country gaining altitude and the south of the country 'sinking'."
Given that the British Isles are comprised of the UK (which is Great Britain and Northern Ireland) and the Republic of Ireland, a separate country, shouldn't that read "with the north of the countries 'sinking'"?
As an Irish citizen who went through the process of acquiring permanent residency in the US while living in Amsterdam, I can only commend the INS and Embassy staffers for their efficiency, politeness and friendly attitudes. My experiences in dealing with the INS has been the opposite of yours.
Worker costs in Ireland are not much lower than the US -- the main advantage for US employers in hiring Irish companies are a business environment much like that in the US (e.g., strong commercial laws, low corporate taxes), native English speakers and an available pool of highly qualified workers. Factor in the higher "hidden" social costs (employer social security contributions, etc.) and I think you will find that the differences are negligable.
I understand New Zealand's anger over the Rainbow Warrior affair but get a grip. Your implication that the French Socialists somehow "bought" the German Christian Democrat government is frivolous at best.
How about just leaving the name as is? It doesn't sound like that pastry/bun is anywhere near as delicious as the other wonderful German confections... so it would be insulting to leave the name as is!
Respect -- learning Hindi and all. That's the most rational response I've heard so far to the wave of outsourcing deals. Personally I think we should have anti-wage dumping laws, much as we have anti-steel and chip dumping laws, but that's unlikely to happen since I am Joe Sixpack and business rules the corporate republic. Good luck!
This further removes the glory of being a computer science graduate.
Glory? What glory was ever associated with C.S.?
Re:Insightful? The great IT labor shortage of 2006
on
Computing's Lost Allure
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· Score: 2, Insightful
Because you're posting on a US-centric site, and everyone knows that the US is God's country, the best, number 1, etc. etc. In the US of late xenophobia has taken hold, all foreigners are suspect, particularly if you're brown and speak with a very noticeable accent. To compound matters, most posters here are hardcore nerds who have trouble relating to their fellow citizens, not to mind a foreigner.
The German poster is correct though. In a lot of Balkan states, the Deutsche Mark became the de facto currency during the wars of the 90s because it was "hard", unlike local currencies.
At least two community colleges in the St. Louis area offered Associates Degrees that focused on AS/400 (I know, midrange not mainframe) technology until last year. My wife availed of one and is very gainfully employed now... I'm glad that there are organizations out there that recognize that heat and flash is no substance for skills that actually result in people being hired.
I would have thought that with your superior experience and exposure to advanced mainframe technologies, you'd put that young whippersnapper back in his box? I'm serious. Most of these "all I know is Java" types really don't know much at all about designing highly-available, large-volume transaction systems. This isn't a troll. I started out on large midrange systems and am currently doing J2EE development myself.
Slashdot Mirror
I can tell you're a writer by how you used the word "progeny" when you could have used "children"!
[off-topic] I attended school in Ireland... back in those days we were *SO* jealous of the neighbouring UK school system because of the use of the BBC/Acorn micros. Those were very nice machines. I wanted one so badly, but damn if they weren't expensive. We had to make do with a mishmash of Vic20s, a couple of Speccys and one Apple ][. Okay, I'm rambling, I'll shut up now.
You are right in that I don't think this really qualifies as outsourcing either, since the actual cost comparison would be against other potential European locations, most of which are more expensive to do business in than the US, while looking to establish facilities to support the EU market, rather than backoffice work for the US market.
I was really just commenting on the parent post saying that there's no EU-wide minimum wage (which is true) and that it makes sense that this be dealt with on a national level, according to the EU principle of subsidiarity (i.e., that laws be enacted at the lowest level possible, rather than at the highest level).
"Intellectuals"? Get over yourself.
I get paid for and take pride in my work. I care about the quality of my code. Up yours, asshole GNU hippy.
Individual EU member states (possibly not all) have their own minimum wage standards. In Ireland it is currently ~$8/hr (or was last time I checked).
Given that the US no longer has a "no first use" policy, we know where to look when guarding against this.
And if they had done that, you'd complain about the lack of accuracy. Whining nerd maggots.
As an Irish citizen who went through the process of acquiring permanent residency in the US while living in Amsterdam, I can only commend the INS and Embassy staffers for their efficiency, politeness and friendly attitudes. My experiences in dealing with the INS has been the opposite of yours.
Worker costs in Ireland are not much lower than the US -- the main advantage for US employers in hiring Irish companies are a business environment much like that in the US (e.g., strong commercial laws, low corporate taxes), native English speakers and an available pool of highly qualified workers. Factor in the higher "hidden" social costs (employer social security contributions, etc.) and I think you will find that the differences are negligable.
I understand New Zealand's anger over the Rainbow Warrior affair but get a grip. Your implication that the French Socialists somehow "bought" the German Christian Democrat government is frivolous at best.
You are an idiot, aren't you?
How about just leaving the name as is? It doesn't sound like that pastry/bun is anywhere near as delicious as the other wonderful German confections... so it would be insulting to leave the name as is!
Entwickler[n]?
Respect -- learning Hindi and all. That's the most rational response I've heard so far to the wave of outsourcing deals. Personally I think we should have anti-wage dumping laws, much as we have anti-steel and chip dumping laws, but that's unlikely to happen since I am Joe Sixpack and business rules the corporate republic. Good luck!
Because you're posting on a US-centric site, and everyone knows that the US is God's country, the best, number 1, etc. etc.
In the US of late xenophobia has taken hold, all foreigners are suspect, particularly if you're brown and speak with a very noticeable accent.
To compound matters, most posters here are hardcore nerds who have trouble relating to their fellow citizens, not to mind a foreigner.
The German poster is correct though. In a lot of Balkan states, the Deutsche Mark became the de facto currency during the wars of the 90s because it was "hard", unlike local currencies.
The iSeries, formerly known as the AS/400, is a midrange system, not a mainframe. I know. I spent 12 years working on 400s.
At least two community colleges in the St. Louis area offered Associates Degrees that focused on AS/400 (I know, midrange not mainframe) technology until last year. My wife availed of one and is very gainfully employed now... I'm glad that there are organizations out there that recognize that heat and flash is no substance for skills that actually result in people being hired.
I would have thought that with your superior experience and exposure to advanced mainframe technologies, you'd put that young whippersnapper back in his box? I'm serious. Most of these "all I know is Java" types really don't know much at all about designing highly-available, large-volume transaction systems. This isn't a troll. I started out on large midrange systems and am currently doing J2EE development myself.