The XBoxen won't be able to break out of their playpen, but it's only a matter of time before someone reverse engineers the XBox protocol and connects a PC (or an XBox running a full-featured OS) to the network. There's still plenty of fun to be had if you can get inside.
I can understand the if its there challenge but seriously what sort of fun? wheres the fun in hacking into someones console ?
Good points and i was wondering about it - but the issue is present with every console isnt it..?
And the broadband applies to the states but what about other countries ? in Australia at the price of broadband i cant see many people getting it just for their X Boxen.
Its interesting to note that in this case the closed network MS have been building for X box might be the best thing in the circumstances as it should prevent DDOS usage of the things.
but is this really going to be a major issue ? in reality how much time will these boxen spend on line when not playing games ?
have MS written in code to the os to identify what is and is not and X Box for example? and what about servers - can they be run ?
"I started playing with Slackware 1.01 in early 1994 "
But think for a second - in 1994 you would need to be more technically knowledgeable that you needed to be in 2002 - 1994 was pre windows 95 and the PC world was still DOS based - you needed to know what you were doing - and running a BBS was hardly a point and shoot thing...
In other words dont you think that you may have had more knowledge of how a computer ticked than the average mum and dad these days ? Slackware is not forgiving if you have never used a command line - i put it to you that none of us had a problem but then i suggest you find your mum or your boss and give it to them and get them to run it - you may find what im getting at...
I have been branded as a troll on here for expressing my opionion more times in the last week than in 5 years previously - so at risk of it again please understand that when i say Slackware is not a beginners OS i mean not someone who has only ever used windows and has NO understanding of how and OS actually works - Joe Average. Sometimes we all forget that we are a lot more techincally skilled than we realise.
Seeing as i have now been branded a troll (open comment and opinion is alive and well on here) i feel i should explain why i said what i did. I have used slackware personally for about 5 years and i run it and debian here.
I made the observation i did based on giving people slackware as their first linux and then having to help them - these were average people who had never ever used anything but Windows 95. Technically savvy windows users will find slackware a good starting point but then again they are less likely to become frustrated with it.
The average person like that gui fied front end as it is familiar and helps them ease into linux - you need to remember that there are people out there who have never worked with a command line and for them when confronted with nothing but it gets scary as hell.
Not everyone has a linux guru to call on - thats why i recommended the other Distros ahead of slackware - purely easing them into it. I have had great success with Lycoris (at home and in corporates) because it looks familiar to them and they can use it without the massive learning curve in front of them that a command line only OS presents.
I can understands many of the points put forward but take a step back and remember that most if not all of you were hardly beginners at computers and you wanted and had time to learn - this goes to the root of an argument about Linux on the desktop and i respect the opinions that some of you have put forward - but surely the key to linux is choices - if a distro like mandrake or lycoris changes one more user from windows and onto open source then thats one less slave to the corporate path and surely that cannot be all bad?
Yep a lot more windows user and linux haters - slackware is not a product to learn linux on for beginners - it is however the best damn Linux out there and once you know a bit about linux you will love it - but please dont install it as your first attempt at linux - if you have only ever used linux then do yourself a favour and start out with something user friendly like mandrake, red hat or lycoris. Slackware and Debian are oses that dont suffer fools lightly..
maybe i wasnt clear as well. The thing i dont get is the importance of this issue.. No one can ever claim to have been blocked by the list and i havent seen one example of it being used.
That said i dont want you to get the impression i am for censorship - i am not i simply believe that there are moral and legal rules in society and that the government (any government) is bound by mandate to enforce them. you touched on movies (have seen both of what you speak and read the books - i doubt most people would understand lolita and i personally thought Baise Moire was an intresting movie but also one that realistically had no chance of remaining on movie screens in this country - without the censorship hype at best 5% of the population would have seen it or known what it was)
Ok you did what you felt morally compelled to do and i support that - you fought for you convictions and the decision came down against you - i can understand but the fact is i think this is a fight that is lost and i can see no good reason to bring it into a forum where people have now gotten the impression that it is some evil ban or blocklist that can be used for nefarious purposes (come on even you cannot believe that)
The Internet Censorship Debate in this country is a valuable one and there are many issues to fight it on - this list was set up to deal with sites which are not desireable but hang on - they show it to you and then what ? do you publicise it ? what if showing it to you has an effect on a criminal investigation ? or warns someone they are being watched ? what if a child pornographer escapes punishment due to this list being in the open?
I'm trying to say that i can se rational reasons why the list should remain secret - and i don't for one second see any nefarious reasons (im sure there may be but as i have never come across any site that is blocked including hate sites etc i somehow doubt that this is an issue)
Perhaps the reason they dont want anyone to see the list is that the list is in fact empty and is simply used as a deterrent measure ?
As for tax payers dollars well i pay 45 cents in every dollar i earn in tax and i have no problem with this - its not like its real money after all and i doubt the figure involved is large.
You out your point across well and i am now aware of the organisation which counts for many things - so your time has not been wasted - and even though i might not agree with you it is after all only my opinion. Thank god thats not censored (although on here the moderation system works as a form of censorship all of its own)
"In the US, various privately-run internet blocking services have blocked POLITICAL sites"
Yes and i disagree but this is NOT a private filter site it is a regulation and blocking system and it is monitored and regulated by the legal system and the government - it exists for a specific reason and i would suspect it has very few sites on it.
I do NOT support censorship i simply think this is an argument about semantics - there are more worthwhile issues to battle than this one and the majority of internet users in this country would not even consider it or care if it exists as it has NEVER been used that i have heard or can find mention of.
I often think the time lines have become so compressed in terms of expectations that it becomes harder and harder for companies to write clean code and get it out the door in order to meet the expected cycle of upgrades - and this is something i find common to all companies and even open source software. It seems we as consumers have come to expect an upgrade to this or that every year and so the dev cycle becomes one continuous thing - coders who are exhausted or working long hours write buggy code.
I think many people would be happy to wait a bit longer for better products but the industry has brainwashed them into thinking that its almost easy to bung a new version out.
The best way to avoid mistakes is not to make them in the first place but thats not so easy when working on a compressed cycle with management on top of you - its not just programmers who deal with it - its network designers, SOE architects etc etc
Bugs exist - they always will - but minimising them requires time and time is a commodity not readily found. I dont know what the solution is - as i say its just my thoughts.
"The Administrative Appeals Tribunal yesterday ruled that the Commonwealth Government's Internet censorship regime would be ineffective if it did not operate under a veil of secrecy, unlike offline censorship laws."
Thus under the laws of Australia they can and have decided not to allow you access to it.
Having been legally refused you then decide to attempt to generate noise on the issue by posting it here - no doubt in the hopes that it will be picked up by other 'freedom fighters'and become a cause celebre.
" So, basically, they were saying that if people were able to see what was being blocked, the system wouldn't work. Excuse me? What sort of dodgy system is that? If it can't work with disclosure of the blocklist, then I would say the system is fundamentally flawed. Indeed, that's what EFA and numerous others were saying when this system was first proposed. Now that those concerns have been borne out, will the system be scrapped? No, it will continue to operate under a veil of secrecy, wasting my tax dollars on something that is inherently broken. "
The system was NEVER secret - it has always been there and is documented. I have no problem with it and neither does the man in the street. What reason do tyou have (aside from it's there) from needing to see the list ? is there ANY site you cant get to in Australia ? i can get to White Power sites, Porn Sites, etc etc (i just tried a few) so obviously there isnt a major issue and the fact is that it applies to AU sites only - do you not agree that say sites breaching the hate crime legislation in australia should NOT be shut down? how about kiddie porn ?
That said however i respect you for your opinions and for stating you are a member of the organisation - you at least stand up for what you believe and that shows a strong character. Now informed of who the EFA are i am reading about them and the issues. I just don't feel this one is that big an issue - censorship in AU has always been fairly relaxed in most areas.
I could speak volumes on the subject but the fact is that in this country despite all the noise and chest beating when it comes down to it i have NEVER seen an issue of censorship here. I saw the Global Village idiot campaign and basically ignored it - having lived and worked overseas i have seen what REAL censorship looks like and we DONT have it here. I am frankly insulted by the assumption that my not being involved in activism for the sake of it means im new at the internet - i spend 18 hours of my day running an environment and i really do not pay any attention to the sort of noise that EFA and others promote.
The IIA Code of Practice [iia.net.au] shows that Overseas URLs are not blocked but can become the subject of investigation with cooperation of the relevant overseas authorities. It is the list of sites taken down that is the subject of the secrecy. It is absolute stupidity that the names and description of the sites are not published. The URLs are immaterial. Democracy requires transparency in decision-making, not this secrecy.
Why ? what reason ? so you can look at the site before it goes. This circumstance would likely require invlolvement of the foreign office and or the federal police and authorities in the other country (as was required in the Kiddie Porn case win WA where the Australians and US govt co operated) - at that stage it would be a legal issue and thus why would you need to see the name? This is nothing to do with democracy at all - there is a legal and political and legislative process that was gone thru to get to this stage and its been ratified by the elected government. Censorship is designed to protect the majority of the population and
You may not like Alston (he isnt actually doing a bad job) but thats your right. Dont however presume that you will speak for me - i am doing what you sugested and experessing what i say - as you have - now lets see others do the same thing - that is after all what free speech is about.
PS i have met 3 of the people on the EFA board in the past - 2 of these are intelligent people and im reading their website - the other one i will not mention - i do however think that this issue is a storm in a teacup.
' Maybe it was marked troll because your statements were so incredibly stupid as a reply to the post you chose.
Poster: It's impossible to tell if it's down or blocked. You: What sites are you saying are blocked, then, eh?
You wonder about 'this place,' when you should wonder why your parents decided to have kids'
I wonder about people who post as AC as well... The guy was commenting that certain sites didnt work - i was wondering what type of site - that's easy to say - as the 'blacklist' is no such thing and is voluntary i was intrigued.
Im sorry - i thought that was blindingly obvious but maybe i didnt explain it too well.
Oh and many thanks for the personal insult at the end - my daddy however didnt teach me to hide behind 'Anonymous Coward' status when i wanted to have a go at someone...
'Voltaire must be glad that guns are banned in.au too:)'
Semi Automatics only are banned - i can still use my shotgun.
I make no apologies - im a father of young children and i consider kiddie porn and its purveyors people not worthy of any form of respect or understanding - i cant help that.
Of course internet censorship does nothing to stop people getting access to it but hell thats another post....
' That's a *very* slippery slope, my friend. Let's make molestation and exploitation illegal, but speech should always be free. No exceptions.'
personally i dont agree - and i think its funny that in the US today i can go to jail for agreeing with Al Quade (i dont but im using it as an example) and expressing that - there is a BIG difference between censorship and prohibition - even the US has censorship rules.
Looking past the EFA post (an organisation that i have never heard of an have never done anything that I can find) the entire information regarding this storm in a tea cup can be found on the ABA site
And here it discusses the type of information blocked...
What is prohibited Internet content?
The co-regulatory scheme covers content on World Wide Web sites, Usenet newsgroups and other types of stored information that can be accessed over the Internet. Ordinary email, chat and other content that is accessed in real time (for example, some types of streamed audiovisual content) are not covered by the scheme.
Under the Act, the following categories of Internet content are prohibited:
* Any Internet content that is classified RC or X by the OFL Classification Board (PDF file - 65k). This includes real depictions of actual sexual activity, child pornography, depictions of bestiality and material containing excessive violence or sexual violence.
* Content hosted in Australia which is classified R (PDF file - 65k) and not subject to a restricted access system. This includes depictions of simulated sexual activity, material containing strong, realistic violence and other material dealing with intense adult themes.
Further information about the types of content covered by the scheme is in our complaints section. Internet content that has not been classified but which, if classified, would be prohibited content is regarded as potential prohibited content and is dealt with in a similar to prohibited content.
Unless the content is in one of the above categories, the ABA cannot take action over Internet content that you simply don't like or do not agree with. In such cases, you should raise your concerns directly with the operators of the site in question.
And of course this forms part of the NON MANDATORY code of practice Found Here which states
While these Codes are not mandatory, the Broadcasting Services Act provides that once the ABA directs an ISP or content host to comply with a registered code, they must then do so. This is similar to other codes currently operating in the telecommunications industry and forms the practical operation of what is known as 'co-regulation'.
So basically the code is only enforced when you have done something worthy of enforcement - perhaps like hosting kiddie porn sites ?
So what we have is an orginisation who is trying to make a name for itself (having no actual cases to fight in australia aside from this) by filing a freedom of information request that they no doubt knew would fail and then when it does and the press release hits the news getting one of their members to post a story here....
Maybe im cynical but there is no story here that i can see ?
"Internet sites are quite often just unreachable, never an explanation. Could be down, could be censored..."
im interested in that - can you tell me where in australia you are and youre ISP and some example sites... ive never come across one that is blocked althought i have seen lots that go down...
Have never heard of this group anywhere but slashdot. The URL list is indeed kept hidden but the average man in the street is not in the least bit interested in it - i have never come across a site that i cannot get to and from memory the submission is voluntary.
A country has a right to prohibit the import or availity of certainf thibgs, publcations, movies, pictures, magazines etc - no one will argue that the prohibition of kiddie porn mags is a bad thing (no one i wont shoot on sight will argue it anyway....) but they will argue about this mythical list that may not even exist (no one has ever actually seen it)
This is not america and thankfully censorship here is not all present, you also need to be aware we do not have a constitution like the US (we do have one but not like yours) and no free speach amendments.
Basically i see this as a storm in a teacup and im sure other aussies feel the same way.
Well i think the 24 hour response time is a good thing.. However to play devils advocate for a second - if Microsoft had resolved an issue (i know stop laughing and read on) in 24 hours would it have been posted on here in this manner?? I suspect it would have had a different slant to it...
I only ask this in the light of the fact that ALL software has bugs and issues and exploits but all software eventually gets patched - I find open source more responsive in some cases and worse in others - its not a given that something will get fixed every time faster but on average it is - this is an advantage of open source software for me. The disadvantage of course lies in people who claim open source software never has a bug or exploit at all - all software HAS these things but some softwqare gets fixed faster than others.
'vietnam never had an "official" declaration of war. just to let you know.'
Vietname and korea were both police actions in matter of fact - they didnt require a declaration of war - The Korean war was run by a joint force of commanders from around the world.. Vietnam was a mess
but they were both real 'hey look the enemy is over there' conflicts.... this is not
And you could draw some parallels in other ways - during both conflicts there were NEVER wholesale changes to law and civil rights made for the worse like no.
Re:How about free books available online?
on
General IT Books?
·
· Score: 2
I have one for you - Free as in freedom - Sam williams - great book on RMS (Stallman for those not in the know)and the reasons behind GNU and Open Source - Worth the read (even a RMS hater like me appreciates it)
Slashdot Mirror
"DDOS, or other attacks where you want to own other people's boxen. And consoles are probably less likely to be kept patched up than PCs"
yes i understand that but why ? what is the point of hacking to 'own' someones system? they havent got bank account data etc on it so why ?
I can understand the if its there challenge but seriously what sort of fun? wheres the fun in hacking into someones console ?
Good points and i was wondering about it - but the issue is present with every console isnt it..?
And the broadband applies to the states but what about other countries ? in Australia at the price of broadband i cant see many people getting it just for their X Boxen.
Its interesting to note that in this case the closed network MS have been building for X box might be the best thing in the circumstances as it should prevent DDOS usage of the things.
but is this really going to be a major issue ? in reality how much time will these boxen spend on line when not playing games ?
have MS written in code to the os to identify what is and is not and X Box for example? and what about servers - can they be run ?
Thought provoking.
"I started playing with Slackware 1.01 in early 1994 "
But think for a second - in 1994 you would need to be more technically knowledgeable that you needed to be in 2002 - 1994 was pre windows 95 and the PC world was still DOS based - you needed to know what you were doing - and running a BBS was hardly a point and shoot thing...
In other words dont you think that you may have had more knowledge of how a computer ticked than the average mum and dad these days ? Slackware is not forgiving if you have never used a command line - i put it to you that none of us had a problem but then i suggest you find your mum or your boss and give it to them and get them to run it - you may find what im getting at...
I have been branded as a troll on here for expressing my opionion more times in the last week than in 5 years previously - so at risk of it again please understand that when i say Slackware is not a beginners OS i mean not someone who has only ever used windows and has NO understanding of how and OS actually works - Joe Average. Sometimes we all forget that we are a lot more techincally skilled than we realise.
Seeing as i have now been branded a troll (open comment and opinion is alive and well on here) i feel i should explain why i said what i did. I have used slackware personally for about 5 years and i run it and debian here.
I made the observation i did based on giving people slackware as their first linux and then having to help them - these were average people who had never ever used anything but Windows 95. Technically savvy windows users will find slackware a good starting point but then again they are less likely to become frustrated with it.
The average person like that gui fied front end as it is familiar and helps them ease into linux - you need to remember that there are people out there who have never worked with a command line and for them when confronted with nothing but it gets scary as hell.
Not everyone has a linux guru to call on - thats why i recommended the other Distros ahead of slackware - purely easing them into it. I have had great success with Lycoris (at home and in corporates) because it looks familiar to them and they can use it without the massive learning curve in front of them that a command line only OS presents.
I can understands many of the points put forward but take a step back and remember that most if not all of you were hardly beginners at computers and you wanted and had time to learn - this goes to the root of an argument about Linux on the desktop and i respect the opinions that some of you have put forward - but surely the key to linux is choices - if a distro like mandrake or lycoris changes one more user from windows and onto open source then thats one less slave to the corporate path and surely that cannot be all bad?
Yep a lot more windows user and linux haters - slackware is not a product to learn linux on for beginners - it is however the best damn Linux out there and once you know a bit about linux you will love it - but please dont install it as your first attempt at linux - if you have only ever used linux then do yourself a favour and start out with something user friendly like mandrake, red hat or lycoris. Slackware and Debian are oses that dont suffer fools lightly..
hi justin
maybe i wasnt clear as well. The thing i dont get is the importance of this issue.. No one can ever claim to have been blocked by the list and i havent seen one example of it being used.
That said i dont want you to get the impression i am for censorship - i am not i simply believe that there are moral and legal rules in society and that the government (any government) is bound by mandate to enforce them. you touched on movies (have seen both of what you speak and read the books - i doubt most people would understand lolita and i personally thought Baise Moire was an intresting movie but also one that realistically had no chance of remaining on movie screens in this country - without the censorship hype at best 5% of the population would have seen it or known what it was)
Ok you did what you felt morally compelled to do and i support that - you fought for you convictions and the decision came down against you - i can understand but the fact is i think this is a fight that is lost and i can see no good reason to bring it into a forum where people have now gotten the impression that it is some evil ban or blocklist that can be used for nefarious purposes (come on even you cannot believe that)
The Internet Censorship Debate in this country is a valuable one and there are many issues to fight it on - this list was set up to deal with sites which are not desireable but hang on - they show it to you and then what ? do you publicise it ? what if showing it to you has an effect on a criminal investigation ? or warns someone they are being watched ? what if a child pornographer escapes punishment due to this list being in the open?
I'm trying to say that i can se rational reasons why the list should remain secret - and i don't for one second see any nefarious reasons (im sure there may be but as i have never come across any site that is blocked including hate sites etc i somehow doubt that this is an issue)
Perhaps the reason they dont want anyone to see the list is that the list is in fact empty and is simply used as a deterrent measure ?
As for tax payers dollars well i pay 45 cents in every dollar i earn in tax and i have no problem with this - its not like its real money after all and i doubt the figure involved is large.
You out your point across well and i am now aware of the organisation which counts for many things - so your time has not been wasted - and even though i might not agree with you it is after all only my opinion. Thank god thats not censored (although on here the moderation system works as a form of censorship all of its own)
"In the US, various privately-run internet blocking services have blocked POLITICAL sites"
Yes and i disagree but this is NOT a private filter site it is a regulation and blocking system and it is monitored and regulated by the legal system and the government - it exists for a specific reason and i would suspect it has very few sites on it.
I do NOT support censorship i simply think this is an argument about semantics - there are more worthwhile issues to battle than this one and the majority of internet users in this country would not even consider it or care if it exists as it has NEVER been used that i have heard or can find mention of.
I often think the time lines have become so compressed in terms of expectations that it becomes harder and harder for companies to write clean code and get it out the door in order to meet the expected cycle of upgrades - and this is something i find common to all companies and even open source software. It seems we as consumers have come to expect an upgrade to this or that every year and so the dev cycle becomes one continuous thing - coders who are exhausted or working long hours write buggy code.
I think many people would be happy to wait a bit longer for better products but the industry has brainwashed them into thinking that its almost easy to bung a new version out.
The best way to avoid mistakes is not to make them in the first place but thats not so easy when working on a compressed cycle with management on top of you - its not just programmers who deal with it - its network designers, SOE architects etc etc
Bugs exist - they always will - but minimising them requires time and time is a commodity not readily found. I dont know what the solution is - as i say its just my thoughts.
Right now im laughing my self sick at the guy who wasted his mod points marking these posts over rated
slashdot moderation at its best..
"The Administrative Appeals Tribunal yesterday ruled that the Commonwealth Government's Internet censorship regime would be ineffective if it did not operate under a veil of secrecy, unlike offline censorship laws."
Thus under the laws of Australia they can and have decided not to allow you access to it.
Having been legally refused you then decide to attempt to generate noise on the issue by posting it here - no doubt in the hopes that it will be picked up by other 'freedom fighters'and become a cause celebre.
" So, basically, they were saying that if people were able to see what was being blocked, the system wouldn't work. Excuse me? What sort of dodgy system is that? If it can't work with disclosure of the blocklist, then I would say the system is fundamentally flawed. Indeed, that's what EFA and numerous others were saying when this system was first proposed. Now that those concerns have been borne out, will the system be scrapped? No, it will continue to operate under a veil of secrecy, wasting my tax dollars on something that is inherently broken. "
The system was NEVER secret - it has always been there and is documented. I have no problem with it and neither does the man in the street. What reason do tyou have (aside from it's there) from needing to see the list ? is there ANY site you cant get to in Australia ? i can get to White Power sites, Porn Sites, etc etc (i just tried a few) so obviously there isnt a major issue and the fact is that it applies to AU sites only - do you not agree that say sites breaching the hate crime legislation in australia should NOT be shut down? how about kiddie porn ?
That said however i respect you for your opinions and for stating you are a member of the organisation - you at least stand up for what you believe and that shows a strong character. Now informed of who the EFA are i am reading about them and the issues. I just don't feel this one is that big an issue - censorship in AU has always been fairly relaxed in most areas.
" I think the question is how did he get +1 in the first place....."
The old fashioned way - make an account and post intelligent comments and get modded for them....
I could speak volumes on the subject but the fact is that in this country despite all the noise and chest beating when it comes down to it i have NEVER seen an issue of censorship here. I saw the Global Village idiot campaign and basically ignored it - having lived and worked overseas i have seen what REAL censorship looks like and we DONT have it here. I am frankly insulted by the assumption that my not being involved in activism for the sake of it means im new at the internet - i spend 18 hours of my day running an environment and i really do not pay any attention to the sort of noise that EFA and others promote.
Why ? what reason ? so you can look at the site before it goes. This circumstance would likely require invlolvement of the foreign office and or the federal police and authorities in the other country (as was required in the Kiddie Porn case win WA where the Australians and US govt co operated) - at that stage it would be a legal issue and thus why would you need to see the name? This is nothing to do with democracy at all - there is a legal and political and legislative process that was gone thru to get to this stage and its been ratified by the elected government. Censorship is designed to protect the majority of the population and
You may not like Alston (he isnt actually doing a bad job) but thats your right. Dont however presume that you will speak for me - i am doing what you sugested and experessing what i say - as you have - now lets see others do the same thing - that is after all what free speech is about.
PS i have met 3 of the people on the EFA board in the past - 2 of these are intelligent people and im reading their website - the other one i will not mention - i do however think that this issue is a storm in a teacup.
PS your webiste appears to be down anthony..
' Maybe it was marked troll because your statements were so incredibly stupid as a reply to the post you chose.
Poster: It's impossible to tell if it's down or blocked.
You: What sites are you saying are blocked, then, eh?
You wonder about 'this place,' when you should wonder why your parents decided to have kids'
I wonder about people who post as AC as well... The guy was commenting that certain sites didnt work - i was wondering what type of site - that's easy to say - as the 'blacklist' is no such thing and is voluntary i was intrigued.
Im sorry - i thought that was blindingly obvious but maybe i didnt explain it too well.
Oh and many thanks for the personal insult at the end - my daddy however didnt teach me to hide behind 'Anonymous Coward' status when i wanted to have a go at someone...
'Voltaire must be glad that guns are banned in .au too :)'
Semi Automatics only are banned - i can still use my shotgun.
I make no apologies - im a father of young children and i consider kiddie porn and its purveyors people not worthy of any form of respect or understanding - i cant help that.
Of course internet censorship does nothing to stop people getting access to it but hell thats another post....
Please explain HOW this is a troll ? Im interested in finding out what sort of stuff IS censored and i ask a question and IM a troll ????
hmm i wonder about this place sometimes i really do...
' That's a *very* slippery slope, my friend. Let's make molestation and exploitation illegal, but speech should always be free. No exceptions.'
personally i dont agree - and i think its funny that in the US today i can go to jail for agreeing with Al Quade (i dont but im using it as an example) and expressing that - there is a BIG difference between censorship and prohibition - even the US has censorship rules.
The Regulations explained
And here it discusses the type of information blocked...
And of course this forms part of the NON MANDATORY code of practice Found Here which states
So basically the code is only enforced when you have done something worthy of enforcement - perhaps like hosting kiddie porn sites ?
So what we have is an orginisation who is trying to make a name for itself (having no actual cases to fight in australia aside from this) by filing a freedom of information request that they no doubt knew would fail and then when it does and the press release hits the news getting one of their members to post a story here....
Maybe im cynical but there is no story here that i can see ?
"Internet sites are quite often just unreachable, never an explanation. Could be down, could be censored..."
im interested in that - can you tell me where in australia you are and youre ISP and some example sites... ive never come across one that is blocked althought i have seen lots that go down...
What sort of sites are we talking about heee ?
Have never heard of this group anywhere but slashdot. The URL list is indeed kept hidden but the average man in the street is not in the least bit interested in it - i have never come across a site that i cannot get to and from memory the submission is voluntary.
A country has a right to prohibit the import or availity of certainf thibgs, publcations, movies, pictures, magazines etc - no one will argue that the prohibition of kiddie porn mags is a bad thing (no one i wont shoot on sight will argue it anyway....) but they will argue about this mythical list that may not even exist (no one has ever actually seen it)
This is not america and thankfully censorship here is not all present, you also need to be aware we do not have a constitution like the US (we do have one but not like yours) and no free speach amendments.
Basically i see this as a storm in a teacup and im sure other aussies feel the same way.
Well i think the 24 hour response time is a good thing.. However to play devils advocate for a second - if Microsoft had resolved an issue (i know stop laughing and read on) in 24 hours would it have been posted on here in this manner?? I suspect it would have had a different slant to it...
I only ask this in the light of the fact that ALL software has bugs and issues and exploits but all software eventually gets patched - I find open source more responsive in some cases and worse in others - its not a given that something will get fixed every time faster but on average it is - this is an advantage of open source software for me. The disadvantage of course lies in people who claim open source software never has a bug or exploit at all - all software HAS these things but some softwqare gets fixed faster than others.
Good one to the apache team.
"Oracle does. It sucks. Big time. Java may be portable and all, but it is mad slow"
You think thats bad you should see the SAP Java gui - now THAT is painfull - and yep it uses the Sun Java VM...
'vietnam never had an "official" declaration of war. just to let you know.'
Vietname and korea were both police actions in matter of fact - they didnt require a declaration of war - The Korean war was run by a joint force of commanders from around the world.. Vietnam was a mess
but they were both real 'hey look the enemy is over there' conflicts.... this is not
And you could draw some parallels in other ways - during both conflicts there were NEVER wholesale changes to law and civil rights made for the worse like no.
I have one for you - Free as in freedom - Sam williams - great book on RMS (Stallman for those not in the know)and the reasons behind GNU and Open Source - Worth the read (even a RMS hater like me appreciates it)